Cleared Hot - Powered By BRCC - Full Auto Friday - Round 11

Episode Date: July 24, 2020

Today's Full Auto Friday will focus on two questions, instead of multiple, with no time cap. How do you say goodbye to someone dying in front of your eyes, how do you deal with severe depression and suicidal thoughts? They were tough questions, I hope my answers did them justice. Enjoy

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So if you're into that type of thing, on it.com slash hot. Go to town. West of the smoke. I'm looking at danger close now. All right, today, full auto Friday. If you're a fan of the podcast

or you have listened to these episodes before, you will know that they are generally rapidifier Q&A. But occasionally I will get what I consider to be a question that is important enough. I don't actually know the right terminology. Important enough has enough gravity that perhaps it would be better to dedicate the time and effort to answer just that one question. So I actually have two today that I believe personally are a little bit tied. And I'm going to do my best to answer them. So here we go.

Question number one, and I'll just use the first name here. Johnny writes to me. I served in the 173rd Airborne. In my time, I've had to say goodbye to a few brothers. And now that I'm out, a lifelong friend is dying from brain cancer. How the fuck do you say goodbye to someone that is slowly dying from that shit? It was one thing to get closer for someone that was fighting. It was one thing to get closer for someone that was.

fighting something you could see and deal with. He is probably in his last few weeks, and this is the hardest shit I've had to deal with yet. It's a tough question, and this one hits home for me, actually, because of my experience with my mom. And early on, many years ago, when I was soliciting for, I believe, one of my first Q&As, somebody wrote in and asked me, what is, or what was, one of the biggest regrets of my life. And my answer was the ending that I had with my mother. And I'll lay it out a little bit the specifics of what was happening in my life during that time period to give people some context. But it was in 2010. And, you know, actually probably should rewind a decade before that when my mother was a cancer survivor. She had cervical cancer and she

beat it. She actually outlived every person that was in her cancer survivor group. And in 2010, I went on a military deployment. I think I left in either late February or early March. I came back in August shortly before she died. But right before I went overseas, she was diagnosed with her second bout of cancer. And I was in the United States and actually with her when we went to the hospital. I was with my sister and my father. I feel very fortunate that I was able, I don't want to say that I was able to share that experience with them, but that, I mean, that's exactly what I mean. I'm glad that we were there together. And shortly thereafter, after the diagnosis, I launched overseas.

And I stayed in touch with my mom. I think we talked on the phone a few times, but more than anything, the easiest form of communication was email. So we emailed back and forth. And speaking for her a little bit, she got to a place where the choices were the following. die from chemotherapy or die from cancer. And she chose the latter. And I don't blame her, having now seen at least a little bit in the tail end of what the chemotherapy does to the human body. And I'm not anti-chemotherapy by any stretch of the imagination.

I'm just saying that I understand why she would make that choice and she would choose to go out on her own terms as opposed to in a fruitless fight with the cancer that was killing her. So I got a red cross message overseas, and it's perhaps important to describe at least a little bit, the mindset that I experienced. When I talk about my experience in the military, I'm talking about only that, my personal experience, because I can't speak to anything else. But for me, on deployments, I would find myself in a headspace that I don't want to describe it as binary or black and white, but there was an essence of both of those things. not on a daily basis, and maybe even sometimes not on a weekly basis, but you would be out and you would make decisions about life and death. And when you're in an environment, at least in my own experience, where that is happening relatively often, the severity of other decisions that are being made, they kind of fall by the wayside. And a lot of the static bullshit that draws people's attention in or draws my attention in when I'm back in the United States, it's not even hitting your radar screen anymore. But it was a very black and white headspace.

And that is the headspace that I was in when I got home. And when I saw my mother for the first time after getting back from being overseas, I knew that the end was near for her. And I mentally crossed that boundary in an instant when I first saw her. I did not experience the slow decline like you are talking about. And I actually think that that made it easier for me. There was pros and cons to that headspace. The pro to that headspace would be

is I was able to emotionally bridge that gap and realize that my mom is dying and she was going to die soon. The con to that headspace was I wasn't in a place where I could be the son for her that I wish I could have been. And that is my regret. My regret in the end is how we had our last interaction.

