Driving to the Basket: A Detroit Pistons Podcast - Episode 234: Free Agency Recap (with Zariq of RealBullyBall)

Episode Date: July 5, 2025

This episode, featuring Zariq of RealBullyBall, recaps the Pistons' free agency journey so far.

Welcome back. Everybody, you're listening to another episode of Drive into the Baskets. I'm Mike. Hope you're all doing great during this interesting free agency period. The pleasure of being joined today once again by Zarek of Real Bully Ball. Zarik, always a pleasure to have me on the show. Really glad to be here. Thank you for having me on as always. And yeah, I'm excited to talk some Pistons basketball and free agency. It's been definitely noteworthy thus far. So excited to get to it. Absolutely. It's been, I'll say definitely, more satisfying and exciting than Reblings Free Agency for any of you who are hockey fans. Not a fun time, but thankfully we're not here to talk about the Reblings and, you know, more a team that, you know, is, well, whatever,

I digress. Nobody wants to hear my resentment over Steve Eisenhower and pour through. If you want to hear that, you'll listen to any Reblings podcast. All right. So, Free agency, we are what feels like a lot further into it, at least from me, probably because of all the time I've spent just F5ing news sites. It's only the 4th of July, so, you know, a little less than four days ago is when free agency opens. We were greeted first, I believe, in the day of, by news of some unfortunate impropriety on the part of Malik Beasley. And it was a big part of the front office's plans. And, you know, everybody was pretty excited to have him back. unfortunate yeah extremely um it's a weird it's a weird one for me because um malik's one of the players

that i actually ended up working with the most this past season so uh it definitely felt like a a bit of a shock when i got the the shams notification i'm hoping everything gets cleared on his end and he's able to just return to basketball if not the pistons because that is such immense talent to not be playing in the NBA possibly again. And I'm really hoping that everything is able to be cleared on his end because, again, I just, I can't imagine a talent that high having the season he had just not playing again. And so I'm really hoping he gets this stuff cleared out. And hopefully none of this is true. But man, rough situation for the Pistons for sure.

And it definitely made them adjust their free agency plans on the fly. I saw some people saying that like the Pistons definitely knew about this. And, you know, that's why they were interested in to kill Alexander Walker. That is not true. the Pistons did not seem to know about this at all. So I think given the circumstance, Duncan Robinson, I'm sure we'll get more into it. Duncan Robinson is as close to a on-court replacement

as you can get for Malik Beasley. But again, I'm sure we'll get more into each signing and potential. Yeah. Yeah, for my part, of course it sucks to lose Beasley in the court sense. I just hope the guy finds his way because, I mean, you hate to look at somebody in any field who is so irresponsible in a way. I mean, I don't know if it hurts the people around him, certainly hurts him, just kind of setting himself up for trouble. So hope he finds his way. Hope he finds a financial advisor whom he'll listen to. And like you, I hope he can resume his MBA career.

and maybe he's clear mid-season and ends up back with the Pistons on a minimum deal. Who knows? But, yeah, I mean, I think the front office was really served up with some terrible lemons on, you know, very shortly before a free agency. And I think that all things considered they did an admirable job. Before we get to who they signed first,

the other departure, other significant departure, that is not Tim Hardaway, Jr. I guess we can talk about him a bit, but that'd be Dennis Schroeder. And how do you feel about him leaving the team? Yeah, Dennis leaving was somewhat of a surprise to me because I saw him as someone that definitely seemed to have a likelihood of returning to Detroit. Once more suitors started emerging,

where you started hearing about how much interest Sacramento had, Dallas, potentially Milwaukee, It seemed like he was going to have a market, but I didn't know how much the priority for Dennis would be like continuity versus potential like the highest contract, you know. Smart for him to get the contract and, you know, on a multi-year deal at that. I don't think Detroit probably was willing to offer around the same money for the same amount of time. I feel like Trajan definitely has a cap on years that he's willing to give on a contract. If we pay attention to these deals he gives, it's usually a two-year deal, which is what he gave to Tobias, a one-year deal to Malik Beasley, and then even Carislevert to two-year deal. Duncan Robinson technically also a two-year deal.

And one and a half, yeah. Yeah, where that second year is partially guaranteed, third year, not guaranteed at all. Yeah, I think we saw it just to break in that Beasley, he's. he was going to offer a two plus team option. Right. So the flexibility there is clearly really important. So maybe that was a factor as well. But even before free agency, right before, I should say,

it seemed to like Dennis was not returning because there was that clip of him from an Instagram stream where he was saying how Detroit didn't really want him back as much as he wanted to go back. So I'm glad he gets to go to Sacramento and find a really prominent starting point guard position where he definitely was not going to have here. At the same time for the Pistons, it's a major blow to me. I think Karris Lever comes in now, hopefully, ideally to replace Schroeder's production because at the moment, if he's not playing the backup point guard, you do not have a backup point guard.

And we already know the staggering Ivy and Kate thing does not necessarily fill the void. Yeah, no thanks. So, yeah. So I just, I don't see that as a solution. So if anything, I do see Carri Slibert as the backup point guard, which is pretty much the role he had in Cleveland under G.B. Baker staff before. So that's really what I expect. So the whole point guard discussion to me, like where people are like, oh, we need to go and get a point card.

I'm like, I think you already got one. I agree. That's what he was signed for. He does a fair job of it. But yeah. Yeah. So do I think he, I don't, so I've never been like the hugest Karras Levert fan. I was a really, like my biggest fandom of his was Michigan back when he was, he was playing at UFM.

