Coffeez with Joe Shalaby - Lending a Hand ft. Kevin Kenerson | Coffeez for Closers with Joe Shalaby Ep. 36

Starting point is 00:00:00 What's up everybody? Welcome to another episode of Coffee's Proposers. Today we're sitting down with the number one mortgage broker in the state of Tennessee. This man has managed to grow in a very adverse market and continues to double down on his growth. He is one of the kindest people you will ever meet, a very humble heart, and a person that has, been an inspiration to myself personally. Please welcome the president and CEO of Lending Hand Mortgage, Mr. Kevin Kenerson. What's up, Joe? How are you, brother? Good to see you. Thanks for having me. Absolutely, absolutely. And I know we were talking yesterday, you were a little nervous about, you know, doing a discussion for 45 minutes. I'm like, bro, it's just a conversation for a little bit, you know, it's a, don't, don't be intimidated, no big deal, just thousands of people watching and,

Starting point is 00:01:03 you know. Don't big deal. No, I mean, listen, I don't, I don't know if I've ever had a deep conversation or conversations for like 45 minutes, except with you, Joe. Yeah, exactly. And your wife. Yeah, and my wife, right. So it's an honor to have you here, and thanks for coming on.

Starting point is 00:01:21 So I like to start every show off with an icebreaker, and that is, how do you, Kevin, start your morning, what is your morning routine every single day? Well, I have chickens. So it starts with, I look at my, of course, Cassie, she wakes me up. So she's like, okay, because I'm naturally a late sleeper. I used to be a late sleeper, but now I get up early because I have chickens. So, yeah, I got chickens. You got a rooster too?

Starting point is 00:01:48 I have roosters. I have like, gosh, I had a lot more roosters, but they became pest. So I got rid of some of them. But right now I've got like five roosters. So they do all the hollering and everything, but it's cool. So I get up in the morning, I let the chickens out. I spend way too much time with the chickens. So Cassie's like, you need to come back inside, you got to deal with the kids, you got to get them ready for school.

Starting point is 00:02:10 But I could spend all day outside watching the chickens, and people say, well, you know what, chickens are just dumb, but actually they do talk to each other. So there's a lot more to chickens than most people realize. It's just like bees. Yeah, just like bees. Actually, I want to get into bees too. So this is your exit strategy here. It's like these and chickens. It's my, yeah, it's my exit strategy.

Starting point is 00:02:34 But, no, seriously, I could spend, I can spend hours watching the chickens. So I do the chicken thing. Right now I'm not working out. I messed up, I messed up my arm. So maybe it's just an excuse, but I need to get back at it. So then I get the kids ready for school. We get them off and then hit the office. How long have you had an injury?

Starting point is 00:02:56 You know, it's been like, so I first had a shoulder injury, I was lifting way too heavy. I thought I was a young buck, but I'm not a young buck. And then I hurt my bicep. So it's probably been like a year and a half, like a year and a half. Oh man, I'm starting to hear that. Yeah. Was it a tear? You know what?

Starting point is 00:03:14 I don't know if the bicep has a tear. It feels like a tear, but never really checked it out. Yeah, you just said, I'm hurt. I'm hurt. I can't do this. Yeah. Well, God, God. Restore you quickly, man. I'm sorry to hear that. I know that it was part of your regiment.

Starting point is 00:03:31 Yeah, it was. We talked about it before. He used to do it like five times a week. Yep, absolutely. All right, well, Kevin, how did you get started in the business, the mortgage business? And why did you choose mortgage? Well, you know, Cassie, my wife, when we got married before this, like we dated six years beforehand. And like, I love numbers. Like, I always love numbers, but her father was a real estate agent. and I like numbers. I don't know if you remember Carlton Sheets, like he was a real estate investor.

Starting point is 00:04:02 Okay. This is like back in the 90s. So he's a real estate investor, and I'm like, oh my goodness, I love this. I think I could probably do some investing. So Cassie's father was a real estate agent. I was like, okay, well, maybe this relationship, I can learn something from him too.