It wasn't great. It wasn't scripted. I didn't realize in the moment. moment that it was going to be our last interaction. What I would have liked to have done is to have taken the time to explain to my mother how important she was to me and to explain to her how meaningful she was to me. I view my life and the successes that I have had and the things that I have been able to do are largely built on the foundation that both my mother and father provided for me. they absolutely set for me and calibrated my moral compass, my work ethic, my integrity.

And one of the things that I really appreciated the most about my mother, and she always reinforced to me that I should be true to myself at all times. Don't bend to other people's will. Be the person that you believe that you are. And I wish I had been able to say those things. because that is how I feel, but that's not the ending that we had. And I feel like to a degree that as her son, I failed her in those moments. I wish I would have taken the time to go back and have another conversation with her.

And I can't. And for what you are asking about, Johnny, is that I don't want you to be in that situation. So what I don't want you to do is have an experience and those residual feelings and emotions that I still do to this day. My mom has been dead for 10 years. So my advice to you, and that is all that it is, because I'm not an expert on death or the end of life. When I think about your question, what I arrive at, or where I arrive at would probably be the best way to say that, is if the situation were reversed, or if you were somebody who wanted to have closure with me, what would I want to hear? And you would you. You know, you would you want to hear? And you, you

you could think about that, Johnny, and perhaps the context of what would you want to hear if the situation with your friend was flip-flopped? I think that all I would want to hear in the end is that I was loved and that I mattered somewhere to somebody. I think at the end of life, if people that you care about could say those two things and they couldn't get anything else out, I think that would be important and I think it would be meaningful and I think it would be impactful in that phase of your life. And what I'll say is, based on my own experience and from what I understand now when talking to some other people, is that it's likely when you go try to have this conversation, if you do go try to have this conversation, it's going to be anything other than a Hollywood

movie. I don't know anybody yet who has described to me a situation where it was just flowery and the words were perfect and the sentiment was communicated perfectly, and I'm not saying that that can't happen. But what I am saying is in the people that I have talked to, it was anything but that. So don't try to make it a Hollywood movie. Don't worry about it if it's clunky. Don't worry about it if you break down and cry

and have a hard time getting the words out of your mouth. And don't worry about it if it's emotional and challenging and difficult and all of those things that it's going to be. But keep doing it. and keep trying until you say what needs to be said. And maybe that's one conversation or two or three, or however many it may be. Because the beauty of, I think, probably the best thing that you could provide for your friend is just being there with him. And in that attempt to be there with him, you can have these conversations.

So even if it does go great and you are able to have the perfect Hollywood movie where the script and the plot play itself out perfectly and, you know, there's classical music playing in the background, whatever it may be. That's awesome, but still be there for your friend because I think that is the most valuable thing that you can do. And you've expressed that this is probably the hardest thing that you've ever had to deal with. I understand exactly how you feel. And my recommendation beyond this when your friend does unfortunately pass is go find some help for yourself because we all needed. Which leads me into my second question. Second question, and I'll use first names only again. comes from Sean.

And this was an email, actually, that came with the subject line of depression. Says, hi, Andy, I just had a question regarding depression. My background is in the Marine Corps. I joined right out of high school. I never deployed and never saw any action of any kind. Throughout my enlistment, I struggled severely with depression and suicidal thoughts, though I never had any real injuries or experiences. It got so bad it actually led me, it actually led to my early separation and the subsequent shame that I still feel today from not being able to hack it.

I hate talking about it and I was wondering if I'm just being a bitch. Am I a coward or is there something wrong with me? Hope you can read this eventually. Sean. Let's start with the obvious. I am not a doctor or an expert on depression or suicide. So please take that with a grain of salt. I don't know if I have ever had a deep bout of depression.

