CALLING HOME with Whitney Goodman, LMFT - Trauma From A Survivor's POV with Nate Postlethwait

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

This is an episode that every trauma survivor—and the people who love them—should listen to. Nate is an amazing speaker who discusses childhood trauma from a survivor's perspective, and I have no doubt this episode will deeply impact you. You can learn more about Nate and his work here. May at Calling Home - Grieving Complicated Relationships: ⁠https://callinghome.co/grieving-complicated-relationships ⁠ Have a question for Whitney? Call in and leave a voicemail for the show at ⁠866-225-5466⁠. Follow Whitney on Instagram: ⁠www.instagram.com/sitwithwhit⁠ Subscribe to Whitney's YouTube: ⁠https://www.youtube.com/@whitneygoodmanlmft⁠ Order Whitney's book, ⁠Toxic Positivity. ⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. www.ca slash yamex. Bank more oncores when you switch to a Scotia Bank banking package.

Learn more at scotiabank.com slash banking packages. Conditions apply. Scotia Bank, you're richer than you think. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the Calling Home Podcast. I'm your host, Whitney Goodman. I am so excited for our guests today. I have Nate Possible. on the show. He is just incredible at sharing from a survivor's point of view, and I have been

looking forward to recording with him, and I cannot wait for you to hear this episode. Nate is a writer and trauma survivor dedicated to sharing his journey of healing from complex post-traumatic stress disorder. After a successful 13-year career in real estate, he embarked on a global sabbatical where he began documenting his experiences with childhood trauma and mental health. This candid storytelling fostered a supportive community of fellow survivors. Nate has spent over two decades in therapy navigating the challenges of recovery. He emphasizes the importance of understanding the distinction between dysfunction and trauma, aiming to guide others toward appropriate healing resources.

And that is what I love most about him and his writing, is that he really gets to the core of what this actually feels like for people. has such a unique perspective, especially if you're used to following therapists like me or other clinicians who are talking about this from a totally different lens. I think you will love this episode. Let's go ahead and dive into that interview. I never planned on being where I am in this. I'd never planned on having like a social media following and talking about inner child work. I do feel like the universe kind of like was like, hey, this is a need. need. And so I'm participating. But I am like wildly introverted, very private. And so it's just,

it's a lot. And I've learned I value my story way too much to share it publicly. I feel the same. Yeah. The publishers that are just like, we'd love for you to write this, this, this, this. I'm like, I don't feel the need. I just don't know that this world would hold my story the way that I would expect it to be held. Yeah. Let's let's actually talk about that though, because I think you're the first person that's really actually said that to me. And I find that as a therapist with the work that I do, the number one question I get asked when I get on any interview is like, so what happened to you, that you do this work? And I'm like, wow, no other jobs really get asked that question, right?

And it's almost like you have to have this story that exists and that you're willing to share in order to like lend credibility to what you're doing. I don't know if you had that experience as well. Yeah, it's funny. I'm very clear on saying I'm not a mental health professional. I'm a writer. I also completely remove myself from the coaching realm because there's a lot of complication there.

And the way that I view my work is that my work isn't influenced by anyone other than my own experience. And so I'm able to say when someone says, what are your credentials? I'm like, to write? Yeah. What are my credentials to type words? Like, what do you need? And that's why I'm just very clear. I'm not a mental health professional. I'm not trying to be a mental health professional. I'm trying to change the conversation around complex trauma, especially around the childhood piece because it's just we're not covering it the right way. Yeah, that's, you know, and I think I come at it from a completely opposite perspective that I would say I feel very strongly that I don't allow or want my personal story to be part of my work, unlike the path that I've taken. And so I think this is a really good, interesting conversation then that what would you say you feel is wrong with how we've been talking about this? I know you just mentioned that with how we've been talking about complex childhood trauma.

I think it is underestimated the impacts of what happens in childhood shapes so much of what's to come. And so I think that someone who is 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 is looking at patterns in their life. And they are trying to make sense of things. And what they have access to is to be more positive, to let go of the past, to trust that everything happens for a reason, to have more faith. And yet there are very specific, intricate wounds that are 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 years old, that live inside their mind and body that they don't realize, like, in that moment, there was a version of you who could not handle that pain and shaped a life so that they could.

And that 10-year-old turned into a 15-year-old, that 15-year-old turned to a 20-year-old, and we literally build our lives around that out of survival, which is brave and wise, but also really complicated to untangle. Yeah, I have a post of yours in front of me that I just love, and I think it speaks to what you're saying, that you said trauma doesn't make people stronger, it damages their nervous system, hijacks their digestive track, keeps the person in a constant loop of hypervigilance to tell someone they are stronger because of trauma is to deny what it has cost them to survive. And I think in my world, like, that's changed a

