Cinepals - JUSTICE LEAGUE: THE FLASHPOINT PARADOX Movie Reaction & Review! | DC Animation

Episode Date: October 22, 2024

Jaby & Achara continue their DC animated journey with Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox, an animated film in which The Flash inadvertently changes the timeline, resulting in a war-torn world where Wonder Woman and Aquaman are at odds, compelling him to team up with a grittier version of Batman to restore balance. Directed by Jay Oliva (Batman: The Dark Knight Returns & Man of Steel), the film stars Justin Chambers (Grey's Anatomy & Cold Case), C. Thomas Howell (The Outsiders & The Hitcher), Michael B. Jordan (Creed & Black Panther), Kevin McKidd (Rome & Grey's Anatomy), Nathan Fillion (Firefly & Castle), Ron Perlman (Hellboy & Sons of Anarchy), Cary Elwes (The Princess Bride & Saw), and Vanessa Marshall (Star Wars: Rebels & The Spectacular Spider-Man). Watch the cutdown reaction on YouTube at www.youtube.com/@cinepals or watch along with Jaby and Achara on Patreon at www.cinejump.com SOCIAL MEDIA ~CINEPALS~  Insta: https://instagram.com/TheCinePals Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheCinePals

Senna. How? Y'all will have to guide us a little bit. I don't know the best DC animations to watch. We chose Flashpoint Paradox because Achara's convinced that this is the most popular one. It's really good. Cool. I'll trust you, Achara Kirk. No problem. Achara told me that some of the Flash movie was based on this, but this did it better?

That is what I have heard. Okay. Here we go. God, we don't even need to see what the last. to see what the letter says. You're one hell of a messenger. Thank you. Wow.

That was cool. Yeah. That whole Bruce Wayne, Thomas Wayne thing got me. Yeah. Honestly, I thought we ran out of tissues here, and I was like, do I need to replenish them? Probably not. And then, yeah. It all worked out.

Whoopsie. Wow. This was really, really good. I thought that because someone had said, like, oh, this is, the Flash was trying to do the Flash Point Paradox. I thought that I would kind of know all of the story beats, but it's actually interesting how in this one it's more so about like Thomas Wayne and Bruce Wayne like that relationship rather than it being solely about the Flash and his mom. Because like we understand that, right? We understand his regret and desire to save her. I think it's so interesting that in this alternate timeline, Thomas Wayne is Batman,

and he's like a very different Batman from the person that we know. But ultimately, he's just like, I love my son and I just want to save him. It's really beautiful. When did this timeline, like, thing happen? Because, like, they had the introduction where they introduced Thon, Thon, Thon, and the dismantling of the little bombs. Then we got the credits. He ran. he was running somewhere.

Okay. So it just happened off camera then? Yeah, it just happened off camera. That's kind of what I understood. It's like he was running and then he was just running really, really fast and then accidentally. I looked here for a second to get the IMDB. Yeah, sorry. My bad.

And then I looked back and I'm like, did I miss something important in 10 seconds? Like 10 seconds pass. How could I have missed? It said Justice League. Yeah, it just happened. It was, I mean, I guess it helped. Because it kind of gave us the audience that same unsettling feeling that Barry Allen has, where it's like, whoa, I was in my world just a second ago. And now I'm in this like alternate timeline, this alternate reality.

And so both of us are just like, whoa, what's going on? And so it's kind of cool how we, the audience, are discovering at the same time as him, you know, all the stuff that's going on and how everything that's different. So, yeah, it's interesting. I really enjoyed the action and the way they were playing with these characters. You know, it's the multiverse kind of thing or an alternate timeline thing where you see different versions of these characters. And, you know, instead of Harley Quinn, she's yo-yo, instead of Bruce Wayne, it's Thomas Wayne, et cetera, you know, so on and so forth. It's just like kind of neat how they explored it. And it was done in such a way that it didn't feel like it was ribbing me too much, if that makes any sense.

Yeah. You know? It was just kind of fun, cool, and delicious. delightful, you know, and also disturbing, because to watch Wonder Woman and Aquaman be the villains of the story and see the level of destruction that they are able to reek on the world, it's just kind of like, whoa, that's a lot. I wonder how the hardcore comic fans feel about seeing those characters portrayed that way, because you have them doing some really, really heinous stuff. I think, I mean, I'm way less familiar with Aquaman than any of the other superheroes outside of, like, the DC films, you know? With Jason Mamoa being Aquaman in the films, it was a little bit easier for me to buy into Aquaman being this way, I guess, because Jason Momoa was kind of like, because it was a badass in that era of movies. Now he's, you know, Dora the Explorer in this new movie they got coming out.

