Culture Apothecary with Alex Clark - "I Killed Dirty John." - Interview with Terra Newell About Overcoming Trauma

Episode Date: April 1, 2022

In 2017, the true crime podcast ‘Dirty John’ was released based on the life and death of the infamous John Meehan. He was a con man who married wealthy interior designer, Debra Newell, and lied about his identity to the entire Newell family. The podcast series became such a smash hit that Bravo created a television adaptation of the story with Connie Britton playing Debra Newell, Eric Bana as John Meehan, and Julia Garner playing one of Debra’s daughters, Terra Newell. In this episode of ‘The...

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Mehan. After their first date, John texted Deborah and told her he was going to be the best thing that ever happened to her. Well, if you're a true crime connoisseur at all, or really just fluent in pop culture, you know that John Mehan was not only the worst thing that ever happened to Deborah Newell. He was downright deadly. John was not an anesthesia. He lied about pretty much everything. And after wiggling into Deborah's life and stealing her money, he attempted to murder one of her daughters. Then in 2017, a podcast called Dirty John skyrocketed up the charts and raked in millions of downloads. The world was mesmerized with how such a smart businesswoman and mother could fall for a scheming, lying, dangerous con man.

The daughter, Dirty John tried to murder, was Tara Newell. Not only was he unsuccessful in killing her, she ended up killing him in self-defense. Here to tell her story of survival and how she used that experience to become a life coach focused on trauma and wellness is Tara Newell herself on the spillover. Listener discretion is advised. For those who don't know your story at all, which I honestly find hard to believe because we were just talking about before we started how dirty John really is. I mean, whether you want it, obviously you didn't want it to be, but it has kind of become a pop culture phenomenon. If someone hasn't seen your story or watch Dirty John, I kind of want to get into some of the survival story part with you, starting with the moment right before John's attack in your apartment complex parking lot.

Okay. My favorite part. Right. So I met John Mehan. because my mom married him, but I didn't know it at this time. And so this man essentially ended up coming after me and trying to kill me. And the parking lot, that is the spot where my trauma happened, my main trauma. And he actually came up to me, grabbed me by the waist, looked me in the eyes and said, do you remember me? And from there, I went into fighter flight mode and tried to flee.

I was unable to flee, so I had to fight. And I ended up stabbing him 13 times, I believe. And now I'm kind of here today in a sense. I mean, that was like a very short version of like, right, what happened to me and whatnot. But basically, my mom married a psychopath, and he ended up coming after me and trying to kill me. And I killed him in self-defense. when that was all happening, you noted right away when you were parking your car that it looked like John's car. So I actually didn't.

Oh, you didn't? Yeah. No, I, so my sister the night before warned me because she saw him try to like tail her down or whatever. And so I was warned. But I didn't like I didn't have that awareness because I. was trying to go to the Jason Aldeen concert. And I was just preoccupied by that. And so when I got through the gate,

my dog actually barked at his car. And I told him to knock it off. Because I was like, it just looks like it's a homeless person who's like fiddling with a tire iron in the back of their trunk. Right. So I told my dog to knock it off. And then I got out of my car. And then that's when he grabbed me.

Did it cross your mind at all that he would come back? for anyone in your family, like what ended up happening? 100%. You were kind of anticipating this. Uh-huh. So thinking that that could be a possibility, were you doing things like self-defense classes or trying to prep in that way?

Or what were your survival instincts before this happened, just anticipating that this guy could come for you? I was scared of my life. I was just living in this fear that I just couldn't walk down the street. But it was just like, I felt crazy in a sense because no one's validating what's going on to me. So I literally, I think I went on Amazon, bought like 10 different knives, taped them all around my house into places where someone couldn't like just see a knife if they went into my house and they were trying to like put all the knives away so that I couldn't defend myself. So I would tape knives everywhere.

It's very smart actually As you're saying this I'm like taking notes in my mind like I should do that Yeah I think I learned this from burn notice that one show Yes And I also learned that like when you're in a knife attack You have to control the knife This is so wild to me that you were thinking of things like knife attacks And then that ended up being exactly what happened

Well see a knife is so personal Where if a gun that is just like okay it's quick and done and John was a straight psychopath so he wanted this dramatic ending and what was going to give him this dramatic ending a knife or a gun but he was actually trying to get a gun but he wasn't successful with that he um thank goodness yeah but he wasn't able to get a gun but he had so many knives and that was it was scary and so personal when that moment in the parking lot happened did you feel like time slowed down or sped up it's really weird when you look back to it i mean it happened in a matter of seconds per se but it seems so long but then it all seems so fast and during that time i was just so

preoccupied because I was trying to get to the Jason Aldine concert. So I was just like, oh, right. Everything's good. Everything's fine. I'm going to get to this concert. It's all going to be good. This guy is in my way right now. But I'm going to get there. You know what's crazy is, I mean, just to, you know, kind of make light in like such a terrible situation, which a lot of people do, is Jason Aldine, who I love the Aldeans. But isn't it crazy how many not like crazy tragedies and stories have happened having to do with his concerts like the dirty john incident happened before this and then you have you know the terrible tragedy in las Vegas but it's just so wild that with him you have all these stories tied with his concerts which is just a random side back it's so random um but it's actually kind of crazy because i was trying to go to his concert you know route 91 and stuff no way and i was unable to get tickets unable to go but it's like the universe god whoever was looking out for me and And hey, I got to see him the next year. You did?

