Camp Gagnon - Lesbian Comedian Expert Advice On How To Bang Any Girl | Ashley Gavin

Episode Date: May 1, 2024

🏞️ Sign up for free and exclusive updates: https://camp.beehiiv.com/subscribeAshley Gavin is one of the funniest comics in New York City right now! She came to the tent to chop it up about her latest special, the downsides of internet fame & even gives us the secret on how to get ANY woman you want. WELCOME TO CAMP!Intro by ​⁠ Produced by ​⁠ TIMESTAMPS00:00 Intro1:16 Ashley being Jew-ish3:55 Her comedy special, perfect timing + social media’s impact9:40 It used...

Oh, I've never seen a penis. Ugh. Why the side? So in 2012, I was like, I wonder if there's a way I could see a penis live in a safe environment. So I posted on Craigslist, lesbian seeks penis for educational purposes. And so what happened? I organized a flash mob of men at a mall. I told them to all meet me at the mall wearing a red shirt.

No way. Probably a dozen men kind of milled through the area. You saw them milling around? Yeah. And they didn't just point it. You'd be like, are you lesbian? I was on a balcony. I don't remember what I was wearing.

I mean, if you're wearing anything remotely similar to this, they should have been able to be like, well, that's... So you still haven't seen a penis in real life? I've never seen one in real life. Are you ready? No. Apparently, the highest rates of domestic violence. Lesbians. Here's why I think that is.

Fair fight. Men are taught never hit a woman. Yes. But men could hit men. Sure. But why aren't they fighting at the same rate y'all are fighting? You know gay men. You can't fucking land a punch.

I can help anyone talk to a woman. And I am always right. My game with women, incredible. Can you put me on a little bit? There's a lot of men out there that would be very curious about your information. Why don't I have a podcast where I talk to men and I fix their romance problems? That's what I'm saying. Welcome to the show.

All right. We're about to start the podcast. So how do we do it? Ashley Gavin. We're live. We're live, dude. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me.

I love this place. And like we said, thank you for wearing your camera. Yeah, I wore the camo specifically because of the tent. Yeah. I went to camp in tents. So like tents kind of like this. I don't even know that, but I do know that. Right.

It's Evan and I am a human camp. If camp, counselor were personified, it's me. Yeah, exactly. I am camp counselor. You love hiking? I do. I love hiking. And things that rhyme with hike? Dike. I did not say that. I was talking about a Jewish slur, okay? But you can go there if you want to, okay? That is also what you could say.

You know, it's a very tired joke, but there is the Jewish camp joke that never, that never. I'm also Jewish, sort of. Are you really? Yeah, yeah. My grandfather's Jewish. So I'm Jewish on my mom's side. but it's not like a big part of my life because we were not raised religious but culturally pretty Jewish Oh wow

Yeah What was like What was your grandfather's last name? Bachman Oh hell yeah So yeah So yeah Was he on the run

Was he a runner? No They got out Okay My that side of the family Got out of Germany long before But they were German Jews Yeah

Whoa Do you know when they left? I think in like a while ago Like the 1800s Okay So they got out long before long before. They probably were seeing that shit like, whoo.

Well, I thought about going back through my ancestry and seeing who hadn't left, actually. Which almost inevitably. Yeah, yeah, some. A couple dozen. Who knows? Right? If they're, yeah. That's crazy.

You know, but. Well, you hope they're on that side, right? Like, if they're Germans, you hope they don't like somehow sneak on the other side or something. Well, it was a secret Nazi, like Jewish Nazi? I don't know. There probably was a couple. Yeah, you're right. There probably were.

I don't know. Blending in. They'd be crafty of them. You know what I mean? They're sneaky. They had a, they had, there's a specific slur for the Jews in the camps that were like elevated to. Oh, I've heard this. Yeah.

Like the Uncle Tom of Jews. Yes, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have heard that. There's some of that at least going to happen. I had no idea. Great way to start a pod, by the way. I'm not really Jewish, but let's do some concentration camp material.

Let's go, dude. Let's go. Hey, what's up guys? Sorry to interrupt this amazing program, but I need a little bit of help. If you're watching this on YouTube, you can probably see our subscriber number right down here. And if you're able to, it would mean the world if you could subscribe. That is the best way to support this show. Because when you subscribe, I'm able to show it to potential guests or to different brands and stuff like that. And it really, really helps grow the show, get us cooler guests, have cooler conversations,

and it helps everything so, so much. So if you don't mind, thank you so much. Let's get back to it. I mean, it's not out of character for you. I mean, I just watched your special. Oh, thank you. It was one, like I was telling you before, genuinely so great. Thank you.

And I wanted to make the caveat, like, I'm watching it. I was like, I'm, I wasn't surprised that it was great because of anything about you. You're obviously a great comic that I've seen in person and also in clips. But the special just stood out just as like a holistic work. Thank you so much. I could cry. It genuinely had felt wrapped up and you did cry at the end of the special, which was a little much. Okay, we'll say that part was a little.

No, that was fake. It was a trick. And it worked. No, it did work. He's acting. It was great. No, but genuinely, it like is a holistic work that wraps up, and I, like, have, you know, through working with Schultz

and seeing how much time he puts into his special, the amount of work it took to do that, it seems like it probably would have been a lot. It was a lot of, like, I had all the jokes, you know, because I'd been doing comedy for nine years. So I had, like, you know, I don't know how comedy into comedy your listener basis, but I had nine years of all my material. And, you know, like Hollywood wasn't really, working for me and the online thing had started working for me. So I was like, okay, I'm going to

join this group of comics that have done this. You know, kind of knowing that I'm like one of the only women like kind of doing it in that space. So I was like, I really want this to like be really when I watch a special, I want it to feel like a special and not an hour. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Even if that's on a subconscious like thematic level, it doesn't all have to tie together literally, but when I'm watching something, I want to feel like I watched a cohesive piece. And yeah, and then, and it was really cool to write it because I felt like I've never written a special. So now I've found my voice in a new way. Like I think I know who I am in my jokes, but knowing who I am on an hour long level when you're like tying everything together and how

you choose everything and what the theme you're going for, it was just such a fun. It was such a cool experience. Yeah, I think it was the right timing too. Like 10 years, I think it's probably like, the world of time that I think makes sense. I think sometimes people make the mistake, especially when they are like in a quote unquote unrepresented group, you know what I mean, to like do something earlier. Like they'll get like an industry tap at like five years in. Exactly. Yeah. And be like, oh, like you are our non-binary gay person or black person like do this special and then they're like not really ready and then it isn't as good as it could be. That drives me crazy as like one of these groups like the stuff where they're just like putting the like the one that they released a few years ago all of the comics who i love are in it but they have like 45 hours of gay comics each doing five minutes each and i'm like what the fuck is this like this is not the way to represent us or to pick someone too early or you know you want something really really good that's how you change people's minds you know like something really good and it was just like raw like you watch it and the point

that you drive home at the end, like not wanting to be seen as like, oh, you're a lesbian comic, you're a gay comic, I am just a comic that is gay. Yeah. Like, I think is evident. Like, it comes through. Oh, good. And I think the way you structure it, like, is, it feels like it is done in mind of people, for people that are both, like, of, you know, your community, but also for people like me

that are just, like, oh, this is just funny. Oh, good. You know what I mean? That's so good. Yes. That was my goal. Yeah. So that's really good to hear.

I think mission accomplished. Thank you. And also just the device of, like, having someone in the crowd, like, hey, you're my straight person. Yeah. It's just like so clever. Thanks. I think in my mind I was like, oh, okay.

It's a good, like, trick. If anyone listening likes performance art, having someone there, you can use them. You know, transitions are hard. Like really good transitions. Transitions that make you feel like you've watched something cohesive. Yeah. That's hard. Like, good transitions are easy.

In a conversation you're transitioning all the time. But like having someone in. the crowd to be like that you're talking to conversationally is a great little trick to like make people think that something so organic and authentic and it's like no i i actually do this every time and it's a very intentional device that i use yeah no it's very good it's very i thought it was awesome i think people should definitely go check it out thank you it was really appreciate it and what is the what is the trajectory since that has the response been wild online like the clip started percolating and was that the biggest jumper was the special thing that like took you

over the top in terms of fans. I think the special just what I've seen more from the special isn't a big jump, but I've seen more of a shift and like we like come up. This whole year was a process of going from being like that gay TikToker that I think people just liked to feeling like people recognizing me as a comedian as opposed to, you know, content creator. Yeah. So that was,

the special was a part of it for sure. Like I'll get guys sitting in the front row being like, I love your special. And I'm like, who are you? Where did you come from? And that happened later. That was, there was the initial pop of, you know, my people watching it, which was incredible. But the crazy thing was like a month and a half, two months, as I'm about to get canceled, literally to the day, my special started going crazy again. And I didn't know why.

The YouTube algorithm just finally started pushing it, I think, to comedy fans. and that's where most of the views ended up coming from. Oh, that's cool. So it took longer than I thought it would. By month two, I was like, this didn't do as well as I wanted it to do. But then it really took off. Oh, interesting. Which was, I'm very grateful for.

Huh. Yeah. Now, I'm so curious because, like, in my mind, and I think just in the mind of, like, a lot of dudes, especially guys that are like in entertainment or whatever, they're like, oh, being like a gay girl, you're obviously going to be, like have all the opportunities in the world. Like, all the opportunities from Hollywood, Netflix. Well, only one of us. us gets it. You know what I mean? I don't think guys are wrong. Des Bishop has the best joke about this. I haven't heard it. Oh, it's great. He's like, it's not hard to be a white man. It's harder than it was. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I did hear that. You know what I mean? But like,

that's objectively true. Like, you guys are having a tough time relative to where you were. It was sick back in the day. It was sick. It was an awesome run. It was incredible. I don't even, Honestly, power to you guys. You missed it. I genuinely did. I went to college in 2015. What's wrong with you? I'm fucking,

I'm too young. You should have gone out to Hollywood. Now, yeah, now you gotta care about people. I went to college, like the year that Me Too happened. Literally, it was like, yo,

we're in college, everyone was about to finger each other. Orientation is just everyone being like, I'm sorry. Bro, literally, like that was the vibe. It was crazy. I met my girlfriend

at the end of high school kind of with the idea, like, y'am gonna go to college, like, you know, I'm gonna be some bad bitch and you know what I'm saying?

And then I went and literally orientation, they told us if a woman drank alcohol and you had sex with her that it was considered. Because it could be. I decided to sit it out and I was like, you know what? I'm just going to get married. I'm going to sit it out. I got married at 23. Is that a fire alarm? I thought it was your crickets.

I was like, that's amazing. Did the sun just go down? What time is it? These guys are not fucking around in this tent. Yeah. Hey, Brandon. Are you there? Yeah.

All right. Are the cops here trying to... Are they here for you, Brandon? They heard you talking about women that way. They heard you talking about women and... Also, that wasn't just a fire alarm. It sounded like it went through like an audio filter. It was like really eerie and scary.

Yeah. And this is very like... We were talking about it earlier. This is like very cool. But you do... It does kind of feel like we're at... Oh, is this when I die? Fuck, dude.

Is it not? Is this when I fucking die? This is it, bro. This is it. All right, are we good? I hope so. I see it. Okay.

If you smell smoke, let me know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You might be having a stroke. Or maybe we're on fire. Maybe we're both having a stroke. Yeah, exactly. But I went to college in this crazy time and I was like, you know what? I'm just not even going to deal with it.

And I was not really one of these like fuck boy type dude. But I was like, but it's nice to have a run. You, like, it would just be nice to know, like to have the freedom. Just a couple times. Let's flirt. You know what I mean? But it was like, I'm not even messing with it. Yeah.

So I didn't even get to enjoy the glory days. of being a white dude. It was wasted. If I had a time machine, I would just go back to like 95. 95 was great. You know what I mean? Just like, do blow on Wall Street.

Yeah, yeah. 2015 was really the, yeah, you really did miss it. Yeah. But yeah. I think what people don't understand is that the opportunities are still,

they are going to pick, and I'm not going to say who, but they're going to pick one gay, female comedian, and they are going to fucking champion. champion her, you know? Like, they have their picks that they are going to develop, and if you're

not that pick, like, it's really hard. Maybe not at the lower level, but to get to that, you know, top tier A-list level, very, very difficult as a, as a gay person or anybody. You try the industry route for a little. Yeah, I guess. And then you were like, I'm good. I think it was around 2018 that I was like, this is not working. And then I had to kind of like bumble around a little bit. And then by 2019, I had started recording my podcast. I'd started recording everything, taped everything, taped all of my stand-up, just was taping, taping, taping, taping, just understanding that I had, because of Andrew Schultz, like we were saying, I was like, this is how I have to do this.