Oh, Minecraft movie. Yeah. But he's still a badass. Anyway, all I'm saying is, you know, he gave Aquaman this edge that I wasn't. you know, prepared for expecting, and I thought that was cool. I think most people agreed with that, you know, it made it were a billion dollars. And so whenever I saw this version of Aquaman, like he just seemed more, um, almost like Captain America, like the schoolboy kind of thing. Clean cut. Yeah, clean cut. And so it's like, this was like really dark.

Really dark. You know, and I'm like, okay. So what long winded, you know, way to get to this question? Like, how do the hardcore Aquaman and Wonder Woman fans feel seeing their heroes portrayed this way it's like do you buy it like like wonder woman killing this kid you know would she do that so i think i mean i think it's an interesting question to pose right and i i know that they've kind of covered this with superman as well where he goes evil as well right and so the question is like you know in an alternate universe or in an alternate timeline if situations or things were different how would they react and so i i do think It is believable.

They're not the same people. Well, the circumstances are different. Yeah, the circumstances were definitely different. But I guess I always, I liked this movie a lot. Okay, let's just put that out there. I enjoyed this thoroughly. I'm just asking questions at this point because, like, I buy into the reality of it and all the actions that they're taking, et cetera. It's just that, like, the Wonder Woman I understand is just like, she's just very good-natured.

And they showed her do some, like, crazy bad shit in this story. And I'm like, okay, so it's just the ripple effect kind of thing. It's just the butterfly effect. I think they kind of addressed it in the movie. I don't know what the line was exactly, but you get the sense that both Aquaman and Wonder Woman truly believe that they are doing the right thing, that they are fighting a just cause. And that's truly what all villains believe, right?

Because they believe in their reality and they believe that they are the protagonist of their story. And so according to them, they're like, no, I'm doing the right thing. When to the rest of the world, they're a villain. Now we never really, I mean, understood what those reasons might be. But we can kind of get on board with the idea that, you know, at first they were teamed up against the rest of the world. And then they had a falling out, obviously, because like she killed Mira. The part that threw me about Aquaman wasn't his destructive behavior. It was the way he went about it at the very end.

and surprised me because that bomb was detonated underwater. And I'm like, you're killing a bunch of aqua life in an effort to eradicate humanity here. But like he said it was worth it. He felt like it was worth it. No, no. I'm saying the move is fine, right? Yeah. But like maybe it buoys up first.

I don't know. And then moves towards the city before it explodes. I don't know. Like surely they have the tech to make it go up into the air. Sure. I guess what they're trying to show is like he's so different. Like you said from the Aquaman that we. We know that he would sacrifice the marine life that he loves so much in order to eradicate his enemies.

Sure. You cut off your nose to spite your face. Exactly. Which they said in the movie. Which they said in the movie. Yeah, it was actually very poetic the way that it was written. Like to kind of bookend it with the first scene with Barry and his mom and she's telling him the serenity prayer. Yeah, it's a great one to remember it. moments in your life it's like what what can you change what can you not and just knowing the

difference and having that kind of book end the story when he finally understands as a grown man like oh some things are just meant to be and you can change the things that you can and and some of them you can't and you just have to make your peace with it and let it go you know I really appreciated the like the few lines that they gave Kevin Conroy's Batman at the end because all of it was poignant. It's like there was no fat in that scene at all. Everything he said was important. Like, super

important. Yeah. Because he's like, you know, Flash is like, I'm dealing with the blah, blah, blah and all these memories. And Batman's like, it's a gift. I'm like, huh. Like, you know, because he got to, he has these memories of a life that he didn't get to live. Yeah, he has all the memories of a life with a mother

that he loved a lot. And so, yeah, that is a gift to have those memories. And I guess if we, if we look at life that way where it's like every single moment that we have with the people that we love is a gift and you know he was he was truly given a wonderful present it's like obviously we saw the destruction that happened as a result of barry going back through time and doing a time boom right but like for him personally i i did he get enough of a lesson in that like no you have to appreciate like the circumstance that you come from like it it's meaningful you know almost like that

Just the thought of, like, no regrets. Like, not in the comical sense, but like in the genuine sense, like, no regrets. Like, your experiences make you who you are. Sure. And it's like he saw this like global scale destruction kind of outcome of not accepting that thought. But did he get a personal lesson, you know, of like, no regrets? You know, because like there's this life that you have here. I guess I guess he did.

