Culture Apothecary with Alex Clark - “Cuteservatives SPILL ALL.” - Escaping Cults, Involuntary Manslaughter & More

Episode Date: February 4, 2022

Alex Clark brings you the craziest stories from renowned prosecutors to famous survivors of heinous crimes. But what about the riveting stories that never get told…unexpected experiences that are left unnoticed. You never would expect that the person commenting on a POPlitics episode survived a CULT or accidentally KILLED someone. In this special SPILL ALL you get to hear the incredible, funny, and gut-wrenching stories from our very own CUTESERVATIVES.Special THANKS to:Autumn Schi...

When a story makes its way into the news, media, and even podcast world, it can start to feel a bit far removed, right? Or sometimes guests or public figures already, whether they're an author, podcaster, business owner, or host. And when I cover a new story, I always get flooded with comments and DMs from conservatives who totally and completely relate to the guest. And that's just on the days when we posted a new episode. On other days, the messages keep coming in from girls and young women. Some of them are going through their own crazy story of being fired, broken up with docks, or intimidated because of their conservative beliefs. Other messages are from conservatives who have amazing small businesses or are starting families or jobs in brand new cities. Cutservatives are everywhere.

And you all have such unique stories wherever you are in life. Some of your stories might not get national attention, even though they should. but they're just as real. When I began creating the Poplittics brand, I was new to Phoenix, Arizona. I had all these ideas I wanted to explore and goals to accomplish, building a daily show,

and even a podcast comes with so many pieces that most people don't even begin to understand. But from the start, the brand itself had to be just right. It was clear to me from the very beginning that this show wasn't just mine. I wanted to share it with girls and women everywhere

who felt like I did as a conservative. I started a daily show because I didn't see myself in the media options that existed at the time. And I knew I probably wasn't alone in that. What I'm trying to say is that my story is your story. And all of you help make this entire thing possible from Poplitics on Instagram, my daily show, or to the spillover. And I can't thank you all individually. But I did want today to be dedicated to every cut conservative. We're highlighting some everyday stories that didn't necessarily make.

headlines, but are just as compelling, just as important, and 100% representative of who we all are as cute servatives. The episode is going to cover each story individually, so you can expect a little style change on the podcast today. Joining me will be Autumn Shimmer, who was assaulted on the steps of the Supreme Court when she bravely stood for life. Jacinta Rigi, who committed accidental manslaughter. Francesca Arnaudi is a total boss, who is a sheriff's deputy and and now has a brand dedicated to educating women on self-defense. Then we have a love story between a cute servitive and a dude-servative who bonded over their conservatism and love for politics. Hannah and Matthew, they're literally the cutest.

And finally, cult survivor, Katie Reeves, tells her story about leaving ICOC. Never heard of it? You will today. I hope you love each guest as much as I do. I'm Alex Clark, and this is The Spillover, Cute Servatives Spillow. all. Katie, let's just start with what is the international churches of Christ? Is it different from the denomination Church of Christ? Because I've heard that in my whole life. And I'm not sure what the difference is if there is one. And just walk us through what it is and then what

are the steps someone goes through to join. And then we'll kind of launch into your story. Okay. So the International Church of Christ is not at all associated with the Church of Christ, the normal church of Christ, I want to say. The international churches of Christ was created by a guy named Kit McKean, and he started out in Boston. And it was actually called the Boston sold out movement. It started as a house church, and it expanded from there. And a huge part of it is there was this goal that in one generation, they would evangelize the whole world. So they would get everyone to follow them, kind of giving off that idea of that they were the one true church based on their discipleship program. So in order to become a member, as of today anyway,

there is a study called the first principal study. I believe it is a 12-step study. And it's very standard Christianity in theory. But on top of that, though, they believe in discipleship. You need discipleship. So you need somebody to be there walking beside you your whole life to make sure that you're staying on the straight and narrow path. So that's a huge deal. They also believe you have to be baptized in order to be saved. And on top of that, for the most part, you have to be baptized with this church. So if you came in as like a regular Christian already baptized, say when you were like 15, 16, if not, you know, early 20s, They will go through this whole study and show you why basically your baptism might not have counted.

They give you this idea that you might not have been following the Bible as well as you could have been. And so if you didn't understand what you were doing and you just got baptized and you're still living your way the way that it was, that your baptism probably doesn't count. So you obviously know a lot. I'm like, listen, do you talk about this? And it's like, you know a lot about this, you know, so-called church. But is that because you were just in it for a long time, you joined later than life, or you were born into it? Like, let's talk about how you got involved with ICOC, how long you were involved. Yeah.

So my parents joined in 98. I was only three years old. So I wasn't born into it, but I was very much raised into it. And for a lot of kids that are either born into it or raised into it from a very young age, they're considered kingdom kids. And so like you would at a normal church where you would drop your kid off at like Sunday school, that Sunday school, they called kingdom kids. And that's where you started. Everything starts. But my parents, as far as my parents joining, my parents were in Vegas. They're two law enforcement agents.

And my dad was working a lot. My mom was working a lot. but my mom used to take us to iHOP every weekend, every Saturday. And one time she was sitting at an IHOP and she overheard some of these disciples sitting together doing one of the studies. And my mom was listening and my mom says that she'd been praying to God. She was like, God, please show me your church. Show me where you want me to be. And she just felt like what she was hearing from their study that she wanted to know more.

So when they finished and they were about to get up, she approached them and asked them, and ask them, you know, what are you guys studying? And so they explained to her. It was just a regular Bible study. And she was like, I'm like super interested in this. And they're like, oh, why don't, why don't, I give you my number and we'll meet up and we'll study the Bible together. And so they did. They met up.

They did studies. They studied the Bible. Was it actually the Bible or was it this? It was the Bible. I would say that everything in these studies was, there were scripture used. I very much believe that a lot of the scriptures were cherry-picked. A lot of them were out of context. But it was the Bible.

There was no other book. There was a written out, like, how to lead this study. And I remember doing that myself when I studied the Bible with people. But the scriptures and everything were scriptures from the Bible. So you're in this. You're a toddler. Your mom convinces your whole family they need to join. and how long did you guys go being involved in this cult ICOC before someone in your family started realizing something isn't right here?

And who in your family was that to first say something's weird? I can't really put a finger on it. My parents left first, so obviously they had the guts to dip out first. I remember as a teenager because I was so angst that there were so many rules that I had to follow as a teenager in the teens ministry. What were the rules? So there was no dating. I mean, my parents were very like, you're not allowed to date because if you're going to date, you have to date a disciple. And that's a rule within the church is they want you to not yoke yourselves with nonbelievers.

So you date within the church. It's very, it's highly advised. And advice is not like advice where you take it and leave it. Advice is like, I'm giving you this advice. I think you should go get advice when they say stuff like that. It's you need to go get approval from someone else. And so the advice was very much, I'm telling you. And if you don't follow it, there's probably going to be some kind of repercussions.

So what kinds of repercussions were there if somebody were to break a rule? There was never like obviously any physical violence or anything weird like that. It was mental. It was spiritual. It was them telling you like, you're really struggling in your faith right now. You know, you really need to get better at your relationship with God. I feel like there's a lot of words in the English dictionary that I just can't see the same because they use them so many times. It was like the lingo.

And so those words like you're struggling. I feel like you're struggling a lot. Or I'm discouraged or, yeah, I'm discouraged by, you know, you making this choice or telling me this. And I think you need to go get advice for this. And so it was more like it was a lot of shaming. And in your head, you're convinced that like your salvation is always on the line. I remember feeling I was never good enough for God. and it was so hard to do anything.

I felt like every time something bad was happening in my life, it was because I was about to lose my salvation, that God was mad at me, something was wrong. I wasn't spiritual enough. And I was constantly in this like mental warfare that I was being told that I wasn't spiritual enough and I needed to work on my relationship with God. And so it just, I mean, it would eat at you,

would make you want to do whatever they're saying because you feel like something's wrong with you and that God's not going to look well on you. And this is a massive, ICOC is massive. There are hundreds of thousands of members all over the world, right? It's international. There are L.A., like I said earlier, their L.A. Chapter alone has over 6,000 members. And I'm just, you know, what's really striking to me is that you talk about this clear mental suffering

and manipulation that you were under throughout your entire life. And yet you still somehow found the strength to leave. So talk about the leaving process, the exiting process, because you met your husband, you're married now, you met him while you were in ICOC, right? He was a member also. Yes. His family was members were members. Your family were members. You're, like, heavily in it.

