CALLING HOME with Whitney Goodman, LMFT - What it’s Like On Both Sides of Estrangment With Kreed Revere

Episode Date: August 25, 2026

Content warning: This episode contains descriptions of child abuse and references to sexual abuse.Kreed, host of the Estranged Heart Podcast, shares her perspective as both a formerly estranged adult daughter and a formerly estranged mother, now reconciled with her daughters. Kreed and Whitney cover the common mistakes parents make when first reconnecting with children and what their children actually need from them instead.In this episode, you'll learn:- Why reconciliation is an ongoing process, not a one-time repair- Why "defending, justifying, and explaining" backfires with an estranged child- Why rushing contact after reconciliation often causes a relapse into estrangement- Why "what is within your control" matters more than trying to get the other person to changeConnect with CreedWebsite: https://theestrangedheart.com/podcastWhitney Goodman is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist (LMFT) and the founder of Calling Home, a membership community that helps people navigate complex family dynamics and break harmful cycles.Have a question for Whitney? Send a voice memo or email to [e-mail] the Family Cyclebreakers Club: https://callinghome.coFollow Whitney on Instagram | sitwithwhitFollow Whitney on YouTube | @whitneygoodmanlmftOrder Whitney's book, Toxic Positivity: https://sitwithwhit.com/toxic-positivitySign up for updates on Whitney's new book: https://cmnyyv4kpyt.typeform.com/to/PHMzjy0oThis podcast is for informational purposes only and is not a substitute for professional mental health advice. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hi everyone and welcome back to the Calling Home Podcast. I am your host, Whitney Goodman. I am so excited to be here with you today. I loved this interview that you're going to hear. It was honestly one of my favorite ones that I have done for the show. And what's interesting is that my guest today is a formerly estranged parent and also a formerly estranged adult daughter. Creed is the host of the estranged heart podcast. And many of you have probably seen her. videos lately reflecting on her former estrangement from her adult children and her mother on TikTok. And I'm so excited to have her on the show today to talk about her own personal experience as both an estranged mother and an estranged adult child, as well as her coaching and

reconciliation work with other estranged parents and her over 260 podcasts on this topic that she's done so far for the estranged heart. I love this conversation because even though Creed has been an estranged mother and she works with estranged parents, it's really fascinating. And I think honestly, made me feel so happy to hear how aligned we are in our approaches, in how we think about this issue on what we think parents should work on and the things that they can do to reconcile and the issues that adult children are also having with their parents. I think creed is such a breath of fresh air when it comes to content creators that are talking about estrangement, especially those that were estranged parents

and the approach that they are taking to this type of content. So I hope that you'll go ahead and welcome Creed to the Calling Home podcast. Let's go ahead and get to the interview. So, you know, the reason I wanted to have you on today is because I think that you are able to claim a title that most people can't. You know, you have been the estranged daughter and you've also been an estranged mother. And I'd love to hear when you work with parents, what do you think is like the most surprising to them about what they need to do to reconcile or what is, what do they resist the most? I think it can take a little bit of time for the parent to get to that space of understanding the child's wanting the repair. The repair piece is something that I, it takes

a good bit of time for the parent to get to. They go from this estrangement has happened to, I want to reconnect, but they don't understand how long that repair process actually takes. And so that's the big piece of it that is oftentimes lacking. How long do you think that repair process usually takes, like just in your experience, when it's been successful? I'm going to say something probably that I don't know that anyone else feels this way. I think in some ways it's an ongoing process. I completely agree.

Yes. I don't. I, so I have been at the end of this year, we'll have been reconciled with my daughters, one for nine years and one for eight years. And I don't think I'm like the reconciliation repair process is done. and most of my folks in my world are like, oh my gosh, you've been reconciled for almost a decade now. So everything must be, you know, happy, happy joy, joy. And I'm like, no, this is, this is an experience that has impacted our relationship. Full stop.

It will always be present. It will always be present in them on some level. And it will always be present for me on some level. And so it's in working through those because even this far out from the estrangement for me, there are moments that I still get triggered. And I'm like, oh, I don't, did I say, are they going to exchange it? Like, you know, and it's that trauma from the estrangement for me. Are they going to estrange again? Are they, did I say the right thing?