Yeah. Oh, good. I'm glad that you ended up being able to go. They're just the sweetest people if you ever have a chance to meet them in person. The Aldeans are great. Okay. So I actually met Jason Aldeen. Oh, really?

Just for like a quick, like, you know, picture photo op. And I was just so nervous, so shaken because he was associated with my trauma. Right. And so it was like, I'm going to like cry for this part. I just like felt like, I was connecting the dots and everything was coming together kind of full force. And it's like just so meaningful to me. But I also felt bad because I was like there's so many people that went to Route 91

that could have used that closure too. Yeah. But I was just so fortunate to get it. Like at that time I hired a PR person and that PR person was like, oh, I'll get you that meeting. And that's how like she kind of got me in. Did you tell Jason during your quick, even though it was a quick meeting great, did you tell him like, hey, so this is who I am and this is my link to you?

Not necessarily. I just told him, thank you so much. This means so much for my trauma. And I think that just, I don't know if he knew who I was when I said that to him. But it just, I felt like he got it. When your attack was happening, did you feel like you were just kind of quiet in the moment, just in survival mode or were you yelling out for help it's really hard to kind of look back i feel like i was screaming but it's like silent moments like you know the silent like horror movies yeah it's like

that it's like you're watching it but and it's probably so loud but i'm like monotone silent well i i uh i know that there was a there was a 14 year old girl who ended up being a key witness in in your case for what had happened to you, right? Yeah, so she was one of the people that came down at the inn, Skyler, and she was 14, which made it so prominent, you know, this 14-year-old

coming down to help someone that was injured and whatnot. But, like, it kind of made it seem like she was the only person there or the first person there where that wasn't necessarily true. Okay, so tell us the truth. You set the record straight and tell us,

because I don't you know I want to hear from you first person sometimes things get embellished in media portrayals and everything too you know well and then I feel like you know it is like such a great story that this girl came down and I'm so thankful for that but everybody wants their 15 minutes of fame did she kind of take advantage of that a little bit

well not her okay um her mom got mad at me for her not being like the star you're kidding me and the mom tried to tell you the mom tried to tell you the victim of this crime well and then okay and i am so sorry that this happened and she had so much trauma for what she saw me go through yeah and she was wondering what was happening to this girl and stuff where i was going into my own healing journey and her trauma was about me And so she needed to kind of get like, okay, this girl's okay, like this girl, like peace of mind. And I felt like maybe she needed to understand the circumstances also that it wasn't such a random case.

Right. So I think for her, there was like her trauma that she was going through. But I was just trying to focus on my trauma. And I hate to say this, but you know, you have to put the mask on yourself before you put the mask. on other people when the plane's going down. So I was just in my own real trying to recover, trying to not want to commit suicide, not want to, like, it was so hard to be there in that moment. And I feel bad. I feel so bad that like I created that trauma for her. But you didn't create, you didn't create trauma for her, Tara, you know. Yeah. Well, John, you know. Yeah. But I feel

bad that it happened, you know, and that she had to recover, but I felt like she did hold this burden against me. And, you know, the story isn't about her. Right. It's about this John Meehan. It's about my mom. It's about me. It's about, and she is a part of the story too. Of course. Yeah. But it's not 100% about her, you know. So I just. And I also think that's okay to say. Yeah. I mean, how long had it been? So from the moment John entered your life to the moment he exited, how long had he been tormenting your family for? A year and a half, I believe. Jeez.

You brought up that you had stabbed him 13 times. 13 is a lot. I mean, that is when you look at other true crime stories and stuff. I mean, they talk about, you know, and you brought up, too, that stabbing is a very personal act. and then to stab someone more than once, a lot of times that's aggression coming out, anger, and I just think about everything that John Mehan had put your family through. Do you feel like all of that was coming out

and that is what accounts for how many stabs there were? Or do you think it was more just in the moment you were terrified and trying to make sure he was dead? I think it was a combination of all of the above. I think, you know, I hated this guy so much. Right. I never wanted to plan to murder him or anything. Of course.

You know, I wouldn't mind. if he was dead. Yeah. That is fair to say too. Yeah. But I never wanted to do the dean myself. And I felt in that moment, it was kind of a mixture of my rage, me watching the Walking Dead. This is the craziest part of your story.

That the Walking Dead actually played a part in your self-defense and survival story. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. I killed him like a zombie. So explain that. Walk us through this part. Okay. So when I got the knife, I started just willing.

