Feel Better, Live More with Dr Rangan Chatterjee - #127 Wim Hof on Waking Up to Your True Potential

Episode Date: October 13, 2020

CAUTION ADVISED: This podcast contains swearing from the start. How long could you last in a freezing-cold shower? And for how long could you comfortably, peacefully hold your breath? My guest today insists you can learn to do both for far longer than you think. And that by doing so, you can battle disease, regulate your mood and connect with your true self. This podcast is a fascinating insight into the mind, work and charismatic personality of Wim Hof, aka The Iceman. Wim has been described as a ‘trailblazer for human potential’ and a ‘modern legend’, thanks to his incredible feats. They include withstanding extreme temperatures, climbing Kilimanjaro in nothing but shorts – even, as he describes to me, being injected with a toxin and resisting illness. But he is no mere showman, there is method to what some might see as madness. Wim wants to convince people they too can do the ‘impossible’ and prove it through evidence-based science. Brain scans now indicate we can take conscious control of our autonomic nervous system. But this sort of ‘top down’ regulation had been unknown in science before. We talk about cold-water immersion – and why he believes that ‘a cold shower a day keeps the doctor away’. He explains that cold stimulates vascular muscle tone, increasing blood flow, slowing heart rate, increasing energy and lowering cortisol. Wim gives practical advice to help all of us build from a tense, 10-second blast of cold at the end of a shower, to comfortably showering cold for two to three minutes a day. And with benefits like reduced inflammation, improved cardiovascular function and immunity, reduced depression and anxiety. Breathing techniques go hand in hand with his cold-water exercises, and we discuss how his particular practice can work to help us achieve peak functionality before endurance events, stressful times and more. Paradoxically, it involves over-breathing and breath-holding, to create a stressful spike in the body. Yet it results in a very tranquil sensation – and builds resilience to all kinds of stress, physical and mental, for the rest of the day. At the end of this podcast, Wim kindly agreed to take me through one round of his technique, so you can give it a try with me and experience the effects for yourself.* It felt incredible, like accessing a different state of calm. I really hope you can feel the positive energy in this unique conversation.  CAUTION: If you have uncontrolled hypertension or heart disease it is not advised that you start practising cold water immersion. If you have any doubt at all as to whether you are fit enough to give this practice a go, please consult a qualified healthcare professional. Show notes available at drchatterjee.com/127 Follow me on instagram.com/drchatterjee/ Follow me on facebook.com/DrChatterjee/ Follow me on twitter.com/drchatterjeeuk DISCLAIMER: The content in the podcast and on this webpage is not intended to constitute or be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your doctor or other qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. Never disregard professional medical advice or delay in seeking it because of something you have heard on the podcast or on my website.

So we are able to shoot people to the moon, but we are not able to regulate our own mood. We have not been learned or schooled in our schools. Rocket science, yes, history, mathematics. But to be happy? We don't know. We don't know. Today we are poor. We are poor within ourselves because we don't know the core values of our life itself. Hi, my name is Rangan Chatterjee. Welcome to Feel Better Live More. Hello and welcome back to my podcast. My name is Rangan and this is episode 127. So, this week my guest on the show is none other than the Iceman himself, Mr. Wim Hof.

So, how long could you last in a freezing cold shower? And for how long could you comfortably hold your breath? Well, in our chat today, Vim insists that you can learn to do both for far longer than you think. And that by doing so, you can battle disease, regulate your moods and connect with your true self. Now, Vim has been described as a trailblazer for human potential and a modern legend, thanks to his incredible feats. They include withstanding extreme temperatures, climbing Kilimanjaro in nothing but his shorts, and as he describes to me in our conversation today, being injected with a toxin and resisting illness. toxin and resisting illness. But for me, what is most exciting about Vim is his belief that every single one of us has access to the techniques that he uses. Vim wants to convince all of us that we too can achieve the impossible, and he is committed to proving it through evidence-based science. Brain scans are now indicating that we can take conscious control