Did I upset them? Oh gosh, they haven't responded like they normally do. Have I said something that's upset them? So this is an ongoing process. It's not a, and I do try to clarify, it's not a process that I sit and think about consciously every day and, you know, before every, every thing I say or do. But it is, it's just always with us. Yeah. It's just always with us. I want to talk more about those two parts, though, because I think especially for someone listening who might be like working on reconciliation, that anxiety is important. But first I want to start with. you know, for people who, and tell me if you see this in your work, I think for people who did not do a lot of stopping to repair and reflect throughout the life cycle of the child, that wasn't really part of the relationship. They may have been the kind of parent that was like, parents don't need to apologize, or,

you know, what I say is right, or they just weren't very insightful about it. they feel like this should be an act of like, okay, we apologize and we repair and we move on because they're not used to that being a chronic part of the relationship, which is kind of how I feel as a parent in my relationship with my children is that that's how relationships work. We will always be hurting each other, hopefully not so bad, but then repairing. And so do you see that with parents where they don't really have that mindset about these relationships. Absolutely. Absolutely. That was where I was at. That's how I raised my children, right? I did not. There was zero self-reflection. It was my way, the highway. I don't have to apologize for a thing. And so when

the estrangement happened and then I started working through some of this in therapy, I remember going to therapy and saying, why can't I make this, make them do what I want them to do? Because that was what I had done with their childhood, right? So I didn't have control and I wanted control back. So, and I think that with, if we look at the generational patterns that we have here, right, boomer parents come from a generation where there really was not self-reflection. There was not an ability to go in and question a parent about something, right? They were very authoritarian ways of being in the world and lack of curiosity because curiosity oftentimes ended in punishment. So there was those things come into play with this. So this is I do so much of the

work I do and so much of my own personal work was education about how healthy relationships are actually supposed to work. Absolutely. Yeah, and a lot of these parents, like, it's not, you know, there are, of course, abusive parents who I think rule on control and authority and power. And there are parents like you're speaking about that just had no exposure to how this stuff is supposed to work. They got so far down the line, you know, kind of avoiding doing that work. And now it's like scary to go back and learn healthy relationships. And having no models of that, I also work with a lot of adults who had parents that actually did a lot better than their own parents, right? They broke some cycles. They stopped physically abusing their children or there's no sexual abuse in the family anymore. So I'm wondering how you work with parents like that who might be reflecting and saying, but I did a lot. Look how much better I did than my own parents.

And so this attack on them feels very unfair. Very unfair. And it just is. That's how they feel. Again, the work, the bulk of my work is helping parents to understand that intention versus impact. It just, that's, it all comes down, I think, to so much of it is about that. And being able to validate where they're at, I tell them, absolutely. You absolutely did.

You changed so much. And this other thing happened. right and just validating and allowing them to kind of sit with that without the pressure right without the judgment that there's so much judgment that's placed um i think on parents i mean obviously from the children but even from their own friendship circles their communities extended family members um and so it's hard to make space for curiosity it's hard to to to be begin to see anything else if we're under that thumb of judgment all the time. So so much of my work is just sitting with them and saying, validating, you did. And in letting them know, I agree with them.

You did change things. You did do things differently. And you were still human and you still made mistakes. Your children are human. They are going to make mistakes and so on and so forth down the line. I think that's so important. And the fact that you validate them and see that and try to kind of meet them where they're at, I think probably is very disarming and it motivates parents to, you know, be more vulnerable. I think it's got to be so hard to feel like, gosh, I did kind of break all these cycles in my family and now I feel like I'm being judged. And my work with adult children, I think, is, I get this feeling always from these adults that they are not asking for perfection. I hear it a lot from parents. They want me to be

perfect. But it's not what I hear from the adults. They really want to see that there is acknowledgement and that there is work happening. And that there's the ability to show humility, I guess. Yes. Yeah. And when you're talking about a parent who's been managing and doesn't think that they should apologize when you have a parent who, like one of my videos on TikTok, that's the biggest, it's the one that's had the most views and the most comments on it has been, wow, the accountability you've taken and the humility that you've shown. That is what kids are asking for. I tell parents every day, every day, your child is not asking you to be perfect.