And I'm just like not taking it enough. You know how, like, when he saw his mom, he was so happy, you know, and almost like the Dorothy scene at the end of Wizard of Oz, it's like, oh my God, and you were there. He didn't get that with Green Lantern, with G.L. You know, he didn't get that moment back. Like, dude, you're alive. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, there was that cathartic thing. It was all just like Batman.

Right. Which is fine. If I had to pick one superhero, that's the dude I'm going with. But, like, it would have been kind of nice to have the other guys a little bit. Sure. I guess you don't get, like, as dramatic of the thing of him just running into the, but. Anyway, that's all. Sorry, that was kind of dumb, I suppose, but...

Yeah, yeah, I can see how that might have been fun to just have him with the rest of the Justice League and be like, oh, my God, I'm so glad you guys are here and like, you're normal. But I think that ending it, you could have still ended it with the Batman scene, obviously, but I think the choice to just kind of go straight to Batman was strong because at that point, all I could think about was like,

yeah, but do you still have the note, though? Sure. That's what I want to know. I want Bruce to get some closure as well and to get a message from his father from the Great Beyond saying whatever it was. I imagine it said, like, I'm so proud of you, I love you, blah, blah, blah, blah. And is exactly the thing that you need to hear

and it would be incredibly healing for him who spent like his entire life crusading because of that incident that happened. It's definitely a strong choice to go straight to that. For me, not getting a reunion moment with a Green Lantern minor criticism from me you know another minor criticism i guess would be i enjoyed a lot of the action but like there was a lot of action sequences that dealt with aquaman and wonder woman and i was just like i don't really know who i'm rooting for here it's just a lot of violence yeah you know

and i'm like that's cool and all but like what what am i what am i hoping for in each of these outcomes you know it's so interesting because um one of the things that i didn't really enjoy in the live action Batman versus Superman is that what it's called Batman v Superman? Yeah was that fight

when they're just like Oh no it's not Batman v Superman It's Man of Steel With Zod right Where they're just like destroying the city And it You got by the last 45 minutes

Yeah Yeah yeah okay I was just like I'm sorry Not that interested because it just becomes a little bit overwhelming It wears you down

It does wear you down But for whatever reason in anime I can stomach that a bit more. It was interesting and fun to watch the heroes just be pitted against each other and like trying to do cool moves to outmove each other. Don't get me wrong. I thought that shit was dope.

Like I thought all of that was really cool. It's just that like there's a part of me that goes, well, what am I hoping is the outcome in each of these scenarios? For instance, you know, you have Wonder Woman against, I know this is just a flashback, but it's the only example I can come up with at the moment. But you have Wonder Woman and what's her name? Aquaman's wife, Mira.

Mira, right? You have them fighting. I'm like, I don't know who I'm rooting for here. Like, I don't know what I'm hoping is the outcome. Right. I understand it's a flash pack to just give us the backstory, because that's when Flash himself was like getting his new memories and stuff. I get it.

But it's like, just in the moment, I'm like, I don't know what I am just aiming towards. But I think that's the whole idea, right? it's supposed to be supremely unsettling for us as an audience. When we know these characters so well from other movies and things that we've watched or maybe other comics that we've read to then kind of have them in a situation where they're pitted against each other and that feeling that you're describing of like, wow, I really don't know who to root for right now. It's super disturbing.

You know, like it's a lot to take in because I think as, as audience members, we so desperately want to know who we're rooting for. Like, who's the good guy? Sure. Who's the bad guy? And in this case, it's like, wait, but the people that I like, the characters that I like are no longer the good guys. So now I'm just confused and I don't know what to do.

And I feel like that's kind of probably what Barry Allen is feeling as well. Like he's in the situation. And so it's like, oh crap, well, I guess they're bad now, but it's still hurt. you know. Yeah, there was an interesting thing that they were doing here that I kind of wish they expanded on because at its heart, I mean, at least for Wonder Woman, both of them actually, there was a love that they had for each other. And it just went completely awry when Wonder Woman killed Mira, right?

And it just became this thing that was kind of like out of Black Panther Wakanda forever. It's like, I messed up. Now we're all going to fight. What's his name? The underwater people in Black Panther Wakanda. Yes, yes, yes. I forgot a to LaConne or something. No more.