Starting point is 00:04:17 And through college, though, you know, I wanted to graduate quickly. So I graduated in three years instead of four. I was like, what can I do to push myself to get finished? Well, we got finished. I became an accountant after I graduated for, it was a staff accountant position for a hospital. And it's like, man, I don't really like this.

Starting point is 00:04:36 This isn't something that I want to do. I was 21 years old, and it was just monotonous. It was like the same thing over and over again. We balanced accounts. Then at the end of the month, we had the end of the month, and it was just like, okay, I was making maybe $30,000 a year. maybe a little bit more, but it was about 30,000 a year. And it was just the same thing over and over again.

Starting point is 00:04:57 I was like, I need more interaction. I'm a type D, but a type I, type I personality. So I was like, this isn't for me. And my cousin Amy, she was in the business too. So I was like in real estate originator. And I was like, you know what? Maybe that's something that I could do. So in 2003, I got into business.

Starting point is 00:05:18 And you're just co-calling leads or what were you doing? No, you know what? I didn't really, it, I didn't really, I didn't know that you could cold call. All I did is I went after real estate agents. You've never done anything other than real estate agents. That's it. That's it.

Starting point is 00:05:33 Now you dominate that space. Yeah. So I was like, I beat the streets. I walked the streets. It was just old school. I was like, all right, let me come say hi to you, shake hands, kind of tell you what I did. Of course, I didn't really know exactly what I did at the time. I was just like walking the streets and set up as many appointments as I could.

Starting point is 00:05:50 And at that time, I was like, okay, I can't. fail because I'm putting Cassie you know Cassie was working a little bit but she was finishing college too so I was like you know there's no option but to succeed so just like a no fail attitude and just over and over again and you know it's just something I loved immediately it was a little stressful like when you get in the business like you don't know how to deal with the stress of this business especially if you're doing any type of volume and at first being young I was like I There was times I cried.

Starting point is 00:06:25 I was like, I don't know what to do. This is stressful. And it could be, especially because the path that you took was one where you, it was relationship building. It was. So there was no real, like, certainty. And you were still not married at the time. You were still dating your wife? No, we got married.

Starting point is 00:06:45 So we got married in 2002. So I graduated 2002. I was a staff accountant immediately. like it actually I started I started as a staff accountant before we got married but I knew when we were getting married which was June so I graduated like in May we got married in in June but I'd already started my position as a staff accountant so so you left the certainty of a W-2 job yeah for the absolute uncertainty of a relationship building loan officer position why did you that you know what I don't think it didn't scare

Starting point is 00:07:21 me. Like it, being commissioned didn't scare me because I knew that we could be successful. Like, I just knew, I was like, we're going to be successful. We'll do it. Was there someone who had walked the path before you that you knew that was successful in the mortgage space? Amy, my cousin, was the only one. Yeah, she was the only one. She was, I didn't even know what originator was back in, like, in college. And then, you know, like, we knew that she was doing well. So, like, well, I can do it, too. Nice. Okay. So then, when did you start your entrepreneurial journey when you wanted to start your own company? What year was that? You know what? I was probably 12 the very first time that I knew that I was going to own a company. My dad, he owned a company.

Starting point is 00:08:01 He was a commercial artist and I was like, you know what? This is exactly what I want to do. What I want to do. I want to own a company. I want to, you know, I think I said I'm going to be a millionaire. Of course, at the time, I was like, obviously it doesn't really matter now, but at the time I was like, I'm going to be a millionaire and I want to run a company. And that was at a very young age. You didn't know that millionaires would be middle class now, huh? Right, they're middle class, exactly, right? Running off budgets. Because now the kids are like, I want to be a billionaire.

