CALLING HOME with Whitney Goodman, LMFT - Is "Therapy Speak" Out of Control? with Jacquelyn Tenaglia

Episode Date: July 1, 2025

I sat down with therapist and content creator Jacquelyn Tenaglia to discuss the rise of "therapy speak" online and in popular culture, how mental health terms are being misused and weaponized, and what to look for when consuming mental health content on social media. We explore the fine line between increased mental health awareness and the oversimplification of complex psychological concepts, plus red flags to watch for in mental health content creators. Follow Jacquelyn on IG at no.bs.therapist Whitney Goodman is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist (LMFT) and the founder of Calling Home, a membership community that helps people navigate complex family dynamics and break harmful cycles. Have a question for Whitney? Call in and leave a voicemail for the show at [phone]⁠⁠ Join the Family Cyclebreakers Club ⁠⁠⁠Follow Whitney on Instagram⁠⁠ Follow Whitney on YouTube⁠⁠⁠ Order Whitney’s book, Toxic Positivity ⁠⁠Learn more about ad choices. Visit podcast.choices.com/adchoices This podcast is for informational purposes only and is not a substitute for professional mental health advice. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome back to the calling on podcast. I'm your host Whitney Goodman. Today I have a guest on the show. I am joined by Jacqueline Tenaglia. You may know her as the no BS therapist on Instagram. And we are talking a little bit about Instagram therapists, how some terminology has spread like wildfire and what you need to look out for when you are following any mental health content creators or therapists. on the internet. We talk a little bit about narcissism, relationship advice, and kind of our process as content creators who are also therapists. All right, let's go ahead and get into the interview. I want to start off, I think, by saying that I know that we both participate in this like online culture of therapists and therapy speak, but it seems like, you have been pushing back against some of the ways that that has been, like, getting taken a little bit too far. And I'd love to hear, like, what was the moment for you where you decided, okay, I kind of want to do something about this because it's getting out of control.

So it's funny you ask. I got my start as a therapist working at a methadone clinic. I did individual and group counseling there for 11 years. So when I started to see posts about emotion addiction it really kind of made my head spin because I was like is this a thing or you know wait a second that's not that can't be right um you know people aren't working into cars in order to fuel their emotion addiction habit right so it was just it that was one of the first things that kind of captured my attention and made me wonder about the influence of what's happening you know what being the discourse online and just the validity of it kind of questioning the validity of some of the things that we see.

Yeah, totally. I think, yeah, I remember seeing something about that in the past. But I think that that is an interesting trend that we're seeing is where there's just like a need to pathologize everything, diagnose everything, like give it a name. I don't know if that's something you're noticing as well. Yeah, the desire to, I mean, it's. it's great that we, it's not a bad thing that we want to kind of like label and understand things better, but it does seem to be getting out of hand. And it's leading to a lot of misunderstandings

about what certain terms mean. Yeah. Have you seen that misunderstanding like play out in in real time? Like have you seen people kind of mislabeling things or using words in an incorrect way? Yeah. I see it. Well, I see it the most online, but certainly talking to people in real life, it comes up as well. It was so interesting. Have you ever watched the show Love is Blind? I have seen, I saw one of the first seasons. Yeah. There is, there was like a reunion for the recent season that was on the other day. And the girl, there's a girl on there talking about one of the guys' behaviors. And I guess everyone online is saying, he's a narcissist, he's a narcissist. And she like found it necessary to say, like, I see you guys all writing this. And I,

he is not a narcissist, like, and he, you know, we didn't get along. I feel like he treated me in these ways, but that is not how I would label him. And I was like, wow, what an interesting moment for people who have never met this person that are viewing just snippets that are edited by reality TV producers online to kind of make this call about someone. And I feel like that's really representative of where we're at with like therapy speaking and labeling to some degree. Yeah, narcissistic is one of the ones, the terms that we see most often being misused online. On this podcast, I talk a lot about how I watch a lot of reality TV. That's where I get so much of my content inspiration from.