And that I didn't really kind of give thought into. But as I started to like process what was happening in the moment, he started to, he gasped. And then from that moment, I kind of put my hand on his head. And I was holding his head like so that he wouldn't bite me and turn me into zombie, which is really bizarre. Did you really think he was going to try to bite you or just in your mind you're like, this is like the walking. Dead to Dr. Process what was happening. Well, like, monkey see monkey do. I didn't think like he was a zombie and he was going to bite me and turn me into a zombie.

But like, I watched so much Walking Dead that that's like my mind knew what to do from that. Right. And so I held his head and I stabbed the last two times, one in his forehead. And then the last one is in his eye, which is the softest point of entry to the brain. Okay, so that is so scary to me. Do you think about where you're stabbing or what you're doing or you're just hitting anything that you can? At first, you're just hitting anything you can

because you're not like thinking like, where do I need a stab? And then, but when he's coming down on you and it's like, oh, you're taking the final moments of this person's life. And you know it's his life or your life. Then that's when you need a like, okay, I need to make this person not come up.

You know, and like Freddie Cougar and all those movies, they get up and they chase after the person. So I knew that if I got him in the eye, that that was his way of not being able to come up to get me. His way of not being able to come up and try to hurt my nieces or my nephews or anything like that. I think it's important just to draw attention to the fact that you're getting emotional. Sorry? No, I think it's important for people to understand that when you have to act in self-defense like that, when it is between your life and someone else's, even though you are defending yourself, it's still hard to do. It's not even though you hated this guy, you hated his guts and wanted a world without him. When it came down to you having to be the one to take him out, it's still hard for you.

It still makes you emotional taking the life of somebody else and we'll get into your. trauma and dealing with that and how now you're a trauma specialist in a little bit. But I just think that's important to just sit with that. It's not like you just, it was so easy for you and you were just so happy and like, yay, now I can move on with my life. Like, that's just not the reality for people that go through trauma like what you did. Yeah. Well, I was watching the movie scream last night. Is that not hard? Wait a minute. With all the stabbings and stuff in a scary movie, is that not hard for you to watch? It's a bit triggering. That's what I would wonder. I found it kind of just like encouraging.

Well, because the main character in that movie, they named her Tara. Was that named after you? I don't know. I don't think so, but like, you never know because, like, people listen and then they're like, oh, I want to, like, nonchalantly do something here. And she was a survivor. She was a badass, you know, and it's just, like, so important to, like, see that, like, you could do what you do, but when you watch those movies and stuff, like, they kind of showed

that, like, the characters that came back from, like, the original scream, they were still dealing with trauma. And I feel like that's so important to show. But they kind of make a comment, like, what do you do after this? You just keep living life. It's like, oh, you're going to have to go through, like, moments of, like, where you wish you were dead. You might want to even be dead because you feel worthless that your trauma has taken over your whole entire life and you're like, I don't know what to do now. Some people may not understand that. That might be hard for somebody that's never experienced trauma or know anyone that's gone through trauma. If you survive and you fought to survive, why would you want to be dead? Why would you be experiencing those thoughts?

So everyone is different, you know, if they go through trauma and stuff. But it's really common for people who have been in traumatic incidences, even veterans and stuff, to want to kill themselves. Unfortunately, our brains change after trauma, and they're completely rewired. So we're kind of always living in this fight or flight mode. And until like we go do EMDR or we do extreme like therapy is we can't really reverse that. Yoga is extremely helpful. And that's why like I did my yoga teacher training too because I just like want to learn how to relax the nervous system because like our nervous system is what tells us that we are in fight or flight mode it tells us that there is either we're speaking on stage and we're getting those effects or a tiger's there you know and so

it's so important to learn to rewire the system and to learn to learn to calm down. And, you know, as I'm talking about it now, I'm like living a little bit in the fighter flight mode, but it's important to get this out there because it's cathartic and it also will help people in the long run. That's right. It is. And you're, you are one of the bravest people I know and that we have had on this podcast. So it's just, thank you. Thank you for being willing to share this. I know it's really hard reliving trauma and talking about it. So, um, It's never easy, but you have your dog with you. Yes.

I love that you have your dog. And you can talk about how that's helped you too. In case people are wondering why she's like reaching down what she's doing. She's petting her dog as she's talking. So, okay, one thing too is when the police were coming and everything after the attack, were you scared at all like, oh my gosh, am I going to be blamed? You know, like I was the aggressor in this situation. Are they going to believe that it was self-defense?

Were you scared at all? Or were you like, no, I got this. I'm good. I think I was really careful. what I said when they started coming up to because I'm like, well, you can't say like I killed him. Yeah. But I just said, I kept repeating, that's my stepdad. He was trying to kill me.

