CALLING HOME with Whitney Goodman, LMFT - Reparenting Yourself While Parenting Your Children

Episode Date: December 3, 2024

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When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. www.ca.com. Hey, everyone. Today, my guest on the podcast is Libby Ward.

You may know her from TikTok or Instagram at Diary of an Honest Mom. She is over a million followers, and she posts the best funny, relatable, heartwarming videos about motherhood and being honest about motherhood. And the thing that drew me to her was that she's somebody that talks. a lot about reparenting yourself while parenting children. And this is a theme that we've been discussing a lot in our support groups at Calling Home for any of you that have been in those groups. You know that we're always talking about how difficult it can be to give your children something that you didn't get as a child. And so this is a great episode for anyone

that is a parent that's dealing with generational trauma or even someone who's thinking about having kids and doesn't really know how to navigate like what they're dealing with from their own childhood or how to become a different parent, maybe than the one that they were raised with. I'm really excited for you at all to hear this conversation. So let's go ahead and dive in. The first question I always like to ask people who, like, they're not therapists or this isn't their career, is why did you decide to start posting about this stuff online? That's a great question. I started posting online in 2020 in the beginning of the pandemic on TikTok because I thought that no one in my real life would ever find the content that I made if I posted it on TikTok and I felt like it was a

really honest, authentic place that I could share what I was really going through and like show this side of me that I didn't really show in, I guess, real life. So I mean, they this last words, I posted because I thought that no one would ever see it. And I just wanted to connect with other moms on things that I thought were important. And then here we are, four years later. I take it people that you know have now found you on the internet. Oh, one or two. Yeah, one or two. Before I started sharing on TikTok, I worked as an educational assistant at our local school with kids with special needs and I was working in a grade seven classroom and on one of the breaks these kids were doing this like weird dance with like their hands and like what are you guys

doing like what is that dance and they were like oh it's from TikTok and I was like what's TikTok they're like oh it's this app where you dance and then you can share videos of you dancing and I was like that's dangerous you shouldn't be on the internet like posting videos and you dancing like TikTok sounds like a bad thing and then two weeks later the pandemic hit And I was like, let's see what TikTok's about. And then I fell in love with it. So it's really cool how everything has grown and how I've been able to find my voice and find topics that continually resonate with people where I think that I'm the only one going through something.

And I make a piece of content. And so many people are like, oh, my gosh, me too. I thought I was the only one. And while social media definitely has its downsides, it's got to be one of the most beautiful things that has come out of all of this is realizing not only that I'm not alone, but being able to like be a space for other people to realize they're not alone. I feel like we've talked about this before, you know, when you and I have spoken and from looking at your content that you're really trying to show the good parts of motherhood, the in between and the bad parts. but I'm wondering if it's hard to strike that balance on social media because it seems like the really, like, quote unquote, negative parts are the ones that go viral, right? Or that get the most attention?

Is that a difficult balance to strike? Well, it is a really difficult balance to strike, especially because when I started making content, I was really going through it as a mom. I mean, it was pandemic. I had three years under five. one of my kids had a severe speech impairment and I just had a lot of things that was going on and the internet as we know likes to put us into boxes and the world tells us to niche down and that is what I was going through and so I created a community really of other moms who

were going through hard things you know and who were tired of this sort of aspirational motherhood that say like the Instagram moms and the mom bloggers have been sharing for, you know, decades. And so when I want to share things that are positive or want to share things that are more nuanced, it can be tricky in that if you share things that are more nuanced, that's not as viral worthy, right? Like that's not as shareable. That's not as like it doesn't get the hits and the clicks and the unless you take a hard stance on something, people aren't interested. Like, people don't want to hear the long, nuanced version. They want, like, the quick hit.

And so that's hard in terms of still maintaining that reach, maintaining that authenticity, maintaining, you know, showing all different aspects while still having your content seen. Wanting to maintain my kids' privacy. So being aware of how much I'm sharing, you know, obviously people, the more detail you give people, the more interesting, the more shareable. But wanting to maintain that privacy is difficult. people wanting that shock value where the algorithm is like shifting.

And then also it's hard because while I want to share the good parts about my life and about motherhood now, and I am leaning more into sharing that now, it's not just that it doesn't get seen by as many people or it's not as engaged in. It's that the market and the social media world is still so saturated. with like, let's look at the positive. Let's look at aspirational motherhood. Let's show you this like four-hour recipe that I make it look like it takes 10 minutes. Let's look at all the beauty parts.

