EverydaySpy Podcast - How to Win Every Argument

Episode Date: May 16, 2023

Arguments are never fun, rarely productive, and always frustrating. Whether at home, at work, or out-and-about, the fastest way to end a good time is with an argument. That's why CIA uses a shockingly simple secret to not only end arguments, but win them at the same time! In this episode, Andrew lays out the process you can use to transform every argument into agreement for the rest of your life. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

My name is Andrew Bustamante, and this is everyday espionage. Not long ago, I had a podcast interview, a YouTube podcast interview, that went completely south. I mean, the thing absolutely fell apart. And as soon as it happened, I knew I had to tell you about it, because this is a reality in life. Not every conversation goes the way you hope it will go. Not every conversation is, you know, sunshine and day. and positive energy and everybody's happy. Sometimes shit goes sideways. And that is exactly what happened in this YouTube interview. And I realize that we have this really exciting opportunity

for you to see me and how I handle a sideways conversation in real time. And I absolutely had to make some kind of lesson out of this so that I could share it with you. So here are the details, right first of all if you are interested in watching the video itself you need to go to youtube the title of the video is CIA spy meets crypto godfather and inside that title my name Andrew Bustamante is always there it was streamed live by a channel called the XX network so if you want to watch this after the conversation that we have right now or if you want to watch it right now before we have the conversation is totally up to you but if you go to YouTube If you search the XX network, if you look at the live stream section, you'll find a video called

CIA Spy meets Crypto Godfather, and you'll be able to watch it from there. Now, I was invited this conversation by the network itself because they wanted my insight as a former CIA officer into cryptocurrency, cryptocurrency, privacy, and kind of the future of AI and quantum computing and how those different future technologies are going to disrupt the cryptography space, but also the cryptocurrency space. So I was well prepped going into this that we were supposed to have a conversation about technology. Now, the person sitting opposite of me in this was another expert, a gentleman named David Chom. And David Chom is sometimes called the Crypto Godfather because he was one of the pioneers that created digital currency, right,

back in the 80s and 90s. And he's also a very well-known expert in the cryptography space. having done work for NSA and having done work for some of the other big companies around the world who have created encrypted technology. So going into this conversation, I was expecting that both David and I would be talking about technology and talking about the future of technology and how the future of technology impacts digital currency. Instead, what happened is that very early into the conversation, I started talking about the realities of how governments prioritize projects to protect democracy. And as soon as I started talking about democracy, I hit some sort of emotional hot button issue for David. And that's when the conversation went totally sideways.

If you're pulling up the video or if you plan to watch the video, it starts kind of getting shaky about 14 minutes in. And by the 18 minute mark, it's full on disaster. So if you want to fast forward to the exciting parts, you can either look at minute 14 and start watching or you can fast forward to minute 18 and start watching. Now, it's not just about the entertainment value of watching two grown men argue with each other. What I really want to talk about today is how I was able to make something productive out of this conversation that failed with David Chom. And here's why, because during the call, I had no way of changing David's point of view. He was idealistically driven and he was emotional. And you'll see that when you watch the video. He was already on his own highway of

emotional hijacking. That's the terminology we use at CIA. He was emotionally hijacked. He was arguing about something that he cares about. There was no way I was going to change his mind. You've been in the same situation yourself. Maybe with a girlfriend, maybe with a teacher, maybe with a spouse, maybe with a coworker. You have said something that made somebody angry or sad or emotional. And then once that happened, there's no way that you're going to talk them off the cliff. There's no way you can tell them to calm down. There's no way you can say that you didn't mean, you know, no offense. There's no way that you can get them to change their point of view in the moment because they have been hijacked by their emotions. And that's exactly what happened to

David in this video. So I knew very early on there was no way of changing his mind. So that left me two other options because, again, this was a public live stream. People are watching this in real time. So I knew I couldn't change his mind. So I had to decide whether I was going to debate with him or whether I was going to essentially allow him to fall on his own sword and make a fool of himself through this emotional hijacking. Now, he's an expert. So there's no way he's going to say something about his expertise that's wrong. So when I say, let him fall on a sword, or when I say that he might make a fool of himself, I'm not talking about him making a mistake in his expertise or in his field. There's no way that's going to happen. But the purpose behind every public podcast like this

is to either gain influence or lose influence. So when a conversation goes sideways, you have to understand that the same calculation is relevant for you. Every conversation is a chance for you to either gain influence or lose influence. And when conversations fall apart, it's really difficult because we feel like we have to fight in order to gain the influence from that conversation. We feel like if we don't fight, then we're going to lose influence. We're going to get bullied. We're going to look soft.

Who knows whatever else, right? I also grew up in the era, just like you, where you're supposed to punch a bully in the nose to teach them a lesson. in reality that never works, right? In reality, what you have to do is you have to take every situation that is presented to you, and you have to do this calculation of how do you save or build influence more so than lose influence. So when David took his very emotional point of view, I decided that I had to change my approach. No longer was this going to be a conversation about technology.