Starting point is 00:08:27 Yeah, right. Now it's a billionaire. Yeah, I didn't even know the word billionaire up until it's like 20. Right. Yeah, so at a young age, I was like, this is what I want to do. Actually, at first I wanted to be, well, so I wanted to be a cardiologist, and that was probably like I was 10. And then I wanted to be an obstetrician because I love babies. My sister, she worked on the OB floor.

Starting point is 00:08:51 And then I was like, they've got to go to school way too long. They've got to be there for like 12 years. And I was like, I just don't have that time. So I was like, probably owning a business is what I want to do. Yeah, there's a, so, you know, as parents, we both have four kids. It's like, I'd rather have my kids go to med school. Still, I'm convinced, you know, because all my kids, in my culture, everybody's a doctor. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:09:14 Like, we just had an outing, and every single person was a specialized doctor. They're all like dermatologists or neurosurgeons or radiologists or eye surgeons. And for me and you, being an entrepreneur, it's like in our blood. But, you know, the path of least resistance, like, is kind of like going that stable route, like, which is, you know, something I think about for the kids all the time. Do we want them to go down the path that we went, that uncertainty? or do we want them to go down this, like, straight path of it, you know. Yeah, you know, and I talk to the kids all the time, and I, you know, talk to Cassidy. It's like, I don't necessarily have to have the kids go to college, just because I think that I know the path that we took, if you're a hard worker, you can accomplish a lot.

Starting point is 00:10:01 Yeah. And really, if you're going to be a trade, such like doctors, obviously, you know, it's not really considered a trade, but you have to have the schooling. It's a trade with a lot of schools. Yeah, it is. Exactly right. Because handymen make like $80 an hour now. Yeah, so I'm like, okay, if you're going to be a trade, like HVAC, electrician, journeyman, whatever it is, yeah, go get your schooling for that.

Starting point is 00:10:24 And I do think college does prep you for it. And it also matures you a little bit more if you are willing to, like, really absorb everything. But I told the kids, I said, you know, I don't necessarily have to have you go to college. Like some parents are like, you have to go to college. This is the only option that you have. but I'm in the mindset now being on the path that we've been in. I think that it did make us a better maybe CEO and be able to operate our company better. But, you know, I don't know if everyone has to go to college.

Starting point is 00:10:56 Well, now, sadly, all the kids that go to college, they just run all their work through chat GPT, so they're really not going to college. They're just having AI go to college for them, and they're just showing up. Yeah. So it is totally a different dynamic. traditional college that we went to because we just had Google at best. When did you graduate college? I graduated in 2001.

Starting point is 00:11:22 Okay. Yeah, it was 2002. I remember in my freshman year in high school, I was like, what is the internet? That was like 94, 95. Yeah. I'd never got on the internet prior to that time, really. Yeah, I knew about the internet earlier than that. Well, you lived in California.

Starting point is 00:11:38 I lived in Tennessee. Yeah, yeah. You're always four years behind. You're fine. So, what do you think inspired you to become an entrepreneur? I think, I think really it was probably my father. Yeah. Because, you know, I do, of course, I was the youngest of seven.

Starting point is 00:12:00 And my mom, she didn't work until, like, I was five. Like, she raised all the kids. And then once I was, I was born, like, my grandmother, she took care of me, like, while my mom went to school and obviously when she worked. But I think, like, my father, he did inspire me to step out. Like, do a little bit more, be an entrepreneur. Maybe it runs in the blood, I don't know. But I would go into work with him all the time.

Starting point is 00:12:26 And, yeah, I was proud of him. So I think that I just, I saw him do it. And I was like, okay, this is cool. I like it. Now, you have such crazy work ethic, right? We were talking about it earlier. It's like, how are you going? going to instill that same work ethic that you have and give that to your children.

Starting point is 00:12:46 That's tough, Joe. I'm asking for a friend. Yeah. So you know what? It's funny. I thought some of my sons would do a little bit differently. You know, like I was worried about one child, maybe not progressing in school as much as the others. But that one son, now he's like progressed a whole lot.