And I was looking at the podcast girls. I was like, like, guys, we fucked and girls got to eat and come town. And, you know, I was looking at all of that being like, that's how I'm going to do this. And then the pandemic hit. And I was like, great. let's edit you know and that that was worked out really well for me god bless rest in peace everybody but thank you pandemic for like i feel the same way i was like covid happened and all of us were locked in the studio i was with shultzzi and he was

like all right let's make some monologues yeah and literally we just like started writing and then like turned to like a Netflix thing and i was like everyone else was having an awful time and i was like yeah i know best thing it was sort of that i was stuck with my very hot brand new girlfriend. Yeah, fuck you. Like, locked inside during the time where we were having so much sex. Yeah. You know at the beginning.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like, oh, no, we can't leave. And then just editing old stand-up and I put it online and it was pretty much instantaneous in that it was working instantaneously. And I was just like, let's go. And that's all I did for like a full year. That's literally all I did. Were you doing stand-up during COVID?

Yeah, I was doing some of the outdoor shops. I ran an outdoor show. Oh, cool. Yeah. And was it fun? How was it? It was fine. I didn't really do anything.

They weren't, you know what? I don't think you really missed out on anything. That's kind of how I felt. I was like, it's sort of cold, and we've been doing shit all day writing these monologues and doing pods. And I was like, no, yeah. Is it worth me, like bombing in a field? No. You know what I mean?

Like, like, to my ego. Did you have to bring it back to World War II again? I'm so sorry. I know this is triggering for you and your whole comp for whatever. But literally I was like, do I really want to go out there and just like eat it after this whole day? I did my show. I didn't do a lot of other people's shows. So I'd work on my new material.

Honestly, looking back, I don't know that I used anything from that period. Now that I'm thinking about it. We're like slightly less depressed. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just working my shit out, you know? Which is cool. Yeah. But it was a good time for me.

Yeah. I learned a lot about editing and social media and podcasting. So that was just your lap. you just figured out the whole game. Yeah. And then initially, are you hitting, like, people that are like you hitting, like, gay women? It's only gay women. Well, the other thing that was happening that I'm not sure the streets know about is there was a renaissance happening.

The Bushwick Renaissance. The pandemic was the best thing that has ever happened for Safik women. All of these women, sapphic, like women loving women, bisexual women, pansexual women. You don't know the word sapphic? I feel like I've heard it in like a Greek sense, but like I've never heard it in a conversation. So, Sappho's, okay, whatever, I'm not going that far back. We can start, we can start in 2020. Women were at home with their boyfriends trapped for months.

Yeah. And they all said, bro, I'm not fully straight. That's what women, you give women time for introspection. They're going to figure out they're bisexual. This is why you guys need to be working. Okay. This is why I'm over. proponent of women in the workforce, okay? Because you have idle hands or the devil's workshop.

Exactly. And lesbians are of the devil. As we know. And so many women were coming out. So I just got lucky. Like my podcast came out. My clips were doing well. All of these women were coming out. It was just like the universe colluded for me at that time. It might have been a social contagion. They might have seen you. And you might have been. I am a flipper. I will say that. Is that true? Oh yeah. I'm a big time flipper. No way. Well, people aren't really like as closeted as they used to be. So I would argue a lot of the women that I've flipped.

And also the term flipped is problematic and I don't care. Wait, why is it problematic? Ugh. You see, this is the- They're not problematic for your people. You guys and your whole thing. Put in the comments why I'm a problem. Okay.

We will not read them. I'm tired. I'm tired. Don't use my camera. Then you're your own camera. Talk to those, that camera out there. There's one out there. Come on.

I'm tired. I don't see why I flipped. I mean, all. I don't know most things. Don't worry about it. We'll move on. It's the idea that an orientation is something that can be changed. Oh, it necessitates that...

They were exploring with me. I see, I see, I see. Okay, that makes sense. Yeah, you're a scumbic. Now that I get it, I completely agree with them. After this one sentence of explanation, you are a fucking piece of shit. Yeah, I'm an asshole. Wow, I didn't know that you flip a lot.

Yeah, yeah. I didn't like a lot of bisexual, more feminine women. So when I was younger A lot of the women Had never been with women before Now that I'm older It's less Is that annoying if a girl is just like

Exploring with you And then she goes and married some guy And you're like Really? You told me you were gay And all of a sudden She had sex with me So I'm happy Okay

So you are dude All right cool This is I get it now This all makes a lot more sense Yeah Now I know why I liked your special Yeah

I was like Women are funny Okay When women are like men They're like funny Yeah they're like sick. Yeah, bro.

You guys are fucking dope. No, that is very interesting, though. That is very interesting. So you hit this whole community and then they all get on board. Yeah, they're cool. They're awesome. They're very fun that they did that. Thank you. But it gets broader than just that because it's not just like queer women. Now of a sudden it's like

you got non-binarys. Yeah, yeah. You get the whole LGBT spectrum. Yeah, I'm very fortunate that it's a lot of different types of people. Is it interesting that many of these people probably are not like, and I'm assuming here, I don't know, Probably are not like diehard comedy fans first, and they're all of a sudden just like fans of you. So this has, this is the thing that's shifting for me right now in real time.

But yeah, they've never, I mean, because I used to do meet and greets with everybody. When I first started, I was like, I am meeting everybody. I felt guilty to even charge. It was free. I just stayed after the show. Anyone who wanted to talk to me, you know, line of 500 people, whatever. That's awesome. I talked to literally everybody.

And they were like, I mean, I would wager 50%. this was their first comedy show ever ever yeah that's kind of tricky because not it's not like a problem it's obviously an awesome thing to have happened to expose all these very flattering like it's like it's so cool yeah like like i look at this with like even matt rife like people talk about oh matt's exposing all these people i'm like yeah that's amazing yeah it is like it's so cool that so many of his it's great for comedy if those fans enjoy it and leave it and go see more comedy and i always tell everybody you do that it's awesome and you're doing that with so many people i'm sure like the trans dude that doesn't really like comedy because it seems kind of scary

and all of a sudden they see you and they're like oh wait this is fun and then they can become a fan of whoever else within the world yeah that's so cool or like they know your opener's cool because I feel like what a lot of queer people are looking for is they just don't want to go to a show where they feel like they're a topic yeah you know what I mean it's fine if you talk about like you know you personally I don't give a shit if you do gay jokes but don't make gay people feel like they're a topic right do you know what I I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So then, you know, through my podcast and through who I'm bringing to open and stuff like that, they're like, oh, well, this is a straight guy, but he's cool. Like, he's with Ashley. That's cool. So I'm going to go see him. So that's cool. I like that. What's up, guys?

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or dial pound-law, pound-529 from your cell phone. This is a paid advertisement. Now, let's get back to the show after the short disclaimer. In my opinion, at least anecdotally, the black comics that are able to talk about like whiteness or blackness in the best ways were kind of like outsiders

to both of those communities. They were able to, like, to, they maybe floated in between or they went to a white school and they kind of saw things from the outside. Yes. And, you know, straight people that have gay friends are probably able to write gay jokes really well

because they're able to see the experience from the outside. Totally. And the same thing goes for like, why do you think so many female comics are lesbians and so successful? Yeah, what is that? We're watching, well, I have a couple theories, but we are watching the straight experience from out here being like, this shit is crazy.

Yeah. So we can see what men are going through and what women are going through. Yeah. And make observations about that. Yeah, because you're also trying to bang chicks. I am. Yeah, and that shit is confusing.

as hell. It's hard. But you're also on the inside. You know what's crazy? I are we over time? Also, I have to adjust this. I talk about overtime. I do at least five hours. Okay, cool. You're a real, you're a real rogan. Yeah, dude. There we go. Very industrial. So I took, I was on hormones

because I had to freeze my eggs. I froze my eggs. Oh, hell yeah. And so I went on estrogen, which is a female hormone. You know, I think everybody has a little bit of everything in their system. Actually, don't quote me on this. I don't know what I'm talking about. But when I went on estrogen, I mean like, I was such a bitch.

It's crazy, right? Have you met a woman on estrogen? Better. I met a friend, I will say, a friend of mine's grandfather had prostate cancer. And as a way to shrink the prostate cancer, they put this 85-year-old war vet on estrogen. And I sat down with him, I was like, how do you feel? And he's like, it's fucking weird. I was like, why is it so weird?

He's like, I got an argument with my wife and I began to cry. Yeah. He's like, I don't know why. It wasn't even a real argument. We were like bickering. Like we were trying to put Christmas gifts in the trunk of the car and they wouldn't fit. And she wasn't doing it the way I wanted her to do it. And I was trying to do it.

And then I started it misty-eyed. He's like how I understand what these girls are talking about. Yeah. It's like one of these things. Well, the angle that I've taken as a comedian because I'm always saying the fucked up thing is like, I was like, maybe bitches do be crazy. And I am that bitch. Yeah.

Thank you. Finally. Also, you're not crazy because that should is just in you. It's just in you. And it's like... And yes, can we have a little space? Can these men just be like, oh, the estrogen? Every man should go on estrogen for a week.

But you guys have to be open to when we say, oh, is this your period? To say, yeah, it kind of is. And yeah, exactly. I agree. There needs to be this. I think that's the compromise. I mean, Jen and I, Jen's my girlfriend. We're in an open relationship.

I'm not a creep. When Jet, I mean, Jen and I are fully open about our periods because we live in a sexistless household so we can say like, oh, yeah, I'm on it. Yeah. It's bad. Oh, that's interesting. I'm going to be annoying. If she accused you, she's like, well, are you guys synced up? Is that a myth?

We're close to synced. It's not a myth. That's a thing. It's a thing. Not everyone gets it, but. But sometimes. Sometimes. Your Bluetooth.

I'm, my, uh, my Bluetooth. I don't know. My period is a little bitch. I'm very masculine. Do I'm I supposed to affirm you? Yeah. For sure. What's up?

Hell yeah. Let's go drink beer. Thank you so much. Oh my God, thank you. Yeah, got you. Mine syncs up with other women's like that. I'm like a little simp. Oh, really? I'm like uterus whipped.

Oh, you're a wombcuck. I'm a wombcuck. Yeah, dude. That's amazing. Can I use that? It's yours. It's yours. Whatever you want.

Like if you're, if you're syncing, I'm sinking. Like, that's crazy. So you just do whatever the other girls are done. Yeah, yeah. You just follow suit. Every girlfriend I have. Oh, wow. weird. I'm womb-cutt. Oh, that's crazy. You just follow them. Yeah, and it looks like they

would follow me, but that's gender roles. So if it's not exactly synced, but it's close, and your girl's like, oh, I'm on my period, so you're probably going to be super annoying pretty soon. Yeah. Are you open to that? Are you like, yeah. Yes. I think it's great. So why don't you all do it when we pointed out? Because honestly, well, I think it's just the way you pointed out. I think just, just be nice. I'm sure you're nice. But when a guy's like, she's on a fucking period. I'm just like, okay. All right. I mean Yeah, maybe

Are you recommending guys to try this? There are men listening to this right now I'm just saying Let's say they go home They know their wife's on their period You gotta do the allied training She's snapping at him Is he supposed to

No No What does he do? Here's what you gotta go The other direction first You can't follow the mood to the period You have to follow the period to the mood So if you know she has her period

I'm listening Then I would Oh boy I'm on the spot And I have not formulated an answer for this. This is like, you know, it depends on what level of education you have going into this

and what kind of relationship you have. Oh my God. Is that what you mean? No, just like, but that's bad. Okay, like on the subject, like, do you guys talk about her period? Because if you're not talking about her period at all, I would not.

I would not. We can make this personal. My wife is a midwife. Oh, cool. She delivers babies all day. That's amazing. Yeah, she's an angel. And so we're very open with all types of,

bodily sort of anatomy type talk. So I know when it's... So when it's her period, this is what I recommend you do. When you know she's on her period, then I would be like, hey, you know, I notice you're on your period. I want to be more sensitive about that. Could you use any more emotional support

or can I do anything for you today? Or maybe just kind of be gone for a while. Yeah. If you need me to step out and kick it with the boys, I'm completely down with that also. Yeah. That's how I would do it. I would not go the other way.

Which is? Which is, oh, you seem to be upset. Could it be your period? Do you see what I'm saying? That I wouldn't do. Because maybe she's legitimately upset, and that's why people get mad. I wonder if I could throw her off the scent. Like, if she was mad at me.

You need to start tracking her cycle. Every man needs to have it. You got the app? You don't think I'm on the app already. I'm completely on the app. See, you're already an ally. I don't even need the app. You want to know why?

Because she's synced up with the moon. Are you serious? Yeah, dude. When does she get her period? Full moon. No. I'm married to a witch or a werewolf. I don't know exactly what it is, but like it's synced up with the moon, literally.

Am I supposed to talk about this, my wife? Okay, I'll ask her. That's sick. It's crazy. That's sick. She's like, it's been that way every like 29, 28 days. She is a perfect cycle. Perfectly regular.

