Bulwark Takes - Cover Up!? The Truth About Fetterman’s Health

Episode Date: May 5, 2025

Lauren Egan talks to Ben Terris about his article in New York Magazine where he talks about a former top aide to Senator John Fetterman raised serious concerns in a detailed memo, describing erratic behavior, paranoia, and signs of megalomania during Fetterman’s recovery from a stroke and mental health crisis. The article reveals mounting internal fears about his well-being, especially after a high-speed car crash, and raises tough questions about transparency, political loyalty, and whether Fetterman is truly fit to serve.  Ben Terris article: All By Himself John Fetterman insists he is in good health. But staffers past and present say they no longer recognize the man they once knew. 

Hey guys, it's Lauren Egan here at The Bulwark. I just finished reading what is truly just a heartbreaking piece about Senator John Fetterman from Pennsylvania. It's about his mental health struggles and I have the author of that piece here with me today to walk us through it all, Ben Terrace from New York Magazine. Hey Ben, how's it going? Doing all right, thanks for having me. Yeah, thanks for being here. So obviously, Betterman's health has kind of been always part of the story that we've known about him since he's been on the national stage. He, of course, had a stroke when he was running for Senate back in 2022. He gets elected anyways,

he makes it to Washington. And then shortly after he arrives in DC, he checks himself into Walter Reed to be treated for clinical depression. And, you know, the party really kind of rallies around him and he's applauded for how openly he's talking about mental health struggles. It's kind of a bit of a of a game changer in a way in terms of destigmatizing some of these issues. But your piece, I think, really shows that it's obviously a lot more complicated than that. After he leaves Walter Reed, his chief of staff basically what within a year resigns and then ends up writing a letter to his doctor. So can you walk us through that letter? What's in it and give us the lay of the land? Yeah. So his chief of staff was a guy named Adam Jentleson, and he was with Senator Fetterman part of the time during the campaign and through his first year of a relapse of sorts that the senator was kind of struggling with his recovery plan. He wrote that he didn't think the senator was really on his

recovery plan anymore. And his letter was 1600 words long. It came with the subject line concerns. And he listed just a lot of the concerns. And some of those concerns were kind of small seeming, they sounded like they were small, he's not drinking enough water. He's not getting enough exercise. He's eating too much fast food. And those things sound small, but when you're recovering from a stroke and from a mental health, you know, kind of crisis that sends you to a six week inpatient care.

And actually even that stuff is kind of serious, it turns out. But then there's even more serious stuff. There's the way that he is getting repetitive and kind of paranoid. And I think he uses the word letter to the doctor, this was one of the warning signs he told me to look out for. It's a red flag. So I'm alerting you to it. And so clearly Adam Jentleson and this doctor had kind of been a team at one point, kind of keeping an eye out on Senator Fetterman and making sure that he stayed on this plan. And Adam's belief was that he was not on that plan. And it was so strong that he was willing to send a letter to a doctor. I think that really kind of decided to come forward now and what you think he was trying to accomplish, because it is a big deal for a former chief of staff to talk so openly

about their boss like that. Yeah, I mean, covering Washington, it's incredible to get staff to talk about anything with their name on the record. And so when they do, I think it really is a big deal. And credit to Adam. I mean, I think it's a brave thing to do. I think he probably risks career repercussions for it. Loyalty is very important in Washington. And if you are seen as somebody who's willing to throw your boss under the bus, that can hurt you professionally. And I think that really speaks to the severity of what he was seeing. And if you, when I talked to him, cause I asked him, I was like, why, why now, first of all, even before, why now, why talk to me before that? Why talk to the doctor? Right. Why, why send this letter at all?

That's a, that's a big step. And what he said is there was a long time where he was in the office where it was kind of unclear. It was a gray area, right. Where things don't seem great, but are they as bad as I think they are? Am I the crazy one? Are things, you know, is everything that I'm witnessing actually a result of a mental health issue? Or is this just what John Fetterman is like, right? And each individual moment, you could have that wonder and that worry. But with enough time and enough space, you look at the whole thing together, and then you see how things are going when you're no longer in the office. And I think that was enough to make him

say, all right, I'm worried that he's going to get hurt or he's going to hurt somebody. So I want to put this all on record to the doctor and do everything we can to get him the help that he needs. A month later, John Fetterman is in a car crash that nearly kills somebody, right? He is going well over the speed limit. He smashes up his car in the car of a 62-year-old woman. The police get on the phone with a staffer in Fetterman's office and say, it's a miracle nobody died. And so that kind of proves the point here, which is that there could be a dangerous situation that arises if we're not careful. You have a line in there, too, where you say some of his current staffers worry that he may present a risk to the Democratic Party. What do you think they meant by that?

