Crime in Sports - #219 - A Sandwich In Your Neck Hole - The Hungriness of Bobby Czyz

Episode Date: August 4, 2020

This week, we travel down the path of a sad, twisty story of a man who started with such promise. He came from a very abusive family, putting his toughness on display with a championship boxing career. The problem is, he also couldn't stop getting arrested. Find out why he said he father "made Hitler look like a choir boy", and just what the Gambino crime family had to do with all of this! What a wild journey!! Have a horribly abusive father, turn your ability to take a beating into a career, and join MENSA with Bobby "Matinee Idol" Czyz!! Check us out, every Tuesday! We will continue to bring you the biggest idiots in sports history!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman Donate at... patreon.com/crimeinsports or with paypal.com using our email: [e-mail] Get all the CIS & STM merch at crimeinsports.threadless.com Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things CIS & STM!! Contact us on... twitter.com/[e-mail]/Crimeinsportsinstagram.com/smalltownmurder#  See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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And it's anything above the five dollar level if you just want to be a good person and get a shout out have jimmy butcher your name you can do that also over at paypal using our email address crime and sports at gmail.com let's get into this because it's crazy excellent and it's deep and it's thick and uh the story was a lot deeper than i thought it was going in uh bobby chez you know bobby chez is you know the fighter bobby chez no he's a boxer and was an analyst for showtime forever up until 15 years ago maybe i mean he's if you heard his voice and saw him you probably know who he was as far as just from boxing analysts type shit but bobby

chez boxer coming up uh in the 80s and all that we'll talk about him because what a weird life this guy had great holy shit his dad oh just a a gem a real gem let's let's do it here robert edward uh chez jr oh boy so right away there's problems right away there's an issue we know it and his dad if his dad was an athlete really would have been a monster so what the hell was he with the hubris for a junior oh we'll talk about it his dad has hubris is one way to put it with his dad. Now, this is Bobby Chez, and the Chez, the spelling of the last name is C-Z-Y-Z. Oh.

That's Chez. No. It's his Polish part of him. Oh, thank God he's not. Which is a small part of him because the rest of him. Don't want to miss show. Yeah, you would go, oh, no. Science.

They'd go, I don't think you said my name. Nicknames here. Number one, matinee idol. That's what he called himself. And also Chappy. Early in his career, he went by Chappy, which is what his dad called him. But he's born February 10th, 1962. And he's born in Orange, New Jersey.

Later on, he'll live in Wannock, New Jersey for a while here. He's three quarters Italian Italian and one-quarter Polish. So this is going to be a big deal because the Italian, especially boxing community, is a really thing unto itself. It's interesting. Yeah, the trainers and all that, there's a lot of...

It's really insular. And I know this because my stepmother's father was an Italian boxing trainer, so I know this because my stepmother's father was a boxing trainer, an Italian boxing trainer. So I know this for like he had Zuri Lawrence, who was a half decent heavyweight in the 90s and stuff like that. So like it's they all know each other. It's all very inside. It's all the Italian community is very insular in lots of different ways.

If you live in like, you know, Phoenix, let's say not so much because people have moved away from their families to out here they do have the knights of columbus we have that still we'll get together sons of sons of italy hall besides that though back east everybody's lived there for fucking generations and they know each other and the parents knew each other and it's all very insular it's not there's no connection really with the outside world they get a little italian stay there yeah and even even when they're not in like a section like that still they deal with each other they have their own little clubs or things they do there's no it's not an outside

thing really it's so that's a that's an interesting thing now i never knew really what the hell bobby ches was he sounds italian i know he's from new jersey and i know we have okay how do i put this i don't know how to put this uh in a legal non-libelist and also accurate way uh how do i do that allegedly i know that we have bobby chez and myself yeah mutual friends of ours let's just say mutual friends so yeah i'm not say, and for legal reasons especially, I'm not going to say that Bobby Chez knows a lot of mob guys, but I will say that mob guys know Bobby Chez. So I don't know.

You can take from that what you want, basically. He's a friend of ours. Well, he's just, if you're a figure back there, and especially an athletic figure, and especially a guy like a boxer, when you're a boxer in the beginning, especially an athletic figure, and especially a guy like a boxer, when you're a boxer in the beginning, you need someone to stake you. People have to stake you. Got it.

So it's a, you know what I'm saying? Is it a friend of mine? He's a friend of mine. That's what it is. Well, no. A friend of mine, we're not going to, it's not going to be the terminology. Isn't a friend of mine like a guy that I know he's fine? He's inside me.

Yeah, he's a friend of ours. It's like, that's a terrible man. Yes, exactly. So we have mutual friends that are ours as if we know what i'm saying so yeah anyway uh we have a uh a quote from bobby he is a michael ray richardson new jack level quote machine by the way oh these fucking guineas are voluble we'll say for number one and number two he's a real smart guy and god does he love to tell you how smart he is too so he just loves to talk and tell you how great he is uh here he is quote i was born in

orange new jersey it was in the harlem-esque section the really downtrodden ghetto area i don't have any memory of orange and i don't have much memory of newark i used to live in newark too and it was in a bad section before I was two or three years old. I was a very small baby in the apartments. So then he says, talking about his family life and how they ended up here, quote, I was born five days before my father turned 18. That's tough. Four months before my mother turned 18. So obviously I was not a planned child.

Yeah, probably not. Juniors in high school usually don't say i think it's time to have a let's settle down yeah i think it's time to settle down and have we've been trying can't take my mind off this homework we've been trying since first semester and it just hasn't taken yet we're gonna keep pumping away though jesus christ yeah he said so obviously i was not a planned child they both had dropped out of high school my father got his ged and my mother didn't she had three kids before she was 20 wow yikes so it was children raising children if you will so yeah this is holy they're young they're poor they have a shitload of kids that's this is a veto corleone

situation is what we have going on father too that's what this is like except in the 19 having three kids yeah mind-blowing it is mind-blowing and that that happened a lot back then that was a big thing before because this is before i mean the 60s is when the pill became big so this is i have a feeling his mom really didn't know too much about it yet because or had the lack of uh availability and that's what i'm saying that too yeah so back then people would just fuck fucking so many kids uh he man his family life is fucked up let's just say his dad is a fucking monster we've talked about a bunch of dads who we often say we can't figure out what's better yeah for a criminal athlete a young budding criminal athlete is it better for a criminal athlete, a young, budding criminal athlete. Is it better for the father to leave and just abandon the family completely or stay close by and beat the living shit out of anyone with an arm's reach?

We've gone through this many times. We show them how to not do things or also show them really how to not do. Yeah. not do yeah or the opposite of that or actually kind of goes with it is that overbearing parent who like the todd marinovich eating kidney gummies in the fucking crib and you know the jennifer capriotti parents that are just forcing not a perfect solution to it no if you're a dickhead that's the thing the thing is with an ad parents think they can make their kid like a professional athlete but it's like if they don't want to do it, then you force them to do it like Todd Marinovich, and then they turn out like Todd Marinovich. If you just lay back on them, they don't have the desire.

They won't do it at all. They basically have to want to do it themselves, and they have to come to you and say, hey, Dad, I want to play on that traveling team. And then you have to go, all right, fuck, we got to figure out a way to get the kid to play. That's how it has to be. It can't be you're going to play on the fucking aau team or you're gonna know that that's not how it works the really the answer is adjust your your schedule to this fucking horrible schedule yeah and watch kids play fucking sports which is terrible very bored and hopefully there's a payoff of retirement later that if they're good at what they do or

hopefully they just they'll be happy that you came and they won't murder anyone later on for it either way though you know whether they take care of you or just don't ruin the family name one of the two things all good for you even if you force them to play and there is an early retirement in it in the cards that oftentimes i mean on a hundred and so many episodes 182 is it yeah eesh 82 this is 219 small town murders 180 wowza we're on 219 holy fuck man so we've had quite a few of these people there's a lot of people who uh even if you've had every example it's still detrimental to that kid dude the crime in sports is really like a study like if you looked at that i don't know any other place and not try to pat ourselves on the back here because it definitely wasn't our

wasn't on purpose it wasn't our call hey let's set out to have a comprehensive you know that wasn't what we were doing but if you look at it i don't know any other place that's taken 220 and we're you know keep going every week athletes and done a fucking detailed study about all of them to kind of figure out patterns and shit where it went you could do it yeah this is like by the time we're done with these with crime and sports going to be basically every criminal athlete in the history of sports that you can just go over and pattern them out and you could see exactly what causes what find what great wild man or uh drug thirst or whatever this shit should be studied yeah and if it is if i must say this to check this out to future professors or somebody that's smart

and listening to this and just yeah just doing all this stuff guess what poop there you go how you like that now you feel dumber okay so anyway uh he says about his parents getting married here and this is uh kind of goes into their poorness quote when my parents got married and got back from their honeymoon they had a grand total of 40 cents they had to borrow money to pay for the cab to get home jesus christ they went as far away as a cab could take them i mean they probably went to the shore yeah from jersey they probably literally probably were like we'll go to wildwood or whatever horse shit was going on in 1960 i don't know but it's someone with a striped umbrella let's go there any marriage where the honeymoon is at the jersey shore that marriage is doomed

to fail let's just say that i've got 1760 what do you got not good we could get to the shore we could get to the shore we can't really do much when we get there walk around i guess and as far as the cab will take try not to step on any needles that's what they're doing if that's where your life is how about don't get married no no they're ready to have three kids never mind mind getting married. They're having three fucking kids. Hey, I think we're real established here. I think we should have many children now. That seems like a smart thing to do.

I was 17 and got a girl pregnant. And I was like, oh, my God, I'm in some. I was like, I can't do that. I don't know what to do. And then she was a smart girl and guided me along the way. She said, what you need to do is go get $200. She said, tell you what. She wanted to split.

We're going Dutch here. What's your next paycheck? And I was like, I don't know. In like two weeks, she's like, I'll do it. And then you just pay me back. I got one on fucking layaway, James. Well, she did. She got it. I didn't do anything. I certainly assisted when i had what you know when i had yeah yeah yeah you know when you got it yeah just hook

me up at least you didn't like we're like hey listen no good that was on her it was her decision thank christ she was the smart one because i was dumb i was like i'll raise it as my own obviously you dummy it is yours we're getting married next week. And then we'll go as far as the cab can take us on our honeymoon. Because that's the couple. You want to go to the mall? Because that's what I've got in my pocket. We could get to the mall and take a couple laps around.

I'd be talking about your criminal athlete kid right now. Get you some man-man. Worked out better. So they had to borrow money to get uh to pay for the cab to get home they lived with my aunt and uncle for some time they were taken in uh family is family they lived for a while with my grandparents which i have memory of my grandparents had a two-family home we had the upper floor they had the bottom floor once my mother and father got on their feet a little bit they paid a nominal rent so that's kind of how they came up that's

how a lot of young people kind of come up banging around but you shouldn't have three kids no while you're trying to figure out where you live sweet jesus yeah now a little about his dad yeah to give you a background because the things he says about his dad and the things that his dad did are kind of so terrible you really need a background on the guy to go what the fuck happened to this guy so uh his dad robert senior uh his dad died when he was two robert's grandfather so he never robert jr never met his grandfather uh he said that he once told bobby jr here that he once told Bobby Jr. here that he was infuriated by his father dying, which that's understandable. Kids get mad, but you can't.

I mean, it's not like he did it on purpose. I'm sure he would rather have been alive. It depends on how he died, too. Some people do that. Some people get mad at people for dying, even if it's just a car accident. They'll get mad at them for dying. Especially kids. They feel abandoned feel it's mostly kids it's kids yeah so this robert senior grew up as a latchkey kid in orange new jersey and uh apparently he was picked on by a daycare center worker where he was enrolled as a child oh no he was like beaten up and picked on by a by a caregiver

that's horrible as a young child so he ended up becoming very kind of an angry guy uh at a very young age he joined street gangs yeah that's it yeah he's just he's an angry motherfucker and he knows how to take a beating sure if you're not afraid to take a beating that's it's one of those things where i remember listening and it's it's clear in a lot of different places but in the hunter thompson hell's angels book he talks about how like you'll hear he's like he's talking about the hell's angels and how they're if they like to have bar fights and shit in the 60s and he's like you'll hear you know you always go into a bar you'll hear some bartender talking about how he's a black belt in karate and he you know kicked eight guys out of here and all that shit he goes but you know a hell's angel who's in fights all the time is

gonna fucking mash some guy who's a black belt in karate no matter how skilled he is the fact if one guy's not afraid of getting his teeth knocked out and the other guy is right that's not an even fight it's not that's it if one guy's used to it and like i don't give a fuck if you break my nose and the other guy's like i don't want to be hurt in this fight i don't care how skilled the fucking combatants we're talking about one guy is going to keep coming yeah so that's kind of what you got here and there's also a difference between the way you put your hands on something when somebody's doing it for style and points and the other guy's just coming at you to put his fucking hands the other guy's got a fucking a chain whip or a fucking tire iron it doesn't matter anymore he doesn't

care he's not in this for style he's in a show off he just wants to hurt you and get you out of the way as a as an obstacle and to your uh style fighting yeah that's a problem and it is so uh yeah he spent bobby senior this is robert senior spent his sophomore year of high school in a correctional center in jamesburg new jersey from getting arrested for doing a bunch of street shit there uh he ended up meeting he gets he gets out of there and he's on parole and that's when he meets louise who is bobby's mother luis guerrero who's very italian yeah so his father is half polish his father's father is polish and that's it everybody else is italian so bobby's three quarters italian one quarter polish and is very much embraced by the new jersey italian community i'm sorry as you can imagine here so they got married when she became pregnant with bobby

so this wasn't like a hey we're married isn't this great and then oh look at this and another blessing this was uh oh shit i guess we better get hitched i better take care of you yeah he uh apparently yeah he was in that jamestown reformatory eventually robert senior got his ged eventually here and uh his father was very very much uh wanted his kids to box he got robert into boxing at four years old he started uh making teaching him kind of the the basics and uh he wanted his boys to be tough and not take any shit from anybody and know how to defend themselves basically the seniors had it rammed down his throat his entire life he's like this world's a cold bitch it is you better start fighting back and they're in a tougher area and it doesn't want the kids to be walking around getting rolled when they're going to school and shit like that which is good you should teach a

kid something so uh later he uh this is bobby says this later on about his childhood and uh it sums a lot up here this is bobby jr our guy here quote a couple years ago i was due to receive a special award for the courage i showed in the ring i had a speech but i uh to say but i really struggled because to be honest i didn't know if i could accept the award as the courage i showed in the ring i had a speech but i uh to say but i really struggled because to be honest i didn't know if i could accept the award as the courage i showed in the ring had been beaten into me by my father he said in a way i'm grateful to him every day i got beat up but it made me strong uh it made me strong but i feel the lesson my father taught me didn't have to be that hard yeah i would say so uh he his father beat the living shit out of everybody in the house constantly including the mother a lot and we're talking the uh he had four

kids beat the living shit out of all of them beat the living shit out of his wife his wife louise say said that he hit her he beat her so often that when it rained her jaw hurt oh no had like an arthritic jaw from getting fucking popped in the face. She knew when it was going to rain. Yeah. So, yeah, he made her a weatherman. That's how fucking. If you beat someone to have like predictability of weather into them, that's a lot of beating.

Better than Channel 5. I'll hit you so hard you're going to know when it's going to rain. That's a threat. You're going to know when it rains. Turn your ass into a weather vane. You keep talking. That's fucked up, man. That's mad.

I'm just trying to make light of it. It's fucking awful. It's the worst. And back then, this was- My hand sometimes throbs when it's going to rain. This thing was fucking mangled. Yeah. And the little amount that I can change the weather or predict the weather, I can't change

anything. I was going to say, Jimmy. Jimmy, we need to talk buddy i mean jesus christ i know we've had flights delayed you could have could have done something about this what are you doing for her to be able to know every time team player that's a beating man she sustained it in the jaw several times a woman getting punched in the face that's how he was that's horrific and i i hate to you know ever throw people under the bus but back then that was real fucking common yeah kind of in the northeast and these italian guys were fucking brutal yeah both of my grandfathers were not kind in that way both of them you know what i mean my grandmother italian grandma left my original grandfather and got a

divorce in the 60s in you know which was not fucking done especially in that community not done her family people were calling from italy to tell her not to get a divorce i swear to god that like she had people calling like 100 year old relatives from italy were calling her to tell her what a sin it is and this is terrible and you guys like i'm telling an unbelievable feast you use the lines under the ocean she ran away to california wow with their daughters for fucking to get away from her own family for fucking breaking her balls for wanting to get a divorce and to get away from all of them it's a long story but tired of getting hit this was a fucking you know what i mean this was very common back then and then she met my you know her next husband grandpa who was uh my grandpa who was very nice and calm

very calm owned a pizza place it was just like you could go off on a big rant and he'd go hey i don't know as much as you're gonna get at him she would she would yell at him she'd scream at him in italian and english back and forth and he'd go hey i don't know what to tell you i don't know what the hell you want from me that's all he would say. At the very cost. That's essentially how I would fight with my ex-wife. It works perfectly. And I wish, whatever.

Oh, Ben. I wish I would have hit her. No, don't say that, Jimmy. I'm joking. Yes, obviously. He's kidding, guys. He does not. Oh, my God.

I don't. It's never the answer. Don't hit women. No, never. I don't understand how people can just lose it and punch people. i don't there's never the answer don't hit women no never i don't understand how how people can just lose it and punch people i don't understand how that's the solution ever the parent for him it was this guy apparently he beat bobby the worst because he was the oldest so bobby took the brunt of everything louise and bobby took most of it uh now at the age of 10

his parents got a call from the school uh, whatever you want to call it, the school district is the word I was looking for, to advise them that Bobby was far advanced ahead of his fellow classmates here. And because there was a lot of kids that were below levels in reading and math and all this shit, and Bobby was far accelerating above them. low levels in reading and math and all this shit. And Bobby was far accelerating above them. So they recommended that they relocate to a different district where they, where they, that has more, you know, better accommodations for kids who are smart,

basically access to fostering a growing mind. Yeah. So they ended up moving to Wannock, New Jersey, which is kind of lower middle class, but they have a good school district. And that was the, that's how he went there. He it's hard for him in school because his home life is so fucked up.

He does well in school, but there's certain things like in gym class. He had to beg to not be on the skins team because he didn't want everybody to see that he was covered in fucking bruises from his dad beating the shit out of him. Oh, I thought you were going to say hair because he's a Italian. Yeah, he's covered. He was was a suit he's a fucking suit all the other kids were hair just his hair are you kidding me it's fucking new jersey he had bruises 45 italian kids 45 black kids two puerto ricans and a jewish kid that's that was the neighborhood i'm sure that's basically every school back then kid has bruises yeah it's got bruises all over him here.

Unbelievable. He came home when he was 14 with a broken ankle from playing basketball. And this is when he's already boxing in tournaments. We'll get into that. And this broken ankle would make him miss a tournament. And so his father saw him with a cast on and punched him in the face for fucking up. I'm sure he didn't want to break his ankle i assume um now this is this is pretty fucked up here uh he says about his dad

we'll just let him tell about his dad he says quote he was a very possessive and brutal person i never knew how sick he really was i just thought he had a mean disposition um by the way he's also a brown belt in karate robert also so he like knows how to hit people he's not just willy-nilly smacking people he's you know his dad's a brown belt in karate when he was a kid so his dad's below black right yeah that's the one but his dad yeah at least knows how to deliver a blow we'll say he's he's you know familiar he's good at it um so he said uh, to this day, he even says it too. He talked about his mom.

Then he says, to this day, my jaw hurts when it rains. And that was after boxing for all that long. It was already in before he started boxing. He says that he thinks his dad's violence was somehow rooted in affection, which is how he looks at it, which is a twisted way to look at it. He says, quote, the reason I hit you and the kids is that I love you, he would tell his wife, is what he said,

which is what a lot of abusive people say. OJ said, I just love Nicole too much. I mean, that's not a reason. You can't do that. You know what I'm saying? They say it cuts like a knife. Yeah, that's a fact. Yeah. Listen can't do that. You know what I'm saying? They say it cuts like a knife. Yeah. That's a fact.

Yeah. Listen. No, no, no, no, no, no. I heard that a million times growing up. I'm doing this because I love you. Yeah, it's not okay. It's horrible. Yeah, but that was the thing back then. It's not rooted in love.