Yeah, okay, yeah, whatever his name is. Stupid reference on my part. But all I'm saying is like, there were hints of stuff because in the last fight, Aquaman is like, you know, I, just so you know, I loved you. And she's like, no, you didn't. And like, you know, there was that exchange. And so she was having her, they each have their own psychology going on, right? Yeah.

And right before she was about to execute him, she had tears in her eyes, it's like, well, clearly she has feelings for him too. And clearly they're just not having a conversation they need to have. Right? And I'm like, it'd be cool if they found more opportunities for that because it was more, it was just way more focused on the action. Well, it's, it's interesting too, because it's kind of like what happens when two superpowered meta-humans have a lover's spat? Yeah. Really? It's like the repercussions are huge. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's wild. It's literally the end of the world because they can't have a conversation. And he's pissed because

because she killed his wife, but also, like, didn't you sleep with her? Like, okay. Yeah. It's complicated. It's very messy. It's very messy. It's very human. But then they are meta-humans who have superpowers that can break the world.

Yeah. I just wish they expanded on that a little bit more just from me because it's like, that's some emotional stuff that they could have played with. Kind of like the stuff at the end with Batman and the letter. You know, there was more opportunities there that they just sort of did. I'm like, no, but there's a cool scene there where, you know, a Wonder Woman talks to Aquaman is like, yo, I took care of her.

It's like, what do you mean took care of her? Whatever the dialogue would have been, it's like, now we can be together, no issues. He's like, what did you do? You know, like, I think that there's... I was never going to leave my wife for you, you crazy ho. Yeah, whatever that dialogue would have been, would have been fascinating, like, what's his response, you know?

And he's like, be gone. And now... I mean, you get all of that. I know you get all of it. I don't want footnotes. I want to see that scene. You know what I mean? I want to feel something.

So then at least I have a stronger understanding of like what's going on here. He attacks first and then the, you know, it's, you know, that's all. So this is like the nitpicky part of the conversation. It's just like. You're only nitpicking because you enjoyed it so much at this point. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I like the relationship that developed between Barry Allen and Thomas Wayne. I thought that was cool. Yeah. You know, and seeing what comes of Thomas Wayne. And after losing a son, it's like, it's crazy to think, like, you get an even darker Batman as a result of the similar incident. I think it's part, I mean, it makes sense. Losing a parent is bad, right? But on some level, I think we all expect it.

We are supposed to outlive our parents. Yes. But a parent isn't supposed to outlive a child. And so that's probably way worse, you know? Yeah. Yeah. it's way worse when you lose a child. It breaks

a part of you. Or unless you're Matthew McConaughey in an interstellar. Oh, okay. I was like, what are you talking about? What are you? Happy, shut up. Let her talk. There was another thing left unexplored, which is Mrs. Wayne becomes Joker or something. Yeah, I wasn't

sure if that was a dream or if that was like she just cracked and she turned into the Joker. It was a memory. Okay, so it wasn't. Okay. Yeah. It was, it was Barry's memory. And so she becomes, but like, we never saw that unfold. But I guess that kind of makes sense, too, as to the extreme hatred that he feels towards

the Joker, because a lot of the time, I mean, they say that love and hate are kind of two sides of the same coin, right? And so I guess this doesn't imply in every situation, because obviously it is possible to hate someone that you've never loved. But often you hate someone so passionately when you used to live. love them so passionately sure i mean that's what happened with uh aquaman and wonder woman in this oh yeah exactly so yeah i guess the last thing i was wondering about is just like what what motivates batman each day because it's like he's he's got he's got he's got such a dark outlook i'm like

what what are you fighting for that was a little bit it's a little bit unclear to me because you don the cape you are you are fighting crime but you're fighting crime within certain parameters in order to to, like, be able to hurt, maim and kill villains who are like the villains that killed his son because the pain never goes away. And so he needs to get out there and just, like, pommel a few faces. Sure. Okay. Okay.

I'll take that. Yeah. I kind of wanted to see him, like, take a break at one point and be like, yo, I got to go deal with this casino bullshit. The day to day of running a casino. It's fine. He's got people to do that for him. He's delegating. Yeah. He's just cashing the checks, you know? Yeah. I mean, he mentioned, you know, that he uses the plane to shepherd around, like, rich people.

Yeah, they do that. Like, what if there was a guy on the plane with them? Like, who is this person? No, we're just dropping him off. Don't worry, we're going to go fight. He needs to get to, you know, Chicago. Whatever. Yeah. Anyway, that's nonsense. I, again, I like the relationship between Thomas and Flash. that was pretty cool.