of our autonomic nervous system, but this kind of top-down regulation had not really been validated by modern science until now. We talk a lot in this conversation about cold water immersion and why he believes that a cold shower a day can keep the doctor away. He explains how the cold stimulates vascular muscle tone, increasing blood flow, slowing heart rate, increasing energy, and lowering the stress hormone cortisol. This conversation really is full of practical advice, such as helping you understand how you can slowly build up from taking an initially uncomfortable 10-second cold blast at the end of your hot shower, to comfortably immersing yourself in a cold shower for two to three minutes a day,

with benefits like reducing inflammation, improving cardiovascular function and immunity, inflammation, improving cardiovascular function and immunity, as well as reducing depression and anxiety. Breathing techniques go hand in hand with his cold water exercises. And we discuss how his particular breathing practice can work to help us all achieve peak functionality before things like endurance events, exams, stressful times, and so much more. And paradoxically, it involves over-breathing and breath-holding to create a stressful spike in the body. Yet, it results in a very tranquil sensation and builds resilience to all kinds of stress,

physical and mental, for the rest of the day. Towards the end of our conversation, Vim kindly agreed to take me through one round of his technique. So if you are sewing clients, you can give it a try with me and experience the effects for yourself. It felt incredible, like accessing a different state of calm. But please note, as Vim makes clear in all of his work, please follow his instructions carefully in order to carry out his techniques safely. It is very powerful stuff. I've also put the whole video up on YouTube. So if you actually want to watch Vim take me through it, you can go to my YouTube channel, pull up this episode with Vim and go towards the end and you can actually sit at home comfortably and go through the breathing technique

with me. I think my conversation with Vim was really special. He has a unique way of articulating himself and a very special energy full of hope and positivity. I'm pretty sure you're going to enjoy listening to our conversation as much as I enjoyed having it. Now, on to my conversation with the Iceman himself, the one and only Mr. Finn Hoff. Mr. Finn Hoff. I'm very clear in the purpose why I am here with you in the podcast, in life, in science, and taking away the anxiety and confusion within the human population, the humanity, like every day.

Every day we should wake up to being a missionary. Yeah. Because it is so beautiful to be on this planet. And anything that holds us back, feeling us, you know, in 80% of our power or something, something strange within that makes us unable to really create, that we should, like the question David Asprey asked me, when, what is enlightenment? And please put it in one sentence. I never asked this question. Put it in one sentence. I said,

okay, here it comes in one sentence. Just be happy, strong, and healthy. The rest is bullshit. So let's get the bullshit out. Everybody be happy, strong, and healthy because we got it evidence-based through science that we are capable of so much more than up till now has been arraigned by the paradigm of the old. The old is gone. The new is to come. Here we are. Hey, that is a very powerful way to start this podcast. And Vim, look, this is what I love about you and your approach. There's such an energy, there's such passion. And again, just to give perspective to people, you know, we were so late for this call, we jumped on and within 10 seconds, you're singing, you're just happy, you're joyful. And my stress levels went right down. I thought, hey, you know what? It's not the end of the world, right? Nothing's happened. We're just a bit late. Life is good, right?

It's just the beginning. And you have a real passion for sort of simplifying this stuff for all of us. And I want to tell you, I have been in the same room as you before. You won't know this because you were on stage and I was in the audience. But in 2017, I was at the Summit event series in LA and you were in the auditorium. And, you know, I looked at my time. So I thought I'm definitely going to see Wim Hof. You know, I'd read all about you. I tried some of your techniques.

And I was sitting there with about 300 people. And I remember clearly at the start, you said within half an hour or something like that, within half an hour, all of you are going to be holding your breath for three minutes. And I thought, what? Everyone in this room and even me, because I've always had difficulty. At that point, I'd had difficulty holding my breath. So I thought, okay, let's see. And 25 minutes later, along with the whole group, I held my breath. Not only did I hold it for three minutes, it felt fairly effortless.