No. It's rooted in I'm fucked up and I'm frustrated and I can't process this emotion. Back then, though, especially you have to look at it in context of the community too like violence was considered love right i mean you beat the shit out of your kids because you loved them yeah i love my kids i don't want them to be bums i gotta so i have to beat them unconscious that's how they were these people to be degenerate you ever watching here's something everybody's seeing goodfellas when they're talking about when uh when uh karen there she's at she's at the post-its party,

and all the other women are there, and she's like, they talked about how awful their kids were and about beating them with broom handles. That's how they were. That's what you got to do. Otherwise, they don't know you love them. It's a weird... They'll be out running the streets. You don't hit them and tell them you love them.

I can't express to you what a weird, odd place violence has in the streets you don't hit them and tell them you love them i i can't express to you how what a weird odd place of violence has in the italian culture it's very odd yeah it's it's a currency it's just like there's no fucking i can't even explain it to you it's just it's just my grandmother has smacked me with weapons a million times. It's just what you do. Even in a congratulatory thank you, I love you, good to see you, you guys hug and then assault each other's backs. Yes, that's what I mean. Smack each other. How you doing? I love you, pal.

Smack him in the face. They do that all the time. And that's love. With a smile. That means they love you. And you're supposed to smile back. How you doing that, pal? Good to see you.

Like, Jesus Christ. Knocked a fucking filling loose and they don't care don't care and we're both smiling about this yeah it's bizarre it's fucking wild man it's it's a weird i know we're laughing about something that's crazy but it's a strange culture to grow up in it just doesn't make any sense but it makes all the sense yeah it does now bobby said she would he would tell her the reason i hit you is that i love you and he she would say then love us a little less, which is a great fucking response. I wish you just liked me. Hey, let's get back to I'm not so sure.

We'll see where this relationship is going. Can we get to that point? Because I feel like that'd be less painful. You were just interested. Yeah. yeah now when bobby on his 18th birthday he formally this is a weird conversation with your dad to have on your 18th birthday on his 18th birthday he sat his father down and formally requested i don't know if it was in writing i don't know if he put a like an outfit on and got a horn play or something but he formally requested that he stopped beating his mother

okay please dad i just on my 18th birthday for my present i would like you to you know requested that he stop beating his mother. Okay. Please, Dad. I just, on my 18th birthday, for my present, I would like you to, you know, not beat the shit out of Mom anymore. This will cost you nothing. Yeah. What did Robert Sr. say about this? I mean, yeah, sure. He's going to honor his

son's 18th birthday wish, right? He said that, quote, he couldn't promise anything, but he would try to ease up on it a little bit. That's ass he said that quote he couldn't promise anything but he would try to ease up on it a little bit wow that's what he said i'll pull my left next time he said he'll try to ease up on the punches a little bit i'll just smack her next time because that's considered like you know everybody smacks each other this is how crazy this fucking society you know i've been thinking about it yeah you're right yeah it's fucking insane this is where what the fuck wow this is

i grew up around these people this is where senses of humor come from when you look at these people you either go yeah that's what you do or you go the fuck are we doing are you seeing this why is this a thing yeah this would be like me and my cousin be sitting there going you're seeing this right like this is this is crazy this environment we're growing up in. We both see this and nobody's saying nothing? We both see it. It's just us. All right. Whatever. I guess it just happens again.

I guess it's just us. Fuck it. So let's do an In Their Own Words. Yeah, it's a long one and it's kind of worth it here. Let's do it here. In Their Own Words, quote, I was baptized Catholic. My father turned atheist when I was four.

All I remember was being an atheist. Now, when he died, my mother was Catholic. She wouldn't say it before because he would kill her. My father was probably the most single, vicious human being. He makes Hitler look like a choir boy, and my mother makes Mother Teresa look like Hitler. You're saying, did you just say his dad killed eight million jews he just said his dad must gas the children in the neighborhood lord um i guess because wow uh but he said his dad well i apparently i think he's what he's getting at is if his dad had had access to that sort of arrangement he probably

would have been enthusiastic for it. Make Hitler look like a choir boy, and his mother makes Mother Teresa look like Hitler. The wait is over. So far, you're not losing. The only thing you're losing is my patience. Quickly, I see that. Ding! The queen of the courtroom

is back. I didn't do anything. You wouldn't know the truth if it came up and slapped you in the face. I see he's not intimidated by anything. I can fix that. New cases. She wanted to fight me. Leave her.

A law. Okay, so, um... This is not a so. This is a period. Classic Judy. Did you sleep with her? Yes, Your Honor. You married his cousin.

His brother. That's not him. Yes, ma'am. I would make a beeline for the door. The Emmy Award-winning series returns. How did I know that? I have a crystal ball in my head. It's an all-new season.

It's streaming. You can say anything. Judy Justice, only on Freebie. streaming. You can say anything. Judy Justice, only on Freebie. If you don't know when Crystal Pepsi was discontinued, what was in Al Capone's vault, or which famous meteorologist is Lenny Kravitz's second cousin, then you haven't spent enough time on Wikipedia. But that's okay. I am here for you. I'm Darcy Carden, and I'm inviting you to listen to my new podcast, WikiHole, from Smartless Media. Discover the craziest rabbit holes on Wikipedia with me and my funny friends as we bring the cyber frontier directly to your tympanic membrane. And if you

listen to my podcast, you'd learn that that's the science-y term for eardrum. We embark on a hyperlink rollercoaster as we start out on a Wikipedia page and go from link to link to link to link, careening through trivia, oddities, and unexpected connections until we collectively shout, how the hell did we get here? Follow WikiHole

on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to WikiHole ad free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. So that's an interesting family. Yeah. That's a really, it's a strange way to grow up. So he's saying his mom's that much of an angel and dad is that much of a piece of garbage. He's literally, quote, worse than Hitler. If you say someone's worse than Hitler, like, that's a lot. That's literally the worst guy.

Worse than Hitler. So they are absolutely opposites attract kind of thing. Complete. Yeah, complete. How's that? Because that's how a lot of those girls were back then. They'd look for the guy who was. Balances them out?

No, they'd look for a guy who was in charge and was fucking, hey, look at him. He's in charge and he's loud and he makes money. Not even that. It's just a matter of uh somebody they look for like a loud guy it's a weird thing the quiet italian women back then they find some loud husband it's very strange yeah so he says again quote i didn't understand that i would go in the ground and never see anyone again so i used to cry myself at to sleep at night every once in a while it was so hurtful if i cried at night before my father came in he would slap the crap out of me my father used to use open used to open-handed break your jaw that's a slap yeah that's a that's quite the slap

jaw-breaking slap yeah that's a whoo boy yeah the last time he did it was july 1969 that's he's seven years old right he cracked me so hard he separated my jaw seven year old wow seven he said quote i told you the only way you can live forever is through your family or being something special so stop the crying he would beat him up because robert was sad that he found out that people die and that he was going to die someday so he'd beat the living shit out of him to cheer him up. Feel better? I mean, the right thing. Now you want to die, don't you?

Don't worry. You're only seven. That's the right thing to say. You got so many years ahead of you. You know how your whole life seems long? You're going to do that like 10, 12 more times. Like, that's what you tell. Like, holy shit, that's forever.

So far from it. They can't even calculate that. You're going to one day be 18 18 doesn't that seem far off yeah it's way after you're still a kid right that's how you still don't know shit absolutely so uh he was forced into boxing basically uh also his brothers vincent and tony so bobby vinnie tony this is a very yeah yeah they got bobby and vinnie tony this is jersey from jersey yeah which is i have cousins and bobby vinnie tony this is a very yeah yeah they got bobby and vinnie tony this is jersey from jersey yeah which is i have cousins and bobby and vinnie and tony and they are nicky and this and then yeah george carlin stereotype oh it's just a stereotype in general because it's real but it's george and it's bit well it's it's everybody yeah so he said it's fucking dom herrera's whole career right you know what i mean whole career

yeah whole thing is this story the story of dom herrera he's not involved in this at all yeah so he said the boys were uh uh you know young and the father believed it would help shape their character uh now he talks about later on a script was written about his life. And this is what Bobby says about his childhood. He says, quote, The people who were sent the original script thought it was too violent, and it wasn't even 100% of the violence in my house.

It wasn't all the things my father did to me, my brothers, and my mother. It was so toned down, and even that was too much. It's not a boxing movie. It so happens that I chose boxing as my path. It's the story of survival within a family of extreme dysfunction and vicious abuse. Holy shit. He says the single most important reason for my story being told for me was I wanted one single concept understood.

Throughout recent history, psychologists and psychiatrists all talk about murderers, rapists and serial killers being abused as children. Well, you know what? I was physically and emotionally abused almost every day of my life for 20 years. And I made a decision not to do not to do that to my family and make myself better. I think the bottom line is you make a decision. And once you make that decision, once you make that decision, you do what is correct. Yes, that's true. It's called breaking the cycle in so many words. That's the point. Yeah, there it is. And we'll find out the reason.

The fact that he's on crime and sports means that he didn't succeed 100% in breaking that cycle. Otherwise, we wouldn't be talking about him. His own advice eludes him. That's exactly what it is. In high school, he played football, baseball, and basketball. And he said, quote, I played well in all of those things, but I let it all go. My dad sort of made me let it go just to box. I boxed from ages 10 to 15, like, you know, actually in tournaments and shit.

My brothers were 9 and 7, and he made us fight for five years. After five years, he said we could quit. My brothers quit. So they quit. He kept going. He ended up uh he was bobby he's an honor student in school uh now he says he said he's on the list too he's a member of mensa here he says he has a 140 something iq and uh he was an honor student in high school

he claims he was accepted to rutgers arizona state and seaton hall those are very different places they really are he also says that he was offered an appointment to west point in partial payment scholarships um there that's awesome that's awesome and he said he did well in school a because he was smart and quote to bring home a b might result in a beating yeah so well incentive it's wild right yeah that's yeah so uh he says quote i was a straight a student i didn't know it back then but i was mensa material i didn't know what mensa was i didn't try out for mensa until in 1993 when i was 31 years old try out out. Went and auditioned. Go do some wind sprints. Get back here.

All right, you look pretty smart out there. All right, fine. Your suicide's a week today. It's a little weak. I'm not going to lie to you. I'd like you to, you're going to do some layup drills now. Let's do this. Come on.

Not sure if you're Mensa material. I'm not sure. I'm just saying. I'm not sure. Why don't you show your ass a little bit? We'll see maybe if you got a. Why don't you take down that third button? That's a Mensa kind of ass.

That's what we're looking for here. We're looking for that Mensa ass. He says, when I was 15, I was so acclimated to boxing that I was sparring with grown men, 24, 25, 26 years old. Many times I was 147 pounds fighting men 155 to 160. At the time, they were making good money fighting or what I thought was good money, $6,000 or $7,000 a fight. To me, $10,000 was a fortune.

I'm boxing these guys, getting them ready for a fight, and I'm handing them their head. They're not sparring with me. They're fighting to stay alive. When they got off their Sunday punch, I would just say, nice shot. I didn't mind getting hit. When I did get hit, nothing happened. I guess taking punches every day since you're four

is gonna toughen you up anyway you're not afraid of contact is he saying that he was a piece of shit because ten thousand dollars was a lot of money to him no he was saying that these guys that were boxing like he thought they were like these big giant guys because they made seven thousand dollars because back then to him ten thousand dollars would have been like the whole world right you know seven hundred000 they were making right? No no no $6,000 to $7,000 a fight He was sparring with lower level Yeah because $10,000 is a fortune

That's a lot of fucking money But it's also you know nowadays it's not really that much In terms of for a fight And then when you take the taxes and the monitor fee out And the training fee and everything You're left with $4,200 $60, $80, $40 Yeah exactly he says I'm boxing these guys i'm handing them their head uh he says quote

i don't want to die my name and accomplishments are in history books for eternity i'm immortal i don't think we've ever had a guy claim we've had a guy claim he's the president of the world i don't think we've had a guy claim immortality on our show yet um not small town murder people have claimed many that's a two three that's old hat they're claiming to be god they're claiming to be the devil they're claiming to be jesus they're claiming to be immortal it's a wild trope wait till you hear the bonus episode for that this week this guy claims to be the devil so that's he claims to quote transcend good and evil oh my i said all right fine that means that all right, then that's small town murder bonus, which you'll get access to if you sign up on the Patreon for this.

So anyway, yeah, I'm immortal. All right, then. He said that people told him that he could turn pro. He could be a professional fighter. And to him, that was interesting. He said, quote, I busted people up pretty bad, pretty quickly. I liked the way it felt. And I told my father, I want to turn pro.

Let me give this a shot so uh yeah anyway earlier than that he said when he was 10 earlier when he moved i just want to get a couple quotes and he said when we moved to wanock in the first week of september 72 i was 10 the very next week he took me to the gym in patterson he didn't ask me if i wanted to he said this is what you're going to do I said for how long he said until I say otherwise okay let people punch you for a while so yeah uh he said uh the thing is I was 15 years old I was beating on guys who were 28 and world ranked as pros the power I felt beating guys like that was like a drug to me and I wanted to carry on yeah yeah I would think so yeah that would feel good and you're you're earning this is the you're earning your father's praise right when you beat the shit out of somebody your dad says that a way to do it bobby rather than punching you in the face and a

child beating up adults yeah that's amazing yeah that's well i mean guys who are physical age doesn't matter because mike tyson was pummeling people when he was i know a guy my dad knew a guy he was over my dad's house for dinner once who was a boxer who had uh was sparred with mike tyson up in catskills catskills there with custom auto like i said it's all one big little thing here and uh he was a big motherfucker this guy too and he said this was when tyson was 15 and he said he fucking hit like cinder blocks like you were getting hit by a truck never been hit so hard in his life and it was a 15 year old hitting him so some people just have the torque and can do it and it's it's also an anger and it's an aggression and it's an it's letting go right you gotta let go and it's you know guys some people can do that and if you've been hit before and you're not afraid to get hit

back you don't mind letting go i think that's what it is guys like tyson and this guy have been hit a lot and he's giving it back and then you get to give it back right which that's great you get hit it pisses you off and you want to hit more so it's if you add some skills with that holy shit at home my dad hits me and i'm not allowed to throw another punch yeah weird here i get revenge time this is great absolutely so uh, he says that he looked into boxing and he looked into university and everything like that. He graduated sixth in his class at Lakewood High School. 350 kids in the graduating class. That's awesome. That's pretty good.

He says, quote, I investigated boxing and college. I was going to go pre-med at Rutgers, but I didn't feel I could do justice to both. And both in terms of boxing and pre-med at rutgers but i didn't feel i could do justice to both and uh both in terms of boxing and pre-med right yeah if you're learning important medical things and then having them punched out of your brain at night yeah it's probably not going to be great reversing whatever you learn whatever you learn yeah and you're going to learn how bad this is for your brain so that's not going to work my graduating class was all in alphabetical order and i think i still walked around the same rank yeah either way either way this w i think i still walked about the same rank in my high school either way i'm

bottom eight don't worry about it i'm not embarrassed not at all now he says that he also turned down an appointment to west point like i said and uh lou duva who is his future manager and uh he's been made a fucking jesus lou duva who is his future manager and uh he's been a fucking jesus lou duva's everywhere he's he was a vander holyfields guy awesome that was and then he was uh everybody jesus from the 80s lou duva's the short fat italian guy with white like a white pompadour in the corner yelling shit at you that's lou duva uh he's lou duva says quote i never found out how much of it was true about the how smart he was in the end we're marketers you need a story back then you could color outside the lines

i give a shit how smart you are it doesn't matter so as an amateur his career uh his record as an amateur was 22 and 4 uh he won the junior olympic state twice, which is pretty good. It's a couple of gold medals. He also won the East Coast regional title twice. He won the bronze medal in the nationals. And yeah, and this is like his story very much mirrors Tony Ayala Jr., who we did, who was a monster where Tony Ayala came up and he was a young guy fighting fucking grown men. They actually spar really at a certain point here in the early 80s, Ayala and Chez. Yeah. They just beat the living shit out of each other, basically, because they're both fucking animals.

So, yeah, people knew who he was. He would, like, lie about his age to get into certain tournaments and shit like that. He says, quote, they used to call me the white boy with soul. I fought more like he's basically uh he's uh basically like jason williams here he's that sort of thing white chocolate yeah he said i had a lot of rhythm when i fought i fought more like those guys did people still don't understand to this day what soul is i tried to explain what soul is to a couple writers who have interviewed me i tried everything i could to explain what soul is i finally came up with the following analogy and everybody seemed to get it okay took me years

everything i said keep coming up racist so coming up raising like shit i don't want to no that's not it you know how black people can dance real good right yeah but the way he describes it is a little uh it's not actually that way he says but it is at the same time he says if you watch larry bird play basketball he's technically correct everything is perfect his execution is correct everything is correct then watch michael jordan play you can't describe what michael jordan does it isn't technically anything you can put a finger on but that's soul the flat floating through the air with the grace that he has of making the impossible happen that soul which it's a it's a it's a improvisational technique is what he's that's more like jazz

than soul if somebody would have taught him the word athleticism it would have changed everything yeah yeah yeah absolutely but no i get that though that's that makes sense because there's plenty of guys who are athletic that don't play with any fucking soul i suppose fucking watch lebron play it's dull yeah it's dull he's great fundamental basic there's no soul to this game at all do fucking anything yeah oh he's amazing one of the best players ever but you look at you go i'd rather watch magic johnson run two plays and watch your ball lebron for the rest of my life i'd rather watch the same two magic johnson plays him running the fast break right fucking twice rather than lebrron for the rest of my life. Because it's fucking amazing and fluid and beautiful and different.

Also, when the ball goes in when LeBron shoots, you go, well, of course it did. Watch what he just did. When the ball goes in when Larry Bird shoots, you go, how the fuck did that just happen? Because it's fucking weird. Well, no, his shot is perfect. Like you said, it's technically perfect. It makes sense. But you didn't understand how Larry Bird had any athleticism that he sort of did in a weird way.

It's a bizarre thing. But yeah, I think I think it's a I think he's sort of getting the deal here. He says as an amateur here, he was trying to get on the U.S. Olympic team and then the U.S. Olympic team boycotted the Moscow Olympics. So that was a problem. But there he was on the national team who was going to go over to poland uh problem was he says quote i fell asleep at the wheel while he was driving and hit a tree and got a broken nose oh my god um he says that being polish and italian i wanted to go to poland to fight he says but the doc said the nose would break the first

time i got hit so i decided not to go basically i set it. You'll go over there and get it broken in the first fucking time. Your face is broken. Yes. You can't go get punched in it. Yeah. So out of the whole team, Sal Shenicola and Tony Tucker, who was a Tony Tucker, was a great fighter. Well, he got shitty at the end, but he was around for a long time.

Tony Tucker, Shenicola, and Bobby were the only three who didn't make it to weren't going over there to poland and uh luckily for him he didn't go because uh lot flight seven crashed uh yeah it crashed uh landing in warsaw into a military base oh my god and everyone on board died what 87 people died on the flight and it could have been him he was supposed to be there oh my god the doctor was like i wouldn't do and he's like i'll just stay home the best broken nose of his life lucky as fuck yeah uh he says quote i remember that day like it was yesterday my dad called me at home when i got off when i was off school he said remember that boxing trip to poland you were

supposed to go on i got ready for him to go hard on me and give me a fall. And then he said, quote, everyone on the plane is dead. People always joke about a chill going up their spine in certain situations. But at that moment with me, it literally did. I would say so. It should. Yeah, it was faulty landing equipment caused the plane to crash and explode. He said, my father told me, quote, they're all dead.

I almost collapsed. What do you mean they're all dead? The plane crashed 100% fatality. They're all dead. Then it hit me. I'm supposed to be dead. But I'm immortal. So fuck it.

He didn't say that part, but he said it hit me. I'm supposed to be dead. They're dead. What do you mean? Hey, remember when you were seven? Yeah. Holy shit. That's what happened to him.

Wow. That's so i could see you feeling like you're a little bit kind of yeah better have like a seth mcfarland vibe to you at that point if you i'm everybody knows the story but if you don't seth mcfarland the creator of family guy and all that shit he got he yeah he was supposed to be on the flight the first flight on 9-11 and there's a story him as the, he's on the phone bitching at the person who booked the flight because it was too early. Why'd you fucking book?

I said I wanted it later. Standing in the lobby of a- Standing in the fucking airport watching the plane hit shit on the TV and he went- Nevermind, I'm sorry. Thank you. Giggity, giggity. I got a good show to make. Giggity, giggity, giggity.