Ironically, it was that team where he was with Duncan Robinson. and then I want to say it bled into the time he had he spent a year with Tim Hardaway. Yeah, he was really a low minute player on that 2013. Yeah, with Trayberg as well. Yeah, national championship runner up. Yeah, with McGarry and Stouskis of Sacramento King's fame and that clip that everybody loves, you know. Yeah, Mitch McGarry also famous Troy Weaver. A famous Troy Weaver favorite is Mitch McGarr.

Oh, right. I don't know about that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And the last one on that team, I'm forgetting. Or did we go over all five already?

Oh, anyway. Yeah, he was a small midipler there. Yeah. So he was a freshman on that team. Yeah. So I like Caris Laverda, Michigan. I thought the earlier's in Brooklyn were fun. I even liked him in Indiana, but in Cleveland,

I found myself get a little bit frustrated at times just because it felt to me like he would shot hunt a bit and it wasn't in a productive manner sometimes. I can't speak for his Atlanta run. Admittedly, I did not watch much of Atlanta post-trade deadline just because that was an injured team. Like Dyson Daniels was interesting. Trey Young had a statistically interesting season,

but with no Jalen Johnson, and it seemed like they were just kind of kicking the can, which fair enough. Yeah, I mean, they wanted to keep their, they wanted to keep their back. So that makes perfect sense. So I can't say it's necessarily a substantial upgrade over Dennis Schroeder. The size is definitely an upgrade where you're now have that switchability that you did it with Dennis,

where if you were playing him in a lineup with, let's say, not even Cade and Ivy because, you know, Ivy and Shrewder never played together. But like it was Cade, uh, Beasley, Shruder you lose less by having Kerasavert replace Shruder in that type of lineup where you're less worried about who he's guarding so I think that's definitely a plus the contract a bit high in my opinion but again if if Trajan in this front office has one specific specialty it is

contract so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on that just also because it is incredibly movable as well. So I do think this is a decent replacement for Dennis Schroeder. It's nothing like I can get extremely excited nor pessimistic about. But with that said, I don't know, and we can get more into that. I don't know at the moment how much better I think this team is than they were last season. But we can also get into Duncan Robinson, who I'm much higher. for sure much higher on it yeah i'll break i'll just break in about lavert here just to profile him for

people who maybe aren't quite as familiar with him as we are so yeah came out of michigan uh this would be his 10th season which is crazy to me and yeah started with brooklyn moved on to indiana in the jared allen deal uh well the jared allen deal i think that was james hardin deal i think it's a better way putting it. But obviously James Hardin has moved around a little bit, a little bit, and Jared Allen probably has had the most long-term impact on one team. Then was in Cleveland with J.B. Bickerstaff for three seasons, I believe, yeah, just about three seasons. And, oh, excuse me, almost four seasons, and then got traded to Atlanta and a DeAndre Hunter deal. So a six-foot-six, you know, 200, a wing, as you had pointed out,

probably the backup point guard, you know, bench handler at least. That's a decent job of handling. I really likes to attack downhill. Never been the most efficient score. And, I mean, not, like, dreadfully inefficient by any means, but typically below par. Last season was his first time since his rookie year that he scored it, you know, league average or above efficiency.

And his three-point shooting is hit or miss, like very, very much hit or miss. last season he shot 37% but it's like he started really strong in the first few months and then tailed off so it's excuse me yeah I think I agree with you I mean they got stronger on defense I think you'll lose something on offense as far as Schroeder's ability to penetrate and get to the rim and also his swagger which I'll miss

agree to contract at mid-level oh do you remember something I find hilarious when Josh Smith signed that horrible con It was starting at just about what Karras Leverett is getting this season, maybe a little bit more. It was a four-year, $64 million contract. Yeah, so I think, assuming it was typical structure with 8% raises, yeah. That was a handicapping contract. Oh, yeah, it was the biggest contract in team history. Wow.

Yeah, so it's just amazing how much things have changed in, like, the last 12 years. And now we have guys like Shay, you know, and Booker, maybe getting $75 million a year. Yeah. A 15 million looks like nothing. Oh, yeah, for sure. So that was kind of wellmed, so to speak. That's not a word, but over versus underwhelmed by the signing. It's kind of like, he's okay.

As you pointed out, I agree short-term contract. And so if you want to use him a salary ballast, then cool. He's also still a somewhat useful player at any team that wants to trade for him. And, yes, I think it was a lateral move. Aside from size, the piston's got a lot taller. For sure. in general this off season. And that's a big plus, in my opinion,

where you lose, again, on the defensive end, Duncan Robbins is not necessarily giving you that defense, but on offense, it adds a lot more to have people over 6-5 in your lineup where it's a completely over-6-5 lineup. Having a 6-7 point guard also plays a great factor, that it'll be interesting, honestly, seeing Detroit with so much size and switchability. The more I think about the Carouselvert signing, the more I like it, it's just one of those ones that initially I looked at and I was like, I don't know how I feel about that.

Yeah, it's, yeah, I was kind of indifferent. And so as long as he can stay healthy, I mean, I think he'll be okay. I think his role will be, I mean, the idea I think is going to have. two of Caden Ivy, excuse me, one of Caden Ivy on the floor with him. So like not staggered Caden Ivy, but, you know, probably Ivy comes out first. Yeah. And, you know, you got Cade on the floor with Leverton. It's just, you know, he can do a decent job of handling. He's not like a lead at it, but he does decent job of it. It's not a situation where you're asking somebody who's just not in, you know, that's just not the role. I feel like increasingly, it is increasingly unusual for

anybody of wing size to be completely unable to playmake. 100%. Especially in today's NBA. It's almost a necessity. Yeah. That skill for men just keeps getting higher and higher. I feel like it was the Toronto Raptor Steve in 2019 that really created that foundation

where it's like everybody has to at least be solid at driving and kicking. Yeah, that was a big factor. I think of Mike Dantonies rockets where all of a sudden for like a year people just hated centers. And I was like, and they were saying, oh, there's not going to be any more centers. This is completely position most basketball. I was like, I had. Robert Covington at center.