Starting point is 00:13:06 And the other one, he's brilliant. He's a brilliant kid. But, you know, he's taken a step. back you know like in something so I'm like you know what I don't I don't really know but what we do is we try to push them as much as we possibly can like giving a hundred percent and everything that we do and that's one of the things that we do is like we give them chores we give them responsibilities but kids are kids and they're you know obviously they don't necessarily want to do as much as

Starting point is 00:13:28 we would like for them to do sometimes but we do it's like if you're gonna do something do it a hundred percent otherwise it's not worth doing and I think that's that's part of it's like you have to show up each and every day you've got to be there for your team whatever it is you've got to got to be the best team member. And so we have a lot of our kids that play sports. And, you know, sometimes, though, it's like they can do really well. They can push really hard.

Starting point is 00:13:51 But sometimes when you see them, like, how they act on the field, that's like, okay, they pick up a kid. You know, they cheer their team members on. That's like, that gives you the most pride. It's like that type of stuff. But we do. We push the kids to give everything they've got. And, you know, we'll see.

Starting point is 00:14:10 it's hard to it's hard to say right now yeah no it is and i know it's a tough question and it's something that you know i want and we all want it as parents for our kids just to maintain that same level of grit and that same mindset because we talked about this before you and i uh not on a podcast about like you know we we grew up poor right so there was like no choice or is there a feast or is there famine you know like so i i chose to feast so i had to grind for it Our kids don't have to grind that hard. Yeah. Because I remember at like the age of 12, like, of course, when I was younger, like, in

Starting point is 00:14:48 elementary school, I was selling stuff. I was, like, selling little devies out of my lunch. I was making bracelets. And at that, you know, like, I had an entrepreneurial spirit at the time. And then I had jobs, like in the neighborhoods. Like, I would go across our town to do hedges, and I would, like, cutting hedges and doing landscaping and things. And then in the neighborhood, I was cutting grass and stuff at a very young age.

Starting point is 00:15:10 And, you know, it gave me, like, I enjoyed it. Like, I like pushing myself. It created that entrepreneur a spirit. My wife makes fun of me because I always say, oh, that was one of my first jobs. It was like Chuck of Cheese. And then I was like an ice cream scooper at Thrifty's. And it was like some, I had like four jobs by the time I was 15, fired from all of them. Fired from them?

Starting point is 00:15:30 Yeah, you know, thrifties. I was Chuckie at, you know, I was a traveling, like, Power Ranger, you know, type guy that would show up to birthday parties. That makes sense. I got that through my theater class. No, I didn't get fired from that one. I think I got fired from thrifties, though. Yeah. I think I was giving away ice cream.

Starting point is 00:15:50 But you have a good heart. Yeah. I was like, you know how to give away ice cream? I'm like, oh, he's a nice guy, didn't have any money. I was 15. I think I was 14 and I had that job. Your parents would be proud of you for giving away ice cream. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Starting point is 00:16:04 They weren't proud that it lost my job. It's $4.25 a now. hour, you know. Yeah, isn't that crazy hell those wages? When I first started, my first job was a laundry. Like, we folded laundry. It's like $3.55 an hour. Yeah, I know. It's like, I don't think I can get the kids do anything for that. No. It's like it takes a 20 for them to rub your feet. Yeah, my wife, she'll be like, will you scratch my head, do my hair, you know, like, rub my feet, and literally you'd have to give them a 20 to make them do it. Actually, my daughter, She'll do it for free, but the other ones, yeah.

Starting point is 00:16:41 I bless the girls. Yeah, they're so much nice than boys. They are. 200 bucks. Yeah, they're working deals. Daughter will do it. She's just so sweet. Yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 00:16:54 So you've managed to really like navigate really tumultuous and tough times, a lot of adversity. What do you think has been the source or the mindset you've had to have to overcome these tough times, the last couple years? I think just, like, we stay really positive. My wife and I, like, we just stay really positive. And it's like, really, if you're positive,

Starting point is 00:17:21 you can accomplish so much. And we're, like, too small to really fail. Like, I think it's just been having a positive attitude. And, you know, like, seeing stuff like what we went through growing up, we can do this. Like, it's not an issue. And actually, through the harder times, like the last housing crisis, That's when we did the best.