Let's have sex. Let's do it. Okay, it okay bye i gotta go mark walbert canceled that flight he was supposed to be on it too so i mean that's a that's a you you would feel sir holy shit am i glad i had those three extra drinks last night that made my alarm not wake me up i tried to finger a college girl thank fuck for that oh miss seth mcfarland who knows who he's trying to finger anyway so he's did i say girl we're never sure you know who cares i don't, who knows who he's trying to finger. Anyway, so he's... Did I say girl? We're never sure. Who cares? I don't care who he fingers. So he says about this, I love this guy, he's a quote machine.

Quote, I'm not a religious person. My mom is very old school Catholic. And when the plane crashed, she said to me, and I quote, son, don't you believe in God now? He let you get into a car accident and saved your life. And Bobby said, quote, you mean he killed all those people to make a point to me that's just bad math to this day she still believes that's what happened genius it's so something i would say to my mother i'd be like so they killed everybody to make a point to

me that's what we're doing here no i don't think so 87 families do you see how i'm not special this just reminds me of my child that it warms me a little bit. Because just the way he says it, he goes, like, a lot of people would say, I don't think God killed all those people to make a point to me. But the way we would say it is, you mean he killed all those people to make a point to me? Right. All right. Fuck out of here.

You know, everything is sarcastic. And even your mom, you're breaking her fucking balls. Sarcastic. So he decides to just go pro after this. We'll get off the amateur thing why not give it a go so he does it april 24th 1980 is his first fight and we will buzz through boxing matches unless there is something very interesting that happened or someone with a really funny name okay uh other than that there's so much going on here so april 20th 1980 it's at

ice world in tatawa new jersey ice world is an ice rink of course it is where people ice skate April 20th, 1980, it's at Ice World in Tottowa, New Jersey. Ice World is an ice rink. Of course it is. Where people ice skate. And then they put a fucking boxing ring over it and make a makeshift boxing center once in a while. But Bobby will become a very popular attraction there. He's a young guy. He's 18, 19 years old.

He's a young guy. He's pretty good looking. All the young Guinea girls all swarm there and like him and uh he goes by matinee idol and he's selling out the ice rink just because all these people want to see him he's a local guy you know it's it's interesting he fights hank whitmore in his first fight who is oh and two oh two and two coming in and will finish his career oh six and two so not a great fighter here just a sobering yeah oh that's not good i am terrible at this yeah uh they they uh he ended up knocking the shit out of this guy obviously and he goes to one and oh here with a tko next one's may 8th 1990 so he's going to start

doing them every couple of weeks like they do in the first year. They try to get 20 under their belt as quickly as possible because then you can make money once you have 20 wins. Then you can fight somebody with a name. Then you can space them out because you'll have money per fight. That's the thing. When you're making $200, which he did his first fight, he made $200. You've got to do them every two weeks. But if you're later on, when you make $175,000, you can take six months off.

That money stretches a while. And train. So May 8th, he's at Resorts International in Atlantic City. He is Mr. Atlantic City, by the way. He fights Jamal Arbubakar, who is his debut. And this fight goes all four rounds for unanimous decision win for Bobby. May 22nd, again, two weeks later, on the money. Again, back at Ice World, he fights Dalton Swift, who is 2-7-2.

I'll tell you how this one ends. TKO for Bobby. He's 3-0. Dalton, not so swift. They're lining up the tomato cans for this guy. And here's my favorite one here. June 19, 1980 at Ice World, he fights Roland Cousins, whose record coming into this fight is 0-20. Why do you keep going?

Why would you pass? 10 is it. You hit double digits and you still haven't won yet? It's over, bro. I don't give a fuck. Somebody needs $200. Even if you win your next 60 fights, you're 60-10, which doesn't sound great.

You know what I mean? It's just not wonderful. This will be his last fight. He gives up after this 0-21 career. He wanted one win. Just one to tell his grandkids how good it felt. If the house has 21, you may as well fold. Fuck it.

Fold. So this is a TKO win for Bobby here, obviously. Bring him to 4-0 July 17th, the next month at Ice World. He fights Bruce the Mouse Strauss. He fights, by the way, an ordinate number of white people yeah just an absolutely inordinate number of blonde men why do we think we're any good you know that blonde guy that boxed in the 80s and he i'm not saying he's a specific guy he's all the blonde guy where he had kind of the hair part in the middle kind of like that and when you hit him

his hair would puff up right like the knockout punch, his hair goes poof up in the air and he falls down. That guy. Yeah. That's who we're dealing with here. Every 80s villain. Yeah. He beats the shit out of the guy who falls from Nakatomi Plaza constantly. All the time.

Yeah. It's one of those deals. So this is Bruce the Mouse Strauss, which is not a real threatening nickname. But I'm impressed with the rhyming. That's all he could do. I mean, Mouse. What else do you nickname. No, but I'm impressed with the rhyming. That's all he could do. Yeah. I mean, Mouse? Sure, whatever. Bruce Levi? Yeah. Bruce quote Levi Strauss.

It's very important. What else you got? Comes clad in denim. Oh, the house? Bruce the shithouse? In the yellow trunks in the one corner there, we got this guy, and in the other corner in the denim trunks. Right. The cut-off denim jean shorts. We got Bruce Levi Strauss.

You knew. You knew it was coming. You knew it was coming. Second I said the yellow trunks, you knew. You knew the other guy had cut-offs on. You knew what he was wearing. Yeah. It's not even trunks.

No. They're all frayed at the bottom. They're cut-offs. He came right from swimming in the lake. He went on the rope swing before he came here. He didn't even just freshly cut trunks. No. They're all frayed at the bottom. They're cutoffs. He came right from swimming in the lake. He went on the rope swing before he came here. He didn't even just freshly cut them off. No. Those have been cut off a while.

Yeah, yeah. Not a lot of strings even left on those. It's just cut off. It's almost a hula skirt at this point. That's all. So Bruce is 32, 13, and 2 coming into the fight. He'll end up fighting. His career record will be 78 53 and 6

my word holy shit the mouse will take a beating apparently this is a tko in round four there's so many fights so many fights that's ridiculous if you think about that on average what do you think he made 300 bucks i mean at the most for all of those i don't know what level he got on the guys made a grand i believe he was he was European, if I'm not mistaken. So that's another thing. Do they got to pay to fly him out, or is that on his dime? I think they got to pay to fly him. So that's most of his purse.

He didn't make much money. No. Now, August 21st, 1980, he fights Leo Martinez at Ice World again. Leo's 2-4 coming in, 2-12 for his career. So he'll never win another fight here. This is a unanimous decision win for Bobby. So it's 6-0, September 18th, back at Ice World. He fights Johnny Davis, who is known also as Yaya Ali.

And he's a white guy, by the way. This isn't like a 70s, you know. His name is yaya ali um okay and see for me to be yeah he comes into the face he's like if i just give myself the last name ali maybe i'll be a better boxer nope is that that's all he did yeah worked for him no it's not quite all he did it's also the best in the world before that he didn't come into a fight with bobby with a 3 and 31 record like this guy three wins 31 losses fuck jesus tko win 7 and 0 for bobby october 16th 1980 back at ice world again oh baby it never stops the action never stops at ice world at best you get a black after you just lay down you just lay down and ice it that's it it feels

better yeah we don't have ice put your head on the floor now you got to put it up against the copper you'll feel the cold coming through don't worry about it's just that indoor outdoor shit it's real thin why you think everybody's wearing a fucking pocket in here what's wrong with you you fucking bums so he fights tommy marola oh i feel like there was cannolis being sold in the crowd that night. Holy shit. Between the two of them. This is a TKO win. Eight.

No. For Bobby here. December 18th, 1980. This is Christmas fight. Hey, back at Ice World. He fights Skipper Jones. No boy. Skipper.

You can't be Skipper. No. And fight. No. Skipper. That's Barbie's little sister. I was going to say, wasn't that the doll that walked on its own skipper i don't maybe i think skipper was the doll that was also barbie's little sister but oh okay maybe that's what it is then one of them i do somebody tell us a girl's toy

it was definitely a girl doll like a girl a doll who was a girl who was meant for girls right but there was a doll i don't like a cricket maybe that way i don't know i could see that it was like a fucking two and a half foot tall doll that walked on its own like a fucking blonde zombie. It was disturbing. I think it was called Emily. So does it. I think it was my own.

Yeah, that's what it is. They renamed it for the new generation. They renamed it. This is the My Emily doll. That's it. And it just stiff-legged walks at you. It's very weird. And talks to you and says fucking creepy shit.

Says weird shit. So the Skipper Jones is 4, 6, and 5 coming in. TKO win for Bobby, 9 and 0. Next is February 8, 81 at the Great Gorge Playboy Club in McAfee, New Jersey. That's where I see Playboy. Where all the hot Playboy action happens there. And it's fucking in Jersey. So he fights Danny Long, who's 18-0 coming in.

Oh. So this is 9-0 versus 18-0. Danny will be 31-7 for his career. That's great. That's good. That's a good career. He beats Danny Long with a TKO in the fifth round. Wow.

So it brings him to 10-0. Wow. 10-0, and he's ready for the big time. February 23rd, 81, he's at Caesars in AC. Yeah. Not Vegas Caesars. Not the good one. No, Atlantic City Caesars.

It's a shithole. Yeah. But still, this way, he's fighting Irish Teddy Mann. Very creative nicknaming there. Old Irish Teddy. Are there any great fighters, their nickname is Irish? No, they're fucking Irish. There hasn't been a good Irish boxer since the 1800s.

That's the fucking point I'm getting at. Once they invented boxing gloves, their careers died. Yeah, yeah. I know there's been a couple since then, but not a lot. No. It really hasn't been a lot. It's a joke usually. You guys came in and got

settled this is what fucking happens in america you come over here whatever group you are you come over here you get into boxing yeah and then as you get more into society you get less into boxing because you need it less well yeah middle class people tend to tell their kids to get punched in the face less often than if you're poor and trying to get out of that so that's the thing when everybody was poor like the chezzes you get the fuck in there and punch each other fight your way out yeah that's that's kind of how it worked here so yeah that's um that's why i didn't believe that creed movie at all no i wouldn't see it because apollo creed's kid would be a terrible fighter he would not be a good fighter he he's

not hungry his father is a fucking world champion. He's not going to come up fucking, I'm hungry. No, he's going to come up the first time he gets his nose broken. He's going to be like, I want to do video production. He's not going to fucking do that. His dad's rich. That's the way my dad died, too. That's the other thing.

I'm not going to do what my dad did. Fucking A. He dies? I got a weak neck. It runs in the family. I don't want to bleed out on the mat. I got a weak neck. It runs in the family. I don't want to bleed out on the mat. I got a weak neck, man. Let's see what's going to happen to me.

But I didn't buy that shit for a second. That's why Rocky's kid was a pussy in Rocky V, because he's a fucking privileged little shitbag. He doesn't need to do it. He went to private school. Yeah. Yes. He can't fight.

No. So he beats Irish Teddy Man in a unanimous decision 11 and 0 for him next on may 21st 81 man he's pumping him out ice world again he fights shotgun oscar alberato shotgun he's 55 8 and 1 though that's a quite the record this is a tko win for bobby there uh so he's doing very well he He's 12 and 0. People are starting to kind of become aware of him and starting to notice him. People buying tickets to see his fights.

And the Kathy Duva, who's one of the Duva clan there, she's the wife of one of the Duvas, she says about him, quote, he was charming, he was handsome, he had people swooning at his feet. Everyone loved Bobby. So that's what he's the world.

This is fucking oyster right now. I mean, literally, he's the king of New Jersey. He must feel so good. You know, it's weird, too, with boxing because it's got to be saying he gets a sausage and peppers free wherever he goes. Bobby, take over sausage. But come on on me. At least just the meatball. At least take a meatball.

Something. You're hungry. Take one home to the family. Growing boy. It's fascinating with boxing because he's now a draw and he's in charge. You know what I mean?

In comedy, this is what you do to be able to go do anything on your own. He's still, no matter what he does, he's still beholden to whatever's sanctioned and wherever he can go. And wherever he goes and whoever's in charge of it and whatever shady shit's going on there.

He still isn't making money for somebody else no matter what. Oh, yeah, he's still not making shit here. This fight, though, on June 18th here coming up, 1981 at Ice World, is for the vacant New Jersey state title. Oh, so it's going to be filled tonight. The king of New Jersey. And by the way, at this point,

I should have mentioned this earlier, he goes from welterweight all the way to heavyweight at the end of his career. He started out in the 140s. Then he moves up into the 150s. Fights kind of the most of his career in the middleweight section. Then it comes back as a cruiserweight in the 90s, which is like pre-heavyweight. What Evander Holyfield was before heavyweight. Then he moves up to heavyweight.

Is that 170 and up? Yeah, it's like 177, I think, is cruiserweight 177 yeah that's cruiserweight yeah because i'm the fucking i'm 175 right now yeah that i'm not fighting no those guys fuck you up that's the biggest 175 i've ever seen and those guys are like six two and ripped they're unbelievable yeah or stocky it's incredible tell. That's like at the end of his career, Roy Jones was fighting cruiserweight. And he looked amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was looking great.

There is a big difference between that and me. It's called genetics. Same size. We weigh the same. Let's put you next to each other and see what... What? How do you weigh that? Are you the same species?

What the hell is going on here bananas wow what happened to you can you make mine look like is there a medical problem this is crazy so here he fights reggie jones who's 16 7 and 1 coming in this round uh reggie cannot come out for the sixth round he stays in the corner really so the fight's over so uh bobby wins the vacant new Jersey state title. Got himself a belt. I think it's at Super Welter, I think, maybe, possibly. 13-0, this is for him.

July 26, 81. He's getting out of Jersey, doing what everybody does when they want to. Every mook in Jersey when they want to go on vacation. He's going down to Tampa. Yeah. You know. I'm going to go down to Florida for a couple days. Did he go to Tampa? I'm to florida for a couple days did he go to tampa i'm going to florida for a couple days i got a couple things to do down there and catch some sun you know what i mean we kick them roosters out of the street that

tampa's got running around this is at the sun dome in tampa yeah jesus he fights rick noggle oh okay so he's going for work noggle yeah he's not going on vacation but i'm sure he did plenty he's a guinea from New Jersey. That's where they go. 14 and one coming in for Rick Noggle. But Bobby knocks him out in the seventh round or TKO. Anyway, 14 and 0 for Bobby. So, you know, he's doing fucking great.

He's doing great. I figure this is a good time to get a Bobby quote in here. Just squeeze a Bobby quote in because it's fun here. It's great. Tampa's great. I fucking love it down down here the heat makes me feel good the heat beneath the gold chains on my neck i don't know what it is i just if the sweat that it builds up it's like it like it cleanses me you know what i mean the sun warms my chain it warms my chain you know it warms my chain. You know, it warms my bracelets and all my rings. I feel like I belong.

I feel like this is a place for me. When I'm about 75, I'll come down here. So he says this is about his life in general and about who he is. And when he sees this view of things, nothing to do with boxing. He says, quote, I have every kind of about his parents i have every single plateau in between both parents and both extremes i can be the nicest sweetest guy in the world or i can slit your throat and dip my sandwich in your bleeding neck if you cross my family hurt me or harm the people i love i have no compunction about it it was the way i was raised to see the world what i have never why

heard why did he go there he made it a french dip what the fuck is going on it's not jew my friend what are you doing i can open your head and fucking dip my fucking i'm gonna dip my veal parmesan cutlet hero in there. You don't know anything. I'm going to dip it. It's a little dry. You know, I need some sauce. I'm going to dip it in your neck hole. What a wild thing to say.

I'm going to dip it in your neck hole. Is that all right with you? I could be a sweetheart. You know that? Or I could do something fucking insane. Or I could take my soppercetta capagol sandwich and I could fucking dip it in your neck hole and get a little bit of, you know, because I forgot to get oil and vinegar when I had a make it. You know what I'm talking about? I can neck fuck you.

You have no idea how often I've heard people say shit like that. That's crazy. That's how that's that's Italian. That's Lucy. That's Italian. That's Lucy. Hey, you know, I could be the nicest guy in the world where I could cut your fucking head off and stick your kid inside your body head first so he comes out of your asshole like you give him birth to him. That's what I could do to you right now.

What if you're just nice? Okay. Nice guys don't say shit like that. But these are nice guys, Jimmy. Until you cross them and then they'll fucking kill you. until you cross them, and then they'll fucking kill you. There's a certain pride in the Italian culture in being like a nice family guy and a guy who's like a stand-up guy with your friends and a good person,

and then to be ready to kill someone at the drop of a hat also. There's something, if you can have both of those things, that's called well-rounded. That's a well-rounded Italian. That's the difference between white trash and Italian. The white trash would be like, I could be your best friend or your worst nightmare.

That doesn't tell me what that is. No, this is very specific. He's really painting a nice picture. I've never even had that nightmare. That's fucking crazy. Now I have options to weigh. Now I know what the choices are. This is helpful.

White trash. You don't want to cross me. I don't know what that means. Why? I know exactly what that means. Why? I know exactly what he means. Oh. And he said this very calmly. And in a way that he's trying to tell you how nice he is.

That's how he started out. Let me tell you what a nice guy I am. I'm so nice that I could also do this. Okay. I want you to know I've thought about it. Yeah. And I know exactly what I'm going to do to you. It's amazing.

If and when you're a piece of shit behind my back. You have no idea if you're not from back there. I keep saying that, but how much violence has currency? How much currency is in violence in our culture? It's just wild. And how much he's been exposed to that he knows the right route to take to let you know exactly how much of an asshole you are. This is how much I want to murder you. My opinion.

It's creative. This is how I want to murder you. And that's what happens when you don't pay me back. If I just killed you, who cares about that? But no, I need to make it so you understand how little I care for your life and how much that I am happy to do what I just did. If you don't return my lawnmower. If you bring my weed whacker back with the strings too short.

Just tap it on the ground. They pop out longer. That's what happens. Boop, and then they boop. Don't make me do it. What's wrong with you? What the fuck is wrong with you? You see.

I'll open your fucking neck. You see what you did. I got a sandwich right in my fucking hand. Don't make me. What a thing to say. Okay. Taylor Swift is soaring high. Her every move captured in the news cycle and devoured by her devoted fans.

She's broken billboard records and made Grammys history, not to mention becoming a billionaire in the process. But along the way, Taylor has had to wage war, first by taking on a very powerful, very famous manager, Scooter Braun, and then by going up against the biggest live events company, Ticketmaster. Hi, I'm David Brown, the host of Wondery's show Business Wars. We go deep into some of the biggest corporate rivalries of all time. And in our latest season, Taylor Swift will shake up not only the music business, but Hollywood and the NFL. Follow Business Wars wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen ad-free on the Amazon music or wondery app. Unbelievable. It's interesting. So October 8th, 81, he's back at ice world and he fights dancing. Dan Snyder, the dancer,

a mouse. He's really, he's really fine. By the way, he really is. He comes to the ring, uh, to the theme from fame,

by the way, it's exactly fame is his fame. I'm going to live for it. That's what he's, that's what he's coming to the ring to. so uh tko in round two here making him 15 and 0 november 12th 81 he's at the meadowlands arena yeah holy shit for a jersey kid hell yeah that's pretty new back then fighting billy ballet he fights elijah obed that night he's 86 12 and 4 coming into this fight fighter that dude has fought 102 fights that's an experienced motherfucker and 184 184 that's a lot yeah that's uh no no

one uh 104 86 12 and 4 oh he won 86 he won 86 yeah yeah okay we got one versus one gotcha sounds the same spelled different jimmy i got a sandwich in my hand don't fucking make me i swear to god i will dip it into your neck hole the name of this episode is i'm gonna dip my sandwich in your neck hole you know that's what it is that's the name of the episode the absolute hungerness yeah the hungriness bobby ches there you go hungry i have to write that down sandwich uh neck hole all right there we go okay so november 12th 81 is elijah oh bad this is elijah is dq'd in round six i don't know what the disqualification was for but he's disqualified so bobby wins 16 and 0 headbutt or something who knows they're uh i don't know this guy i don't know what the disqualification was for, but he's disqualified, so Bobby wins, 16-0.

A little blow on the headbutt or something. Who knows? I don't know. This guy, I don't know. I mean, he's doing all right, but I think Bobby's doing a little better, if you know what I'm talking about. So January 17, 1982 is the Tropicana Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City. Jesus. All the way down to glamorous Atlantic City.