That was my stepdad. He was trying to kill me. And at that point, in case anyone listening has forgotten just because it's been a few years since dirty John has come out or they've watched the show. At that point, what contact was he legally allowed to be having with your family? any. You could have any contact with us because we were unable to get restraining orders. Why? Because in the state of California, you have to have three complaints to like three harassment complaints to even get somewhere with some person. Has this changed since this attack happened, this law or rule or whatever? I don't know if this one has changed, but my mom,

and I have helped kind of course the law into effect. Senator Rubio from California, we helped do the coercive control law. It's a standalone law, so basically we're hoping to see the effects of what it does this year. I know Evan Rachel Woods is using it with the Marilyn Manson case. Yes, absolutely. Yes. Oh my gosh, that's incredible, Tara. Yeah. I haven't talked to her, but I seen that she's using it to help her case. That's amazing. That's amazing. That everything, you know, that she said about that is wild too. Of course, now he's trying to sue her for saying all this. And it sucks, but he might win. Yeah. You never know. Gosh, how quickly after everything had happened in the parking lot did you call your mom or were you thinking, should I even call her? How do I tell her that? I tell her that I, Were they still legally married?

Yes, they were legally married. And she was still happy with him and talking to him or no? No. Okay, that's what I thought. She left him. Right. I called her the second, like the second I was able to get my phone. I called her and I was like, I'm so sorry.

I think I killed your husband. And I also told her I was like, I knew he would do this. And what did she say? And then she just like went into frantic mode and she was like, oh. And then she was like, where are you? And then she started headed towards my way. Was she also glad that he was out of your lives at that point and kind of relieved? Or did she go through sadness?

Because I mean at one point, I mean, right at that moment she was terrified of him, but she had been in love with him, at least for some point. So I'm just going to say this because I want people to understand that. when someone dies, you have to mourn them no matter what. You have to go through those motions. And when that happened, I was with someone on and off for 10 years that was abusive and that hit me with a car and stuff. Oh, my gosh. So I knew I was like, she's going to have to mourn him and I felt bad.

Just because of what you had experienced in your own relationship. Yeah, I knew that like, as much as like that person is evil, there was love. Everyone makes fun of that sad dog commercial with the Sarah McLaughlin song in the background because of how dramatic it is. And I'm not an animal rights activist or anything, but I will say this. Animal abuse is rampant in the meat industry. Usually animals are kept inhumanely and killed inhumanely, but not moink animals on moink farms. Moink, that's moo plus oink, is a meat subscription box that I love, and I knew as soon as I found them keeps derivatives would too. Their meat is free of sugar, nitrates, nitrites, food dyes,

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and your options include wildcaught salmon, grass-fed and grass-finished beef, pasture-raised pork, grass-fed and grass-finished lamb, and pasture-raised chicken. Keep America farming by signing up at moinkbox.com slash spillover right now, and cute servatives will get free filet mignon for a year. That's one year of the best filet mignon you will ever taste, but for limited time. Go to M-O-I-N-K-box.com slash spillover. that's moinkbox.com slash spillover. So it's interesting because it sounds like you kind of had already been going through trauma

and your life before this incident. Oh, yes. So you have gone through a lot then and there's a lot. There's like compacted trauma on top of each other that you've had to learn how to deal with and cope with. Oh, yes. I've had to learn how to deal with a lot of trauma. And it's weird too because like I'm 30 now and I didn't have memories.

of like some of the trauma until now. Really? Why do you think that is? So the brain compartmentalizes trauma. So you may even like block it out of your memory, may not even remember it. And especially for children, they block things out of their memory because for them, it would be like losing their safety, losing everything. And the most important thing for a child is to feel secure, have consistent. see in life and know that they are loved, you know?

Did you feel like you had that growing up? My mom and my dad, I love them. They were not the best for each other. And I know my mom talks about that a little bit in her book that she has out. So I don't want to give like too much information about that. That's okay. What's the name of the book? Her name is, the book's name is Surviving Dirty John.

Okay, great. So she kind of goes into that a little bit just about her toxic first relationship. or first marriage? Well, she's been married. Going to hate me for saying this. She's been married five or six times. Wow. So she talks about a few of those relationships and what happened. And I love my dad. They just weren't the best together, you know. And I think my dad's a great person. I think that we've all had trauma and stuff to deal with. But I love my dad and I have a great relationship with him. And I have a great relationship with my mom, but, you know, I feel like in talking about generational trauma, which I feel like the show showed so much of, is you learn what you're taught, or you do the

complete opposite, or you learn from other people what to do. And so when you're a parent, you're going to do what your parents did or you're going to do the opposite. So it's just like they weren't taught 100% like let's be the perfect parent you know but they were good you know they provided

and my trauma stems from like a family member but not like close I've had so many traumas but like the memories from when I was 30 that I remembered like those were being molested as a child.