And I thought, this is incredible. So Vim, how can you be so sure when you go to another city, when you go all around the world talking, spreading the love, spreading your knowledge, how can you be so sure that everyone in the audience is going to be able to hold their breath for three minutes? We just make them. We just make them and share the power of the mind together with the life force which is called the breath. With the breath we have shown recently in the brain scan to be able to willfully activate the neural activity not 16 or 17 percent but 100. 100 through specific breathing exercises. We have been in the old paradigm, which is actually a narrowed consciousness, a narrowed neurological network within us. And it enables us to have partially control over our own brain.

And that's the thing. We don't own our own brain, our own deceit of the mind. We don't own it. We are not born that way, not taught that way, not schooled that way. not told that way, not schooled that way. But I know we are able to captivate, to learn to control 100% of our own potential. And that is only logical. We are not born with a piece of meat called the brain to be 84% without our control within our head. That is not evolution.

Evolution is that what you are is what you need. And then as being young to become adult not only physically but spiritually we grow into 100% usage of our unlimited power of our mind and through the life force thus in this exercise we did there within 25 minutes bringing for sure the people over two minutes to three minutes without air in the lungs, is showing that we are able consciously to be in control over the biochemistry in the blood, in the neurology of ours, and opening up past the conditioning of the narrow mindedness, the narrow down consciousness, which is neurology, to go past and to have a tremendous, tranquil feeling, sensation, while holding in a very stressful situation of having no air in the lungs for three minutes. What is happening?

We are just entering with that on the threshold of the power of the mind. And the mind, do not confuse the mind with just thoughts. The mind with just thoughts is a complete different dimension where we are able to get into and learn to control, to be conscious, and enter consciously thus into paradise. If we talk about yoga or the Bible or the Quran, they all talk about the paradise. Well, the paradise, the Bhagavad Gita, they call it, they talk about it, the Nirvana, and in the Bible, they call it the Garden of Eden, the paradise, and it's all there, man.

There is no fears, nothing there. And the Mohammedans, they call it, when you wake up after you have lived, no. While you are alive, you are able to enter with this powerful tool of ours, our mind through the heart, which understands more than words. The greatness, the fullness of who we are and what we are and we are now at a time of change you see the governments you see the disease and they are not able to control because mother nature is knocking at our door our divine mother is knocking at our heaven's door wake up guys wake up to your true potential because you are beautiful all and until it's not showing completely

been taken on in the world I keep on showing through science and so I doing right now that with top researchers in the world on the DNA and show that we have the absolute influence neurologically at will to enter into our own ancestral encrypted codes of the DNA, our genetical past, to enlighten our past right here in the moment, here and now. That is our purpose. That's why we talk to each other. But before people begin to understand what is the soul all about, to be fully expressed,

to be fully expressed, to be in the paradise already fully there, being able to share, to feel the presence of it all. We will show the people how to battle disease much better than science has stated up till now, how to learn to regulate our mood much better than the psychiatry knows. And I've already shown this scientifically with groups of people. And so let's make it baby steps before we enter into the full potential of ours. Yeah. I mean, thank you, Wim, for that. One thing that I really like about your approach is I've heard you say that you're not special.

And why I really think this is important, people listening to this, people watching this may go, hey, man, you're different. You know, you have been up to the top of Kilimanjaro in your shorts. You have been in an ice bath for, you know, however many hours. You know, you're in the Guinness Book of Records, right? What you do has no relevance to me and what i think is powerful about your approach is you say hey look you can all do this i'm not special what the tools that you're using are available to every single human being i wonder if you could explain that for people yes so for example depression is on the. Depression is on the rise in our new generations, young people. What is this? This is absolutely lack of purpose. Purpose is life. Life is purpose. It's the full vibrancy of life. That's the purpose as it is. It goes past words. It is's pure it's beautiful it's there it's the soul full bloom no people get depressed so we are able to shoot people to the moon but we are not able to

regulate our own mood we have not been learned or schooled in our schools. Rocket science, yes, history, mathematics. But to be happy? We don't know. We don't know. Today we are poor. We are poor within ourselves because we don't know the core values of our life itself. And now when we come and we are doing the studies right now on depression, bipolar, and we are showing that we found the keys. The keys to go within the brain consciously, to go consciously inside of the brain

