Coffeez with Joe Shalaby - Lending Strategies with Ease ft. Dawar Alimi | Coffeez for Closers with Joe Shalaby Ep. 43

Episode Date: October 4, 2024

Dawar Alimi is a visionary in the fintech space, reshaping the mortgage industry with cutting-edge technology and innovation. As the driving force behind Lender Price, he has developed one of the most advanced and scalable mortgage pricing engines in the market today. His platform has become a game-changer for lenders, bringing unprecedented efficiency, transparency, and accuracy to the mortgage pricing process.With a background in both technology and entrepreneurship, Dawar has always been passionate about using innovation to solve complex problems. His expertise and forward-thinking approach have earned him the trust of some of the largest lenders in the country, helping them streamline operations and make smarter pricing decisions.Dawar’s relentless drive to improve the lending experience has positioned him as a true leader in the fintech space, and his work continues to inspire others to think bigger and push boundaries in their respective industries.For More Check Out our Playlist: https://music.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLgPwyhl8CkXiM0cBtuY8A_6JS60FueLz3&si=0_2dnoPkYV6jcSGw Check Us Out on all Platforms!Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/coffeez-for-closers-with-joe-shalaby/id1726674707Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2KkQWRqHSHcCK3TVfsRKUK?si=hjTnUOjFS5eTDxBjgf4RwQ&preview=noneAmazon: https://www.amazon.com/Coffeez-Closers-Joe-Shalaby/dp/B0CRYLQRW6 Coffeez and Closers Socials & WebsiteWebsite: https://coffeezforclosers.com/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/coffeezforclosers/TikTok: https://www.youtube.com/redirect?event=video_description&redir_token=QUFFLUhqbnU0T3RrLXdPbC1BR2NLc2lWcExqWklQaHlQUXxBQ3Jtc0tudi1GV2Zod3hRYzRhTkhONFBuMlptblNGSlJ1QzhpV0tzbHh5YThNR0R3Y2RnNnU5NV9ER3E5ZUhxMjdUUWp1UWo4MVl6Q2szeXo1cFh1OHNkYkxDR1F0MXZtMTZ6QnZoakdzSnJpVl9PcWZBOU9zZw&q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40coffeezforclosers&v=uXvk6LY9lS8Facebook: https://www.youtube.com/redirect?event=video_description&redir_token=QUFFLUhqa2pLZ2pMaUxmSTh4dy1qazMtdlBjX2pVN1AxQXxBQ3Jtc0tua2RUTUNsRmJob0RKWlVqeDhNaUN4US1rdlRvUG9Fdm5SNk1jU1pQNzNLQnVmUmtGMGtMYUViZ2pLMXJkOVJUci1kMk9DN2poTThVV2NFd0tISWdDMzNwOEZ2c3pVb09lbEhjemJHblRsS1RKdHZqbw&q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fpeople%2FCoffeez-for-Closers-with-Joe-Shalaby%2F61556355642488%2F&v=uXvk6LY9lS8 Joe Shalaby SocialsInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/josephshalaby/TikTok: https://www.youtube.com/redirect?event=video_description&redir_token=QUFFLUhqa3p6VlRzR1BWMkJQM1ZIaUdVZHhYVTYyak43QXxBQ3Jtc0tuUXVBOE1oZUJYTmZIZnNENUgxQkhjamk4RXJHb09MWU9OczJhLWpnX0JwN2pENzRhaV9NajJROW5nek1tQ1VvVE40ZFJuUUI2cnI0ajNKLXE4d1VMUUpkTGFHR0tGY0o5NUhnWnZnaXJoZXdEM0piaw&q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40josephshalaby&v=uXvk6LY9lS8Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/josephshalaby E Mortgage Capital Socials & WebsiteInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/emortgagecapital/Website: https://www.emortgagecapital.com/Twitter: https://twitter.com/Emortgagecap #1 Mortgage Company on Social on 🌎#1 Non Delegated Lender in the Country🌟#1 Broker in CANMLS #1416824"Mortgages Are What We Do Not Who We Are"™https://finance.yahoo.com/news/learn-why-e-mortgage-capital-192000740.htmlAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

What's up, everybody. Welcome to a very special episode of coffees for closers. Today, we're excited to spotlight DeWara Leamy, the visionary CEO and co-founder of Lender Price. With over two decades in the mortgage industry, DeWar has become a reverend figure in the financial tech sector. Under his leadership, Lender Price has surged over 300% in growth since 2015. impressively increasing sales revenue in the last 12 months despite industry downturns. This success caught the private equity sector's eye, enabling further innovation. Lender Price now leads in the mortgage space, serving 22 of the top 30 wholesale lenders, and managing about $30 billion in loans through its platform.

Join us as we delve into DeWar's journey and the innovative strides lender prices making in the mortgage space. welcome, DeWar Alimi. Thank you, DeWar, for coming in today. Thank you for having me. Man, I'm so stoked. I've been trying to get you on this show for probably over a month and a half now. So I'm pumped that you're here. And more importantly, I'm really excited about all the massive strides that lender price has made in the last year.