Starting point is 00:17:41 And like this last couple years, we've done the best. And it's just like... You've been growing in the last couple years. Just pushing yourself like, okay, let's not stay complacent. Let's evolve. Let's get better. And I think really we do, like you hear it so much, but we do embrace the challenge. It's like, I want to do more. I want, like, we're going to do this.

Starting point is 00:17:58 We're going to make it through this. We're going to thrive through the downturn. And that's exactly what we've done. And it was even the last time, like, through 2008, 2009, through 12, is like, It's like, okay, we did really well. And so many people, they didn't do well, but it was just because we were positive. And we're like, this is something that we can do.

Starting point is 00:18:19 Let's reinvent ourselves in a way. Like, we're going to create new techniques. Let's just create a drive that no one else can match and show up each and every day. Like, there was times, like, unfortunately, I don't remember my daughter as a baby. That's the sad part about it because we were working so much. And it was like, we would give us.

Starting point is 00:18:38 up at 6 o'clock in the morning, go to bed at 2 o'clock at night. And it was like that for like two years. So just working hard. Yeah. You know, one thing I know you have some great talent here visiting with you. How are you fostering talent at Lendingham? How do you continue to foster talent there? Yeah, you know, with talent, you can show them the way and you can continue to lift them up and you hope that they would follow like some of the things that like you do that I do. And when they do, it makes you really proud and like obviously committing them on that success as well. Now, the mortgage landscape has changed significantly over the last couple of years. What do you foresee on the horizon? Because you're on a different, you do business totally different than most mortgage companies.

Starting point is 00:19:34 You know, you've been purchased driven the entire time. You've never been refi-centric, like 99.9% of loan officers. And then obviously when people had to transition from like a refy mortgage company to a purchase mortgage company, they kind of, you know, now you had competition, which you didn't even have competition. But what do you foresee on the horizon in the next year in the mortgage landscape currently? I think this business is going to continue to be a relationship business. That's the one thing because when you look at mortgages,

Starting point is 00:20:04 it's still in the top three of the most stressful things that someone's going to deal with, because most people, you know, it's a huge investment. Like someone, you know, like their spouse dying, that's the most stressful thing. You know, a divorce is the second, and then purchasing a home is the third most stressful thing. So I think that there's going to be some really good automations that will continue to take place. It'll continue to evolve the mortgage business. And I think that we're going to become more and more efficient. But AI is definitely going to have a huge part.

Starting point is 00:20:34 in making our jobs probably a little bit easier, but it'll also take away some jobs at the same time. But I think ultimately, if we're going to continue to operate in the purchase business in that segment, yes, we're going to continue to gather those leads a little bit easier with some of the AI and some of those things. But I don't think there's really going to have to be, there's not going to be a whole lot of change in the relationship side of things because people are people, and this is a people business. You've done a great job fostering those relationships. relationships with people. Yeah. Now, given all your success over the last, you know, a couple decades, how do you, even though you don't need to now, but how do you continue to wake up every single

Starting point is 00:21:17 morning with that same motivation? You know what? I live in a state of gratitude. It's always, man, I'm thankful to be here. I'm thankful to be able to see. I'm thankful to be able to walk and run and all these things to taste food. And it's like, I think if you just stay in a state, state of gratitude, it makes things and life a lot easier. It really does. And that's just where I try to stay. It's like, okay, you know what? I'm kind of tired this morning, but let's push it. Let's get it. Let's push it up a notch. It's one of the things I love about you, Kevin, it's like, you've always been one of the most sincere, kind guys, like kind, humble spirit. It's always just got a smile on his face. You know, it's like, nothing's going to like let you down. No market adversity,

