Driving to the Basket: A Detroit Pistons Podcast - Episode 150: Thoughts on Monty Williams

Episode Date: June 6, 2023

This mini-episode discusses the Pistons' hire of Monty Williams as the team's new head coach. 

Welcome back. Everybody you listen to another episode of Drive Into the Baskets. I am Mike, your host, coming at you with another mini episode. I had planned to record this one last week, a couple days after the Monty Higher, to talk about that. Of course, that being a pretty big piece of business news, unfortunately ended up with a pretty unpleasant cold or pretty severe congestion over the weekend, which would have made me sound pretty horrible. So I ended up doing it today. And of course, there's going to be a full episode tomorrow. This one, a deep dive into 10. Taylor Hendricks, an interesting player whom the Pistons will probably not draft unless they trade down. So let's get straight to it, Monty Higher. Biggest coaching contract in the history of the NBA, it doesn't really have any practical impact. Coach salary doesn't count against the cap.

It's pretty much just coming out of Tom Gores' pockets. It's obviously up to any given owner how much they want to pay the coach. And Tom Gores say what you will about his questionable business dealings and the horrible way in which he ran the team for his first. I don't know, I think eight, eight and a half seasons. He's always been willing to spend. So Monty Williams, former coach of the year for the Phoenix Suns, before that coached the New Orleans Pelicans. And I know that I sort of poo-pooed Moni as a hire on an episode probably, I don't know, like a month ago maybe. And I'm not upset about the hire. Mani is a solid coach. You know, you could even say he's a pretty good coach. He's just not quite what I wanted. I did not want the past.

to turn to another coach who, in terms of his flaws, is very set in his ways and is very unlikely to improve. Now, he's not quite part of that same group as, say, Budenholzer and Dibodeau and Dwayne Casey, of course, who have really just been passed by the NBA, you know, the NBA, of course, which has evolved a great deal in the last seven, eight years. And that's a crop of old coaches who really just haven't been able to adapt. And they managed to stick in the league, but, you know, Boodenholzer, I'd be surprised to begin another gig again.

Casey obviously is done for good. But, yeah, so these are coaches who have not translated well into the modern era, who are rigid, unimaginative on offense, and really, above all, unable, but completely unable to adapt to changing circumstances to make the necessary adaptations in anything like a timely manner, which hurts in any situation,

but is deadly in the postseason. So Moni doesn't really belong to that group. You know, he's, I'd say, kind of like a generation ahead of them. He does still have some issues adapting, for example. And I wasn't a fan at all of his coaching against the Nuggets, I think. That sure his team didn't really have all that much depth, but just an offense that was hand the ball to one of your big three and asked them to create in the mid-range is really not ideal.

You know, I was up close in the arena to watch game two and to watch even Chris Paul not really being used as a playmaker. It was just, you know, take the ball and get to your favorite spot in the right elbow and take that fade away. So, yeah, just not, again, he's a solid coach. I just, I did not want a coach who has fossilized faults, put it that way. But we got money now, and I don't think it's a bad hire. It's just, like I said, it's just not exactly what I wanted. And, of course, if the Pistons had gone with a new hire,

with a coach who had no experience coaching in the NBA before, of course, you'd taken a risk there. and there's no guarantee that's going to work out, of course. I'm not saying that's to, you know, in terms of, you know, to contextualize Mani's higher. I'm just saying, you know, even if I had gotten what I wanted, it may not have turned out well. Who knows? I just wanted the pistons to finally take a chance on a young coach, you know, with potential who, and I'm just repeating myself, I know Mani's faults aren't huge, but I just, I wanted them to avoid that sort of coach, but that's what I wanted when they, you know, when they ended up hiring Casey as well.

So I digress. money's a solid coach. You know, I rank him as like a B plus coach. And he's definitely good with young players, just like Dwayne Casey is. He was sort of the safe choice. That is what it is. And, you know, it's a solid hire. It's a solid higher in particular for what continues to be a rebuilding phase

when the Pistons are hoping to see continued development from the young players and march toward first returning to the postseason. and then hopefully contending for a championship, you know, somewhere down the line. I think Monty is good, you know, if we're saying like contending is five steps down the line, I would say Monty is good for like the first three or four of those. He's got a six-year deal. Who knows if a coach is, you know, that's a long deal for a coach and who knows if he'll be around for the entirety of it.

He's certainly getting paid. About 76 million before incentives. He's got another 26 million. There's two, excuse me, 21 million coming from the Sons. Next season, in terms of the current roster, he would be the second highest paid person in the organization after only Boyan Bogdanovich. Of course, that might change this summer if the business make a big free agent signing, though I can't really foresee anybody being paid more than $20 million unless it's Jeremy Grant, not from the free agent market. So let's dive into Monty a little bit, though. I don't really have a ton to say about him.