Like, you're just notifying me now, and I'm very proud of you for this. Like, ready price is out of business. Like, they were trying to gain market share. Like, you put them out of the game. Well, I don't, I mean, it's good for us. I don't like any vendor to go out of, you know, go out of business. But, you know, what I tell everyone at our company is, rather than focusing on competitors, just focus on what you do best and what we do best. Because the only thing that we can control is what we do, not what others do. I love it. I love it. Now, the way I like to start the podcast is like, you know, I like to humanize you a little bit because everybody's like, oh, who's this big CEO that they're bringing in? here. And, you know, so we're going to dive right into it. So when you wake up every morning, like, what's your morning routine consist of? Yeah, so it's interesting. So I actually wake up at 4 o'clock. So my internal clock is 4 a.m. I love it. Mine too. And then immediately go out.

I've got a very cheap coffee machine that just makes coffee. Not a juror. It's like a curing or just a regular old school coffee machine. A coffee maker and I put the McDonald's coffee, right? Because, you know, before that, I used to go to McDonald's every day or, let's say, you know, even Starbucks. And then I looked at my bill. I was like, oh, my God, I'm spending a lot of money. And then I looked at Amazon. I was like, hey, I could get like the McDonald coffee at my house. That's perfect.

So that's what I do is I have my McDonald coffee. I get on my computer, look at emails. Sometimes, you know, we use Gmail. I actually send out emails the night before and I actually schedule it. But real quick, all I like. do is just look at emails and then I go work out. I do, um, uh, I do hit training. Uh, that's my thing. Um, I'm not a gym guy. So what time do you do your hit training? Uh, usually around six o'clock, six a.m. I went today. What, which one do you go to? F-45. Nice. Nike just opened

their vertical of that. I think they're going to take all the market share. Just like lender price is doing everybody else. Nike's going to put out F-45. They just launched it. I'm on, I'm at their pilot gym. They opened it in Santa, Santa, Santa Monica. Newport in Miami. So who's F-45 spokesman? Mark Wahlberg. So Mark Mulberg must be pissed, right? Yeah, he's going to be pissed. But I mean, like, I mean, for a while, I mean, I weighed like close to 200 pounds. Today I'm at 159 and I contribute that to obviously just eating right and intermittent fasting, obviously, right? We talked about that, so fasting and just exercising. For me, it's a, you know, it's a way for me to

you know, have the energy that I need in the morning to get to work. Yeah. It gets me through the day. But it's also, it allows me to focus better. As a kid and my son, you know, my son has ADD and I had ADD. I have ADD too. Do you? Yeah.

We love it. You know, and it kind of gets me to like focus better when I get to work. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's something, it puts me in the zone too. I have to do it. I do it seven days a week right now. It's like an addiction.

You? Okay. What, the hit training? Yeah, hit training. Yeah, I mean, I started off before doing a lot more, but I've paired it down to like 40 or 5 days. And I really like doing the weight training part only because I'm going to be 50 years old this year. Nice.

You look great, 50 years old. What are we doing? Just what I said. You know, and I think the reason why I did it is because when my kids were younger, they wanted to, you know, they started playing sports, and I just couldn't keep up with them. Yeah. And I said, I've got to do something about this. Plus, I've got, you know, history of heart problems.

My mother just had triple bypass surgery, and I was like, how can I reverse all the stuff? And I, and, you know, at the end of the day, it's just doing what you're supposed to be doing, which is eating right and exercising and just try to get your body to a point where it's healthy. I love it. I love it. So that's, you know, I notice that trend in leaders is they, they, always got to take care of the human temple, right? Yeah, I mean, it's like if you're not healthy, you don't have the energy and you don't

have the mental capacity to actually make tough decisions. Yeah, I love it. Great advice. So I'm going to dive into how you got started in the mortgage space. And then we'll talk about how you got started in the fintech mortgage space. Okay. Okay, so when did you start in the mortgage space? And we could dive into like our little history, too.

I've got undergrad and graduate degree in computer science. but as an undergrad, I went to Cal State San Marcos, and when I graduated from Cal State with an undergrad degree on the day of graduation, so I was student body president. On the day of graduation, my parents were there, and I was in the science section. And being Middle Eastern, right, there's two things that your parents want you. Yeah, that's it.

Either a doctor or an engineer. That's an engineer. That's two things. Right. And then so... We don't have a choice. Yeah. So then that day, I, you know, I said, you know, so my mother's like, you know, my,

you know, my answer there like, oh, my son, he's going to be a doctor and this and this and that. And, you know, with her accent. And I was like, well, mom, it's computers. And she said, what? What is the computer? What did you do? I wasted my time. I came to this country and I did all this for you.

And you just, you know, you just threw your life away, right? Now she's proud, by the way. But that's how I started. And then I ended up moving back with a bunch of guys in Pasadena. We rented a place. And they were all in the mortgage industry. And I thought back then I was an engineer working at GTE. Now it's called Verizon.