Not by my brother and sister at all, but someone close to the family. Wow. Why do you think, Tara, that you over and over again have been able to survive so many monsters? Because the neuroplasticity in my brain is just the way my brain's wired. Like, I am positive, you know? And when you create positive neurons and these positive, like, neuropathways in your brain, you're going to move.

on from stuff. And when you are stuck in this negative mindset and these negative neuropathways, then you're not going to grow in your trauma and you're going to contribute to yourself and you're going to make yourself ill. Do you think that John was born evil or that he learned to be evil? This is a very hard question. So I don't know. I think that his, I think how he was raised was not right. and that the mentality of like screwing over other people and whatnot, I remember his sister sharing a story with me, how he like beat the crap out of her at her 16th birthday party because she was just having fun.

And so it's like when you hear stuff and about that, you think, oh, it could be just his childhood. It also has to be like the brain too. I believe that John had a smaller Olympic system in his brain. This is interesting. And so, you know, that contributed to his how he behaved and stuff,

but it also is like how you nourish that behavior when they have that in their brain. I know that Kutzeravidus would be upset if I don't ask you this. Since this attack, what are your thoughts on carrying like a firearm? Or do you still prefer knives?

I just know a lot of people are going to hate me for this. That's okay. Be yourself. It's all right if people disagree. I am okay if people are carrying firearms as long as they have a mental wellness check. I would like a little bit more restrictions about that. But I think that people just need to be trained. But what about you? Oh, for me? Yeah. Do you do you do you, do you, And just now after dealing with your trauma and a lot of people will then start carrying, you know, wanting to have a gun on them at all times, whatever, because of what you went through. Do you feel like that or have you, are you just not a gun person?

And it's okay if you're not. Well, I've been bugging my dad to take me to the shooting range. Really? And like I get his revolver when he like passes. But like I would like to do that. But I also would encourage people to feel safe just walking. on the street alone, but there's random attacks these days. Like in L.A., random people are getting attacked.

And I know, like, this one girl, like, a couple weeks ago got, like, murdered in Venice Beach. Yes. And there's been attacks even in Beverly Hills. Yeah. Yeah. And you're in Orange County. Yes. It's a little bit different down there.

We've had multiple guests from Orange County on this show, which is kind of great. I'm kind of in my boyfriend list there, too. So I keep thinking, oh, maybe I need to just move there. So many great guests live there and like sounds like all the cool people live there. Okay. Something fun. Something fun. What did you think of Julia Garner's portrayal of you in the show?

I just love Julia. It's always hard when someone else is playing you and you have like critiques and stuff. What were your critiques of her? Well, it's just like, I don't, okay, I don't feel she got my voice right. but every single person that I talk to, they're like, oh my gosh, she got it down 100%. And I'm like, really? Okay. But like, you know, each person you can kind of tell, like,

difference of their voice. Well, she's had to do a lot of interesting roles with different voices. And Ozark, she's got to do a weird voice. She has to do a really weird accent for Anna Delvey. Oh, yes. And then you know. I was just like, oh, Anna Delvey. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. You're so, you're such a loser. Why are you wearing that? Yeah, so why are you wearing that? That looks ugly. It's perfect. It's perfect. Did you actually get to meet her?

Did she, like, consult with you about playing you or nothing? So, well, I met Julia, a couple times on set. But, like, she's such a sweet girl. Like, she is so busy to them. But, like, I think actors, when you're there, they get nervous, like, of you watching them. I'm sure they do. I know I would. I'd be pooping my pants.

That would make me so uncomfortable. I couldn't do it. Well, I know, like, I realized Connie when she was acting and we were there, and I've seen her on so many things, you know? And I'm like, oh, she's nervous right now. Did you think she nailed your mom? Oh, yes. Really?

Although, my mom does have a little bit of a backbone, and I feel like they didn't quite get that. They kind of portrayed your mom as more of a passive, I think, passive. person yeah but it's so funny like i think like how they talk like oh it's okay like that hundred percent and Connie like sweetest person ever i just don't think like i don't know like she's so sweet um and like just different views you know right how has your relationship been with your mom as of now so you know we've had to go to a lot lot of therapy, deal with a lot of stuff. I had to deal with my, what is called, not abandonment, but like my resentment towards her and had to say things to her that were not pleasant and stuff,

but we really work through it. And I think we're at a really great place where we're able to kind of break that generational pattern and like have conversations about it. And I think we're at a really great place where we're able to kind of break that generational pattern and like have conversations about it and we're like I feel good. Have your mom's dating habits changed or are they kind of the same? She's like, you're wanting me to spill all the tea. Well, I feel that like COVID, that's been like a hard time to deal with. I really like the last person she was with. In fact, like he's still in and out of.

of our life. Well, like, he's still in for the most part, but like, they're not together. But he's taken care of her when she's had cancer. And he's been there for me for certain things. And I appreciate that so much. That's great. Yeah. That's great. Even if they don't connect romantically, like, she has found someone else that has been able to be there, you know? eventually you had to quit the job that you had when all of this happened. Is that because you were dealing with trauma or just because you wanted a new job? I couldn't deal with the dogs. I have to be honest.