little bit, but you're one of the only people that I have seen really publicly calling out this, like, trauma has a negative impact on you. And you can't just put a positive spin on that. What was the reception to you putting this type of thought out there? It was really interesting. I never set out to really change the conversation around how we talk about complex trauma. My goal in starting social media four or five years ago was this prompting of, hey, you should really share your story because I don't think that people understand the background of where you've come from. And then you start sharing these ideas. And my thought process was like, oh, especially some of my friends are going to be able to say, I didn't know it was that extensive. But instead, this whole community, came together and said, that's my story too. So a post like that is relatable to this like underbelly of people surviving very quietly because to address no matter what you come forward with, there are three slaps on the hand of how you're approaching it. Like if you think about victim mentality, people say, don't be a victim, be a survivor. Victim is not a bad word. And it has

become this thing where someone who is an actual victim of horrific trauma keeps saying, no, I'm a survivor. And it's like both can exist. Totally. It was recently someone said to me, do you think that victim mentality is real? And I said, yes, but victim mentality is the idea that you're a victim when you're not. Victim mentality are the people that are offended by someone expressing their pain and saying, this makes me uncomfortable or this bothers me or you need to be doing this. That's a victim mentality. Yeah, so true. The projections of it. So most of the messages that I've shared have been really well received across the board because I think that people are saying, I didn't know we were allowed to talk like this. Yes, yes. Yeah, and I think

that's the message that I get when I read a lot of your words is like, oh, thank you. Someone's finally saying the actual experience out loud outside of a therapist's office, you know, publicly and saying like, yeah, I was a victim. Someone, you know, utilize their strength, their power, their authority over me in this way that harmed me. And saying that I'm a victim can actually be empowering in a lot of ways. And I think so many people are afraid to use that word, like you said, they have to be a survivor because otherwise they're kind of playing into this negative belief about themselves. Or that you graduate to being a survivor at some point. Nope. I mean, I am no less a victim now of what happened to me 40 years ago than I was then.

I was a victim of those specific things and that doesn't change. And that's not victim mentality. It's looking at that and being honest about the way people do use power. to hurt others. So what do you think you would say to someone who feels like identifying with being a victim is going to like hold them back in life? I think that you have to find the underbelly of people who are talking about the real context of pain and recognize it's normal to attempt to heal and be surrounded by 95% of people who project back on you because you represent something that they're not

willing to look at it themselves or in their environment. So I think that truly the most vulnerable do walk through this world and have projection on them all day because they're not representing the status quo or what makes other people feel comfortable. And so I would say find that underbelly, find the people who do speak that language and know that there's millions of people out there and that being dependent on people who have never done any reflection or don't have the self-awareness or for a part of the trauma you've endured. Yeah. It's going to make you feel crazy. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's so true. And I think

you're right that like, you know, when I was writing my book, Toxic Positivity, like I came up against a lot of pushback about people. They don't want to admit a lot of the things that really happen to people in life. And when I work with family relationships and estrangement, I think our denial, about how awful some people are actually treated in this world and even at the hands of their own family members stops us from even wanting to like get into that conversation, right? Because I think a lot of, like you're saying, a lot of the world doesn't realize what's actually going on in some people's homes, you know, before they get to work, before they get to school that you just don't know about.

Agreed. I think that those people, they don't know it themselves either, the people that it's happening to. You're surrounded by what your normal is. And so you move about and you adapt to whatever is being presented to you. I really think a lot of people, I don't like these conversations where people are suggesting that people are digging at something that's not there. I've never come across someone in my space who did not have severe complex trauma. I have never heard a mild story where someone was like, yeah, my feelings got hurt a lot when I was a kid. It's like, If anything, you hear the other extreme where someone says, I think that my childhood was pretty

normal. And you're like, tell me about it. And she's like, well, my dad would throw the frying pan at my mom. And it was just like, yeah, yeah. I mean, if that's what you know, that's your norm. So I think that a lot of the people who are the victims of complex trauma don't know that it's trauma. It's all they know. It's so, it's so true. And I also have that same exact experience, you know, especially in the estrangement world where people say like, oh, they just became estranged because they got their feelings heard wherever. I'm like, I have literally never heard a story that even comes within five miles of that. Like, it's always so much more extreme than you would think, you know, which brings me to something else that you wrote where I love this

one. You said, please stop encouraging reconciliation when the person who did the harm isn't even sorry. Can you tell me more about what what you were thinking, you know, when you wrote that? Think about how basic that statement is. Think about how just not to discredit myself, but just how basic and borderline and plain that statement is. Yep. And yet for people to have such a large reaction, it's just like, why in the hell would we ever tell someone that reconciliation is the goal and the person who has traumatized them has never even said, I'm sorry, has never even acknowledged. The role that enablers play is just so significant. I think that they are just as, if not more dangerous than the perpetrator. And so I think that it's really more towards

that middleman who says, well, family is everything and you really need to forgive. And they're not even scratching the surface of the reality of what's going on in that person's mind and body. So it really is, in a weird way, it's kind of sad that these statements do as well as they do because they're so, like, it's such a common basic, like, don't tell people to reconnect with someone who traumatize them. And it's just like, well, but. Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm good. Thanks. Yeah. I mean, I could fill a book with all the emails, messages I have received from people that will tell me I am destroying families by saying something as truly just basic like this, right? And that's why this statement really stopped me in my tracks because I was like, wow, so true. Very basic to the point. But people are going to push back on that because there is this expectation that reconciliation always has to be the goal. right? Especially with family relationships. I hear that from a lot of enablers, like you're saying external people that like, no matter what a family member has done to you, we should be working towards reconciliation. And do you think that reconciliation is always the goal? Like, how does that

