Bulwark Takes - MAGA Becomes the Cancel Culture Mob

Episode Date: August 28, 2025

JVL and Sarah Longwell take on Trump’s latest culture war skirmish over the Cracker Barrel logo — and how these distractions fuel his bigger authoritarian power plays.

Book club on Monday. Gym on Tuesday. Date night on Wednesday. Out on the town on Thursday. Quiet night in on Friday. It's good to have a routine. And it's good for your eyes too. Because with regular comprehensive eye exams at Specsavers,

you'll know just how healthy they are. Visit Spexsavers.cavers.cai to book your next eye exam. I exams provided by independent optometrists. Hello, everyone. This is JVL here with my best friend, Sarah Longwell, of the bulwark. Guys, before we get started talking about Cracker Barrel and Donald Trump and this horrible, horrible timeline we're trapped in, do me a solid. Hit like, hit follow on the channel. We need you. It helps more than you can possibly imagine. All right, Sarah, while you were away, Cracker Barrel, the iconic store, as part of their big $700 million makeover as a chain, changed their logo. was met with some outrage.

There was some stuff happening. The stock price dropped about 9%. Many people on the right became very snowflakey about it. Then eventually Donald Trump, our president, weighed in because we live in a constitutional republic in which all the decisions in power are located with a single person. And now they've switched.

Cracker Brown's going back to the old logo. Do you have thoughts on this? I mean, I guess so many things. I'd like to know what you think about Cracker Barrel. I'd like to know what you think about the two logos. But we'll get to that a second. Let's start with the reversal by Cracker Barrel. Good, bad?

You know, graphic design is your passion. It is. But sausage and gravy is my passion. And as a result, I'm from Central Pennsylvania, right? I'm from Cracker Barrel country. But I'm more of a Bob Evans person. I just, I think the food is better. Bob Evans, personally. I think their sausage biscuits and gravy is better. But I like a Cracker Barrel. I've

always liked a Cracker Barrel. I come from the kind of place where on a Sunday around 11 p.m., I mean, a.m., sorry, in the morning time, there's a line out the door at the local Cracker Barrel. And you've got to hang out in the little market where they sell the candy while you wait and they sit in a rocking chair. That is the saddest thing I've ever heard. No, like a cracker barrel's nice. I love a cracker barrel. Here's the thing. I also don't like change.

I think some of my conservatism, you know, I, whenever, I hate it when, I hate it when Twitter has, you know, changes its font. Anything, at any time you change the things that I am used to, I'm going to find it sort of uncomfortable. I think that's some of my inherent conservatism. I like things to be the way that they were. If you asked me, did I prefer, just aesthetically, the old logo to the new logo, I would say yes. Also, I would say, do you care? Who cares? Like, but apparently some people, it is a, it is a grave offense to their culture. And this is one of those, it's sort of like the bud light thing. It becomes a cultural flashpoint for reasons that their C-suite could never have imagined. Because their CEO is a woman, it becomes a DEI issue. And as best I can tell, they instead of, you know, they have caved just to the blowback. Now, I do think the blowback is coming, though, from their people.

Like, the people who eat at Cracker Barrel and we're mad about this are probably their customers. And so I don't think from a strategic corporate decision, it was necessarily the wrong move. it's sort of like when HBO spent all that money to move over to Max and everybody was like everybody was like well this why would you give up all that brand equity and that is like a stupid decision and so then they paid McKinsey another gigillion dollars and they were like we're going back to HBO Max and everybody's like great uh but I do think it's a little bit like that they got backlash from their customer base okay but the fact that every single one of these things has to become this is One of the things that's interesting about it is when I say I didn't like the logo, I guess it could be a world in which this was like everybody thought the new logo kind of sucked relative to the old logo. And because we live in a world where everyone has to have an opinion, that was the dominant opinion. But the way that it got turned into a cultural flashpoint is bizarre because it didn't need to be. It's not like the left was out there being like, you must change the Gregor Barrel logo. That's the weirdness of it, right?

It was a one-sided culture war. Yeah. And that, yeah. And so this is, I mean, I guess this is the, I'll wait for you to put that down. I don't want you to spit it out all over your computer screen. Oh, no. What are you going to say? I think Trump is right.

Trump is right that they should change the logo back. Look, if your stock price drops by 10% because you change your logo, they should change your logo back. I'm sorry. Like, that's just, that's just objective signal that it was the wrong call. And also, like, who cares? Right. Bring the logo back. You can have a second logo, right?

You can use the shield on travel cups with a, you know, a better design, see if it catches on. Maybe, maybe a year and a half from now that hated shield logo with the barrel will actually become sort of a hipster. Oh, yeah, you know, that's kind of the cool kid signal on Cracker Brow, right? You can use a couple different logos. You may notice Coca-Cola has all sorts of different logos. So it's Pepsi. I hadn't noticed. I am in favor of them changing back.

I think Trump is right that it's the right thing to do with for the brand. What I don't understand is how this is somehow part of woke culture war. I don't know. I mean, it seems to me like the right has decided that everything is political and are they are now like the PC police from the 1990s. I wonder if there's ever a backlash to that or not. Like maybe backlashes only go one way in the same way that everything else only seems to go one way in America these days. But it's a little strange and be like, you know, oh, they're disappearing the old man because of woke DEIs or whatever. Like, no, the thing is that, you know, Julie Messino, she comes from Taco Bell.

Like this is, you know, she spent most of her career. She clearly very smart. If you look at her CV, this woman has like risen through the ranks in her. retail. She understands retail and understands business. But she's coming from a world of Taco Bell where there just isn't a lot of brand equity in the logo and stuff like that. And so she missed this. And fine. Fair enough. But like this isn't, nothing about this was woke or political or any of that. And I don't, ah, it kind of makes my skin crawl watching this turn into a culture war instead of a logo war, right?