Yeah, man. That worked real well when L.A. faced off Anthony Davis against him in the playoffs. Yeah, that worked greatly for the Lakers winning a champion. Yeah. So cool. But yeah, I just feel like with size, you definitely gain a lot in terms of just having people who can, can switch positions. The Dennis Schroeder minutes were a bit restricting because of his size,

where I felt like maybe someone like Karras replaces that and you're able to run three guard lineups technically without the fear of, oh, God, we have to get back on defense. So that could be beneficial. Yeah, for sure. And one of the advantages of drafting Kade was, I mean, well, this was back. before the infamous gravity incident when he shrank from 6-8 to 6-6-6-6. Yeah, of course, this is a joke.

This is the NCAA's size inflation. I hope someday they'll start measuring, you know, becoming required to measure with shoes. You know, I've ridiculous situations where Ace Bailey is actually Wobolo 6-8. Jace Richardson turns out as a midget. So, yeah, so one of the ideas with having Cade is a jumbo point guard was you could run these big lineups.

And that took a slight step back with Ivy because he's in the shortest. But he's still 6-4, which means he's at least a hair above 6-3 by NBA standards. So you can still run these big lineups. Right now, he's projected, you know, because Robinson is a few inches taller than Beasley.

He's projected as the shortest member of the rotation right now. It's 6-4. So you can find major advantages from that. So, yeah, let's segue into Duncan Robinson. So just for any of you who, I mean, I'm sure there are some very, very happy University of Michigan fans. right now who, you know, got two pretty notable former Wolverines on the team in the space of a day and,

well, 24 hours or so. So clearly the pivot piece from when they lost Beasley is you're losing a crap with a shooting, you know, perimeter play finishing. Same thing, but play action. You know, they ran so much of that around Beasley and also gravity. So Robinson is a shooting specialist, like barely nothing. You know, that's not, not that he's nothing beyond that. That's what he's always been, spent the entire career at this point playing under the great Eric Spolstra, who is better than anybody at maximizing role players. And for a little while there in his, what was basically his rookie season, because he didn't play much in his actual rookie season. He was an incredible shooter.

Like, but a huge role on that Miami Heat team. The first of two-minded. Greatest shooter in Miami Heat history. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And basically every sense. So, yeah, he came in shooting 45%. He had close to 69% true shooting in that season.

Yeah, he was part of the first of two heat teams in the 2020s to have absolutely no business reaching the finals, but get there anyway. And things went a little bit downhill from there. He had a bad season, 22, 23, got really superseded by Max Drews, even the season before that. And it's kind of made a comeback, though. A lot of gravity knows where to go, can shoot off the move. And, you know, playing under Spolstra, you learn great habits. It's not great on defense, but I feel like not as bad as he used to be. So this was an addition I was happy with.

Yeah, Duncan Robinson is someone I've been like a pretty big fan of for the last few years. I always saw him as someone that would make sense next to Kate Cunningham. So it happening now of all times just feels a bit odd. But I'm happy that the Pistons were able to get him because if not, things were looking pretty bleak in terms of adding another shooter on this team. So I think that that worked out perfectly for them because I seriously think like if anybody can get close to replicating Mleek-Biesley season last year, it would be Duncan Robinson. But in addition, he also adds a level of playmaking on his own where what he lacks on the defensive. event. I feel like he's such an offensive, honestly, like he's such an offensive treat to watch sometimes where

he can make plays on the dribble. Granted, you don't want him making plays on the dribble, like consistently, but he has the ability to, and he has such a high basketball IQ that you trust him. Yeah, you trust him with decision making maybe a little more than like, let's say when Tim Hardaway would put the basketball on the ground and you're like, God. No thanks. Yeah. Take that mid-range pull-up is pretty much the inevitable result.

Yep. So Duncan, Duncan, to me, has a little more finesse to his game, and he's a really, really savvy player. And I think that adds a lot. My brother, I have to give him credit, he had tweeted that Duncan Robinson is the second, he thinks he's like the second smartest player that, if not the smartest player that Kate has played with thus far in terms of basketball IQ.

And I was thinking. about it, I feel like that that might be accurate just because if he had played with someone smarter, they might not have been getting like high minutes. I think of maybe even like Todd Gibson, I guess. But, you know, like, he came along at a great time for the team. Yeah, I, Josh Gibson. Yeah, what an amazing season. Morale boost. Famous morale boost, Todd Gibson. Oh, yeah, he was great. He really turned that season around. Yeah, man. But no, I really do feel like Duncan adds a lot in terms of basketball IQ. And I think watching him and Kay play off of each other will be really fun.

I think Jalen Duren also will be a huge beneficiary of Duncan Robinson minutes where if you looked at the screen actions that BAMM out of bio, and this is again not a one for one comparison at all, but the screen actions that BAM out of bio would run for him, knowing that Duren has the ability. to not only be a screener, but catch Robinson on DHOs is a big, big win. Because Duren, again, he's not someone you necessarily want making plays all the time, but he's shown the ability to be a clever playmaker. And I think that's part of his game that you can use a lot more with Duncan Robinson joining your team. So I really think there's a lot of things that he opens up with coming to the Pistons. and defense isn't one of them.

But you can live with that if he's going to give you the offensive production that you're kind of anticipating. And it's on a pretty good contract, honestly. Initially, like, the number that was given was like, oh, wow, that's a lot of money. But looking at the guarantees, it's really smart on Trajan's end. And I got to give credit to Michael Blackstone on that as well, who they call Magic in that front office. He's definitely a cap expert. And I think this front office has been really savvy with giving out contracts and they're very meticulous and the things that they do. So I will give them credit for that.