So that kind of dates me back, right? And I started, you know, all my roommates were in the mortgage industry and they started bringing all these big checks, right? And then they were like, hey, look what I got and this and that. out all this. And then I just had, you know, a job, had, you know, everything was fine. I had health care. The traditional things to do, right? And then so, you know, then I remember my friend Mike and my friend Omar and Danny and they were looking at things, you know, I was looking at their paychecks. And I was like, that's not what you're making. That's someone's like, you know,

down payment and this and that and like, no, this is what I'm making. And because I've always had an entrepreneur spirit and heart, I decided to leave my nine to five job, just getting a salary, and ended up working for a broker and doing IT stuff. And I did that for a while. And then I learned the business. And then again, Middle Eastern opening up your own business. And I ended up a brokerage first. And then grew that into a wholesale mortgage company. Then I opened up an escrow company. What was the mortgage company that you started? Cornerstone lending. Cornerstone. Just a quick side note, guys, if you don't know, one of my, I think it was my first mortgage company job. I was just a runt in his office working at one of

his branches. He didn't even know me. Well, last time, like, you know, like we had a mutual friend called Emile, right? He goes, hey, so Emil's doing fantastic. He's got this company called EMC. I'm like, really, I was like, who's Emil? He goes, dude, do you remember Sleepy Joe? You're not sleepy. Yeah, I know. You've got more energy than anyone No. I didn't even know how I got that, man. That's crazy. That's awesome who you were. I don't know that. That's so funny. So that's how you entered the business, out of the mortgage business. And when did you enter the fintech business? So you started your own mortgage company. And then when did you transition to starting a fintech company? So after I, you know, in 2008, you know, right before the mortgage debacle, you know, I had a wholesale mortgage company servicing brokers. And, you know, just like with every,

everyone that crashed at that time, I crashed with them, right? Because, you know, credit market froze. You couldn't do anything. Your warehouse lenders didn't, you know, you lost all warehouse capacity. You couldn't lend, right? Yeah. So then, so then I couldn't really pushed the wholesale mortgage company. And because I had an engineering background, my wife worked at Bank of America. And Bank of America at the time was having problems with short sales and loan modifications. The banks at the time didn't have a way to actually handle loan modifications and short sales. And they didn't have an application. CoreLogic had something. And then at Bank of America, they were running everything through these things called stored procedures, SQL stored procedures.

So I got brought in as a consultant. So my wife was at dinner with a team of executives there, and they said that we have a problem. And then my wife's like, hey, my husband is an engineer and he knows mortgages, so maybe he might be able to help. Sure enough, I worked for them as a consultant, ended up running one of their groups that handled loan modifications in shorttails. Did that for a while. The entrepreneur in me came back and I said, I can't do this. And then sure enough, we were actually dealing with a lot of the Treasury supplemental directives that the Treasury was, you know, the bank was dealing with it and getting fined. And, you know, thousands of loan modifications was down to, you know, a lot lesser number.

And I felt like the problem was fixed, right? And then I got recruited with a company called CCG. It's a tax credit company. It was one of the tax credit companies at the time, and I became CTO at that company. And there was their, you know, I got introduced to, so they had two different, they had apparel app that competed against, that competed against paychecks and ADP, and they also had a tax credit side. And again, on the tax credit side, what really attracted me to that business was, you know,

the CEO said, this is how we deal with tax credits. So they have these enterprise zone tax credits. And what we do is we go with all the Fortune 100 companies, and we say, look, you know, if we can save you X amount of money and tax credits. So basically you get a tax credit if you hire a former felon. You get a tax credit if you hire someone over the age of, I believe, 50. So the state of California, just like any other states, they have these tax credits and they would give you incentives. So all they would do is just itemize that. They had an electronic signature way of actually doing it

because our software was connected inside, what was it called? It was an ADPA. It was Toledo, right? And so anytime someone would, these, you know, let's say foster farms would hire people, it would tally up all the tax credit. and then you would go back to a company, let's say EMC, and you go, hey, you've got $150,000 in tax credit

that you can use to reduce your, you know, to use your corporate taxes. But if you use it, you have to give us 30% of whatever you used. It sounds like an ERC business now. That's what they brought, they brought the business back like that, ERC credit. Oh, they did? Okay. Yeah. So I did that for a while.

And then I met my partner, Lee Koo, there. And the other thing that attracted me is the architecture and how well the code was written. And Liku was the chief engineer there and met with him. Interesting part with that is that I combined both technology groups into one, and I let go a bunch of Lee Koo's family members that were working there. But we're still partners today. So he's our CTO.

So, you know, he forgave me. And then we started Lender Price. That's awesome. So you started lender price. What year was that? 2015, 2016. Really, we incorporated in 2015. We really started in 2016. Yeah, right around when we started incorporated e-mortgage capital. And then you didn't gain, like, when did you attract the eye of like Kevin Costner and Glenn Stearns? Like, how did you get such big names to invest in your company? Yeah. So, you know, actually, I created an LOS back in 2002 and failed at that.

And then how did Kevin Kossner even know about the mortgage industry? Well, well, so he didn't at the time. But the way that I got introduced to him was that when, so when I quit CCG, Liku quit at the same time. I was like, what are you doing? And he goes, we're going to start this together. And we also started with a good friend, German Centeno. And he started, but then he left and he came back.

And when we started it, we just started writing the code because I actually got a pass for my wife. So I said, Laura, I was like, I'm going to do something that I have a passion for. I want to build software. That's what I went to school for, and this is what I love. And she said, okay, you know, and, you know, raising two kids, she's salaried and I had no income. It was tough. And we started building the software. And as we're building the software, we knew that we had something. And then we got introduced to Rod Lake, who's Kevin Kossner's partner. He came in and he said, hey, I love the solution. He goes, I want to invest.