Midwifing is what she was born to do. When she was seven years old, she got a Barbie. And her mom was like, what Barbie do you want? She goes, I want the pregnant Barbie. and got the little barb with like the detachable stomach with the little baby inside and that was like her life she started like birth assistant when she was like 16 I could brag she's awesome but yeah like I'm I'm I know too much now about y'all I want to be friends with your wife yeah no she's this podcast really should have been with her yeah because I just froze my eggs it was an incredible experience yeah what's the eggs on ice um because I'm 36 damn I know I look at it yeah you actually yeah I would I would say you're probably 30 thank you thank you you appreciate it. The dam was a, not the damn that I thought it was. You were giving me the Kevin Hart.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. No, no, no, you look dirty, you look good, I would say. Not as enthusiastic as the damn. Sorry, now, yeah, you look great. Thank you. I sound like Larry David. Like, yeah, come on.

You look awesome, come on. I, yeah, and I just know I'm not gonna get pregnant for another couple of years. So I was like, I want, I wanna, you know, make sure that they're healthy and the best quality. So I went and frozen. But now you're with a girl. How long have all been together? Well, she just moved in. We've been living together for three months.

Yeah, two, yeah. We've known each other for a couple days. We started dating in 2019. And we took a break for like a year and a half because she's a little younger than me. She wanted to like go and explore her, you know, do her, you know, mid-20s stuff. Don't be too enthusiastic about it. She wanted to go fucking, you know. Be an idiot.

Well, I'm trying to be, she wanted to have like a slut face. Yeah. You know? And I was like, that's very important. Reasonable. You should do that. And if it's meant to be, it'll be. It was the greatest relationship in my life.

Incredible, amical breakup. I, if I'm going to be honest, I just sort of knew we were going to get back together. So I just, I mean, like, I wasn't 100% confident, but I was like. That's big clit energy right there. Thank you so much. And my clit is regular size. But perverbially, okay. Thank you.

I appreciate it. You're going to be coming back. I know you're coming back. That's, I mean, I think she felt that way too. Yeah. I think we talked about it a little bit, but we didn't want to keep each other on the line because that's not fair. So then about a year and a half later, we got back together and we've been together since. Is that like press, though, like you are freezing your eggs.

You're like, yeah, I've got to use these eventually. No. Like, how does that work? If I don't use them, I'll find a way for someone to use them. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah. Because that would be a way.

That would be a waste. There are people who need eggs, so. Was it painful to do egg retrieval? The egg retrieval surgery was not painful. I got a lot out. And if you get a lot out, the effects after are a little stronger. If you only get three out, you're not going to be feeling it that much. You're going to go back to regular life.

If you get a ton out, you're going to be feeling it a lot more. You're in like the 20s? I got 25 eggs, which is like twice as much as what they usually get for someone my age. super fertile so fertile so fertile so fertile so fertile um

so I was pretty bloated whoa pretty bloated from like literally like puffed up yeah for how long like a week it was fine

but it was uncomfortable yeah it was uncomfortable could you get off estrogen yes thank God yeah just like making you feel like what was like the residual effect of the estrogen

I feel great now I'm normal now right but like you're just snappy, you're snippier, you're a little moodyer, you know, you cry a little bit more. It wasn't that bad, but Jen definitely was like, you're a little, yeah, you're a little snippy. Yeah. You know? And Jen is so chill.

My girlfriend is, my girlfriend's the boyfriend. That's the secret is that she's like feminine, but like in terms of gender roles, she's chill, doesn't have big emotions, goes with the flow. you know, not as good at talking about her feelings. And I look like the boyfriend, but I cry. Yeah, you get sad and angry and feel all the feels. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. You were bringing something up before.

I did yell at a woman to kill herself, so if this is a... Yeah, we established. She deserved it. But no, you had brought something up before that most successful, I shouldn't say most, a lot of successful female comedians happen to be gay. And you said you had a theory as to why. Oh, yeah. I also have a theory, and I feel like mine is going to be more right.

But you can start with yours. No, I want to hear yours. Okay, my theory? I actually don't think it'll be more right. I'm not giving you the answer. Okay, fair. My theory is that I think in the way our society is set up, the pursuit of trying to charm and woo women.

You're exactly right. Hell yeah, dude. Oh, I love mansplaining. This is awesome. Yes. Oh, yes. You learn funniness as a skill, because that is seen as a masculine skill. so that's an easier skill for someone who's not trying to fuck men.

Funniness intimidates men, a lot of men, not all men. But humor, funny women, not super attractive to men most of the time. If you're into funny women, you are a good guy. God bless you. You're the fucking shit. I'm into funny women, but I'm not a man. So, yeah, it's just easier for you to cultivate that skill as a woman when the people around you who want to fuck you are receptive to it.

I mean, what better motivation than pussy for anything. The ultimate motivation. Literally anything. So also, I think when you're gay, you have a lot of women who are gay who are really successful in male-dominated fields. You see that a lot. Yeah, like the power boss CEO chick. Yeah. So I'm like, if there's a woman that's a CEO of like.

Yeah, also that. Construction. Yeah, that's, yeah, likely gay. Chefs. Yeah. Lots of gay chefs. Yeah, yeah. A lot of buzzed sides of hair.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think the way that society treats lesbians is they kind of like, you know, we're a little bit invisible. The guys aren't going after us. You know, especially if you look like me, if you're more like look like a lesbian. Do you get hit on by dudes frequently? Every time it happens, I'm like, what the fuck is wrong with you?

Yeah, just come out, dude. You got to tell him that. But does it happen? Like, are guys coming up to you being like, so, well, like, what's your deal? No, not anymore. No. And honestly, I don't even know that I would see it if it were happening. Oh, hilarious.

Because I'm so stupid. I can't. Well, also, you're not seeing it. Like, I might not be as receptive to, like, a guy flirting with me if it's not, like, super. Obvious. Which, in fairness, most dudes that are flirting are pretty on the nose, like, in my experience. Guy just coming up being like, I love your mouth. You're like, okay.

I'm not I know you're I'm not I don't think I'm flippable well gay men right gay men man they have that is a good life they can just

fucking because they have the freedom of you know straight men and women we don't want to be creeps because women are constantly being objectified and hurt and horrible things happen to them

so we don't want to creep them out that stuff doesn't happen as often to men so men just have with other men have this freedom to just grab each other's asses. Yeah, want to fuck? And you're like, no, I'm good. You're like, all right, just keep a moving. But it's actually doubly hard for you.

Because for me, if I'm a single dude, I see a girl at a bar. I'm like, oh, I should go talk to her because obviously she's straight. Not only are you trying to, like, enchant a woman, you also got to, like, suss it out and see if the vibes are right. Here's the secret. I don't assume people are straight anymore. At all. At all. I mean, when I'm hitting on them.

Yeah, that's fair. So how often are you hitting on straight women before you're with your lover? I had sex with a straight girl. Actually, no, you're in an over relationship. Yeah. Okay. I had sex with a straight girl last weekend, the weekend before last. It was great.

But you can't say she was straight. She says she's straight. What? That's not how that works? She went down on me and I'm like, you're gay now. There's just a moment. You are gay. Well, you're less gay.

You're less straight than you were. Like, I don't know if you're officially gay. Your hit points are down. Yeah. Like, I don't know. If we're saying it's a spectrum. you're definitely not as straight. Like, I don't think every dude that sucks a dick is gay,

but you're not as straight as you once were. Is that fair? Am I being mean? I don't think we have the answer to this question, so I think you're allowed to postulate. I think it's, I don't know what the numbers are. Listen, in the gay community, we're like, they're all gay.

Everyone's a little gay. That's the other thing that might be actually easier for you is that I think women, like, are basically all bi. I agree Not me Ever? You kissed a guy

I kissed one boy And Gross Just immediately Well I was trying to be straight And he was the only one That would Help with that

This is like your friend No it's like a Yeah Like a kid from my That I grew up with Yeah But did he know that you were like No he liked me

Oh wow Isn't that weird Isn't that weird there was ever a period where I was like trying to be in the closet I think that gives myself the ick yeah a little like like it's more your energy like I think once you talk people are like all right yeah this is not like what like I don't know you throw like lip liner on like a dress like I feel like you could kind of be like all right this is like a straight girl but the way I move it's the energy yeah the way I move yeah no this is I've never seen a woman talk like the

fons yeah that doesn't happen often sure that's pretty good why is the fons wearing a dress Yeah, that part would be a little bizarre punching a jukebox in my prom dress Yeah, yeah, you're like a greaser from the 60 or something Yeah, that part is bizarre But yeah, I don't know, I could see a guy like I don't know, being into like a tomboy vibe Yeah, there are guys like that

Yeah, and are you polite or you're like Oh, I'm not what you're looking for I don't think I've ever had to turn down a guy in person I don't think it's ever Is this part of your make-a-wish? I can set this up for you I can I don't know if this is even on the things that you want to do in life, but we could do this. I know a guy.

Oh, this is not to bang him. I'm not saying you were hooking up with them. The only time that I've ever felt like this and I don't have this desire anymore. In 2012, I was like, am I really going to go my whole life without seeing a penis in the flesh? Oh, wow. So you're like basically Gold Star. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I kissed a boy in seventh grade.

You knew you were gay from. Yes. Or like day one. Yeah, and I was so hoping I would end up being bisexual and that I would meet a boy. Oh, really? Yeah, because I knew I was gay. I knew I was attracted to women, but I was like, I don't want this life. Like, earliest memory?

Yes, yes. That's wild. Like, I remember just being desperately in love with a girl when I was like eight years old, like longing for her. Yeah. Like longing. But I remember having fake crushes as early as that. Oh, hilarious. Being like, maybe I could like this guy.

I never phrased it. to myself that way. Yeah. I was like, I like him. And these are the reasons why. And because other girls like him. So therefore? Yeah, yeah.

Like, I like him. It'd be like the reasons I would come up with liking a guy. Yeah. Like, okay. Like this very like... He's probably sick at sports and like the other people like him. So seems like I have to, I like him. Like my reasoning for...

He's being strong. He lifts so much, bro. Yeah. My reasoning for liking a dude would just be the worst ever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It'd be the reasons that I'd just like a dude. He's great sneaker collection. That's the reason I just like guys as friends.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the only thing I can think of. I'm like, he's got a cool job. He's pretty funny. Yeah. That's basically it. So I was trying, but I was, you know, I was, I hooked up with a girl for the first time in eighth grade secretly. So I was actively having sex with women in high school hoping that I would have sex with a man at some point never happened.

Wow. So I've never seen a penis. So. So in 2012, I was like, I wonder if there's a way I could see a penis live in a safe environment. Yeah, that last part is a big part of this. So I posted on Craigslist. You're lying. I've written jokes about this.

I have to bring them back. I posted on Craigslist, lesbian seeks penis for educational purposes. And when I tell you that my inbox exploded. Yeah, dude. How old are you? I was like 24, 23. This is hilarious. And I made a data, I made an infographic because I was a software engineer at the time,

and I was like, there is so much good data in here. I also put in the post no pictures. So I wasn't getting pictures. I was getting descriptions. Like men were sending me descriptions of their penises. How many different descriptions could there be? It was mostly length. Yeah, right?

There's one description. Yeah, yeah. Mostly length, no girth. Not a lot of girth. Color, I guess, maybe. Yeah, I don't remember color. Yeah. I made like a word cloud of all the words.

that I got. And so what happened? Did you... I organized I organized a flash mob of men at a mall. I told them to all meet me at the mall wearing a red shirt. No way. Are you being serious? This is fucking unbelievable. Wait, why didn't you just ask you're a homie or something? Like, guys show each other with their dicks all

time? I'm not there. I can't. That's why... This seems way more dangerous. I brought some friends and we and not a lot showed up. Obviously, a blublish. Like the thousands of men that responded, you men, you know, because you're sending back a canned email being like, thank you. Because to respond fast enough, you can't be negotiating time and place with all these guys. So I wrote back this place, red shirt this time, and probably a dozen men kind of milled through the area that we thought might be. I know, I feel really bad because I get a lot.

Wait, why is it bad? Because I didn't meet up with them. But I guess when you're doing something on Craigslist, it's like. You saw them milling around? Yeah. And they didn't just point it. You'd be like, are you the lesbian? I was on a balcony.

Waring? I don't remember what I was wearing. I mean, if you're wearing anything remotely similar to this, they should have been able to be like, well, that's, are you ready? You want to do a distance or you want me to come up, like, be pretty, right? There's a busy day at the mall. Yeah, I guess. I wasn't quite in this era of my gayness.

Mm. And, yeah, I just watched them mill about and then I went home. It was kind of sad, and I feel guilty about it. You got kind of scared. You were like, I don't want to. Yeah. Because what was the plan after that? Like, you would have to go into, like, a family bathroom or something?

I have no idea. There was no after plan. It became more about the flash mob almost immediately. When I saw all the emails, I was like, I'm going to make a flash mob. Yeah. No pun intended, but Flashball is so on the nose. But it was rude of me to do that to the men. And men, if you're one of those men, I'm so, I'm really sorry that my comedy got ahead of the science.