I didn't know that about you. Yeah. You know, I try not to have a rule where I don't talk about like specific people because even though they're putting themselves out there, I still just, I feel like, Icky being like so-and-so's mom did this. But I watch it and I'm like, oh my gosh, this is something that's made it into my TV in the popular culture. So I think other people must be going through it. So I use that a lot as inspiration for my content. And I just noticed that therapy speak has like infiltrated reality TV, which I often find is like a mirror sometimes

of like popular culture. And I'm noticing even that if you've been watching any of these shows for a really long time, the people are becoming a lot more like, oh, well, maybe it's about her childhood and like they're kind of doing all this. And I find that to be positive to some degree that we're not just like chewing each other's heads off. Yeah. But I also wonder if like, I think it can be weaponized in both ways, right? To excuse bad behavior, to explain the behavior. And I don't know if that's, is that making sense to you? Absolutely. What you see.

Yeah. So sometimes some of the downsides of it include avoidance and, you know, avoiding, you know, avoiding accountability, avoiding a difficult conversation with someone. Sometimes people use, you know, like, that's just my boundary. But it could be more avoidance, right? Yes, you should avoid people who are harmful. But for someone who you could have just a simple conversation with, what are you using, one is avoidance kind of disguised as a boundary?

And, yeah, so language has been really co-opted by so many people. It really seems to have infiltrated everywhere, even workplaces. Yeah. You might see therapy speak. like, you know, make sure you practice self-care and that's bad. It's just interesting how therapy-ish language has kind of infiltrated everywhere. And I think it really, it was becoming more popular in the late 2010, but after 2020, when all of us were chronically online, it really seemed to blow up. Yeah, it's so, it's so true. And I will even hear people use terms like in social settings

And I'm like, huh, like, how has that infiltrated? And I know that I'm partially responsible for that. But it's fascinating, you know, to see it kind of move into popular culture. And I think it does get weaponized even by people in abusive relationships. You know, people who are being abusive. And also the workplace thing is interesting. I saw some video of like a, I think it was a younger Gen Z person. being like, oh, I can't start, I can't be at this meeting at 830. That's my boundary. That's when I go to the gym or something. And there was this big clash, right? Between like the generations, you know, at work and it sparked this huge debate that. Yeah. Yeah. And so the conversation was, you know, I think the Gen Z side was good for them. That's, you know, they, that's their right. That's empowering. they self-advocated like that's great and then it seems like every other generation

or a lot of other generations were saying you know sometimes you do have to like sometimes life is uncomfortable sometimes you do have to show up early at work for the meeting and yeah you know if you want to get ahead you have to be willing to put in an effort to do some of the things right so totally there can be avoidance of discomfort is one of the overarching theme that we're talking about. Yeah, yeah. And I think that's one of the biggest things that people have gotten wrong about, like, mental health in general is that, like, it's about having, like, good mental health, quote unquote, is about feeling good all the time or about eradicating bad feelings. And you and I both talk about toxic positivity a lot and how that type of mentality can so.

negatively impact you. Why is that something that you have wanted to push back so strongly against toxic positivity? Yeah. Perhaps just anecdotally, right? I had early experiences with grief and disability and so I was exposed to a larger dose of toxic positivity than the average person wise. Totally. Totally. I mean, I think in the in the disabled community among people who are disabled it is used constantly. Yeah. And certainly to make people feel like you have to be an inspiration or something along those lines that it becomes debilitating to some degree to live up to. Yeah, really invalidating. Totally, totally. And just like that you're there as to be an inspiration for others. I mean, it's awful to use people in that way. We see it all the time.

I mean, as, you know, certain times of year, we'll see, you know, prom season, we'll see a lot of, like, oh, gosh, the homecoming king asked out the student with a disability to the prom and how wonderful this is, you know. Yeah. Yeah. What do you think when you see that type of content? Like, what does that evoke in you? physically like disgust but it's just yeah i i don't see it at it it's it's really well-meaning but it's like we shouldn't celebrate just basic acts of decency totally in that way i completely agree i completely it's like clickbait and like click bait yeah it's it's so and i think people see it as like oh we're celebrating we're being so kind but it's it's certainly like much more in insidious than that when you actually look at it or if you're on the receiving end of that feeling. Yeah. So, you know, one of the questions that I wanted to ask you was, because I think

you do a great job of calling this out, is like, what advice would you give content creators who create mental health content or wellness content to make sure that they are doing that responsibly and, like, providing value without oversimplifying. Yeah. I think, well, number one is prioritizing the accuracy of the information that you're putting out there and making sure that you're citing reliable sources in some cases. If you're not a mental health professional, then you should be really clear about your expertise.