They're not. They absolutely are not. I know it might feel that way. Right. It might feel that way. Absolutely. But that's not what they're asking for. Yeah.

They're asking for you to see their pain. They're asking for you to acknowledge that they are in pain. Right. Exactly. Exactly. Speaking of TikTok, how have estranged adult children received you on there? Like, what has it been like? It's been super interesting to me.

The estranged, 90% of them, of the comments I get are from a strange adult children. Okay. 90%. And of those 90%, 85% is really good. Thank you for doing this work. Thank you for showing up for your kids. This is all I've ever wanted from my parent.

I know my parent will likely not reach this point, but this has been healing for me to hear that a parent can reach this point, right? it's been comments like that. The 10% that are parents that are commenting are generally arguing this is a trend. When I say it's not a trend, they're saying they're asking for perfection and that they're entitled and that, you know, those types of things. So I have had a few parents who have come in and said two different types of parents. one are estranged parents who are thank you for helping me to understand this i think i have more work to do um so there are i am reaching some of those parents who i don't think want to be in the echo chambers but maybe don't necessarily know how to where to go or how to get out of that kind of thing

and then interestingly enough i've had several adult children as parents say i feel the way that you described how you treated your kids, I feel like I'm, that's me. And I want to stop. How do I stop? What do I need to do? How can I do this differently? And to me, when I get goosebumps every time I get a comment like that, because I'm like, oh my gosh, this is the work. This right here. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. Because of course, I think all of us doing this work, you know, myself included, want to stop these things before they reach the point of estrangement. You know, my goal is not to work with people who are all estranged and it's to prevent this outcome because I really believe that estrangement is a consequence. It's an outcome. It's

largely avoidable in a lot of families. And we can learn so much from people like you who have experienced it and come out the other side and reconciled. And we can also learn from people about what happened leading up to that, even if they haven't reconciled or they never do. I think it's a lot of this, like we're focusing on the tip of the iceberg. Like, estrangedment's bad. Estrangement's bad. Okay, cool. Obviously, estrangement is bad. Like, nobody likes it, but why is it happening? That's what I think is bad. And what I, want to attack, right? Absolutely.

Are those issues? Yeah. In your experience, like, if you just sort of had to throw out, these are the reasons I think that parents are becoming estranged from their children based on my experience. What would be like your top three or four reasons? Control issues. What I call D.J.E. Defending, justifying and explaining.

because that leads to invalidation of the child's experience, and that generally never works in your favor, right? I think the only time it can work in your favor is if it's asked for specifically. So if a child says, I need to know, I need you to explain to me why you did this thing. Then that opens the door and gives you permission to talk about that. But I think they do it so much. I know I did in the beginning so much of that and it just shuts everything down. But that, and again, that in the lead up to estrangement, all of that that's under the water of

the iceberg is just piling on all every time we're in the middle of defending and justifying all of those things that we've done are not done, we're just adding to the problem. So control that invalidation piece are, I think, the two biggest pieces of, of it. And I think that there is, I think there can also be a level of that identity that what will people think of me if I, if my kid does something wrong or bad or what I think is wrong or bad and not, and doesn't perform in the way that I think they need to perform, what, what will people say about me? Yeah, yeah. When you're saying that, are you referring to things like an adult child, like making a different decision about their life, whether that's

school partner, et cetera. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And so parents have this perception that for me to be a quote unquote successful parent, I need my child to do A, B, and C. And if they choose to only do A, now I have failed. And how will my community look at me as a result of what you have done or not done? Yeah. Yeah. And that's where I think it's so sad. because I feel like people who are really steeped in those types of communities, and this happens in all different parts of the world and cultures and religions, they have sort of been taught that their outward performance and, like, compliance within the group is more important than their connection to their child. And they prioritize that for a lot of very valid, deeply ingrained