So when you find out that your parents are dipping out, are you, like, shun, you know, they're not spiritual? Like, what is going through your mind? So I mean, at the point that they decided to leave, I was having doubts myself because I'd already been through so much. I was a disciple and I just felt like nothing was my own choice. And so I was struggling, but I wasn't telling anyone. And so for my parents to leave all of a sudden like they did, I was like, oh, what does that mean? Like, that's interesting. It wasn't this like, I'm upset at you.

Like, how could you? My dad, when he did leave, when they did leave, he told me my sister, he's like, I'm not going to make you leave. like you have to choose this, which I was kind of like, why can't you just make it like, you know, tell us to leave kind of thing? But, you know, he felt like he was doing right up until that point, raising us in this church. He wanted people to guide us to be better people to, you know, follow God because he thought that, you know, we were following God. And were you married at this time to your husband or you guys were just dating? No, we weren't even dating when my parents left.

Yeah, we were not dating. We were friends And that was it And his parents actually Were discipling partners with my parents So there was a little connection there So were they like You cannot talk to this girl

Her parents are defectors or whatever The parents were very much upset That they were leaving They were very much It was a big shock to them Because they You know talked all the time They had to

You know they kind of reported To each other kind of thing And then when my parents decided to leave They were like What the heck And so your parents leave you said they left six months before you. So it took six months for you to say, now I want out.

Yeah. And then what about your husband? Oh, yeah. And so in that six month time, actually, when they left, I was interested in a totally different guy, random guy. And I, oh, my gosh, I really, this is so silly. I really thought he was the one. And I didn't even know him that well, so that's kind of dumb. But I really liked him.

And I even introduced him to my parents at some point. And so I was like, you should just tell me like him. I'm like, Mom, we can't do that. We're not allowed to tell people that we like them. We're not allowed to initiate that relationship. So what? You have to tell a mentor-leader-type of person? Do you tell a leader that you like them?

And then if they think you're spiritual enough or they think that they're spiritual enough, then, you know, they'll prove it. But if literally if one little thing is off, then it's like, no, I don't think that's a good idea. I think you should work on your relationship with God. And they kind of like deter your mentality. And so I was deterred often anytime I like somebody. So I told my mom, she's like, what? She was like, you should only be getting approval from me and your dad. I'm like, well, that's not the rule.

And she's like, what role? Like, she was totally oblivious to what was going on in my life. How did you guys figure out that you wanted to leave after your parents? So six, not even six months, maybe four or five months into it telling you there was this switch that loser dude just disappeared out of my life. I'd always talk to my husband about these guys that I liked and he would give me advice. And he's like, yeah, that guy, you know, he's immature. He doesn't know what you need. And he didn't like me like that.

Like he... Or he thought he didn't. Yeah. He said, he was like, he goes, you were cute, but you were like a hot mess. And so, yeah, so he was, he would give me genuine like, no, I don't think it was this. Or like, no, Katie, like you do these things and you're not right for him because, you know, you're this personality and he's this personality. And that's why it would have never worked out. And for the both of us, just one day something.

changed and I started feeling those feelings. I'm like, oh, and I remember I hated myself for it because I'm like, I can't lose him. That's my best friend. Like I would rather deny toe death that I had any feelings for him than approach this because they're going to take him away from me. They're going to tell me to stop talking to him. They're going to tell me that I can't sit next to him, that I don't need to be at events that he's at or I need to be on the other side of the room if he's there. because that's how they would separate you from people you were interested in. They would just cut it off. Don't talk to him.

Don't text him. Don't call him. None of these things. And I started noticing that he liked me back. So I just asked him. I was like, hey, so do you like me? And he goes, you're not supposed to ask that. You know you're not supposed to ask that.

I'm like, okay, but do you like me? And he was like, well, yeah. I'm like, hey, well, what are you going to do about it? He was like, I don't know. Like, there's something we could do about it. And I'm like, well, maybe. So maybe there's something we could do. We leave this got-susaking place.

Maybe there's something. Maybe we could make this happen. Well, at this point, my sister had gotten wind that she thought I liked him. And so did the church. And I don't know, to this day, I do not know how they figured this out, unless they overheard me and my idiot sister recording ourselves saying that I didn't like him. Do you think that they, were they the type of people that would monitor, have access to phones? No. Would they bug places?

I mean, oh my gosh, no. I can't see that. I've never heard anything like that. So I cannot say that that's the case. But I know that- Somebody informed on you. That's what I thought. So my only thinking is somebody overheard me and my sister, you know, messing around.

Because it was the only time it was ever brought up that I liked him that I was in a conversation of. That and this other girl who liked him had like a suspicion. And I remember her asking me. I'm like, no. And I like walked away. So I don't know. Somebody told the leader though. And the leader was hot on my collar at that point.

I started getting messages from the leader. And she was like, hey, let's meet up at this Starbucks. So I met up with her. And she just plainly asked me, like, so is there anybody you're interested in? I'm like, no, what about him? And I was like, no, I don't like him. And she's like, are you sure you don't like him? I'm like, yeah, I don't like him.

I don't know what you're talking about. She's like, hmm, how often do you guys talk? So then she started grilling me, like, how much do you guys talk? Are you guys texting? I'm like, yeah, we text like normal, you know, we do your own thing. Well, I don't think you should be talking to him as much. And I'm like, okay, well, cool story, but, you know, I'm not talking to him. Like I was denying everything.

She kept giving me advice for something I supposedly wasn't doing, even though I was. And so she's like, okay, well, let's talk again next week. I'm like, okay, so then a week goes by. And so we met up again, and she started grilling me even more. And this time she brought reinforcements. She brought a girl that was living with me and who was buddy buddies with all the girls before me who liked my husband. And she was like, yeah, I've seen him, you know, break her heart and break her heart. and, you know, he just, he gets in your head.

So they got a whole gang together to try to convince you not to be with this guy. So at this point, we're trying to convince me not to like him. And I'm like, I don't like him. They didn't think I was spiritual enough. It didn't matter what he was because I wasn't good enough to date in the church. And so I just didn't want to ruin that friendship. I didn't want them to take him from me. And so I just tried to keep convincing them.

So they brought in someone else. They brought in another girl who was actually best friends with him. And they're all telling me all this stuff. And I remember the leader. said, you need to know this, but he is a wolf in sheep skin. Oh, brother. Yeah. So we go for like two, three weeks of this grilling meeting up nonstop. And it got to one week every day, I had to meet up with them and hear from them. And she told me that Wednesday, she was like, you need to make a decision now. You need to decide. Are you going to cut this off? Or what are we going to do? And I remember she said,

it's not going to look good for you if, you know, you can't be straight with me and you can't, you know, just let this go. Well, that sounds like. like a threat. And so I said, and so I was like, okay. And then that night, I talked to the leader and two of the women who had no idea what was going on with me, who had no idea what she'd done to me, I had no idea what I'd been through. And I just straight up told them that I don't believe in your doctrine. And I think it's wrong. And you just want to sit here and focus on who I like and who I don't like. But like, I don't agree with this. And I can't do this anymore. So I'm leaving. And at this point, There was one of the person who recently left, so it wasn't like, this is a huge shocker.

So then I decided to leave. And it wasn't until a month later, my roommates all sat me down, read me a scripture, totally out of context, and said that I couldn't live with them anymore. And you were officially shunned. Yeah, that they didn't want me because we didn't share the same ideas. At this point, though, a week after I'd left, they tried to have one conversation, one, with my husband's whole time. one conversation with him about dating me and being with me. And he was like, show me in the Bible where it says I can't date her or I can't date her just because she's not in my church. And they're like, well, we don't have that.

And he's like, all right, well, then I guess I'm leaving too. He had the means and the opportunity to leave whenever he wanted because of his job. I didn't have that. I didn't have anything. I barely had a job and no friends. And so when they sat me down to tell me that I had to leave, I remember one girl saying because it was around December. She was like, hey, so don't worry about getting us any gifts for Christmas because we want you to save up money because I know you have to move out soon. I'm like, wow.