and to regulate what is out of order. To get into the emotion everybody wants to feel happy only nobody knows how to do it get a hold over your own hormonal system the endocrine system we have shown this very strongly not little bit of significant change in a scientific comparative study. No, big, big, unknown, unknown. So for the guys, for the people listening, depression, your mood, learn to regulate your feeling. Is that possible? Yes, it has come. Natural knowledge through science

shown irrefutably the evidence that we are able to willfully control our own mood. That is number one. So that one is there, guys. Just look it up all the films we got the data we got the analysis we got the publications so it's there it's for you to take up you want to be happy happy pappy take them on take them off it's there hey yeah, party time. Let's celebrate the moment of enlightenment that the burden of life and feeling miserable and bad feelings and all that, moods changes and all, is the past paradigm, part of the past paradigm. This is a new time of enlightenment

where you are able to enlighten your own burden, your own heaviness in the biochemistry, in your neurology. It has been shown. That is number one. Number two, inflammation. Cause and effect of disease is inflammation. Infection, inflammation, it's all caused by inflammation,

inflammatory markers. And we have shown people being injected after a couple of days, and this was after 16,000 people taking the same experimental model with an injection of E. coli bacteria, becoming sick for three to six hours. Now, suddenly, I trained a group of people within a couple of days. couple of days, they took the injection and after 16,000 people who became sick, suddenly 12 people exposed into the same experimental model were able to nullify the reaction caused by the E. coli bacteria on the immune system. They did not become sick. And then they found out that these guys through blood samples, so there is no speculation about it, had a control over the autonomic nervous system, over the immune system, far more than was

stated in science. And I'm trying to tell that through science and through publications in the best of papers in the world and try to get it to the people and i think these podcasts like we do right now is the way to get there to the people to the the listeners. Disease and mood, feeling happy, it's your choice. Ben, you've taken a group who've had this injection, but I think a few years ago, I read about when you did it for the first time. I think from recollection, you were injected with lipopolysaccharide or LPS, which is this endotoxin. And I know as a doctor, I've seen the studies, I've seen the trials. If somebody gets injected with that, they typically will go into septic shock. They'll drop their blood pressure. They'll become very unwell. But you manage to not get sick

by controlling your immune system. So I'd love to hear about that because you were injected with it. What happened? Did you feel something? Did you feel yourself starting to get sick? Did you breathe in preparation of that? Or once you felt it, were you able to then control that? I'd love to understand that. It's so interesting to me that you had this endotoxin in your vein, but you didn't get sick yes exactly so when the professor injected me he said oh but it takes an hour before it's really working i said no it is being injected now now i'm going to start i'm just going to try i I do my best. That's what I said. I was for sure determined to succeed in my attempt to show that the immune system, the innate immune system and the specific immune system both can be activated at will, influenced at will. influenced at will. So the innate immune system, for example, get it down. And the specific immune system, get it on. So specific solutions at the core, at the start of things happen. So what I did,

I started my breathing exercises. When he injected me I began to start. You see how simple it is? Determined, my mind was not out there, my mind was in the breath, in the biochemistry. Neurology influences the biochemistry. That's its logic. So I was into the breathing. And then when normally the polysaccharide had to have its influence, you know, like uncontrolled shivering, headaches, fever, all over agony, back aches, muscle aches, things, even vomiting. All that can happen. For sure, it happens a lot. Nothing happened. Nothing.