fit into your work? I don't think that reconciliation should be on the table. I think the healing of the traumatized person should be the goal, period. Interesting. I don't, I think that reconciliation is this barrier that puts more weight on them that says this is where you're headed. And that person's body is saying, I don't want to be close to them. I mean, when you're talking about incest and sexual abuse and these different stories that that's all I know in my space. That's all I know in my online community. I do not have, like you said, the five mile thing. Yeah. I do not have a single person in my space who has ever shared my story and not provoked deep grief in hearing what they've endured. Not a one. So I want to tell you.

one of the things that happened recently that was really interesting to me was I put up a comment about estrangement and this young gal who appeared to be in her 20s shared the most beautiful poetic heart-wrenching story about her relationship with her mother and then an estranged mother came onto that young girl's comment challenging her correcting her and giving her another side of the story. And I removed the person's comment and I removed them from my space. But my thought was, I am in no way connected to you. I do not know you. You're a complete stranger. But the fact that you cannot read the room and see how many people were impacted by this young girl's bravery and holding space for the horrific trauma that she just told, you just made it about you. I don't know you, but I know that I would not want to be your child. if I know that you are a complete stranger to me who does not know how to respect another person vulnerably sharing something that is helping all these other people, I know for sure I would not

want to be your child. Yeah. There's something about that. But on the flip side of that, when I hear those parents who check in and they write comments about all the mistakes that they've made and how hard they're working, oh, I cry every time. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. crap like the ones who are saying like I would give anything to have known this I really did damage to my child here's where we're at and I'm just like I want nothing but so much good for you that's when I think that you know I still have to pull back and just say I'm not their child and I don't know what happened but I know what that parent is saying is with so many long to hear and they'll never hear it yeah yeah absolutely I think the the first thing that you said like gave me chills about

someone kind of coming into the space and doing that. And that is like the fastest way to get blocked on my page as well as to do that. But you do get this sense of like, I can see how you operate in the world, you know, when you're willing to do that to a stranger. And that tells me, you know, maybe where you're at right now in terms of your ability to see other perspectives and and heal. And then there are those stories of parents who, whether it's too, late or not, I don't know, is up to their child, but they are seeing it. And I agree, like, we've had some of those people in our groups at calling home. And I see the other adults there whose parents are doing that being like, thank God, you know, I see this and at least somebody

else out there. And it's so powerful. Somebody tagged their daughter one time and said, love you, baby girl. I'm going to cry when I say this. She said, love you, baby girl. I'll never stop being sorry. And her daughter replied and she said, I'm so proud of you, Mama. Oh my God. I'm going to cry.

Right? Like, that's what we're looking for. Yeah. That's what we're looking for. And like, who knows if the mother started healing first or the daughter started healing first and the daughter brought it back to the mom? Who knows? That's reconciliation.

Yeah. That's when it's available for all parties. And they are going to just be so good to each other for the their lives. If either of them approached that with reconciliation being the goal, neither would have been able to heal. Yeah. I think what's so different about the reconciliation that you just described, you know, where both people are being open and honest about their pain, there's an apology, there's recognition, there's accountability. That's true reconciliation that can happen when both parties are ready to do that. What I find most people actually want

is not reconciliation. They want to brush everything under the rug. They want to act like everything is normal and be able to pretend. And the abuser or the estranged person, the enabler, like, doesn't want to do all the other stuff that maybe the person who has been victimized needs in order to achieve reconciliation. I love what you just said, because you're right. Like, even when we call it estrangement, that's not what we're really talking about. We're talking about denial. talking about abusing power. We're talking about complex trauma. We're talking about breaking cycles. We're talking about the scapegoat role. And estrangement is kind of that bridge that represents all of these other stories that have been swept under the rug. And it's easy for someone who's

not willing to do any self-reflection to call it estrangement and just blame everybody and just say, they went no contact. They ghosted me, this, this, this. And it's just like, there's always 10 layers deep. Yes. Underneath that title of estrangement. We're not really talking about estrangement. We're talking about a family system or a relationship where someone is not willing to address the truth of what's happened.

It's so true. And I think that's the one thing that I, you know, when I do work with parents that I have to really push back on is like stop focusing and telling me exactly what happened right before they went no contact, right? And I think that's what I love about your work is that you're talking about all the things that may be culminated in this moment. But I think some people become so fixated on the last time I saw them, they were okay. Or we had this small blowup over this little thing. And it's not about, it's honestly, I think it's like never about the very last thing that happened. It's like you said, all of that buildup just leading to that moment.