Because I think it kind of plays into this idea, like if you can't do the job, that's a problem. Right. You know, politics plays into this story, right? Again, if you were to take the word of the naysayers of this article, you know, this article got read by a lot of people, which means a lot of people thought it was important. And, you know, kind of the kind of story that needs to be told other people thought it was a hit job, right? And the people who think it's a hit job often think it's because of politics. Senator Fetterman, especially with the way he talks about Israel and Palestine, is on the kind of, quote unquote, wrong side of the Democratic Party on this issue.

And people think, OK, well, this is just a bunch of disgruntled staffers who hate the way that Fetterman talks about Palestine and Israel. And so now we're going to try to take them down. I don't believe that's true at all. I think these are people who truly believe what they believe. They truly are worried about him, but they also might be more willing to speak about these things because they don't like the politics, right? And Fetterman's politics and the way that he talks about issues and the way that he carries himself is reflective of the Democratic Party in some way, right? You get Fox News segments that say, you know, a Democrat has done this or that, or people are worried about Democrats in disarray because the Democratic

Party is always kind of fighting with itself about the path forward. And so I think there are people who worry about Fetterman's role in that. Is he, you know, dragging the party down or is he part of the solution to take it, you know, take the party to the future? I think a lot of people look at Fetterman maybe a little bit, you know, from the outside and say, this guy could be the answer to the Democratic Party's problems right now. He kind of has that, like working class vibe to him. Do you think that the Biden stuff has changed the calculation at all? Of course. I ask people about this. People don't want to be part... Nobody wants to use the word cover-up when you're in democratic politics. Nobody wants to take the word cover-up. So

that's not their word. But nobody wants to be part of the problem. If there is somebody who is going through something and eventually it could become a problem for the party or for their election chances or even their own job security, people don't want to hold that on their shoulders anymore and keep quiet about it. But Biden was a big wake up call. I mean, there's books that are coming out in the next few weeks and there's news stories every day about the extent of that problem. And I think the people who are talking about it now, you know, they're kind of playing defense now, as opposed to sounding the alarm in real time when it matters. you're running a presidential campaign and it's Biden against Trump and Biden to you feels like the, you know, the only bulwark, so to speak, against, you know, to keep democracy safe from autocracy. Sure, you might kind of hide the ball on some things because you feel like, you know,

you've got to get your guy across the finish line. I think there's some truth to that too with, if Fetterman was up for election right now, would these people be speaking? I don't know. If Fetterman was, you know, the most popular Democrat in the entire Senate and was speaking on issues the way that, you know, all these staffers truly believed also, would they be as likely to speak on it? I don't know. But certainly Biden is kind of weighing on people in a way that is making them speak more freely than I think they would have otherwise. You got some time with him for the piece. And I'm curious what that interaction was like and what that conversation was like. Because, I mean, writing about mental health and anyone's health is obviously really challenging. I'm sure it's hard when you have to go to them face-to-face and kind of walk them through what you've been hearing. Yeah. It was a hard conversation, honestly. I mean, it started out not hard. And I'd written about him in 2018. We'd spent time

together. He drove me around in his pickup truck through Braddock and neighboring towns. And I think he really kind of appreciated the story I wrote about him. I think he felt like I got him. And so we had kind of an easy rapport to begin with. We, you know, just kind of shot the shit for a while and talked about politics and his place in the party and what it was like to go to Mar-a-Lago. And he's good. I mean, he's able to do a good, you know, interview. And that was important to kind of put in the piece as well, because one thing that people told me is it's not, there's not a guy who is 100% of the time not doing well. He has ups and downs. He can be erratic. He can have days and weeks where he's great. He can have days and weeks where he's bad. He could have hours where he's good and hours

where he's bad, right? It's, it's not a simple story of a guy who's always struggling. And so I got to see the good side, the John Fetterman kind of at his best, and he still struggles with the auditory stuff from the stroke and speaking can be a little garbled, but he seems like he's there. You know, that part of, that's part of his story too. So I wanted to make sure I got that as part of, part of the piece and part of our conversation. But I will say when it did turn to the topic of mental health, you know, the tone in the room changed. He was pretty unhappy, let's say, about the line of questioning. He got kind of angry about, I think he felt like he was blindsided a little bit.