They came to me. They said, yeah, it's now at its peak. I said, but before they told me, I asked them, when is it going to happen? And then he said, yeah, actually yeah actually just now at his peak they said yeah i do not really feel something so so you don't can i can i say so so basically let's say a week before you were practicing your own breathing techniques at home right was this just like you being in the hospital and you're just practicing as per usual yes you're getting injected but you don't feel anything you you could be on you you could be in your own bedroom doing the same thing right so there

there i go and say everybody is able to do this and yes directly afterwards they said, because they saw such a low cytokine release, the cytokine storm was less than a breeze, I felt good. And at a certain moment I let the breathing go, and a little bit came to me, a little bit. But I had won do I had one I had done I had shown what breathing techniques are able to do together with your determination your being here in the now here and now you have neurology when I say you're I don't know if you have two children yes or no I do two children yes so if I say you're, I don't know if you have two children, yes or no? I do, two children, yes. Yes, so if I would say, your children are in danger, you know, for real,

then you would be full of epinephrine, adrenaline, and run like an animal to where are they, where are they, where are they, and find out out and all that barely in control now that is what happened at that moment epinephrine got so high it went higher in the blood and they compared it to another study where people jumped for the first time into a bungee jump. They took the blood of those people and the level of adrenaline within the people lying there on the bed was higher than the people going for the first time into a bungee jump.

You see? Yeah. That is what we do with these breathing techniques. We enter consciously into the depth of our brain, the brainstem, into the brainstem, and thus the adrenal axis is being activated. It resets the body, and then suddenly the immune system is much more alert. And it is able to handle bacillus and virus and bacteria in any kind, because that's the nature of ours. Only we alienate it from our own brain. They say we have 16% control within our own brain. It's like you have a house and only 16% of your own house are able to be accessed by you. The rest is of the government or by the people in power. I don't know who, but it is 100%, my friend. Rangan 100 my friend uh rangan my friend rangan it is 100 100 and that means we are able to tap into our emotional areas of the brain into our opioids into our cannabinoids, endorphins, serotonins, adrenal axis, anything that is within our brain is ours to be commanded by us. I think nature has it built in. A happy person

doesn't make war. A happy person is not into thieving or taking what is not his. A happy person is like radiating positive energy all the time. And he is happy and that's where he wants to stay. Only we did not know how to get there. And now we found these ways. And in brain scans showing that we are able to tap into those areas of the brain, the autonomous processes of the brain. This is the way they published it. We found compelling evidence of the key components

of the autonomous processes in the brain related to mood regulation. in the brain related to mood regulation so we found the keys to into those areas which were not controllable at all now they are we found them and now we are able to regulate our moon mood and that is emotion and that emotion is who we are what what we are. And the source and the power of sanity is happiness. Happiness all the time. That's irradiance. That is flow. That is uninhibited flow. That is not narrowed consciousness, narrowed perception, narrowed neurology.

It's full bloom neurology. We are born to be holy beings not half beings holy beings that means 100 neurology sane insanity full flow going within our beautiful mind our command that's that's that's what it is and i'm just giving evidence through science. You can look it up. Only the old paradigm is about, yeah, shit happens, wars. Yeah, that is human-like abuse. Yeah, humans, you know, insensitivity, exploiting the world, sodomizing the planet, polluting the planet. It's all there. We don't know. We don't know. It doesn't make sense. And this time we are to bring sense to the people that they are in control over their own happiness, which is the hormonal system,

their own health, which is their immune system, and their own power, strength, energy, which are the metabolic processes in the cell. And we are able to control all the three of them. That's the message. And what I really love about breathwork per se is it's free, right? It's not something that people have to spend a lot of money on. It's something that the richest in society and the poorest in society have access to. And I think that's really, really exciting. Now, if we go into some specifics, there seems to be two broad arms to your method, breathing and cold. And I wonder if we can start with cold.

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are perfect for keeping in your backpack, office, or car. If you want to take advantage of this limited time offer, all you have to do is go to drinkag1.com forward slash live more. That's drinkag1.com forward slash live more. I, this morning, because I was interviewing you today, I thought, hey, if I'm not going to have a cold shower today on the day that I'm interviewing, when? When am I going to do it, right? And you mentioned my kids before, actually, beforehand, when I told them today I was interviewing you, my son was like, daddy, are you actually interviewing the Iceman today? I said, yeah, I am, darling, I am. And he was really excited. Did you know he's in the Guinness Book of Records? You see, the new generation,