The thing that I always look for when someone talks about, and I don't do any type of consulting or coaching or conversations with people that are trying to figure that out, I also believe that it is a dangerous and slippery slope for someone to ever suggest someone else to become estranged. If someone is in a traumatic, abusive situation, we're not talking about estrangement. We're talking about saving their life. But I think that when someone is wrestling with estrangement, I just, I think it's something that you help someone come. to terms with their past, present, and future, and truly empower them to decide. I could care less what someone else decides about what is right and best for them. And I think that there needs to be on social media, I see things at times where people talk about estrangement or no contact. And I'm like, you're not really presenting both sides of the story. You're not really showing how painful

and complicated this process is. It's not simple. But when I look at a situation and I hear one person, talking about themselves the entire time, it's like, listen, that's just difficult for anybody to be in a relationship with. When you hear the parent, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me. It's like, I don't know how you are not seeing this. And your child is just giving you one sentence of like, I wish you gave me room to breathe in. It's like they respond with 10 sentences. It's like, yeah, estrangement's not the issue here.

I know that it seems like you can point at that and call it estrangement. way more to that story. Yeah. I love what you just said about, you know, the abuse part in seeking safety that I think that that's what gets lost in the conversation is this is never about promoting estrangement as a solution or as something that's going to fix all the problems. It's really about when I think about it, it's like, how can we keep you safe? How can we make sure that you can live a life that is free from additional trauma, you know, from this person? How can you be yourself and live a life that's meaningful for you. And some people have to choose estrangement in order to have those things. But it's not ever just like estrangement or no

estrangement. You know, there's so many shades of gray in between. And what I find is that most people are not always processing things that happen to them in childhood. It's that their parent or their family member is still doing it today. And that's part of the big issue. I don't know if that's something that you run into as well in the conversations that you have. I can say that in my own personal life, when I came estranged, my assumption, before I became estranged, my assumption was that I was bringing information and all of these details to the table that I thought was going to make me less problematic and needy to our family. I was finally going to be approved, accepted.

And so there was an excitement of just like, oh, yes, I am the most effective person in our family, no doubt. But maybe it's because they did this. And this was like a list of 20 years of horrific neglect, abuse, and trauma. Once it's presented, the assumption is like, we're going to come together. And no one even responded. did not even acknowledge like this effort that I made to say like, hey, we need to talk about these things. And I remember saying to my therapist, if for whatever reason this does not help the tension that's always there, I have to be done. But there was no part of me that

actually believed or thought that that would be the case. And that was the case. And it really was this moment where I felt like such an idiot that like by shining a light on all of this abuse and trauma that had been done to me in our home, that was the moment where my family was just like either be quiet and adapt better or we go our separate ways. I don't think that people are prepared. I know that I just, I was not in a place where I thought that's what's going to happen. You know, I think that there's just a vulnerability. If you've been in that scapegoat role and you've been made to believe that you're the problem. I grew up in the South, youngest of seven kids, gay, undiagnosed autism, not fun in the South. Deeply, deeply

religious family. There was nothing that fit in my world. And so I just absorbed and digested being the problem. And it was always looking back thinking, how do I adapt better so that I get treated like everyone else. And that's that vulnerability that we're talking about. There are people that really see the vulnerability and other people. And it just spurs darkness in them. It spurs something where they see opportunity. They do not see vulnerability. And so even when I'm presenting all of this stuff, I still believed there was something about me that caused it. But I never believed this is going to be one of the last times you speak to your family. Like this is going to be the divide, you bringing these things to the table is going to be what kind of puts

the nail in the coffin. Yeah, gosh, I'm very sorry that that was your experience and I really appreciate you sharing that with me. And I know that I know there are a lot of people listening right now who have had that experience because I speak with hundreds of people who are estranged every week in the groups that we run at calling home. And this is a trend that I am, I don't want to use the word trend because that gets used incorrectly a lot in this space, but it's a, it's a pattern that I'm noticing that there's a misnomer, I think, out there that a lot of adults who are becoming estranged from their parents will cut their parent off and the parent is like fighting to get them back and, you know,

that's kind of the dynamic. And what I'm actually hearing a lot more of is what you're talking about is like, I did all this work. I thought I was going to come to them and have this, you know, we were going to have this like awakening as a family and we were going to be closer. And instead, I got crickets and radio silence. And it's actually more like the family did the cutting off than you. You know, they, yes, you brought the pain to the table, but they didn't, they decided not to do anything about it. And that is so painful. I think that results in a different type of wound than people who say, I'm going to set a boundary and I'm going to, you know, cut my family off because you tried to show them a way forward with you. And they decided not to take it. And I think that's so painful. And I'm hearing just more and more stories like that come out every day. And it's, it's so sad to hear. I will say, you could have never convinced me in that moment that that was going to be one of the best things that ever happened. for me. Tell me more about that. It's been over 10 years. And for me, I just, I wish I had done it

15 years earlier. I wish I had done it when I was 18, to be honest. And that's not a promotion of estrangement. That's a promotion of my story of just saying, I know for me that I would not still be paying for things that were going on in my world, which I am still paying for, had I become estranged earlier. And again, it's that thing where it was my norm. It was what I knew. And so I did what I thought was necessary to hopefully eventually be a part like everyone else and over-extended every part of my life while no one ever did me a favor. It's just that very typical scapegoat role. Yeah. And it's different for everyone. I think that while I can say I I wish I had done it 15 years earlier. There's going to be people who say, I wish I had not done it.