If you know those men, stop listening to the show, all right? We don't want losers. We don't want crows. Craigslist, horny-ass, fucking weirdos, listen to this, okay? So turn it off. That's fair. But that's like a wild.

So you still haven't seen a penis in real life? I've never seen one in real life. Are you ready? No, that's, I'm sorry. That should not have said that. That's, we're going to edit that out. Well, the thing that I'm like so could. The thing that's like so crazy to me about them is that they're shape shifters, dude.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that is kind of wild. And they all, like, there's no correlation. Like you can have a teeny little one that becomes a big, big old. You can have a big one to say the same size. That is. Yeah, yeah. And even you can have like a medium one that gets really small when it's cold and then it just is the smallest. That is such a crazy body part.

Yeah, yeah, it is insane. That's so weird that you guys do that. And then you wake up and you're hard. That's such an insane energy to bring to the morning. Yeah, every single morning. Every morning you're just like so confident. Yeah, that is a good point. I don't really think about how weird that is.

I have bits about it. But like, that is, you should not be waking up with that much. Just ready to fuck the world. It's violence. It's violence. Carpe diem, carpe rape them. It's scary. It is like, that's how men's hormones are, apparently. My wife's telling me this. Like, women's hormones will fluctuate on a monthly basis. Men's hormones fluctuate on a daily basis. So your testosterone is highest first day in the morning. Your wife is amazing.

Yeah, she's the best. Yeah. That is so cool. It's wild. So that is what it is. Yeah, yeah. Because I've been looking for this. You guys are hornier in the morning. Now, why? Why in the morning? Because you can get the women because they're sleeping? Yeah. That's so fuck up, dude. No, they're vulnerable.

They are vulnerable. That's so fun. Yeah, they're just kind of knocked out, they're snoring, and you can have your way. No, I don't know what it is. I'm assuming it's like testosterone being higher. It also, I think the boner thing is blood flow. That's blood flow, yeah. So like while you're sleeping, you have like more consistent or like higher blood flow

some shit? I don't know. There's something, my whoop tells me, I don't know. But apparently that's what it is. Like that's a sign, that's why your boners get lower as you get older because your blood flow changes and like your, like, the efficacy of your cardiovascular health changes as you get older. But if you keep your cardiovascular health

up into your old age, then your boneers kind of stay the same. That is so great. This is not necessary for you. No, I love it. I love it for you. I'm explaining this to you. I'm, you know, I have a quit.

Okay, don't brag. Jeez, dude. I have a clit. And not all that changes a little. It shapeships. It does. It does its own tiny version of that. And when I was on the estrogen,

I couldn't get clit hard. Wait, what? I couldn't get clit hard. I feel like it would make it better to get, Is it testosterone what makes you get clitted up? Yeah, testosterone is a sex hormone. So even women have that. Right.

Yeah. So you get Lego bricked. It's not fully bricked, but it's like a, you know, it's a Lego brick. Right? Roughly size? I don't know. But it is a wild thing that you guys get engorged also. It's like bizarre.

I know I'm writing about this too. And I'm like, it's so hard to talk about you because you don't want to say hard because that makes women uncomfortable. No woman wants a man to be like, you're so hard right now. No, no, no, no. You have to find feminine language for it. You know, like, no, that's why we don't talk about it. I'm like, oh, your flowers blooming.

You know, like something feminine. But mine wasn't doing that, and it was so hard to come. Whoa. It was so hard to come. It was not a fun time for me. That increase in estrogen. Mm-hmm. Oh, that's interesting.

Yeah. Do you think trans dudes come faster because there's more testosterone? Probably. You got to have to research that. I could ask one. Have you been with a trans dude? Do you know me to text someone? No.

Trans woman? Not sexually, but I've like talked to, like hung out. Okay, yeah, you don't get a prize for that. Everyone's seen it. What do you mean? Excuse me, are you handing out prizes to people who are fucking trans women? You problematic piece of shit. I'm just asking, I'm like, oh, have you banged a trans or you're like, well, I talked to one?

I just like, yeah, we've all talked the one. Romantically! Oh, you did? Yeah. Oh, okay, okay, that counts. Yeah. I think you meant just like in passing, like on the train. But I never got there.

So I've never hooked up with someone without a vulva. That could be your chance to see a penis. Like, that might be a safer way. That's a good idea. Right? Just throwing it out there. That is not a bad idea. Yeah, this could be your chance.

But, like, you, I've, for educational purposes. Problematic on the other side coming back, now I'm like, all right, to a trans woman, let me see your penis. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. So, uh. Yeah, you're kind of a, between a rock and a.

I'm not going to say it. I'm not going to say it. A hard clit. Yes, exactly. Couldn't you go to like a strip club or something? Or like, get a stripper? This is not something I want to pursue me. All right, right, right, right.

You want me to pursue it. No, I don't desire this for you, but you seemed like this was on your bucket list and I want your dreams come true. 12 years ago, this was something I was considering. Today. You're just a young woman. You didn't know what you're done. Yeah. Today I have peace of mind.

Hmm. I don't need to see it anymore. I think it was sort of me clinging to remnants of like, self-loathing homophobia where I was like everyone talks about this thing and they make it seem like it's so great I should go see it like a good movie

yeah yeah yeah yeah like I've never seen I've never seen The Sopranos yeah me neither but every time you tell people that they go you haven't seen the Supranos right that's what dicks are like You haven't seen what

Yeah yeah and then they talk about the end of it They're like wait until you get to the end It's big and black And you're like what this is crazy Yeah, that is a good point. That is a very, very good point. But now I've let go of that.

Yeah, just move on. This actually, I have a question for you. How do you know, I have a lot of lesbian friends? I have three. But, okay, give me a prize for that. Am I one of them? Four. So my question is, I have some Muslimian friends that have gone trans.

How do you know when you're like, all right, this is where I am? And have you ever thought, like, am I more? Or am I different than what I? I think it's different feelings. It's like I knew I was getting. my whole life, I was desiring women. And any kind of reflection of myself that I saw in men was orbiting around women. Like when I was growing up, I couldn't understand like what my relationships would look like

because I was the one that had this desire to bring someone flowers. And I'm like, how do I bring a boy flowers? Like, they don't like that. They don't want to do that. How do I get down on one knee? How do I save the princess? Like, I can't save the prince. And so I would see myself reflected in men because I wanted to be able to do the things that they were doing.

But it was an external expression. Yes. And not an internal expression. So I never had body dysphoria. I never looked at my body and thought, wow, I hate this about myself. Or I wish I looked like this. Or I wish I had bigger arms or I don't feel comfortable in my body. And I'm simplifying a little bit because everyone goes through this their own way.

But, you know, there are trans people who are straight. There are straight people who then transition and then they're gay or a lesbian after the transition. So they are like segmented different things. I think, you know, there's a lot of people who are a lesbian and then they transition and they're a trans man. They're a man. But for me, I just never, because I know I'm boyish and I think that's like kind of part of it. You know, like when you're figuring yourself out, your gender out. But yeah, I just never had that feeling.

That makes sense. But when I talk to trans people, because I'm gay, I sort of am like, this is what it feels like sort of to be straight when straight people question like, are you really gay? It's like, I know as a gay person, I would never, ever, ever, ever. put myself through this if I didn't have to. Yeah. Which I think I'm lucky that I'm gay that I get to at least know what it feels like to have something incredibly inconvenient that I eventually come to feel very proud of in love.

You know what I mean? Yeah, that makes sense. So I have a lot of empathy, but I don't have that direct lived experience. That makes sense. Yeah. External expression and desire versus internal, like how do I perceive myself? Yeah. Would be the differentiator.

Yeah, I think so. I have more lesbian questions. Also, I will say, like, young trans people, like, there's a lot from what I've learned in my podcast, there's a lot more like, I want to be them, you know? I want to be that guy. I want to be, I want to piss out of urinal, you know? Like, I desire that. That was never on the table for you. God, no.

Yeah, no, that shit is weird. I don't hold it against you. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the way you guys have that set up, that's crazy. You're just whipping your dicks out in front of each other. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I mean, the trough is like an all-time-old-old-old-old.

That's gay, dude. Who came up with that? Probably a gay guy. No other they think about it. It is sort of gay, but it's also sort of not. Like, that's what, there's this line with, especially white dudes. I'm not going to speak for anyone else other than white dudes, because white dudes and gayness is just like peanut butter jelly.

You know what I mean? We just, like, we like to wrestle and we like to take our dicks out, and it's just kind of what it is. Like I've tried to show Brandon my dick many times, right Brandon? Okay. He just refuses. He just won't play. He calls it white boy shit.

Which is funny to me that my black friends will be like, you know what white boy shit is? It's like, you know, skydiving or like playing with an anaconda or like doing something mildly gay. As if like those things are like the same level. They're like, dude, I'm not going to do something crazy. Well, it's sort of like privilege. It's like fuck around and find out. You know what I mean? Like jump around as jump out of a plane is fuck around and find out.

And there's a lot of homophobia, you know, like, in black church, like, black communities. There's, like, toxic masculinity and stuff. Like, you're not going to fuck around and find out if you're gay. Yeah, I'm not going to hell for this. I'm not going to fuck around. That's not worth it. But no, it is like, yeah, white dudes, we just like to do gay stuff. But it's not gay.

It's just like, I'm naked, you're naked. We're just people being naked. You know what I mean? Sure. But why is that gay? This is what we've done for hundreds of thousands of years. No, you're right. And the non-proatic answer for that is, men should be as affectionate.

as each other with each other as women and that's fine. Exactly. You guys should pillow fight. I actually, this is another bizarre theory I have. I think the more homophobic as society is, the gay or the men are. I agree. Like you look at like any society

and I think the reason is that there is a, like I said, a fear of a gay people in the society, but if they believe that there are no gay dudes in the society, that they have freedom to be affectionate with each other without fear that someone's going to break that that friendship bond and make it gay.

So they're like, none of us are gay. So we can then be affectionate, we can hold hands. You're right, yeah. You can be naked in the sun. A lot of, like, in India, I saw a lot of men walking around just holding hands as friends. It's super common. I was like, I was like, oh, wow. When were you in India?

I was studying abroad in Hong Kong and I flew to India. Oh, sick. Yeah, it was really fun. Delhi? Yeah. How was it? It was awesome. It was amazing.

A wild place, right? Yeah. Yeah. Packed. Yeah. Food was incredible. Oh, the food was stupid. and I'm a vegetarian, so I was like, God bless this place.

I mean, there's a lot of vegetarian options, right? Yeah, yeah. Like, Jains are like a big religious sect, I guess, within India, and they don't eat anything unless it falls from the tree. I think it's like their philosophy or something like that. Wow. Like, it's like no suffering at all. Like, they're like the ultimate vegans.

I don't know if you sell it now. Ultimate vegan is my favorite show. Yeah, exactly. They're so weak. Yeah, exactly. Like, we can't pick this apple. Ultimate. We have to wait for it to fall because we're ironed.

Ultimate vegan is like that ninja warrior show, but like there's just no one can get past that first stop. America's ultimate vegan. Yeah, they're just sleeping. It's so tired. Yeah. That's a, I mean, that's a good place for a vegan, I feel like. Yeah. There's a lot of options.

You said you had one other lesbian question. Oh, yes. I love that you saved it for the end. I have so many. I can, this is my favorite thing in the entire world. Why? Save one. You come to my podcast.

Save a couple of these. There's infinite. Okay. I'm around. you all a frequent amount. Okay, I'll tell you later, but like... All four of us. Exactly. And so I just, I see things and I observe them and I can't necessarily ask,

but now I can't. Why do the first dates last so long? Oh. Is this hack? Like, I just, I hear about these like five, six hour marathon romances that... Because, first of all, stereotype, you know,

women, we're a little more looking for that, like, deep emotional connection. I know men are looking for it too. But let's just like say across the board, two women find each other. I think there's a higher probability of those women talking for a while looking for that deep emotional connection. But the gay, this is a really cool thing about being gay.

You get to sit down and one of the first, on any gay date, one of the first things that you're going to ask is, when did you come out? What's your relationship with your family? that is a huge question but all of us are really used to talking about it it's a huge part of our life it tells you a lot about where a person is with their queer journey um and you learn a lot about a person from that so you're finding out you know like whether or not their parents accept them um do they are they surrounded by queer community how many women have they dated are Are they bisexual? Are they pansexual? You know, what is their relationship to gender? Like, that's a really intense conversation on the first date. And it is very frequently a conversation that

you have on the first date. What's your story? And then just floodgates open. Because you had to go through a thing. Yeah. And we all went through it. Or you haven't gone through it. It's like, oh, you haven't told your family yet? And then that's a whole different thing. Yeah. Like what's going on? Like a straight relationship, a guy and a girl, whatever. You need siblings? Yeah, exactly. What's your favorite color? And you could hate your family, but you don't have to bring it up because...

You're not going to bring up your alcoholic father on the first date. Yeah. But if you're talking about... But if you're gay, yeah, you might. And you're like, yeah, well, I told him, my dad was pissed. We have to understand my dad is an alcohol. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That makes sense.