So you're conservative and, you know, conservatives. Even I have talked about how I feel like the left is like a cult. Do you agree with that or do you feel like that's totally off base? It depends. I think when you get yourself so involved in not politics, but, you know, any political side to the point where. they like if you spoke out against them they would not just make your life a living hell but they would take things from you or you could lose you know finances to where you couldn't support yourself um if they were paying for everything i think in those cases where you have to agree with everything they say or your livelihood and your ability to live is on the line then yeah i believe that that is a cult but i think you know if you're just a teenager listen to everything you read on the internet and believe it and not, you know, seeking that out for yourself and having, still having the ability to have free thought and not be persecuted for it. I don't believe that, you know, I think you can be

setting yourself up to be getting into a cult, a cult mentality. But I don't like to use the word cult, like in situations where you just don't like something or you disagree strongly. I think it has to be affecting your welfare significantly to be considered that. So one last thing, Katie, before we wrap up, is if somebody's listening to this who is currently in ICOC, what is your short message to them? I would say right now, the biggest thing that helped me was when I started getting friends outside of the church, when I had friends that literally looked me in the eye and said, Hey, Katie, you're in a cult.

And I laughed at them, but, you know, this guy was in my wedding, and he's like one of my best friends now, and he was right. And he was definitely one of the few people that I had to lean on. when I wanted to leave. So I definitely would say, you know, even if you have to make it a secret and you don't want to share with anyone, having those friends outside of the church

can be your only life line at some point. Katie, thank you so much for sharing your story today on the spillover. Thanks. Fran, you and your partner were working one day in Santa Barbara where you were a sheriff's deputy and you actually got worried about a stolen vehicle. You had the make, the model, the vehicle, the details, the suspect.

And then you actually anticipated he would come your way. And then when he did, you initiated a traffic stop. So can you just describe the total chaos that ensued after that traffic stop? Oh, my God. Yeah. So my partner was posted up on the highway waiting for this car to come in. He could only go one of two directions and he came ours. So he saw the car. car and the way that our staffing levels are, it's only him and I in our area. So the staffing

isn't the best. So we planned out this traffic stop. And when you know it's a stolen vehicle, you just go about it a different way. Like you don't just walk up and say like, hey, I'm deputy so and I stopped you because XYZ. You do what's called a high risk stop or a felony stop. So once you put your car in park, you get out and you draw your firearm. Ideally, you'd have like four officers there that way you can have like a handgun and a long gun and someone on less lethal just so we have different options. But we unfortunately didn't have that availability. So my partner and I stop this car happens to be like in this massive Home Depot parking lot. And the guy gets out at first and like, you know, puts his hands up in the air, all this good stuff. It's totally going

with the program. And he like looks around. And if you work in law enforcement, you know like when someone's looking around, it's not a good thing. Does that mean he's looking for back? up he is friends hiding or something either that or like he's looking for a place to bolt he's like well where's my nearest escape route um and that's what he did he started running away and the partner i was with is like super solid super squared away like total inverted triangle very fit great partner definitely someone you want in a fight and he starts chasing him on foot and i thought to myself i'm like yeah right i'm not chasing on foot i'm going to get hurt why would i do that sounds like me as a cop.

There's nothing wrong with that. Yeah, wait, physical activity. I'm not doing that. So I'm like, I'll just follow in my car. Like, if he happens to lose my partner, I'll be able to follow in my car. No big deal. And he zigzags through the parking lot and comes to a hospital that was in the same parking structure.

And at that hospital were other police officers from a different jurisdiction. And they had someone they had just arrested who was getting medically cleared at the hospital to be transported to our jail. And they're just waiting outside, waiting for their guy to be ready. And he rounds the corner and sees them. And he sees them and like totally panics and starts running towards my car. So I'm super stoked. I'm like, yes, I'm going to like jump out and tackle him and arrest him. Like every cop stream. Like everyone wants to do that. And I slam on my brakes. And I jump out of my car. And my partner grabs him. And out of the corner of my eye, I see my car continuing to drive without me behind the wheel. What? Yes. And it was horrible. I mean, like, police aren't everyone's

favorite right now. We definitely get picked apart in the media. So of course, my first thought is like, oh my God, my car is going to crash or what if it crashes into someone and I injure someone or like, just like thinking of these headlines that are going to be horrendous and like, I could lose my job for this. So I start running after my car because we're obviously, you know, liable for everything we do. And the right half of my body makes it in just fine. And the left half doesn't. What does that mean by the left half of your body didn't make it into the car? So like my right butt cheek was sitting down.

And my left leg is just like slowly getting drugged behind me. It's like totally like, you know, that cartoon like X where you see a character just like stretching. Yeah, like elastic girl. Yes, that was me, except I'm not elastic. So what do you do? So I still have to stop my car. It's still like traveling through this parking lot. And I'm like, oh, God, please help me.

Like, I don't want to crash. This is horrible. And so I end up using just the leverage from my right leg to like heave myself into the car. And while I'm doing that, I hear this loud, audible pop. And I'm like, oh, no big deal. Maybe it's just like, you know, like popping a knuckle. Like I was thinking it was something like that. So I stopped my car.

Don't hit anything. Super stoked, super proud of myself. And then I get out. and I start to take a few steps to get to my partner and nothing worked below my knee. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, maybe like it's just adrenaline. Maybe I'm super nervous. Like, it's obviously a really high stress situation.

And it's normal to like have your have your stress totally worked up. So I'm like, oh, I'm just nervous. No big deal. And I take a few more steps and it's still not working. I'm like, okay, something's totally wrong. And I like look down, start checking myself. Like there's no broken bones. I don't have like bones protruding through.

my skin. I'm like, but something is very obviously wrong. So I physically braced my knee with both of my hands and like hobbled back to my car. And then someone came over and they're like, Fran, are you okay? I'm like, no, like get me in the hospital. Something's totally wrong. And then we went from there and yeah. So did you ever catch this suspect? Oh yeah. He went to jail. The best part about him is so thanks to the pandemic, the criminal justice system has definitely been affected. And ironically, he was arrested that very same day, earlier that day, for the same charge, felony vehicle theft. And he was released thanks to zero dollar rail. Thank you, Governor Newsom. And as soon as he got released, he found his way to a rural area, stole another car.

Oh my gosh. Recommitted the same exact crime. And I encountered him an hour after that happened. So what did you find out was wrong with your leg? How was the, what was the injury? So my leg was basically being held together by skin. Oh. Yeah. So it was broken? So it wasn't broken, but like all of the ligaments, all of the tendons, everything, they were either completely gone or they were torn and just like hanging by a thread.

Oh, sick. It was disgusting. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Okay. So the recovery process for that, I imagine, was absolutely bruising. I mean, I cannot even go. I can't imagine going from like being fully mobile to completely needing care because I'm assuming you couldn't move around. So what did you need help with in the recovery process? What was going on there? The recovery was horrendous. So it was rough because since it was an on duty injury, we have to go through like workman's comp. And if anyone listening has been injured at work, you know workman's comp is horrible. It took three weeks just to get an MRA to find out what was wrong. me and then an additional two months after that to get surgery to fix it. But yeah, like just like

what you said, I went from this very active, very like highly functioning lifestyle like 12, 13, 14 hour work days. And then when I get off work, I'd go work out at Orange Theory, which is like super high intensity interval gym, doing everything myself, like a normal 30 year old person would be doing to I can't drive anywhere. I can't take a shower by myself. I can't change my clothes by myself. I can't do anything. So to go from like this super high functioning lifestyle to needing someone to basically do everything for me. It was horrible. Luckily, my husband is very patient. But it, yeah, it was a huge struggle. It was like definitely a difficult change of like mindset and just like being patient with myself. So how long was, how long were you totally

like bedridden or house, house ridden or whatever you would call it? So I got injured. on April 20th. I had surgery, I think July 1st. And I went back to work light duty. So just like desk job, like filing paperwork, September 1st. How was your mental state during that time not being able to work and be an active police officer? At first, it's nice to have some downtime. Don't get me wrong. But then like, you know, you start to feel just like this huge loaf. Like you're just rotting away. at your house, you know, you don't feel like you're doing anything proactive with your life. It's a horrible feeling to go from like, you know, total opposites going from one to another. I hated it. It was rough.