And so I feel as though my content, I try to fill that gap where it's the things that people don't talk about as much. But the problem with that is so many people see that and think that that's all I see or that's all there is to motherhood and really struggle to to hold space for two things can be true at the same time. That was a really long answer, but basically really hard to hold space for all of it in the world that we're in these days. Yeah, I can so relate to that feeling of like people thinking that what you post is your

entire experience or is like the only thing that's true for you. And it's like, no, I'm just making like a two-minute video about this thing. And there's so many other things that exist. You're also reminding me of those like, I don't know, like trad wife videos that have been coming out lately of like, my kid asked for grilled cheese. And it's like they start eating the bread. And I'm like, this cannot be real. How to make the cheese and make sourdough.

It's like that recipe. literally would have taken you from the moment you woke up to the moment you went to bed never mind like the whole piece of makeup that you have and the full glam look that you have and like where are your children when you're making this eight hour sourdough grilled cheese and aren't like that you started making seven hours ago i know and then what to me is the comment section because like i can see that video and be like oh this is aspirational content, like I can understand that she's just making something that's maybe entertaining, whatever her intentions are. What's concerning to me is the common section

and like the hundreds upon thousands of women and moms being like, I wish I was more like you. Why can't I be like that? Why can't I do that? I want to do that. That's what I aspire to do. That's what concerns me. Yeah. Is that there's people in game content thinking that that is somehow realistic or the expectation in any way or even that the marker of a good mom is one that can make homemade sourdough grilled cheese right right exactly they're not really understanding right like maybe her kid is like shoved his wet finger in an electrical socket and crying i'm not saying that that's what's happening but like why are we not like thinking of what it means to be a good parent outside of the scope of what looks pretty on Instagram.

Totally. Totally. Yeah, I think I've been reckoning with that as a parent. Like my kid does not want to wear like anything but this like specific outfit that is like crazy. Like he always wants to put together this combo of clothes that I'm just trying to let him express himself. And I sometimes send my mom these these videos. I'm like, how do these people get their kids to wear these clothes?

like these little matching outfits and stuff. I'm like mine ones like tie-dye and like light up shoes the same thing every day. And it does make you think like, am I doing something wrong if I don't push that or I'm not putting that out there even though I know, like you and I both know what goes on behind the scenes in content creation, but it can seep into your brain and really start making you question things. Yes, absolutely. especially when you get those little perfect snippets and you're like how do those kids look so happy in that content when like I asked my kids to do like one thing where like their faces aren't even in the content and it's like a big big ordeal and like how are these kids doing this like every day and like what is happening behind the scenes here yeah and what does it actually look like for these people it's it's very concerning to me how we can see snippets of people's lives online and so easily

convince ourselves that that is what the reality looks like all of the time. And that's the positive or the negative, right? Like that's the aesthetic power dough bread mom. And that's also me. Like if you see a seven second reel from me being like, oh my goodness, my kid's incessant coughing for the last 12 days is making me want to put a fork in my eyeball, that doesn't also mean that I want to put forks in everyone's eyeballs or that I am even going to do that or that I'm not giving them Buckley's cough syrup or that I'm not looking down to them or that I don't love them or that I don't empathize with the fact that they're sick. I'm simply saying their coughing makes me very angry. That doesn't mean I'm expressing my anger as a full-blown rage attack or that I'm angry

all the time, just like sourdough lady isn't making sourdough all day every day. Right, right, exactly. Yeah, it's crazy the amount of black and white thinking and I think we are inundated with that type of logic all the time. Something you talk about in a lot of your content that I wanted to kind of like explore with you is this idea of like watching your children get a childhood that you did not have. I think you speak really well about that concept and people don't react well when we talk about almost like being jealous of our children or kind of being envious about their experience. And so I'd love to hear like how you have been navigating that as a mom and somebody

who makes content about that. Yeah, it's really hard. And I even struggle to use the word jealous because it has such like negative connotations. and negative, like, character assessment attached to it. Like, if you're someone who feels jealous, then you have problems and there's something like wrong with you inherently. So it's a really touchy one to talk about, but I've found that by talking about it and, like, naming what it is, it helps me to kind of work through it a little bit.