Yeah, that's my theory on that. And I love this. Okay. Because I'm like, I have like an intimacy kink. So I, oh my God, I love intimacy. Oh, tickle me. So gay. Yeah, it's so, so gay, dude.

So, like, emotionally connecting with someone, I love that. So first date is fun because you get to just, like, you get to gush. Yeah. Also, I think there might be this other piece of it. When we were in high school, we didn't get to go on regular dates. So. You have years of making up for- Years of that.

And there's an intensity to it, I think. When you get to be a teenager again in this weird way, you're going on your first dates. You're experiencing these things for the first time. so I think there's like an intensity. And then you're clicking with someone and you're like, oh my goodness. Yeah. Like there's not even that many gay people in my town. And all of a sudden I found one that I'm clicking with.

It's like, I don't want this to end. Totally. That's actually like a thing. My friend who I do one of my podcasts with is becoming a therapist. So she has all the resources and the science. Of course. I don't fucking have it. But that sort of second adolescence, that is a thing that gay people go through.

Because we did not get to have the full experience of adolescence because we were in the closet. And it's really cool that kids today. get to have that. I'm, um, you know, a little annoyed. I'm like, where are you going to get your personality? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, right? How are you going to be so funny? Yeah, yeah, exactly. You're going to be a normal lesbian like with live, laugh, love in your fucking kitchen. Yeah, with no taste. Yeah. But it is like, I feel like you see that with people that later, where it's like, you know, you came out like, you're going to 35 and all of a sudden like they're going to parties and like they have a new social circle. It's like it's very clear to see the like second

adolescence. Yeah. With people like that. It's fun. It's really fun. If you come on when you're like 22, it's like, okay,

it's a little closer. Yeah. But I can, I can see that with like more distance. So does this contribute to like a U-Haulism? I think so. Can you explain the U-Haul

lesbian stereotype? What does a person bring? What does a lesbian bring on a first date? A toothbrush? What does she bring on a second date? A U-Haul. That's the joke. Good joke.

I think, thank you. Well, it's not my joke. I don't know why I said thank you. But it's of y'all. It's kin. It's a street joke. I don't know who came on with that. We can probably figure that out.

It's a good job. Because it's post-U-Haul. Probably, yeah, 90s. Some genius in the 90s. Yeah. It's a really good joke. They deserve credit. Yeah, and I think also just, like, again, two women.

It's a little more emotionally sticky. Yeah. Yeah. And you're so excited. Yeah, exactly what we just said. You just want to merge. You know, I've definitely, God, I have, I've been there. What's the fastest you've moved in with someone?

This girl that I was, my disaster relationship, my rock bottom relationship where the origin of my podcast was kind of because of this woman, where like, I was like, I have done dating so incredibly wrong. I'm going to be a slut for a year. I'm going to document it. and I'm going to just be a whore and do my version of guys we fuck but gay. And this woman, so her roommate was moving out and her lease was ending. And then she found out that she, her family that she nannied for was moving. Damn. So I was like, we had been dating, what, two months?

And I was like, well, you can just. stay with me till you figure your stuff out you fool you fool so how could so this was like basically first day type energy

yeah I mean I mean that's that's wild yeah wow it was very fast how long did that last well that's the thing is like

she was straight so we were in the closet you say we I guess if you're About the relationship. Yeah, I guess you also kind of have to be like, no, it's my roommate. Yep. My roommate in my studio apartment.

My roommate who sleeps in a bed with me, but no, no, she's sleeping on that tiny-ass couch. My roommate who's so hot. Yeah. So how long did this go for? It was like... We dated for like almost three years. Whoa. And then it was a mess.

Yeah. I mean, you should have been. Very high pressure, stress, mess. And we did everything together. Super codependent, bad ideas. Unhealthy. Yeah, really unhealthy. And then it took me, when did we break up?

Like late 2018? Yeah. And then it took me 10 months to get her out. I couldn't get her out. How do you get her out? Well, eventually I put my foot down. See, I thought that I was by being nice, I thought putting her foot down was the first thing you did.

Bro, I thought that I was like, okay, I'll be nice. I'll let her stay as long as she needs. Yes. You know? But she needs you now. So she's going to stay forever. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Yeah, I guess we know that now.

I know now. I, like, put her deposit down. I put her, like, first and last. I guaranteed her apartment. Like, I did everything to get her out. And what really actually helped. with getting her out was me being like, I can no longer live like this.

I require that you leave. And I just had to be kind of a dick about it. Not a dick, but like, firm. Realistic. Yeah, realistic. That worked. That was the thing. Like, I thought by being kind and negotiating, it would.

Have you seen her sins? I bumped into her, I bumped into her getting a haircut because we go to the same hairstylist. This is the worst place to bump into someone, because now you're just awkwardly in chairs near something. We're sitting next to it. each other. No. Yeah. I'm freaking out. I mean, like you feel your blood go cold and you're like, oh my God, my heart is like just. Yeah. And I texted her because our hairstylist knows that we're

friends. We're roommates. My hairstallists, but roommates are not going to have some terrible falling out. Exactly. You know what I mean? You guys might not be friends anymore. And my, my hair stylist was such a straight girl about it. It was amazing. She goes, oh my God, I totally understand. I had to end a friendship recently, too. And I was like, thank you, you straight goddess. So what ended up happening? Because straight women will break

up with her friends. Yeah, which is so weird. Yeah, it's the most bizarre. Agreed. Just stop talking to them. Well, I said, do you want to talk outside? And she was like, yeah, sure. And I, in my mind, I was like, you know, there were so many fucked up things, but we were in this closet of relationship. So, like, in my

mind, I hope you forgive me for my fault. I definitely forgive you for yours because what a stressful situation that was. And she replied with, were we really closeted though? And I was like, bro, this, this is next level. This is, yes. Yeah, I don't, yeah, I mean, I don't like talking shit about X's, but I was like. I'm obviously, I'm dressed like Ryan Shackler.

People know that out. Like you don't have to, you're the one that's in. The fuck? I'd be livid. I'd be tight, bro. No, I can't. You're turning me gay right now, dealing with all these fucking women. Yeah.

God damn, dude. But, yeah, that was, that was the, the relationship that I made, turn me into a slut, which was great for me, which was great. Really? Yeah, because you meet a bunch of people. So sorry, because you... Yeah. Now I'm going to have my face. You should.

And you can just take my wife, okay? Fine with me. Now I'm doing, like, fucking 1950s jokes. Take my wife. She sounds cool. No, she's a homie. But... But, yeah, I never had a slut face.

I was never like, that was never my vibe. Yeah, I slept with a lot of women because I never had. Because I was a U-Hauler for years and years and years. Then I slept around and that was so good for me because I realized I was like, oh, I've never really been in a super healthy relationship. I've never even had a healthy relationship model for me. Now I'm like meeting all these people and really by doing this and being like, hey, this is casual.

I'm only interested in casual. I'm getting to like watch their personality unfold in front of me without becoming too attached too quickly. Trying a lot of different things. Yes, exactly. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. I have another hack lesbian question.

When do you know it's done? The sex? Yeah. Oh, I've been asked us before. I think like when you guys like talk and are like, okay, I think I've had enough. That's just, it's just a combo. It's like, you just give up. When you're with someone, you kind of like, no, you know what I mean?

You have your routines. Of course, you know, you spice things up. You throw in some different moves. But when I'm in a long-term relationship, there's usually like a set, routine that you like to go through, the things that they like that they want every time and, you know, that kind of thing. You're just having wild, spontaneous sex every time. I'm just thinking, I was like, how many different moves are there even?

There aren't that many. Right. But like, you know, she has things that she likes, so I do them. And I have things that I like so she does them. And then usually I know approximately how many orgasms before she gets like really very sensitive and it's like annoying to to keep going like painful is that too she only likes two there's an orgasm gap within the lesbian community okay straight women are getting zero to one and you guys are at two baseline hers yeah because like unless we're going crazy she gets really

oversimulated and it can kind of hurt and then for me i can have more but mine just take much each one takes like more time. So like unless we're going for a while, I'm usually a one. But I have been with women who like are so easy that you can do, you know. I've done 11. No.

Yeah. No one, like people get incredulous. 11? 11. But these women are not common. Do you know that women fake? I'm aware. Are you aware of this?

And I tell them. I say, Don't you do that. I don't know. No, no, 11? Yeah, why would, why? How much? I mean, was this like a, like, how many days?

The straight girl was like, in what time, like. The straight girl I made come three times over the weekend and she was like, oh, I come really easily. I was like, what's your record? And she was like, eight. And she's having sex with men. So, you know, there are women out there.

There are some women who can come a lot, not of many. In the however many women I've dated, the number I will not say. I've met three women who can have that many orgasms back to back. Are women better at giving women orgasms? Yes. Not even question. I don't know. But I'm team lesbian.

I have to. Probably. I have to rep my team. Which like it makes sense. Don't you think you'd be better at giving a man an orgasm? Like that's the thing. If you're into it, probably if you know. I don't know though.

I don't know. I don't know. I'm better at giving me, but that's like a sample size of one. Yeah, you're better at giving, well, you can also feel it. You have the... That's what I'm saying. He's a double-sided situation. But like, I don't know.

Lesbians have the highest rate of sexual satisfaction. That's a stat. We believe this? I believe. What do you mean we believe this? I'm just saying, I'm just, if it's fake news or not, I don't know. Who is... The lesbian agenda?

I don't know if there's a propaganda arm of the Democrat Party trying to push these lesbian facts. I don't know. Okay, I'm just asking if this is something I can believe. No, at the lowest, gay men. Really? Yeah, because I think the interactions are like quick. It's kind of superficial and they're like, we're seeking something more emotionally connective.

Yeah. Now, I've also heard a fact. Apparently, the highest rates of domestic violence. Lesbians. Now where's your facts? Here's why I think that is. Fair fight. Oh, yeah, dude.

No one has been taught never hit a woman. men, men are taught, never hit a woman. That is the rule. That's why I don't do it. Right. Because someone told you. But men could hit men. Sure.

But why aren't they fighting at the same rate? You know gay men. They can't fucking land a punch. That's a good point. These fucking sissies, dude. Unlike you guys with your wrenches and fucking flannels, you guys can fucking lay out of hand. Yeah.

That is the most problematic joke I've ever made. And I am keeping it. That's fine. I have to go back through this. I guess because I was like, I made a couple really good problematic jokes. You got some bangers in here, dude. No, I don't know why with men. Maybe because men, well, you guys have also been taught the rules of combat as boys.

Yeah, I wonder if the stakes of men fighting are higher. Yes, that's probably more. If I'm getting a fight with a dude, like, one of us could die. Yes. You could, like, land a punch, and then he hits his head and then he's just dead. Dead, yeah. So that's probably what it is for men. Men know the consequences of a fight.

They know how to fight. They know how bad it's going to be. And sometimes, I will say, some straight. women don't know the consequences of a fight. No, they don't. You see straight women all the time slapping their boyfriends and I'm like, would you stop? He is big. Yeah. And if he just, it's like, wants

to hit you one time, it's over. Yeah. Or like, they'll start a fight with someone else at a club and be like, my boyfriend will cover me. And it's like... And the boyfriend's like, I will not. The fuck? Like, why are you pulling me into this? Like, I'm your squire. Like, I'm just going to like fight in your honor. Like, the fuck? This is not medieval times.

My lord! Yeah. It's like, so I do think that is actually part of it. I think women just haven't been in a lot of fights, and they don't know the rules of the fight, so they don't have the fear of the fight. It's not a guy. Yeah. So it just gets escalated more quickly because they haven't been trained. But I know every time I beat a woman. You tell her, like, you can hit me back.

This is even. No, I've never been in a fight, but it sounds awful. A non-domestic fight? Have you ever been, like, a fight at school? No, I've never been in a fight at all. Oh, really? No, never. Has anyone wanted to fight you?

Other than, of course. The woman that tried to restore your career. No, no, no. Oh, I wasn't even thinking. I don't even think I'd want to, I wouldn't want to, yeah, I wouldn't. I'd be like, you win. Yeah, right? No, I've never, yeah, I've never been in a fight.

Did you have to come out to your family? Were they like, we know? My brother's new. My sister was super cool about it, probably knew. My mom, it was a process. My father passed away when I was a kid. I'm convinced he knew I was gay. Convinced.

Convinced. Okay. Tell me about this deathbed confession. Because he, first of all, whenever gay people were on TV, he'd be like, they're gay. Those people? Those people are gay? Every time. And fairness, my dad also did that for a completely different...

They're gay. They're fucking gay. They're fucking homos in every movie. Why is every commercial a gay guy? No, it was like, it was like very informational. Okay, okay. And like bands and stuff like that. And also this is going to be problematic.

