CALLING HOME with Whitney Goodman, LMFT - Surface Level Relationships Might Actually Be a Good Idea

Episode Date: January 20, 2026

In this episode, Whitney challenges the idea that all family relationships need to be deep, emotional, and vulnerable. “Strategic authenticity” is the idea of intentionally choosing what parts of yourself to share with certain family members. She discusses how to tell if a surface level dynamic is even possible for you. Surface level relationships don’t have to be about being fake rather protecting yourself while maintaining a sense of connection without full estrangement.Whitney Goodman is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist (LMFT) and the founder of Calling Home, a membership community that helps people navigate complex family dynamics and break harmful cycles.Have a question for Whitney? Send a voice memo or email to [e-mail] more about ad choices. Visit podcast.choices.com/adchoicesThis podcast is for informational purposes only and is not a substitute for professional mental health advice. 9:59 When a surface level relationship is worth trying13:04 Cost benefit analysis of relationships20:29 Temporarily surface level22:26 Should I tell them I want a surface level relationship Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hey everyone, welcome back to the Calling Home Podcast. I'm your host, Whitney Goodman. I got to be honest, right before I started recording this episode, I was scrolling on TikTok, trying to get myself, like, in the zone. And I came across this video from this therapist that put me in such a bad mood about, like, estrangement and parents. And I'm not even going to play it for you guys or talk about it anymore because it is, I don't even know how this person's a therapist. But, you know. I'm going to get back in a good mood now. And we're going to talk about something really interesting today that I brought up in one of our calling home groups today for adult children of emotionally immature parents. And that is surface level family relationships. This is a topic that I have been working through a lot for my book. And it's a very hard line to strike. I think that I think we've been taught that real family relationships should be deep, emotional, connected, honest, vulnerable. There's certainly a lot of adults today who, and I was talking to some about, to some of you

about this in group, that like those are the types of relationships that you want. You don't feel comfortable being in relationships with people that feel fake or forced or service level. But there's also this idea that there are a lot of people out there for whatever reason who think that the relationships that they have with you are actually close and good, even though they feel surface level and empty or hollow, as one of our group members put it today to you. And something I've realized when working on this concept is that surface level relationships

and close relationships, the definition for that across the board is there is such a wide range of definitions for what that looks like, what that feels like. I have talked to people that think that a close relationship is like helping each other in emergencies and otherwise not speaking. I've spoken to people who think a surface level relationship is talking every day. You just avoid certain topics or certain types of contact. or you don't necessarily see each other in person. Some surface level relationships mean you only see each other at holidays or some people

feel like those relationships are close. Like there's no way to pinpoint an exact definition of this because I think it looks different. Culturally for your age, your gender, your personality, your temperament, like all of these things influence what you define as close. And also what I see big differences in between parents. and their adult children is that for some parents of certain generations, emotional closeness was not such a thing in their relationships.

You know, relationships were created to meet a certain need. They had utility to them. They weren't necessarily about enjoyment. And so some of your parents have never had a really emotionally close relationship in their life. They haven't had that with their spouse or friends, coworkers, their own parents. And so they think that your relationship is very close. And I think that's why some of these people are completely shocked when their child cuts them off, right? Because it doesn't make sense to them because they thought the relationship was close.

Yet a lot of these adults are reporting that it didn't feel. very close. And so I want to talk about, you know, like what happens when any deeper version of this relationship is just completely stressful, unsafe, or impossible? And I think a lot of you all are asking yourselves, like, is it wrong to keep things light and surface level? Like, am I being fake? And my answer is no. Not necessarily. surface-level relationships can be protective, grounding, incredibly functional, and they might be a good alternative to, like, chaos, conflict, or even total estrangement. So let's look at this a little bit deeper. I think that we've gotten to this place where we all feel a desire to be our full selves

everywhere, right? And we all shift who we are. are depending on the context. I am certainly different on this podcast than maybe I am in a session with a specific client or with my kids or out at a dinner with friends or when I'm speaking in public or how I am with my mom. We all have different versions of ourselves. And yes, our core self is in there, but we certainly have different ways of showing that and different things that we highlight in certain situations. And so you're not the same person at work with acquaintances in a group chat, with your partner at your kid's school. And it's not that you're being inauthentic all the time. It can be that you are adapting, that you have emotional intelligence or that there's