And Kevin and Rod just wrote checks because that's what Hollywood people do. And so then I go, what do I do? And I contacted the top startup attorney in Pasadena, Albert Lee. And he said, you can't accept these checks. There's a process. That's the way it's done in Hollywood. You can't do this. So then I was like, okay.

And then my brother-in-law started a company called Quantified, who they compete against Palantir today. They got investments from Andresen and Red Point. And he said, let me connect you with VCs. And then we got connected to various VCs. We got other term sheets there. And then we ultimately went with Rod and Kevin as our first angel investors. Then Kevin said, hey, I've got this guy that he went on a hunting, hunting. trip with. He goes, he's this guy, Glenn Stearns, and he owns a mortgage company, and I don't know

if you know him, but, you know, he might be a good, another person that we may want to get invested in the company. So Kevin Costner introduced you to Glenn Stearns? Kevin Kozner introduced me to Kevin Kossner. Isn't that so funny? It's like, he's not even in the mortgage industry, and he introduces you to Glenn. But Glenn goes dove hunting in, like, Europe all the time, and he always goes with, like, different mega celebrities. He both love hunting, yeah. And then so then, so then we had a meeting at the Sunset Marquis and then Glenn was there and Glenn was like, you know, we were pitching him the software and he goes, I love this. And then he's shortly he invested after that. His wife's coming on the show next week and then he's coming on the show in a couple weeks.

So I think that in this situation, because we got lucky because I don't think that we're in the right time. From a timing perspective, it was great, right? But just like, you know, business, there's there's the vision and the passion of you actually doing something that you love. And then there's the, there's the lock, right, of who you meet. That was pretty lucky. Yeah. And everything just kind of the stars aligned for you to really kick lender price off. Yeah. So, yeah. And then you started really like, attract the big name mortgage companies. Like, I was introduced to you a couple years ago, maybe, you know, the next guy's and all the big mortgage companies. And you still don't know all of them. I still got to introduce you a few of them.

Yeah. You do. Yeah. And I got you just for coming on the show. Okay. But now you're really like gaining steam. And now with Ready Price out of the space, we're working on Loan Sifter next. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. Well, I've been gunning for them for a while. Yeah, yeah. We got, you know, the software really improved and enhanced. It's UI. So that's going to be a big help. Yep. And then obviously, you know, how did you get the agreement with UWM?

I mean, I could have really helped you with that, but. Well, I mean, UWM has been, they've been in a solution. You know, we're hoping to, you know, work out something with them soon. So I think by the time this air is, hopefully that that comes into fruition. But I think for us on the wholesale space, it was mainly working with the wholesale lenders and offering them a option outside of Loansifter, because Loan Sifter is very, very expensive for the wholesale lenders. Very expensive.

So we come at a fraction at a cost. And then for us, it was like increasing the user base. That was really important. So we increased the user base and, you know, gaining trust. And still till today, we have clients, we have still brokers, as you know, users that use Loansifter and users that use our solution. and we're always trying to find innovative ways to try to get some of those loan zifters away, you know, and some of them just, you know, you can't because it's just muscle memory and we

they love their UI, yeah. And we've come out with 2.1 to tackle that. Yeah. But it's constantly like- Your new UOI is superior to their existing UI. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, our UI is. And then I think that what's important is listening, especially in software, and I think in any business, right, you've got to listen to.

your customers. Yeah. Constantly be listening. I think that's a superpower that you have, you know, because you're in the weeds with us, you know, like, I tell you, Duar, I just walked you up to my recruiter, like, what don't you like about? Yeah. You know, like, I just like, that's the kind of partner we need.

Yeah. You know, someone who's in the weeds, like helping us get better, innovating with us, like, and I tell my people all the time, like, I'm not going to work with a CEO that doesn't play ball. Well, also, because you don't know what you don't know, right? It's like, you know, especially in software, like, you think that you're building something right. And then you find out that what you build is not what people like. You know, there's a great book in software. It says, don't make me think. The easiest software, the best software

are the ones that you don't have to use a lot, that you could go in and out. Yeah. So we're constantly, you know, obsessed about how can we make things easier? How can we make things more efficient? Because if we can think, it make things more easier and efficient, it'll drive R-O-Y for you. Yeah, I love that. And I love that you think like that because the experience that people have with Loan Sifter is nothing close to that. And Loan Sifter is not always innovating. It's not, they're not coming up with creative solutions with the brokers. There is no tech team or support team or any team that really help us get better or improve our, the way we're quoting or, you know, I love it with you.

I'm like, Dora, let's build this API. Let's figure this. Let's tag it to this, you know, like. go. Yeah. Well, you'll make it happen. So that's the kind of mindset that we need to grow. You know, these, the problem with the mortgage industry that we see as a whole, like whether it was Calix point, whether it's loan sift or whether it's optimal blue or encompass or these big companies that don't, they've, they're maintaining the status quo with their technology. And we do that not just for the brokers too, but we also do that for the lenders. So as you know, like the space right now, you know,

conventional financing is tough. You've got a lot of people that have refinanced. And during the sugar high, I call it the sugar high in 2020, you know, like that time where you could find anyone to refinance. Now you're looking for innovative products. And a good example of that is our relationship with Deep Haven, because when we started dealing with Deep Haven, deep Haven is a pricing engine client.