But like he like we would play peeping Tom. Like with the idea, like it was a bit that we would like look at women. We never actually looked at women. We were like, oh, those binoculars were going to go stare at a lady. And I know that that's fucked up. But I think it's so cute. Like in retrospect, my dad was like browing out with me when I was like five years. years old and I can have I have that memory you know because I never got to come out to him.

Do you feel like you exhibited characteristics early on? Yes. I was swimming in just trunks. Okay. I was like dressing up as all the princes and do you have Disney movies? I have a younger sister. Okay. She was not that way. And and when you would like hang with your brother and hang with her sister would be like, I'm more interested in what they're doing? Yes, that kind of thing. Yeah. Oh wow. So. Okay. Last thing I want to know. After observing me, and people like me, straight men. I think you're gay. That is potentially true.

I was actually just talking with Mateo Lane about this where I was like, there is a chance that the flip wasn't switched. The switch wasn't flipped. Whichever one, that like I, like John Malina has a joke. Like, I was supposed to be gay and they didn't make me. Yeah. Oh my God, you, I was, I'd be an amazing gay man. I have the cake for it.

A lot of people, I don't, as my bro, I just want to point it out, a lot of people do call me buddy because I'm the cake boss. but I digress I do believe I was raised somewhat gay that I was raised only around women I had four sisters yeah and you know like how like if you leave like a banana in our lunchbox

everything tastes like banana I was around a lot of banana you know what I think I just have like the residue and then um like I was in musical theater I was sorry what musical theater suicidal the musical when I was in eighth grade I was Wickersham number three

so potentially you're like I'm a little good that's what I'm saying dude I love one of want one time like that happened with a couple boys in my class where like we were doing the musicals and then when I was in eighth grade I was like Sam and wants to be in the musical and Nick wants to be in the what are you guys doing here you guys are sports boys like what are you know but I will tell you the girl that was playing Maisie I had a huge crush on oh okay and so I was

like kind of a stray reason to be in theater yeah yeah right um but no after observing straight dudes like me macho tough guys um What do you understand or know about straight men that I don't understand? Are there things about dudes that you're like, you guys do this and it's bizarre and it's strange and you guys don't notice it that might be oblivious to me because I'm too close to the mosaic? I would, okay, I'm both an idiot and a master. Here's the thing I'm an idiot at. I cannot help my straight girlfriends talk to men. I can help anyone talk to a woman.

my game with women incredible can you put me on a little bit like there's a lot of people that could use this about you could be like an alt-right like like red pill guru there's a lot of money of this actually what the fuck have i been doing but we can rebrand if you want to make money money all of a sudden it's like hey here's how you talk to bitches as a bitch like and then you sell it to like the red pill community yeah but my stuff is going to be more liberal yeah no you have to get rid of that part but if you can get rid of that there's a lot i feel like I feel like if it's for pussy. Yeah.

There's a lot of men out there that would be very curious about your information. Why don't I have a podcast where I talk to men and I fix their romance problems? That's what I'm saying. Welcome to the show. All right. We're about to start the podcast. So how do we do it? How do men...

I will actually do this podcast with you. Yeah. Tell me how. How do men talk to women? Well, I think like I just know how to flirt with a woman and I know what it feels like to not feel safe and yada, yada, yada. I need a more specific example, but I tell you what I cannot do. I cannot help a woman talk to a man. That makes sense.

You might have masculine characters, but you are in fact not a man, despite what people on comments on that. I don't understand how men think at all. Like my advice is so bad. I will say such straightforward, reasonable things, and men will be like, no, no, like, don't say that to me, no. Like my girlfriend who fucks men She knows how to manipulate a man

Into getting what she wants Yeah, there's sort of like a coyness and like a distance that you have to kind of play That's an amazing thing about being gay that I love about being queer like you can just be so much more open So much more straightforward Nothing about you is very subtle Yeah like I don't think you're like exuding subtle That's how I am very straightforward and my track record is pretty good because of it Yeah

But being straightforward in a way that is You know like kind, I guess. And that's, I think, what a lot of men miss. Yeah. Is that men are like, oh, I'm going to go talk to this girl and be like, what's up, baby? You look fire. Right.

And that is bad. It's not great. Yeah. But, yeah, but the thing I'm good at is if when my guy friends are in relationship problems, I always know what the outcome is going to be. I always have the best advice. And I am always right. Always.

Yeah. See, this is the kind of thing that I think we're, be helpful because there's a lot of guys that are going to male dating gurus. There's a whole community for this. Are you aware of this? I'm aware. It's not good. There's the book called The Game.

Are you familiar with this book? I think I've heard of that. This is a book literally that's like how to flirt with the week or sex. But that's based on like old school. Yeah. Like, my approach is like when I was doing the slut, here's a great example. When I was doing the slut that men are just like, that's crazy, you cannot do that. When I was doing the slut phase, I would straight up on first dates be like, I am only interested in a casual relationship.

And men will be like, you cannot say that to a woman. Because that is what I want. And that's not what she wants. Yeah, because she wants to love. Exactly. So I have to trick her. Yes, exactly. So there's this constant back and forth of mistrust.

And I feel as a lesbian, if we all just spoke to each other a little more honestly, we would have a better time. But would women be like, ew, you're just trying to use me and get your dick off? Maybe. But if you're charming and kind, why don't they want to get their dick off? Yeah, that's a good point. Everyone wants to get their dick off. Yeah.

Yeah, that is a reasonable point. So straightforwardness and just being up front. And kind. Just being like, hey, like, I totally understand if you're like, looking for something serious. Oh, the kindness. You've got to think about them. Yeah.

No, actually, that is probably helpful. Just go up to them and be like, hey, you know what? But if you need someone while you're working on that, I'm your guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Put me in. Yeah. I'm like a relief pitcher. Yeah.

While you're looking for like your closer, let me get some, get some throws in. Relief pitcher is a great. Yeah. Great analogy. And women will know what that means. Yeah. Yeah. So you have an ace and then he gets hurt.

He's got to get Tommy John or something. Who knows? And then I can put this in softball terms of people. But then you need someone to come in. Just just rename them. Exactly. Janie Lynn. Yeah, exactly.

You got to get Janie Lynn surgery. No, but it is a, I think that actually is a reasonable point. Like, just kindness. I think actually Dr. Huberman said this, and it was so funny because he said it on the pod. Or he's like, you interviewed him? He was on Flagrant, okay? But yes, we got to talk to them. That is sick.

He's the man. He's so cool. But it was so funny. He was like, the number one trait that women look for in a man, kindness. And all of us were like, what? That's crazy. I hooked up with this girl, this straight girl. And the way, she's never hooked up with a woman before,

the way she has been complimenting me on the fact that I'm like, hey, are you okay with this? Like, this, that, and this, she's like, you just check in with me so much. It's weird. But what about nice guys finish last? What about that whole thing? What about girls that like bad boys?

Okay. Maybe I'm wrong about a certain section of the population. because I'm not a woman from Iowa. But if a woman does not value a man being kind, I don't really think she's for you. Yeah, there might be some bigger problems there. Yeah. If she's into a guy that's a dickhead.

Yeah. Maybe some talking to someone professional might be good. I just like, I just don't, I don't get this attitude of like, Ugh, he asked to kiss me. Like, that can be really cute. That can be so endearing that someone's so attracted to you that they're a little bit nervous. And they open themselves up and go, hey, I think you're so beautiful. I would love to kiss you right now.

Yeah, you would think that would be seen as, like, nice. Yeah. And if you're the type of person, that's like, ugh. Yeah. Maybe you suck. Yeah, like, maybe check in with yourself and be like, oh, maybe the reason. I keep dating people who mistreat me is because I'm not looking for signs of people who are interested in my boundaries and my well-being.

You know what I mean? Yo, talk that shit, bro. Now we're talking, dude. Sorry, this got turned into a girl podcast. I have that tendency on people. I did. That happens. But, yeah, I don't know.

But I don't know, like, I don't know a ton of straight women like that. and it just seems like a really stupid old school way of thinking. Are you familiar with Lil Dickie, the artist, Dave Bird is his name? He has a show on FX called Dave. He's a rapper. Oh, yeah, I know about Dave. I haven't watched it. He's great.

But he has this line that he says it uses on women that he says is like amazing, where he just will walk to a girl at a bar and be like, hey, are you in a position where you're looking to be flirted with right now? And he says it works really well. That's like a, that's a banger? Because he's not, here's why I think that's great. That's a line I would use because what he's saying is I am going to approach you. I'm not scared of approaching you.

I'm not scared of flirting with you. I'm not a beta guy. But also, I'm sensitive that maybe that's not something you want. You know what I'm saying? He is the confidence to walk up. It reminds me of a line that I use when I'm flirting with straight women. If we're talking to each other, the line that I, I don't know if you're going to think this is funny gay people love it. I go, so what's happening?

here. See, that's that's that's that's nefarious. You're just casting doubt and all of a sudden she's looking through like 50 years. I'm like, why do I like lesbian porn? This is so bizarre. That is actually a really good point. And all of a sudden snaps back. The other one when I don't know if someone is gay or not, I say, are you gay enough to let me buy you a drink? So that's sort of like, hey, I'm taking the initiative here. But if this is not your thing, that's totally fine. You don't have to make any decisions tonight about whether or not you're gay. And I think it's sort of the same idea with Dave's line. It's like, I would love to put the moves on, but only if you say yes.

And I think that's hot. Respects the boundary. It says, hey, I'm not like a cuck at the same time. Yeah, exactly. I respect you enough to not just like fuck your whole night up. Yeah, yeah. And also it helps with dudes getting rejected. Because the girl will be like, actually, I'm just kind of here with my friends.

And I'm not really in that mood tonight. And he goes, that's great. Instead of being like, what's up, trying to be suave. It gives the woman an opportunity to get out immediately. Without being. Without being perceived as rude or annoying or scared. It's the equivalent of someone like being like hanging out with someone being like, yeah, so where are you going after this? Right.

It's kind of like a subtle unspoken way of being like, I think it's time for us to kind of like wrap up. Right. But it gives them the out to be like, oh yeah, I'm going somewhere else. Yes. Without being like, hey, leave. And then it becomes awkward. Yeah, I think that's the, you nailed it. It's like the thing, it's the caveat.

It's the opportunity to exit safely. And you don't get rejected as badly. Yeah. I think it's a win forever. Yeah, that's a great line. Yeah. What's up, guys? We're going to take a break really quick because we got to talk about your amazing dick game.

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That are sort of like unwritten. Yeah. It's like, don't go on your phone, don't, like, record videos, shit like that. Yeah. Is that a weird kind of, like, path to sort of trege where it's like, you have to kind of educate people? Like, we dealt with this with Schultz a little bit. Like, when he was starting to blow up, there were so many people that were not comedy fans. They were just fans of, like, him.

And they were like, oh, this is the first comedy show I went to. Or like, me and my dad went to this comedy show for the first time. And later became a lot more crossover. That's so great to hear, honestly, even though that must have been hard. Especially for him, like, early on, and I don't want to speak necessarily for him, he might, I don't know if he would disagree or not, but like, it seems like, especially starting off with Charlemagne. He was doing this podcast with Charlemagne that had, like, a predominantly, like, black radio. Yes, yeah. And so a lot of those people were not like, some of them, obviously were comedy fans, but not all of them were, like, going to see comedy shows every weekend.

Right. So all of a sudden he gets this new audience of people that are sort of fresh and kind of, like, educating and helping them learn how to do, like, how to be at a show. Yeah. I've gotten shit online for this before. Not by normal functioning people. But the mentally ill. But by the mentally ill. People in the comments.

It was the hardest thing that I dealt with after the... And this is one of those things that's hard to talk about because you're so incredibly grateful that this room is full of people to see you. Because there's so many years of emptiness. Yes. Empty rooms and barking. This is everything that you've ever... ever wanted. And then you're like, oh, this feels really different than when I was just doing

a spot at New York Comedy Club. Sold out spot at New York Comedy Club, fucking sick. Right? Like some of the best shows I've ever done, random people at a- That just love comedy. Who Love Comedy at a Comedy Club. Have no idea who I am. Now I'm walking into a room where the majority of people, they've never been to a comedy show, and because we are queer, I don't think people understand how much queer people historically hate comedy. Really? Because we were the butt of jokes for so long. For so long people made horrible, horrible jokes about us.

And it's just not something that people felt super comfortable doing. You know, like, I don't want to go to a show. We're also women. Historically, women, the butt of jokes for a very, very long time. Thankfully, about 10, 15 years ago, a group of women finally started rising. You know, Amy Schumer did The Garden and we, you know, Taylor Tomlinson's huge now. Things have really shifted for women in comedy. And I feel like right now it's shifting for queer people in comedy.

I hope, I pray. And I hope that I'm a part of that. But, like, and gay people are very, they don't want to hurt anybody. So they're sitting in the audience, they're hearing things that they're like, oh, this is subversive, this is offensive, maybe? I don't know. They're like taking time to think about it. So I got into this room and I was saying, I was doing satire and half of the room seemed to be really cool. And the other half of the room was like, do I laugh?

