DGTL Voices with Ed Marx - Digital Transformation Opportunities in the Classroom (ft. Christopher King, PhD)

Episode Date: July 17, 2024

In this episode of DGTL Voices, Ed welcomes Dr. Christopher King, the Dean of Georgetown University School of Health, to discuss the importance of education in healthcare leadership and the focus on social justice and well-being. Christopher emphasizes the need for systems thinking and the integration of technology for good in healthcare and highlights the significance of networking, establishing a professional brand, and practicing humility in leadership roles.   Takeaways Education in healthcare leadership should focus on social justice and well-being, and incorporate systems thinking and the integration of technology for good. Networking and establishing a professional brand are essential for career advancement and making meaningful connections in the industry. Humility is a crucial trait for leaders, as it allows for better understanding and empathy towards individuals and communities. Optimism and spirituality are important for leaders to maintain a positive outlook and inspire others. Georgetown University School of Health aims to train students to be reflective lifelong learners, responsible participants in civic life, and engaged in service to others.

Thanks for tuning to Digital Voices podcast, where we chat digital transformation, challenges and opportunities across healthcare and life sciences. And now, your host, Ed Marks. Hey, everyone, it's Ed here. Welcome to another episode of Digital Voices. So glad you joined us. I know you have a lot of choices. There's so many good podcasts out there. I listen to a bunch of them myself. You've chosen some time to spend with us, and we're going to make it worth You're wild. We are commercial free, all content, so you don't have to worry about putting the fast forward button as we get into it. So I'm super excited about this episode because we have Dr. Christopher King with us. Dr. King or Christopher, welcome to digital voices.

Thanks, Ed. It's a pleasure to be with you. Why this is exciting, there's many reasons, but one for sure, we haven't really tackled this topic yet on digital voices after over 200-some episodes. We have talked about education a little bit, but never talked to a dean. That's really cool. And Georgetown, which is a double whammy, like this amazing school. And talking about, you know, digital in leadership and what people learn and things like that. So super excited about it.

So you are the dean of Georgetown University School of Health. You have this great background, which we'll get into in health care prior to becoming dean. And so I'm really excited about jumping in. So let's just do that. So that's how we sort of met was online. I see the content that you put out there. I see what you're doing at Georgetown, and it really attracted me. You actually have some of your adjunct faculty, some people that listen to digital voices.

So that's pretty cool as well. But the most important question that I have for you, Christopher, is what songs are on your playlist? That's the most important question. I love it. I love it. Let me tell you, I have a very eclectic library of music. It's all over the place. And I, you know, I, most people don't notice about me, but I love, like, techno house music,

dance music. That's my default. So when I'm here around the house cleaning, I'm listening to music that you just, you can't help yourself but move. And I think you also like to dance if I'm not mistaken. Yeah, yes. That's right. Yeah.

I love that. So, you know, I have, I love, of course, Jay-Z is my favorite rapper. I love Dolly Parton. I love electric light orchestra, earthwind and fire, Harry Manilow. I mean, really, I'm all over the place, right? Yeah. Michael Jackson, of course, when it comes to gospel music, I just adore Richard Smallwood and Aerosmith.

I mean, come on, right? Yeah. So I'm all over the place. Yeah, and I love music. That's a great question to kick us off with. Yeah, no, I love hearing it because I always learned, too. You threw out a couple, or one for sure, that I had to be. not heard of on the gospel side, and we're going to add that to our playlist. We have a digital

voice playlist, and we'll add that. Oh, that's great. Yeah, Richard Smallwood is wonderful. Very inspirational, great music. I know Kirk Franklin. Kirk Franklin, probably in that genre. But yeah, it's good stuff. So what about your life message or mantra? Are there certain words that you try to live by? Yeah, there's two. I have them all over my office and in my house. One is, you know, leave the world better off than it was when you arrived. And the other is Gandhi, and that's be the change that you wish to see in the world. You know, you can't get better than those two, right? And I believe that, you know, a purpose-driven life, and we do everything we can to inculcate that and how we teach and making sure that students are pursuing work that's meaningful

and they're tapping into their natural talents to make the world a better place. So, yeah, leave the world better off than it was when we arrived and let's be the change we wish to see in the world. Yeah, I love it. Super inspirational. We're also creating a playlist, if you will, of everyone's messages and mantras. So we should be published pretty soon. So, yeah, let's talk about your story. Can you share with us and you can go back as far as you want, personal, professional, a little bit about who is Dr. Christopher King?