Starting point is 00:22:01 no drama, no gossip, nothing like phases you. And that's the reason I think we can attribute direct correlation to your success. Yeah, I think, yeah, staying positive, that's huge and just keeping a smile on your face. I wish people could all just embrace that. We just replay this. We're going to replay this back for everybody to hear that. Now, right now, like, do you think that Lending Hand is to do you think that lending hand is taking a lot of risks, big risk, or are you guys staying risk adverse? I think we're kind of staying

Starting point is 00:22:36 in the middle a little bit. Yes, we're exposing ourselves a little bit more, but I think it's all like the risks that are not too risky. We can continue to grow. Like, there's a lot more room for us to grow. And that's what I'm excited about. Like, we're putting ourselves in a really good position that if someone will just, like, I'm stepping out of the business just a little bit more, like not on the origination side of things. Like, I still originate as well, but we've built a really good team out. But we're doing things that I think in our business that other companies aren't doing. And while others are taking notice of it, I don't think it's as easy sometimes just to replicate

Starting point is 00:23:18 because it does take so much personal time. Yeah. Like it's scalable. Yes, it's scalable. But you still have to have the people that are willing to do it. You know, like if they're not willing to have these conversations and have the heart, to do, have the conversation that we're having and helping the way that we help. You can scale it in a way, but you can't, you know, it's difficult still to do,

Starting point is 00:23:39 complete our process. So, I don't know, I think the risk though, we could definitely step it up a little bit and I'm excited to see what the next couple years lead, you know, hold for us. And do you think like, so are you going to always stay relationship purchase driven? Are you going to add any more variations of verticals, you know, refi, heat locks, investment properties, DSCR, you just honed in and just dominating purchases. And that's great. That's worked well for you. I just want to know if you're planning to expand in other verticals. And that's part of it is expanding in other sections. While we do love the relationship side

Starting point is 00:24:17 of things, we still want, that's the aspect that we want to continue to grow in. Like, I have friends that, you know, we all know them. They only do refinance business, and they would love to get into purchase business. They just don't know how. They just don't know how. And I'm on the other side. I think I could probably get into the refinance business, but I don't know how, per se.

Starting point is 00:24:39 I can get into it. Refis are just so much easier to get into because it's just a data buy. Yeah, absolutely. All the systems to kind of foster that. Your loan officers who are so used to shaking hands would have to pivot to phone sales, and that's a totally different play as well. Yeah, no, that's absolutely true.

Starting point is 00:24:59 but right now we've stepped into the investment side of things we've stepped into the DSCR we just don't advertise it as much as we should we've really stepped up our advertising here and actually we're beginning to hire more advertising and more marketing than we are sales support and obviously now that you have the marketing then you've got to obviously hire more of the sales support so that's kind of in the phase that we're in because we've built out the marketing so much now we're in trouble because we have so much business coming in the door it's like okay we've got to continue to address this concern in it. But I also have my standards of who we hire is also pretty high. And we just, we want to make sure that we vet the right people because sometimes

Starting point is 00:25:41 you get the wrong person and they're a little more difficult to get out of, you know, kick him out the door. When you say standards being high, like let's talk about that. Like, what kind of standards are you setting for your employees that you're hiring? I think it's just the expectations. My expectations are pretty high. Like I want things done a certain way. You know, like I want communication back in 15 minutes. I want emails back in, you know, like 30 minutes. I want these certain things done in a particular way.

