Bulwark Takes - Even MEGYN KELLY Admits Trump's Chicago Threats Are Illegal!

Episode Date: September 7, 2025

Trump posted a meme declaring "war" on Chicago, raising questions about whether he’s joking. Tim and Sam take on what this means, why Megyn Kelly of all people is pushing back, and how blue state governors are preparing for Trump’s authoritarian instincts.

Hey, guys, me Sam Stein. I'm engaging in at the bulwark. Back with my bud, Tim. We are here to talk about Chicago as the next battlefield, apparently, for Trump's wars. He put out a bleat that was ominous, to say the least, saying, what was it? That he likes the smell of deportations in the morning? Is that what it was? I forget what it was.

It is. It's right here. I love the smell of deportations in the morning. Chicago about to find out why it's called the deportations in the morning. doubt why it's called the Department of War, then three helicopters, and then Trump in an AI image with chipocalypse now with fire and stuff. I'm a little confused about, I thought that they were talking about how the city was already on fire and that law and order was going to bring peace. So I'm a little confused why in this AI image, Trump is kind of overseeing a city

of, yeah, a rain of fire on the city of Chicago. It's a really good point, Tim. You got them. it just seems like there's some inconsistency in the messaging there fair enough all right actually i want to talk about that but i think the bigger thing to talk about is um megan kelly so megan kelly was doing her show and um she was with batya and they're talking about um i don't think batya has reached one word one word she's not like in biancy territory yet uh she is for me i was on bill morrow i really had a good time with her so i don't want to speak out she was on bill morrow sam she does she's kind of a populist right type one of these i was i was left and now i've gone maga type people yeah okay

well batia and megan i go by first names only here uh they're talking and megan drops um some interesting analysis about the prospect of trump forcing the national guard to go into chicago for this purposes let's watch megan and then get tim's reaction on the flip side We're watching this happen with Pritzker in Illinois, where Trump is saber-rattling about sending troops next saying, quote, it's going to happen. That'll be interesting. I mean, it's going to be a legal battle because he's very limited in what he can do outside of Washington, D.C. You can't just send them in to random cities in support of just fighting crime. Like that you really can't do without the invitation of a governor.

I'm sorry. but we can't have it. He does not have the constitutional permission to do it. And I think, and I hope, I'm sorry for the people of Chicago because I wish their governor would be better and ask for help. But I think Trump knows that. I think it was just a saber rattle. It very clearly is not constitutionally permissible.

He cannot do it. I really hope he doesn't do it because I don't want a world in which I'm siding with Governor Pritzker over President Trump. But I will if he does. it because he can't do it legally. Megan, just calling balls and strikes. Love that from Megan. She might invite me back on the show sometime soon.

Megan have had a falling out. You know, I haven't heard from her. It goes nasty DM a couple of a while ago, but it's been, that's been it. So I'm always available, Megan, if you want to chat it through. I agree with her on this, on the Chicago thing. I think it's it, the Megan speaking out of this leads me to believe that there are real, like, internal dissent and conversations about this. I don't suspect that she's just popping off about this.

I suspect she's heard from people around Trump on this question. And to me, I just, with Trump, you always never really know, right? Is he just doing word diarrhea and shooting from the hip? Or is he saying something because he's not a really good poker player. He's kind of revealing where he's going to go. Like, sometimes you can't really tell. And in this one, like earlier this week when he said, you know, we're looking into Chicago. We're looking at very strongly. We're also looking at New Orleans. You know, we've got a great

governor down there who's going to welcome us. We'll see how it's going to turn out. I did a video on that. Now, people can go watch my feelings about that. But to me, that signaled that he was considering, like, not, you know, do it, not challenging the courts in this way. I mean, he got rebuffed in L.A., as Megan mentioned in that video. And it's like, well, maybe the path of least resistance here, you know, if you're, or whatever metaphor you want to use, you're dipping your toe into the authoritarian waters. Maybe, maybe the first step is to not go over the blue state governor's heads, but go to blue cities and red states where you think the governor will welcome you and, you know, see how that goes. And then, you know, maybe if something happens

in Chicago, there's a, there's a, you know, there's some, you know, protest or murder or some, some reason where you can have a plausible excuse to go in based on a fake emergency, then you going to Chicago later. To me, that, like with no insight info, just sort of reading the tea leaves watching what they're talking about, I think that's where they're going with this. And on the one hand, I think that it's just the most mild amount of good news and I think shows the importance and the importance of the legal pushback against the regime is that like they've been brushed back a couple of times. I mean, they're still doing a lot of authoritarian shit, but they've been brushed back couple times. And if they don't go into Chicago, this will be the latest example of it.