So that's paramount. avoiding generalization in clickbait not being reductionistic with the information they're putting out there because we know that black and white information does go the most viral yes right yes so people learn they're possibly reinforced they learn that you know the more extreme they are in with their in their language the more likely that post will be seen by a of people. So avoiding that because we lose accuracy when that happens. We're losing the nuance. We're losing the, you know, could be you might have ADHD air, right? And so use language that educates and doesn't diagnose. That's another thing. Because there's so much, there's so much

diagnostic information out there. But it doesn't really give you a guide map for, okay, you have this diagnosis, now what, right? Most of the information is you have X, you have this diagnosis if X, Y, B. It's just not prescriptive. Is that the right word? Yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. And I think that when you're not, that's the problem with diagnosing yourself on social media. And I know that some people get upset about this because there is, of course, like, access issues and privilege and all of that related to being able to get a diagnosis from a professional. And there's value in self-diagnosis and self-assessment. But at the same time, I think there's a difference between seeing a list of symptoms and

saying that fits me and having a conversation with someone who is able to see all these different diagnoses, right, and say, okay, you do fit here, but you also could fit here and here, right? And being able to kind of give those differential diagnoses. Yeah, it's, it's hard. And I feel for people who are looking for answers and wanting to find that. Right. And that's been the upside of all of this, that people do have more clarity and need you feel more empowered. I also wanted to add, going back to your previous question to, you know, if you, if you are trying to become a content creator, especially in the field of mental health, make sure that you respect the lived experiences of people who have dealt with certain conditions and certain phenomena.

You know, if you're tossing around, going back to the word narcissistic, if you're tossing around that term to use it to someone who doesn't really fit that description, to me at least, it seems invalidating to the person who has dealt with abuse from a narcissistic person or to the person who does have narcissistic personality disorder and is trying really hard to do something about. it right yeah that's something that like i have pretty like thick skin online but when people start making um generalizations about others that are very like derogatory you know particularly in the estrangement space i can't go a day without someone saying to me like oh these selfish brats are just cutting off their parents on a whim and like that's just the fastest way to get blocked

by me because it's just you're coming into a space where people are there for help and support and they're dealing with this and you're choosing like to attack like you can yeah that somewhere else right it's it's wrong and I think also to tell people like well I have three friends who have been through this and I know exactly what their experience of that invalidates yours is a big a big problem online I don't know if you encounter like that type of invalidation where it's like my lived experience is the only one that can be true. And so you're saying some people who say that are dismissing more scientific evidence or? I think it's more that it's like I notice that people will say, well, that wasn't my experience.

So that can't be your experience. And I think that that's something that people also have to, you're saying on one hand, we need to respect a lived experience. I completely agree with that. And then the other flip side is like your lived experience is also one data point, you know, in a sea of lived experience. And that can't be used to refute other people's experiences in the same way that my knowledge as a therapist should not exclude your lived experience.

And I find that that's hard to capture online sometimes as well. What do you mean by that? I think that people, I don't know if you've experienced this where people will come to posts that I write and say like, well, that didn't happen to me. This isn't true. Like something along those lines, right? If they don't see their exact situation reflected in a post, it must be inaccurate. So I take painstaking effort to make sure that that doesn't have.

And I use language like could be or maybe or perhaps, right? Very tentative language because I want to both, I just want it to be tentative. Yeah. And I think that that is a great tip, like to give people. The thing I've also noticed is like sometimes people just, they don't read everything. And so I will get comments, you know, that are very much reflective. that you haven't consumed the whole post, maybe. And so that's also like another recommendation that I give to people is like, if you ever

have a really strong reaction to something, make sure like, okay, did I read through? Are there any disclaimers here? Are there any words that might show me that this is not being stated as fact, but as an opinion? Or as something that occasionally happens to some people that doesn't fit my. experience and that it's okay to just say, this does not fit me at all. And so maybe I don't want to listen to this person. Yeah. Yeah. Not everything will apply to you. Yeah. And so that media, social media literacy, that a term? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I think that, okay. No, for sure.