So, I mean, I started having feelings, I don't want to say towards my kids, but yeah, towards my like motherhood journey, my experience of childhood, my children, even when they were infants, like from the very way that I was providing love and care and nurturing to my kids, seeing them and listening to them, I could at the same time as providing those things to my kids and feeling proud of myself for doing that and grateful for them that they have that, in the other hand acknowledging oh my goodness

wait a second I didn't get this oh my goodness what has happened to my development and my life if I'd received this oh I wish I had this

that's really hard that I didn't get this I am a little bit jealous that I didn't get it but that jealousy doesn't have to mean that my kids don't deserve it or the jealousy doesn't have to mean that I resent giving it to my kids

or that I don't want to, it's this both hand of my kids are deserving of being seen and known and loved and cared for and I was too and I can hold both of those things at the same time. But it's a really hard thing to talk about, especially to people who haven't maybe experienced parenting or a childhood that was really hurtful to them, where they, were lack of those things that seem like natural things that every child should get. Yeah. I think that's such a beautiful way of describing it. I've talked about this in relation to, like, grandparents, you know,

watching your parents be better grandparents to your children than they were parents to you. And it was shocking to me the reaction I got from people about how wrong it is to be jealous of your children. And jealousy or envy isn't really normal feeling. We're not like immune to that just because it's our child. And you said it perfectly of like, it doesn't mean that I don't think my kid deserves it or I don't want them to have it. But I am talking about like the little child part of me that didn't get that and is watching it and thinking like exactly like you said, who would I be if I had experienced that?

Well, and the full circle moment is for me is that I wouldn't be someone who is at 35 years old still trying to convince myself that I am worth love and care and attention and respect and boundaries. You know, my self-worth has taken me until my mid-30s to realize that I am worth it, that I deserve having self-worth and care and love. And, you know, so much of the research points to when children, especially young children, are seen and known and loved and they feel that way, it builds that internal, like, self-trust and self-worth that they don't have to spend the rest of their lives, you know, trying to figure out. So it's, it's hard. Like, it's, I feel so grateful to be able to be a cycle breaker and to be able to give my kids what I never had. but at the same time, it's so hard to think about maybe what life would have been like or what I may not be struggling with as much if I had received that. Yeah, absolutely.

How did you decide that you wanted to break this cycle in your family? Reading, playing, learning. Stellist lenses do more than just correct your child's vision. They slow down the progression of myopia. so your child can continue to discover all the world has to offer through their own eyes. Light the path to a brighter future with stellar lenses for myopia control. Learn more at slur.com and ask your family eye care professional for SLOR Stellist lenses at your child's next visit. I mean, before I even became a parent, I knew that I was going to parent differently to how I was parented.

the circumstances that I grew up in with a mom who had undiagnosed and untreated mental health disorders. It was, you know, fairly traumatic. And so it was something that I kind of knew from the get-go that I was going to do things differently. And I didn't have the language when I became a mom nine years ago of being a cycle breaker or of reparenting or of any of any of that. I didn't have the language. But I knew that I wanted to do things differently. And from the get-go, I set out with that intention to do things differently to how I was raised. Now, once my kids got to the age that they had personalities and, you know, were toddlers and had opinions and needs and tantrums and things got really triggering, of course, like intentions aren't enough to get you through and teach you

the skills that you were never taught to regulate and teach your kids to things you were never taught. That's a whole other story. But I had the intention of, you know, breaking cycles from the get-go. I think it's one of the hardest things as a parent to give your children things that you didn't get, things that feel like foreign to you or like you have to learn them. And how do you find like the strength or the resources to do that with your own children? Slowly and consistently and through practice, which that sounds like a very vague answer. But I think when you hear the term cycle breaker, you think of an automatic start and

stop. Like, I'm not going to do it like they did it or how I did it anymore. Now I'm going to be different and I'm going to be a better parent and I'm going to be loving and patient and kind and listen and be regulated. But the reality is if you're someone who's wanting to break the cycle, you probably don't know how to regulate and you probably don't have those skills. And it's going to take time to build those skills. So for me, you know, I have been in therapy for many years. And so is a combination of going to therapy, it's reading different books, it's listening to podcasts, it's practicing self-care and looking after myself so that I have the capacity to execute on all my well-laid plans. And I will say with that, like, I have gotten to a point where I've

realized there's only so much therapy, only so many books you can read, only so much information that you can take in about being a cycle breaker and parenting differently before you realize that you actually have to take care of yourself and listen to yourself and that you know more than you give yourself credit for. Like I realized that for so long, because I didn't have a roadmap that I wanted to follow, I looked to everybody else in my life for how I should do it. and that was books and podcasts, but that's also social media and friends and different people in my life. And to a degree, that's really helpful. But it became almost toxic to the point