reasons. And I think as a parent, that's got to feel so awful and almost like, wrong. Like you really have to fight that urge to prioritize the group over your connection to your child's. Yes, I agree. I definitely agree. And it, that's, you know, that deconstructing that is, it's a process and it's hard. It's, it's, it's, again, we come back to that identity of, I've harmed my children and that, that was never my intent, right? Thought I was doing what. I needed to do. Yeah, absolutely. You know, that brings me to like, do you see a lot of parents feeling like their children have an inaccurate perception of their childhood? Like they are fighting over different memories, different experiences. What do you normally see from the parent when

they're doing that? All the time. I see it all the time. And again, I come back to that both and, right are we i'll ask parents is that a hill you want to die on is that a hill you want to die on that you are right and they are wrong because that could very likely be the outcome that this terminates any option for reconciliation right um and i do a lot of work also in excavating like how why why do you think you're right and they're wrong why do you think they've rewritten history Right. Those types of things when, and oftentimes I'll turn it around and ask them. So I might have information about something that happened in their childhood. And I'll ask, if mom says that that didn't happen, how are you now feeling that your own, your mom says that didn't happen? You know that's what

you experienced, right? And then that's when you start again piecing some of this thing. But again, that's the U-turn, right? Back to their childhood, their inner feelings and experiences. I love how you continuously ask them to sort of experience, like put themselves in their child's shoes, in their own life. Because I think that's something that's really missing a lot from these strange adult children's childhood is like it's always been about how can I understand my parent. How can I take on their perspective? And the parent isn't really thinking about How hard is it to be this child? Or what was the divorce like for them?

What was moving all these times like for them? What was my cancer diagnosis like for them? We don't practice that type of perspective taking as much. Totally. One of the questions that I ask often of parents is, what was it like to have you as a parent? Great question. And that just kind of by and large, stops them in their tracks. And they're like, I, I've never thought of that. Right. I mean,

just quite frankly, I've never thought of it. Again, that was my experience. Didn't think about what it was like to have me as a parent. And when I started thinking about that, I was like, oh my gosh, I can't. As a matter of fact, I had an experience this far into my life with my father about two years ago. And in that moment, I said to myself, oh my gosh, this is exactly what my children felt growing up with me. That must have been overwhelming. Yeah. Very. Very. And I guess in essence, not that I needed to have proof, but it was like, now I get what they're talking about. Now I understand, like I embodied experience of what they embodied and experienced in their childhood. Absolutely.

I find that so many times when adults and their parents are talking about different memories, they think they're fighting over like facts, but they're actually talking about just perception and feelings. And when we get so caught up in the facts takes you out of the facts. takes you out of that. You know, of course, there are situations where I understand if a parent is being accused of sexually abusing someone and they didn't do that and they know for a fact it didn't happen, like, we can take that seriously.

But sometimes I find parents getting very caught up in like, no, we actually took you to Disney three times and we always bought you these things. And the adult child's like, I'm not talking about any of that. I'm talking about how I felt what it was like. when we took those trips or when you came home late and they're getting so caught up in the minutia. Do you, do parents kind of get stuck in that mud with you as well? Yes. And it takes time and lots of it to be able to, you know, I understand it's their protector parts coming in and like I just can't, I can't get on board with this hurt that my child says I caused, right?

So they're going to throw up all the things to self-protect. And so it's really slowly taking that and kind of walking it back with them and validating again their perception and their experience and then just slowly walking that back. But that takes so much time. That's why, you know, and here's another piece to this. So many of the parents are, again, they're in their 60s and 70s in some cases and they're like, I'm running out of time here. I don't have time, like, I don't, how long is this going to take?

You know, the kids are like, it's going to take as long as it takes. Yeah, I was there, right? It's going to take as long as it takes. And the parents, like, I don't have another 30 years to be working on this, right? They pull that clock pressure. Right, right. So in helping them to understand how slow this process has to work, we have to walk some things back.