What do you mean you couldn't deal with the dogs? So my dog with me, not the one now. He actually passed in August. Oh, wait, you got to explain for people that may not know if they're listening to you for the first time that you were a dog walker. I'm doing all that. So I used to be a kennel attendant, dog groomer, all that. And what's funny is, like, now I'm kind of getting back into it because I had to stop at a point because my trauma overtook me. And Cash, my old dog was in the attack with me and he was barking to warn me.

So I would get triggered with dog barks. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah, that would make that job difficult. And so I would be, but my boss had cancer at the time and had to go to work afterwards. And I would be there literally feeding the dogs, but like bawling my eyes out, hyperventilating, crying. And you're just, I'm like, I can't do this. Where now I love working with dogs again.

That's so great. And I'm like crying because like it's been such a journey and never thought that like I had to quit doing it. for that reason and then now I'm like I'm not like I'm just pet sitting and walking dogs now like in between my life coaching because it helps well with him to get my dog's energy out and then it also helps balance me because I'm working with nature and working with animals now and then I'm able to like do my life coaching so it's like in the morning I like answer emails do my life coaching, then like 12 to 2, then I walk dogs, and then like the rest of the day, I'm like doing other stuff.

That's great. How long after you quit that job did you start working as a life coach? I'm four years. I had to get to a place in my own healing where I felt like healed enough to help others, if that makes sense. Like, you know, I'm forever going to be. going through this healing process. I'm never going to be 100% like, hey, we're not trauma, you know?

But I've gotten to places where I've been like serene, calm, collected, been able to work on my nervous system. I've been a little shot this week because I've been dealing with like car issues and stuff. But we're good now. I got a new car. That's good. Yes. And so, like, you are forever, like, working on your nervous system when you, like, and I feel like anxiety, people with anxiety have to do this too.

If you go in social situations, you have to continuously work on your nervous system to, like, be in those situations and be okay. How would you describe the survivors that you coach? Are most people coming to you because they also have significant traumas and what kinds of traumas are they? So multiple of reasons, more so because of toxic relationships. And I've had, you know, a few clients that actually have been stabbed. Really? So how is that you stabbed someone and they've been stabbed from someone else and they're telling you about their trauma? Is that hard for you?

Only if I let myself be there and get too involved. There's this thing called like tapping that you could do. where you literally like tap your body, tap your shoulders. And if I start to feel like I'm getting too involved, then I'll do that to kind of bring myself back to the present moment. And I'll also remind myself like, that's not my trauma. That's their trauma. And we're separate.

But, you know, I'm here to help her. And so I have to regulate my nervous system now to make sure I'm good for her. Can trauma be marked by time, by moments, or just a feeling? I feel like I don't really get time with trauma, to be honest. I think that whenever someone tells you

just give it time, that's bullshit. Whenever you give it time, if you're just sitting there in your trauma, you're like giving yourself stomach ulcers, you're giving yourself, you're making the trauma worse.

But if you're getting up and you're moving your body and you're putting in the work, then you're moving. that trauma out of your body. Do you feel like you going on podcasts or speaking publicly about your trauma is helping you kind of get it out of your system and out of your body? Oh yes. I feel it leaving my body right now. Tara's trauma is just like in the room with us. It's like a pink cloud. In my stomach, you know, in my chest. Like whenever you're also like doing speaking stuff,

it activates like the fight or flight mode too. So you're like a little bit confused. You're like, am I getting like ran over by a car or am I public speaking right now? That's interesting. So speaking about, when you speak about going through significant trauma, sometimes for people that it can feel like physically painful. Oh yeah. Well, because trauma is stored in the body. And whenever you talk about it, like I remember times where I would like literally just

talk about something and my shoulder would hurt. Or, oh my gosh, I looked at, oh, the scream. I was watching a scream last night. When she got stabbed, I grabbed my arm because I was like, I felt, I felt her get stabbed. And it's like that feeling stays with you in the body. And you have to release it and you have to move it around. You can't keep it stored in you. And a really good book to check out if this resonates with anyone is the body keeps score.

And it talks about how trauma is stored. in the body and how you need to move it and what not, you know, what you need to do. Right. What are the steps that a person needs to take to no longer be categorized as traumatized or does trauma just stay with the person forever no matter how much help they get? So it really depends. I would recommend EMDR therapy. EMDR therapy works its eye movement desensitization. I can never say that part, right? No matter what I do. Repetition. And it's been. It's been. It's been. It's Basically, going through your traumas, but adding the extra sense to it. Like, basically, you're going through your trauma, but you're looking at, like, a finger moving.