Well, one thing, if anyone takes a look at my CV, they will see that health has always been the underlying, like, theme, right? I started out as a high school health educator. I then moved into hospital administration and org leadership, and I did a lot of that work. I was learning on the job because I didn't have a, I didn't have a master's degree at the time. But I was doing work that I was good at, and I had a wonderful supervisor that picked, that, that, that, that, saw that in me and invested in me and really put me out there and made me take some risk. And if it wasn't for those risks, I can't say that I'd be here with you right now, having this conversation. I had an opportunity for about four years to work as a senior director for a federally qualified health center in Southern Maryland. It's called Greater Bate Medical Services. And that's where I really learned, you know, the importance of enter the importance of integrating public health concepts and health care delivery, systems of care. What does that look like?

Did a lot of grant writing for the FQC. We expanded our services and included WIC, HIV through the Ryan White Care Act. I managed that and did a lot of great work for the FQHC. And then I worked for MedStar Washington Hospital Center as senior director. grants and communications. And in that role, I was responsible for, you know, doing a lot of grant writing. And I always say I wasn't just, I wasn't, because people will be, we need a grant writer. I was kind of offended by that. I'm like, no, I'm more than a grant writer, right? I, I, I'm a strategic thinker who can document this in a way that may be compelling. But you don't just call me to

write a grant. I am part of the conception of how this actually works. Because I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, brought that skill set. Did great work at MetStar Washington Hospital Center. And then in 2010, something we all know big happened. The Affordable Care Act legislation passed. And I was recruited as the first assistant vice president of community health for MedStar Health. MedStar is a large player in the Mid-Atlantic, a $6 billion distributed health care delivery

system. And I was responsible for, you know, as part of the ACA, all hospitals have to do. do a community health needs assessment once every three years. And so it was my function, my division that was responsible for how do you do that? What does that look like? So I put together a comprehensive community health needs assessment that would be consistent across all 10 hospitals at flexible enough to meet the needs of the changing community. Each community is very different. Each hospital is very different. So we have to have some flexibility and respect the uniqueness of communities. And that, Ed, was also when I realized, my goodness, we have gaps in skill sets at the

highest levels of leadership. Because at that time, if you remember, it was about population health improvement, right? What does that mean? Keeping people well, value-based care, keeping folks out of the hospital. Folks weren't trained like that, right? These are new skill sets that are needed. And I was like, wow, I remember the first time using the language social determinants of health at a board meeting. and my colleagues looked at me like I was just, you know, during headlights. And I was like, boy, we have work to do. And it wasn't just a MedStar thing. It was industry-wide, right?

It was like, these are, if we're trying to improve the health of populations, we have to think beyond the walls of the medical care system and think about communities and how do we rethink how care is delivered to meet the needs of the whole person through strategic partnerships and meeting those needs in real time. Right. And so I did that work for about, again, this I think it was 2015. That's when I looked in the mirror and I was like, it's time to do something different because, you know, and I tell students this all the time. We have to be self-aware of who we are in the spaces that we're in and making sure that we are, there's purpose, right? Yeah. In that. And I felt like it's been five years. I moved the needle. I was also at that time ready to go deeper into. racial inequities and structural racism as root causes of these racial differences in health outcomes, the industry wasn't ready for that. It wasn't ready for that. And I was. And so I needed to,

and I said, I want to take a year. I'm going to take some time to write about what are the new and emerging skill sets that are needed in health care leadership, health care management, to truly advance a population health agenda with a focus on racial. differences in health outcomes, right? What does that look like? Well, to make a long, well, let me tell you, Georgetown reached out to me before I could even like plan what a sabbatical would look like and said we're thinking about, you know, restructuring some of our programs, our courses, to better align with the future of health care. And I was like, I was going to take time to write about this, but you're saying I can do this in real time with real people. Sign me up.