And that part of the conversation was tough. And, tough. And he denied it. He says that he's better than he's ever been. He blames his undiscredited staff and kind of feels like people are out to get him. And I think he thinks that it's about politics. And so the second half of the conversation did feel different than the first half. You talked to some other senators for the piece as well. This kind of goes into like the politics question and motivations for people kind of, you know, wanting to hang on to Fetterman or not. What were some of the other folks that you talked to that work with him? What were they saying about Fetterman? Yeah. So two of the people that I spoke to for this piece were Democratic Senator Peter Welch and Republican Senator Katie Britt. And the three of them kind of have a friendship that goes back to them coming into

the Senate at the same time. They go out to dinner every once in a while. They talk about their families. John Fetterman loves Katie Britt's husband, who's like another big guy. He calls him the big unit. They like, you know, they hang out, they go to Chinese food or Peter Welch, apparently he's a good cook. And, um, you know, they talk about the foibles of the Senate and how annoying it is to have to stay late for votes when they want to get back to their families. And, you know, they, they, they hit it off. And, um, I truly believe that they, their experience with Fetterman is a good one that they see him at his best. And, um, you know, when they have an hour long

lunch or dinner together, they, they hit it off and they do, and, you know, they, they kind of get along as buds. Um, you know, I talked to a lot of other people too, who didn't want to put their names in the story because it's, you know, it's easy to put your name in the story when you're talking about how cool your friend is. It's harder when you're talking about the difficulties of working with somebody that you have to work with. Um, you know, he is for the most part, a pretty isolated individual in the Senate. It's not like he's got tons of friends. You know, it's not like a lot of hallway chatter with people when, you know, they're walking past each other. Some people kind of say it has to do a lot with just like the fact that he doesn't wear the right clothes that allow him to go onto the Senate to vote.

A lot of senators hang out on the Senate floor and that's where they catch up and they, you know, gossip and they talk about what's going on and, you know, get people on bills or whatever. And, and Fetterman famously wears his hoodie and shorts. So when he votes, he goes to the doorway of the Senate and he puts his thumb up or thumb down and that's how he votes. And then he's gone. And so, you know, stuff like that. And also just, you know, kind of his state. He's, he's for the most part, kind of a lonely figure in the Senate, I'd say. Yeah. And to that point, how do you think about what is sort of a symptom of some of his health

challenges versus like, what, what is just his personality? What's just John Fetterman, like his position on Israel? I know in the piece, he kind of is defending it in a way and saying, this is always who I've been, whereas some other staff members, I think sort of seem to imply that, you know, it was a symptom of some of the challenges he's had. How do you think through like, what's just him versus what's a, what's a problem? Yeah. Um, it's hard for me to say, right? Like I can't get inside of his brain. And so all I can do is kind of present the information that I have and let readers decide for themselves what they feel about what is what. Personally, I don't think that his mental health

struggles has defined his position on Israel. And I don't think even his staff think that, right? The way that that kind of intersects with the story that I'm writing is less about his policy beliefs and more about how he talks about it, how he carries himself. You know, he'll have a meeting with somebody from the kind of liberal Jewish organization, J Street, and he'll say some pretty out-of-pocket things. According to my reporting, people heard him say things like, you know, end the ceasefire, we got to get back to the killing. Somebody overheard the conversation, said he heard him say, we have to kill them all. From a policy standpoint, these people just disagree with that, I'm sure. But also from a kind of a human standpoint, there's a question of why is he talking like this to this person? I mean, is he thinking through the way that he sounds. It's not, wow, he's now pro-Israel because he had a traumatic brain thing happen. It's how are you talking about this? How are you feeling about this? He's a guy who his career is defined by his, um, kind of radical empathy that he has. He famously has murder victims tattooed on his arms, um, from his time at Brad, as the mayor of Braddock. I mean, you know, he could say that he's being empathetic

to the victims of Hamas attacks, which is true. And he does, I'm sure, care deeply about that. I'm not trying to negate that. There's just something about his lack of ability to keep a conversation from going off the rails that has people like, what's going on in this room right now? Well, Ben, it's such a good piece. Um, I know something like this takes an enormous amount of work.

So thank you for, uh, for writing it and thanks for coming on here to chat with us about it. Yeah, of course. Thanks for having me.