I realized that early on. This was going to be a conversation where David was emotional and David was frustrated, and I had to do the best that I could do to take advantage of growing my influence during this live stream. So to do that, I had to disengage from David's arguments, right? And this is important for you whenever you have any kind of conversation that falls apart. You cannot win an emotional argument with somebody who has become emotionally hijacked. It's a lose-lose situation for you. So instead, you need to define your own points and simply say, state and restate your own points. You cannot change the other person's mind. Now, during this conversation,

during this live stream with David Chom, what he kept trying to do was change my mind, which wasn't going to happen any more than I was going to change his mind. But when you watch the clip, when you actually watch the live stream, what you see is the perception that I am the expert stating my position. And David is just arguing for the sake of argument. right? So by virtue of the viewer's point of view, I am building influence with the viewer during the live stream. David, on the other hand, is losing influence with the viewer during the live stream. And this is not just something that's important because of ego. This is something that's important because it has a very real impact on your career, your profitability, and the success of your business.

when that conversation was over and that conversation was a painful 90 minute conversation. Don't get me wrong for a second. I didn't enjoy it. It wasn't fun. It wasn't easy. And it was 90 minutes of my life. But coming out of that conversation, almost within an hour of that conversation, I was getting phone calls from people who had watched the live stream, who had then looked me up on the

internet, who had found my website and who had requested a conversation with me because they wanted to hire me and do business with me. So I have already earned more than $2,000 from direct client consults coming out of that one, that 90-minute live stream with a guy who was emotionally hijacked, right? So you can see that for me, I clearly gained influence because I went on to a show. I stated my position. I defended my position. I did not try to change David's mind. And in that process, I grew influence enough that multiple people have come on board and hired me for my services. Now, on top of that, in addition to the fact that I am currently being paid for what was otherwise a public argument, you can also look at the metrics from that video right now,

and you will see that that video is the most popular video ever created via live stream by this YouTube channel. You will also see that it is the most popular recorded video that has ever been recorded by this channel within the last two years. So the video itself, which during the time that I am talking to you at the time of this recording, that video is less than one day old. It's less than 24 hours old and it is already growing in terms of traction and popularity faster than any other video on this YouTube channel's network. And within the first 24 hours, it has already generated for me more than $2,000 in revenue. That means it's generating revenue for me. at the speed of about $1,200 per hour, right?

So an hour of my time has generated $1,200 in revenue within 24 hours of that interview. This is real, these are real metrics, right? This is a real demonstration of what you stand to gain by understanding how people embrace arguments and hostile conversations. When someone comes to you with a conversation topic or when someone changes the tone of a conversation and they turn it into an argument or a debate of some sort. Don't let yourself be goaded into defending yourself against their attacks. Don't let yourself get emotional like they are getting emotional. Keep in mind that during an argument, the last person to get emotionally hijacked

is the one most likely to lose the argument. Think about that for a second, okay? That means if two people are having a conversation and the first person gets emotionally hijacked and then their emotional hijacking makes the second person get emotionally hijacked, it means that the second person is going to lose the argument, even though both people have been emotionally hijacked. In my conversation with David, he became the first one to get hijacked. So I had to make sure that I did not become emotional because if I would have become emotional, he would have won the argument. And I I can't let that happen. You can't either. Whenever you are having any kind of dialogue with an individual publicly or privately, your objective is to always gain more influence from that exchange. Either

gain that influence in private with the person or gain that influence in public with the person and or the audience watching the conversation. The way that you gain that influence is by never letting yourself become the last person to be emotionally hijacked. The key to winning influence in any kind of dialogue is to be the person who remains steady and non-emotional. When somebody that you're arguing with or debating with or having a conversation with becomes emotionally triggered and that makes them hijacked by their emotions, the conversation is going to go sideways. It's going to become hostile. It's not going to be fun. It's going to be something you don't want to do. But recognize that the influence value of the conversation is still there.

And if there's anything I want for every one of you listening, it's that I want you to gain every modicum of influence that you can. Every conversation, every debate, every argument, every time, I want you to walk away the winner. And you will walk away the winner as long as you never let yourself become emotionally hijacked. When you're debating with somebody who's emotional, when you're conversing or arguing with somebody who's emotional, keep your cool, state your claim, defend your claim, and essentially act as if the other person doesn't exist. If you do that, your influence will grow, their influence will shrink, and that is everyday espionage. Everyday espionage is dedicated to one thing, educating everyday people.

I know that not everyone will listen, but those who listen will learn. If you learned something new today, click subscribe, review, and share the podcast with a friend. Find me on social media at EverydaySpy or on my website, Everydayspy.com. If you are up for a special challenge, visit Everydayspy.com forward slash operations. And join me for an authentic spy training mission. And above all else, remember that knowledge is freedom.