I think Duncan Robinson is a great addition to this team. My only question, though, is what exactly the style of play is going to be in terms of how this team's going to play top to bottom? because to me, my issue with this off season isn't that I dislike Carous Lever or Duncan Robinson, especially Duncan, farthest thing from it. But to me, it seemed like they were trying to replicate the formula of last season and without the same layers

and necessarily even the same amount of shooters, right? Because Tim Ardoin is a shooting specialist, much as Malik Beasley was a shooting specialist. And I saw a statistic from Omari where they accounted for 47% of made shots last season, which is a lot of offense. So if you are trying to actively replicate last season, which I think, I don't know, I think there were some things that could improve. And granted, there's still time for them to make other moves, which it seems like they're trying to do, at least. but as it stands right now like let's say this is just the off season i i just don't know if it's necessarily a formula for success because you lose a lot of shooting right like i i think that's like

a huge thing i can't expect chas leneer um to play huge minutes in his first season or yeah or any um coming in as a second round pick i just you know like that's that's something that happens circumstantially, it's not something you planned for, you know. Yeah, I hear you. So Duncan Robinson's great, but Carous LaVert's not like a shooter, you know what I mean? Not really. So how do you replicate that offense off the bench? Is it just going to be, you know, Carouselvert playmaking and you let him, you know,

get more shots up because then I don't know if even that's necessarily a recipe for success. Just because I also think Tim Hardaway worked in that, starting lineup really well, not necessarily that he was playing amazing, but just having shooting gravity in that starting lineup seemed to really open up things for Cade. And I, from what I can tell, it really seems like it's going to be Cade, Ivy, Asar, Tobias, Duren. Yeah. At the moment.

I think that's more or less a foregone conclusion. Yeah. And I, I like Ivy. I don't know if he has shooting gravity quite, yeah. I mean, I'll break in here briefly. Yeah, they, it's going to be a significant change without a doubt. And Baker staff is going to have to be a little bit more creative because I agree. I mean, he relied on Tim Hardaway Jr.

And on Malik Beasley for a great deal of play finishing. And they, Beasley, of course, was beyond elite at that. Tim Hardaway, Jr., I'd kind of have more mixed feelings on. I think he was, I mean, he shot well on wide open threes. He shot below par, pretty much on everything else. you know, where he was, you know, a jump shooter, and on defense he was bad, and as a passer, he was bad, and as a rebounder, he was bad. So I feel like it's kind of addition by subtraction, but it does change things. And I feel like you're asking for more shooting out of Ivy. You're asking probably K to finish more plays, and, you know, hopefully playing next to, you know, hopefully playing next to, in one of Leverd and Ivy, pretty much probably at all times, as long as they're, as long as all three of them are healthy is going to help with that. Also, hopefully help him not carry. 5,000 pounds on his back, you know, with the defense, he issues me the offense depending on him.

And, yeah, things will just need to get more creative, which hopefully J.B. can manage, and it'll be interesting to see. But Ivy, of course, is possibly the biggest wild card on the team for next season. Yeah, and it's a lot of pressure to me, like, for someone coming off of a huge, like, first ever, like, major injury, you know what I mean? like he broke his shit like he broke his shit it was it was it was about fun to watch no not fun to watch and it's about eight nine months you know after like after that he's going to start playing five-on-five

basketball you know i i just don't know like how much success that's going to produce if you're bringing someone off of an injury and you're just expecting him not only to replicate like the run that he was on prior to injury but also like more you know like i you're again you're going to expecting more out of him and I don't know like how much I can bank on that um which if if we're going to touch on that at all I think that's where a Malik monk finds himself useful if this deal ever goes through um because this seems like the most complicated convoluted way of getting a malik monk on your team while giving up absolutely nothing yeah yeah let's let's rotate onto that for sure. But one thing I just want to, I want to jump back to Robinson just for a second in, in terms of

how he fits in. And I'm just saying this because I am a fan of Duncan Robinson. I hope he can, I hope he don't lose effectiveness from him with him being away from Spolster. Who knows, Gabe Vincent certainly didn't do well. Srews has been fine. The guy never stops moving is one of the things I love about him. Like in addition to being very high IQ, like you said, like yeah, he'll he'll parlay his gravity. He knows how to parlay his gravity, whether that's, you know, when he's on the perimeter

or when he's attacking a closeout. And he's gotten better in the interior at scoring off closeouts into making a play. Like probably a little bit better than Beasley did, you know, when to make the pass

rather than take the shot. And yeah, I'm just a fan. Really hard worker, high IQ player. Also three inches dollar, which helps. And just one thing, yeah, about the contract. They did lose,

even in the context of this season, they lost $8 million of Fontecchio. So this one guaranteed season, he's really being paid because he's starting at about 14.5, about 6.5 million less, actually, in terms of the difference. Yeah.

Were you surprised that the heat just wanted Fontecchio straight out? I thought they were going to have to pay some assets to move off of even just this one season. Yeah, I definitely knew that Detroit was actively trying to move Fontecio prior to the Duncan

Robinson sign and trade because it was a holdup and I think it was a holdup in that Malik Monk deal where they were trying to find a way to get off of Simone. And I'm not necessarily surprised that Miami would want him because if you look at how he plays, just kind of how he is, I think that is a Miami Heat player through and through. That is someone who is absolutely going to fit in upon arrival and 100% I have no doubt in my mind he will remember how to play basketball in the way that he did in the 20 24 season yeah they they can I mean they can bring you know water from a stone in Miami it's yeah kind of infuriating oh yeah so I definitely expect simone to have a bit of resurgence next year I also think playing the power forward position was a bit unfair

for him in terms of like evaluating because he he and to my knowledge he hadn't really played the power forward at all um so being tobias his backup he had to go against different uh defenders and defend um differently as well granted also coming off a toe injury regardless it was a rough season for simone it was a rough season yeah he i will say he he was um always one of like the main guys in terms of like locker room morale, like, that kept it super high because that was a huge, huge benefit. I don't feel like gets talked about enough with, with, with this team was how well, like, they got along and how consistently, like, they were high morale, like, for lack of better term, like, great vibes, you know, like, it was consistently just good energy.