Was that what Atlantic City was? Was it marketed and designed exactly after Vegas? East Coast Vegas. That's exactly what they wanted it to be. Yeah, just East Coast Vegas. It started out as like a boardwalk, you know, whatever. People come there for the health benefits. I'm tired of flying six hours to get to this fucking place. We got to get our money.

We got to fly six hours. Why do we want to do that? Why do I do that? Let's get one down in Jersey. No one cared about atlantic city though because it's gross it's gross it really is he fights robbie sims who is marvin haggler's half brother really marvelous marvin haggler's half brother yeah he's a good fighter too 12 and 0 coming in robbie is 38 and 10 for his career so damn not not quite marvin but he's pretty fucking good this is a unanimous decision win for bobby bobby chez not robbie sims so uh he says at, but he's pretty fucking good. This is a unanimous decision win for Bobby. Bobby Chez, not Robbie Sims.

So he says at this point he's having a hard time making the 160-pound limit for middleweights. He's growing. He was only 18, 19 when he started. Right now he's 20, so he's filling out. As he's working out and he's filling out just as a human being with normal genetics. So he's having a hard time here. He's maturing as an adult yeah exactly he said they were quote they were giving me water pills so i'd make the weight then after the weigh-in i'd rehydrate but there was a strength loss which makes sense the pills were debilitating by the fifth or sixth

round i was getting tired against mustafa i never fought at 160 again uh he so but you know his managers say that it's different his managers say quote bobby and his father were forever arguing over money with the duvas because he's gonna the duvas are managing him and he's gonna start fighting with them and it's all stemming from his dad trying to get into this whole thing and be bobby's manager to make a couple of bucks or whatever. So they said Bobby and his father were arguing over money with the Duvas. This is Ferdie Pacheco, the boxing analyst. He says it's a repetitive story in boxing.

You bring someone along. Then the father insinuates himself in the situation and says, I'm the boss. I make the decisions. Damn it, Mr. Culkin. Go home. Yeah, it happens all the time, Mr. Spe jackson how the fuck okay all right let me ask you this how the fuck is britney spears how do they keep her like that i don't know okay how many fucking crazy people are rich and are allowed to be crazy and rich and spend more money and do

whatever the fuck they want kanye west is allowed to walk the streets and i'm not saying oh making fun of his fucking mental illness. He has a mental illness, which is fine. And he should be able to walk the streets as anybody else with a mental illness, unless it's totally out there. But what I'm saying is, why is that okay? Whereas I don't know what the hell's wrong with Britney Spears, but we got to lock her up.

Why is she not allowed to enter into any legal decisions? You know what I'm saying? Lock her away and let dad deal with everything. There's how many crazy rich people are. there's a fucking so many of them how many rich people are there so many i think that's the number of shit rich people that like what the fuck are you talking why is she the craziest i see the one that we obviously it has to do somewhere behind the scenes and it's marketed that way on purpose to show to i don't know why they do that to us and i'm saying they but it's it there is something sick i watched it i watched dave chapelle explain how why he went to africa yeah it's essentially the actor studio it's essentially

that the that the monster the the whatever it is of people behind the scenes making money are so fucked up that they've got to try to create something that's awful to try to make you look bad, to try to bring it back, to try to make more money. And it's all about somebody else making money. It has nothing to do with them being sick. That's the whole thing we were talking about. Martin Lawrence snapping and doing that whole thing. Right.

With the gun. Yeah, yeah. And all that shit. And anybody that's ever quote unquote gone crazy, maybe they're not crazy. Maybe everything else is sick around them. Or they're as crazy as normal people are, but normal people don't have those pressures. I did read an article, too, about Justin Timberlake ruining her. Yeah, but, dude, I see people.

Look on your Facebook feed, and you will see people literally going crazy about their fucking office job where no one cares what you do. At the end of the day, you go home. Nobody bothers you. They can spend their money. They're not a pop star where everyone's always taking pictures of them and talking shit about them and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Not that that's a hard job, but I'm just saying whatever.

So obviously that's not the most come with everything. It's not the most important issue going, but I just see that and I'm like, what is she doing in there? Let her go be fucking nuts and spend her money. Who cares? She earned it. What do you give a shit what the hell she fucking does? Wouldn't that be fun to just be out of your mind and with a boatload of cash? Lots of people are like that. I would love that. There's lots of people,

especially musicians. How many crazy musicians are there that have a fuckload of money? Jesus. Nobody put Hunter S. Thompson in a fucking home and he was the craziest motherfucker alive. They didn't care. I don't get it. So anyway. Nobody locks up that Aerosmith guy and keeps him from changing his face every 12 days.

That's a good point. That guy's sick, too. No shit. Everybody's sick. Just let her be. That's what I'm saying. Leave Britney alone. Let her be crazy.

I don't care. And let Kanye be crazy, too. I don't care. Just make him shut the fuck up. Somebody put a cork in his mouth. Just don't ruin fucking, just don't do dumb political shit. I don't know just make him shut the fuck up just don't ruin fucking just don't do dumb political shit i don't care what you do if britney starts making political speeches i'll change my mind put it that way put her in a home in new orleans i don't give a shit i want kanye to go crazy and not go crazy but i'm saying like let loose talk about whatever the fuck you

want but don't don't push don't push people on a thing when you're having a breakdown. That's not okay. Don't encourage your enormous fan base to be as crazy. Or talk shit about Harriet Tubman. Maybe keep that. Maybe keep that one under wraps. Keep that to yourself, Mammy, possibly. She's kind of a hero. As soon as you start saying something bad about Harriet Tubman, that's when you go,

did I take my medication? No. Okay, I got to go do that. I clearly meant someone else. And we're not making fun of mental illness no if we are it's only because we're so fucking familiar with it and passionate about it being fixed exactly that's what it is and we're so kind of ingrained in it and everything else and we have lots of people in our family and ourselves and everything else so uh fun to laugh

at my own exactly that's what i mean that's how uh that's how it goes we laugh and come from where i come from you laugh at uh you know i'm gonna cut his throat and dip a sandwich in it that's what i mean that's how uh that's how it goes we laugh and come from where i come from you laugh at uh you know i'm gonna cut his throat and dip a sandwich in it that's fucking funny that's mental health so you know that's what i'm saying so uh anyway yeah he said about the father and all that chez says about that that's a partially fair assessment but let's face it my father wanted a fair shake for me an injury and i could be out of business if not him then who should be concerned well he's the one who's more most likely to injure you probably uh so may 23rd 82 he's at the tropicana in ac he fights bobby the ice man coolidge who is 21 2 and 1 coming in unfortunately

though his final career numbers are 21 3 and 1 this is his last fight. Bobby knocks him out in the fourth round, going 18-0. He's back at Ice World on July 3, 1982, facing Manuel Mellon, who's 13-2 coming in. He'll finish 13-3 because this is his last fight, too. Bobby retires two guys in a row. Good for him. That's Freddie McCruddle. Guys with decent records. Yeah, not bad at all.

Yeah, guys with way more wins than losses. Christ, the one guy was 21-2. Right. That's decent decent nothing to cry about no this is a tko in round two bringing him to 19 and oh then september 25th 1982 at the great gorge resort he fights chris linson knocks him out in the second round he's 20 and oh awesome that's when you get to you're gonna have some fights and that's when his whole life gets really turned around so grace 20 and 0 is impressive 20 and 0 is great that's awesome what they need you to get to to make you a contender because then you can put you can put them against any world champion against anybody and 20 and 0 looks like a good record and generally 20 and 0 means you've probably even if it's you fought a lot of shit

bags you've probably fought a pretty decent guy you've fought a couple good he has he's fought a couple now november 20th 1982 uh this is at the convention hall in atlantic city against mustafa ham show now ham shows a syrian guy he's 34 two and two coming in and this is a fight that bobby said he wasn't ready for before the fight he didn't want to take the fight lou duva offered him 125 000 for the fight i'll take the fight. Lou Duva offered him $125,000 for the fight. I'll take the fight. And he said, no, I had not taken the fight. I said, I don't want the fight. So then Lou Duva came back with $175,000 and he had never made anywhere close to that in his whole career.

Right. Cumulatively. So he took the fight at that point. Now, this fight ends up going the whole distance and he loses by unanimous decision god damn going to 20 and one uh so he says about it quote things weren't right for that fight with hashmo uh ham show first of all my manager gave me diet drugs to lose weight and then they took a lot out of me and in the second round i broke my hand which later needed surgery to rebuild oh fuck yeah that's whenever a fighter hurts his hand in a fight.

They're fucked. Yeah, it's so hard for them to do anything because you can't hit with the same abandon. And in the second round, this fight's over. You're shit out of luck. And he went the whole way. He lasted the whole fight. The whole way. He said, there's also pressure on me to win that fight, on that fight to win.

Hamshaw was a good fighter. Apart from Hagler, he had beaten everyone out there. I lost, but I learned a lot in that fight. He was far more experienced than me. And like Ray Leonard once said after he lost to Roberto Duran, I lost in the fight, but I learned how I could beat him. That's how it was. Yeah, he claims he injured his right hand early and he was weak for making weight. And Lou Duva says, quote, that's BS.

It wasn't the weight. It was Bobby. He could have beat Ham show any, that's BS. It wasn't the weight. It was Bobby. He could have beat Ham show any day of the week. Bobby just wouldn't fight. His head had gotten too big. You're in trouble when a fighter starts reading his own publicity material and believing it. So that's his manager. Bobby says, not true.

Quote, not true. The only material I pay attention to is attendance figures and Nielsen ratings, which makes sense. I pay attention to is attendance figures and Nielsen ratings, which makes sense. He says that his right hand required a bone graft from his hip, and it took 10 months to heal. So, yeah. And this, from what he said, this saved him from fighting Marvin Hagler, because if he had beat Hashem at Ham Show, he would have had to fight Hagler next. And he says, quote, I could have never beaten Hagler, don't get me wrong.

He was a superior fighting machine than I was, but I would also have welcomed the fight as it would have been a good payday to feed my family. Sure. Which is fair. But Hagler's a great fucking fighter.

Oh, fucking Hagler's one of my favorite fighters of all fucking time. I love Marvelous Marvin Hagler. His fights are just fun to fucking watch. It's a good name, a good name will fuck you up that hitman hearns haggler fight is watch it it's like a minute and a half long it's so they just it's like a movie where just two great fighters line up and punch each other till somebody falls

it's absolutely intense just rock them sock them fucking a hearns and Hagler, man. Oh, it's the best here. So Bobby and his father, they were still kind of working hard on their relationship and shit like that. Bobby's father would be sitting at ringside for all these fights and that sort of thing here. But he said as this went on, as he grew more prominent and the purses started to get bigger, that's when his father was now wanting more control over everything. Yeah. And we're talking about when he's an adult, he's doing this. Here's a quote.

The bottom line is that my father was a vicious disciplinarian. I was afraid of heights as a kid. He wanted me to climb a tree that was 35 to 40 feet tall. I was afraid. He said, climb that tree or I'll break your ass. I climbed the tree to the top. He asked, who won? You were the tree.

I said, I did, Dad. He said, you know why? You're more afraid of me than the tree. Now climb out of that tree. You know what? I built a tree house in that tree. I jump out of planes now. Fear was the only motivator.

What? You climbed a tree and now you can jump out of planes? He's not afraid of heights anymore. You're out of your fucking mind. Now he's not afraid of heights. He says that his father kind of was a self-educated guy. He became a district sales manager for the National Telephone Directory. So sales manager for phone books.

Aren't those free? I say, don't they just drop them off? And you go, why the fuck is this here? And you throw it in your recycling bin before it gets to your before you even take it a bunch of doorsteps go 38 sales today hey i did it if somebody brought the phone book from your front step into your house wouldn't you be like what are you doing why did you take that in my house throw it in the recycle bin outside sometimes my kids eat at the dinner table with us and this is the booster seat and we don't newspapers don't exist anymore to lay down for pumpkins we make them sit on these to eat dinner no shit the white

pages are thick they're thick i'll tell you he said quote i know my father was an alcoholic he never drank before five o'clock but he drank every day after five o'clock. He was a functioning alcoholic. So you get home from work and rip into it. Now, June 12th, 1983, Bobby says, when I lost, it wasn't a real, it wasn't really a problem for me.

I had surgery to rebuild my broken hand and I was ready to start out, start over. But before I did, let's see, I grown up in a house that was nearly always in turmoil. Many times, you'd know there was something wrong just by walking into a room. said life was easy and it can be damn hard sometimes my dad had his demons my father used to always say i would never kill myself except for two reasons one if

i were terminally ill i would never put my family through the emotions and financial torture two if you don't love me son not your brothers not your, not your mother, you. You're the only one. That's a lot of pressure. Yeah. Yeah, so that night they got in a big fight, apparently, Bobby and his father. Basically, his father tells him that he threw one of his brothers out of the house there, and Bobby then yelled at his father,

and they got into a big heated verbal confrontation. Robert Sr. told Bobby that Bobby was nothing without him at his father and they got into a big heated verbal confrontation robert senior told bobby that bobby was nothing without him and that without him he would fall flat on his face and bobby said that yeah you've helped me some but you know i don't need you going forward i could make my own fucking way and so uh at one point they are arguing arguing his father saying about you know you wouldn't be making money and and it's money, money, money. So he says to his father, quote, tell you what, keep all the money, keep everything. Tomorrow, you're dead to me.

I have no father. And he walked out the door. So that was it. That's a big fucking, big dramatic thing there. So, yeah, he did that. He came home a few hours later. Bobby did. Yeah.

And he felt bad about saying that. So he tried to apologize to his father. His father would not acknowledge him at all. Yeah. Wouldn't accept his apology. No, no, no. Well, no, he was. He just wouldn't accept his apology.

Wouldn't do anything here. So Bobby said, fuck it. Came up. I said he went to bed. This is June. So he turned the air conditioner on those window units on, you know, full blast here. And that was that. Went to sleep.

He said, quote, when we came downstairs in the morning, we saw his blood and brains all over the sliding glass doors. No way. I wanted to find the gun because I was going to shoot myself as well. My brother found it first and ejected the clip. Then my mother came down and called the police. After that, it's a blur. That's. Dad.

Blew his brains out in the living room because he said, you're dead to me. Yeah, that was that. I'm dead to you. I'll give you dead. I'll give you that. That's that's Italian spite right there. Wow. Guilt.

We're good at guilt when it comes. The parents are really good. I'll just be dying over here. Italian and Jewish are very Jewish, like grandmothers and mothers are very good at it. They're very good at it. It's amazing. I don't know what it is, but I think we all grew up in the same areas together. Can you get me a water?

Just a minute. I'll get it after this. I'll just drop it at night. I'll just die. And you know what? It's okay because I've lived long enough and you have a life. You have a life that you need to lead and that's okay and that's all right. I'm willing to sacrifice.

That's what they'll say. They're fucking crazy. And so this is the ultimate. And so he actually did. Actually blew his brains out. Probably going, this will get him. So, yeah. Now, Bobby's 21 years old, too.

He's not like he's a. That's horrific. That's insanity. Yeah. And they all found it. And Bobby's trying to shoot himself. And his brother's running for the gun, getting the clip out. So Bobby can't shoot himself. Imagine the's running for the gun, getting out so he can't

shoot himself. Imagine the mother and all this. They're going crazy. The one kid's trying to keep the other one from shooting himself to your husband's brains are on the sliding glass door. It's going to rain. So your jaw's a little sore. Yeah, there's a problem.

Jesus Christ. So now Bobby, at that point, he had a five year old sister because his parents are having kids. Keep going here. Think about it. When he's 21, they're only fucking 38. So he has a five-year-old sister named Maria. And apparently Maria asked him, quote, was daddy a bad man?

And Bobby told her no and not to discuss it out of the house. And he said that he kind of took care of his sister after that because she was only five. Yeah. and he said that he kind of took care of his sister after that because she was only five yeah he says quote i'll tell you what i came up with many many many years after the fact i think at the time my father was losing control of himself and he was afraid of hurting me or someone in the family rather than hurt us he took it out on himself instead of the ultimate cop out it was the ultimate gesture of love wow you really had to twist that thing into a pretzel to make it fit holy fuck man i'm more impressed that everybody in the house sleeps so soundly yeah not a single person heard window unit air conditioners i guess that's it nobody heard it yeah i guess so make that much fucking racket yeah they do and they rattle they make noises and shit yeah they're paying the ass and a muffle of gunshot

apparently yeah fuck man from from upstairs so uh yeah no i think that was the an act of fucking aggression is the way i look at that um now september 9th 83 is his next fight so he's fighting a few months later and uh his this after his dad goes though he kind of goes off the rails a little bit he starts boozing he starts partying more his dad isn't yelling at him to train and do all that kind of shit so now he's like oh ladies like me i like to booze i'm a popular guy also he's dealing with anguish he's dealing with anguish too that's the other thing so you add all that in and then that's the easiest thing to go to especially if you're famous and in new jersey and a bunch of people around you september 9th, 83 is at Caesar's

Palace in Vegas. The real one, baby. How about this? Holy shit. Oh, it's awfully dry around here. Where's the humidity? What's going on over here? It's so nice here. Jesus, I better slit open someone's neck hole because my sandwich is drying out. Look at all these pools. This is great. My sandwich is drying. He fights

Bert Lee, who's 23, 7, and 4 coming in. It stopped in round two, and that's 21 wins for him. 21 and 1, like I said, starts to booze it up, party it up, loves the ladies. Ladies like him.

He's having fun. Uh-oh. October 25th, 83, at the Playboy Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City. He fights the Italian Hammer, Bill Medai. Mm-hmm. Italian Hammer. Mm-hmm. He's 12, 1, and 2 coming in. TKO in round City. He fights the Italian Hammer, Bill Medai. Italian Hammer. He's 12-1-2 coming in.

TKO in round four. That's 22-1 for Mr. Chez here. February 15th, back at Ice World. Yeah. You know, I got to go home to your roots here. He fights Jimmy Schoolboy Baker. Real tough names. The schoolboy, the mouse, dancing.

Fuck. 9-7-1. Fights in a kilt. Fights in a... Yeah. Like the ACDC guy. Yeah. He fights in an English schoolboy outfit.

That's what he does. His little shorts. And his tie. Right. Fucking TKO win here. 23-1. May 30th, 84 at Harrah's Marina Hotel Casino in Atlantic City. Mark Frazee he fights.

27-3 coming in. Good fighter. Unanimous decision. Win for Bobby. He's 24-1. Now, this is interesting. August 1st, 1984. Lou Duva dumps him, his manager.

He's on a roll. It doesn't make a lot of sense. He cites at the time in the press that Bobby has a lack of gym work and desire among other things. And he kind of makes, he kind of makes allusions to like that Bobby's either into drugs or into something nefarious that Lou doesn't want a part of without actually saying it.

So he basically just kind of puts a, puts a cloud over his character without even making an accusation, which is, you know, not one of the greatest things in the world. Now, Chez says about Lou Duva, he was one of the best matchmakers, if not the best, and he could build you and make you a star, but he refused to pay. So Duva claimed while Chez fought under him, Chez made about half a million dollars in purses. And Chez says that's way too high.

Duva says, quote, We were marketing Bobby Chez says that's way too high. Duva says, quote, we were marketing Bobby Chez and getting good exposure for him. So when he talks about not enough money and collusion, he's crazy. So at this point, he said Lou Duva said a lot of bad things about him. He says, I was blackballed by the networks. People in the business believed what Lou Duva said about me and that caused some problems. From 1983 to 1986, nobody gave a damn about what I thought. Duva did his best to put little roadblocks in front of me,

but I persevered. Now, he's talking about networks want nothing to do with him for the next couple of years because of Lou Duva. That was August 1st. August 3rd, 1984, two days later, Bobby is arrested in his home. He's arrested in his home in Wannock. He's arrested by Bloomingdale Police and Passaic County Prosecutor's Office after a week-long investigation, which was going on two days ago when Lou Duva dumped him and said it was because he didn't train hard enough. Or Lou Duva knew he was about to be arrested and fucking dumped him beforehand, which is, I mean, I'm sorry.

Coincidences don't happen like that. Lou Duva didn't just go, two days before he gets right, this is the time I'm going to cut him right now. You know that guy that I got that fights 24 and one right now? You know that guy? Sells a lot of tickets.