I did it too soon. It's of course. Barying for everybody. There's not a way to say this is how estrangement works. It's looking and saying, what is healthiest and best and right for my well-being and the life that I want and where I go from here. Yeah. You said that so perfectly. And I think that that's really at the heart of like why I even have this podcast is just to tell different stories about different families and different ways that people handle things and not to be prescriptive about any of it because you're right. Someone could hear your story and say, this is exactly what I needed to hear and this is what I need to do. And there are other people who are going to hear it and say, you know, I wouldn't have made that decision because we are all so profoundly unique in the

way that our families operate. But I would love to hear, you know, a little bit about how your life has been positively changed or some changes that you've noticed, whether that's mentally, physically, emotionally from the work that you've done. I was diagnosed with CPTSD in 2009. Okay. And I had been in therapy for 13 years, but it was religious therapy. It was absolutely no connection to anything realistic, a lot of conversion therapy prior to that, which was horrific and truly. Was that something that your family had put you in? Okay.

If you don't may answering that, of course. Yeah, it was an ultimatum. Just like, you know, being gay is the worst thing ever. Here are your options. And so that conversion therapy was just, it's a mind fuck. Like that there's no other way to say it. It's horrible. I did that for quite some.

time and then just was just in this like religious bubble and environment where I was kind of floating through and didn't have any type of words or language for my reality. And I think because I had been in therapy for so long, when my body and mind started to kind of unravel, that's when I was afraid. And the resources that I had, the therapy I was in was just like memorize this Bible verse, surrender this to God. And I was just like, I am. I'm doing everything that I can, but like I really do need to sleep. Like I'm having repairs. And I still need to be able to have something that feels like this is going to get better. It got so bad that I went through a period of almost a year where I shut the blinds in my home. I could not see light. I could not

hear noise. And just I could not, I would grocery shop at 2 o'clock in the morning. It's a very, very dark period, I checked into an outpatient center and they said, you have C PTSD. And they were showing me this rap sheet of like, you have this history here, this here, this here, this here. It's one of the first times I heard someone speak about conversion therapy as being traumatic. Yeah. And so it was confusing for me because part of me was just like, well, I'm still kind of in it. Like I wasn't sure. I wasn't practicing conversion therapy, but I was in a religious environment that still viewed it as being wrong and that I was waiting for this thing to be healed in me. And so I think that through that process, even when I was diagnosed, my approach was,

okay, well, just tell me what, whatever it is I'm supposed to do to make this CPTSD thing makes sense. Just tell me and I'll do whatever you, whatever you say. I did so much EMDR. I don't recommend the way that I did. I mean, I was doing like eight hours a day. three days in a row because I was in such bad shape. I did, I think in the end, I did like 10 intensives of EMDR. Okay. But I was in such dire need in the beginning that really did save my life. What I noticed after doing EMDR and starting to get trauma-informed care, the first big change was being able to read. I had always loved books and admired readers. I'm not kidding, when I tell you, I could not sit down and read a book without my mind going at a pace that was just impossible.

I was always dysregulated and over-stimulated 24-7. So that was the first thing I recognized is like, I can read. I can sit down. Like, this is shocking to me. I moved out of the south. I moved away. As soon as I got back from the outpatient center, I kind of knew that I needed to get away from my environment.

After a lot of that, I think the biggest shift for me was learning to read. really enjoy my mind and body, when you feel like a prisoner inside your own mind and body, and it's not from anything that you've done, it's just from stuff that people have piled on you. And you get relief from that for the first time. You're not in a hurry to reengage with a whole lot of people and build a life that's like really active and stimulating. I've taken the biggest step back from life, especially over the last 10 years, the last five for sure. And I think that in the midst of all of that, one of the biggest shifts, too, was like me creating my own dialogue around inner child work. I had this experience that I wanted to understand inner child work more.

And so I did my own thing where I like taped all these photos of myself from five to 30 and wrote my favorite quotes around them on the wall. And for a month, I did these ceremonies of like looking at different parts of me and talking to them and saying, what do you need me to know? Yeah. And that shaped so much of me being able to be inside my mind and body. The way that interchild work had been presented to me a couple of times, it just didn't register. Yeah. It did it. I didn't understand it.

I feel similarly about it. Yeah. It was strange. Like the first time a therapist explained it to me, I just, I didn't get it. And he was like, now, are you ready to invite, you know, five year old Nate in the room? I was like, yeah, I bring a fucker in here. And he was like, wait, what? Yeah.

And I was like, are we killing him? Like what I'm doing? Am I disciplining? I don't understand what we're doing. I don't understand the assignment. So I kind of, it was 2015. I just, I did this thing for a month. And at the time, it was funny, I was leading a men's group and they would walk into my home. They would look at this wall of all these pictures of me and these clothes. And they were like, what the hell is that? I was like, I don't really know, but just don't ask. Don't tell anybody you saw that. It's just something I'm working on. That is the foundation of what I teach. you about now. Okay. It's just that the power of being able to look at a past part of you and saying, what did you learn about yourself from that experience? How is that shaping you now? Because I need you to back off a little bit. I need my 14-year-old self to not feel like they're in control. Yes. If I'm on a date or having intense conversation. I need the six-year-old to feel like they are completely integrated into my world. Oh, hi, buddy.