And he was, he and Malik Beasley were, like, the two biggest people in keeping that Pistons locker room just like a fun place to be and, you know, really embracing the camaraderie. I think losing both of them, obviously, Malik, you lose a lot more on the court. But I really feel like I'm going to struggle to know, like, how well this team is going to mesh in the way that they did last year, just because those are two, like, high character. I mean, in terms of the team, high character. like high high energy like really positive influences they they're going to be missed and i i i hope detroit um is able to replace them because again like especially kate is he's a quiet leader

you know what i mean like he's not someone who's going to be the loudest person in a room so having other voices who you know pick guys up and stuff i i think that's really important on this team and I hope there's a plan to replace that. Yeah, I didn't know that about Simone. I mean, it seemed like a really good dude and I think the toe injury really hurt. I feel like we saw that. I feel like we saw it most, how much it limited him in terms of just this inability to attack, close out, to run the floor in transition, which he's been very good at the season

before, at least in his short stint with the pistons. But let's rotate to Malik Monk. Of course, everybody's heard about it. You know, at this point, originally Schroeder, Schroeder the pistons were trying. sorry, stop mispronouncing his name. I don't think we'd talk about much about him anymore, but I finally got into the point where I was remembering to pronounce his name correctly every time. So, originally there was talk about making it a sign-in trade, which would have allowed the Pistons to recoup something, whether it was a player or just a trade exception, and would also earn the Kings, you know,

potentially the ability to maintain access to their non-tax pyramid level exception. that fizzled out and then came back. In the meantime, the Pistons had signed Duncan Robinson. You know, Malik Monk was the name. But yeah, they pivoted. It seems possible based on what's being said by certain sources that Monk was available all along, and the Pistons went out and got Robinson anyway.

And it's currently a three, it would be a three-team deal because they'd like to use Monk's outgoing salary, along with that of a couple of other small salary players, Carter and Dario Sarich to bring on Jonathan Cummanga from the Warriors in the sign and trade. We learned, wait last night, that the Warriors are not interested in their package, which is just those two and two second round picks for Cumminga, who's been disappointing, but for Warriors' team where literally now is the time and they are just maximizing every last minute they can get out of Steph Curry, I feel like Cummanga's a lot likely to offer in the now value than the

player Sacramento is offering, also trading him within a division for what that's worth. Yeah. So, yeah, it feels unlikely at this point. Yeah. Well, on one end, it feels unlikely, but on another, I don't know if they're going to get anything better in return for Jonathan Kaminga. Because you look at the suitors, like Washington's the only one I think that's willing to give more in terms of player value.

But I don't think they're going to get that first round pick that they're actively seeking out regardless. And I just don't see a world where Jonathan Camiga returns to Golden State. It doesn't seem like he wants to return to Golden State. I don't think he has the biggest fan in Steve Kerr. So them really try to maximize his value, acting like he is, I don't even know. He's an intriguing player, but he's not a proven one, right? And the way that they're trying to leverage things is like as if he is a proven,

like young, perennial, like, fringe, all defense or all, you know, all star type of player. I don't know about that. That's not at all. I mean, they're asking for a promising young player in a first round pick for a sign-in trade. And I... Just to break in what I would say about the, in that situation, sorry to interrupt. I just don't want to forget what I was saying, which I do constantly. Yeah.

So in that situation, I mean, it's all about the now. And if you feel like Jonathan Cominga has the... you know, if you feel like just sign them to the qualifying offer and keeping him for a year, it stands you at a higher likelihood of being better next season, then I think you could reasonably expect from Sarich and Carter. Then I think you just keep him for a year and figure it out next summer. I don't think they're necessarily in any hurry to get rid of him. And if he, you know, would prefer not to play in Golden State, well, sucks to suck.

You got drafted, you know? Yeah. You got no choice. Yeah. It just didn't seem like a situation that I saw as really salvageable for those. like the last like two years, let alone this past year especially, um, where I don't think Steve Kerr is a big Jonathan Kaminga fan in all honesty.

And nor do I think that Jonathan, I think Jonathan Kaminka actively dislikes, um, Golden State. So I just, I don't know if like part of like, like, that is true what you said, but at the same time, I don't know if I want to, I know if I want to risk a disgruntled young player being in a locker room with Jimmy about there and Raymond Green. No, they'd kill him.

Yeah, they'd, yeah. So I just, I don't know. Yeah. Not saying Dario Sarich or Devin Carter are necessarily great replacements, if replacements at all. But I think it's better value than what they're most likely to be offered. Because, I mean, Washington may be able to give you more. But that's, you know, there's no offer technically, as of I now, like right now, like on the table from Washington. Yeah.

New Orleans would be interesting. Again, like what are they willing to give up? I don't know. And then you look at Miami and we both know Pat Riley is not really trying to trade much of anything a value ever. So I can't necessarily guarantee that they're going to give really a great offer. So there might come a time in July 6th where that moratorium period ends and Golden State might end up having to take that deal.

Now, to my knowledge, I think there is a world where Sacramento includes a first. first round pick for Jonathan Kaminga, in which case they do kind of meet the quota of young player and pick. I think Devin Carter would be interesting on Golden State, but that's neither here nor there. It's totally unproven also. Yeah, that too. Rough circumstance for a rookie year, too. But yeah.