I see a lot of the new generation already knowing me. And they love it. They love it. They need direction. So about the cold, what I always say, a cold shower a day keeps the doctor away. Now I know why you weren't there for 45 minutes

exactly i was i was doing i was i was holding my breath but cold right so people so look i think there going to be people listening to this who have heard about the amazing things you've done. They'll be interested. And I want to make sure we make it super practical. So they think after this, actually, you know what, I can do something. So if we talk about the cold, right, you are a big fan of cold immersion and you always recommend, certainly I've read an early copy of your book which is really really good really interesting um and you say that everyone would benefit from taking a cold shower every day why is the cold so powerful the cold without a doubt very directly very effectively, very strongly is able to tackle the biggest health problem in the world, which is the cardiovascular-related diseases. And we have the organ, which is called our skin, and we never expose it to natural elements. And it is built to be able to be stimulated.

Electroreceptors, thermoreceptors, they are all in the surface of our skin that directly goes, when we take a cold shower, like an electrical jolt through our spine to the deepest part of our brain the brainstem it's being alive oh yeah the shocking experience that you are surviving that is a great way to not only give a jolt to say an electro shock and to your brain for the people who are into depression this is great you just take the cold

shower and you depression is going to be depressed so that is one the other thing is and we got all of us we have hundred thousand kilometers like 70 000 miles of vascular little channels, capillaries, arteries, and veins, like 100,000 kilometers. That is a lot. That is like two and a half times the world is in each and every one of us. They contain millions of little muscles, and they help the blood flow going through. But not if it is in a condition after we have been living with clothes all the time, which is a destimulative behavior and which makes the muscle tone go low.

And who has got to compensate for that? That is our heart. Our heart is pumping more than it should. It's pumping more because it tries to get the blood flow full of oxygen, the nutrients, and the vitamins to the cells. And it is not able to do that. You weaken yourself because you are in stress. And that stress creates oxidative stress

through the continuous presence of cortisol. And that is when the heart rate goes up. That is normally done when there is danger to pump the glucose through the body. And the adrenaline, that is when there is danger to pump the glucose through the body and the adrenaline that is for there is danger now this danger because we have a weak condition within our vascular system maybe not when you are young still but when you are 30 35 40 and begins really to wear out. A cold shower stimulates all the vascular muscle tone, and thus the blood flow will go better to the cells. Heart rate goes down with

20 to 30 beats a minute, 24 hours a day. And the energy is being fat the energy processes the metabolic uh mitochondrial processes are being fed with all the oxygen nutrients vitamins all what is needed you get plenty of energy so when you take a cold shower a day it does not only keep the doctor away, as a saying, also the doctor is doing it. Because it is great. It's like a vaccination, a natural vaccination, where you make your body the way nature meant it to be. With a great blood flow, which doesn't know inhibition, fears, blockages, sclerosis, or anything like that, because it's flowing. There is no cortisol, no oxidative stress going on. This is the way nature managed to be.

Everybody in the world should take the damn beautiful cold shower a day. It is not difficult, and the investment is by far the outcome. You get so much more energy and so much more peace because the stress will go out of your body. We can think of muscles, right? Everyone understands muscles and they know if you go to the gym and work your muscles, they will grow stronger. So as you were describing that about cold showers, I'm thinking we live these comfortable lives. We have temperature controlled houses. If we go out, we don't want to feel hot.

We don't want to feel cold. We put on our jackets and our fleeces. So our blood vessels are never, in some way you could say, are never been exposed to those sort of extremes where our body then responds and adapts. And I guess having that cold shower is an intentional way of providing, I guess, like a helpful dose of stress to the vascular system, which will cause it to grow back stronger. Is is that a fair analogy absolutely

absolutely the blood flow is going to be better the muscle tone is going to be better the heart rate goes absolutely down absence of cortisol presence thus oxidative stress and yeah sleep is better anything is better the hormonal system is is, the endocrine system is being fed a lot better. It's all about the blood flow. The blood flow is everywhere in our body. Only we cover up our bodies and thus actually we suffocate our body. It's breathing. The body needs to breathe and the cold shower does it.