So tell me about thin blue line. Thin blue lifestyle? Sorry, yes. You're good. Tell me about thin blue lifestyle. So I started thin blue lifestyle because I had all of this downtime. And like being off work, I'm like, well, I don't just want to sit here and like rot away into nothingness. I wanted to do something productive with my time. So I figured, you know, why not look

into trainings? Why not do this? Why not make myself a better partner for when I come back to work? And while I'm looking into this, I was thinking to myself, I'm like, we have so much training and knowledge as law enforcement officers. And so many people treat it as like, it's like this big secret or like you have to be a part of like the cool kids club to know this information. And in my mind, I'm like, that's dumb. Why do I not want to share this with other people so that they can, you know, be more safety conscious? And it just went from there. Like I just totally dove into it. And it's all information that like I wish someone would have taught me when I was, you know, in college or or a young female or just a young person in general, because why wouldn't you want to

be more safety conscious? Absolutely. And so what topics do you cover on social media? And what is what, where can people find you? Yeah. So people can find. me on Instagram. It's just at Thin Blue Lifestyle, no spaces, no underscores, nothing like that. And we just go like literally everything. We go over basic medical stuff like how to apply a tourniquet or like how to stop the bleed on different parts of the body or how to put together a basic medical kit for you or your family or to leave in your car or how to put together like a go bag that you can leave in your car that if you have to up and go in a moment's notice, you'll at least be good for a few days. You know, we talk about like concealed carry stuff like basic.

firearms fundamentals and safety and things that when I was a newer female deputy getting into firearms and stuff, there was no one there to tell me like, oh, hey, you can still look cute and like carry your gun too. And someone that I really look up to and she's been an amazing mentor's Emily from Style Me Tactical. Dude, we love Emily Valentine. She's awesome. I love her. I've met her in person when my husband and I were in D.C. And she's amazing. She's been like a great mentor. I'm like, I love her style.

Our styles are very similar. I'm like, okay, I definitely like I loved the tips that she would give. So I like to give like a little bit of fashion advice or like, oh, like, oh, if you're purse carrying, do this instead. Like a lot of things that when I was new to this whole safety conscious self-reliant journey, I wish someone had told me and helped me with and now I'm helping other people. And I mean, it's super fulfilling. most of the time it's more fulfilling than police work. So I can't complain.

I think that's so awesome. And I love that you make police work seem so much more relatable. And I like humanizing a police officer, I think, is so important in this culture right now. And just the stigma and the stereotype of what someone is like and their personality is like that decides to pursue a career in policing. Yeah, totally. I mean, a lot of law enforcement officers. officers out there. Like, it's intimidating. A lot of them are like very macho. And, you know, at first glance, they're not the most welcoming people. And we're not like that. At least, you know, a lot of the people I work with aren't like that. So to show them like, hey, I'm just, I'm just Fran. Like, I'm just here to help you and to help you feel more like confident on this whole self-reliancy journey.

And I'm not here like masquerading myself as like, you know, this most tactical girl. Because that's not me. It's not my style. And I know, like, I totally have a huge. amount to go on this journey of, you know, firearms, fundamentals and all of these skills. And that's a big part of thin blue lifestyle is like putting it out there that you don't have to be amazing at this. It's totally fine to start and be new at it and not feel comfortable and to build your skills up. And that's what it's all about because everyone has to start somewhere. So to be intimidated by all of these other like larger accounts or like, oh, I want to go and ask for help. But I don't know where. Like, cool. Come to me. Come to thin blue lifestyle.

we all start somewhere and, you know, we're here to help everybody learn and grow. I love the resiliency and the resourcefulness and just the creativity behind thin blue lifestyle. It's exactly like when I started Pop Politics, my daily show where I cover pop culture on Instagram and entertainment news from a conservative perspective, I just wanted to create something that I wasn't seeing, you know, in a movement that I loved in the conservative movement. And so I just made it myself and you really did the same thing with Thin Blue Lifestyle. So congratulations. I love following you. You're so much fun. I highly recommend following Fran. She's

absolute who on social media. And you totally get my sense of humor and everything when we're interacting on DMs and stuff, which I love. Oh, yeah. I love it. Yes, I love it. Thank you, Fran. Thank you so much, Alex. Hannah and Matt, thank you guys so much for both being here to share your very unique love story. First of all, I want to start with when and where did you meet. Absolutely. So about three years ago, I had just gotten a new job at this Jewish organization that did a lot of work on Israel education and fighting anti-Semitism. And actually my very first day on the job that asked me to go to Philadelphia for this fundraising gala. I said, all right, sounds about, sounds good. And I took a train and I get there. And I'm meeting a lot of

new people, some of my coworkers. And actually one of those people was Hannah. So she worked at the same organization that I had just started at. We didn't really have a chance to talk all that much at the beginning because it was so crazy. There was a lot of, you know, gals are busy and crazy. And I know you were there kind of. Yeah. I worked on the event side of things. And, you know, you just meet people. and so we were meeting new coworkers. I'm like, okay. And it was actually funny. One of our coworkers asked me later if I thought he was cute because I knew I was Christian and he was Christian.

And actually kind of said, oh, I think he's too young for me. But then fast forward a year later and we were at a wedding from one of my best friends who happened to be his boss. And it was a Jewish wedding. we were the only Christians there, the only single Christians there. And it kind of just threw us together. Yeah. And yeah. It was, it was incredible because, you know, somebody had mentioned to me earlier, like,

hey, Matt, like, you know, people meet people at weddings all the time. And I was like, this is a super Jewish wedding, like very, very Jewish wedding in Brooklyn. There was no way I was going to meet anybody there. I told myself, like, there's no way. Like, I'm just there to have fun and celebrate my boss. And then you saw Hannah. And you're like, wait a minute, I've met you before. Yeah.

And so I had seen her. And so, you know, it was fine at first. I didn't think much of it until the music turned. Listen, music starts. And we all know when the music starts, people want to dance. He loves to dance, Alex. Like, this guy can dance so well. So it was kind of like one of those things.

He starts dancing. And then, I don't know, we just ended up dancing with each other and really hit it off. Yeah. We just spent the entire evening together. we went and took some shots. She actually grabbed me. It was like, let's go grab another shot. And I was like, I don't know.

But I was like, you know, she's looking really cute tonight. So I had to. So when did you find out that each other was conservative? So I think it was like on our first date. We were like talking about all the things that people tell you not to talk about on a first date. But at this point when I was dating, I was like, I want to be really intentional. And I don't want to date someone who doesn't align with me on the things that

matter and the non-negotiable. So I kind of just, we just laid it out on the table. And I was talking about my political beliefs. And he agreed. And I was like, oh my gosh, thank goodness. Like with And so Matthew, when you heard her say, these are my beliefs. This is very important to me. I'm a conservative. As a guy, what was your immediate reaction to hearing a girl say that and be so sure of being conservative? It was a major side relief because my track record of dating, nobody that I dated in the past was really conservative. Granted, like, I didn't really, I wasn't super strong. Actually, like, this is a side story, but in college, I was actually very liberal.

So I didn't really care about, you know, I just assumed everybody believed what I believe. And that's a whole different story for another time. But by the time I ended college and kind of began my professional career, I had become more conservative. And so once I finally spoke with Hannah and we talked about that, I was like, this is exactly what I'm looking for, you know, as a Christian, as a conservative. there are some values and beliefs that for me are extremely important to find in a partner. So it was a major side of relief, to be honest with you.

Okay. And so in what ways 2020 happens, the pandemic happens, how did Jarrell's work environment actually get worse? You want me to go? Yeah. So we actually were one of the first organizations, at least on the coast like New York, that like went remote. And before, like, before the pandemic happened, like with the election, a lot of people at work were talking about things.

And we had a lot of colleagues who would post and they were liberal. And there was kind of this like privilege for them that they could post whatever they wanted on their personal social medias. And our us as conservatives in the organization really weren't given that same kind of privilege. Like we would. At the Jewish organization? Yeah. So we kept everything like, especially because your social media also represented the organization. So there was this, you had to be professional online.

So it was just this weird thing. So that was that started when like election season was coming up. And I work, I'm based out of New York. So New York is, as we know, pretty liberal. So that was like something I've experienced like for a long time. But then everything started happening escalating. and it just got worse because things got heightened. And then, yeah, it just kind of was like a snowball effect for us.

And we also didn't get to see each other in person for three months during 2020 with like lockdowns. Yeah, actually, we haven't mentioned this, but we are long distance. We've been long distance the entire relationship. So we've really, we really got hit hard. We spent, we had before the pandemic, we had seen each other at least every two, three weeks, maybe once a month, you know, whether I, because I was living in Washington, D.C. at the time. She was living in New Jersey. And so we really had to figure it out.