Fundamentally, sound coach, again, good with young players. decent offensive scheme. Again, a better coach thing Casey, unequivocally. More fit for the modern NBA, more fit to run an offense, you know, better at adapting, even if he's still not as good as I would like. And though his scheme against Denver and the playoffs really just devolved into awful, you know, for the most part, he runs a solid offense. And he's good with his players. I'll get to this DeAndre Aitin thing. I do not blame money for that. I think DeAndre Aten is exactly the sort a professional athlete I dislike. You know, petulant, self-centered, much more interested with his, you know, with his petty vendettas

than he is with actually doing what's right for the team. When he got benched last year in game seven, again, players just get benched sometimes. It's like, get over it. He was playing a really bad game. It seems to have been tension between he and Monty ever since. And I just think that Aiton's a bit of a baby. I don't blame Monty for that. And by all accounts, he's always had a very good relationship with his other players.

And that stretches back to his days in New Orleans. I think he got a raw deal with the Pelicans when he was fired there. If you want to read a touching story, look up, you know, how he supported Ryan Anderson. This is after Ryan Anderson's girlfriend at the time tragically committed suicide. You know, it's a real touching story, how money was there with him through that. So I suppose I'll just use the rest of this time to talk about, you know, the impact that this could have on the offseason, you know, and going forward. And just some general thoughts of mine about his time in Phoenix. So at Phoenix, his time there coincided with the Suns really improving from a perennial disappointment to a team that ultimately went to the championship and was one of the top regular season teams for, I believe, three seasons in a row.

Well, not this year, actually. Things didn't go particularly well this year. But last season and the season before that, they were really up there. So how much of this is due to Monty? I mean, you got to lay some of it at the feet of James Jones as well. You know, the Monty, you know, he did a good job at the youth in New Orleans, and I think he did a good job with the youth in Phoenix as well. If you look at how they improved, I mean, part of it was bringing on Chris Ball, of course, Chris Paul, who at the time still had a great deal left in the tank. He wasn't the player. He used to be, but 80% of peak, Chris Paul is still a pretty darn good player.

You know, McCall Bridge has got a year older, Aidan got a year. year older. You know, Booker got it together and just, you know, became much more of a winning player. Again, who knows how much of the youth development was on Monty? Probably say some of it, but, you know, and James Jones did a lot to improve the roster at large. Cam Johnson, I forgot about him. Now, you know, one little quirk is that we saw McCall Bridges, and again, I'm doing this in no particular order, we saw McCall Bridges really blossom when he got to the next. I mean, into, you know, a guy you could look at and say, you know, maybe this dude is like a number two option on a championship team or at the very worst, the number three option. And you got to

wonder why he wasn't really able to find, I mean, he didn't really have quite as much in the way of usage to go around in Phoenix, but there was certainly space, especially with Chris Paul really, seeing a pretty significant downward turn this year. And in aid and seeing a reduction in usage, it is a little bit weird, you know, because again, and sorry for the creaking of the chair. This Mike's, I know, very, very sensitive. So given the fact that, yeah, Monty is, you know, fairly good with these young, you know, with these young players, I think, that he just didn't really see what Bridges could be

or given that opportunity, though Bridges had gotten more of an opportunity this season. He obviously was not going to be the number one with Devin Booker on the team, but there was certainly a space for him to get a larger role. So let's look forward. In terms of the draft and free agency. you know, how much of an impact will Monty have? I would say probably not much. Ultimately, it's Weaver who still makes all these decisions.

You know, I don't doubt that coaches always put in input. You know, we know that Dwayne Casey was involved, you know, was, you know, very involved in the draft process. He's had any good coach is going to do that. So is he going to impact whom the Pistons draft? Just because he has a reputation as, you know, being good at developing young players, I really don't think so. I think the Pistons, you know, I think his feedback will be listened to,

but I think the person's decision will ultimately just be made on which player they believe has the best shot at elevating the team. In my opinion, it's probably going to be Cam Whitmore if he's on the board. And though I really don't like saying this, I think that Asar Thompson is probably the number two behind him. I think that, I mean, I did a draft episode about the Thompson Twins that was the first in the draft series. So this would have been like three weeks before the lottery and probably circle back to Assar and kind of do. you know, another go over. I've softened on him a little bit, not a ton, but seems worthy of being revisited, especially in light of the fact that I think he's a real consideration for the Pistence at number five, though I'd be surprised to see him take him with Whitmore. That's still on the board.

So in terms of free agency, again, same thing. I don't think really money is necessarily going to have much of an impact there. Again, feedback we listened to. This is a very weak free agent class. you know, outside of Jeremy Grant's, the list of impact players for the Pistons is quite short, the list of impact players in general, again, who will realistically come to Detroit, who the Pistons are realistically be interested. I mean, the Pistons do not have much space on the roster when you put in all the young players they want to be able to get time to, and then the two veterans on the roster, those being Alec Berks and Blam Bogdanovich, who might believe will still be on the roster next season.