Fuck that guy. I don't like that fucking guy. I'm going to get rid of him now because he's a bum. Right. Yeah, so two days later, so someone tipped off Lou to fucking, to what's going on here,

and Lou knew, and Lou knew he didn't want any part of him and whatever Lou said about him wouldn't have blackballed him with networks. It's what fucking Bobby did here that blackballs him with networks. He's arrested after a week long. Like I said investigation the indictment accuses Bobby

of breaking into a woman's home a 42 year old woman at 730 a.m. While she was alone. Then he says he hit her sprayed mace in his in her face and tried to handcuff her and sexually assault her what yeah this is uh she's in her 40s and she is the mother of bobby's girlfriend no yes this is way crazy. Bobby's breaking into his girlfriend's mom's house. Yeah. To like viciously rape her.

She was cut on the mouth and bruised on the shoulder as she fought back to get away from him here. As they were arresting Bobby, the assistant Passaic County prosecutor, John Lackey, told the press that he had information that bobby threatened to quote kill himself and others if he were arrested so he kind of went a little nuts with the uh with that he didn't uh didn't do too well here he's charged with the second degree burglary there and also attempted aggravated sexual assault which is uh not great that's a heavy one that's a heavy one here um the prosecutor said quote he committed a burglary once he got inside and came upon the female victim and attempted to commit an act of aggravated sexual assault this is fucking crazy um but his attorney says that bobby's not suicidal they don't have to worry about him he's not going to kill anyone basically because they they were like well

his dad killed himself last year so they were kind of looking at it like that and uh he his lawyer says bobby ches is the last person in the world i consider to be suicidal he's bright intelligent the antithesis of what people might expect of boxers he's a golden boy he's got his whole life and career ahead of him i don't hear anything about let's hope he didn't fucking try to rape somebody i would like to hear that first before you get this is all of course hinging on the fact that we really hope he didn't try to sexually assault a woman in no part of that did he say these are extremely serious allegations no none of that shit um so he's indicted on charges of aggravated assault and burglary the panel found insufficient evidence to indict him on the uh attempted aggravated sexual assault charge so

that ends up being dropped now his his lawyer says i know my client he has ties to the community and i think he deserves a personal recognizance bail i mean come on he deserves it uh no they didn't though they ended up uh releasing him uh he pleads innocent to all of this and he is uh released on a hundred thousand dollars bail that's which is not his own recognizance. Well, it's a serious fucking charge. And he's also placed under suicide watch before he was released. They wanted to keep an eye on him for 24 hours first.

So he's released on a Saturday afternoon. He said they don't know what the amount, if he did bond or what, on the bail. They're talking about they try to call Lou Duva to get a comment and they get no, he's out of town. But his son says, quote, we're shocked because it's totally out of character for Bobby Chez. We don't know any of the facts at all.

I consider him to be a good person and we're here to help and support him. Whatever Bobby wants, we'll provide. This is two days after they were telling, saying he was such a bad person. So it's pretty funny. If convicted, he faces up to 10 years in prison. I would hope so.

And a huge fine. So what does the silver-haired, middle-aged white man have to say about this? Let's talk about Lou Duva, whose hair is as silver as, I mean, it is just a silver mane. He talks about this. He says, I just got back from the Olympic Games. We spoke on the phone once while I was in California,ia and once after i got back he sounded a little a little down i think it's a shame about

the sex charges i think it was all blown out of proportion it could hurt his career there was never any doubt in my mind that he's going to be exonerated so uh yeah so this goes on in the courts but he's still fighting he's back at ice world in October 84, fighting Marvin Mack to a unanimous decision win. January 18th, 85, at the Summit in Houston. Oh, boy. He fights Tim TNT Brody, who is 14-2-1, and Bobby TKO's him in round four, making him 26-1. March 5th, 85, he has a match with Court. This is a tough matchup here in Court.

He has a match with court. This is a tough matchup here in court. Here he is pleading, and he has to say what he did and all sorts of shit like that. He does this. This is in Patterson, New Jersey. Bobby, in part of his plea, he has to tell what he did. He says he entered the apartment. It was July 26th, which was a week before he was arrested, intending to this is his words in court, quote, pin her to the floor or chair or anything where she couldn't move and threaten her to stay out of my life because she was screwing up my life.

He said that him and his girlfriend had gotten in a bad fight the night before, and I thought it was because of her mother. So he admits that he took a pocket knife and handcuffs to the apartment. This is not something you do. That's not how you tell somebody to stay out of your life. No. And so no one would recognize him. He also wore a ski mask and a running outfit. So handcuffs, knife, ski mask. Right.

That's kind of like nightmare fuel, right? That's what everybody's worried about that's what i picture uh that's what somebody breaks into a house so people get dogs and shit and guns and stuff for this reason right now so i have a nine millimeter while i watch yeah rock a love there you go so uh yeah uh he all it is charged that he sprayed mace into her face and then tried to handcuff her and that's when uh her mouth was cut we don't know if it was with a blow or the knife got her or something but there was a wrestling match apparently while he's trying to handcuff her uh yeah it's it's pretty wild here he said that he got into the

apartment with quote a key that i had that they didn't know i had that is terrifying and he said quote it's not right to go into anybody else's house when you're not invited, especially with a ski mask and a knife and handcuffs. Never mind when you're not invited. You didn't pop over with a coffee cake in your hand like, hey, I just want to see what you're up to. That's what I'm saying. It's one thing if you walked in like, you know, with a pizza.

That's a different say. I want to discuss some stuff. Let's talk this out together. Like a ski mask and a knife and some handcuffs which would make you i don't know shit your pants and try to jump out a window i think at that point so uh yeah he uh blamed the incident on his career pressures that's what he said he said quote there's a family misunderstanding that was blown way out of proportion i apologize to both my family and theirs for this embarrassment and the time and trouble it took to clear it up.

This is not cleared up. It's you're getting sentenced. He said they had broken off the engagement and, quote, hope to shortly be reengaged and hope to live happily ever after. Hope she'll take you back. How the fuck are you going to get married to a chick whose mother you fucking put a ski mascot and broke and assaulted you and maced and fucking beat you can't i feel like there's gonna be some objections at that does anybody have any yeah i don't know a little bit see the scar on my face yeah i don't recognize i'm not the ski mask so i'm gonna go out here fuck so the prosecutor's office rejects uh bobby's lawyer's proposal for a pre-trial

intervention program that would have led to the dismissal of the indictment. Instead, under this plea agreement that he adopted, Bobby pleaded guilty to a charge of third-degree burglary. He waived the right to an indictment and jury trial on the new charges for the plea that's part of it. And let's see here. Otherwise, the agreement called for a dismissal of the second-degree burglary indictment, Otherwise, the agreement called for a dismissal of the second degree burglary indictment. And the prosecutor agreed not to make any recommendation on sentencing, not to try to tell the judge to put him in for 10 years or something. However, though, the agreement allows the victim to comment by letter or in person on the sentencing. So the victim can do it, though.

They said the victim's been in constant communication with the prosecutor and she was in agreement about the negotiations. Quote, she is in full agreement with it. The victim and her family were not looking for any type of revenge. This is what the prosecutor saying. Quote, what they were looking for, frankly, was some kind of acknowledgement by the defendant that he had done something wrong. Please say you broke in and maced my mother. Right. Just admit it.

Jesus Christ. you broke in and maced my mother right just admit it jesus christ could you just tell the tell the tell that guy in the robe that you're bad yeah that's all just go yeah did a bad thing right so uh may 9th 1985 south mountain arena west orange new jersey he fights mike fisher 17 and 60 you see why people wouldn't want him on network television that's why he wasn't on not luduva possibly so uh kind of a bad look it seems like mike fisher here's the unanimous decision win bringing him to 27 and one and when there's a list of uh every fighter has like this interview they do with a bunch of fighters and they ask best best fighter you ever fought best feet best this best that best punch all the superlatives of fighters he fought mike fisher wins for the best chin category and uh he says quote my hands were hurt for weeks after hitting him mike was just a really

tough fighter you could hit him with a baseball bat nothing would happen i hit mike with a four punch combination broke his nose split his mouth open he was splitting blood all over the place after i was done mike, I missed that one. I turned around and thought he was talking to someone behind me. The guy was crazy, but a good fighter. So there's that here. He's trying to reset his career here, the whole thing. Yeah, he says that he came to a low point here in his life emotionally.

Personally, yeah. But physically, he was doing great. July 26th, 85, at the atlantis hotel casino in atlantic city he fights murray sutherland which sounds british yeah because he is british that's the point 46 12 and 1 coming in though so he's beaten some other brits a lot unanimous decision win 28 and 1 uh there now before the next fight, there's a lot of publicity because it's a big fight, the fight he's going to fight next. There's a lot of publicity about his trauma and his dad killing himself and all that sort of thing. He says that there's been some personal as well as professional trauma in my life. But my father always said that young men were like a blade being honed for a sword they have to be hardened and tempered it's part of a natural building process that everyone must go through on the way to maturity and then he shot himself to spite you

to spite you what the fuck um he says in many ways he was my mentor from when i was a baby i was carrying out his dream of being a fighter trying to do what he could not do when he passed away he left a little cavity in my heart and i'm still trying to fill it yeah he says that like his dad had cancer and was a great guy right and didn't abuse the whole family he was a horrible man who shot himself to spite you to spite you in the living room so everyone could find him nice job he did it didn't even go out in the shed or something like a fucking decent human being under the cover of window air conditioning so that when you wake up to make bacon in the morning you find this brain so jesus christ the next fight's a title fight yeah and uh it's slobodan kachar who was a 1980 gold medalist actually which you know

u.s would have participated and planes wouldn't have crashed maybe he would have fought that guy so this guy's a 21 and 0 fighter coming in not too shabby uh finishes his career 22 and 2 so not too far after this now uh they're asking bobby about him and he says bobby says quote all i know is he's a stan he's a very europe European stand-up boxer who lacks the American soul, if you will. Oh, boy. Here he goes again. I'm going to put pressure on him, test his chin, test his heart, see what kind of man we've gotten there. That's what he says.

And he knocks. It's a TKO in round five. So Bobby wins the fight, bringing him to 29-1. This is at the Las Vegas Hilton it's for a title so he's winning a belt in Vegas now now you feel like a fucking boxer when you win a belt in Vegas

next December 26th, 86 at the South Mountain Arena in West Orange he fights David Sears nothing interesting there this is David Sears' last fight because he's knocked out in the first round never fights again that's 30-0 for our guy here, Bobby.

Now, Bobby, February 21, 87, at the Trump Plaza Hotel in Atlantic City. He fights Willie Sandman Edwards, who's 22-2-1, knocks him out in the second round. May 3, 87, Convention Center AC, he fights Diamond Jim McDonald, who sounds like he's sent by a company to force African children to pull diamonds from the side of a fucking mountain. Does he not? Yeah, they had to make him sound flashy with a name like Jim McDonald. Diamond Jim, I am. Fucking.

Jim McDonald. Fucking ridiculous. 20 and 3, he is coming in. And Bobby knocks him out in the sixth round. And he says, at this the sixth round and uh he says at this point bobby was he says quote this is 87 he's 25 years old i was like a huge snowball going downhill i could not see over or under or through it i had to crash i had the loss the surgery then my father passed away i had weight problems managerial problems mono quote a minor scrape with the law but i kept fighting you

no he had mono too mono in this point yeah uh i was still active but uh but and now i'm back basically i had everything thrown at me and i handled it adversity tragedy lost either these are things that develop character and let you know what you're made of there's nothing more than you can throw at me and now i'm a champion it's something to be proud of okay that's fine he's a champ give him that and next october 29th 87 he fights at the las vegas hilton prince charles williams who's 21 4 and 2 coming in and uh they're uh they uh he's already fought charles before i'm sorry this is the first time he's going to fight him later on this fight is uh stopped in the ninth for a loss when there's something wrong with bobby's eye it puffed up and the fight stopped it's not bobby's decision they they closed so the referee stops the fight

so uh he protests the loss bobby does but nothing happens there bobby's mother was crying in the corner after the stoppage wanting to know that he wasn't hurt as well he's 32 and 2 he says quote i think i over trained for the williams fight i overdid it and i think i left my fight uh in the gym that fight cost me at least a million dollars for a next fight now 1988 let's talk about some women he was engaged back in 83 we know how that ended didn't go well didn't go fucking well. That's a definite way to end a relationship. Well, one relationship he moved and then I went out with this other guy and he put a ski mask on, broke in, handcuffed and had a knife to my mother and tried to sexually assault her. So that didn't work out.

And then this guy just didn't click. So then he says, quote, I was engaged in 1983 and then in 1988 the first time i knew i wasn't i wasn't going to marry the girl but my dad just had just killed himself i guess the girl with the other one there i broke up with lou duva and had a major surgery on my right hand my wife my life was in i was just trying to fit in somewhere. Then I met a girl who had finished runner up in a pageant. Oh, no. Here we go. Here we go. Runner up.

Yeah. She's not feeling that great about herself, but she's still pretty fucking hot. Yeah, but if you tell that girl she got a nice ass, she's in your corner. Cheer up, sweetheart. That's what he's coming and doing. Listen, they didn't like you, but guess who does? Hey, listen to me. Me.

You're number one in my heart, sweetheart. You know what I mean? That girl doesn't have shit on you. My book, you're number one. She's fucking hideous. Look at her. She's ugly. She's got a big fat ass.

Not even a good fat ass. She's a fucking pig. It's a dumpy fat ass. It's a fat ass. Look at yours. It's all round. This is beautiful. I want to chew on it.

So he says, she was a sweet girl, very pretty, but her family was wonderful. So wonderful I ended up inviting her mother and dad and her brother and sister-in-law to my wedding. Again, to somebody else. Oh, okay. I was like, well, that's what you do. Yeah. Her family's so nice. I'd like them around when I marry the daughter.

I'd like them around when I marry the daughter. It's kind of nice. They're so nice. When we got married, I said, you know what? Invite your parents. Why don't you go ahead and invite your parents? I don't know. I married a daughter. It's kind of nice. They're so nice. When we got married, I said, you know what? Invite your parents. Why don't you go ahead and invite your parents? I don't know. I'm feeling good.

I'm feeling generous right now. You're great. I love you. Your parents are nice enough. Your brother? Ah, Christ. Don't push it, sweetie. All right, fine.

Your brother can come. Bring his wife. Get his wife. Oh, for fuck's sake. That's four plates now. Your mother, your father, brother, and a wife. That's four plates. That's a lot of plates.

I'm going to have to get veal. 80 bucks a wife. It's four plates. It's a lot of plates. You're going to have to get veal. 80 bucks a head. That's a lot. That's all I'm saying. Says I still talk to the family to this day. Now, before his next fight, he says that a loss would be a serious setback for me, but I'm not looking for a loss here. He's talking about his next fighter that he's fighting. Andres is his last name.

Andres is an awkward fighter, but he's getting up up in years i don't foresee any problems at all so i always viewed myself as a fighter with limitless or with limited ability but a lot of potential because of my desire i'm not perfect i've been beaten by lesser foes i don't consider mustafa ham show uh and charles williams great fighters but they both caught me on less than my best day. I want to keep fighting until I'm 30 or 32. And then he says that if I won the lottery and got a million dollars, I would still fight. I love what I do. Okay.

No fucking way. Well, here's the thing, man. A million dollars ain't shit. And in 1988, you can just get a good fight and you'll make a million dollars. You don't even have to hope for the lottery. Don't buy tickets, man. You're wasting your money.

Wasting it. So May 22nd, 88, at bally's and ac he fights dennis the hackney rock andres he's from hackney uh 30 and seven he is uh coming in it's a split decision and a loss oh no for bobby which is strange he says that quote the andres fight i was sick but I went through with it as it was a $75,000 fight and I needed to feed my family. Prince Charles Williams just had my number. It was frustrating. It was a frustrating time, but I thought one day I still have something left and I wasn't just done yet. I was out only from summer 89 until early 1990. So that's later on october 25th 88 resorts internationally fights leslie laventiel

tiger i don't know 26 and 3 uh stewart is his last name split decision win this time so he's 33 and 3 now this is a time when every time there's a a fighter uh a white fighter who's not terrible yeah the people go crazy back then oh boy and he always hated the great white hope bullshit he said he said as a matter of fact he says quote a quote i understood the great white hope bullshit uh because that surrounded me all the time they asked me if i considered myself a white hope i said listen i'm white and i'm hopeful but not for everybody else for me so no i'm white and i'm hopeful but not for for everybody else. For me. So, no. I'm white and I'm hopeful, but not for everybody else. Fuck everybody else.

For me. It's for me. Yeah, I used to joke about it because if I beat everybody in the world who is black or Hispanic or white, that doesn't mean anything other than I did the work. Rocky Marciano beat everyone who was white, black, or Hispanic. It didn't mean anything other than he was a great fighter. Yeah. So, December 27th, 1988, he fights Mike DeVito, beats him in seven rounds.

1989, he meets a woman named Kim. Talk about her. That'll come up more. March 4th, 89, he fights Quick Silver Virgil Hill, who's a goddamn good fighter. And all of his list of bests, Virgil Hill is like best feet, best hands, fastest fighter. He's like the greatest fighter he fought. He said he was so hard to hit. He's 23-0 coming in, Virgil Hill is like best feet, best hands, fastest fighter. He's like the greatest fighter he fought. He said he was so hard to hit. He's 23-0 coming in, Virgil Hill, too.

He's an up-and-comer. This fight goes all 12 rounds for a loss for Bobby. Unanimous decision. 34-4. He's got a rematch with the Prince Charles Williams guy coming up here. He says, this will be the fight of my life. There's no other way to put it. This is Bobby. He says, beat charles williams or else i retire i can take my ups and

downs with anybody but i feel there's no way i can duplicate or no way he can duplicate what he did to me the first time if he's able to do that to me twice and it's time for me to retire he says uh you know i had some physical problems for other fights he was in now i'm back to prime time form i'm feeling good again. I've got the feeling again that I can beat anybody. And I have the strong feeling that I can beat Charles Williams this time. I'm just glad I have the opportunity to get Williams back. After you lose to a guy once and complain about a call, people think it's sour grapes.

I have the chance to prove it wasn't and that he's in it for the fight of his life. I guarantee you that. So, June 25th, 1989 in Atlantic City. Prince Charles Williams rematch. And it has stopped in around 10 and uh he loses the fight again so 34 and 5 to his credit he announces his retirement after the fight what he said he was going to do and uh he says he's retired he's not but he says he is and there's articles in the paper i found in the courier courier news in new jersey an article called past champ trains for life after boxing oh and it's him in a suit like hey how you doing standing there and uh it's a place called la cucina restaurant on west main street

here and uh bobby chez is the maitre d here oh. Oh, boy. Because he says he's learning the ropes. It's a friend of mine's business. He says, I'm learning the ropes so I can open my own restaurant. That's what I'm going to do. So I'm going to hang around here, and they're letting me learn the place. He says, it's a tough business, but it's a people business. And he says, and I like people. La Cucina?

La Cucina. I like to punch people. That's one letter away from La Cucina, which is gross in Spanish. Yeah, well, La Cucina, there's restaurants called that all over the place. Is that a thing? Yeah. Really? Yeah, it's Italian.

All right. What does it mean? Not gross? Yes, Jimmy. Not gross. No jizz in it is what it means. He said him and a partner of his, Nick visco uh are looking to open a restaurant and uh in the next three to five months the food will be continental with italian specialties he says

and the marquee is going to have his name on it be his restaurant here that's right he says uh you can't wait you know he'd like to have that kind of atmosphere that he likes he says i'm setting up my future no sense wasting all those years of hard work or blood and sweat and blood in the gym he says uh uh you know he wants to do this friend of his who run the manager at the restaurant says he picks things up right away i tell him something once and he knows it i trained a lot of people and it's not that way with everyone you know that's how he said it too he picks things up i said oh people come in oh, people come in. You sit them down. Now he stands there. They come in.

He sits them in a chair. Puts them right in the fuck. Some people, they go, hey, I don't know what I'm fucking doing. You know, hey, what are you doing here? You want to use the bathroom or whatever? He's like, no, I'm gonna put him in a fucking chair. That's what I do. Does it mean that?

He knows. Does it mean pick that plate up? He picks it up. He picks it up. He did it. Now he's a major. So he described himself. Bobby says that he's, quote, a big sponge right now i'm a big

fucking sponge i'm soaking up everything i can i got neck blood i'm soaking up i got fucking marinara sauce i'm soaking up he says that uh yeah he says he would like to box again but he uh you know it had the price would have to be right basically here he says i miss the roar of the crowd i miss the people chanting bobby bobby i miss all of it the lights the camera tv performing i miss all of it every bit of it so 1990 in march he's back yeah showboat casino atlantic city he fights uriah boss man grant goes all 10 but he wins it so 35 and 5 1990 gets engaged to kim that he met earlier june 1990 convention center atlantic city he fights boxing andrew maynard okay yeah boxing one the boxing andrew maynard there must be another one that's really famous i'm gonna name myself joking james petrogallo when i go on stage for comedy

yeah motherfucker of course that's why you got a microphone that's why you got gloves on dude we didn't think you were the fucking concession guy. You're wearing boxing gloves and you have no shirt on. And jean shorts for some reason. I don't know how that happened. Boxing. So he's 12-0 coming in boxing. He's been boxing.