And once a pandemic, it became a lot harder to see each other. I had a traveling job with my organization. So I was able to make it work pre-pandemic. But then things became a lot more difficult after the pandemic. But like with your saying about like the work environment and stuff, like lines kind of got drawn. People got harsher in their beliefs, I think, when it came to like the political side of things. And I don't know if Matt felt this way, but I felt like I couldn't talk or like out loud at work,

but that also kind of fueled me to be stronger in my beliefs because I was feeling so isolated. You actually had a very close friend confront you. What prompted that confrontation? Yeah. So it was a message on like Instagram where you were texting about something that had to do with nothing. It had like just a regular conversation. And out of nowhere, it, it turned and she first like really cornered to be about like, oh, I think it's really important that you vote a certain way in this election and like, are your parents going to vote for Trump and all this stuff? And then she like pivoted it to abortion and like, what's your stance on abortion? So it's just kind of this weird, I don't know, I felt like completely taken off

guard. This is someone I've known for a really long time. And I didn't even know how to respond because I was like we were just talking about, you know, normal things. And that out of nowhere, I just felt like I got cornered. And it was really hard. I'm not usually confrontational person. And I'm someone that really treasures my relationships. So I felt like she didn't know me at all and was starting to question who I was, even though she's known me for a long time.

And the abortion one hit really hard because of Matt's story. I'm going to let him share that with you. Yeah. Yeah, like two seconds. My mom had a very complicated pregnancy and multiple doctors were telling her to abort because if not, neither I nor my mother would survive. But my mom had recently became a born again Christian and she said, no, God gave me this child.

I'm having this child after an extremely arduous birth and she went into a coma. Thank the Lord. I survived. I had to have like emergency surgery and there's this photo of me as an infant with seemingly hundreds of cables attached in and around my body. That is very emotional for my family even until this day. But I think that story for me carries a lot of weight in how I view abortion. And I actually, like I remember watching your recent podcast with the abortion survivor.

And I just think like, you know, it's just one of those things that's extremely important to me. Did your mom survive, Matt? Absolutely. Yeah. She is my, she's here with us. That's another miracle. She's amazing. She's my number one advocate.

my favorite person in the world, obviously besides Hannah. And I love her so much. And she's very proud of me. I'm an only child. And so, yeah. So Hannah, when this girl, this girlfriend of yours had confronted you about being pro life, had you always been pro life? Or did you become pro life after dating Matt and hearing his story?

So I've always been pro life. I grew up in a strong Christian household. And for me, it was just a no-brainer. because life, I value life and so does the faith that I'm a part of. And I think it's something that never came up in conversation with this friend before. But all of a sudden it did. So when that happened, I did send her like a really long message explaining, look, like I'm not supportive of abortion because if abortion happened, the person that I'm in love with,

like would not be here today. Wow. What did she say to this? that. Honestly, I don't like, I'm trying to remember the exchange and she kind of sort of said, oh, like, I didn't know or something. And, but it didn't really change much after that. After that, we really just kind of fell out of talking. Yeah. But I did bring that story because I'm like, you know, I have an instance actually that's really hits close to home for me. In addition to my already like my conviction I had prior to that. And you know, that also could have.

have been planting a seed for her as well, hearing that, you know, may not have changed her mind right that in the moment. But who knows? Who's to say a few months down the road, a few years down the road, that that couldn't have an effect. And you mentioned so much of your relationship being long distance, even your engagement. So I am curious what advice you guys have for listeners who are in a long distance relationship, other cute servatives. Absolutely. You have no idea how many times people say, like, long distance relationships are impossible. Don't do it. It might not be for everybody, but for those who really want to make it work, I think communication is so important.

We face time every single day. We always face time in the morning, at least, and at least at night, and pray together. That's something that's really important to have that kind of Christian centerpiece in our relationship. I would also say anytime they're together

to make it intentional, I know that in today's generation, it's super easy to be on your phone while on dinner or like, you know, be distracted in what's going on. But any, even if it's for a day, even it's for a weekend, make every single moment intentional because you never know. Once you guys are, hopefully one day, you know, you and your partner will be closer together and not have to deal with long distance.

Right. So Matt. Oh, so go ahead, Hannah. Oh, yeah. Sorry. As I say, also to the conservative, like, be creative. We found like a bunch of different apps that we could do like this one called house party. So you can both be on it, but you can play games. So you like can do Pictionary and you can do these different like games together. So like if you only have FaceTime available, you like, you know, shake it up. Also, like watch the same Netflix series. We did that. We did like, so you'd be on FaceTime but watch the same show. So you have to like, it's, it's work. But it's, it can be fun. You just have to get creative with it. Yeah. I've heard some friends of mine that have been in long distance relationships. They had a cool idea. They would

FaceTime each other. And then they would order DoorDash or Postmates food from the same restaurant. example, they would both order something from Cheesecake Factory and then they would eat it together and like have a candle dinner set up or whatever each of their apartments. And then it would be kind of like, oh, we'd get her together, which is honestly, it's kind of depressing. But like, I love the creativity and that you do what you do to make it work. And that makes me think, Matt, hearing you talk about it and how intentionally you've been with Hannah, is it fair to say that, you know, when people talk about, oh, long distance is impossible, I feel like if a guy wants to make it work, he's going to make it work.

Absolutely. And even before I met Hannah, I had come to the realization, you know, I had just graduated from college, probably six months before I met Hannah, that I'm dating to marry. I'm not dating to just have fun. I'm not dating to for pleasure. I'm really dating to start a life of somebody. And if you find somebody that you really see that with, which for Hannah, I really only like first two months, I could tell, first two, three months I could tell she was going to be the one.

if you really want to make it work, you're going to make it work. Now, what was it about her, though, that made you think this girl's the one? Well, number one is kind of what we alluded to earlier with the values and the fact that we also are in the same field, you know, fighting anti-Semitism, talking about Israel, talking about all these complex issues. I love that because it's like you guys are both running your own race, but then you can come together. You guys are both working towards the same goal. Then you can run the race together. Absolutely. That's something that's extremely important to us.

And also I just love her for her heart, heart of a servant. And, you know, she's very involved in her church. And that's something that I want my spouse and also the mother of my kids to be that, to be that leader and to be that example. So pre marital counseling. Is that a yes for you guys as you're in your engagement period or you're not doing that? So that's a yes. We're actually in it currently.

So we've had some sessions. It's good. I think that people, underestimate it. It's going to be hard. You have to talk about things. But I think it's better to talk about all this stuff before you like get married and then it happens. Like I just, I've heard too many stories. Yeah. Also, it's not, it's not good. Talk about everything first. Also, there's this stigma that only if you have merit, if you're having relationship issues that you should do pre-mederal counseling, no. Like, if you are, if you have minimal issues, you should still do

premarral counseling because you never know what's behind the closet. You never know what will come out. Did you find out anything yet about each other that surprised you that you didn't know, you don't have to say what it was, but has there been things that you're like, you know what? We never talked about that. Not yet, but we did do this temperament exam that they like gave to us. And it was really interesting to find that out. Our temperaments are like very evenly matched on things.

But there are certain areas. And when they were reading it back, we were both like, oh, yeah, that's you. Oh, yeah, that's me. So that was interesting to find it. out how close are like whatever scores were on. I love that. That's going to give so many people hope that are trying to find their cute servitive or their dude servitive.

And I think hearing from you guys, these are real people that watch Poplitics just like you, that listen to the spillover, just like you, that are going through the same things, that have gone through the same things. And now they have a happy ending. And, you know, really your story, actually, I wouldn't even say an ending, but your story is just starting to be written. So that's so exciting. Thank you, Matt and Hannah, for coming on the spillover.

And congratulations, by the way. And you're naming your first born, Alex, right? Boy or girl can be Alex. It does. It does work both ways. And we do have some cute, servib friends who are single. So if anybody is looking, we can have to be a matchmaker. We're already thinking of our single friends going to our wedding.

That we can set up. That we can set up. Because we know. Good. And I think that's the right thing to do, actually. I think that those of us that are in relationships or are married already, we cannot forget about our single friends and helping them. and thinking about who do I know, you know, like a cousin's friend or anyone, just who do I know

that I can set up? Because I think that also is such a better way for people to find other people to date than doing dating apps. Like having people in common that can vouch for them and say, this is somebody that has good character. I think that's important. Matt and Hannah, thank you so much. Thanks, Alex.