context to how you choose to behave and present yourself in certain moments. And I think that it's empowering to say like I choose the parts of myself that feel appropriate, safe, and aligned to share with these people because I cannot realistically show every single part to everyone all the time. It wouldn't be effective for anybody. And there's, there's of course, a lot of social and cultural norms at play and things that should change and that we shouldn't shrink ourselves for. but I think that there is some type of balance here, right? And so when we talk about having a surface level relationship with a family member, whoever that is in your family, I don't want you to think about being fake.

I want you to reframe this as strategic authenticity. And this episode is not for people who are in abusive relationships with family members, because this is not going to apply to you. This is more for people who are trying to figure out a way to make this work, maybe with people who they already have some distance with or who they don't totally get along with. At its core, a surface-level family relationship is predictable, structured, contained, and intentionally limited. Okay? It's not estranged, but it's, it's, It's not deep. So this is safer territory.

You can share activities, maybe common interests, small talk. Maybe you share some memories or you have like a rhythm with this person, certain things that you do together. You manage contact with this person very intentionally. And you decide how much of your inner world to show. to them. And I think that this approach can be healthy for adults who especially are likely to slip into like emotional caretaking, trying to change people. They feel a lot of disappointment or they have family members that maybe they like and they're nice, but they don't particularly

have the ability to get deep with them. They're not very emotionally connected or they just don't have a ton in common. Now, I think it's important to talk about how these types of relationships feel. And this is the big thing that we were talking about in our adult children of emotionally immature parents group today is that you have to start looking at the way that your nervous system and your body responds to certain relationships. And this is how you can tell if a surface level dynamic is even possible for you. This type of relationship should feel calmer. It should feel more predictable. It should feel lighter, less risky. It should be easier to regulate yourself in it. And it should feel safer because there are very clear boundaries. And like I said, this could be

as simple as like you share a hobby. You have a weekly conversation about certain logistics. They help you with things. You have holiday get-togethers. But it is not like the person that you're going to call when you need to vent or to share something deep about yourself. And this isn't possible with every family member because some of them we have more history with. We have higher expectations for, but it is possible with some of them to be able to maintain other benefits of being in that family that would no longer exist if you did not have a relationship with this person. And I know that there's a lot of grief around this. That was a lot of what we were talking about in group. because it's not the deeper connection that you may have wanted with this person.

And you can feel both relieved that it's not as chaotic. It's a little more distant and contained, but that you can also feel grief that that's all that it is. I want to talk about sometimes when a surface level relationship might be worth trying. So these are some reasons why someone might intention. maintain this type of relationship with a family member. So you want to stay connected to extended family, cultural rituals, community events. You're trying to protect a relationship with someone that is connected to that family member. So maybe grandparents, sibling, step-parent, etc.

You want to avoid the emotional or logistical fallout of complete estrangement. It may be because the relationship, even in its limited form, still bring some value to your life. Or the the alternative would create more harm, danger, or conflict. Maybe you want to keep the door open without giving full access to your life, or maybe your life circumstances require some level of contact with this person. So you might be co-caregiving with them, financial support, shared property, child care, illness, et cetera. For many people, estrangement is not an option. And so a surface-level relationship isn't like a cop out or you giving up or giving in. It's really just a way for you to protect yourself while still maintaining some type of connection with this person. Now, a surface

level relationship is impossible or likely to be impossible in a couple of situations. If this person, this family member, cannot tolerate any limits or distance, they react to all of your boundaries with guilt, rage, manipulation, punishment, or just trying to always escalate things, not going to work. If they use any contact to push for more access or anytime you communicate that with them, it destabilizes your mental health to a degree where you need to recover. You're having panic attacks, anxiety. You're talking about it for weeks. It's just not good for you to see their name like pop up on your phone.