And also Superman was cool, too, in this. Like, that kind of skinny, emaciated. That version of him was neat. He reminded me of James Stewart. Isn't that his name? I always get a... The one in It's a Beautiful Life? Yeah.

Yeah. You got me scared for a second that I said the real name. I was like, why are you staying that he reminds of James Stewart? Yeah, James Stewart. Or just in the look? Yeah, that Superman reminds me of James Stewart. Like, when I saw his face, I'm like, that's totally James Stewart. I kind of wanted him to talk like this, and it was pretty cool.

Yeah. No, really? I love the, I love the innocence that he had. That's a terrible James Stewart impression, but yes. Okay. On my part, my part. Yeah, I said I'm more like, oh, and Wilson, but go ahead. Sure.

No, I just like the innocence that Superman had where he's like, oh, you know, we're friends. He just trusted the first people that saved him, but I suppose you would if all you'd had was being stuck in that room. And then these people come in and they're like, we got you. the way, you know. Yeah, he came back in clutch. He did. Right in the nick of time. It is sad that this wasn't just directly yoked and put into the live action, you know,

like, just use this. This is good. Like, this was solid. This is a solid foundation. Expand on it and create a live action version that is even cooler. It was doing way too much other shit with bad CGI, with baby's CGI that looked awful. Yeah, they were going through the jokes a lot more, whereas this was just like, you just felt more serious, which I appreciated.

This would have been a great story to see live action, actually. Like, it's a little sad that we didn't get, anyway. I guess they really wanted it to be a story about Flash, whereas this feels like it is a proper Justice League story because it's about all of the different members of the Justice League. But the heart of it is still Batman in Flash. Sure, but then in the end, like in the end of the live action, the movie, we have that moment with Flash in the supermarket with his mom, right?

And he gets to have that moment. That was a cool moment. That was a cool. I did really like that. That was probably one of my favorite things about the movie. But then here, we don't have that emotional moment really with his mom. Yeah. We didn't get that with Batman.

Yeah, we didn't get his goodbye with his mom. Like, we saw him tackle Flash to stop him from saving his mom. Yeah. But, yeah. Like I said, there's like opportunities they could have expanded a little bit more. It would have cost you five more minutes of time, maybe, and it would have been great. I feel like they weren't really trying to lean into the melodrama so hard. I guess that's what I was looking for.

Yeah. I love a bit of melodrama. Yeah, maybe that's what I was looking for. I think you're secretly a melodramatic person. Because like every single time we review a movie, you're all like, I just wanted that moment where the character gets to do this thing and have that. of closure and it would be so dramatic. It's like, I think you mean melodramatic, but.

Maybe. But like you just said, that scene in the flash was, or a flash, yeah, the flash. The movie, yeah. Like, that was one of the good scenes in the movie. Yeah. You know, I'm thinking about CGI babies now and it's awful. I can't get it out of my head. What about?

Thumb, the thomp, thomp, thong. But anyway, him putting the baby in the microwave, like, what are you doing? Yeah, it would have been nice to have a little goodbye here, but. You know what? Sometimes you don't get to have goodbyes, and that's okay, because. What did the movie teach us? Sure. You don't get to change all the things.

I know, but just like Back to the Future, you know, it just gives you that opportunity to like have that moment. The whole reason Back to the Future was written is because the writer, if I'm not mistaken, the writer like lost his father and it's like, what if I could go back in time and see my dad as a kid? Like, you know, that feeling? And so it's just sort of like this extra cathartic thing. Like I said, the introduction of Batman and Flash to each other,

like it was really cool because it's like not what you expect at all and Wayne Manor is all like just not held together Al what happened to Alfred we don't even know he got let go sure he was trying too hard to help Thomas Wayne yeah Thomas was like nah I don't need healthy choices right now I'm all about alcoholism it's really it's really apparent though how heavily this this influenced the flash movie you know just because like Wayne's living alone he's older yeah even though it was still Bruce Wayne um he just was like you know disheveled and whatever yeah yeah there was no Alfred and um and then like flash in that relationship anyway i thought it was cool and then the whole lightning thing you know it was just it was fun

that there was that whole aspect of the film i really enjoyed between batman and flash yeah so it was great anyways you guys thanks so much for hanging out hopefully you enjoyed that i'm jabby kui this is achara cook peace out