Yeah. What's your sense about where the pistons are and all of this? I mean, it really feels a lot from the reporting like Monk was available. all along and they just didn't pull the trigger. Yeah. Yeah, that that that's pretty much what it is. Sacramento's actively, and this is, you know, just gathering the tea leaves, reading a lot of Sacramento Kings media and then just hearing some stuff.

Malik Monk does not seem to be likely to be returning to the Sacramento Kings this upcoming season. sucks though. Yeah, his market, I've heard, it's terrible. It does, but I think it has less to do with his value as a player versus just teams not having cap space currently and having other priorities, where I don't think it's like he's untradable. I just think they are trying to trade him at the worst possible time. And Detroit is one of the only teams that really showed interest in him last, last,

last off season where he he was a free agent. So I think Detroit has an offer for Malik Monk on the table. They have had an offer for Malik Monk on the table where they really give up nothing and get Malik Monk for free. I think knowing Trajan, he's probably trying to leverage getting a draft asset of some kind. I'm assuming it probably like a second round pick or something. in return for Malik Monk as well. If I were him, I would just take the deal at this point.

I know that they're actively like seeking out ways to reroute Malik Monk or maybe just, oh, maybe we'll just take the trade exception instead. If I'm Detroit, I just take Malik Monk. And I know we differ on this, which I'm sure we'll get into. But if I'm Detroit, I just take Malik Monk and I figure out the rest later just because you get a deal that good. I'm taking it. Like, you're, you're giving up the, um, idea of Dennis Schroeder, you know, like you're, you're not necessarily even giving up Schroeder himself because he was signing that contract regardless. Um, and you get a player that gives you more production

offensively than, then, uh, Schroeder was able to give. So I just, I see it as like a, a, an easy win, you know, like he, if he doesn't work here, like, you can figure things. You can figure things out, I don't think he'll be as unmovable come trade deadline. But if he does work, you got a great addition to your team while giving up absolutely nothing of value. So I really feel like Detroit should take this offer regardless of any second round pick compensation because they also already have a huge pool of second rounders, which I don't know if they're ever going to actually use. And if they do, you know. Yeah, we'll see. Yeah. But we'll be. Yeah. But we'll be. Why pivot to Robinson when that offer is already on the table?

I mean, you've got a full rotation at that point, nine guys who are all going to command 20 minutes or more. Yeah, I'm, so I just, I see it as like, one, you'd still need, I would say Robinson's less of the factor here. Yeah, it's just the Paris Lavert deal, a little more questionable if you bring in a Malik Monk. At the same time, I'm just saying that, because that added the ninth guy to the rotation.

Yeah, which I don't have a problem with like I I would much rather them have an issue of we have too many players that should play minutes rather than we're giving minutes to guys that have no business, you know, playing minutes on a meaningful team. Where it's a good issue to have. It's an issue to have regardless, but it's a good one. And I think by committee you look better as well. like if you have more players, their value, I think seems, because ultimately a lot of times value in the trade market and free agency comes down to like the hypothetical, like, oh, well, what if you were in a different role or what,

you know what I mean? Like, it's that, it's the, I don't know if you ever watch the family guy. Like, there could be anything in this box, like, or you could take the boat and they're like, I want, well, it's in that box. So it's just the hypothetical, like, oh, what if? that gets added in terms of value. And there's also a thing with young players as well. But I think Malik Monk and Karas Levert hypothetically could work on this team together,

especially because Karris consistently has had some injury issues as Malik Monk has been pretty available. I think it's one thing I haven't looked into as extensively is how many games each of these guys have played for the past few years. Because I remember that was a really big thing last offseason where Beasley, Hardaway, and Tobias all were like Ironmen, basically, where they were known for, you know, playing for a lot of the season, each season. I haven't looked into it as much, but regardless, I feel like, you know, if someone gets injured, Ivy's coming off of an injury, you have good depth. You know, like we have depth where you can plug someone back into that starting lineup. up and you don't really lose sleep about it. I hear you. It's just a weird situation.

It's like, I feel like it opens up the door if there is good health for somebody to be unhappy. Yeah, you just can certainly expect people to miss time and the pistons outside of Ivy were spectacularly lucky with health last season after a SAR came back until like the last week of the season. To me, like, if you can bring on Monk and you can make it work and everybody's happy, great. It's just if everybody is healthy, like, you're not taking away minutes from the youth. I think that's a foregone conclusion.

I don't know if you disagree, but I feel like detrasion has made it clear that, that, you know, that's the priority is for them to develop. And, you know, you know what Malik Monk is. You hope that Asar or Ivy or Ron Holland can be more than that. And you're not taking away minutes from Tobias. Obviously not from Cade. The centers doesn't really make a difference. It's not going to impact that. And you don't want to bring in a couple of free agents to whom you've made.

made promises of significant minutes and then say, you know, especially if it's Carous Leverton sale, well, we found somebody else too bad. It's just, you're just acting in exceptionally poor faith in that circumstance. No, don't get me wrong. Yeah, I'm all for it if they could make it work. It's just, I just worry about the potential implications. If, you know, if the minutes, you know, do become a crunch because in that case, somebody almost certainly will overt is getting screwed over. I think just that sets a scuzzy thing to do. sets a bad precedent in players notice and the locker. Absolutely.