And, you know, here I am, what, eight years later now, dean of a new school. Yeah, that's incredible. Yeah, that's super incredible. And so, yeah, so along the way, you were getting continued your education as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. Every day I'm learning. Every day I'm learning.

That's very cool. Yeah, let's talk a little bit now about Georgetown University School of Health. And then I want to talk about, like, how do you discuss, you know, digital transformation of those sort of concepts with your students. So just for those who might be unaware, it's just, you know, a really. really brief overview of Georgetown? Yeah, so Georgetown is the oldest Catholic university in the country, formed in 1789, so we're a little over 200 years old now. And the university educates people to be reflective lifelong learners, to be responsible and active participants in civic life, and to engage generously in service to

others, right? And so we really, you know, we value discourse. We value interfaith. If you come to our campus, all faiths are there and we value that. That's what makes our community so special. And, you know, social justice and doing what's best for the common good. That is a Georgetown education. And that comes out in everything that we do. Yeah, that's awesome. My oldest sister has her master's from Georgetown. So whenever I'm in town running around by the university, always take a picture, sent it to her. Awesome. That's cool. So let's talk about School of Health as opposed to. And tell us, too, about the nuance. It's not public health, but School of Health. Tell us what about School. Yeah, so

we were initially a School of Nursing and Health Studies, right? And the and Health Studies was what is now the School of Health. So it was always nursing, nursing, and those other people, the and Health Studies. Well, who are those people? We didn't have much of an identity. And if you look at our enrollment, we skewed female because applicants thought that everything we did was nursing. Right. And so there's other reasons that we decided to decouple the school, but now we have a school of nursing and a school of health, which is made up of the three inaugural departments or the three founding departments. And that's human science, health management and policy, and global health.

right? And so those are, those three departments today represent the School of Health. We will grow over time. Now, we're not a school of public. Our name is School of Health. Again, we're trying to be very strategic and we really want to be a trailblazer in the field. We have wonderful schools of public health all around us. We have Johns Hopkins. We have George Washington. We have University of Maryland School of Public Health. So we wanted to, again, be different. in a Georgetown kind of way. And so what differentiates us from the others, right? Again, I'm not putting down or disparaging the other. Those are wonderful.

I'm an alum from University of Maryland School of Public Health. We ask people, when you think public health, what do you think? Like lay person. They think vaccinations, bicycle helmets, clean air and drinking water, all that wonderful stuff that's important, right? We need that. we're thinking about how do we change minds and hearts to value prevention, to value well-being. If we do that, if we have a societal shift, Tony Fauci would not have had such a challenging time doing his work, right?

How do we go from a society that's so me, me, me, me, me, right? I call it the me-ism to we-ism, right? From it's all about me to it's all about us. It's all about the common good. We make decisions for the common good. good, right? So that's the approach that we're taking, again, with the focus on well-being. We believe that that has not had the, well-being has not been amplified in a way that we think it should be, right? We know that if people have a sense of purpose, if people are loved and

cared for, then that is going to translate into improve physical health outcomes. Our society is, right now, it's really, you know, it's pretty cracked up, right? And people are just falling through those cracks and very unhealthy mental spaces. And so how do we, how do we evolve to a better society? And so that's the angle that we're taking, again, with the focus on social justice, always think prioritizing the most vulnerable. We believe that if we can improve the conditions, whether for a person or a community that is the most vulnerable, if we can fix that, then the rest of the world will benefit. Yeah, Christopher, it is, super interesting. You know, you're talking about your your career and just how you got to where you are. And