Of course, the Pistons would jump at the chance to return Jeremy Grant to the roster. that would be pricey, but I don't really care. You don't want to give the guy a max deal, of course. I don't think he's worth that. But though, I mean, I suppose you could argue that if you feel like you have, you're going to have your roster in place in terms of, like, you've got enough of this high-ceiling young talent that you feel like you can just overpay grants,

then whatever, of course, Portland can offer him that fifth year on a higher yearly raises. I get the feeling the guy's probably going to end up being overpaid, and, you know, in part because he's one of the big fish and a very weak class again. And I know I've seen Cam Johnson mentioned. Not a huge fan. I mean, the Nets, I think, will want to keep Cam Johnson.

The Nets can't really tank. They don't own their picks until, I think, like, 2027 due to the James Hardin trade. There's no reason for them to tank. They'll get nothing out of it. The pick or a pick swap until then, an alternating years. So unless they're worse than Houston, one of the pick swap years, they're not going to be able to keep their pick. Yeah, unless they're worse than Houston, which,

excuse me, unless they're better than Houston, pardon me. So I think that the Nets will want to keep Cam Johnson, even if they didn't, I would not want the Pistons to overpay for the guy. You know, he's a solid role player, you know, decent defender, good shooter. You know, solid all-around guy, if not the greatest NBA athlete. But his health is a major question mark. His health is a major question mark coming into the draft, and the guy can, you know, be real, has, you know, been reliably missing

basically 20 plus games every season. Well, one season he played 65 games, but this has been missing a lot of games thus far in his NBA career, and there's no reason to believe that that won't continue. And that's a big risk, especially because that can very, very easily get worse over time. So I'm not a fan of that either. And again, I don't think Monty would really make much of a difference there. I mean, maybe Cam Johnson be willing to make him more willing to sign an offer sheet. But again, it just comes down to the nets and their willingness to match. when it comes to players who are in restricted free agency, their teams have all the power. And that's how it's designed.

Okay, so let's look forward to developments. There's not really a ton to say here, beyond that, Monty is coming in at a point when development is one of the key bellwethers for success, when the patients are concerned. A lot of youth on the roster right now, of course, Cade, Ivy, Duren. Beyond that, you know, of course, Isaiah Stewart, Isaiah Livers, guys I think will just mostly be role players. And then whomever you're adding with the number five pick, you know, development is imperative, if it's going to play the biggest role in what happens with the pistons going forward.

I think they're in good hands in that capacity with Monty. Now, do I expect, you know, next step, of course, the playoffs, do I expect that to happen this season? I think a great deal would have to go right, like a great deal. The pistons would have to get a lot better and some teams would have to get worse. And this is a season in which, as I've said before, there may be 15 teams competing for the playoffs in the east, which would be kind of crazy, but is not outside the realm of possibility.

So probably another developmental season. Again, something that Moni seems well suited for. And then next step playoffs. And again, once you're, when you're a team in the early rounds of the playoffs, you know, Monty's flaws are not necessarily going to be damaging. It's probably when you get a little bit deeper. Now, I know it's brought up that Moni has made it to the finals. I'm not trying to poo-poo is his achievement here, but the Sun's got extraordinarily lucky.

I'm just saying this because you might be listening to listeners and saying, well, Mike, the Sun's got to the finals on Armani. And it's true, again. He did get to the finals. They did benefit from Anthony Davis missing much of the series in the first round, the defending champion Wakers. LeBron ultimately getting injured as well, playing injured. They went into the second rounds, and they faced the Nuggets without Murray,

who had been excellent the year before in the bubble, but it torn his ACL earlier in the year. Yokic, as amazing as he is, cannot carry that team on his own. And then they moved on to play the clippers who were missing Kauai, one of the greatest players of his generation, basically this generation's Grant Hill, and that he's incredible but can't stay healthy. And then they went on to face the Boodenholzer Bucks

and surrender. a two-nothing lead and lose four games in a row. The Buden-Hulzer, again, Buden-Hulzer, not a good coach. His postseason offense, certainly in those finals, and, you know, even before that, basically boiled down to here, Drew, Chris, Yannis, take the ball and score with it, and either one of you has to have an amazing game, two of you have to have great games, or all three of you have to have good games, or the start of the offense is going to fall flat in his fate, and we're going to lose. This is also a Bucks team that came, you know, literally possibly about half an inch. from losing to the Nets in the conference finals,