Starting point is 00:26:10 And I think so right now when we hire people, I let people know those prospects. This is the way that what we expect is something that you think that you could handle. And so I think we're doing a better job, setting the right expectations when we hire, because I do expect a little bit. more. I think, you know, and it's like, well, why are you, why do you do? I was like, well, if we didn't, maybe we wouldn't be as successful as we, as we are because we have high

Starting point is 00:26:39 standards. Love that. Now, what do you think, what do you think is the future for lending hand? More states, more loan officers, more products. Yeah, we've, we've been in slow, so I don't, we've been open since 2005. And we've definitely, grown but we haven't grown we've grown comfortably and every time I come to like a masterminds every time I go to UWM it's like and we could do so much more we have an amazing product we have amazing people we've got amazing service all we got to do now that we've scaled to where we are all we got to do is add people and so you know Cassie and I we've talked it's it's time so we're going to continue to grow in additional states

Starting point is 00:27:28 and then really pull in a lot more retail originators to the team, just because I think we've got a really good thing, and we're ready. Yeah, I mean, listen, growing the number one brokerage in the whole state of Tennessee, that was no easy task. Yeah. That definitely took tons of work and an incredible mentality and mindset. What kind of mindset do you think a loan officer has to have right now or any entrepreneur has to have right now to be successful in this environment?

Starting point is 00:27:55 I think you really do have to stay positive, but you have to have short-term memory. Like you have to forget about what happened yesterday. You have to forget about that last call, whether it was successful or not successful. I think sometimes, you know, we get caught up on the day before that we had success, and then we don't push ourselves the next day to be as successful, where we need to be more successful the next day versus the day before. And I think that's where a lot of entrepreneurs and originators get caught up. It was like, man, I had a great month last month.

Starting point is 00:28:26 And then the next month sucks because they got so caught up on the month before that they can't focus on what they've got to do. It's like, man, we had a great month last month, but it's going to be an even better month the next month. And she's like, forget about that success. Yes, celebrate it, but move past it because you've got the next month, the next year, the next two years, the next five years to really continue to drive your business forward. Originators, do you hear that?

Starting point is 00:28:51 short-term memory loss. You need that, because that's going to save your butt. You know, we just had a dip in CPI. Rates dropped. I'm going to have a good month. Next month, race went up. Like, you totally meant to forget the fact that the rates just drop, just keep grinding, keep your head grinding.

Starting point is 00:29:06 You know, because that's one of the biggest problems with originators, and I wish we would preach that very, very early on, and I actually haven't used that phrase, like, just have short-term memory loss. Like, you're going to have a good month celebrated for that second, but forget about the next day. Yeah. Because it goes so fast. And we saw so many originators leave the space since 2021.

Starting point is 00:29:25 I mean, we've probably lost half the originators at least. Absolutely. Since the rates tripled, more than half, maybe 60%, 60%. Yeah, I saw a number. I think last year there was only 134,000 originators that originated at least eight loans. For the year. For the year. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:29:43 That's crazy. Yeah. Yeah, we had like. That's not even livable income. No. It's not. It's not livable incomes. That means you're doing one.

Starting point is 00:29:50 every other month, which is very unfortunate. Yeah, and you know, like, you guys probably talk about it too, but it was easy. 20, 21, even the very beginning part of 22 was still easy, but they, you know, some people just can't push past adversity. And they're like, you know what? I just, I'm going to wait for the market to change. It's going to get better at some point in time, right? Like, no, you can go to the, I tell our team all the time, it's like, go to the market.

Starting point is 00:30:19 you can create whatever business that you want. You don't have to wait for the market to come to you. Go to the market. And I think that's where you see a lot of success is, man, you can make whatever you want out of it. You can go after more market share. You can go after more agents. You can do more presentations.

Starting point is 00:30:35 You can do all of these things. You can generate your own business. It's just what do you want to put into it? Exactly. Now, if you had a piece of advice that you can tell your younger self, what would that be? I think it would don't run yourself too thin. like stay focused on one thing and then if you stay focused on that one thing then move on

Starting point is 00:31:00 it's like don't start too many things at one time and then this ADD society that message needs to be told and heard we all have ADD right a little bit yeah no I definitely do yeah supposedly I'm diagnosed with it but it's like only three three questions they ask you like do you do too many things at once yes I do like do the more time focusing yeah yeah I do you're a EADC Yeah, I must be ADHD, too. It's not even a real thing. There's no medical diagnosis for it. It's like those three questions that I, you know, that's it.