I mean, I've got clients I've been working with for three and four years. at this point still doing quote unquote doing this work right not therapeutic work but working with them in this relationship with their child and how are we going to do baby baby baby steps to move it forward yeah absolutely i think it's so important that people hear that and all the data that we have on reconciliation like any any studies or like manualized sort of treatment that has been done on that really shows that this is a years, sometimes even like decade-long process, there is no quick fix. And we all want that, myself included. If anyone's ever been mad at me, like, oh my God, I want to fix it right away. You do not want to be walking around. And especially if it was

my child, I can fully embody and understand how that would feel terrible. And it's sort of like we've got to temper our expectations because the thing I've seen consistently go wrong, and you can speak to this as well, is when parents try to rush the process and push like the push the rock of the hill way too quickly. That is the number one thing. When I've been a part of, I'm approaching 100 reconciliations now. I've been a part of all of those. And when I see that, when I see some of them go back into estrangement. Luckily, not many of those do, but the ones that do, it's exactly that. The parent has pushed. They've wanted too much too soon, right? So they want that contact. They want that. Okay, now we're talking with one another. And so do I get to go on this next

vacation with you. Like, and I'm like, wow, no, we have to, like, really, we've got to pull back. Yeah, we're just talking about, like, maybe exchanging a couple of text messages or something. And sometimes parents are jumping to, like you said, we're going to go on a two-week cruise together right after we have just, like, barely reconciled. Yeah, that, the urge. And again, I mean, parents sit in that space of just, I just want to. I need my child back in my life, right? And so when that happens, there's this, you know, yay moment that, okay, now things are quote, unquote, back to normal.

Now they understand, I think, by and large, especially my clients, understand by and large that things aren't normal yet, but we can quickly get there because we're all in it together now, right? Like we're all headed in the same direction. And that is the, it's the biggest piece when I, when in my groups that I have, when I have parents who say, they're not answering my text or things like that. The first, my first question is, how often are you texting? Right.

Like those kinds of things. And that generally, it plays into it in some, in some form or fashion. And I mean, it's, it's common. And part of, I feel, the work, why it's so important to have support as a parent is to help you to, you know, be able to pull back when you need to pull back and understand why that's happening versus you kind of floating out there. Oh, now they're not talking to me. And so then most parents, if they've not had really good support or coaching or therapy around this, is then they go back into the grasping. And now we're just in the vicious cycle. Yeah. It's,

it's making me think so much about how important it is to talk, to have, external supports for the parent during this process. And I think we can, you know, kind of circle back to talking about like the Facebook groups and the groups that you and I talked about offline that I can sort of see this going two ways. So if you have this parent that you're talking about that is highly anxious and they're texting their kid a lot and they're like, oh, they're not responding. If that parent is in a group like yours and says this, they might get the response of like, you need to pause, cool down, breathe, go do these extra things, schedule a session with your therapist, whatever it is. I have seen this go the other way when people like this post

on TikTok or go in these Facebook groups and then they get this rush of that spoiled ungrateful Brat isn't responding to you. You should just block them, cut them off before they cut you off. And I think, gosh, how that could go to totally different directions depending on the kind of support this person is getting in those moments. Do you see that like discrepancy between the two? Totally. I mean, absolutely. Whatever, and this is another piece of this when I'm also working with clients. I'm like, what is your outside support? Yeah. Because sometimes they'll come in and they'll say, you know, my mom thinks I should do this, my husband thinks I should do that, my best friend thinks I should do this and that and the other thing. And we work through that. And I'm like, do you feel

that's helpful? Do you, knowing the work that we've done, do you feel that that's helpful? Well, no, not really, but they, you know, they just, they want what's best for me. I understand that. And they are, they're in a position where they want to they want it to be fixed so they're not uncomfortable too right you're uncomfortable they're uncomfortable so now everybody's trying to fix things when we have to practice the pause that's my another saying i have like we have to practice the pause and i know it's uncomfortable and i know it's not what you want right now in this moment and i know it's scary it's scary when you have to sit in that space of unknown are they going to text me back Have I upset them?

I don't know. It's a super scary place to be. Yeah. And that also reminds me of like how important it is to build up that sense of trust between the adult child and the parent of like, I am going to trust them to tell me when they are upset. I am going to create a relationship and a space where they feel like they can do that. And it's reminding me of, did you watch the Oprah special about estrangement?