I think as human beings, we will have a natural oscillation of highs and lows. I certainly have felt depressed in my life, but I don't think I have ever dealt with what you are describing. And suicidal thoughts, if I'm being completely open and honest, for a very long time, I did not understand suicide. I did not understand the decision to take your own life. I didn't understand how an individual would get to a place that is so deep and so low and so dark that that would become a viable option or even an option that hits a list of 100. In the past 14 months, I have a better understanding of that. I am not suicidal and I have never had the thought of taking my life, but the divorce that I am 14 months into, again, if I'm being totally open and honest,

I now have a better understanding of how and why you can achieve a low point where that becomes an option that may seem like the better alternative than continuing forward. So again, and for people out there, I'm not saying that I'm suicidal. What I'm saying is I have developed, I think, a little bit more empathy and understanding of what it is that you're talking about. But I really, I worry in my answers with this to you because I think you might be in a different place. But I'm going to dig into your email here in a little bit. You said that you feel shame today from not being able to hack it. And what I would say to you is, what does that even mean? You were, it sounds like, as you have expressed to me, dealing with personal issues

that likely would have prevented you or prohibited you from hacking it, regardless of your profession or occupation. It may, because maybe this was a point in time in your life where there was a chemical imbalance or there was something going on in your personal life. I don't think it has much to do with the Marine Corps. You happen to be in the Marines when this was happening, but imagine if you were working at Apple, and I don't know why I just selected that as an example,

but if you were dealing with the same depression and suicidal thoughts, you probably wouldn't have been able to, in air quotes, hack it there either. My answer to whether or not you were being a bitch, no, you're not being a bitch. And my answer is to whether or not you're being a coward is, no, you're not being a coward. In any way, shape or form. I mean, as human beings, we're completely, in my opinion at least, imperfect and a constant work in motion. There's no arrival point. There's no end state when it comes to the things that you're going to have to work through through your life.

And there's absolutely nothing wrong with having a phase of your life that is a massive dip. I hope that it was followed by a massive climb and a massive peak. But just because you experience those things and they have a negative impact on your life, it doesn't mean you're being a bitch or a coward, like at all. You're talking about it. I mean, that's a huge and important step. I think that's the most important and critical step in the beginning. And I've said this before and I'll say it again.

I'm not worried about the people who will verbalize that something is wrong with them. I'm worried about the people who tell me that they're fine and they say nothing and they go out into the woods and they blow their brains out. Those are the coworkers that I worry about the most, not somebody who can write an email like you did. The advice I would give you is that you need to let go of whatever you're still holding on, whatever you're still holding on to in regards to your military service. It's in the past and you have to let it go because it's only going to be an end. anchor for you. You have to let go of the fact that whatever you were dealing with prohibited you from having a Marine Corps career that you wanted because there's no way that you're going to be able to achieve that. And holding onto that is just going to drag you down

for the rest of your life. So step one, take the brucksack off and just put it down and start walking away from it. And my second piece of advice, and this ties into the first question that I got it at the end, you got to find help. I hope that you are talking to somebody, Sean. If you're not, I cannot recommend enough that you go find somebody that you can. Like I said at the beginning, I'm not an expert on depression or suicide, but there are many people out there who are experts on both. And I highly recommend that you go find one of them. If you're anything like me, you are your own worst enemy. I am absolutely my own worst enemy.

And to me, that is the value of the counselor that I sit and talk with every week. I had an hour conversation with my counselor this morning, and it changes the trajectory of my day and my week when I do so. It puts things into perspective for me. It provides for me an objective view of the things that I'm working my way through, as opposed to an emotional view of the things that I'm working my way through. And like I said previously, we're all broken to some degree. I am firmly of the belief now that all human beings are broken to some degree, to one degree or an order. And I think that the goal should be for you and for me and for everybody else who either listens to this or watches this, I think the goal should be for all of us that we never get up, never get up. We never give up when it comes to trying to make ourselves a better version of who we are.

And that is what I hope everybody can think about at the end of today's Full Auto Friday. Think about where you are. Think about some ways that you can be a better version of who you are right now and then never stop that journey. when you get somewhere where you think that you've done well in one area, find a different area and just continue that cycle throughout the course of your life. And that's what I'll leave everybody with for this Friday. Have a good weekend. See you back on Monday with a new episode.