Oh. And it helps, like, create this bilateral effect with the brain. We're able to stay in the present moment, but work through your trauma. It's very interesting. I feel like right now in culture, trauma is a very trendy word. Like, everyone is talking about their trauma, you know, whether it's. from childhood or like a bad job or a boss they hated or something. And I think over the last decade or so, it's really just kind of been normalized also with

social media. You have all of these people on TikTok talking about my trauma, my trauma, my trauma. They're going viral. And, you know, you can basically find a community now with other people that say that they've experienced trauma. But also, I just wonder, do you feel like as somebody who has truly gone through trauma? that it has become trendy to the point where some people are just saying that they've been traumatized in their life and they haven't. You know, I actually had someone reply to my story but meant to send it to a friend.

And they were like, I'm triggered. And I'm like, I kind of called that person out and I'm like, why are you triggered? And it was just like, oh, this is a joke to my friend. And I'm like, does she even know what it meant to be? triggered? Does she know what it's like for you to feel like you're crawling out of your skin and you want to go stab the person next to you? I don't think she dies. But, you know, I really like that trauma is kind of a trend in a sense because it's helping us open up our vulnerabilities and for so long that has been shamed. And whenever someone in the past has been like, oh, I'm raped. They've been shamed or

like just you know and even now like if we talk about it there's still that still happens but i'm really happy about that because it opens up the narrative and then it opens up the narrative for more healing and we can heal each other or you could heal yourself but we're all in it together in a sense where it makes it less i don't know just like makes people feel less alone yeah Less alone in it. And I really appreciate people talking about it. One of the craziest parts of your life story that you've shared is that leading up to the attack with John, you were experiencing premonitions. And as a child, you talked about how you dreamed that someone tried to abduct you.

But I guess I'm wondering now, looking back, do you believe that that was a dream or do you think someone actually when you were a child was trying to take you? So whenever you have someone narrating a different podcast. Okay, this is somebody else, got the story wrong? Yeah. Well, they say allegedly that happened, you know, and it's like legal for them. Like the LA Times, they don't want to like say, oh, this happened and stuff come from it. Man, there's a lot of lies about your family. Well, it's just like when you're in the.

media and stuff, you have to be careful with legal stuff. Right. And so Christopher Gafford said something like, oh, allegedly like that happened or she had a dream about it. Or I think my parents even said like, oh, I think my mom said, oh, I think she was dreaming about it. But I confronted her because I was like, how dare you say that? How dare you say that about my trauma? That's not validating me. That is making me, And that's actually gaslighting me. And so, like, you know, we work through that. So then someone did try to take you as a child? Yes.

Was it the person that was abusing you? I believe so. And EMDR, that's who I saw. Wow. Okay. Yeah, that's wild. But I'm glad we're setting stuff straight. Okay, so.

Me too. So the person that kind of takes me, talked about it and they said allegedly so it it's not that you were having premonitions about john and stuff but you did dream as a child that somebody had tried to take you um i didn't have that that actually happened so and tried to take me um right and but i did have premonitions that i saw john stabbing me in my dreams before it even happened what do you think that's about um i just have dreams like that sometimes and they come true and um and i i i just have dreams like that sometimes and they come true and I'm just like very spiritual and connected.

And I believe it was God's way of preparing me for my attack. But I also just see stuff sometimes. And I'm a little bit clairvoyant. What is your own dating life like now if you're willing to talk about it? I'm not really dating right now. Because you don't want to or because it just hasn't worked out? I'm just, I've tried the apps. And, you know, I've really worked on working on my boundaries with people on the apps and stuff.

But I just feel like when I'm doing me and I'm at my highest and I'm vibrating at my highest and I'm in alignment with myself, that's when people come into my life. And that's what I noticed. Like when I did yoga teacher training, I was like, I really want to see this one guy. And then he came into my life. And then I don't know where it would go with that person. we'll see are you scared doing online dating though because of everything that happened with your mom no i don't know if i could get over that i think i'd be like never i'm never you know going out with somebody from online well you just create boundaries like you meet them at a public place and i say like do that like the

first couple months a couple months you know i am so selective of who i bring into me my house, bring into my space. So it's just like, you know, navigating that. But I'm not, I'm not scared, for a say, because I defended myself and. And you could do it again. Yeah. And I could do it again. So I, you know, I don't prefer to do it again. But I know it's in me and I know I can take care of myself. I really like that. That's really strong of you. recently there's been a lot of people talking about cultural trauma or intergenerational trauma and you know that certain traumatic experiences that happen to one generation that trauma can be passed down if you heard about this?

Oh yes. Okay. So I wanted to ask you like an event like 9-11 for example. Okay. Do you, that's obviously culturally traumatic. How do you think the traumatic effects of 9-11 are still playing out today? Well, I wonder the people that were in it and that are having kids, I bet you that their kids have a lot of anxiety. It's just they're probably having social issues, maybe sometimes.

You know, not everyone. It really just depends on how you deal with your trauma and your trauma responses. But if you're not dealing with something, it's going to create, you know, anxiety in the next generations. And, you know, when we're actually created in our uterus, our nervous system is the first thing to create. And so, you know, if you have trauma and you're having a baby, you're creating your baby's nervous system. And if you're anxious, you're creating an anxious baby nervous system. Are you, you don't have kids, right? No.