Thank you, Alex. Autumn, let's set the stage a little bit here. It was your first week working for students for life. You were part of a group that was protesting and counseling. counter protesting on the steps of the Supreme Court. Going into that day, were you nervous about being around this pro abortion group or were you really just excited? So I was a little nervous, but more excited than nervous. So we had a group of about 10 people, some guys, some girls, so it was a good mix. And we were just saying an Airbnb really close to the Capitol. So we were

ready to respond whenever something was happening. And we heard that this protest was going on. And so we're like, well, we have to be there. And so we headed over. And we were pretty excited leading into it. And explain what the protest was, who this pro-abortion group was that you guys were going to counter-protest. And how big was their group compared to your Students for Life group? Yeah. So like I was saying, we had a group of just about 10.

So we were a small group and the protest was being led by NAROL. So obviously a huge pro-abortion group. And we show up and we don't know what we're showing up to. So we have our signs and our megaphone and it's probably over 100 people. So we're very far outnumbered. And they're all right in front of the steps of the Supreme Court. So we go just right across the road on the sidewalk. And we began holding our signs in protest.

And they saw us coming because we came running on with our bullhorn going and with our signs. And they knew we were there from the moment we showed up. What were some of the things that you guys were shouting or saying in the megaphone and the posters that you were holding, what were the things that, you know, possibly could have triggered this group? Yeah. So we were in D.C. right before Amy Coney Barrett was confirmed to the Supreme Court. So a lot of our messaging was confirm ACB. Like, why are these feminists protesting a woman? Listen to pro-life woman, hear pro-life woman, very pro-woman and then also pro-life messaging. So it makes sense that that's really what triggered them.

And also a lot of the pro-life language of we must defend human life. This baby has a heartbeat, that type of language as well. So you're just doing your job advocating for life. And then this woman comes up to you. What was this pro-abortion woman saying and doing? Yeah. So at this time, we had crossed the street and headed over to the steps of the Supreme Court. So we were in the midst of it with all the NARAL protesters as well.

We felt safe going over there, had some guys with us. There are people recording. There was a police presence. So we go over there and I'm holding a sign and it says, I can't believe these feminists are protesting a woman. And then I had hashtag confirm ACB. So very blatantly going against everything that they were out there for. Yeah. And this woman just came up out of the crowd about my age.

So I'm about 25. And I'd say she was about my age. And she comes up to me. me and just ask me why I'm holding that sign. What do I think feminism means to me? And I go, well, I don't think it means that we empower women by telling them they need to kill their children. And that was basically all I said to her before anything further happened. And so how does it escalate from that point? When could you tell that the situation was escalating, I should say? Yeah. And so that's what's interesting. I couldn't tell it was escalating. So that was

basically our only exchange. She just came up to me, asked why I was holding the sign and what feminism meant to me. And I told her. And then, so we're probably only about like three feet away from each other. We're pretty close. And I'm with my group. And so I respond. And she's just, she doesn't say anything back to me.

She's just staring me down. So I'm like, I'm just going to keep my eyes straight ahead. And then out of nowhere, she just punched me in the face. we hadn't talked for probably about a minute or two. Holy crap, it just came out of absolute nowhere. It really did. And so was it a hard punch? Like she put all her weight behind this punch?

Or it was kind of like she was a little hesitant? She was definitely hesitant. So I thankfully wasn't hurt by it. And I think even if it did hurt, it's like my adrenaline was going so much even before that happened. It was enough I like stumbled backwards. and she actually ironically, like, ripped off my mask when she hit me in the face. And I just stumbled backwards.

And like, I don't fully remember it, but there's a little bit of a video clip. And I just kind of stumbled backwards. I kind of just stand there for a second because I'm stunned. I can't believe this just happened. And then I just started crying and I was so overwhelmed. And it was a very crazy experience. Were you saying anything to her when you started crying or were your friends that were in students for life saying anything?

Like, why would you do that? So she fled right into the crowd. She hit me and like did not look at me. What a coward. Yeah. And that's exactly what I said too. She, I didn't even had the opportunity to say anything to her. And so did you guys immediately go find the police? What happens next? Yeah. So we are like right, yeah, right by the step still. Police are pretty close by. So one of my managers, he goes over and because he was recording this all too while it was happening, but the camera wasn't right on me when it happened. And so he goes running over to the police and it's like, hey, one of our coworkers just got assaulted. And they were asking me, do you know what this girl looked like? Any like descriptive like information that I could give.

But I was so overwhelmed. I really couldn't remember. And she had fled into the crowd. I was like, she's a girl about mid-20s, brown hair, had her hair up, was wearing a white t-shirt. And it was like a super, super hot day. All of us are so sweaty and gross. And so we were talking to the police and they're asking if I want to press charges if they want me to go find the woman that hit me. And so I tell them like, I don't really want to press charges. Why not? I was really overwhelmed at the time. I just wanted to move on from it. So it was my first week in the job. And I didn't want the whole punch. situation to be what defined me.

That's so interesting because I feel like I would have done the opposite. I would have been like, yeah, like I would have been all over social media. Like, I'm the girl that got punched because it shows how insane these pro-abortion women are and how they don't care about treating women respectfully. And I just feel like it would have made such a good example out of that to open people's eyes. Do you regret not pressing charges? or you still feel good about that decision?

So I still feel good about not pressing charges. I was super vocal about it on social media. My, like, Twitter blew up, my Instagram blew up. I was just getting comments from a bunch of pro-abortion people. They tracked us down and found our Instagrams. And so were they like, I'm so sorry she doesn't represent us or were they defending this psycho? Oh, they were defending her coming for me? Really? What were they saying?

You deserve it? Like, no, well, some of that. But then also the discussion. language of like, I eat fetuses for breakfast. Six. Or like all the very gross messaging that you see from kind of the Gen Z pro-abortion people. They just do that, I think, to shock us.

They know that it like gets under our skin, so they just like to say that crazy outlandish stuff. 100%. It's all for the shock, like, reaction and the factor that they just want to get you riled up. So it didn't, the punch didn't hurt you in the moment. You decided not to press charges. you were vocal on social media, but how did the effect,

how did the assault affect you afterwards? Did you struggle with wanting to go to any other marches or protests going forward? Yeah, so I was definitely hesitant and still somewhat am. I actually haven't been back to the Supreme Court for anything since, yeah, so that was September of 2020. So, and I live in Chicago,

and there's been opportunities for me to go to some protests, but I haven't. And it is a little bit of the hesitancy of what's going to happen because Chicago is just as liberal as D.C. is. And the idea of what could happen, it definitely does scare me, kind of whether I like to admit it or not. Were you diagnosed with PTSD or anything after that incident? No, I wasn't. And I actually went to the doctor, like for a physical examination after just to make sure I was okay. And I was.

But yeah, it's still like it's funny talking about it right now. It still feels like it's a situation that didn't happen to me. I feel very like removed from it almost. Like it's very interesting. Like when I was like reading the articles that came out or anything, I was like, wait, that actually happened to me. That's what was really weird for me to grapple with. Are you still involved with students for life?

Yes, I am. So that was my first week. So now I've been there for over a year. Wow. And so is everybody pretty understanding at the office? Like, okay, you know, Autumn is not going to be the one that we, you know, send out in the trenches again for a little bit till she's ready. Everybody's been nice about it. Yeah.

And everyone was like, I can't believe you didn't quit after that happened. Like everyone was so worried I was going to quit. But I was like, no. I'm like, that made me so much more fired up to want to do this job because I'm seeing firsthand just how radical. And to the like links they are willing to go, the pro abortion crowd. if they're willing to be violent just to a random stranger on the street, then it's no wonder that they're okay with abortion. I love that autumn. Yeah, it all just made sense. It just shows that key preservatives are not quitters. We are in this fight. Yes. Okay, so what do you hope other

key observatives can learn from your story of standing for life? I mean, after getting literally knocked down, but then choosing to be the much bigger person towards the person who wronged you. Yeah. So like you said, always just be the bigger person. Don't be afraid to stand up for yourself. Be vocal on social media. You'll make connections with other pro-life friends. You'll learn about other pro-life organizations. You just can't be afraid, even though it is very scary. You're not in the fight alone, like the media makes it out to be. You do have people on your side. And we're ready to support you. Autumn. Thank you so much for sharing your story. Yes, thanks, Alex. Just into your story starts when you were 17 on your way home one summer afternoon in 2018.