So being able to have discernment and be able to critically think about the information that are consuming, know when something, you know, be able to say, you know what, that doesn't, the word is making that sound like this applies to me, but I know that it doesn't. Yeah. That takes a lot of discernment and checking in with yourself. It does. And I think that discernment is especially challenging when, you know, an account has like a lot of followers and a lot of engagement and appears to get a lot of affirmation from other people. I feel like it's harder for people to. I feel like it's harder for people to, it's almost like they're like, well, maybe this does apply to me or like I want it to fit me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I want me, ma'am. It's okay. I probably know you're talking about

fucking go. Yeah. Yeah. There are some certain big accounts that really draw a lot of attention and have a lot of virality. And so that's another thing. It's important to be able to, the size of account doesn't necessarily reflect the accuracy of content? A hundred percent. I was having this conversation actually with my husband the other day that I was like, you know, if I ever got that big, like I'm talking like millions and millions of people, I would know that I kind of was not doing a good job because my message would be applying to way too many people. And as a therapist, like that makes me concerned, like, that I was speaking so generally. Like, I don't know. It would just make me feel like I was, I was really trying to sell something, which to me is more like self-help world than,

and not that one thing, yeah, not that one thing can apply to a lot of people, but like when it applies to like millions of people and they're all saying it's amazing and perfect, I just think the words are so empty that people are able to just put themselves in it. And it feels it feels not right to me. Yeah. Yeah, I get that. And I think that certain big accounts have really grown because of the lack of nuanced language in their content. Totally. And I noticed that if I look back at, I've been doing this for like five years. If I look back at some of the stuff that I posted when I first started, it's like that. It's definitely more that way where it was kind of just like, I don't know what I'm doing. Like this.

is Instagram. I'm just going to go on and write thoughts that pop into my head. I couldn't have foreseen the level that it would get to and the amount of people that would have been looking at it. And now when you have more followers, you of course have to consider that even more, I think. Yeah. By the way, did you ever think that you would end up in the world of like family therapy and estrangement? I mean, I always have worked with like, family issues. Like, I worked a lot with, like, families who had a family member that was diagnosed with cancer. And then I did a lot of family therapy in addiction. And so I've kind of always dealt with the way that issues show up, like, in the family. But it wasn't until 2020

that this adult child parent stuff was, like, just flying at me 24-7. It was something, yeah, it was like COVID, I think, forcing a lot of younger adults. to move back in with their parents. Okay. People that I was already working with, it started to be an issue. And then they just, it just kept coming up all the time that I was like, okay, I'm kind of already working with this. I want to start learning more about it.

And since then, I've just like immersed myself completely in that world because I find it beyond fascinating. And there's a real need for that to be done ethically. And with a lot of... A lot of you want because it is such a complex world. Oh, absolutely. And I, that's, I think, why I get, I have to really work on my, like, trigger response sometimes when parents come at me saying, like, you're pushing estrangement. You want people to be estranged because, like, I really don't.

And I really feel this, like, desire in me to try to help people, like, navigate this in the way that makes most sense for them. And sometimes when people are so triggered around the issue, I find that they only see what they're feeling sometimes in content, too. You know, and we can imagine things that aren't there or aren't being said. And I also need to reflect on it sometimes. So the feedback is good. Oh, you're probably the subject of a lot of projecting. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

I've had like video series made about me by parents. I get emails. Gosh. If I ever go on anything that is like primarily watched by boomers, like I went on, I did like a PBS special. My email was wild. Yeah. But you know, it's good. I'm like, you know what? I think I've talked to other people about this and I think it has a lot to do with like they project their child onto me sometimes because I'm around the same age as a lot of these people who are, you know, estranged from their parents. And. It's easy just to like, it's okay. I can take it. So I want to know, like, are there any red flags that you tell people to look out for when they're going to follow a content creator online? Like anything that they might see and be like, oh, maybe this isn't so like nuanced or well thought out.