it seems like already in high school, you had an interest somewhere in your, in your heart with health. And then it comes out in your talk about well-being and wellness and social justice. Was there was there a definitive moment, defining moment maybe in your youth that kind of got you on this trajectory? Or did you truly just fall into it? Or like was there, you must have been wired, pre-wired, maybe headed this way? You know, it's so interesting. I think about like my undergraduate education and the way that we were taught. You know, the health belief model was drilled down. It's like tell people, give people the right information and they will make, they will make the right decisions for themselves. And I remember thinking that's, we just have to educate people, educate people and then they'll make better choices. My goodness, that was the norm. That was how people were taught. It's so much bigger than that. You can, you can, people know, smoking. is bad, but they still smoke, right? So there's a reason that we're not seeing significant improvement. So as I evolved in the field in my work, it became clear and clearer to me that I must be a systems thinker. And again, this is what we also teach in our programs. I must be, if I'm going to be

impactful in this work, I must be a systems thinker and think about all of the facets of our society that impact how I make decisions, what makes me happy, all that, right? And so that's, that's, again, a gap that I observed and why I'm so honored to do this work right now because our students are understanding concepts like systems thinking, right? Yeah. And we're putting them through different simulations and exercises to help them understand, you know, if this particular actor is impacted, this is going to impact this actor, which is going to have this particular outcome.

lead to this outcome for this patient, right? And so we even have a health systems degree that our students learn all of the different players in the ecosystem that impact a person's or communities health outcomes. Yeah. We believe that that is how people become more impactful. And they're more, they're more conversant. They can talk to all kinds of folks about these issues. Our students can. They can talk to a CEO or a chief financial officer around why it's important to why community benefit is important and why we need to prioritize communities that are most marked. There's a financial impact or implication. Sorry.

I'm going on and on. I'm charged right now. Yeah. No, you should be. You're the dean, the inaugural dean. That is so cool to start something from scrap. You know, a lot of our audience probably already has a bachelor's degree. What would you say to audience members listening right now?

I mean, if I, man, if I was at the position, just what you said there about the systems thinking and kind of being well-rounded, because, you know, it hadn't been like that before, I'd be, like, registering. So what would you say to someone who's listening who's got a bachelor's, and they're maybe mid-career? Like, why should they, you know, go get their master's or PhD in what we're talking about? I love it. I love it. Thank you for giving me this opportunity because I always want to, I always like talking about our master's programs and why they're exceptional. If anyone who's

interested in, again, addressing some of the seemingly most intractable conditions that are just preventing people from being well and achieving optimal physical health, if they want to look at that, not only through the healthcare lens, but also through a biocytocytocin social lens, this is the place for them, right? Our graduate program is designed so that folks can enroll from all across the globe, but there's still an in-person on-campus component

because we want them to experience the Georgetown. So they come to campus four times a year during a two-year program. But if they really want to be skilled in understanding all of the different facets, that impact the patient's experience, but also go through their own customized individual journey. We call this the, like the Capstone Project in which they have a whole year to do work that's specific to what's important to them. And talk about it like a TED talk at the end

when it's time for them to graduate. That's who we are. That's what we do. And again, social justice. You know, that's who we are. You know, care for the most vulnerable. making decisions for what's in the best interest of the people, not just the person, but the people. And if you also are interested in helping our health care sector do better, right? We're still grappling with how do we go from a biomedical system of care, which is what we have right now, to a biocycle social system of care? That's the space that we're in, and that's where we're going to do some powerful work. Yeah, that's good stuff.

Yeah, so yeah, I encourage everyone to go out. I'm a big believer in education myself and married to a doctor. So all about getting educated. This sounds like an amazing program. So let's keep going along this education's read. I'm curious about digital transformation, right? So that's sort of the genesis of this podcast was, you know, how do we spur digital transformation, get people to adopt new things, but also being aware on the social side, right?

tech equity and things like that. But how do you handle that in your programs? Like, is that talked about? Like tech is talked about? And I'm really curious. Yeah. So I think about this from two lenses. One is how do we transform the classroom experience, right?