Okay. So there was a part in that where I can't remember if it was Nedra Tuob or Lindsay Gibson said kind of like, if your adult child isn't coming to you and telling you what's wrong. If you're saying, I have no idea. You have to step back and ask yourself, why aren't they telling me? Right. And think about what are the conditions. And so I love that because it's something the parent can control.

I can't control if they're going to tell me or not, but I can control that if and when they do, I have created these conditions and this space so that it goes well. Like, do you think that's an important part of the parents' work? Totally. It's that space of take back. What do you, and I talk about this all the time in sessions, what is within your control? Let's work from that space versus. is wanting them to change, again, that outward focus, we turn it back inward.

What do I have control over? And then how am I helping? I use another example I use is if your child had a severe cut on their arm, you're going to take them to the doctor and you're going to do what the doctor says. If the doctor says leave it alone for three days, you're going to leave it alone for three days, right? Like we're the same thing. We're just on an emotional level.

It's the emotional piece of things. So look at this as I'm helping my child to heal by not forcing something to happen before it's ready to happen, right? Not forcing our way in and what we think needs to happen. And allowing our child and that autonomy is a huge, huge piece of, another part of this work, allowing your child to have autonomy, their own world. It is, that is another significant piece. Yeah. I think in my work, that is one of the main contributors to estrangement that I have discovered

through the stories of adult children that I have worked with is this lack of what we call in family therapy differentiation. So the ability to exist as a separate person from your family unit, while also remaining emotionally close with them and tied to them. Do you have parents come to you and say that they are upset about their adult child being different? I don't know that it comes out as that. I think that what I, and again, I think that maybe that's because the folks that I work with are, they're ready for something different.

right so I think that that that plays into it but I do know that I have talked with adult children who are in those shoes who have said those things it's not to say that I haven't come across something like that like I've had I've had a couple of adult children again who've reached out to me and and asked me to you know I've sent my mom your information um you know and then the mom reaches out and then we have a we have a conversation and um And they're like, I, yeah, yeah, no, I'm not, I'm not doing this. And it just is, on some level, it's soul crushing for me because I, as a formerly estranged adult child, I know the pain that this kid is going through.

Yeah, yeah, that's right. Because you have been on both sides of this, I think it just affords you like such a different level of credibility with parents and with adult children. I always tell people, I come to this from a very professional lens. I'm not as strange for my parents and, you know, my children are so young, they're not able to distance themselves at this time. But it is not something that I'm speaking about my personal experience with. And so I think for some people, that is a positive thing. It lends to sort of some maybe unbiased nature. And then I've also had a lot of people tell me, like, you cannot speak about this because you have not been personally affected,

which that's something that you run into, I think, as a therapist, I used to work in addiction. I don't have, I don't have any substance use history like that. And I would be told that all the time, which I think is really just coming from a place of, I want to feel like you get me. Like you understand me. You know what this. is like you've been in it, which is something that you are able to offer, which I think is really, really wonderful. That being said, there is another layer of this, I think, whenever you're sharing your story, especially publicly, and you have experienced it. And I'm wondering what that's been like for you on a personal level to experience some criticisms or pushback when this is

something you actually lived. I have to take that with a grain of salt, right? Because, and, And, you know, I think you have to have, you have to build some thick skin if you're going to be out in the public in this way. I know that not everybody, like there have been some adult children who have been like, you know, had someone the other day was said, I think this is fake accountability. And, you know, for me as a human being, I go, ouch. Like, I've done so much work. I've done, you know, all these things. And then immediately I'm like, that's hurt talking. That's pain talking. That's I can't trust my parent to show up in this way. Right, right. They think like no parent could ever show that accountability. Right. Yeah, exactly. So that has been, it's interesting. And I also, again, I've done this long enough. Professionally, I've done this long enough with my own children. in this estrangedment and reconciliation experience, that I'm now able, there was a time I wasn't on,

but I am now able to stand in that space and say, it's totally okay for you to have whatever opinion you want or need to have right now. I know, I know where I'm at in the world. I know what I've done. I know who I am. And it's okay. And that kind of leads me. me to the space of when I'm working with parents who have are super reactive to things, I tell them that's your trailhead. That right there is a hurt or a pain likely take that to your therapist. Here's something you might want to work with your therapist on, right? Because when we've, I feel when we've done a significant amount of healing work,