They're an enterprise client. They helped us understand how to, to build user interfaces and functionality that's needed for the non-QM space. So we do that as well, is that we partner, it's a true partnership. Because the hardest thing I think in the non-QM space is educating loan officers and how to sell, right, how to sell non-QM loans. Yeah. And it's also listening to our enterprise clients and listening to them and them telling us,

This is how the UI should work. This is how the user experience should be. And hopefully that trickles down to other loan officers using it. So that just brings me to this question. Like, you're working with the investors, these non-QM investors, and figuring out how to really optimize the pricing solution for non-QM lenders? Absolutely. So we came up with a thing called a configurable UI, right?

Because non-QM, you know, it's different in a sense that if you look at, legacy pricing engines, the UI was very, you know, you couldn't make any changes, right? Yeah. So we came up with a configurable UI word. Think of it like a, you know, like your, you know, like what are some of those websites that you could just drag and drop and drop. Job form. Yeah, exactly.

So that's our UI. So you can actually just create your own UI for non-QM or hard. Can you do it for hard money too? The hard money has nothing. You got to help these hard money guys out. They're just stuck. I got to get introduced. you of Valchrist, great bank, but they're just archaic.

So, yeah. Well, that's the whole thing. So when we first architected our application, it's not just for, you know, mortgages. It's for all consumer lending products. So it's everything from, you know, I mean, we've got a fantastic home equity, a UI. You know, there's, you got to dominate. There's no, there's no market in the- We want to get into auto.

We want to get into other areas, yeah. Yeah. And like, especially our banking clients, you know, like, you know, this is, Matter of fact, I'm just going to invest. Just get me a partnership interest, and I'm just going to go balls to the wall and make all the intro. So you know what we're doing, and I think this will be out by the time you guys have this live is, you know, we've had a great relationship with Chase, Chase Retail. So Chase Correspondent lending is now our client. So, sorry, you know, so we've expanded that relationship to Chase correspondent. So the portal that everyone uses today that, you know, if you're not going to, you know, if you're not going to, going to sell loans to the agencies, Fannie, Freddie, Ginny. And if you're going to sell to Chase,

you've got to use that portal. That portal is our portal, and that's going to be released at the end of the year. That's amazing. That's amazing. So let me ask you this. You know, you've been an entrepreneur. You've had several journeys in your entrepreneur, you know, lifeline. What do you think has been like your biggest inspiration to start your entrepreneur journey? I mean, the inspiration is mainly just to be able to build a product that people can use. Because I could tell you this, like earlier on when we're developing and coding the application, John, who's my brother-in-law, came to our office, and I was like, John, I go, you know, quantifying is doing so well, and you got so much money invested. And, you know, I can't wait until the company gets to that

point. And he goes to our, he goes, what you're doing right now, where you have no money, and then you're buying, like, you're paying a $1.50 for a hot dog at lunch. Still, they haven't changed the price. Costco's still a buck 50. Still a dollar. Still one of the best deals. It is the best deal in America. Yeah.

But that would be a launch. And then he goes, this is the time that you're going to remember and you're going to cherish the most. Is when you don't have clients, you don't have anything else and you're doing what you love, which is building software. You know, I would also, I'm going to tell you, because I saw this the other day, like, keep that immigrant or that, I don't know if you're an immigrant. I'm an immigrant.

I came as a refugee. Yeah, yeah, me too. So I came at five, and I've always maintained that immigrant poverty mentality, and people have always made fun of me. I saw something that really was cool to see. It was LeBron James is actually the cheapest person in the NBA. And in this video, they have, like, LeBron James. He packs his own lunch.

He packs his own snacks. He doesn't pay for anything. He makes people, when he goes to dinner with the other. guys, they all buy him lunch. And I'm like, that's why he's the richest guy in the NBA. You know, it's like he's maintained that. He packs his own snacks. He doesn't buy snacks at the game. It's unreal, you know. It would also be that his, you know, his snacks are probably healthy. Yeah, yeah, that's right. He's probably packing like, you know, pistachios. I think that, you know, like you said,

you know, you're an immigrant and I came here as a refugee. And I think that when you come here, you don't have the network. Yeah. So like, you know, when my parents came here, they had nothing, you know, my father was a Maytag repairman. my mother was a hairdresser. And then, so then my mother ended up opening up her own shop because, you know, that's what immigrants do. Like, you can't find jobs. So it's like, you got to open up your own business.

And then hustle in your community. So then that's what you do. Yeah. And it's just instilled in us. Yeah. It's instilled in us. So you've seen a lot of like success, a lot of challenges. What do you, what do you foresee like in the fintech space in the future?

Like with the advent of AI. And, you know, I just told you. about all the different AI platforms we're using. What do you foresee, how is this going to impact lender price? Number one, so I've got a graduate degree in computer science, but the emphasis is an AI machine learning, right? So that's where, I mean, I love. But even that's changed, right?