If you are slipping back into old roles where you're constantly having to take care of them, you notice it's just like this slippery slope where it cannot stay surface level. Not a great idea. If they are violating agreements like to privacy or boundaries or anything like that, they might not have the capacity to handle this surface level relationship. This is a huge one. If they continue to be abusive, verbally emotional, financially, psychologically, or physically, you can't have a surface relationship with this person.

The abuse needs to stop before you can move forward in any direction. If they see the relationship, this limited relationship as a challenge just to push you to get more access to you, that's a problem. That's something that the two of you are not going to be able to contain together. A surface level relationship is only possible when both people, can respect the container. Now, I think it's important a lot of the time to do these like cost benefit analysis of what these relationships bring to your life and what they cost you. And this is a new phenomenon that I think is not going to change anymore, that adults want relationships to bring

something to their life. They don't want it just to take from them. And so you have to ask yourself, what does this relationship cost me? And what does it? give me and looking at these different domains of emotionally, physically, financially, socially, can I stay regulated during and after small interactions? Or like we said earlier, does this impact me for days where I just cannot contain myself? And it is so challenging after even the smallest interaction with this person. Does this dynamic align with my well-being and my values and my goals for life. Is this relationship style something I'm choosing feels very different than something I feel I am being forced into? Does the other person stay within the confines of the relationship?

So even the best like surface level strategies collapse if one of the people is pushing every limit and trying to bulldoze past any boundary that you put in place. Am I hiding parts of myself that are very important to me, or am I completely erasing myself? There is a difference, I think, between being a version of yourself and completely erasing yourself for someone's comfort. And it's important to kind of think about the nuance there when we're talking about these surface level relationships. If you have to hide, like, who you're with, what you're doing, your work everything from this person, probably not going to be that great of a relationship.

And what outcome are you trying to avoid or maintain? You know, are you trying to avoid estrangement, trying to protect your safety? Do you want to maintain access to certain parts of your family? I think this clarity really helps you decide if, if, surface level relationship is protective, if it's tolerable, or if it's just simply too draining for you. Now, I think something that a lot of people have brought up when we talk about surface relationships is that these relationships feel fake. And I think that we have to rethink like why we have certain relationships, what the utility is of them. And also, a surface level with relationship with a parent might feel more fake and worse than having a surface level relationship with an aunt or

a second cousin, right? And so you don't have to reveal your inner world and how you feel to every single person in your family or that you share a last name with. What you can do is decide what is worth it to maintain some of my connection to this system. And that's, And some of you might be listening to this and being like, Whitney, nothing's worth it. Like, I get no upside from this. All it is is work and effort and downside for me. And I would say that makes sense. You're allowed to feel that way because it probably is true for you, right?

So if you have to constantly betray your own values, accept mistreatment, abandon all these really important parts of yourself to keep the peace, then this isn't right because a surface-level relationship doesn't require you to completely erase yourself. It should feel lighter and more sustainable if it's truly working for both of you. I think in all these conversations about estrangement, it seems like no one is really talking about the gray in between. We're talking about these two choices. You're either very close and you love them so much or you are completely estranged. but I think most families, most even healthy, quote unquote, families, they live somewhere in the middle of this. And so sometimes having a surface level relationship with a family member can really

just be a way to pause and figure out what's going on, give yourself some space. It could be a permanent status for this relationship and a container that you both live in. It's a protective strategy. It's a way for you to stay connected without being consumed by this dynamic. And sometimes it's a way to honor certain values without totally sacrificing yourself. And so part of having surface level relationships is kind of claiming this adult part of you that gets to decide that not every family member gets full access to you and your thoughts and your life and what you're doing. And not every family relationship can be that deep. And it doesn't mean that all you always have to end. these relationships or keep this type of distance that requires you to lose your connection to

everything unless that's what's required for you in these situations. So I think the real question here isn't like, is a surface level family relationship good or bad? It's more about does a surface level relationship, however I define that for myself with this person, support who I am, function, the life I'm trying to live, my needs, my goals. Does it help support other people in my family that I love and care about and want to have access to? And only you can answer that. I can't tell you whether you should pursue that or not. But I think that it boils down to, like if you're choosing between closeness, distance, surface level, no contact, like you get to decide what is the best type of relationship for you. When we're talking about creating surface level relationships,