Knocks him out in the seventh round, Bobby does. 36-5. September 1990, Taj Mahal AC. He fights, who cares? Some guy, it doesn't matter. It's a TKO win in the sixth round, 37-5. Now, his next fight, Bobby says that Bob Arum, who's crooked as anything, allegedly, signed him to fight Daniels for $225,000.

Arum told Bobby that he would have to cut his purse to $185,000, but would give him $40,000 in tickets. What? Like a like a bringer show. Right. Like he can sell $40,000 in tickets to sell. No, bitch. I'm a fighter. I'm boxing people. What am I going to fucking go out and stand at the door and collect the money? Sell

tickets to people. You're going to give me tickets and I got to walk around and sell them? It's ridiculous. So he says, quote, so you know what Aram does? He calls the newspapers and tells them it's ridiculous so he says quote so you know what aram does he calls the newspapers and tells them he gave me the tickets i didn't know that until i went to sell them and they say well you got them uh you got them for free i had to tell them that i made a deal with the casinos to sell the tickets at half the price for the high rollers so at least i got half oh my god he's got it so he got fucked up actually has to go buy ticket he has to sell tickets and he only got half the money for it even oh that's the worst that sucks he got actually do

that oh they do it all the time boxers i've never heard of it before i assume and maybe the lower levels but not when you're in a casino fighting on television go get your cardio and run around the block and sell these that's what i mean hey, you want to see me fight later? Hey. So March 8th. I swear to God, look at me. I'm running. March 8th, 91. He's at the Trump Taj Mahal in Atlantic City for the WBA cruiserweight title. And he fights Robert Preacherman Daniels, who's 19, 1 and 1. And this fight goes all 12 rounds.

It's a split decision win for Bobby. So he wins the cruiserweight title this is back in the higher weight class and then he decides after that to marry kim all right 1991 he gets married july 1991 oh man how much do we go over of this because this is crazy okay this is almost like a whole separate episode on its own but we'll get over it quickly uh there's a guy who carlo uh carlo deulius is his name uh he's known as carlo d everybody calls him carlo d now carlo d came on to help bobby out with management and promoting after lou duva left and his father killed himself in 1986 okay now um what ends up happening in 1991 well let's let's catch up on it here uh he this is what bobby says we worked out a deal and it was okay carlo was with me when i first won the

world title and became international boxing federation light heavyweight champion but i'm sure i lost some revenue because of his lack of experience in the promotions here. Now, what he ended up doing is, over the course of this, this guy is all sorts of hooked in with mobsters, as we'll talk about from a federal trial at Sammy. The Bull Gravano testifies. Oh, no. Yeah, this guy is all sorts of deep. This is the thing that is a thing.

I know it's a stereotype, but it's really hard to be involved in anything back there, especially in the 80s and early 90s and less than the 70s and 60s, but still huge in the 80s and 90s and not have the mob somewhere in your fucking business because it's just the way it was. And especially in the entertainment area and especially they have cash to put up for training, for things like that and so the 80 85 as we'll hear from sammy the bull is when john gatti decided or 86 is when john gatti decided that they wanted to get the gambino family back into boxing because the purses were becoming so big really there's millions of dollars in purses like if we manage one of these fucking guys it's our guy we get you know this chunk of that it's a big chunk of money is that what they're fucking legal yeah you you buy it's they buy restaurants or buy a piece of boxer you buy that you're in illegal businesses too yeah

diversify your deal here uh so what he did is this carlo d apparently um they had told the u.s district judge here that he uh that he lied to officials of three banks in order to obtain loans and then gambled the money away oh you asshole yeah they said he told the bank's money was being used to promote bobby chez boxing matches as he was his manager uh but instead uh and he and uh and the banks knowing bobby chez was a championship boxer gave him the money expecting to be paid back from the substantial proceeds from the matches but instead of using the money for seed money, Carlo D spent it on personal and business costs. It's fair to say he used the money to fund a lavish lifestyle,

and he was apparently a very heavy gambler, they said here. They also says Bobby Chez had nothing to do with Carlo's business affairs. He was just managing, promoting him. Yeah, so he said uh what is this um yeah oh jesus christ they're talking to bobby about it and he's talking about coconut shrimp interesting here so bobby says that uh uh that uh it was nothing for this guy to spend ten thousand dollars a day at the track this carlo d guy so that'll get you no matter what he says that was the first indication

of problems i think i think those problems he couldn't get uh get out without a big hit so uh they split up in late 1987 and bobby says he really couldn't bring to the table the things i needed he couldn't get the money or the financing but we split amicably i still like him but i wouldn't lend him money uh they said all together he stole altogether he defrauded a bank of about $2.2 million in loans and checking account overdrafts and also defaulted on $200,000 in loans from another bank and $50,000 in loans from a different bank. Does that fall under his umbrella? Not on Bobby. Oh, thank God.

It doesn't fall on Bobby. They said he wasn't involved. This guy was just using his position to say that that's what he was doing. Carlo D. faced a maximum of 12 years in prison. Bobby said, I had to see somebody who had so much, let the disease of gambling get the best of him. He lost everything, and that's sad. I'm sorry for him. I'm also sorry to see my name get dragged through the courts.

The whole thing is just kind of tragic. Not really tragic. It's really pretty much this guy was in deep with the fucking mob as we find out from a see that typeface and all that that's from federal court documents there that's pretty that's pretty official looking there that's not my handwriting or my typing on the computer uh this is a copy a pdf of this uh carlo d they said it's better known as a restaurateur and a boxing promoter uh he operates the meeting place restaurant at the time a hangout for organized crime members and associates

he promotes boxing exhibitions under the corporate name of carlo d enterprises a friend of his for 20 a friend for 20 years of andrew lucari of livingston who's you know who he is he's a crime associate he became active and that's the lucasies are who that's who he is he's a lucchese crime associate he became active and that's the lucchese's are who that's who he's involved with yeah so well that's who yeah that's who i never mind yeah so anyway yeah he uh he became uh active in professional boxing from an early fan of boxing of boxer bobby chez in whom lakari subsequently bought a financial interest. So Bobby Chez, whether he knew it or not, Carlo D was just a front man for this Licari guy to buy an interest in Bobby Chez, basically.

This was a way for the mob to get into this here. After a stint as a Jersey licensed boxing manager, he became a licensed promoter in June 1982 and also became a licensed matchmaker and uh yeah now uh the ham show fight that was a thing here they talk about this uh carlo d recalled a promotion he arranged through uh alfred serda miso more widely known as al serdo who's a famous mobster uh i don't know if he's famous but back east he's famous a sycocas taylor uh a genevese crime family associate serdo was a self-described booking agent for mustafa ham show that's why they are insisting

that he fight him remember that's why luduva kept coming back with more money right and gee wonder how luduva would have known of an ongoing police investigation that was going to happen two days later if only he had a connection to the police departments, like a mob guy. So anyway, well, alleged, I'm just saying. Just seems to work out. Seems to work out great here. On August 16th, 1984, Hamshaw, only two months before he was to battle

Marvelous Marvin Hagler for the world middleweight title at Madison Square Garden, appeared at the Ice World Arena for an exhibition of sparring with little-known boxers under the auspices of Carlos D. Enterprises. Carlos D. Enterprises. Then, Ham show wrist injuries that might have affected his performance in a championship bout worth hundreds of thousands of dollars to him suggests the influential clout of organized crime figures with whom he was associated.

At the Tatua event, D. was observed in deep discussion with serdo during uh uh during which he handed serdo a packet containing two thousand dollars so uh yeah he's playing the boss and this goes on and on and i figured i'd just give you the tip of it i mean it's a it's a 50 page document of all thick shit of what's going on and we haven't even got to sammy the bull yet right who comes in and testifies about it really this is what i mean yeah uh august 9th 1991 he fights uh mr president he calls himself bash ali mr president okay all right i think that's enough yeah mr bash that's great mr president you don't need it so all 12 rounds unanimous decision win for bobby next he's in the rivera riviera in vegas may 892 he fights golden boy donnie lalonde oh who is 35 and 3 this goes all 12 again but a unanimous decision win for bobby march 1993 he still got his title by the way that he won so he's got this

title march 1993 he is hit by a car oh no Yes. He said he suffered a mild concussion, strain, lower back, bruised ribs, bruised hip bone, tendonitis in his right wrist and shoulder. Spent a bunch of time at the hospital and all this. Yeah. He said he was at the home of his buddy, Tony Paglucci, who works in his training camp. When a car pulled into the driveway, the driver had to turn around a pile of snow five or six feet high and pulled in too quickly. He skidded on the ice and plowed into me.

He said, I was in the hospital for a long time. I had needles in my spine. I had injections of Botox. I had a clip on my, I don't even know, muscle and try to train again. I shouldn't have done that, but I decided to take the chance. Even when I came back, I wasn't right. Okay, we'll talk about that. Now, his marriage, he talks about here. here he says my mom was special to me i patterned a lot of my expectations after my mom

she's a loving caring wonderful nurturing person my mom was drop dead gorgeous kim was a month his wife kim was a model drop dead gorgeous too with the morals of a saint on our first date she told she told my mom you must be a saint the way your son talks about you he she he introduced his date on the first first date to his mom that's nuts this is my ma so okay let's go have dinner and then right after we're gonna meet my mom i should be cooking the dinner that's how you're gonna meet him was everything i was i i was ever promised the problem was i spent so much time chasing what i was told i was supposed to look for i got exactly what i wanted but i wanted exactly i wanted what i wanted wasn't exactly what i needed believe it or not from 1989 when i went

kim until 1993 when my daughter mercedes was born i was actually faithful i had my issues with wanting sex two or three times a day and about 18 months after the birth of my daughter, I was at the point of a little crazy. So he had some issues. She said, maybe we should spend a little time away from each other. I said, my ass already left. I want to catch up to it. My ass already left. I want to catch up to it.

The look on her face was like I had shot her with a bullet. He moved in with his friend for six months and then moved back in so he moved out and moved back in april 1993 is the senate investigation the united states senate not like even a state thing where sammy the bull is on his testifying tour here uh so they talk about this is about a guy named james buddy mcgirt who was co-managed by uh gambino associates basically they talk about that sammy the bull discusses how uh James Buddy McGirt, who was co-managed by Gambino Associates. Basically, they talk about that. Sammy the Bull discusses how, you know, that Jojo Carrozzo owned a piece of McGirt and Al Cerdo also.

And and that the boxers co-manager Al Cerdo is also a fucking gangster, which we know Al Cerdo from before. fucking gangster which we know al cerdo from before so um he also said here that the subcommittee reported that organized crime figures are associated with at least two other prominent boxers world boxing association cruiserweight champion bobby chez and uh middle super middle weight champion iran barkley chez and barkley told senate investigators in earlier interviews that they did not believe they were associated with organized crime figures. I don't think so. Yeah. Gravano, this is very interesting. He said that the Gambinos wanted to benefit from boxing and that John Gotti, it was at his direction that the Gambinos were trying to reenter the boxing business in the late 80s. He said the interest now is getting a piece of a successful boxer.

Now, because of the size of the purses have gotten so big, organized crime is more and more interested. He said that at one point, Gravano tried to buy Gleason's gym in Brooklyn, which is a big, famous boxing gym. He said, John Gotti urged me to put together some possible gym purchases and promotions and fighters to see if we can get back in the boxing industry. Gravano was a boxing fan, and he used to be an amateur boxer. Christ, I wish he had one professional fight fight he'd be the greatest episode ever oh my god you have no idea so uh

he said that i wish i could just find one of his fights i'd be good enough one and oh we're doing it so apparently giovanna testified how he apparently arranged a fixed fight between heavyweights Francisco Domeni and Ronaldo Snipes. Gravano testified that he met in Atlantic City with a representative of Donald Trump. The Trump rep told us that

the fight would sell. He thought it would be even bigger if Snipes had a high ranking with one of the boxing's world sanctioning bodies. Gravano said he later met in vegas with a referee joey curtis to see if quote he could get snipes moved up in the rankings yeah uh gravano said curtis said that this would cost ten thousand dollars but because it was a favor for john gatti he might be able to get it done for five grand interesting now don king okay yeah don king apparently um gravano's trying to talk to don king about something to put together with goddy and

gravano goes back to john goddy and says that don king doesn't want to play ball he tells god he quote he says he's a street guy and uh he says that he's not doing shit basically he's i'm a street guy and i'm not afraid of shit that's what don king says so uh he said that he's not doing shit. Basically, he's I'm a street guy and I'm not afraid of shit is what Don King says. So he said that he's not having a lot of luck. He says Don King tells Sammy or Sammy tells John Gotti. Don King stands up. He don't want no part of this thing. He says they mimic Don King.

I'm a tough guy. I went to jail for this and that. Fuck John. I'm not doing any of that bullshit. So then John Gotti said, you tell him to mention my name. And Sammy said, yeah. And he says that he didn't care. He's a tough guy and he did time.

Don King. He's not afraid of John Gotti. Yeah. So John Gotti said, really? So then he hung up and called him back. And he says, tell you what, Sammy, kill Don King. While you're out there, fucking kill Don King for me. Fuck him.

I don't know who he thinks he is. Blow his fucking brains out what period so he says Sammy says this is in court and Senate he says quote you want me to kill Don King yeah and he's like I don't care I'll do it if you want it but is that what you're saying so he said John Gotti said quote no

not you he said not you you fucking idiot just have it done yeah he said not you not you the kid because he had somebody with him, obviously. He said, have him fucking do it, stupid.

Obviously not you. They all know who you are. So he said to concoct a proposal and if he says no and gives you any of that shit, take the gun out and shoot him right in the fucking head right there.

Done. Wow. Yeah. And so the kid said, quote, you want me to kill Don King? And apparently they looked around and Don King had left town.

They couldn't find him anymore after that. And then Gotti got busted and the whole thing happened. But Don King was on the hit list. Don King should thank his very fucking lucky. He did not run back into Sammy Gravano that night. He would have most certainly had a hole in his fucking head there. If John Gotti said to kill the guy, he's dead. Period.

Whether it was smart or not, that was what it was going to happen. So February 19th, 1994 1994 he's in charlotte bobby is he fights george o'mara not sammy uh all goes all 10 unanimous decision win uh so uh bobby says quote to this day they'll say to me you're pretty smart for a fighter i say so if i'm a carpenter i'm stupid they'll say you're not bad looking for a fighter i'll say if i'm a lawyer i'm ugly the connotation of a fighter is such a derogatory term that people just can't believe certain things listen i'm a member of mensa i'm in the top two percent of people in the entire world when it comes to intelligence what do you mean i'm smart for a fighter i'm smarter than you i'm either intelligent or i'm not i'm either attractive or not it has nothing to do with my profession which if he left out a chunk of that it's fine I'm smart for a fighter. I'm smarter than you. I'm either intelligent or I'm not. I'm either attractive or not.

It has nothing to do with my profession. Which, if he left out a chunk of that, it's fine. But then he had to throw in all the men's shit. He loves to talk about... Right. I get it, you big-titted blonde. You're also smart. He loves it.

Calm down. And you're cool and you'll go to the strip club with the guys. We understand. The problem is the vast majority of whatever you are are not what you are. Exactly. So, you get a bad rap. I understand. Yeah.

I'm white trash. People think I'm dumb. I happen to be very dumb. Sometimes stereotypes work out. So August 4th, 94, he's at Foxwoods Casino fighting David Izaguirre. Izaguirre, I think his name is. I never knew how to pronounce his name. 15-0 coming in.

23-1 for his career. Chez is knocked down in the fourth round, and Bobby can't come out for round five for whatever reason. He's hurt, so he loses that fight. He's 41-6. Right around this time, too, he gets an analyst job working for Showtime. So he's like part of a three-man crew in the booth for Showtime fights when he's not fighting. So he's like the analyst,

which he's a good analyst because he's very honest. He's very Italian honest. We'll put it that way. He's like, I don't know. I think this guy's a bum today. He's not really doing anything. The other guy,

he doesn't want to get knocked out. He better stop moving around. Like, it's shit like that. He's really tough on the fighters and even tough on showtime and he's just honest so march 24th 95 in west orange all the way back there fights tim dough boy tomasheck puts the fear of god in my heart i don't know poor fat fuck 51 and 11 he is coming in but tko win for bobby 42 and 6 he's in september 95 he's back in west orange fighting jeff williams who's just as boring

as he sounds i know a guy named jeff williams probably everybody does i think it's very common so that's another win next fight he has is against richard action jackson hell yeah down in biloxi at a casino and uh he says about this quote he disrespected me he said i was old and too slow and that he'd kill me uh he said all those things but in the fight he didn't do any of the things he said he would and uh richard action action jackson's 19 and 0 coming in and bobby beats him with a six round tko bringing his record to 44 and 6 next up for the fight for him is a vander holyfield what vander holyfield winner gets tyson that's how this works for a big money fight.

And he's in. He's in. He's fighting Holyfield. Holyfield's fighting him because Holyfield thinks he's a pushover. And it's an easy win for him. And he'll get a little payday here. He's already training for Tyson. Yeah, he's already training for Tyson.

And Holyfield, it's known that he didn't train much for the Chez fight. Didn't train well. Now, Bobby says says i read somewhere where where uh where somebody said evander holyfield was going to snack on a chess burger he said clever clever i like it i know the odds are long against me winning it would be easier if i were fighting a guy with one arm two wooden legs and a kickstand that's why this is going to be such a great accomplishment well yeah i wouldn't be an accomplishment to fight a fucking old man. He says,

quote, the way I look at it, three things can happen and two are bad for Holyfield. If he doesn't knock me out in the first four or five rounds, he loses stature as a heavyweight because he's a, this guy's a cruiserweight. If I go the distance, I gain stature.

Even if I lose a lot, Rocky one, I go the distance, I gain stature even if I lose, a la Rocky I. If I beat him, he's done. He might as well retire. Yeah. Holyfield loses to Bobby Chez. You're done. No one wants to see you fight Tyson now. Yeah.

It's like a tiny guy fighting a big guy. Kind of. Yeah. Not many losses coming at me right now. And Holyfield started out as a cruiserweight, too. But Holyfield's a lot bigger than Bobby by this point. Both of us are past our prime. Neither of us are at the height of our career.

Anything can happen. I've done my homework. He's taking me lightly. He doesn't know what to expect from me. He expects someone who can't hurt him. He expects a blown-up cruiserweight, but I can surprise him. He doesn't know how hard I've trained for this. So Madison Square Garden, May 10th, 1996.

Bobby, at risk of sounding like a homosexual uh holyfield is he's a specimen he is gorgeous he's a specimen looks amazing he's insane uh he's 31 and 3 coming in holyfield and uh this fight goes four rounds and then the fifth round bobby can't come out his eyes are fucked up yeah and he's claiming cheating so holyfield wins great he yeah boxes he claimed that uh somebody in holyfield's corner put hot sauce on his gloves holyfield's gloves to hurt bobby chez and he still believes it to this day really he says yeah uh he says uh still believes it now he says that uh uh he bobby couldn't see and Bobby's eyes appeared red and inflamed and that the referee did examine

Holyfield's gloves and Bobby told everybody the next day that skin peeled off his face from his forehead to his chin where he was hit with the hot sauce and Chez, he quotes also, Chez said that Holyfield head-butted, elbowed, forearm-thumbed him and that he was a dirty fighter, which he is Chez said that Holyfield head butted elbowed forearm

thumbed him and that he's a dirty fighter which he is Holyfield he fought like Holyfield is the most overrated dirty fucking fighter ever he's a cruiserweight

that got his way up to a heavyweight and needed some tricks to be able to fucking contend like holding and headbutting because that's all he fucking does

great fighter but as a heavyweight I would I just can't watch it the ref inspected his gloves rubbed it on his taco and said this is delicious delicious he says bobby says i've never been able to see right since that fight i'm telling you my vision was 2020 before that right that fight and

afterwards maybe 2040 my face burned painfully at the end uh the days after all my skin peeled off from my chin to my forehead, I've been boxing 20 years and had never experienced anything like it. And he says, someone put something on Holyfield's glove. I don't think it was Evander. I think it was his corner and Don Turner. In the gym, you may rub Vaseline on a fighter's gloves to stop cutting and marking up during the sparring. But in a fight, you don't rub anything on them as you want to cause damage

in the fight. Look at the tape of the fight. From the second round, Turner is continuously rubbing Holyfield's gloves between rounds. He says, by the way, even today, Bobby Chez says he doesn't like Evander Holyfield. He called him the ultimate overachiever. Wow. Which I agree with. He said, quote, he's just full of it.