So much. It's changed, but if you look at AI, AI is really about correlating data, looking at patterns, and now you're seeing chat TPT. So one of the things that we did in back in 2016, when nobody knew what natural language processing is, is we implement an NLP on our rules management side of things on their back end. So now you know what NLP is because everyone's using chat GPT. But I think that AI is great because I think it's going to enhance the ability for you to get things

done faster. It's not going to replace loan officers. It's not going to replace underwriters. It is going to make it so that, you know, underwriters can process loans faster or, you know, get through loans faster. it's going to help in terms of regulating the regulation side of things. Yeah, regulations. Now, the regulators are asking for 10 times more data because you can get it because of the technology

and they could read it faster. And I think Ali Cardi is a good example of a person out there that promotes how Gen Z, you know, consumers think. Who's Ali Cardi? She works for, I think, I think I'm going to call comply I oh, I believe. and she's kind of like in the industry, teaching the industry, how Gen Z borrowers, you know, operate. And, you know, Gen Z borrowers, from my understanding is, I'm not Gen Z, but they're really about getting as much information online as they can, right? And I think that with AI and being able to ask questions, like, you know, it's amazing that you can ask chat GPT questions about a mortgage and it gives you answers, right?

Have you have done that? I asked Chad GPT everything. Like I was, I was, I was, I, I was, I was, I was, I was, I, I'm an assistant coach for my, my, my kids baseball team and I asked chat GPT, what can eight year old boys do in the dugout to just keep motivated? And it gave me like 10 things. I'm like, this is great. Like everything.

Oh, oh, I do the same thing. You know, like, I don't know, like I couldn't come up with ways to keep like eight year old boys sitting down. They're waiting to bat or they're waiting to, you know, catch or they're, you know, whatever it is. for their position, like, they're losing their mind. You know, and they're all, you know, this generation. So, you know, how do you keep them motivated?

And chat GPD answered with great suggestions. Yeah. Well, that's what I'm saying is that I think it's going to be ubiquitous in terms of how it's used. You're seeing it inside Microsoft products with Gemini. I don't know if you've, you know, enable that. You're seeing it. Gemini is its own chat with GPD.

Oh, no, no. I'm sorry. Gemini is through Google. It's through, it's offered in their, if you ever have like Google, We switched off of Google into Microsoft. Okay, so Microsoft, I think, has their own version. Everything is going to have a version of AI. We're building our own AI, too, for EMC.

So that's what I'm saying. You have to incorporate it somehow. Encelerate just did that. There are a CERM product out there. Everyone's doing it. I think that the most important piece for us is that because we're part of a regulatory environment is that- hyper-regulatory.

regulatory is that if you're going to use any API frameworks, let's say chat GPT's OpenAI's framework, you got to understand that whatever you, you know, all of the inputs within the solution that you build is that's pushing it to ChatGPD's API. And, you know, depending on what you're going to do, that may not work. Like, so for us, we're you, we're building our own LLM and SLM, a small language models within our company. because pushing pricing data or any type of NPI data or any type of sensitive data is not something that you want to push to Open AI's framework. But is it sensitive if it's generic? It depends on what you send, right?

You can't send loan information. You can't send FICO score. You can't send all that stuff there, right? Which is why some of our banking clients, like when we mention AI and they're like, well, how are you using it? you know, their biggest concern was like, I hope you're not... Sensitive. And pinging it to chat GPT or, yeah. So you have to build your own?

Exactly, yeah. I mean, we're not, you know, we're really focusing on small language models and the algorithms that incorporate, that's incorporated in the small language models, yeah. I can't imagine what chat GPT is repurposing my questions for. Now they know like everything that I'm thinking. And it's getting better and better, right? Yeah. Like, now like, what kind of do you?

they got on us. Yeah. That's like... But it's exciting. I mean, it's... Yeah, it is. I mean, it's... Really, we're doing what 20 companies are doing now.

I'll tell you this. You create an email, right? And then it's middle of night. Someone sends you something and you're like, yeah, you got your anger, me. This angry, you know, email that you're writing. And then you quickly highlight it and you go, friendly tongue. And then you set it out. Yeah.

No, no, I just still delete. I actually haven't started doing that. I didn't even know. You just add the email into Chad GPD? Yeah. Jasper is a good example. Jasper. A.I.

Just change it to friendly tone. Yeah. And then there's also apps out there that you could use for text as well. So that way, you know, you can sound a little bit better and smarter. It's just amazing. It's amazing. I have a few friends that do that. They run it through ChabbytDGPT before they send out their email.

So are there any like specific skills or a mindset that you have to have right now to be a successful entrepreneur? You know, I think the most important thing, and this is why, like, when I was younger and I created the mortgage company, was that, number one, if you're the type of person that says that I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it. You're never going to do it. You just have to take that first step, right? It's kind of like when you, you know, apply for your broker exam, right? Just fill out the application.

Whatever you do is take that first step and everything is that. else will work itself out. I think that's what entrepreneurs know. It's just taking the first step. You know, the vast majority of people that want to own their own business never take the first step. It's just like the gym. Yeah. The hardest part of the going in the gym is just getting up and going there. Just take the first step and you're going to get there. And then and then I just think that that's the thing. And then the other thing too is I, and I like to see a lot of parents out there, get them to, you know, get your kid to start looking at ways to build a business, whatever it is, at an earlier age, right? Not that, hey, you know, they don't want to do that. But if they're

interested in it, encourage them. And whatever it is, just do whatever. I mean, look, I've got a kid right now. I've got one that wants to, you know, he's in high school and then he wants to get into politics, which I'm like, okay, if that's what you want to do. But again, I've never, I've never, I've never stopped my kids. See, unlike my parents, who is like, you know, lawyer doctor, for my kids, I'm like, do whatever you want. I've got my youngest son, Andrew, and he plays basketball, and he loves, you know, basketball. And he knows he's not going to the NBA.