And basically it should have been one of the best summers of your life. You were young nearing the end of high school and it was beautiful and warm outside in Idaho. At one point, the route required you to yield before making a left turn off of a busy road. There was a lot of traffic because a train had just crossed the tracks and held up the oncoming cars. But finally, you saw a clear opening. you make the turn and out of nowhere your life change is literally forever

can you tell us what happened next? Yeah so I make that left turn and instantly there's just a huge bang a loud bang and I my car completely turned and I reared like you'll mention it

but there are so many miracles that happen throughout this day but I reared towards the a ditch but my car actually didn't go into the ditch it stopped before. And all of a sudden, I'm looking around and the airbags are all off. All the airbags in the back. And I'm like, what just happened? I'm sitting there in complete shock. I had no idea what it just happened. I knew I hit something or someone, but I had no idea that it was

that bad at all. You mean, you never imagine it that it would be that bad. And yeah, all of a sudden, probably about like 30 seconds later, a man is coming to my door. My car actually called 911 automatically. I was driving a Kia. Automatically, call 911. Automatically, people came to come rescue me, and there was tons of people around. Tons of people stopped at the railroad track, so everyone was watching.

And yeah, a man came and opened the door, got me out, and it was traumatic, that's for sure. Did you know immediately what had happened or were you disoriented? No, so I was disoriented. I was sitting in the car in complete shock. Didn't know if I should cry, scream. I think after

about 25 seconds, I started screaming. Why were you screaming? When you walked out, what did you see? So my hands are like shaking, but every time I tell the story, it's just, you know, brings it all back. But I get out of the car and this man is helping me. He's such a good man, but he was trying to make sure I didn't see something. And he was like pushing me and making me go to the across the road, but I saw it right away and probably about 10 or 15 feet away, there's just a body lying there. And it was so graphic, just photo, like it's just planted in my brain. I'll never forget that moment, but his head was on the ground and there was blood just everywhere. And it was traumatic and I'll never forget it.

But yeah, I just saw him there and I knew at that second, I literally just hit a man and I killed, he died instantly and I just killed someone. What was your first thought to call your parents or call 911? I mean, your car kind of called 911 for you, but what was going through your mind? I was freaking out. I wasn't thinking about my parents or anything. It literally felt like a nightmare. Like I actually, that's what, you know, shock is too.

Like, you have no idea that that's actually real. It doesn't seem like a reality. You know, no one ever, like, teaches you how to deal with trauma or trauma happening to you. you know so once it happened the guy was like what's your what's your family's phone number and he called for me he did all that for me and while he was doing it I was just staring across the street at a man and then when the cops came at the man on the ground and his name was Chad so if I mentioned Chad that's him um but I was just staring and his body was lying on the ground blood everywhere and then eventually the fire department came and I saw them him put him in a body bag bring the body bag away

Like, I was in shock. I had no idea. Like, I literally just hit somebody. But yeah, he called my family. That man called the family for me. So I was grateful for that. Did Chad's family come to the scene? Did you meet them or that wasn't later?

No. So they actually don't, they didn't live in the state. And he wasn't wearing a helmet. So that's like why he died instantly. So he was on a bike? He was on a motorcycle. and yeah, so it's not, you don't have to wear a helmet in Idaho on a motorcycle, and he was on his way to work.

And, yeah, the parents didn't, they weren't. So they just, they got a phone call. And that was a huge thing that I was, you know, having to deal with, like, I'm going to be the reason why his family gets a phone call today saying your son has passed away, your son is dead. And, yeah, yeah. Did they have you go to the hospital and get checked out and everything after, the scene or did you have to file a report on the scene?

I did have to file a report on the scene, which was, obviously they were so nice, but it's like, you don't want to be answering all these questions about yourself. So luckily they waited until my family came and my mom answered for me. And I was just sitting in the car with my head on her lap, just in complete shock. Were your parents saying things to you like, Jacinta, this isn't your fault, it was an accident, or what were they saying? Yeah, so I know my brothers showed up first. and my brother just hugged me and wouldn't let go of me. Then my mom showed up.

My dad was at work and my brothers were like, we need to call dad. We need to let him know what happened. And my mom's like, do not. He drives for a living basically. He's a salesman. And so she's like, he's going to get in a car accident if he hears what had happened. So she called him and she's like, pull over, honey, pull over. He pulled over and he was just like, I'm on my way freaking out.

I'm the only girl in the family with six older brothers. So my brothers were ecstatic. My brother lives in New York. He was like, I'll fly out and help you and we'll make this all right. And my mom's like, just repeating, it wasn't your fault. It wasn't your fault. But I mean, I didn't believe any of it at first, of course. When the initial shock wore off, what emotions were you overcome by? Well, the shock lasted for about three days. So I was in bed staring at the ceiling for literally three days. And I remember people coming in and bringing flowers or people coming in and my mom with them and just talking about what happened. And I was, I don't remember any of it. I was literally in bed for three days staring at the ceiling, thinking about, you know, the family being called and the family being, you know, like I said, they've passed away. And so after the shock wore off, I just remember having a heavy, heavy weight on my shoulders. Every time I left the house, I went to church after that, and I just remember I felt like everyone was staring at me. And obviously they weren't, you know, but I had like this heavy, I felt like it was a heavy secret, you know.

But everybody knew about it in my town. I grew up in a small town. So just a heavy weight that was on my shoulders, like feeling like, you know, after something like that happens after you kill someone, it's life-changing. It really is.

Were you afraid of repercussions? Like, were you like, oh, my gosh, am I going to go to jail? What happens? Oh, yeah. I was like, oh, I'm going to go to jail. But then luckily, I was 17. And I wasn't turning 18 until October,

and this happened in June. and the family, well, the mom at least was very, she's a saint in my books. She's a beautiful, beautiful, and she's one of the best people I've ever known, honestly. When and how did you find out that this man's family was not going to take any legal action against you? So I was freaking out and I obviously was, you know, dealing with the shock. And once the shock kind of started to wear off, it was about a month later, my mom, and my dad sat me down and they're like, we have something to tell you. And I was like, what is it?

And they were like, so they have ruled it to be your fault because we weren't sure before. And so they're like, they've ruled it to be your fault, which just brought back everything. You know, all the shock brought back was brought back to me. And yeah, so they sat me down and they were so good and they hit everything from me. like all of the insurance stuff. But I was also just like, why? Like, how are these people not suing me or, you know, all this stuff? Like, taking action against me.

Like, they must hate me. I remember thinking, like, they must hate me so much. Like, I'm hated so much by these people. But then I was contacted by his mom. How did she contact you? She, I think my mom found her email and reached out to her. And then ever since, she emails me all the time. What did that first email say?

She was just re-emphasizing, this was not your fault. And she said, ever since my son, he was in his 40s. She said, ever since my son told me he got a motorcycle, I was waiting for that call to say, your son is dead. Your son has passed away in an accident. And she said she was just waiting for it and waiting for it because her husband lost a leg in a motorcycle accident.

So she just kept emphasizing to me, it wasn't your fault. This happened for a reason. God had a plan. I mean, she would send me care packages in college. Wow. Like, she literally is the best thing ever. I haven't talked to his father or anything. I know he was pretty upset about it at first, but she is just the best woman. And she actually lived in Arizona, so I'm hoping to meet her one day. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Well, I mean, obviously that must have been a relief to hear just that this woman had forgiven you, even though you accidentally killed her son. But that obviously doesn't change the fact that you have to live with this experience for the rest of your life. So what has helped you cope?

Have you done therapy? Did you have to go through anything like that? So luckily my mom is a psychiatrist and she has been for like 20 years. And so she has been, you know, the best thing. She, you know, basically does therapy for living. And so that helped me a lot. So I never went to therapy. I never felt like I needed it because my faith was my therapy.

and God was my therapy. And I found peace through that. Yeah, that's amazing. What did it look like for you to lean into your faith during this? I mean, my faith had always been every, I mean, I grew up a traditional Catholic. And so every single day at school, you know, you have catechism classes, and you're taught about God's goodness and God's justice. And so, I mean, I would go to church all the time.