Am I allowed to laugh loud? Is this okay? Is this offensive? So I started doing these, what you said, educating. Like educating at the beginning of shows. I literally had bits that were like about how to behave at a comedy show. I have a five-minute set that's like,

these are jokes about how to behave at a comedy show. Like, don't do this. Don't cuck me. Because only women laugh like this. You know, one of the jokes is only women laugh like that. You hear, ha, that's a man every time. And I don't know if that's how they come, but that must be. You know, like stuff like that.

Yeah. To get everybody to be like, oh, I can feel free here. I can hear something offensive here. I can laugh at something offensive here. Yeah, and that doesn't make me a bad person. It doesn't make you a bad person. Because that what's really the joke I do about that is like, you're going to hear something fucked up. And then I'm going to make it right.

And if you don't laugh at that, then you're racist. Because you're stuck on the fucked up thing. And by not laughing, you're agreeing with the fucked up thing. You know what I'm saying? I would do a lot of that. really funny. And that really, really helped a lot. Oh, interesting. That's helped a lot. And then, of course, getting canceled helped a lot more. Yeah, can you explain this? I like, I tried to find out about this and I was expecting like comedy blogs or something to cover it. And it was just like

random fringe YouTube people that I'm, are not in my lane of consumption. I know. It's like, I've been dying to do a comedy podcast and talk about it, but it never. I was like, where are the boys? Yeah. Where am I canceled boys? You're You got a cancel girl. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but yeah, you kind of got left out. I got left out. Yeah.

That's the most sexism I've experienced in my career. Genuinely, I don't, like, it didn't come on my radar. Yeah. Like, I'm sure you have talked to, like, comedy friends that, like, you're having the worst day your life and they're all just like, wait, what's, why are you man? Like, is it, I don't know why. Like, I guess because the way you came up within your career was on the periphery of, like, you know, traditional comedy circle that it just.

and didn't cross over. So can you explain what happened, why it happened, the whole deal? Yeah. So I, in that preamble that I just talked about, I do a joke where I, I say a sat, I do a satire. I say, no one's going to trick you. No one's going to be like, just kidding. I'm pro laugh. And the conversion begins.

And then I say, and if that made you uncomfortable, kill yourself. And if that made you uncomfortable, double kill yourself. Okay. Because no one's pro-suicide. Like, you're not pro-suicide by laughing. Tweet that I'm pro-suicide. I will retweet it. And then I did.

And that was a mistake in retrospect. I retweeted. I retweeted Ashley Kavana as pro-suicide over and over and over again. Yeah, yeah. You kind of decontextualized yourself a little bit. Yeah, I did. I did. It is annoying when the media decontextualizes comedians. But when you did.

decontextualize yourself, you're kind of asking for it. Yeah, yeah. But what ended up happening was someone heckled me during that joke. Okay. And yelled, I tried. During the, like, I was like, oh, I'll kill yourself. And someone yelled, I tried and I ignored it. Because that's not a heckle I want to deal with, if I'm going to be totally honest.

Yeah. This individual was at a comedy show, wanted to have a good time, didn't have a good time, and I'm sorry for my part in that. But this is the story that happened. All that being said, don't demonize her. Don't go look and leave her alone. You know, that's my stance on that. That's reasonable.

So during the show, you know, she was a little drunk. She was speaking. People around her I could see were annoyed. But it wasn't so loud that the whole show was off. So I never said anything. Interrupting the openers at all? Yes, to my knowledge, yes. Because my friend came backstage and was like,

just so you know there's two girls up front kind of like a little bit yeah but i never confirmed that but that was my impression interrupting the opener interrupting not like yelling just talking loudly do you know what i mean yeah just at the table are they talking to each other yeah after every joke like this is a thing that i think happens with like sort of new comedy fans where they sort of watch comedy live the way they watch it at home yes and when you're at home and it's me and my wife and we're watching Shane Gillis, like after a joke. Oh, that's a good one. Oh, isn't that funny? And we'll talk about jokes. But then when you're in real life,

you don't want to be doing that. No, don't want to be doing that. But I let it go because I was like, this is not disruptive to the entire show. Yeah, it sucks for the people in this front row area, but like whatever. Then we get to a point, maybe she's a little drunker. I don't know. We get to a really pregnant pause in one of my jokes, and she started wooing, like screaming, like quite loud. and I shook my head and in response to that

she screamed louder so then I flipped her off playfully not like actually you know like come on man and then she just started screaming louder and I went oh my god kill yourself and to that she screamed I tried and I was like oh this is the same person

that has been so then I went full roast mode because when you you tell someone to be quiet a couple times, that technique is not working. Yeah. So you have to find, as a comedian, I don't know if you agree with this, you have to find the technique that works. Yeah. Is it?

And the last technique you want to use is shutting down the show. Yeah. No one wants. Security comes. Exactly. They leave. It's like awkward. Everyone claps after it.

It's like a whole thing. It's so. And I never want to kick anybody out. Right. And also, sometimes people like to be roasted at my show. So there was a part of me that I was like Oh, she kind of wants this roast And she's sitting near the front

She's sitting right up front Yeah So this I've seen this a million times Where it's someone that's like in the front They don't know how to behave They're wearing like a crazy outfit And then like in between every joke They're like interjecting

Just trying to get like They want to be in a clip They want to get attention Right totally And I get messages like that And I was like well you should have tried harder And right Which is the comedic response

But the whole thing She just kept yelling and security wasn't in the room and the whole thing sort of spiraled out of control and I definitely at this point will take full like yeah we were it got heated

like she was yelling I was like you are being annoying you know like I'm a yeller on stage I'm a super high energy this did not go the way I wanted it to go and it sucked it's awful like no comedian ever wants that

ever and then she had another classic sort of heckler thing that happened, the heckler realizes that they've been heckling. They thought they were helping. Do you know what I'm saying? Like someone realizes like, oh shit? Because everyone's laughing. That's the other thing. Everyone in the room is laughing.

And she, it clues into her, oh my God, I'm being laughed at. Do you know that feeling? Yeah. And that's when I feel really bad because I'm like, oh, she really did not realize. what she was walking into. But you feel like she thought she was helping? Yes, I think it was one of those. I think I thought she wanted to be roasted.

She thought she was like being loud and interjecting with the show. That's what she claimed in her video that she made about the experience. She was like, I was helping. I was wooing. She told us to be loud. I'm like, I didn't tell you to be loud. I told you to have a good time and laugh. You know what I mean?

Like, it's just honestly, it's like a miscommunication. And, you know, after I realized it, I apologized. I offered a refund. I over and over again was like, do you want to meet me after the show? They declined. And then the whole thing went online and spiraled out of control.

Everything got clipped out of context. So there are just clips of me being like, kill yourself! Without the apology. You're retweeting. You're like, I'm upset. Yeah, exactly. The retweets, I mean, it just was wild.

And at the time, it is awful to make someone feel bad. It's awful. I never want anyone to feel bad at my shows. It's embarrassing. You know, like I did hurt her feelings. I don't want her to have hurt feelings. But it got so big.

I mean, I was experiencing, it went right wing. Because she's not, I don't know her what her relationship to the queer community is. She doesn't follow any of my podcast co-host. I was like looking, I was trying to figure out what went wrong. I don't know if she's queer But she passes as straight So what ended up happening

Because she's very feminine So what ended up whether or not she's straight I have no idea What ended up happening is it went into a right wing algorithm And then people who perceived me As trans as gay Yeah, because I wear a hat People think I'm non-binary because I wear a hat

Whatever I started getting death threats I got anti-Semitic death threats I got threats that people are going to show up at my shows I got docs. My girlfriend got docs. They were threatening and go after my girls from family. I had to call my mother and be like, hey, please make sure all your information is private.

Like, you know, I know it doesn't sound like that big a deal. But as a gay person who assembles gay people today after the post night club shooting, I have already, the reason I make mass shooting jokes that people tell me are wrong and bad is because, It is a release of pain for me, right? Like, I do worry about some whack-a-doodle showing up and hurting people at my shows. I worry about that a lot. And that's why I joke about it. If it weren't happening, if it wasn't something I was worried about, you think I'd just come up with that idea?

That's a plan. That's like, I'm not, like, what is your problem? I'm not trying to enable that. Right, exactly. I'm trying to release some fucking pain. I don't know if this is interesting. I've been rambling for a while. I was genuinely curious about this.

Like, I hurt someone's feelings. I tried to apologize. You had a bad set. I'm sorry. I mean, I was actually having a really good set. But like, look, you can disparage me. You call me racist, try to kill me. Don't say I had a bad set.

The audacity. And I'm still sorry to that girl. Yeah. There are parts of it that I went to 11 when I shouldn't have gone to 11 because I misread the situation. And as a comedian, that's my job. And I failed. And I am sorry that I failed.

And I'm sorry that I failed. that I hurt her. And this is not, but it going to be being like, am I gonna, am I gonna have like blood on my hands because of a bad set? Mm.

That is crazy. Yeah. That is crazy. The right wing angle came because people misinterpreted you and then saw you like telling a straight woman to kill herself and they were like, oh,

this is. I don't really know. I can't say that. I have no idea. Mm-hmm. I just know people. were in my DMs being like this beautiful young lady you like told her these horrible things. I was like I would go and look at their profiles and I was like, oh, this is like some crazy

Christian guy. So not queer people. This is not like-queer people. No, queer people were also really mad at me, but I'm not scared of queer people. They're old pussy-ass bitches and you would never show up and shoot me. Don't say that. My point is gay people don't do that. Yeah, that is fair.

They don't do that. They don't own guns. They're anti-gun. Like, they're not going to do that. When it was gay people telling me to kill myself, when it was gay people threatening to show up at my shows, I was not worried. Because whatever. What, a little, you're going to bully me a little bit? Yeah.

I can be bullied. When it was right winged people, I was like, am I going to die? Yeah. No, I think that's reasonable. I always use this analogy. Like, suffering is like a gas. Like, it fills the space that it's in. And so people look at people that get canceled and they go, oh, see, this person didn't.

Like they came back so they weren't really canceled. They're like what they went through like they're even better now. Like, you know, Shane's hosting SNL. So what happened to him actually wasn't that bad. It's like you don't understand the pain that people go through when the entire world and like their careers in jeopardy and people are telling them to kill themselves and saying, I'm going to show up your house and kill you. Like the type of fear and pain that that puts on a person, regardless of what the outcome is a year later, what they're feeling in that time is true terror. Yeah. Like that sucks.

When I knew, just to contextualize it, when someone says, hey, I'm going to write your sister and I know where you live. Yeah, what the fuck. And my schedule is online and I have been doxed. Yeah. I'm like, okay, there's a non-zero chance. And to me, that's enough for me to like be a little bit disturbed. Yeah. You know, I wasn't awake.

Well, no, I was awake at night. but like yeah it was uh it was one of the most interesting part about it was the aftermath especially now right now is a very interesting time when i i became like a rorschach test you know those those ink bots people would listen to it and some people would be like this is the most horrible thing i've ever heard what if that young lady had gone home and killed herself and then on the other side there are the people that are like this is a comedy show and someone interrupted it and the com the comedians known for roasting the shit out of people. What did you expect?

And it was so interesting to watch so many people look at a few sentences I said and make these conclusions about whether or not I was doing my job or I was committing a crime. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, no, I think that line is kind of like people that are familiar with comedy, people that aren't. Like, to me at least, that's how it seems. Like, people that are familiar with comedy, I think would be able to see the situation

and be like, yeah, I've seen people interrupt. When people interrupt the show, it ruins the show for everyone else that's there. There's a lot of people that spent money, got babysitters, took time out of their day to come to the show and support you. You flew in from a different city to be there. And then one person is going to ruin it. I've seen shows get ruined by one person. Like, I don't think people know that that's a thing that can happen.

It's very possible. And the way to keep that from happening is to keep everything jokes. Right. So that's why it got stayed jokes and kind of making fun. And I think if you know me and you know at the beginning of the show that I'm going to say kill yourself throughout the show. It really makes it different. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because you're like, oh, this person could have left the show at any time. Right, yeah. I think that's actually an important contextualizing part. Like you tie in things throughout the show. If you watch the special,

you do a 9-11 joke all the way through. Like, if you watch the last joke and all of a sudden, that's the only thing you're watching, there's a 9-11 joke out of nowhere, you'd be like, what? Yes, exactly. It's like, well, you need the context because it is a holistic piece. It's not just much of bits all lined up. There is a through line, and there's jokes and callbacks that come back throughout the show. Yeah. And that was one of the callbacks is that you kill yourself. Yeah, exactly. Which is a joke. Like you obviously don't want this person to do that. Yeah, no, of course not. To me, it's so obviously absurd. And like you said, no one is pro-suicide that, that of course this is satire. You're on stage with a microphone at a place that's this

comedy club behind you. Yeah, exactly. So the context all implies that it would be that. But there are people that believe that's inappropriate under any context. And if that's you, I disagree with you. Yeah. But look, maybe this art form or specific artists within this art form are not for you. But does that mean that they shouldn't get to do what they do for the people whom it is for? Yeah, or I mean... I mean, I'm a survivor as well.