No, no, so this is funny. So I was talking to him. And then so his grandpa, you know, calls him Tata. And he goes, Tata comes in the house. This is just literally yesterday. He goes, yeah, so I was talking to Andrew. and then Andrew said he goes, I don't even know why I have to go to school

because I'm going to go into the NBA. Yeah, there's no Middle Easterns in the NBA, bro. Not one. Not one. It's like we have zero, like, name me one NBA player that's Middle Eastern, like one. We used to have Ronnie Cycle, but he was Greek, and he was like a fluke, you know, seven foot Greek guy.

He's not really a real Middle Eastern guy. Yeah, and then, yeah, and then, I mean, I don't know. So for my kids, I mean, my kids, you know, at one point, Alexander was like, like, look, I really want to be. a chef and we said okay well what do you want to do you want to start start cooking is whatever he wants to do that's awesome but the NBA thing is kind of tough for for a short middle eastern guy they got it hey but I got a good credit so like lately you know like he's pretty good though

how old is he uh he is 11 years old okay you know I mean deep down inside I'd still like to make it to the NBA I mean I still play but I just realized that you know I'm just not going to happen for me you know what's funny so I was coaching him and he goes in it He's the shortest kid on the team, right? So I was like, I was like, what do you need to do, you know, Andrew is like, you got to start shooting from the outside. So he's been shooting from the outside. He's got a good permer shot?

So now his shot's getting better. That's awesome. How's his handles? You got really good handles. He's really good at that. He's got his moves. Yeah. Dude, he does his moves, but that's about it. Yeah.

It's funny. Hoop dreams. So out of all the success that you have right now, and you continue to get up. and grind every single morning like 4 a.m. What inspires you to do that every morning? You know, I think what inspires me is just that I just get a, what expires me? I think what inspires me is that I'm doing what I like. I mean, I guess that if you don't like, if you don't like what you're doing, then you don't get up in the morning. Yeah. I mean,

I enjoy what I'm doing, you know, so that's why I get up in the morning and do it. You know, it's tough, right? You know, you have good days and bad. You know, you have good days and bad. bad days. But I think what inspires me is that. And then also, I do get a rush as far as getting up in the morning before everybody else, because I feel like I've been able to accomplish things before everyone else does. And it also lets me handle the rest of the stuff that I couldn't get to. So I think that's, you know, that inspires me. I don't know. I just like doing what I'm doing. You love what you do. Love what you do.

Now, you're in a hyper-competitive space, the fintech space. What are you doing right now to foster talent and create great talent? You know, so I think Glenn Stern said it best is to, well, to create, well, to hire people. It's just not, you know, creating good talent is just really you have to have a good, you know, program, you know, within your company to kind of like get people to do what they want to do, right? one thing that Glenn said to me is he goes DeWari goes you know how you get successful in this business he goes why he goes find people that are smarter than you and hire him so that's what I've been able to do that's awesome get people just get folks that are in certain positions that note really well put him in those positions and then you know it helps I feel like Glenn can say that and he

puts on a front like he's not the smartest guy but he's the smartest guy in the room every time but he can pretend like he's not but dude the guy is unrued real brilliant. He is. Yeah, yeah. He's unreal brilliant. I mean, you don't become a billionaire and you know, and then you have your own show undercover billionaire and you start with 500 bucks and become rich again, $500 in the middle of, you know, Erie, Pennsylvania. You know, he doesn't have to do this again. He's he's humble. He's doing it just because he loves doing it. He loves doing it. He just won't. He's just bored. You know, he's like, I'm going round too. And I think the other thing, too, is that, you know, having a good spouse, like Mindy's just a big. Mindy's superstar.

Yeah. And for me, too, it's like, and I'm sure it's the same thing for you, it's like, When you have, like, if it wasn't for my wife being so supportive, I don't think that I could have done anything. I was just at lunch yesterday. And if it wasn't for my wife, and I hope she's listening right now, like, I would not be who I am. Like, she has been my sole inspiration. She's also like, I mean, she's, and my kids also, I mean, she's been mega inspiration. But she just, she just keeps making me better. Like, she sees some fluke in me.

And she's just like, get rid of that. You know, like. Or they were able to accept all the flukes. us. Yeah. Or always working on cleansing my flukes. Yeah. Yeah.

Which is such a blessing. My kid, my oldest. And I don't know if he does this to irk me. He goes, you could have had so much better than Dwar. Like, look at you, Mom, and look at him. He goes, like, do you have to say that in front of me? Yeah. I think my daughter has said something like that to my wife.

And her name's Alexandra. Like, these kids, like, what? So, like, right now, your business, and I'm wrapping up here, but got a couple last questions, but your business is really, you know, in a hyper-regulated space. How are you still managing, like, taking risks? I think you have to take risk, but it's measure risk, right? I think that in our space is very cyclical, right? So with every down cycle, there's an opportunity.

You know, last two years has always been. tough. But it's always managed risk and figure out what you need to do to stay alive, you know, because we are in such a cyclical industry. I love it. I love it. Yeah, you're always managing the kind of risk that you're taking because it's been so cyclical the last couple years. I mean, it's always cyclical. It always goes up and down. But 2020, 2021, you're like, this isn't good. That was a ride of our lives in 2022. Bam. And you gained all the market share then. Right. But how bad was it in 2008, 2009? I mean, you weren't around then, though. It crushed me.