It's like Gap. I don't know if you remember this. Gap did a bad logo redesign like 15 years ago. And that's, I think it was three days. Like they scrapped the new logo after three days. So these things happen from time to time. But this has a political valence in a way that very few others did. And it's because in this America that we live in,

everything is about the right asserting cultural dominance over anything and everything in the space. and the right wanted to assert cultural dominance that we get to say whether or not Cracker Browel changes its logo. I'll be interested to watch what happens to their stock price, but I think that in today's world, too, this little controversy, I don't think anybody had talked about a Cracker Barrel. Like, the reason they were doing their redoing their logo and their insides anyway is because they were thinking, boy, how do we remain a restaurant that matters in America when, you know, people are sort of not coming here. anymore. Like, it's kind of a tired brand. Like, they were doing a brand refresh because the brand was tired. But now, everyone's talking about their brand. What was the last time you thought about Cracker Barrel? Well, I mean, so the reason they did this is because their customer segment is

aging out, right? And so their customers tend to be much older. They're dying. They are weak with younger customers. So they're looking at a way to replenish that, that chain and bring in younger people, which isn't crazy. They have ref- and they started this all with a menu refresh that seems to have gone very well. Their actual food and Bev sales are up because their menu refresh has done pretty well. And honestly, if you look, I'm not a cracker barrel guy, but just looking at the menu items, I would say what they've done with the menu is attractive.

Like it's very on brand with sort of old, timely casserole type stuff, but kind of interesting. You know, like, oh, a hash brown casserole. okay, that sounds interesting. Sign me up. This is, the logo's, it's, again, I just don't understand how, I don't, maybe it is just about dominance and submission, right? The right sees a chance to assert dominance over anything in the culture. Like, you know, Donald Trump saying that, uh, that Roger Clemens needs to be put into the Hall of Fame at Cooperstown. Why is he, well, because he's decided he's going to make

steroids in baseball is going to become a culture war issue for the right now, I guess. Yeah. It's just

we got to assert dominance. We need to be able to tell everybody what to do and what to think. Yeah.

Also, like, to me, if the right wants to spend time on this, like, this is the sort of thing

that I think in the scheme of things doesn't matter in the way that having ice all over the streets of

Washington, D.C. really does matter. And the fact that Donald Trump finds the time to weigh in on these disputes, like the extent to which this guy doesn't govern in the normal, like this is what he wants to weigh in on. He wants to weigh in on these big cultural fights where they can pick up what looks like a quick win by just turning the eye of Sauron onto one company with shareholders that will get spooked quickly in cave. Because, I mean, we're not Cracker Barrel. We're crumble barrel, aren't we now? I spent so much time last night, trying to find a good, like a good, what do we say instead a cracker barrel?

But I couldn't, I could never get to something that I thought really popped. Yeah, I just, I watched all the cracker barrel discourse and thought, this is a real fiddling while Rome burns moment. But it is, it is part of a bigger cultural issue where the right now is so. addicted to grievance that their only move is to like freak out about these things and be like, see, this is how we, this is how we win. And but what's crazy about it is, you know, you just said something about the, it's like 1990s cancel or like PC police.

What's so interesting to me right now watching this new right is how much it looks like the left of when we were like 12. right like and all my life i've listened to the right complain about online mobs and the mob mentality and the way you jump on people that is what all of this is all of this and people said that it was the left the left was using cancel culture or whatever like what are you talking about this is cancel culture that is all this stuff is it is the way that you mob something in a way to get them to do what you want i'm sorry is that not what you guys complained about the left doing all of this time. The flag burning stuff. This used to be the kind of thing that, like, somebody resurfaced a Joe Biden clip talking about criminalizing flag burning.

Yeah, that was a bad idea that we criticized of the left in the late 80s, early 90s, that kind of stuff. We were like, no, this is a free speech issue. The conservatives were on that side. Now Trump is criminalized. It's like Trump tariffs, like whatever. It's like he took every idea that I disliked about the left from the early, from like the mid 90s and was like, Like, this is, this is being a Republican now. Yay. But then he threw all the racism and stuff on top of it. Yeah. But in the last 10 days, we've had, yes, the cracker barrel controversy. But we've also had Trump now arming the National Guards, people who are occupying the nation's capital, rolling out a literal red carpet and applauding Vladimir Putin as he was welcomed onto U.S. soil. and firing a member of the Fed Board of Governors

in an attempt to take over the Federal Reserve Board. So, like, it's all of the things. It's the ridiculous stuff and the most sinister, most dangerous authoritarian stuff all at the same time. And I think that the Cracker Barrel stuff is where it's funny how they work in concert because it's almost like he builds his commitment from people

over the crackle, cracker barrel kind of thing, over the signaling, but then wields it as it kind of Yeah, right? Yeah. Yeah. And it's a way that they can conjure a wave of support on one thing while the other thing then either goes sort of unnoticed or you're able to kind of tag on the support for the cultural valence stuff into the serious authoritarian stuff. All right. I'm going to ask you a question now, but you're not going to respond to it. going to sit on it and marinate on it, and we'll talk about it on Friday. Okay. Is a country in which a significant share of the population can be turned into a, like, oh, yes, this is a woke war on Cracker Barrel, and so I will definitely support the removal of a member of the Federal Reserve Board.

Is that country capable of self-rule in a liberal-democratic way? Hmm. Just something to think about. Just something to think about for you. We will discuss all of that on Friday when we get together in our secret show. Until then, good luck, America.