I think that is definitely a possibility. I think also there is a world where, you know, you're able to divvy up the minutes in a way that, you know, doesn't rub people the wrong way. I can't imagine Carous Lvert getting more than 20 minutes a game. Just because you'll have a healthy Ivy and a SAR back. So I don't know if, like, J.B. will go to those three-guard lineups as much as he did with Dennis Schrooter, that could change. He could just do the same thing. But I really feel like Karras isn't

someone I worry too much about in terms of minutes. As long as he's around that 20-minute threshold, I think he should be relatively happy. I can't imagine he expects like 25 a night. Duncan Robinson, though, is someone. I definitely would like to see get more minutes, and that could maybe complicate things. But again, I think they could play off of a other really well as you know as well because one's a dynamic slasher really in terms of getting to the rim and the other is a shooting specialist so it kind of gives you a unique dynamic in terms of bench scoring assuming they're coming off the bench it gives you unique dynamic in terms of bench scoring a six man at a year runner up and then a really great shooting specialist I think it'd be

really fun, honestly, to watch. And I think that's part of why I'm really advocating for Trajan to just go ahead and get this deal done, because I also don't know what your options are if you don't. You know, like, I don't know if you get a player, regardless of position. I don't know if you get a player better talent than Malik Monk with this exception, because you would have to attach assets at the end of the day. And I don't know if that's something they necessarily really want to do. So I don't know how much better you get just scouring the trade market and trying to get, you know, I know they're trying to get a power forward. I think Brett Siegel reported last night that outside of this Malik Monk sign and trade, Detroit's actively looking at John Collins in the trade market. I don't trust Brett Siegel.

Fair enough. Yeah. Just for the record. I'm a fanatic about sources, though. So don't mind me. Yeah, but I do know that John Collins is someone that they've had interest in for some time. And it makes sense. His name's been brought up pretty much since the end of the season.

He's a cheap version of what they really wanted in terms, cheap not in terms of contract, but in terms of probably what he'll cost in a trade. he's a cheap version of the stretch four that they were trying to get you know they were linked to a naz read uh bobby porters at one time uh miles turner uh santi aldama none of those things happened never none of which forever forever forever really realistic yeah well miles turner maybe but but uh you know not not being able to go through with almost any of those I think makes you pivot to a John Collins and be like, all right, well, we can go ahead and bring him in. It won't cost us much.

And, you know, he's on a one-year deal. So it's not like you're committing long-term money, which I know Trajan, that is 100% a factor for him because he loves those one-year deals. Is it a factor with Monk in that case, do you think? I mean, because you've got three seasons left in his contract. I do think that's why they're trying to recoup some draft. for taking on Malik Monk. It's just to me, I don't see Malik Monk as an, if he was a negative player, you know what I mean? Like if he was a negative asset, you know, I was going to use Bradley B.

also an example, but that's just like the extreme end of it. But if he was a negative asset in some level, I would feel like, okay, like, you know, that's understandable. I wouldn't take it back if they're not asking or if they're not offering draft compensation. But Malik Monk, to me, like, I really just feel like it's circumstantial with his, his, his current trade value that if they if the pistons have let's say like a productive start to the season and they find themselves you know hypothetically just trying to go and trade for like a tray murphy right at the deadline and they need salary to match they no longer need Tobias's salary um to fill in there

it could be malik monk and i think if malik monk plays well on a eastern conference team um that should be should be around the top six range again. I think his value is a lot higher than it currently is. And I think teams also will be looking more to add someone like Malik Munk than they currently are just because there's so many moving parts with this offseason and, you know, guards and potential trades. Like you look at the Janus or LeBron, like so many things are being put on hold because they're monitoring situations, so much monitoring.

of situations. But I just, I feel like I don't see his value staying this low. I just don't. It would make sense to me if he continues to play at the way, at the level he's been playing. And, you know, he's playing on now an Eastern Conference playoff team. And, you know, he keeps playing well. I can't see his trade value being much lower.

All right. Fair enough. All right. So, you know, just beyond that, I know that, you know, There's the feeling amongst, you know, many people I've seen just general discourse around the pistons that they are a bit lacking in depth at power forward. I mean, my take on the situation, sorry, I know I'm repeating myself for anybody who listened to the last episode, is that at this point, and this is doubly true, if you had Malik Monk to the roster, in order to get enough minutes for Asar and for Rana, I think just by necessity you need to play one or both of them power forward minutes just because of, you know, everybody who's pushing minutes up the. line of the line. Like I said, this crunch gets even real, or if Malik Monk joins the team, you know, because he's playing from the bottom of the lineup. So then that just propagates

upward, bottom of the lineup in terms of, I mean, guard. So is it ideal? No, but the season was always going to be about developments and not ideal. Like, you know, sure, go out. If you can get the guy like Trey Liles or Boucher on a minimum contract, then cool, or on the biannual exception. At the same time, guys tend to want to play more minutes. I mean, if you're offering a comparable salary, they're going to take the bigger role and that wouldn't be here. I mean, what's your opinion on finding more depth of the position? And about Clinton, because I know you watched a lot of G-League. You watch a lot of the crews and I do not.

Yeah, fair enough also. But, yeah, I don't think free agency currently is a enticing way to add this power forward to the team, especially if you don't end up adding a Malik Monk and you take that trade exception. I just think you go out and you trade for a powerful. forward whether that be a John Collins you call Nico Harrison which is a dangerous dangerous task and you ask him about a PJ Washington you know something along those lines I think that makes a lot more sense of the free agents available I would much prefer a Chris Boucher than a Trey Liles and that's not honestly being fair to Trey Liles it's just because I I know I watched him in

Sacramento, he was much, much easier and much better to watch. But God, I have nightmares about that 2021 season where he terrorized me personally. Oh, you did? What did he do to you? My goodness. Oh, my God. I just, there was this, there was just, it was dumping water on your head. He was, it might as well have been, man. I just, I hated watching him so much. Um, which I, you know, um i was blamed Troy weber for the fact that he had to play center that is true um but no i i i don't think he would be a bad addition either i i just i would much prefer chris ruchay just just for that reason um but that's just me being um me being me being unfair uh i i i feel like if let's say like

there's no malik monk on this team you go get another power forward i think that makes things make a little more sense. I don't know if your ceiling's necessarily as high, especially if it's like a Liles or a Boucher, because I don't know if they're going to be like, I don't know, I would much refer, especially if John Collins is coming off the bench, I really wouldn't mind. And he makes up for size as well, which is a big thing, where Isaiah Stewart's an undersized center. And he, granted, he makes up for it in terms of interior defense, but it's still a fact. in terms of like rebounding and John Collins also not you know the greatest rebound in the world. Regardless, I think Asar and Ron playing those spot four minutes will have to happen.