How do we integrate these concepts and how we teach and how we assess student competencies? and the other is, yes, how do we take advantage of this wonderful technology that is before us, but can also do harm if we're not on top of it, right? And so we are at Georgetown, as long as academic integrity is not compromised, we tell our faculty, go for it, go for it, create really cool opportunities in the classroom for students to take advantage of technological health technologies, test, test, it, play around with it, so that our students are comfortable with it when they graduate. Now, we are because, as you know, Ed, this technology is evolving so quickly that policy can't even keep up. Policy and regulation can't even keep up. And so we're, again, I just left

a meeting earlier today, thinking about, for example, AI and where does that fit in our school? How do we situate that at the School of Health? Do we offer a certificate? Do we create a master's degree in this space, right? But one thing that we know is happening so quickly, right? Whatever we do, it has to be agile, and it needs to be able to change based on how the world is changing and how policy may change.

But I think one thing, I know one thing that we've committed to at the School of Health is, again, using technology for good, using technology to advance our commitment to social justice, recognizing that algorithms are likely to be inherently biased because they're pulling from data that is inherently biased. And so we must train our students how to critique algorithms. We must train our students how to develop algorithms so that no population is left behind.

That is our commitment. Now, how we choose to get there, we're still working through that. But we are committed to using these technologies to support what we philosophically believe in, right? That all people should live a healthy, meaningful life. And so I think technology can play a major role in that. Yeah. No, that's so cool. I keep talking about it for a long time.

I know you could too. But I want to roll into leadership. You're obviously a leader. You're a dean, inaugural dean at that. I'm sure that comes with a whole, whole whole. host of opportunities and challenges as well. And then, you know, your career that you spoke about, you've had all these different leadership role.

What's the one best piece of advice you might give someone who is an aspiring executive? So again, you know, the majority of the audience, Christopher is probably mid-career, maybe a master's degree, maybe not. You know, they want to aspire to be someone like yourself or perhaps, you know, the rules that I have passed. What would you say? There's two, two nuggets. I want to drop here. One, networking. Networking is key. And it's actually an expectation in our programs.

We want our students to, and we create experiences for them outside of the classroom to get to know who's who. So that when they are applying for a career move or whatever, a job, that someone knows that name. You know, you're not just sending your resume blindly. People know who you are. Right. So that's one. the power of networking. Of course, you got to have all the technical skills and all those things. But, but, you know, our students tell us this all the time. They write us. They're like, I'm so glad that networking was a part of our cohort experience because people know me. Right. The other is to establish your professional brand. Right. And Ed, I know you found me on LinkedIn because I have been very intentional about establishing my personal brand on that platform.

Now, LinkedIn may not be your preferred platform, but for me, it is, right? Whatever it is that you use, it's important that you have a brand. And so what does that mean? It's like I was talking to an HRP, several HRVPs, and they were telling me that, yeah, resumes are cool and all that, but we can tell a lot from a person's LinkedIn page. Yeah. Right. Like LinkedIn is another resume. And that's how it's starting to be perceived. Again, it may not be LinkedIn. You may use other platforms. But whatever it is, put yourself out there. Don't just like, like, like, contribute to the conversation, right? Acknowledge people publicly who have been the wings to help you fly, right? Like use it for different purposes so that folks can read

that and be like, I get a sense of who this person really is, right? Yeah. And it could really make a difference when it comes to a manager making a decision to bring you on board or not. Yeah, very important. What's the most, I guess we'll go to the speed round because I don't want to skip any these questions. What's the most satisfying part of being deemed?

Well, the founding dean is very, this is legacy work. This doesn't happen every day, right? And so, you know, I tell the faculty, every time I get an opportunity, a hundred years from now, someone's going to want to know, who are these people that started the School of Health? Who had, who, who, who are so prescient about this and got us where we are today, which would be 100 years from now, whatever the math adds up to be. Yeah. 21, 24.

This is legacy work. This is unique. It's Georgetown. I'm the first dean. I'm very honored to do this work. I have a wonderful, wonderful faculty and staff that we are, we are rolling in the same direction as far as who we are, what we believe in, and how we can make a difference in the world. So it's very self-fulfilling. Again, it's an honor.