that I was trying to do the best of everything that everybody else was doing. And I realized that I actually knew so much more than I gave myself credit for. And if I could focus on taking care of myself so that I had the capacity to be regulated and be what my kids need me to be, which is calm and present, that's going to be so much more powerful than any amount of information that I can take in about being a cycle breaker and reparenting. Yeah. So that's such a good reminder for people because I think there is this pressure to be perfect as a cycle breaker and like you said that that sense of like the cycle should just end now

and everything I do from here on out should be perfect and good and not at all resemble you know how I was raised or what I was like before I made this decision when in reality we're all going to slip back into those moments you know from time to time or hear that voice coming out of your mouth of like oh my gosh I sound exactly like the person I don't want to be. And that's jarring, you know, and the shame that comes up from that is difficult. It's so much shame. And I have to remind myself that I was conditioned to be the way that I am for so long and in my most formative years. Like we all know how kids are sponges and how they just soak up their environment and information and the things we tell them and the way we treat them and how we

speak to them. So if for 18 years I was conditioned to be a certain way and perceive myself in the world a certain way, then it's going to take a long time to heal and to work through all of that even longer than the amount of time it took to like set me up this way because now I'm older and it's harder to learn things when you're older and you're kind of set in your ways. And when you're a parent and your environment is so out of control and unpredictable, and you have this little human whose brain is not developed yet and is constantly doing things that trigger you, it's hard to heal and to parent at the same time. And so when I screw up and when I hear my mother coming out of my mouth, I just have to stop and remind myself that the fact that I'm aware that it's a problem and that I'm working towards being better is a huge. huge step and it's unrealistic to expect myself to be perfect just because I intend to do it well. Wow, that's such a good reminder. And like knowing, you know, you're not your mother

or insert whoever, you know, whoever's listening to this, the person that you feel like you sound like, because you're aware of it and you're trying to be different. And ultimately, I think that person who would do that with no regard repetitively without repair didn't have. that awareness. And to me, that's like the foundation of being a cycle breaker is the awareness of what you don't want and trying to do something different. It's not perfection. Right. So another thing I wanted to talk about that I think you were just alluding to was like this month inside calling home, our family cycle breakers club is talking about family rules, you know, like the scapegoat, the golden child. And I'm wondering, like, have you explored the role that you played in your

family at all? I have not explored it in the way that there's like a formal name. But in hearing you say that, the one that I would resonate the most with would probably be the golden child. Even though I am the youngest of two, I've always taken that like eldest sister role, like a type personality, responsible rule follower, organizer, fixer, like bearing the weight of the world and my family's emotions and life on my shoulders. That's like always been my role. And my joke with my brother now is that I used to be like Libby 1.0. So Libby 1.0 organized all the family Christmases, cooked everything, like made the Christmas crackers from scratch and like was in charge of everything and made all the decisions and was super organized and uptight and wanted to

be in charge of everything and felt responsible for where everyone sat and how everyone felt everyone felt doing. And Libby 2.0 just let's go of that responsibility. And it's so interesting because I feel like when I was living 1.0, the golden child, whatever you want to call it, people in my life, whether it's like family or friends, would like lovingly tease me about having that role and maybe like wanting to be in control or wanting to organize things or, you know, being responsible for everything and would kind of like lovingly tease me to like let go a little bit. And I have found that since being what I call Libby 2.0 and kind of being like, oh, I don't care where we go for Christmas. Like I don't need to be in charge. Like I don't need to

cook or it doesn't matter to me where we go for dinner or just being more relaxed and not needing to be in charge and like letting go of feeling responsible for everyone. I have actually noticed some of those people who maybe lovingly teased me before not really know what to do with it where like they would kind of encourage me to not be that way. But then when I wasn't in control, they kind of, I think realized. how much easier I made their lives when I was doing those things. And then I almost got pushed back for being too relaxed. So it's so interesting how like we take these roles and then when we change, it kind of throws everybody else for a loop as well. Totally. Totally. I think it's it's so interesting

to see that like when the homeostasis of the family is disrupted, which is really what happens when anyone starts breaking any type of cycle, right? It's like everyone's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, what are you doing? This is not, I'm not ready to shift. But it sounds like Libby 2.0 is enjoying life more. Is that correct? Yeah, Libby 2.0 is definitely more relaxed. Like, do we have glamorous of meal times?

Definitely not. do we run into maybe some disorganized chaos in our plans we absolutely do but is liby 2.0 more relaxed and fun to be around absolutely yeah yeah hey i think that sounds better than the other stuff you know it's it's probably what your kids will remember more than everything else yeah and it feels better for you it does you know my not to go dark on you but my dad died a couple years ago at Christmas time. And a month before he died, he went into the hospital. We didn't know that he was going to die.