I would say that the biggest thing to be on the lookout for is oversimplified content. And if you do X, you definitely have X, Y. You know, that's probably misleading. Mental health conditions exist on a spectrum. So we really need to take all of that with a grain of salt. You know, most of the content creators who are reputable accounts, it's not necessarily that they're always posting long-form content that has scientific backing.

or long captions, that's not necessarily a necessity, but it can only help in theory because we're adding context and we're adding nuance. So does the person that you follow have to be a licensed professional? Not necessarily, but you do need to look out more for fear mongering and just oversimplified content and any signs that they might be more focused on virality than accuracy. That's interesting. Yeah, that's something to look out for, I think. And I think those are good red flags that people can kind of assess it. And like, I think it's important for people to remember that you don't have to follow like any of these accounts forever or always be implementing everything that they say. You know, I've heard of people like they're following like a hundred therapy accounts. And I'm like, you can unfollow me when what I'm saying does not apply to you anymore. or when it's causing you more distress than it is help. Like, if you're getting triggered and activated, not in a way that's helping you face things, but just in a disregulating way all day long by someone,

maybe it's not the right resource for you right now. Right. Yeah. That's a great point that you can have seasons of life where an account might apply or be more helpful than at another time. Yeah. Or you might start to realize. you know what I'm not crazy about this content creator okay yeah especially because we all shift

I mean I'm talking about things that I wasn't talking about five years ago yeah yeah no it's true yeah and so there's people do you lose a lot followers by the way in that process you know I feel like I have been just like in general because Instagram is like a dumpster fire I will gain thousands and lose thousands like in a month time you know that I am I am no longer trying to pay attention to any of that. Yeah, right. I know. It's it's tough because you just get, you know, the longer you do it, it is true that you just get like addicted to the metrics to some degree too. And it can kind of cloud. I could see how some people get very caught up in that. And if you don't have a good sense of like how to actually be helpful, you just start producing content that

creates that response like people who just produce like rage bait all day long right how you do it it's like the rat pressing the lever you see yeah the reward come out like oh okay this work this went viral yeah and this was really extreme so i'm just going to really hammer like like lean into that extreme with that totally totally it's not ideal no it's not and you have to have the appetite for that. Like, I don't like when I get a million, like, negative comments of people being, if I notice people being really confused and angry about what I said, I don't want to repeat that. And I think that when people repeat that, sometimes it's, it does get engagement, like, making people angry and confused. It's true. It works. If you look at, like, every news channel,

they give you, like, 80% of the story and the comment section goes wild. And, like, I don't have the stomach for that at all. Yeah. That's true. Yeah, you have me in my head thinking about past posts that had a lot of comments and just the content, you know. Yeah. Yeah. It makes me want to, like, clarify myself more. And then I get really caught up. Yeah. I don't, I definitely don't like that. Yeah. For sure. For sure. To be doing or being good to my phone unexpectedly or. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Absolutely. The downsides of content creation. Totally. I've started using, like, a planning software that just posts my stuff for me.

And so now I am a lot more removed, which is really nice. Yeah. Yeah, you know, I, that has been helpful for me. But one time I had a scheduled post that it was, like, I had to, I forgot that it was going to drop. And then it, the timing of it, due to the political, what was happening politically that day. Oh, yeah, yeah. actually kind of insensitive. So it is something to just, you know, if you're looking to get into content creation

or if you're listening to you're already in that world, it's something to be mindful of. It's so true. You still have to like stay on top of it to some degree to make sure that like, okay, if there's a major crisis going on. Yeah. Yeah, I've definitely been there and I'm like, okay, delete today is not the day for that. The last thing I want to ask you about is, you know, how do you feel about the rise in using the word trauma, like trauma bonds? This is a trauma response. I can tell by your face. You've got some things to say. Take your time. Well, you've heard of concept creep. Yes, I have. So concept creep refers to the

phenomena where over the last couple of years the definition of certain terms like trauma like addiction emotion addiction harm abuse etc the definition that these terms have

has widened so much that the meaning is really being diluted and distorted in a way so some of that is positive because we're becoming more intolerant of things like harm abuse and we have more awareness as to how what can be traumatic right that's good but it's not positive when we're we're seeing it's like if all you've