Starting point is 00:31:34 Seriously? Yeah, that's it. If you say yes, it's like 10 questions, but if you say yes to three of them, you're ADHD. You don't get past the other ones. Yeah. Like, you're definitely ADHD. Like, I got a severe ADHD then. So a couple closing questions that I like to end with.

Starting point is 00:31:52 The first one is a three-prong question. Now, what is a personal goal that you have for yourself? What is a family goal that you have for the family? And what's a goal that you have for Lending Hand? So, personal goal is a closer... Is what? I'm trying to get it out. Closer walk with God.

Starting point is 00:32:16 Yeah. That would be the first one. It's okay, bro. Yeah. Family? Business. Family? Family?

Starting point is 00:32:29 Yeah. I just want to spend more time with the family. Yeah. Yeah, no, just, like, I've got a 15-year-old now, and it's like he's now starting to drive. It's like, man, I don't have much time. Yeah. What can you do right now to, like, you know, spend more time?

Starting point is 00:32:54 Because, man, that clock is moving quick now. It moves fast. It's like, yeah, I remember when he was born, it was, like, still remember to this day. So Cassie, she was actually 20 weeks pregnant. We didn't know. and they're like, what can we do to get pregnant? So she went in, she was going to maybe seek fertility.

Starting point is 00:33:18 And they're like, let's do a pregnancy test. So they did a pregnancy test. Like, you need to go get an ultrasound. She came back to the office to get me. Like, I got a soft heart. And she's like, we need to go to do an ultrasound. I'm pregnant. it's like, okay, that's awesome.

Starting point is 00:33:39 I start crying. We go get the ultrasound. I think, oh, it's going to be like this little rice kernel, but it's this huge baby in her belly, and she's 21 weeks pregnant. So to this day, it's like, man, you just see time. It just like passes by. So right now we're just trying to slow it down.

Starting point is 00:33:59 Like, how can we continue to grow the business, but also take a step back at the same time? Let's spend more quality time with that. the kids. And we do. Like, I spend as much time with the kids as I possibly can, you know, getting off work to see their games. Like, they all play baseball. They all play softball. They wrestle. Like, all these different things that they do. So we want to make sure, like, I'm always there for that. But, you know, it's just I want to spend more time with the family. You know, do those things like we took the kids to Disney. And then we went camping. That summer they had to

Starting point is 00:34:36 right about what they did. It wasn't about Disney. It was about camping. It's just spending quality time together. That's it. Yeah, they don't care about the money. No, they don't care about the fancy trip to Disney. They just needed a tent and dad. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. So, yeah, so, and then a goal for lending hand mortgage, it would be just to continue to grow. Like, I want, I want everyone in Tennessee. I want everyone to know about lending hand mortgage. Because we do, we offer so many great things. We offer great stuff to our, to our agent partners. as well. And I think that we're a true partner. But I want to continue to grow. I would, I don't necessarily, I don't want your success, Joe, with what you've created.

Starting point is 00:35:18 It's all relative. But no, I want to continue to grow. I want, I just want to continue to help people. I want our team to continue to help people and create an experience that isn't like other experiences. Like you don't, this process does not have to be stressful. And that's what we want to continue to create and just give families that opportunity that maybe they're not given with another company. And one last question. When you're in front of the pearly gates, what do you think God's going to tell you? I think he's going to say I could have help more people.

Starting point is 00:35:58 Like I should have been like mission work and I should have done more for his people. You're doing it. I am. I'm doing it. All we can do is keep trying. Yeah. All we can do is keep trying. Kevin, it's been a pleasure to have you, my brother.

Starting point is 00:36:17 It's been fun. Yeah, this is awesome. Kevin Henderson, Lenny hand mortgage, check him out. God bless you and the family. I'll get all your goals. Thank you, Joe.

Coffeez with Joe Shalaby - Lending a Hand ft. Kevin Kenerson | Coffeez for Closers with Joe Shalaby Ep. 36

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