Who's the best you are? I wish I could spend all day with you instead. Uh, Dave, you're off mute. Hey, happens to the best of us. Enjoy some goldfish cheddar crackers. Goldfish have short memories. Be like goldfish. That, I think, has just been the thing that's resonated

most with me is just like looking back and realizing those stories live in all of us and we live in a world where if you try to tap into that, there tends to be these 16 messages that come back to you real fast. And none of those messages are saying take a pause and try to find out what's living in your mind and body. And then consider how has that shaped the way you think and respond to the world around you? How has that shaped your relationships? How has that shaped how you're showing up for other people. My experience has been, I have been able to very fortunately attract the most tender-hearted, vulnerable, sensitive, caring humans I have ever met in my life. I love to hear that. I don't come across a lot of people that it's just like, you know,

you're tough, you're a pill. I come across a lot of people, especially in my online group, you sense tension when someone joins at first because they're all waiting to see like, at what point is this person going to turn on me and tell me that I'm not valuable. You feel their vulnerability. Yeah, I understand that for sure. Yeah. What you just walked us through, I think, is so profound and helpful for people to hear because what I have noticed and why I love doing group work now is that when people get

to hear stories like what you just shared of here's how I walked, you know, from over here to over here, and this is what I experienced along the way. It is so helpful because I'm sure you know that when you were in spaces, you know, the story you're telling us about being in your place with the blinds clothes, it's like it feels like there's no escape from that, whether it feels like there's no escape from your mind, your physical location, that to hear that somebody got out of that and came to the other side, I think can be one of the most helpful thing. So I I know that what you just shared is going to be immensely helpful for people listening. The other thing that I wanted to ask you about is, you know, you are a male sharing in this space from a survivor's point of view.

It's something that I don't come across often. And I'm wondering what that's been like for you, if that has played into your experience at all. In what way? Because there have been some negatives at times where I feel like people have projected on me and- Sure. Negative and positive. I think it just, you know, I've noticed that people respond differently to different types of people. I am going to evoke different things. You know, in an estranged parent, I tend to trigger certain things because of my age and things like that. And then I, I just think it's interesting what we can evoke in people as writers, content creators, in this space and how that plays into the work. I think that one of my biggest struggles in life in this work in my personal life is I still feel apologetic too much like I want to explain who I am to make sure that someone's guard is down and I have this conversation with my therapist all the time where I'm able to say there I wrote about this a few weeks ago and I was shocked at how many people responded where I was I had a security guard follow me into a restroom and I have my noise cancelling headphones on. And it was in my therapist building. And I didn't hear the person behind me. And they started raising their

voice. And I was so confused. I had no idea what was going on. And I took my headphones off. And he was like, do you work here? And I didn't know who he was. He had no guard on. And I saw a different security guard. Long story short, he started yelling. And I start shaking. And I was just standing there. And I was like, I'm six one. I know that the way that I walk through the world, people would never look at me and think CPTSD, autism, gay, terrified at most times that he's doing something wrong or making someone feel a certain way because of his presence. And I think that that's always going to be a learning factor for me where I have to surrender

more that it's not my job to make someone see or understand me. I have received projection at times from, I think, someone who would identify as a feminist that I don't believe as feminist at all who has said, you know, I would never join your group because it's being led by a man. And I'm like, I didn't need that feedback. But thank you for seeing me as a man because I often don't feel like one. I'm going to integrate that phrase into my responses. I did not need that feedback. Yeah. On the other side, I think that it's been very healing for a lot of people. There was someone that left me a message on my birthday a couple years ago. And she said, I'm one of your younger followers. I'm 18 and you're the kind of dad that I

wish I always had. And I read that and I was just like, I'm not old enough to be a dad. Am I? Safe. I mean, I'm a mother of multiple children and I'm like, people must think I'm a nanny. My first thought was like, I'm an old enough to be a dad to an 18 year old. And then my second thought was It's like, I definitely don't have the maturity or the stability. But it's been really like 98% I think has been beautiful. Yeah. I also think that it helps that my work is really honest. I think that being autistic helps a lot because I don't have the temptation to be like,

let's say this, this way and do this. I'm truly, I'm so literal. The way that my brain works, I'm so literal. And deeply empathetic, I deeply care about the well-being. of other people. I often show up to my therapist on Mondays with just tears in my eyes of just like, I don't understand what's happening. And she walks me through like different processes. But yeah, for the most part, I think it's been healing. I'm very unapologetic about my work. When I start hearing other people's stories, it puts a fire in me to write in a way

that represents them too. 90% of every quote I've ever put up has a thread to my own story. I just chose to write it in a different way. Yeah. But when I see other people react and respond, I want to translate that in a way that gives them something tangible to hang on to, to say that there's a lot of people that understand exactly what they're saying. I think it's an incredible thing. I think that we need more men who are willing to share about their stories and show up in