I mean, that Sunday after it happened, I went to church, because that was the only place I could find peace. I knew that the worst thing that I could do was tear myself away from God because I've seen it done. And I think that's one of the reasons why I didn't tear myself away from him. And so I was like, I need to go to God with my suffering and with my pain because it's the only way I'm ever going to be able to, you know, not get over it, but just deal with it. In what ways has God's grace continued to impact you all these years after the accident? I mean, I always say, and I know my family knows I repeat this all the time, but I always say, God is so good. I mean, my mom always tells me there's a reason why you were chosen. Like, there's a reason why God at that exact moment and time decided I'm going to take Chad's soul,

but I'm going to let you survive. And I know there's a reason for it. So my entire life I've been like, and then even before the accident, I was like, there's something I meant to do and I don't know what it is. And so whether it be like this podcast, you know, and telling my story to people or working at Turning Point, you know what I mean? His grace has been so good to me and my life has been so good. And sometimes I think about it like, I don't deserve this, especially for what happened. But now I know that it happened for a reason. And, you know, Chad was chosen and I was chosen to live. Obviously this didn't happen that long ago.

It was 2018. But since the act, you brought up Turning Point since the accident, you graduated high school, you've gone to college. and now you've started working here at Turning Point USA. Does it feel like that day just happened yesterday or that it was just another lifetime at this point? When I think about it, like right now when I think about it, it's like PTSD, you know, like my heart's beating thousand miles a second. And with PTSD, you live in the moment every single time you think about it.

Every single time I pass by a motorcycle or people even bring up accidents, my mind automatically goes to that day. So it feels like a lifetime ago, but at the same time, it feels like its own life. Like it literally was a nightmare, you know? It was, it wasn't, it didn't seem like it was part of my life. You know what I mean? Like it just seems like it was in another world, you know, where that happened.

But I've dealt with it so well now that it's obviously become a part of my life and not a good part of my life, but definitely not something as negative as it was at the time. Part of your testimony, I think, with your faith journey. How long did it take for you to start being comfortable driving again? Oh, my gosh, months. It took months. I know my dad was like, no, you can't drive. And I was freaked out to drive my friends.

I mean, the way that the motorcycle hit me, the whole front of my car was gone. It was completely gone. They were like, the lawyers were like, you should be dead right now. The fact that you are not dead right now is just a huge testimony, you know? And I couldn't drive for months after that. I didn't want to drive my friends. I was scared I was going to get them an accident. Every time I take a turn now, I still freak out.

Like, it definitely comes back a lot even when I'm driving to this day. Do you feel like you're now because of this incident, like a overly cautious driver? Are you pretty normal now? I think I'm pretty normal. And I've even sometimes caught myself and I'm like, ooh, you shouldn't do that. Like I wear my, I never go anywhere without my, I always have my seat butt on. And I did at the time, but I'm always aware of that. I think I probably should be more cautious, but I was definitely, like, years after, yeah.

Well, how long did it take for you to start being willing to talk about the story and discuss it with people? Because one thing that shocked me, so, you know, Jacinta sits up with us with the popletics team and the spillover team where we're discussing show ideas and we brainstorm at loud. So we're having conversations, you know, talking about like, oh, what? to be cool to find a guess that did this. And I think someone was kidding. I think this sounds super dark, which, you know me and I have dark humor. So, like, I think somebody had joked and said something like, dude, it would be wild, like get somebody who's killed somebody. And you, you like, very sweet. Just since it was like, well, that happened to me. And we were like, you're joking. And you were like, no. And I mean, so you were willing, you told us. You're like,

no, I have this story. Like, it was an accident. It was a terrible, terrible day in my life. And I accidentally hit someone with my car and killed them. And we were shut. And we were shocked that you were willing to talk about this. So, I mean, that was bold of you. Yeah. How long did it take for you to start sharing the story? Um, I mean, I grew up in a small town, and so my community and my church knew about it automatically. You know, it was posted on Facebook, like, please pray for her. And I remember my friend was like, my mom walked into the room and was like, she's been in the fatal accident. She was like, she died. Like, you know, it was all, like, confusing. So it's like, I grew up in around an area where everybody, you know, like knew about it.

So, but years later, I mean, I almost like talking about it now just because I can bring awareness to it, you know, and to people who deal with PTSD or people who have been in places like I am where they accidentally kill somebody and it's like on their shoulders. Have you been diagnosed with PTSD formally? No, I haven't. But everything that I deal with, I'm pretty sure is what people deal with when they have it. Have you had any serious relationships since then where you had to have a moment and say, okay, how am I going to. to tell this guy that I really like, that I accidentally killed someone. Yeah. Luckily, that hasn't been having, not having a boyfriend or anything, hasn't been a problem. But even just in relationships with people, like, I think it'll just be in God's timing,

you know, and I think, I feel like people talk about accidents all the time as well. And so it'll come up very, it comes up very naturally with me. And so, yeah, I don't think it won't be, I think God's timing will be perfect. like it always is. What lesson do you hope, just since, that this story teaches your future kids

about life, grace, and even just who you are? I mean, I hope my kids and everyone who's listening, you know, will understand that God

has a plan for every single one of us. And I actually brought this. I'm holding a holy card. So we actually made cards after for the family. And my mom was like, you need to have a quote on it. And so I looked at my prayer book that has every single day of the year and it has prayers for that day.

So I looked and I looked at that day that it happened. And inside the prayer was, blessed is he whom now has chosen and taken to thee, he shall dwell, nigh courts. And so I was in complete shock-eyed goosebumps. I'm like, this is the quote we have to use. Like literally on that day, the quote is that God decided to choose him, you know, he chose him. God has a plan for every single one of us. might not, it might not be a plan that we expect, but God is all good, you know, he's all just. He's never going to put something in your way that you, first of all, you can't handle, or first of all,

that's bad or evil, you know what I mean? And so I hope everyone understands that God has a plan, and he's so, so good, and you need to turn to him with your problems, because otherwise you're going to turn to the evil of the world. You know, you're going to choose drugs and alcohol. And if I hadn't chosen God and stayed with God and brought my sorrow to him, I would not be here and I would be a completely different person. Such a beautiful story. It's a heartbreaking, haunting story, but so beautiful. And I'm really, really grateful that you were willing to share this today with

cute servitives because I also think it's cool just people that, you know, wonder what the behind the scenes of Turning Point USA is like, like, there are incredible young people. The average age of an employee here is 24, I think, in our turning point offices. And so you're, this happened in 2018. I just turned 21. So Jacinta's 21. These are incredible young people that work at our office with amazing testimonies, amazing stories that are on the front lines, fighting the culture war, you know,

fighting in the conservative movement, and just sharing their incredible stories of faith and hope and just a vision for what they hope this country is one day. And so I absolutely adore you and have loved getting to know you and working with you. Same. Yeah, thank you for sharing this with cute servatives. Oh, yeah. I hope someone can, at least one person can take, you know, something from the story and say a prayer for Chad because that's one of the reasons why I think he was chosen. He may not have had

many people praying for him, but now that so many thousands of people are going to be listening to this hopefully and hearing it, if everyone says a prayer, that's saving his soul slowly. So beautiful. Cute Servatives, you're the reason I come to work every day. Obviously, I've had my fair share of haters and obstacles as a result of my beliefs, but many, if not all, of cute conservatives actively face some level of hate for their beliefs, whether they're doxed, dropped by friends, fired from jobs, or called horrible names online. The conservative community is an antidote to all of the psychos out there who want to destroy American values and even conservative lives.

But we're also all here to support one another for the fun stuff, like small businesses, social media endeavors, and even love or friendship. So be kind in the comments under the Poplix episodes or the spillover episode. And don't be shy. This community is here to be your friend. That's also specifically why I created the cute servatives Facebook group. Make sure you join that. And before we part ways today, please be sure to click subscribe. If you're brand spanking new to cute servitism, you know, that's what I call like being a fan of Poplittics, my daily show, or The Spillover. Make sure you follow Poplittics on Instagram because that's where I post about the Spillover and join the Kutervative Facebook group. Again, that is the best way

to connect with girls and guys that like you heard. from on this episode. And then leave a five-star review telling me and today's cute servatives just how much you love their stories or if one of them in particular really resonated with you, they're going to read those that's so encouraging. And just leave a comment saying that you're new here in the cute servitous Facebook group and you want to connect. We're back next Thursday at 9 p.m. Pacific and midnight Eastern on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. But you can get the video version of this episode on YouTube, always on the next day. I'm Alex Clark and this is The Spillover. Love you,

mean it. Bye.