I am more positive about Asar doing it because I felt like in that 2020 in his rookie season that that 2020-23-24 season when it initially started before there was a Blayon Bogdanovich, he was playing spot four minutes and he actually did it really well. Um, that's when he was really attacking the boards. Sorry, as, as much as like he had at any point in his career this far. Um, there, there are people talking about like, oh my God. Like, you know, he's, he's rebounding more than, than setters. Um, and I feel like that's something that wasn't really like unlocked much in his second season.

Granted, it was weird circumstances coming back from a blood clot, but I feel a lot better about Asar playing the four than Ron. Um, just because Asar, I feel like, is a lot more sturdy in terms of just being like a physical presence and having it's close to 220 yeah yeah yeah and having the the the vertical athleticism to guard power forwards and and block shots not to say that ron does doesn't obviously if you watch five minutes of ron holland you know that he's a really great athlete but he's he's still a bit smaller um in terms of like weight and i i would much rather him just stay around the wings. But again, that's going to be something that, you know,

you sacrifice with a Malik Monk coming in. And he would have to play those four minutes. So it'd be interesting. I'd be, I'd be a little bit concerned. That's something I hadn't considered as much, just in terms of Ron's development. There is a world where he just, you know, plays the four off of the bench fine and then, you know, plays about three minutes as well. And it all just works out. But I just feel like it scares me a little bit because Ron, to me, seems like a guy that you really have to be careful with in terms of his development. Because I think there is a high, high end potential with Ron Holland. Not necessarily saying that he's going to be an all-world guy, but do I think there's a high-level slasher who can play defense and hopefully along the lines at some point start shooting the three ball at a respectable clip? I think so.

There were stretches this season where he was shooting the three pretty decently. It's just a consistency thing for him. Yeah, it was very raw. Yeah, he's very raw, and I just, I want to be careful with his development.

And if he has to place about four minutes, that's fine, but hopefully you find a way to give a SAR and Tobias, a way to just share those minutes where Ron really guards your two-threes versus your three-fours, if that makes sense. Yeah, I hear you. Yeah, I think he's not as physically ready.

Whereas, you know, his SAR came in older, just much more physically developed, I think, probably at the same age. And I think there's a certain misconception that this league is, at these power forwards, are still huge. I mean, like a solid half of the teams in the league, I think maybe 16 of them if I counted correctly, field of the starting power forward is 6-8 or below. Now, granted, they're a little bit beef here. But Assar at about 6-7 and, you know, in 220 and highly athletic, which is definitely a force multiplier and can account for some of the size.

He's got good length as well. I think, I agree. I think he's fine there. And also, just to my point from earlier, I mean, with the rotation, again, especially for bringing him a Malik Monk, you have to play one of those guys, one of Assar or Iran at Power Forward or they don't have enough minutes. Yeah. I'm just thinking on the fly here. Is there a world where a SAR maybe starts that power forward

and you put Duncan Robinson at that starting three position and you bring Tobias off the bench to stop Ron from needing to play significant four minutes? I don't know if that's out of the realm of possibility and I feel like that would make sense, but I don't know. Yeah, I think that they'd be doing Tobias a little bit dirty.

I mean, if he was fine with it, cool. but I think they could really avoid playing Ron many minutes of power forward. It would just mean that Asar would be starting at small forward, but probably playing the majority of his minutes at backup power forward. Yeah. And yeah, I think he could do fine there. Again, I think there's a big misconception about the role and the size of power forwards these days. Yeah, so I think they could avoid it with Ron Saar.

If I had to make up, let's be honest, I have made him up a minute's projection and did it a long ago. in my projection yeah SAR would probably play like 12 minutes you know a small forward and like another 16 to 18 a power forward you know whatever Tobias isn't playing yeah that checks out

yeah I think that when they brought Tobias on there was the understanding he'd be the starter yeah and I think for last season that definitely made the most sense I just I don't I don't know how much of a significant workload I want on Tobias coming into this season

just knowing he's getting older. And then he dealt with some injuries also last season that were a bit nagging. So I feel like, you know, I would, I don't think he would mind. Granted, I'm not saying he's going to play like 15 minutes a night. You know, I think his minutes would stay roughly the same, but just kind of a Tim Hardaway situation where Robinson starts

and he's not necessarily playing more minutes, but he's just there to fill us, a certain need in that starting lineup where I don't think Tobias really provides that much of any shooting gravity like especially towards the beginning of the season he his three point percentage was pretty rough. That was rough. Yeah. So.

Absolutely. Yeah. All right. Fair enough. It would be interesting to see. We're going to be waiting for the next few days to see what happens with the Dennis Schroeder situation. Yeah, we'll see.

So it'll be interesting to see how things shake out. Give us a little bit more clarity about what the roster will look like next season. So in any case, thank you so much, Zarek for coming back in the show. This is Zarek of Real Bulleyball. So check out his stuff. Is Zarek Xavier on Twitter. Yes, always a pleasure to have you on. And thanks for taking the time.

Thank you very much for having me on. I really always enjoy these chats. Yeah, me too. All right, folks. So as always, I want to thank you all for listening. I hope you're doing great. Have a happy fourth. And I'll catch you in the next episode.