that way. And what you shared is also such a good reminder that we don't know much about a person by just looking at them. And it's very easy to project our own feelings about how someone's presenting based on other people we've interacted with that maybe look like them in our lives. And that can be dangerous. I think it's very helpful to hear how that's impacted. You know, the way that you move throughout the world, it sounds like you feel quite a disconnect between how people perceive you and how you actually are inside. It's interesting. The person who made that comment about like, I would never join your, I like your content, but I would never join your group because, you know,

blah, blah, blah. I thought to myself, it's so interesting that you're projecting this thing on me that you, without showing any respect. And it was like, I don't need to be understood by you, but I deserve your respect. This is my space. And this is a place where I've created dialogue and provided tons of free content and resources to help people without a lot of expectation. and the fact that you're not able to show respect,

there's something deeper that maybe you should look at that doesn't have anything to do with me. Right, right. It's like, why make that known? You know, because you could just not join your community and then you're not joining it. You know, you don't know. That there's, there's of course, something else there.

But I do think because you are showing up as a writer, you're someone that says, you know, you're sharing from a survivor's point of view that sometimes people might find you even more accessible maybe than a therapist or someone who's operating for more of that like authority perspective that they feel comfortable sharing a lot more of the inside thoughts you know with you out loud which is it's hard to juggle on social media I mean I get it like it's I don't think anybody can really understand outside of like a few careers what it feels like to be getting feedback from strangers 24 hours a day and sometimes on things

that are deeply personal and vulnerable to you. It's a lot. I started sharing in 2020. Okay. I lasted four months and my work grew pretty quick and I got off in June of 2020. I was like, this is not for me. A couple of therapists, Leah Man Cow being one of them just like reached back out. I was like, listen, you've created something really valuable to people and you're coming from a unique perspective.

this is needed. And I was like, I can't take this social media. Like, this is so inauthentic. It was when a lot of therapists, Instagram therapists were also being bizarre and calling out other people. And they were suddenly all activists. And it was weird and showy and performative.

And I just left. And she kept reaching out. And she was just like, I really think you should consider coming back. Instagram created the guideline where you could turn her DMs off. So once I was able to do that, I turned the DMs off. I was getting 50 messages a day of just like, hey, Nate, good morning. And it was like rape, incest. And I was just like, you just get to a place where it's just like, you understand that there is such a deep need.

I always say I'm not a mental health professional, hoping that people would scale back. But I think that they look and they're like, he understands. And I do understand. But that doesn't mean that I have the capacity all day. to be exposed. A hundred percent. It's so much trouble. Yeah.

You also don't have the, you know, I've been doing this for a decade. And over that time, there's a skill set that you build up. And there's almost like a, you know, not like a calcine, but like you develop this way of interacting with certain people to kind of protect yourself. And I think there's also a difference when you're sharing about something that happened to you with somebody versus. that didn't, and I'm very careful about what I can handle and what I can't that makes it different. And, you know, you're showing up as, as you, as you're writing. And it's, it's a lot to

have to decide when can I open my DMs, not the first second I open my eyes in the morning. And it's, it's a learning curve, I think, just if this is kind of how you stepped into it versus I had been working as a therapist for a while before I got on Instagram. And then that just opened up a whole other world. So I get it for sure. It has been very clear to me that the universe and the healing world has said, like, listen, there's a lot of value and the way that you see this perspective and it's going to help a lot of people. But sometimes it felt like some of it was without my permission. Using a platform like social media comes with its own intensity where I think that people forget to see you as a human being who may hate social media.

media, but is participating in what they think is like something that's helpful. It's social media. I don't use it as an individual. Like, I don't use it for myself. I only use it for work. I never had social media until this. I had a Facebook account because I would have to RSVP to Friends Weddings, and that was the only way to do it.

And then I would delete the Facebook account for like three years. Yeah, back in the day when Facebook was the update. Yeah. And that's all I ever. ever had. And so that part has been interesting. I don't care if my account ever grows again. That is not the stuff that's important to me. I will say that like 95% of everything that's ever happened in that space has been so beautiful. But that five percent that has not been beautiful has been extraordinarily painful. Yeah. Yeah. And just keeping yourself insulated,

like to, I think using it as a tool to say I'm sharing this so it can get to the right people is easier than for me looking at it as a place where, like, I need to constantly exist and be like watching other people's stuff and keeping up to date, that that has been really difficult for me and not helpful. Agreed. So I get it. Sure. I love that in my group, when you sign on, I'm very specific in saying, if you're looking for

therapy or a support group, that's not what this is. That is not what this is. I'm not pretending or trying to be that. And I know that that's confusing because I talk about these complex things. However, the whole format is around understanding vicarious trauma and compassion fatigue. And so there is an 18 minute long video that every person who joins my group has to watch and agree that there's never going to be a time in that space where you can come share graphic details about anything that's happened in your life. That's not what the space is. Okay.

I take different topics and I do two sessions a month. We do one breathwork session. And it has been so incredible to see so many people say, Nate, I've been able to apply this outside of my life and start to protect my story more. I think that sometimes we don't realize that just because someone is talking about sharing context around something that is beneficial to me, it doesn't mean that you need to respond and share your whole story. Yes.