That bothers me. I don't know. Whoa, this is great. I don't know what religion it is that says you can have 12 kids with nine different women and not be married to them, and that's okay. He's a fraud. He was 188 pound cruiserweight, and then he went to 218 pounds. You cannot gain 30 pounds, lose body fat, and maintain that physique without artificial

enhancement. By the way, sue me if you want. That motherfucker is ridiculous. Holyfield was on a lot. Those muscles behind the shoulders were the traps? Bullshit. Enormous. They look like Brock Lesnar.

That does not happen naturally. Neither for Brock Lesnar. Or maybe it was just because he was fucking all the time. I guess. He says, it can't be done. Not possible. all the time i guess he says uh it can't be done uh not possible he gets a pass in the media for one simple reason he believes in god that's so fucking true he came out oh everybody in the 90s would do all these what a wonderful man holy feeling you're talking well the lord and the god and holy he's got 12 kids he doesn't give a fuck about none of his life i don't care how many kids

you have that's what i mean i don't care what you do just don't be a fuck about. None of his life. I don't care how many kids you have. That's what I mean. I don't care what you do. Just don't be a hypocrite about it. He's like, I love fucking. I got 12 kids. I pay for them. I don't give a fuck. Great.

But he's out there going, I'm a man of God and everybody should just like me. And Mike Tyson's a bad guy and I'm a good guy. It's like, I don't know. He doesn't have 12 kids with nine women. That's something. You know, religious guys tend to have the most kids yeah yeah it's called the birth control uh now but gloves were actually taken to the new york state police crime lab for testing yeah i really hope there was no like you know a murder like a sexual

assault like a rape kit waiting on the fucking counter next to it while they tested gloves for hot sauce. In the New York City crime office? In what year? 1996. There was. Yeah, there was. There was something they could have been doing. The report, which was reviewed, showed the only substance found on Holyfield's gloves was the primary ingredient in Vaseline, which is what Bobby Chez would have had on his face. So that would have been there.

Yeah, it's henna Cosane or some shit. That's the active primary ingredient. November 3rd, 1997, Bobby is arrested. Oh, boy. He is in Old Bridge, New Jersey. He's in a two-car collision here. Yes, he is charged with drunk driving, failure to submit to a breathalyzer test.

Yeah, apparently his vehicle swerved into the right lane and struck the fender of a car driven by a guy named Mario Lombardo. Oh, boy. Everybody in this fuck. Hey, Mario, hit your fucking car. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Hit the fucking thing.

I couldn't see where I was going. Holy feel that hot sauce on the gloves. I can't see shit anyway. And I'm drunk. They're all fucked up. And I'm trying to dip my sandwich in this guy's neck hole in my passenger seat. I got a lot going on right now. Sorry.

I'm drunk as shit. I can't see. They stopped at a gas station here, and the police responded. And old bridge police officer charged Bobby with drunken driving, refusal to take a breathalyzer test, and improper use of dealer plates. Yes. No, not at all apparently they also their summons is charging him with leaving the scene of an accident and careless driving from another thing that happened to him at another time um yeah he got his uh bad night he paged his attorney and asked over the phone if

he should submit to a breath test this is on the street he did this and uh his attorney said quote when bobby was arrested he was asked to speak to his attorney which is not uncommon it's his right uh i asked police if i could take the if he could take the breathalyzer now and the lieutenant said no bobby refused whether there was actual refusal still has to be determined in court apparently he refused then talked to the lawyer and then tried to say okay i'll take it and they said nope you already refused so that's a charge and uh he also says if he wasn't sure if the police performed a field sobriety test, which they did, and he failed.

But still, by the time Bobby talked to his attorney, it was too late. And his attorney says, I'm sorry, the the prosecutor said his obligation by merely having a New Jersey driver's license is to take the test. That's the law. If you refuse, you don't have to be offered the test again. Apparently that's the law. November 13th, 97, court for DUI here. He pleads innocent on charges that he was drunk there.

They said that Bobby's never been charged with something like this before. His lawyer says he will in the future. Don't worry. There's really no... He's charged with aggravated sexual assault. That's way worse. It's not like this, though. It's different.

It's a lot different. This is at 1230 a.m. It's like saying Bundy was never charged with shoplifting. I mean, he might not have been. That's the thing. It's true. He is sentenced to a basically this first one, a six month suspension of his driver's license is the first thing here

june 12th 88 he's fighting again yeah uh this will be his last fight i believe here yes he fights cory the sniper sanders who's 238 pounds good lord that is way he's 6 4 238 and uh you know giving up way too bobby's 5 10 about 210 maybe he's yeah 33 and one two cory sanders is and cory sanders fucking thumps him up i mean it wasn't even it was ugly yeah just a little dude getting pummeled um this was second second round tko they stopped the fight he's tough he didn't go down though um or he didn't get knocked out 44 and 8 is his final record as a boxer uh 1998 he's inducted into the new jersey boxing hall of fame wow oh yeah but i mean john bonjovi's in that so how great you know how great of a boxer do you have to be i'm just kidding i don't know

where the fuck he's in he says to summing up his career my motivation when i was fighting was different to uh different to most other peoples most people are motivated by religion i'm an atheist there's no heaven and no hell for me right now. I'm in the history books for three world titles and three different weights. I competed in six weight divisions and won three one world titles in three. I never wanted to be ordinary. And that was always my motivation. Then he says that he said he didn't get a chance to fight Mike Tyson. He says, I'll tell you what, Mike Tyson would have fought me in a heartbeat just because we're friends. He would probably fucked me up but you know what i would have fought mike for free just for the rush of having being uh for being in there with someone that dangerous just the sheer rush of being in

there with someone who could hit like that just to see what i'm worth people don't understand that but if you haven't competed in anything you won't really understand you need to be a little fucked up in the head touched in the head but, I would have fought him for free. He's maybe the only guy on earth that can say, I'd go five rounds with him. For free. Just wanted to see what it was like. I fucking wouldn't do it today. You want to feel that. No, I wouldn't either.

He's used to getting... That's when your dad punches you in the face every day. Yeah. Makes you not scared to get punched by Mike Tyson. Right. Because when you're a kid... Roy Jones is going to rock him, right? No.

You don't think so? I don't know what roy jones is doing the last time i saw roy jones he was a cruiserweight and he looked fucking terrible yeah that was a while ago all i know is if mike tyson hits anybody he will kill them included roy jones got knocked out by 175 pound guys all right a couple few years ago so let's put it that way if mike tyson hits him with the punch, you're going to have to find his head in the 12th row because it's not even close. I mean, I was just thinking about it.

He's a natural heavyweight. His structure, Roy Jones, is not a natural heavyweight. But the other day I was thinking about how Mike Tyson lost to everybody that was like an amazing boxer. You know what I mean? And much bigger than him. Yeah. He lost to Lennox Lewis, who's 6'6", 250 pounds.

Mike's 5'10". And Holyfield twice. And Holyfield, then bullshit. That's bullshit. No, I watched the fights. Holyfield's full of shit. Holyfield has like

two legitimate wins in his whole career where he didn't fucking cheat. Fuck Evander Holyfield. But I think that, I don't know. Otherwise, I don't know. He lost to Buster Douglas

when he didn't train. Seems like when Tyson wants to fuck you up and you're not 6'6", 250, he's going to do it. In the prime of his career he'd beat you then he beat larry holmes his ass he was pretty big i want to watch this i'm actually

interested i don't want to watch you know i care i i give a shit let's be fun yeah 98 tyson wants his boxing license back in new jersey here and ches uh testifies for him as a character witness in the in the hearing for it to get his new jersey boxing license back he's a good guy yeah all right 1999 despite that other shit you know never mind that other stuff he gets another dui sentenced to another six month license suspension 2000 he got a divorce so it's all kim left him yeah uh says, I quit doing my end. Almost always I put her first and she did me. I stopped somewhere and she didn't. I cheated, but she didn't know or she didn't know or find out until we were separated three months. The breakup was so amicable that I got separated in 1997, divorced in January 2000 and didn't move out until January 2001.

That's really amicable. 2000, by the way, another DUI. And this is going to be a six-month driving suspension again. That seems like very, yeah. How do you get the? Don't worry. Don't worry. They're all the same.

Oh, no, they're not. That's not fair. Well, June 2001, he files for bankruptcy. Oh, no. It's Chapter 7. It is discharged in September. He says, not only that, I went through a divorce and gave my wife a $450,000 house with a $150,000 mortgage. I gave her everything.

I gave her $65,000 a year in child support alimony. I didn't care. I had money from boxing and broadcasting. But after the bad car accident, which is coming up soon, and I lost my job at Showtime, it all dried up. We'll find out about this. $300,000 in equity and you just gave that away? Gave it away. I've known people who gave away way more than that.

He is very sweet to her. That was very amicable. I've had it where guys just don't want to fight. They don't want to deal with it. So February 3rd, 2003, he's arrested again. Drunk driving again. Going 87 in a 55. Caught drinking here.

This is in Route 202. He was, let's see here. They clocked him 87 in a 55 about 11 p.m. They approached his Ford Explorer. Questioned him. Smelled alcohol, obviously. They asked him to step outside and perform some balance tests, and he failed those. He failed tests and was arrested.

They brought him to the police headquarters. They gave him two breathalyzer tests, and his blood alcohol level is.14. So that's over. The legal limit was.10 then in Jersey,.14. That's high. It's a little bit high. They towed his car, did all that shit. Now, that doesn't sound like anything too crazy.

He said that he had about four drinks of vodka and wine at TGI Fridays. And that's it. That's all he had. And then he took off. He says he just didn't wait long enough. You had to say that out loud. Yeah. How's that TGI Friday?

So he said, how's the TGI Fridays? What the fuck do you want from me? He's sitting around. Christ almighty. He's fucking people. He's embarrassed i'm breaking my fucking balls he's sitting outside the courtroom he can't take it he doesn't know who the fuck is everybody's my wife these people that one the goddamn senates are coming out on me with the fucking evander holyfield's got hot sauce in his face i can't take it anymore just as he hears that says that he starts to hear dogs barking he's like what is that and approaching him is of course bobby colorado animal trainer from fredericksburg texas

and he says how is it you come to arrive here the fuck is wrong with you huh yeah yeah i know we're in the same i get what you fucking. Yeah, I know. You don't know nobody. I'm from Fredericksburg, Texas. We all got our secrets, buddy. That's fine.

What the fuck are you doing with yourself? I'd say to get a dog, but Jesus Christ, you're going to get in a fucking car accident and shoot the thing through your fucking windshield. I don't want you to have one of my fucking dogs. You're a fucking jerk off. What are you doing? He doesn't need a seeing eye dog, though. He's half blind now. That's all right.

Fine. You know what? Take this. You ain't going to train it,'t gonna train it though you punch it in the face a few times and then like lose it or something i don't know if you're gonna give it to your wife in the next divorce i can't do it the fuck out of here you know why you're a disgrace and i'm tired of this whole thing i'm out of here poof and in a poof of dog shit and marinara sauce he's gone delicious so this dui arrest causes bobby to be bobby ches not colorado right to be fired from showtime they lost him they shit canned him here he says they canned me they said uh they said it was my fourth dui but uh the first three didn't bother them i guess don king was a convicted two-time murderer he was the promoter with an exclusive contract with Showtime.

That didn't bother them either. Is that true? The fuck? Yeah. Don King's a murderer. Yeah. Is that true? Absolutely.

Do I not know that? Well, he'll have an episode. You'll find out. I can't wait. Absolutely murdered people. Wow. So, yeah, it was. Yeah.

Oh, boy. And this is well before boxing. He says, yeah, he says, after a with showtime i would i got a reputation if i would say fighter a is thoroughly beating fighter b if fighter b gets the decision there can only be two reasons one because the judges were incompetent or two they had an agenda and their frauds showtime took pride in the fact that i said those things but when a promoter has an exclusive deal with showtime and his fighter wins a fight he shouldn't have won uh i say there's an agenda now showtime looks like they're in collusion with the promoter it starts to be embarrassing a little bit he says so uh yeah and he says uh his agent called hbo and they said that uh bobby is

synonymous with showtime so we can't use him he's too too much on show. Look like we're stealing it, basically. March 2003, court for his DWI. What they find is that, basically, this is his fourth drunk driving charge, and they find that he has been incorrectly sentenced for his other drunk driving charges. Oh, shit! He's been incorrectly sentenced because they just didn't look for him. They didn't see him. They've been sentencing him like it's his first one every time. Because it's his first offense every time.

Oh, I know a guy. So, yeah. He was sentenced as a first offender there, six-month sentence, and then the second time. Under state law, a second conviction means a two-year license suspension and at least two years of imprisonment, not another six-month suspension. So, the improper sentencing ended up spurring. Now he's got to do, like, back sentencing for this whole fucking thing here. Oh, no way. Yeah. sentencing ended up spurring. Now he's got to do like back sentencing for this whole fucking thing here. No way.

Yeah. Well, they end up telling him, you, sir, may fuck off. He's sentenced to 10 days in jail and stripped of his driver's license for two different counts of 10 years. So 20 years with no driver's license. Holy shit. That should have been his third and his fourth or both tens. So 20 years now he's getting banged on him hard uh so yeah they first suspended for 12 and he will be given for the

credit for the suspensions he already received that was 10 and then he got another 10 so it's 20 years he will not have a driver's license till 2025 he still has no driver's license trying to rush through to get to the end here so it's not a four-hour episode here but uh yeah apparently uh he's sentenced also like i said 10 days in jail also 500 fine and uh he's scheduled to enter a clinic and then report to jail he said you understand i'm not thrilled with my behavior in the past i'm doing my best to correct it i want to do the right thing so uh yeah they go he goes to court and that's what ends up happening there now bobby's take on the whole thing he's defensive he says that the system

wanted to make an example out of him because uh he said a writer quote thought he was going to expose me and some of my bad behavior and he made such a big deal out of it that the sentencing was not totally proper then they threw the book at me He said, they asked him if he's an alcoholic. He said, no, I just made bad decisions. I went to rehab and the doctor said, based on your test, you're not an alcoholic. No, you have to diagnose me as an alcoholic or the insurance won't pay it. It's $6,900 a week and I don't need the aggravation either. He says that I go to rehab.

They start telling me you're going to have to, you're going to have this and you're going to have that and you're going to shake. I'm bored. I can't have a couple glasses of wine before I go to sleep because I do have chronic insomnia. So I'm in my room doing push-ups and grunting and the nurse comes flying into the room wanting to know what's wrong with me. He said they had these classes. It came back to AA and following the steps. They kept saying that when they follow the steps, they give credit to God. But when they mess up, it's their fault.

I asked them, how does that work? When you stay clean, God says you do good. He's going to let the other ones mess up. So he said, I told them that I know most of you counselors are reformed alcoholics or drug addicts. They got mad at me and pulled me down to the office. They told me these people need guidance and it works for them. I told them that Jesus Christ died 2,000 years ago. What the hell happened to all the people in the 5,000 years before him?

Did they all go to heaven by default? Thank you. I've said all of these things in our religion. Love it. Looking and seeing through the hypocrisy. After that, they kept me away from everybody and asked me not to speak about it. March 2004, a new law is on the books. What?

It's basically the Bobby Chez law. Right. That, yeah, the Senate Law Public Safety Committee released a bill, co-sponsored. The governor loves it. Everybody's happy here. It is prompted by Bobby Chez. It's the Senate committee voted 5-0 to release the bill. Drunken drivers who repeatedly put others in jeopardy

should be getting more than slaps on the wrist. And it's a bill that says that the prosecutors have to go over their record and see if they have any others, basically. Which seems like you shouldn't have to have a law for that. I can't believe they aren't doing that. It took a reporter to tell the prosecutor for them to know. So, I mean, Jesus Christ. He's a mess

and, I mean, everybody around it's a mess. It's terrible. He's got kids, by the way, here. He's a goddamn disaster. He's embarrassing himself. I don't really feel bad for him so much. But I'll tell you who I do feel bad for.

These people. What? Robert Chez. Stop that. Banking professional in Zurich, Switzerland. Get out of here. CZYZ, baby. Unbelievable.

Bobby Chez, account manager at Icon Systems LLC in Chicago. What? Bobby Chez, finance and administration director at Boehringer Ingelheim in Maysovian district in Pruskow County, Poland. You had to find a guy in Pruskow County? That's right. Poland. But you got a hat.

Right. Congrats. Research. 2004. He's inducted into the National Italian American Sports Hall of Fame. Oh, yeah. He said he's still making good money with autograph shows and personal appearances, much as $2,000 a pop.

But he's had a divorce settlement and bad business deal deals that are fucking him over. 2005. They said they wrote of him outside of boxing. Bobby is involved in several business ventures. And around the time he was parting ways with Showtime, Bobby was approached by friends in the insurance and securities industry regarding a new and innovative trademark product. Bobby passes examinations and informed me that his product possesses

tremendous intrinsic value and external financial rewards. It's a nice step in a different direction at this time in his life okay it's a pyramid scheme it sounds like multi-level marketing but i don't know march 19th 2006 kim his ex-wife passes away at age 47 oh no she had cancer god damn it and bobby and his girlfriend angela moved in to care for her for the final six weeks of her life because they all stayed very close. He said, my ex-wife was the best human being who's ever been born in history. So, yeah, he said she's a there's a lot that's sad that I'm not going to get into.

It's very sad. I feel bad for everybody there. Apparently, this is a nice lady. 2007, he says, quote, this is an interesting quote. Right now, I'm in a bit of a struggle. I had the Department of Labor racketeering from the Attorney General's office over my house, and I thought, this can't be a good thing. No, it's not. No, that's bad.

When you hear labor racketeering and you're any part Italian, you fucking worry. I put in 29 months of work and money into a project, and one of these guys was in business with a defrauded number of us with defrauded a number of us for 3.7 million dollars collectively it was seven guys that put in a lot of money and had money coming back 480 000 of it was mine it was involving insurance premiums that's a lot of money to lose we don't have that kind of liquidity i wasn't 480 000 liquid so i lost a lot trying to cover what I had to cover. On top of that, I had a host of problems at the same time. Trust me, I don't know why I didn't shoot myself, okay?

Every day, seeing my daughter, looking at her picture, talking to her, that's what kept me there. Yeah, that's bad shit here. He talks about declaring bankruptcy, which we talked about. So he says he does motivational work charity work trying to keep his head above water april 13th 2007 he's in a really bad car accident now i actually remember this accident wait what april 13th 2007 he's in a what bad car accident why okay well he's not he's not driving he's in the back seat all right he's in a car accident

and i remember this accident because i got a call from a friend of mine friend of ours however you want to say it a friend of mine who's also yeah yeah he calls me up and he goes hey bobby's not gonna make it that's what we've said and i said why i'll be who yeah i know the fuck he was talking about it's bobby who where are we supposed to be i'll be ches like i'm supposed to know this shit and he goes he's not gonna make it and i'm so at this point i'm thinking is he telling me that they're going to do something to bobby chez so i literally was like how do i ask this without saying that and i went what did bobby do did he do something bad or maybe he did something to hurt him like i don't know so it was a very vague question he goes he got a fucking car accident

he's in a goddamn coma i was like really go he? Go. He's going to fucking die. He's not going to make it. I'm like, holy shit. Turns out he was the backseat of a Mercedes when a hired driver crashed into a tree at full speed. What? Not good. He was pulled unconscious from the backseat of the burning Mercedes after a truck struck a tree. Fire Chief James Carbon, who performed the rescue with help from a bystander, said, quote, When I pulled up, the engine compartment was fully involved and a fire was starting inside the passenger compartment.