It put me out of business. Yeah. Lennar Fries wasn't around. So I have two last questions. But the first of the last questions is a three-prong question. What is a personal goal that you have? What is a business goal that you have? And then what's a family goal that you have?

And you can answer those in any order. So I do have a personal goal. So I mean, I've, so I always, I'm very goal-oriented. Like, you know, I've been really into eating right and doing the exercise stuff. So I think that's done. I really wanted to learn how to meditate. That's a personal goal of wine. Just meditate.

Because I think that I hear so much about it. I mean, I've read books about it. I still can't do it. I have a good friend, Brent Chandler from Form Free, that does it really well. And I'm always calling him and asking what to do. Maybe the ADD and me can't do it. I know. I feel you because I tried that too.

and it's like deep, take a deep breath in, five seconds, hold it, deep breath out, five seconds, hold it, like, and then I do that while I'm stretching, and I'm checking my phone, so it doesn't work. Like, I got to cut one of those out and just focus on the breathing. I would love to learn to meditate, too. It's also, like, been on my radar. I can't turn off that long. Yeah.

But the best of the best do it. Yeah, I would love to do it, yeah. Family goal would definitely be, you know, it's unfortunate that, you know, like when you're running a company, you're not there for your kids as much, you know? You know, I have a good friend. And then one of the things that he says is never miss a game or a sporting event from your kids. And I try not to do that as best as possible, but I'd like to do better at that. Do you go to all the practices too?

I do, I try to go to every practice. That's my goal is to this year and next year and whatever is to be there at every single one of their events because they remember that when they're older. Yeah. I noticed in my town too in Newport Beach, like the dads are, they go to every practice. I'm like, and we're in Newport Beach. Like, you know, these guys are all very successful men. Like they're at every baseball practice. Yeah, exactly.

And sometimes I hate myself for missing them. Like, this guy can't do it. Like, you feel guilty. Yeah. I'm like, but there's three baseball practices a week. It's crazy. Like, you guys, like, it never stops with baseball. Like, you're always traveling with baseball.

You know? It's a lot. And then I only have one older one. And thank God, you know, what happens with all four of them are in activities? How do you do that? It's like, you're full-time attending events. Yeah, I think the only way you could do that is, like, one parent has to, because, you know, both Laura and I work, I think one parent has to stop working because you're so busy

doing that. Like, I don't see it in any other way unless you're really wealthy and you can hire someone to do that for you. But then when you do that, then you're just not. there at the games. Yeah. There's a drawback there. Yeah, I'm just, I'm always asking these questions because number one, people who are listening are always working on goal setting, and I'm hoping if they're not working on goal setting, they get inspired by hearing goal setting from other CEOs and founders. And I guess the business one would be to just continue what we're

doing, listening to clients. You know, we have some, you know, real important goals this year. but what are they you know you know as you're building applications you start accumulating tech debt and you're you know and and there's a ton of features and functionalities that we need to build really you know the short-term business goal this year is to really get our product roadmap complete by the end of the year with which is easier said and done because you have a lot of distractions and And that would be the biggest business goal is to end the year where we have all of our roadmap items complete.

Love it. Love it. One last question. And we adjourn. When you die, what's God going to say to you in front of the pearly gates? What do you think he's going to say? I would hope it's something good. What would God say?

Oh, my gosh. So it's a hard question because, like, you know, our kids go to Catholic school and everything. I think for me, I hope that I could. contribute something. I don't know what that is. But, you know, gosh, that's such a hard. What would God say? I mean, I, you know, I guess the only thing that I want to do and that I've been doing is just to be a good human, just be a good human being. I mean, it's not the success. It's not the money. It's not anything else. It's because I don't care about that and really I don't have it, right? I mean, you say that you, you know, you said a lot of nice things at the very beginning of the,

you know, the show. It doesn't matter. All that stuff doesn't matter. I think that's the thing is, you know, there's this thing about, like, you know, like when you die, right, none of that stuff matters. And you know what matter, you know, what I've heard of what matters is, is that you, what you regret is not reaching out to the friends and family and people that you know that you should have reached out, whether it was something that you had an argument with or

something and you just didn't keep in contact with them or go back and, you know, like you had an opportunity to go back and just say, hey, look, you know, I'm thinking about you and, you know, I just want to talk to you again. I think that, I think it really comes down to simple terms like that when you're, you know, when you're on your dying deathbed. Yeah. You know, I learn a lot from, from this experience with sitting down with people because you get to a point where money is irrelevant, you know, it's just fleeting. And life is just a vapor. Right. So we're here for a mission and we're here to serve and we're here to do good things. And, you know, that's what we're here to do. Yeah. It's family. It's our direct family. It's our, you know, it's our friends. I mean, that's what life is about. Yeah. You know, you can take everything away and that's what matters most. I love it. Hey, Devar, I'd love to have you on the show. And I love this relationship that we have. I'd love to continue to grow with you and continue to, you know, let people know about how awesome of a platform we have. with Lender Price and just from the show, I discovered a marketplace that's totally untapped for you

that I'm going to try to get you, you know, introduced to today. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. Doar. You've been the best. All right.

Thank you guys for watching today's show. And we'll see you guys next time. God bless.