Obviously, we thought it was just like a little thing. And throughout that month in the hospital, I realized that I had been prioritizing other family relationships over him for lots of years because those other family relationships sort of made me feel as though I was responsible for them and I would get more guilt trips from them. And I would have more responsibility put on me and be made to feel worse if I didn't prioritize them. And I had been prioritizing these other family relationships for so long that I realized during that month he was in the hospital. I'm like, I haven't spent as much time with dad

as I maybe would have liked to. And it's not because I didn't want to. It's because he didn't really make that big of a deal of it. And I've been catering to what everybody else wants, like before I've been asking myself what I want or what he wants. And so when he was in the hospital, I sort of said to my husband, you know, this Christmas I'd like to have, you know, dad over and I'd like to prioritize him going forward. This has been a really good reminder of that. And then, you know, he ended up passing away, which is really sad. But that was sort of a huge catalyst in my life to realizing what I can miss out on if I constantly live my life in reaction to and in hopes of making everybody else happy and thinking of their needs first and it took

that happening for me to stop and go like wait a second why have I been operating as Libby 1.0 and as this Libby who wants to make everybody else happy before asking myself what I want because at the end of the day I'm the one that's missed out on this relationship with my dad because I was so concerned about what everybody else saw. It really helped me to like come back to myself. And even though he's not here anymore, it's like a reminder to me to not wait until someone is in the hospital or dying before you ask yourself like what you actually want and not what your family has expected of you or what you have made yourself to be

in order to make other people happy. Yeah. I'm so sorry for your loss there. And I can relate to the experience of realizing, like, wow, it's the most difficult relationships in my life, maybe that are getting the most attention from me because I feel like I need to please them or whatever it is. And so it's horrible when you have to learn that lesson in that way. But also a big reminder of like sometimes the way that I'm people pleasing or like catering

to certain people is actually taking me away from what matters to. be. And it goes back to that whole self-worth of I spent a long time not even realizing that I could or should ask myself what I want. Like people pleasing was so deep in the marrow of my bones that I automatically assumed that other people's needs and wants were more important than mine without even consciously thinking that. Like I didn't even, I didn't even stop to ask myself what wanted or needed or what was realistic or possible, I automatically would look to everybody else and then maybe later consider what was left for me. And since I've been working on, you know, my self-worth and my like need to be loved and known and seen and my right to those

things, it's helped me to, I'm not saying this very well, but like since I've gained this amount of self-worth that I never used to have, it's helped me to stop and ask myself what I want and not just like naturally fall into what does everybody else want first. Yeah, I think you said that perfectly. And I think that's such a relatable feeling probably for anyone that's listening to this episode. You do such an excellent job of like highlighting what is what is difficult about being a cycle breaker as a parent and, you know, all the like nuance in between that I think gets really lost. So I really appreciate you sharing that with us and talking about your story with me. The last question that I like to ask everyone, and you've alluded to some of this, is what is a cycle

in your family that ends with you? A cycle that ends with me is the cycle of people pleasing and prioritizing. and prioritizing everybody else over yourself. I love that. That's a good one. All right. Well, thank you so much for talking to me today. I really appreciate it.

Is there anything ahead for you that you would like to share? Anything else that you want anybody to know about you? I know that we'll share where they can find you at Diary of an Honest Mom on TikTok and Instagram, but any other exciting projects going on? Yeah, I mean, I have a guided journal that I created called The Honest Mom Journal, which has helped me so much in being able to write down my thoughts and feelings and realize where maybe I had some unrealistic expectations of myself as a mom. And it's helped me to take time to be grateful for the good things in my life

while also acknowledging what hard things are there so I can proactively, you know, make my day. in my life better. It's really been journaling has been a tool for me that has helped me to build that self-awareness and self-worth. And so that's why I made it. And so I would just like to mention the honest mom journal that you can find on Amazon. I think it would be really great and helpful for any parent who's a cycle breaker or wanting to build more self-awareness and feel better about themselves. Amazing. We will definitely link that in the show notes too so anyone can go there and get it. Thank you again, Libby, so much for speaking with me today. Thanks for having me. The Calling Home podcast is not engaged in providing therapy services, mental health advice, or other medical advice or services.

It is not a substitute for advice from a qualified health care provider and does not create any therapist, patient, or other treatment relationship between you and Collingholm or Whitney Goodman. For more information on this, please see Calling Home's terms of service linked in the show notes below. I don't know.