I got a few things I want to push on that. One, what did Megan DM you? I'm kind of curious. Two, if you need a murder in Chicago as justification for going in, well, Chicago's got those. Don't worry. You have the justification. Three, I totally agree with the idea that they're probably ramping up a little bit here. So DC, they could do because of the home rule stuff. L.A. was a little bit iffy. They had the riots. They used that as a fig leaf, but the riots were really confined, and they got brushed back in court. I think they use your boy, Governor Landry, and he calls in the guard, and they go into New Orleans or something like that, where it's much more legally foundation. It's a solid legal foundation for that. And then they push off the

Chicago Swift. That said, that said, I am sort of curious if they try to draw a distinction between ICE operations, ramping up those and a anti-crime operation, because we've seen all these signals that they're using this base north of Chicago. They're going to get the military involved in some sort of ice operation there. And that's got different legal ramifications than just going in with the National Guard to camp down on crime. So that's where we're at. Now, the Blue State governors have been pretty aggressively pushing back on this. And Westmore was talking about Illinois. Pritzker was talking about Illinois. How do you think they're dealing with it? Like, I don't know.

really know what I would do in that situation, but it strikes me that they're hitting some write notes. Yeah. I think Pritzker has been really strong and more. I'm both. The threats to more were a little less acute. But I think that Pritzker's messaging on this has been really good. And, you know, again, making it clear that it's going to be a fight, you know, is an important,

is an important first step here, right? Because, like, you know, Trump is in some levels, like an insane honeybad. that just like goes and bites anybody that he wants to but like but you know there's still limits right to like what a man can do what a 79 year old aging man with bruises on his hands can do in the you say you say right then so it's like okay maybe that's just not worth the time versus the other thing so I think it's been good that they've gotten some brushback pitches I think that there's some more extreme um ideas for the blue state governors um as far as what they could do with the national guard that is under their control um that i the jvL has pushed out and other

people that I think are probably at this point not needed, but I think that they should have all options on the table. So, and I think that's my view. I think the Blue State Governor is so far on this, they've acted pretty good. I mean, the rubber hasn't really met the road yet. Not yet. And I think that's the thing. Like, in Chicago, when they come up with some pretense, whatever the big balls of situation

of Chicago is, like the question is, what do you do then? And so, I don't know, I just, one other thing on Chicago, I want to extend my comment from earlier, because your observation about ICE is really correct. And I think that, like, maybe they split the baby a little bit and have like a big ice operation in the States and say that, you know, we've gone after a couple of murderers in Chicago and it's a migrant crime that we're going to stop. And because it is hard to totally back down once you've done the Shypocalypse now meme. Yeah. And I thought that was sort of, when he put it up, you know, initially I was just like, ah, this isn't a stupid AI generated thing that he's got going on. But a lot of people were like taken aback by it.

And then I, and then I kind of hit me, like, he, you know, if he take the literal, you know, literal reading of what he's saying, he's like, he's declaring war on a blue, on a city in America. I mean, like, I'm not trying to, like, I don't want to, like, seem hysterical about it. But if you just read it literally, that's what he is saying. And then I was just like, that's so fucked. And he wants the double meaning. Like, here's the thing always of the, like, take him seriously, not literally thing. It's like, he wants both some of his. his base who wants there to be a war on Chicago to be excited about that. And then he wants the

whatever, you know, to be able to have the other members of his coalition be able to say, oh, the liberals are so crazy. Oh, they're clutching their pearls. And I don't know my pearls on, but, you know, they're doing, you know, it's a Sunday. It's not really Pearls Day. It is, it's intentional. He wants that double meaning. And it is like, it's ominous. It's not ominous. Yeah. I mean, that's the thing. It's like, He still posted it. Like, even if he's trying to get a rouse out of people, like, it's not necessary. You don't have to do it.

Sometimes you don't need to post. Anyways, all right, ma'am. You don't want to hear about the Megan? Do you? Oh, oh, you're going to read it? Yeah, I kind of do, actually. Oh, no, no. I guess I can pull it up.

But the, I mean, it's not really that. It's about what you'd expect. I mean, as a PR flack, when Megan was at Fox, like I worked with Megan a fair amount, like booking my candidates on there. We knew each other. Okay. We had a couple of, um, how would, how would I? put this. Rocky interviews with various candidates of mine. We had to manage that together behind

the scenes. So, you know, we felt like we'd been through some trials together. And I did a tweet back in 2020, making fun of Brad Pascal. Remember when he was like, the first campaign manager or second of Trump? Then he was outside his house and his underwear. The cops were there. Big issue. And I was making fun of him. And Megan thought that was unsensitive and thought that I had let TDS get the better of me and then we went on to a lengthy series of DMs back and forth where I said we should hash this out on one of our various platforms

she did not want to do that and then yeah nothing nothing since then she didn't reply to my last DM so there we go Megan I'm still waiting for a reply four and a half years ago so Megan it's been 60 months

anyway all right Megan if you're watching this just constantly refreshing that the end of the minutes. All right, thanks, man. I'll talk to you later. Guys, subscribe to the feed to get good stuff like this.

Talk to you later, too.