And I feel like I am truly, truly living my purpose. Yeah, no, I can feel it and hear it. What practical ways do you refuel? So obviously, you've got a high performance job, but you've got to take rest. What do you do? Well, his name is Winston, and I come home to him every day. He's the first thing I see when I wake up in the morning. And the last thing I see before I close my eyes, he's a two-year-old golden doodle that I am completely in love with.

I tell you, when I am with my little fell, this little dog, I can feel like, you know, your hormones and all that. I could just see all of the pleasure hormones, just everything's just kicking in around him. So I'm very thankful for it. That's my kid. That's the only kid I have. But I love traveling. I think traveling is important. It's important for leadership skills to get out and see the world and see how different people live

and how different people respect our common home called Earth. And, of course, physically, you know, I'm at the gym two or three times a week. That's really important to me. Yeah, people. And family, family and friends. Can't go wrong with that. Good family and friends. Yeah, people.

It is a podcast, so we don't show. the visual, but yeah, you're a very fit person. That's good. That's cool. Look, we talked about a lot of things. It took so many notes. We loved some of the mantras, you know, leaving the world a better place and he found it and then be the change from Gandhi. And then the whole concept of purpose-driven life. And then we talked about the difference between school of health and compared to traditional public health. So cool what you're doing and the focus. Some of the keys that I brought, that I that resonated with me was going from me to we so trying to teach hey take focus off yourself and think about much broader concepts social justice systems thinking those sort of things

learn how to critique very critical but from biomed to biosocial loved it and then and then also from a practical point of view you drop really three things in terms of what aspiring executives could do don't don't neglect the power of networking I'm telling you Christopher and you know this because that's why you're teaching it and stressing it. It still amazes me that a lot of my peers and contemporaries don't incorporate networking. You know, so I'm glad that you all do the professional brand. That's another thing, especially I think in baby boomers, don't want to do it. I think it's more common for other generations, but professional brand is extremely important.

And, you know, when you talk about refueling, you also talked about travel and how that actually helps leadership. So that was sort of another thing. So we talked about a lot of different things. What did we miss? Or is there anything you want to double down on? I'll give you the last word. Yeah, I can't believe I didn't say this word. I don't think I said it once since we started our conversation.

And that's the importance of humility. And so in our work, right? And so for so long we were taught cultural competence. And I've been on this train to evolve from cultural competence to cultural humility. because cultural competence has this assumption that you can teach people about different cultures and what they expect. I remember going to an in-service training and they were like, well, if it's a Jehovah's Witness, then this is what you do. If it's a Muslim, this is what you do. And I'm like, that's how we were taught.

And now I'm like, oh my gosh, we were really doing more damage, right? Each person is very unique. We can't make these assumptions. And so in our programs, when we teach, when students go out into the world, we talk about the importance of humility. We don't know all the answers. We can have as many degrees behind your name as possible, but the person in front of you is not going to have the same experience as you. And we can't have our assumptions imposed on that individual. And so it's important for us to recognize that when we're dealing with a patient, when we're dealing with a patient, when we're dealing with

the community, and we need to be humble and we need to listen and learn so that we can be better of service to that individual. And so I just want to be sure that I stress the importance of humility in this work. Again, I don't think that's a skill set that has been integrated or inculcated in health professions education like it should. And of course, spirituality. I mean, I don't know how you could be a leader if you're not. not optimistic. Yeah. You know, it's like, you know, so optimism is key in this work that we're doing.

So, yeah. Well, Dr. Christopher King, this has been amazing. Founding Dean, Georgetown University, School of Health. We'll put in the show notes how to reach you, how to reach the School of Health, in case anyone's interested. You're an amazing human. I'm so glad that you're leading this part of our industry in terms of educating the next generations and even current generations. So thank you so much for being part of Digital Voices.

Thank you for having me. This has been a pleasure. Hey, that wraps up. Digital Voices. Again, thanks for listening. Thank you for listening to Digital Voices podcast with Edmarts. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe on your preferred streaming service and leave a rating and review. And most importantly, thanks again for listening.