Do you think you want to one day? I love kids. I would love to. But if that's in my path, I accept it. But if it's not, you know, it's okay. Absolutely. Kind of a spicy question and you can take your time to answer. I just think it's like a really deep thinker.

Okay. So when George Floyd happened, we're talking about cultural trauma and intergenerational trauma. Do you think that that situation was traumatic because of the media's perpetuation of it and it was misconstrued? Or do you think, no, that will be a generationally trauma? traumatic thing forever. Or using the media made it worse, I guess is what I'm saying. I think this is so complicated. I know.

And you can take your time. Because George Floyd, he battered his wife and he beat up a pregnant woman instead. I'm, I, anyone that does that, I feel shouldn't be here. Yeah. And I don't. It's kind of weird knowing that and then people still kind of make a murder out of him. almost be like, now that I think of it, and this is just coming to me, it almost be like if people made a martyr out of John.

And tried to say like, well, you know, Tara stabbed him or whatever. You know, he died and like the media blew this up into this whole thing. And they were like, you know, talking about how tragic it was and how great of a guy he was. And then like there's you who knows how he hurt you just like, you know, the pregnant woman in George Floyd's life that experienced all that trauma from him. like that's kind of weird yeah well I just think that it's hard because that narrative like blacks need to be treated as equal of course and I you know I'm white and I can't speak it from that perspective but I I want everybody to be treated equally absolutely um however when

someone has arrest record and has battery and assault on the record, that's a different scenario. In what ways is your life still impacted by John, if at all? I mean, obviously, you have to talk about him and things like this, but otherwise, what kinds of effects are you still experiencing? So I'm still, like, working on my nervous system, obviously. Rewiring parts of that trauma still because I block certain parts out, but I'm just, like, having to talk about him, but it helps me process. And other than that, I'm not connected to John.

Oh, other than his daughters. I like his daughters. Really? Yeah. Wow, I didn't know this. Okay, cool. So what, how, what do they think about their dad and everything that happened? Well, they don't think highly of him. Um, I say that's so sweet. Well, they don't think he's great. But, you know, he was still someone that gave them life. Of course. So they don't like love him and they don't think he's a great guy. But, you know, I'm sure they're appreciative of him giving them life in that sense. What message do you want to leave for trauma survivors who are listening, but maybe they haven't sought help yet for what they've gone through?

And just they're not really sure where to start. They've been scared because they're like, I'm scared to have to go to therapy. and then relive all my trauma. Well, you're going to relive it no matter what. It's going to stay in your body. It's going to come out in relationships. It's going to come out in your children's relationship, romantic relationships, anything. It's so important to get into therapy or to talk to someone that can validate you.

I do life coaching. And so you can always message me. I do free 15-minute consults because I want everybody. to have access to the help. And so when you do a 15-minute call with me, you can literally talk about your trauma or you could be like, I need to find this resource,

how do I do this, and we'll go through it. That's great. What is your Instagram if people want to follow you on your overcoming trauma and life coaching journey? Okay, so my Instagram is Tara Newell, T-E-R-R-A, N-W-E-L, and if you want to follow some cute pup pictures

or if you're in my area, and need a pup sitter or a walk, follow Tara's pups. That's so cute. What is your dog's name, by the way? Dixon. Dixon. He's very cute. Dixon.

Bright blue eyes. Yeah. Well, one's marbled. Oh, gorgeous. Gorgeous. Tara, you, I mean, you've literally looked evil in the face and won. I hope that you think about that sometimes and just and are really proud of yourself. Thank you.

Absolutely. Thank you for coming on the spillover. Thank you so much for happy me. I don't know what you've been through in your life, but maybe you could relate to a lot of what Tara had to say about dealing with and overcoming trauma. Maybe you couldn't. Personally, I haven't ever been through anything like Tara has in my life, praise God. But her story is pretty darn captivating nonetheless. It was also just neat to get to talk to the real Tara and ask questions after being a fan of the Dirty John podcast and watching the dirty John series on Bravo. I don't know of another interview podcast like The Spillover in the Conservative Movement.

do say so myself. If you'd like to support the show, it would mean so much to me. And it is very, very easy to do. Subscribe on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, however you prefer to listen and leave a five-star review every single week. All my true crime aficionados out there. Be sure to leave a five-star review telling me how much you loved hearing terrorist survival story.

Share this episode with someone you know who is obsessed with the dirty John story and tell them, hey, you got to check out the rest of the spillover interviews also. New episodes of The Spillover come out. every Thursday at 9 p.m. Pacific, midnight Eastern on Apple Podcasts and Spotify, or you can watch the episodes live on the Poplittics YouTube channel and participate in the live chat. I'm Alex Clark, and this is The Spillover. Love you, mean it. Bye.