have is a hammer everything the nail yeah there's a lot of seeing harm and trauma in spaces where otherwise might not have really exist um or or maybe it's just stress it's just a regular stress, it's not necessarily trauma, right? Regular stress still exists. I think we're forgetting that when we use extreme language to describe kind of mundane phenomena. Yeah, it's so true. And then it, of course, I think, connects back to what you're saying earlier, that then we are kind of invalidating, you know, the people who have actually experienced that or are experiencing it. Right. It's interesting that you bring up the concept creep thing. because that's used a lot in estrangement circles.

Is it? Yeah, to sort of invalidate, in my opinion, the reasons why adults are becoming estranged from their parents. So with this idea, basically, that adult children, particularly young adults, are looking back at their childhood and now viewing it as traumatic when it otherwise wasn't considered that way. And I kind of have a problem with that theory just because I think that a lot of things were not seen as traumatic, but they still were. So there were people that will argue, like, well, emotional neglect was just the way things were, right? It's not actually bad. But emotional,

just because we didn't have a name for it, we didn't know what it was, it still existed. And so I think that that concept creeped is so accurate in so many realms. And then there's, there's like one study on it or something that I see constantly being cited in that regard. Yeah, it's about, oh my gosh, I think it might be like an Israeli study or something actually. I can't remember. But I've seen it in a lot of places where people basically say like you're going back and looking at your childhood through this lens that only exists because now we have widened the definition. And we have widened the definition because we know a lot more now. So it's interesting.

I know. It has been a double-edged sword. Yeah. I mean, certainly some people have needed concept creep to almost like give them permission. Exactly. But permission to say, hey, actually, you know, that is, that's not okay. Yeah. Like you're saying.

Yeah. Yeah, totally. And like, I mean, I kind of, my estrangement work really focuses on like what's happening in the relationship now more than. on the past. And I don't think that anyone has to even qualify their childhood as traumatic if they don't want to. Some of them are just saying like, wow, my parent is treating me really poorly today at this age. And so I'm not going back. And most of them, most people I work with are not rehashing the past. They're just talking about like what happened on Tuesday, which is what's

really fascinating. Yeah. Yeah. Well, is there anything that we did not talk about. that you feel like people really need to know when it comes to combating mental health misinformation online, thing like that that I didn't ask you. Yeah, I would say embracing great areas is just healthy, right? Black and right thinking is extreme. It's rarely accurate. So being more comfortable with being kind of like sitting in an in-between place. Like something can be two things at one. Yeah. It can be, you know, I can both be grieving and grateful at the same time, right?

Those are two kind of feelings that you wouldn't necessarily put together, but they can coexist. So it's a both-and thing. I don't know if that's a helpful example, but. No, I think that's very helpful. Okay. So becoming more comfortable with gray areas and nuance and not having an example. inserts all the time. Yeah.

Should think it's hard because we like clarity. There's nothing wrong with that. It's empowering. But sometimes things are really murking and just like need more information before we can really fully understand it better. Yeah. Absolutely. And that's what I love about your pages. I think it stops people like to just kind of think about the information that they're

consuming. what it says about them, you know, to commit to some of like this black and white thinking that's being put forth by other accounts. And also just like, why do I want that certainty? Why do I want to figure out exactly what's going on with me? And so I love that you're promoting some of that nuance in a space that so desperately needs it. Thank you. Yeah. I try. Absolutely. And all it was all in response to me, consuming content at the end of the day, right? I'm maybe a therapist, but I was out there consuming content myself. And so that's why certain things ended up on my radar,

which I'm confused, and I'm a therapist. So late people must be really confused by this. Totally, totally. Well, thank you so much for speaking with me and thank you so much for the work that you do. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me. The Calling Home Podcast is not engaged in providing therapy services, mental health advice, or other medical advice or services. It is not a substitute for advice from a qualified healthcare provider and does not create any therapist, patient,

or other treatment relationship between you and Calling Home or Whitney Goodman. For more information on this, please see Calling Home's terms of service linked in the show notes below. Thank you.