we are much less reactive to things we can hold space for a lot of gray area versus the black or white. It's either all this or all that. When I hear that, I know I'm dealing with someone in significant pain and they're not, they don't have the capacity right now to look at the gray. So we have to kind of work our way in from that, right? Absolutely. And I think that something I really respect about you is that you seem to be consistent speaking from a place of like in therapy we say a lot like speak from a scab not like a wound right like

don't don't talk about something that you're still very in the midst of especially if you're offering like advice and things like that because you might not be able to take the pushback and like vitriol that comes from that and I always say that to people who want to share about their estrangement publicly is like what is it going to be like to hear differing opinions on this, what's it going to be like for people to tell you you're wrong, you're crazy, you're awful, and can you stay rooted in your own experience in all of that? And if you can, and obviously we all have moments, myself included, talking about this topic has been just so dizzying for me sometimes because of the pushback.

But can you come back to like, I know what's true for me? I know that my relationship with, you know, for you with your daughters is good. And I know what's true offline, you know, when I walk away from this space. And that was kind of the last thing I went to ask you about is something else I really respect about you is that you don't speak for your children and you really don't talk about their story. And I've actually heard you say a lot of times, like, I'm only going to speak about my experience. I can't speak to what, you know, my daughters felt. And I'm curious, like, how they feel about your work publicly, like if you guys talk about it and sort of what fueled your decision to keep them largely out of it. That's their autonomy.

I don't get, I don't want my, I don't want someone telling my story. I want to tell my story. I don't want to tell their story. They may have things in their story that I have no knowledge of, no, I don't know about, right? And it's a, it's a bound, an honored boundary issue for me. Like, I want to honor my children. And that's a vastly different place than where I once was in my life with my children. I did not honor my children.

I heard something the other day. And it was, it was in reference to nursing. And it said, nursing is hard work. it is honorable work and it is heart work all at the same time and when I heard that I thought that's estrangement from my perspective and so this honoring piece of being able to honor the experience honor the people who are involved in it and their own story their own perspective of this experience is really important for me um I

you know, my, my daughters know about, obviously, about my podcast. I went to them and told them that this was what I was going to do, and they said, just leave me out of it. Totally cool with that. And that's where it's been. I do know that one daughter does listen on occasion to the podcast. I don't know about the other one. She's never talked about it. I have not told them, but I'm on TikTok. I imagine they probably have already seen that I'm on TikTok, right? But again, I want them, and I get emotional about this every time, I did a lot of damage as a parent, and I want the rest of their life to be something different,

a different experience with me. And if I were to go on social media, and blast them into oblivion. That's not going to happen. I want them to have a different experience than what they once had. And I want to leave this earth with them not just knowing, but feeling

that they had a mom who cared enough about them to do some really, really difficult work because they were worth them. Yeah, yeah, I love that. I love that. I think you are such a breath of fresh air in the estrangement, you know, content creator, coaching community. I love your approach. I resonate with it so much. I think we are very aligned in the way that we see a lot of these issues. And I think in a time when it's been sort of like, are you pro parent? Are you pro adult child? I am so grateful for you coming on here and speaking with me and seeing how you and I can be working, you know, with different sides of this issue to some degree and really be working towards the same goal in a lot of the same ways, which I hope for those listening is like a really powerful, amazing thing to see and to hear and your own personal story of reconciliation as well as the ones you've helped facilitate, I think are really helpful. to my audience. So thank you so much for coming on here and sharing that. Absolutely. Thank you, Whitney. It's been an honor, truly. Of course. And I will put links to your podcast, your website, all of that in the show

notes. So if anyone is looking to connect with Creed, whether that's for coaching, watching your videos, listening to your podcast, you can find that there. Fantastic. Thank you. All right. Thank you. The Calling Home podcast is not engaged in providing therapy services, mental health advice, or other medical advice or services. It is not a substitute for advice from a qualified health care provider and does not create any therapist, patient, or other treatment relationship between you and Colling Home or Whitney Goodman. For more information on this, please see Calling Holmes' terms of service linked in the show notes below.