Shit. Which is wild. Chez was pulled from the fiery wreck 10 minutes later and helicoptered to Jersey Medical Shore, Jersey Shore Medical Center with broken ribs, facial lacerationsations collapsed lungs and other serious injuries he stayed in a medically induced coma for 28 days oh my god uh he left the hospital after seven weeks he had a tracheotomy scar short-term memory problem that never comes back so if it's not enough that he's been hit in the head for 55 fucking fights and by his father since he was four this finally fucks up his short-term memory um he says i was getting a ride home from a friend

of mine and fell asleep in the back seat my friend of 30 years also fell asleep in the back seat with me we were going to his house the next thing we know uh is that we've been in an accident as it turns out his friend drove off the road without touching the brakes and hit a tree head on my friend and i went face first into the back of the front seats and sustained significant damage to our face and ribs, broken noses, ribs, severe lacerations. The driver got out and started to run away. And my friend asked me, are you okay? He then chased the driver who had just destroyed his car, not realizing how badly I was hurt. I passed out from the concussion.

Well, the car caught fire and yours truly was still inside. Some people in the neighborhood had seen the trouble and called the police and fire department i was inside the with the fire for eight or nine minutes and then pulled out the fire had burned a good portion of my back and shoulders but i'm healing remarkably well my lungs however were in serious trouble and i was taken to the hospital via helicopter uh well during their work on me they had to pump my lungs clean from all the soot while addressing the burns on my back because he had soot from the fire. Eventually, my lungs collapsed and I was put on a ventilator, but my lungs tried to breathe out the ventilator and they collapsed again. A feeding tube was inserted into his abdomen and I ripped it out because my causing emergency surgery to save my life.

Finally, they strapped my hands and feet down until they brought me out of the coma. When I came around, they told me all that happened, and I was a bit shocked. Normally, I'm a good patient and wanted to do the right things. Every single ligament, tendon, muscle had been dormant for 28 days. I had lost 30 pounds and all the tone and definition in my body. Wow. That's all it takes? 28 days of just one night?

28 days of atrophy. Nothing. I mean, he wasn't even moving. So, yeah, he ends up making a full recovery minus the the brain brain damage. He said that accident ruined my life. Yeah, I would say that. Now, 2009, he's inducted into the Polish National Polish American Sports Hall of Fame. Oh, the eye ties and the polls like they're like, he's only a quarter, but we'll take him.

How many are there? It's all right. It's him and c-vast that's it yeah that's it uh now from the hospital the bill was 1.6 million dollars higher than his insurance would cover oh no the costs are 1.6 million over insurance that's his responsibility uh his friends held a fundraiser for him which i saw larry holmes was there a couple chuck wepner was there a couple of guys he's the guy rocky's based on they were all there um trying to raise money for him at a bar one night um his lack of driver's license said also made it hard for him to find a job doing anything yeah because of that uh you know raising money at a bar yeah it's a nightclub whatever having a big night party raise 1.6 million at you know. Raising money at a bar. Yeah, it's a nightclub, whatever. Having a big night party. Let's raise $1.6 million at, you know, O'Reilly's.

Well, you know, we're going to have a martini special, so it's going to be fine. June 2018, okay, 2018. They find him working as a bagger at a ShopRite grocery store. Oh, no. Yes. This guy was going to fight Tyson. Yeah, and he did fight Holyfield. The guy said, the reporter said,

I reached out my hand to introduce myself. Steve Politti is their guy here who wrote this. He said, I reached out my hand to introduce himself. He shakes it, and before I can ask why he's here stuffing my purchases into plastic bags, he begins telling a story he has likely shared with countless disbelieving customers. He that he said this is just temporary he says he has an upcoming job as an analyst for bare knuckle fighting and uh that'll help us you know get him back into

the uh the broadcasting which i haven't been able to find him doing that at all so i don't know uh he said that he's got a you know millions of dollars in debt from all of this shit he says that he's uh you know he says quote they tell me I should thank God I'm still here, but I'm an atheist. There he goes. Yeah. He says he talks about some other shit and then asks for the price club card. Yeah. He said that he walked from his apartment to where he where he was staying to the shop right and applied for a job.

He didn't have a car. That's all he could do. He said he arrives before 10 a.m. for a a shift that begins at 10 30 carries his work apron in a black bag there and uh you know goes there he uh says he usually bums a ride sometimes he has to use like an uber he says quote if i were taking lift to and from work it would cost me 160 a week for a job that pays 250 that's the definition of insanity oh he's got a bum rides and just like walk or whatever um he says customers recognize him all the time and he kind of has to give him a quick oh no yeah imagine while you're ringing stuff up having to explain what happened

to you yeah he says that uh he tells them quote this is an assembly line i've got to keep it moving so like you know once your groceries are off, our conversation's over. I've got to go to the next one. I've got to embarrass myself in front of somebody else now. Yeah. Jesus. So one lady that knew about him said, quote, you're a member of Mensa. You won three world titles.

You should be proud of that. And he said, what makes you think I'm not proud of that? Because I'm working a shop, right? Right. He says, I like to eat, too. Yeah. So that's fine. He's like, so reusables this time, lady it yeah right good deal he talks to a reporter um that reporter he goes out to dinner with him and he's late to dinner he says because

he forgot to put a rubber band around his wrist to remind him and he can't remember shit anymore short term between the punching and the accident he's a little uh a little fucked up he says that it's it's tough his mind will erase small details of his daily life and he can't get it in he says quote it's chaos being me which is what those guys always describe it as chaos june 2018 he's inducted into the atlantic city boxing hall of fame same part of the same class as evander holyfield and donald trump oh wow um holyfield flew his private jet early out of there early and missing the entire thing he just showed up to wave oh what an asshole yeah and uh so again this is fucking great again bobby says while he's doing his speech

he says quote unbeknownst to most of the public and i hope this doesn't offend anyone i'm not a religious person i love it i'm an atheist i don't believe in god i've done the research there are almost 3 000 religions religions in the world and then one of bobby mercer ray mercer the fighter said uh or yeah no ray mercer's the announcer he said bobby not that story and he said i've got uh i've got to do that story and uh he said that uh about atheism in his career vinnie paz who will have his own episode vinnie pazienza he yelled god is real joking around you know they were laughing and shit and he said i promise you i will not go as long as bobby ches when i get up there so bobby

said well when are you going to make a speech that's as smart as mine then so they're going back and forth and then he says quote i'm in the sports history books three times i can't die i can't die it's like julius caesar can't die and presidents sports history books three times i can't die i can't die it's like julius caesar can't die and presidents can't die and hitler can't die the reason for boxing is i needed a legacy i needed something to be in place when i'm gone why is hitler the funniest word in the world i don't know what it is now also you can't die why are you saying you're gonna be gone i don't die he also uh was hanging out that weekend he was sitting ringside for a fight uh and he passed out had to be carried back to

his room he blamed the blackout on allergy medicine that someone gave him and not drinking but an ex-girlfriend who drove him to atlantic city packed up and went home when after that happened so he's probably shit face yeah uh So he had no family or friends in the audience when he accepted his deal there. Brutal. Chuck Wepner says of him, quote, the alcohol got him. He couldn't let it go. He says, Bobby had a problem.

It breaks my heart to think of Bobby Chez as a bagger in a supermarket, but he's still Bobby Chez. You can never take that away from him. Bobby will get back on his feet. And he says, this is the last word here. Bobby described his career as a boxer. There's what he said. Not great, not extraordinary, but solid.

I've competed in the top 10 and six different weight divisions. I won three world titles, acquitted myself well, never a disgrace to myself or the sport. It's just a solid legacy. Solid is probably the most reasonable word I can use. I came, I saw, and most of the time I kick some ass most of the time i didn't duck anybody i fought whoever was there i fought the best of my divisions where i could i did what i could i brought everything to the table you know there's an old saying you gotta bring uh you gotta bring ass to get it well mine's pretty big and i brought all of it. You got a running ass to get it. He'll be walking it off because he has no license until 2025.

Can't get enough. There's tons of Bobby Chez shit. And working it off because he makes a thousand a month. That's the other thing, yeah. Jesus. And there's tons of Bobby Chez merchandise. Autograph, pictures, all sorts. Gloves, you name it, it's out there on eBay and everything.

That, my friends, is Bobby Chez. And quite a fucking tale, tale boy let me tell you something that's a that's a crazy story how do you get there that's it's insanity right you could have fought mike tyson a million dollars nope he's a paper or plastic oh my fucking brutal paper plastic or reusable you're just gonna get your plastic are you gonna continue spreading covid you got your own yeah so if you like that story i know what you can do get on apple podcast the purple icon and tell us you like it give us five stars it helps a lot doesn't matter what you say say you're following instructions following directions go to shut up and give me murder.com

for all of your merchandise needs all sorts of new stuff is up by by the way. Merchandise needs, everything with Small Town Murder, tickets to live shows, you name it, it's there. You can absolutely do that. Follow us on social media, very easy to do that, at Crime and Sports on Twitter and Facebook, and at Small Town Murder on Instagram. Now, if you want to be a hero, and not only a hero to us, but a

hero to yourself, because you're going to get some awesome content, you want to be a Patreon donor, this week's episode is Vince McMahon and his steroid trial with tons of testimony from wrestlers which is fucking hilarious we can't wait to hear wrestlers in court it's funny so that's going to be that last week uh this week too small town murder is a crazy one and you can get all of that for the low price of five dollars a month on Patreon. If you go to patreon.com slash crime and sports, anything above $5, you get access to all that stuff. Jimmy will butcher your name.

It's goddamn beautiful. And if you just want to have good karma and say, you know what? These guys put out a lot of content. This is a long episode. A lot of work goes into it. I like to throw them a couple bucks and get my name butchered. You can do that at PayPal using our email address, crimeandsports at gmail.com.

That said, God damn it, Jimmy. I need it after this episode, and I'm feeling it this week. I need to feel the love this week. Let me feel the love of all these people. Run me into a tree without touching the brakes. This week's executive producers are Hannah Roy or Hannah Waugh. I don't know if she's related to the guy. French, the goalie, Patrick. Joshua Garcia, Mackie. Roy. Executive producers are Hannah Roy or Hannah Waugh. I don't know if she's French. Gauley.

Patrick. Joshua Garcia. Mackie. Roy. Roy. It's such a good movie. It's so great. It's such a dumb movie.

Yeah. It was when movies were fucking clever and creative. And yeah, even if they were dumb. Even if they were dumb. Mackie Daly. Clay Thorson, who, by the way, you're a fucking hero. Thank you, Clay. What a fuck, man.

Clay is our star of the week. So thoughtful and sweet. Thank you for giving us that. Clay is our producer of the week, by far. Thank you, Clay. You're a great guy. We appreciate it. Fuck out of you.

Jennifer Jansen, Dylan Stafford, Chrissy Ann Costaldi again. Thank you. Belinda Reed. She lives in Australia and wants to donate tickets when shows get back on the road to people that are in the States. Jennifer Foltz, stay the course, young lady. Keep it clean. Jackie Sukup, Jordan Bennett, German, or Hermann Turner.

This show is brought to you by the letter J. Sweet. Jenny Leinen, Jen Freeman. Jenny with no last name. Nikki with no last name. Tommy Pinamanti, Jenny with no last name, Nikki with no last name, Tommy Pinamonte, Pinamonte, Blake with no last name, Sarah White, Eric Moore, Silky B, Frankie Brim, Krieg or Craig or Craig, Kemp, Callie Waldock or Waldotch, Lauren McEater.

Thank you guys. Thank you. McAteer? McAteer? McAteer? You guys, thank you so much for everything you do. Other producers this week are Jenna Say What? she had four wisdom teeth removed oh that's fucking miserable johnny ramey happy birthday tina mines happy birthday that shit's belated i'm sorry thomas hughes robert mayhan uh mike cernak bob with no last name jeremy sterk thomas

smith oh boy fucking what did i do? Wiebke? Nope. Wiebke? Naktue? I'm so sorry. Brendan Ables. George Washington King. Ashley Veo. Eric Castillo.

Leah Lebeau. Bex with no last name. Jennifer Visconti. Vicki Morley. Christy Stout. I think that's what I did. Trevor Ritchie. Sarah Snyder.

Yep. Allison Cannon. Liam Glawe, Danielle James, Amanda Knight, Kelsey. Nope, that's Kelly. What did I do? Panosian? Ira Baird, Son Tran, Duncan Burnham, Jimmy Davis, James Marder, Britton Mayhar, Megan with no last name jacinta edwards edmonds uh kenneth o'sullivan peyton meadows tracy renninger diane mccreary candace black chuck was that chuck yep greenman uh jimmy eat world which is probably not the band but even if it is thank you guys

they're from phoenix reagan shulkley keith cole tim bullion uh part Gary. He's terrific, by the way. Logan and Haley Stratton, John Kay, Brian LeBeau, Michael Miller, Doug... What did I do? Douglon? Douglin? Douglin? Is that right? Cordy? Or is that Douglas?

Probably Douglas. Nope. I don't know. Justin Switzer, Marissa Bean, Katie Fee, Andrew Thompson, Margaret Quackenbush. She donated both ways. Thank you. Carly with no last name. Colin the Dude O'Brien, Dan DeVries or DeVries, Brianna Scott, Janice Hill, April Udy, Jeff Teal,

T.L., Liz Cassins, Corey, what is that, Hoisington. Josh Elliott. Sally Matani. Trey Volkanar. Ash Ambern. Timothy Bartlett. Abby Hinson. Yeah, Hinson. Todd Duncan. Maxwell Davis.

Sarah Surridge. Carissa Spencer. Sarah Webb. Marillion. Marillion, I think. Megan Brown. Oh, fuck. Seppi.

Montarbo. No. Tara O'Neill. Danielle Marr, Brittany Lee, Mike Miller, Eric Schwartzrock, John Stewart, probably not the one, though. Thanks, John Stewart. Hannah Davis, Philip, what did I do here? Megason, damn it. damn it chad nicholson michael espinoza uh josh hughes jordan stivers bob uh belmonte eric of avenger ah yeah tick gaming i don't know lucia with no last name jeff uh rockefellow jen taylor maggie russo cody miller dan adler adler leslie with no last name, Kelsey Walker, Jules Parmenter, Elizabeth Bieler, Sam Stinson, Amanda Roop, oh boy, it's got characters over ease, Helene Young, Helene, I don't know, Scott Stevens, James Grieve, Dylan Derringer, David Smith, Brittany Gann, Chris Currier, Andrew Morales, Dan Carbono, Paul Watkinson.

Oh, fuck. What did I do? Cage Heath, Christopher Harnack, Kim with no last name, Carly G, Chris Thompson, Madison Mathis, Lisette Marte, I think, George Spisano. God damn it. Amanda Rainwater, Noah Wooten, Adrian Connor, Nick Letourneau. And if that's the son of Mary uh mary joe mary g mary ann mary k mary k letourneau there you go if that's your mom bro i'm really really sorry

that you lost her if not hey hang in there you're probably doing fine uh ron bergen bergen deez nuts gotcha all right dana cook nate stew stein sorry j sorry. Jessica Skanu Broussard, I think. Kristen Bremer, Jackie Tucker, Carlos Galvez, Sarah Schmidt, Jennifer Reznor, David Jacobs, Celeste the Best, Douglas Daly, Bogan Yoda, Tony Maldonado, Garnett DeWalt, William Peck,ess hall brandon van demon alina god damn it montroy alinea i don't mary doubt it doubt it elizabeth kate robin would no last name the wheels have come off the cart everyone antoinetta would no last name seth laguerre david meyer anthony cripple christopher, Christopher Hoffman, William Kirkpatrick, Wayne Kolodny, Jessica Freeman, Rebecca would know the last name, Chris Battaglia, Taylor Schulte, Adrian would know the last name, Sarah Nicola, Jennifer Alvarado, Tyler Douglas, Scarlett Jekyll, Damian Cabrera, Annie and Theodore Katz, Megan Young, Tommy McAfee,

Jorge Torres, Caroline Duffy, Brian Schutt. No, that's Bran Schutt. Got it. Like an asshole. Yeah, yeah. Understood. I'm on board.

Caitlin, afterwards. Caitlin Coleman, Christina Neal, Charles McPhee, Kyle Klotz, Beth Green, Anne-Marie Fischerback, Jordan Roberts, Dustin Grant, Veronica Stanwyck, Nolan Heaton, Bobby Metters, Jacob Christensen, Jordan Rollerson, Nicole Galvani. There's a G in there that's silent, I'm sure. Erica B., Captain Surly, Jane Patrizio. Congrats to Colonel Mike Mahan, by the way. The man was promoted to colonel.

Congratulations. Hey, congrats. You get the whole bird's nest or whatever the fuck your wife told me to say. Full bird. Full bird. Is that what it is? I don't know what that means. Does that mean you own the bird?

Yes. You got the bird. It's from the asshole to the beak. It's all yours. It's all yours, pal. Diana Torres, Jane Patrizio, I said that,

Lindsay Easton, I think, Stephen Davis, not the running back, Jason Underwood, Ashley Ellis, happy birthday, Meredith Moore. Krista DuPont.

Audrey Marie. Todd Cochran. Corey Officer. Alex Green. August Barney Arnson, I think. Anna Hiddens. Sandra with no last name. Lisa Love.

Scott with no last name. What is this? Corey Boone. William Justice. Brian Rupp. Brian, not Brian. Robinson. Chally would know the last name.

Jennifer would know the last name. Christopher Waugh or Roy. Roy. Lisa Atkinson. Erica Petsinger. Jeremy Barrow. Miranda Trump. No, Trump.

I'm sorry. That was terrible. Sean Fuller. Alex Sensabaugh. Jason Thill or Till. Nick Giersbach. Rachel Garcia. Britt and Lou Garcia. Jason Covert.

Hannah Mogut, I think. Mark Gilbert. Amelia Francesco. Eric Taro. Hayden D. Sweet. I think that's what that is. Lauren with no last name. Pamela McMillan.

Brand Grayheart. Oh, Gayheart. Jesus Christ. Callie Cochran. Mark Norton. Jesus, this is so easy. Lainey Viscont. Yeah, Mark Norton's an easy one.

Lainey Vicant. Vicat. Vicat. Vicat. I don't know. Angela Riley. Some shit. Niel. Thank you. Niel hewn uh nigel it's probably

niel right the j's probably might be nigel probably not becky knox ace finch jolene herb stritt uh jessica you okay jessica lawrence nolan betterman no, that's Mark O'Hare, Joy Freeman, Kendall Diamond or Damone, Thorsten Gross, Homestretch, God damn it, Casey Barton, Julia Pearson, ELM Nitz, 76, Nicole Leslie, Lynn Van Hoose, Kelly McRae, Melissa Patrick Mops, Mocs, what did I do? Moss? I think it's Moss. Barb Barnes, Mina or Mina?

Aslam? Aslama. Aslama? Are you... What? Rob Holberg, Celia Ehrlich, Elizabeth Hatting, Alexis Coleman. That's a different way of spelling Alexis. It's like a porn star almost.

That's a nice one. It's got a Y in it. Sandra Apodaca? No. Maybe. Cameron Bromley. Kevin Benedetti. And Kevin...

Oh, Kenneth Weld's daughter. He's a driver. And Kevin Dates' daughter. I don't know why that matters. I don't know why I wrote it. I'm sorry. Matt with no last name. Kristen Gillette.

Ashley Owens. Kyle Elbert. Rob Schnitzer. Carl Dennis. Sarah Furr. Matt Dearden Hill. What? Rachel... name kristin gillette ashley owens kyle elbert rob schnitzer carl dennis sarah furr matt deerden hill what rachel anson ah m would no last name no name just an m samuel chavez isley smith kira would know last name taylon rose craig duffel or duffy what sarah in uh la france i think gina uh dear durian what dur durian dur durian susan cassidy shelly shelly uh all what i do ally larry listen and all of our patreon uh patron patrons you guys save our lives thank you thank you guys so much for all of that and everything you do every week

thank you guys for honestly we can't we just couldn't do the show without you guys so much for all of that and everything you do every week. What a group. Thank you guys. Honestly, we just couldn't do the show without you guys. And we do it because you like it. So we'll continue to make the show for you because you like it. Thank you so much. Support us so hard and we can't thank you enough for it. We absolutely do. We love you.

Thank you so much. Jimmy, what if they wanted to thank you? Or what if they want to say, hey, thank me more? Wisman sucks. W-H-I-S-M-a-n sucks on twitter and instagram that's where i am where are you i am at jimmy p is funny and you can find me there you'll find me don't worry yeah copy and paste my name you know how it works that's said everybody god damn it it's been a wild one and i'm heartbroken it's not going to slow down next week either it's not it's all going live from the crime and Sports studios.

We will see you next week. Bye. Hey, Prime members. You can listen to Crime and Sports early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.