I have loved watching people start to have more respect for what they've overcome and recognize that sometimes by sharing, you are provoking a 14-year-old party of yourself that's saying, you haven't talked to me about that. Why are you talking to others? The healing that happens when you learn to protect that, when you learn to say, as uncomfortable as this story is that lives inside my mind and body, I'm not going to get more comfort by sharing it publicly and traumatizing other people. I want that conversation to change.

Yeah, that's very interesting. So the way that we think about vulnerability, vulnerability is not showing up and sharing graphic details of everything that's ever gone on in your mind and body in a public form. Yeah. That's not what vulnerability is. It can definitely become quite performative and open you up to more exploitation and unvictimization, of course. And I'm not saying it's not difficult.

Like when there's complex trauma to not want that to be able to share all of those things, there's just a time and a place and I'm just not one to think that the public form is the place to do that. I think that there's just a respect that shown this is like you have to believe that people know and understand what you've been through without you having to grudge every like drudge up every detail of what those specifics are. Yeah, I think the intention behind it certainly matters about that some people are trying to prove that they're allowed to feel the way that they feel. And that's where all the sharing comes from. You know, there's that line about sharing like from a scar instead of a wound, which I think is also very important, you know, not that you have to have a positive spin on it or tie a bow at the end, but more that I always ask myself before I share anything personal online. Like if I get any negative feedback about this, is it going to send me, you know, to a place that I don't want to go? I need to make sure that if people don't understand me, I get pushback that I feel secure. in my story. And I think that that's a really important thing to always check it. So wise. Yeah. Well, Nate, I could truly talk to you all day. This has been a wonderful conversation. I really appreciate you being here. Can you tell everyone listening where they can find you? If you have anything exciting coming up that you'd like to share, you can have the floor. I don't have anything exciting. I'm just kidding. I run an online group that is a, it's a writing group. I provide journaling

prompts twice a month on different topics right now. We're going through the theme is the softer side of healing and what it means to take up space, kind of understanding the pendulum between how we're taught this is being too much and how we're invisible and just trying to find the center of just like, what does it mean to just exist in this world where there is contentment and peace and the way that you show up, meaning other people can be or however they want to be. And I'm able to still move to centers as often as possible. that's the main thing that I do.

I love it. I do a workshop every other month. I started the first one that I did was healing from sibling abuse in January and could not believe how many people attended that. I've been shocked by the interest in sibling stuff. I've had the same experience. It's kind of the, that I tend to take on the taboo topics.

Lucky me, I relate to all of them. So I'm able to just like say, well, this is, I think this is how you. And what I do is, I try to show them without, I try not to make anything too intense, like in my group or in the workshops to never like rip off people's band-aids, but instead ease into conversations and to say, here's a list of things that you may be feeling in your mind and body. And here's why. And here are some things that you could do to take with you to move on. Whitney, I just believe

that everything is about peace in the mind and body, period. And that is being overlooked and that is being dismissed, and that's kind of the whole basis of everything I want to teach. I love that. And I think the writing aspect is so helpful. It's also something that, of course, people can use, you know, in their therapy or in other types of healing that they're doing. That sounds like this can be a great resource. So I appreciate you sharing that with us. Thanks for having me. Of course. Thank you. I noticed that many of you have been listening to this podcast, but you haven't taken the next step. If you've ever felt overwhelmed by the weight of dysfunctional family relationships, you're not alone.

Many adults struggle to break free from generational patterns and often carry the burden of family stresses into their own lives. Deciding to do something about it is a huge step. Calling home provides expert support and tools specifically designed to help you untangle your family dynamics. Each month, we focus on a targeted topic providing you with actionable worksheets, engaging videos, insightful articles, and in-depth guides all crafted by a licensed family therapist that can help you create healthier family relationships. All you have to do is sign up for the Family Cycle Breakers Club on our website to access our monthly content. Then you can engage with our worksheets, videos, and guides each week

to start transforming your family dynamics and join our weekly support groups to connect with other fellow cycle breakers and gain insight into your journey. If you decide not to take action today, you may continue feeling isolated, stressed, and burned by unresolved family conflicts. Those generational patterns could persist, impacting not just your life, but the lives of your children as well. By joining calling home, you can experience the relief that comes from connecting with others who understand your struggles. Imagine nurturing healthier family relationships and breaking the cycle of dysfunction, creating a more harmonious environment for yourself and your loved ones. Don't wait any longer to take charge of your family relationships. Visit our website today to become a member of the Family Cycle Breakers Club.

Sign up now and start your journey towards healthier family dynamics. I'll put the link in the show notes of this episode, and I hope to see you in a group soon. The Calling Home Podcast is not engaged in providing therapy services, mental health advice, or other medical advice or services. It is not a substitute for advice from a qualified healthcare provider and does not create any therapist, patient, or other treatment relationship

between you and Colin Coleman or Whitney Goodman. For more information on this, please see Calling Holmes Terms of Service linked in the show notes below.