the Nets who were without Carrie Irving had James Harden playing on one leg. It's basically just losing to Kevin Durant. So, yeah, he made it there. And again, it's not some, well, I guess I am minimizing that achievement a bit. But the Sun certainly got exceptionally lucky, like exceptionally, exceptionally lucky, and then lost to a pretty poorly coached team in the finals. So it's at that point, and I know I'm repeating myself in hopefully the future, at which money might become not quite so ideal of a hire as he is not the most facile,

you know, flexible, adaptable postseason coach. But that's probably some years down the line. Now the question, of course, comes up, you know, if he turns out not to be the right coach for the Pistons at that point, given the mammoth salary that is being paid by coaching standards, would the Pistons be willing to cut ties? This is Tom Gores. Again, he's a guy who, you know, say what you will, but some of his business dealings are very questionable, especially to believe it's secure.

is the name. He is willing to spend on this team. It was said, and who knows if Stefanski was telling the truth, but it's entirely possible that they had to tell Tom Gores back in the 2018, 2019 season, you know, the first and really the only full Blake season, that it did not make any sense for the Pistons to pay the luxury tax for that roster. Paying the luxury tax doesn't just mean extra salary. It means starting the clock on the repeater tax. If you're in the tax in three out of the past four years, your tax penalties magnifies substantially. It was really realistic that the Pistons would have been in the tax for three of the, you know, for that year and in two of the next three, probably not. Who knows if he was telling the truth. But, you know, Gores is willing to spend.

He's always been willing to spend, you know. The man bought actually the sons, mine, uh, excuse me, a G league team and brought it to Detroit, where he built this entire new practice facility. And so, you know, if it turns out that money is not the best option four or five years down the line, I would expect Gores. And, you know, if it looked like upgrading the coaching might be the difference between, you know, really being contender for a championship and not being a contender that I think he'd be willing to cut ties at that point. So that'll be it for this episode. I know it's a pretty short one. And so, yeah, just coming away from this one, just sort of feeling okay,

it's not like it was when Casey got hired. And I was like, this guy is a horrible idea for a team that actually wants to win. And he spent years proving it, strong regular season coach. But a guy, well, for a while a strong, I wouldn't even call him a strong regular season coach. I'm not sure why I put it that way. You know, a guy for a year, who for years, you know, achieved pretty good regular season success on the backs of just having a couple of elite ISO players and saying, here, Kyle, here, Tamara, take the ball and score with it

and watching them do well at that, or having his offense fall flat in his face if they couldn't. And then, you know, horribly underperforming the playoffs when things really tightened up. And then as coach of the year season, having Nick Nurse be the one who formulated the offense and then having Casey fall to pieces again. So, yeah, it's definitely not like that.

at that point, I just looked at and said he's absolutely not a coach if you wanted your team to win whom you should be hiring. And certainly not for that roster, which was a nightmare of mismatched parts and really needed an innovative mind, which Casey is not. So it's not like that when I was actually genuinely upset that it had that it had happened. And ultimately, I mean, ironically, Casey, you know, the pistons would start rebuilding about a year and a half later and Casey would end up in a position that really much more befitted him, you know, that of coaching through a rebuild. So for this, it's more just, you know, maybe slightly underwhelmed, but not unhappy. I don't anticipate watching the next few seasons and just getting really pissed off at the piss and being undercut by bad coaching. There's very, very little in the NBA that annoys me more than bad coaching, even if it's

coaching for a team I don't really care about. You know, it still just bugs me a great deal. And I just want to say, I mean, I know that the argument is sometimes made that, You know, that coaching doesn't really matter all that much in the NBA. I unequivocally disagree. I think a good coach will make his team more than the sum of its parts. You know, an average coach is probably a bit equal and a bad coach can easily take a team with a lot of talent and make it quite a bit worse. Look at the bucks this season where Boodenholz are just completely fell apart. And look at the heat, whereas Spolstra, I think is the best in the business, has helped coach a team without much talent

to the finals. I mean, Jimmy Butler is great. Out of Bio is a really good player. and beyond that, I mean, three of their rotation players are former two-way guys. That is really something else. They are not fielding a particularly good roster, but Spolstra is able to get more out of his rosters than just about anybody else. So in any case, yeah, I don't anticipate watching these regular seasons and just getting pissed off at Monty like I have at Casey and like I did at Stan Van Gundy before him.

So, you know, at least there's that. I'm sort of looking forward to seeing how it looks. I think the continuity from Casey in terms of development, which was a strong suit, and in terms of running a good locker room, which is another Casey's strong suit, is going to be helpful. You know, as the pistons continue in this stage of the rebuild, and from there, we'll see. So that'll be it for this episode. I know I just talked a little while after saying that that was going to be it for this episode. So this is the actual end of it.

So we'll catch you folks with a full-length episode tomorrow. Until then, take care. Thanks for listening.