I didn't even include that part of it. Like, you know, I have had my struggles. And I'm the happiest I've ever been in my life. So those jokes for me, they are like a badge of honor. Right. That's a thing that I survived. Don't take that. I make jokes about my dead father.

I make jokes about, do not take this for me. This is how I deal with this. Yeah, this is the outlet. This is the catharsis. Yeah, exactly. And for other people, that's true. Yeah. But the beautiful thing is, is this boring?

No, this is what I am interested in. Okay, cool. As a comic, I just want to talk about this shit. Yeah. We can talk about gay stuff later and why lesbians are so funny, yada, yada. But for now, I'm curious about this. tell people to kill themselves and it's honestly almost adorable when a lesbian

doesn't. Look at me. I can't hurt anybody. Look at my stupid little shirt. Some of y'all are scary. Okay? We're talking about studs. We're talking about butch's. I know the terms. You don't think I'm fucking bitch? Butchish. I'm a masculine guy. Yeah, butchish.

Yeah, I'm so far in the middle. But the beautiful thing that happened is the people that I was doing the educating for have stopped coming to the shows. And now the shows are amazing. Yeah. Now, this I could actually cry again.

Now I get on stage, and I'm not afraid of my own audience. I was afraid. I would get up there and I'd be like, ugh, I'm about to do this joke about, that's like about men. And I know they're all going to tune out. And I know when I do this joke in rooms that are straight, it's a huge hit and now it's still a huge hit and I'm like now weirdly it always felt like I was battling

against some sort of weird thing that Hollywood had with the gay people that they wanted right but then when I blew up on the internet I was like oh now I have to be the gay person that the gay people want before it was like I have to be the gay person the straight people want now I have to be the gay person that the gay people want and Finally, all because I told the girl to kill herself, I have this comedy audience. Right. You can be the person that you want. Yeah, I can be me.

Yeah. Which is amazing. And it, trust me, it took a big emotional hit and a financial hit, but like, it was worth it. Yeah. And I'm weirdly not glad that it happened because I hurt someone and you never want to hurt someone again. but the aftermath of it, I'm almost glad that it came out because

my audiences are the best my audiences are the best audiences. I will put my audience up against anybody. When you got off stage that night after the show did you kind of go in the green room and be like, yes, because they left. And anytime I have a weird interaction,

I haven't had a lot of people leave shows, but when you have it, you're like, oh. Yeah, no, I feel bad about that. I've done jokes, and then you see people kind of like get their stuff and leave and like they don't really say anything and they kind of like saunter off or like the girl will leave and the guy will be there and then he'll leave like five minutes later the girl here is like a joke about yeah women and sure you know like that's and like what they

do in that case is completely the right thing like if you're out of show you don't like a joke that is completely within your right and if you want to leave that is completely fine that's it that's what you do like I like really respect that that's the move and I feel bad that like I kind of ruin someone's night like I like genuinely I don't but may I always make sure I always go to the staff and I go, hey, is it any way to find out who they were and get them a refund? Yeah. Because, or get them free tickets to another show. Yeah. Because that's on, you know what, it's, it's fine. Like, sometimes you go to a movie, you don't like it. It's fine. It's okay. I don't, I'm not happy about it. Yeah. But like, it happens. You can't be, you can't be for

everybody. Mm-hmm. But you walked offstage and you were like, damn, like, that was not. Yeah, that was another thing that made it really a lot hairier is that I, like, looked them up on line to see if they were okay, like see if they had said anything about the show, if they were upset, see if they had DM'd me upset. And I looked at their stories and they were out having a good time, which also like added to my like weird yucky feeling. I was like, they seemed so upset. Now they seem totally fine. And I made this huge mistake. I didn't want them to know that I'd seen their stories. So I blocked them. And I was 24 hours later, I was going to be. to unblock them.

Once they were no longer able to see that. Yeah. And I forgot to do that. And then it was like, she blocked us. What was she trying to hide? I'm like, I'm not trying to hide anything. I do this on stage. Yeah.

This is a public event. I tape them. Yeah. You know? And so it came out. I guess she said something. And then like the recording of it came out. They cut up the recording.

Oh, really? And they took out my apology. And also they used jokes that I made about, other people. Oh, really? So some of those things that I said weren't even about them. In the moment, if you could have changed it or changed what you said, would you have? I think I just would have been way more.

I think I would have messaged them immediately being like, that was such an unfortunate situation. I really felt like I didn't understand how upset you. were and I wouldn't have never made those jokes if I had known how upset you were. And I'm so sorry. And I would really like to extend this refund to you. Yeah. Because I tried to do that in the room, but the reality is it's hard when you're doing a

comedy show to have a moment like that. And yeah, you were also pissed, like this person, ruined, like derailed the show. The other thing is like something unfortunate did happen to me on my end and to the people around them as well. Yeah. But after the show, God, I wish I had just been like, let me take you to coffee. Yeah. Let's talk this out.

Yeah. But that was no longer a possibility after everything happened. Now, in the future, if someone were to say something or interrupt a show, yada, yada, do you think you would be quicker to be like, hey, can we just get you out of here? I think you've had too much a drink. I'm much faster to kick people out now. Oh, really? Yeah.

That's cool. I mean, I think that's probably like the way. I hate doing it. Yeah, it's annoying. The show gets derailed, yada, yada, but at least it preserves you. Like, especially if you know, like, I'm going to get pissed. I don't negotiate with terrorists anymore. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Especially early on in your career, you're so grateful for everyone that's there. Or like early on in your like success, you're so grateful to everyone that's there. You're like, I don't want to kick people out. Like, I'm so grateful that you showed up. The other lesson I learned about it was like, oh, I'm at a point now where people are going to come in and really not understand my point of view. And I do have to be, that is my job to be aware of those people. Yeah. And that happened.

That happened with her. What do you mean by that? Understand your point of view. That I'm roasty as fuck, dude. Like that I'm, I'm a, on stage. That is the brand from the special. I'm a reverse Ellen. I'm mean up here.

I'm nice out there. I'm going to say the meanest, darkest fucking thing you've ever heard. That's like my, and I love including the audience in that. And I have been way more explicit on stage in my little monologue. Like that, I've been much more explicit in my crowd work.

Now when I'm doing crowdwork, I say, listen, if you talk, I am and you say something dumb your asshole will be two inches larger than when you came in here and if at any point that you decide you don't want that anymore stop talking

if you keep talking I'm gonna keep roasting that is that is the contract I can't believe I have to say this but I'm saying it I like this vibe for me I'm like the energy is great like I also like that you're very up front

like yo I'm a dick up here Like I'm being an asshole, which I've always found on a personal basis, the comics that are like roasty and kind of like, like, I don't want to say violent, but it's sort of aggressive in their standup or in their art in general. I generally find it to be more peaceful in real life. Like this is just like a personal observation, like a personal anecdote. Like you meet like guys in like a death metal band and like they're screaming and they're going crazy on stage. And you meet them. They're like generally pretty peaceful. And I find that with stand up too.

Like sometimes you meet guys that are like you know a road guy that's completely clean and he like performs all over in churches and you know whatever And he's like a psycho and you're like okay. This is bizarre and then you meet guys that like you expect to be me and they're actually the nicest guy Well like I don't know. I mean Bill Burr Sam Kinnison Those are like my fucking guys like I want to be like that And I I've never seen a woman do that Yeah, I feel like that's the thing that's the new thing that I'm bringing is like this kind of bat-shit insane woman where you're like, oh, I actually like that she's bat-shit insane.

Yeah. You do it in a way that I actually think is, this is going to sound playfully sexist, and I mean it to be that way. But, like, I always thought about this. Like, okay, Bill is so funny. It's one of the greats, right? And when he's angry, it's hilarious to me.

It reminds me of, like, people in my family that get angry. Yes. Like, there's something so connective about it. When women get angry, you kind of, like, are like, ugh. Like it can be grading. But for whatever reason when I see you, it doesn't feel that way. Is this like a trope that I feel like that I'm stepping into that's like sexist? Or is this just like a reality of how the society is?

I think it is a reality. When women are angry. It is a sexist reality. When women are angry, I think it is grading to men. That is the problem. Yeah. And I'm about to, I'm going to hype myself up. People who hate me.

I apologize. That's what I think I bring to the take. I think men see me and I get to do the things that they get to do and they're like, that's my friend. Yeah. I'm being very vulnerable. I always worry on the internet. Like people watch and they're like, she's not sorry about what happened and she thinks she's the greatest of all time. Well, I am sorry about what happened and I also think I'm the greatest of all time. Talk that shit, bro. But like, that's what Chappelle and Chris Rock did for black people to make white people cute. curious about the black experience and feel like they get to live a part of it through

their stand-up, that's what I want to do for gay people. I want straight people to go and be like, what? That's amazing. Well, I think what you do well is that I feel personally, even just right now, comfortable, like, asking you questions or, like, learning about what the fuck it is. And the worst-case scenario, you're going to, like, make fun of me. Like, you're not going to be offended. You're not going to, like, wallow.

you're not going to like feel a way because you are a nice person yeah I'm agree you are you are you're clearly trying you got married because you were so afraid you were going to someone cut that out edit that we're not we can't put that in it

wait you want me to rephrase it like you're clearly a good guy why the fuck would I be mad at you for vulnerably admitting that you find women when they get angry to be a little grading yeah that is you you are participating in an act of self-reflecting Yeah, I guess there's a fear that like, oh, if I admit this thing about myself that I'm not proud, like, I'm not happy that I think when women are yapping all the time, it's annoying. But like. But it is. But it is to me, to me, not to everyone, but to me. And if I bring that up to you as a woman, you're going to be like, what the fuck is wrong with? And you're going to see me in a bad way. And I think a lot of people feel that. No, I'm just going to let you think about it and process it. And in a year from now, you're going to be like, that was actually really important for me. Yeah. You know, that's the way I look at it. And that's the way I look at the whole situation.

I told a girl to kill herself. I read the room wrong and I went a little hard on her. And I realized it and I apologized. Yeah. And if you want to label me as evil as someone who committed a crime, that's a you problem. Yeah. I'm a person who is capable of making mistakes. I see those mistakes.

I've implemented changes in my stand-up. But at the end of the day, you know, I don't think anyone is evil for one thing that they've did. they've done and our society has swung way too far and I hope we're coming back to a place where like we are never going to get anything done if we don't allow a little bit of grace for people who fuck up yeah fucking up isn't even the word what you did here is not fucking up what you did was just some honest conversation yeah empty truth really making some points some really strong points. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, and now I feel like it is my God-given mission to do the material that makes people the most uncomfortable to my audience. And now they're accepting it.

Yeah, I mean, how fun is that? It's so fun. Do you ever have people after shows that you were expecting would be like, I don't know, like, there would be shows like we'll do and there'll be someone like in a wheelchair or like a trans person that's not like passing super well? And they'll come up to me and they'll talk and they'll be like, I love the show. It was so great. Of course. For me, that's bros. Oh, interesting.

When bros talk to me, I'm like, you guys, thank you. Thank you so wide for that. Yeah, because to me, I'm like, when I see them in the line, I'm like, oh, no, are they going to be mad? Is this going to be awkward? I did say trans jokes and I probably made fun of someone a wheelchair. And I'm not worried about the wheelchair person as much. I'll roll them away. But I am like, I am a little worried.

Like, what if I said something mean and they're going to be mad? and like that's not my goal and yada yada and it's something awkward for all the people in line and then they're so excited and all of a sudden I'm like oh wow like they saw what I was trying to do yes which was make fun of the whole thing so badly yeah like we need comedians that are surprising the queer community and I feel like they're out there there's so many of them but the reputation has not caught up with where comedians are at and that's why I want gay people to like really go and see some comedy go see you you know you know Lucas Zelnick and Jamie Wolfe, two of my best guy friends. I think some of the best allies that I've known in this industry. Fantastic, fantastic stuff about gay people, about trans people. Like, better than mine. Sometimes I'll hear Emil Joachim has this joke about a trans soldier. Like, what if they were like, no trans people in the military?

He's like, what's more American and amazing? This is Emil Joaquin's joke, and I'm butchering it, then what if he got shot by a trans woman? Osama bin Laden shot a trans woman. That's fucking freedom. Yeah. You know, like jokes like that, I'm like, fuck. Yeah.

You know, there are great comedians doing those kind of jokes right now, and it's great that they are straight. It's good for society. Yeah. Ashley Gavin. This was great. I really enjoyed this. This was very, very fun.

I feel like you explained your point of view. I feel like I know who you are now. I feel like I've seen inside your mind, and I'm like, oh, that makes more sense. This was wonderful. You're a great interviewer. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your saying that. That makes me happy.

This is really, really cool. Let's do this again.