I also want you to remember that you cannot change this person and you cannot erase your past with them. And something that someone brought up today in group was like, I feel like if I'm having a surface level relationship with them and I'm just like keeping it light that it feels like I'm giving them a free pass for everything that they did to me. And then I'm saying, hey, it's okay, we'll just move on and kind of have this surface relationship. And this is where it's so important, I think, to step back and be like, if I feel this level of resentment for doing this, it might not be the right time. And maybe I'm moving too quickly.

And that there's also a very big difference between feeling like you're being forced into a surface level relationship to give someone a pass or to allow them to just move on without dealing with this and choosing it because it is the right, like, protective, best thing for you. And it's the kind of relationship that you want to have with this person. These surface level relationships also don't have to be forever if you don't want it to be. And that's why I really like to look at this as like an experiment, right? This is something that I'm just going to try out and see if it was. works for me on the road to a new relationship. And maybe I will find that it feels better for me.

It functions well. It's actually tolerable right now. And maybe it'll be like that for a couple of years. And then I have a baby. And then this person starts acting different. And I feel like I can no longer sustain this type of relationship. But I get to kind of move through life redefining these relationships and how I interact with these people in a way that works for me given the circumstances, right? I also want to point out that creating a surface level relationship with a family member that is very emmeshed or boundary violation, they're always encroaching and like getting on top of you is very different than developing a surface level relationship with a family member that is quite distant or avoidant. They both have their different challenges and levels of pain. I think with

this more domineering family member that just like bulldozes past boundaries, they have more of a challenge with like being contained, having a different type of relationship. You feel like it's a lot of work and a lot of effort. With the more distant or avoidant family member, there might be a lot more grief of like, gosh, we could be closer if this person would just try. Or like, I don't even need to try to have a surface level relationship with them because they're basically not speaking to me, even though they think we're close or they think we have a relationship. We really don't talk that much. And there's a lot of shades of gray in between. Something else that someone asked today, you know, is like, should I disclose this to a parent or a family member that like, I want to have

a surface-level relationship with them. And to that, I would say, like, no, you absolutely should not tell this person, I am exploring a situational support or a surface-level relationship with you because I listened to this podcast by a therapist, and I think that's all you can handle. If the person in your life could handle that type of feedback, you would not be having these conversations with them or or listening to shows like this. And I think this type of rhetoric often really sets off people like this. Defining the new relationship, potentially having a surface level relationship, is all about you.

You running experiments, collecting data, making the best decisions for you, you enforcing your own boundaries for yourself, and adjusting your behavior in ways that allows you to keep, some of the benefits of having this relationship and avoid some of the consequences. And I think that our family members, especially those that can be dysfunctional, are much more likely to believe what we do rather than what we say. And so you don't need to announce yourself when you're talking about a lot of this stuff. It's more about doing it. So I would love to hear what you think. Have you tried to have a surface level relationship with a family member?

Is this something that's worked for you? It's failed. It's helped you become closer with this person. It's improved your life or has it ultimately not been a good exercise for you. Please let me know in the comments. Send me an email. I would really love to hear more about your experience with this type of relationship. Thank you so much for listening. I will see you again in the next episode of calling home. And if you're looking for more support like this, we would love to have you inside the Family Cycle Breakers Club. at Calling Home. That is our membership community where we have therapists-led groups with me and other licensed therapists, as well as private community discussion boards and new content delivered to your inbox every Monday. We focus on a new topic every month. And this month,

we are wrapping up how to be more emotionally mature. So a lot of you have been attending those groups and working through that content with us. And it is all available on the website at callinghome.c. The Calling Home Podcast is not engaged in providing therapy services, mental health advice, or other medical advice or services. It is not a substitute for advice from a qualified health care provider and does not create any therapist, patient, or other treatment relationship between you and Collingholm or Whitney Goodman. For more information on this, please see Calling Holmes' terms of service linked in the show notes below.