It compensates for our covering up the rest of the day and we get great amounts of energy back. If someone's listening to this and thinking, okay, Wim, I see what you're saying, but I can't take it. I get cold a lot. It's too cold for me. What would you say to that person?

For the people who have low energy, because when it's cold, they feel sensitive, it's because the maintenance of their body is at work at that moment, and it takes all the energy at that moment to maintain a normal uh a core body temperature and for the rest they feel like shivering because there's no energy left take the cold shower i know this for thousands of people with problems with the cold having low energy levels and uh being sick a lot of times because of the lowering energy. It's a low

alertness of the immune system. After taking the cold showers, suddenly they burst with a lot more energy. They don't become sick anymore. And it's all logical because that muscle tone is back. And with that, the oxidative stress goes out. You get more energy, so you will never feel cold anymore. Taking the cold shower is a hormetic stress exercise. Yeah. A hormetic stress, which which actually is positive stress exercise which neurologically at will makes you able to control your body whenever you get stress out in any shape could

be emotional stress mental stress physical bacterial viral it does not matter now at will because you are the one who goes consciously into the cold shower You learn to change your neurology your power of will Against any stressor the cold is only a mirror The cold is a way to enter into the stress mechanisms inside of the brain I know you want it only we have this paradigm in our society that and that is from the prehistoric when it was cold outside that was the enemy and it still built in this primal aversion, aversive feeling of a cold out there. No, we have to win out there. No, the cold can be a positive

stressor like a vaccination. It's like a vaccination. It feels very much as though with that intentional dose of stress each morning or each evening, you start to build up that immune system resilience, that vascular resilience, that stress resilience, which is going to help you for the other 23 and a half hours of the day. And that, it feels like a really exciting practice that we can do. But then you just mentioned a phrase, and it's, as I was, I was reading your book this morning, and you said, and there's a phrase in it that you just mentioned, which is, the cold is a mirror. And I stopped, I put my drink down and I read it again. It was one of those phrases that makes me stop and just think, and I think, wow, that is so profound because I

was then thinking, ah, so if you're someone who doesn't like the cold, that's teaching you something about what else you don't like in life. It's teaching you about your resistance to certain things. I don't know. I mean, I wonder if you could expand on that, because I think that's a really interesting perspective. The cold is a mirror. Oh, yes. The cold is a mirror.

It shows you how you physiologically, not only, also mentally, spiritually, are in a lockdown when you go into the cold showers. Suddenly it locks down. You are paralyzed. And it could be very much that it has got to do with a traumatic experience in the past that it has psychosomatically has set in and you think it is the cold i don't like the cold no you gotta solve something because that old trauma is coming to the surface when you take a cold trigger which takes away your normal conditioning you have to learn to let go and that learning to let go at that moment is so beautiful because very soon after you go into culture suddenly you feel oh i can do this i can even sing i can make a dance wow and i feel so great yes that is the nature of trauma, blockages, fears, our concept of what the cold is.

It is a great way to get into the depth of who you are and what you are. If you learn about the cold and you see you can learn to let go therein, and you see you can learn to let go therein, then suddenly you will see that you are ready for any stress. Like you look in the mirror in the morning. Do I look right? Yeah, maybe this hair, a little bit this way. Nice. Good.

Yeah, I'm ready. So if you take the cold shower, you are going to be ready for any kind of stress in the world and that could be uh soliciting for a job or get a big deal or marriage or you want to ask your your future wife would you please marry with all your brilliance of being? All that you got within the control because you learned to tap into the fullness of your blood flow, the fullness of being by going into the cold shower. You break the conditioning and you step out into the fullness of your whole being and then suddenly the flow is there and that becomes one with who you are what you are in your

consciousness because in the end the consciousness is that what they say still 16 we showed 100%. 100! It's like a little baby in your hands. There's nothing wrong with the baby. The legs, there's nothing wrong with the baby. It's a beautiful baby, but it is still not able to walk. It takes a little time to neurologically set. It takes a little time to neurologically set. It takes a little time to neurologically set the access and linking up into all the parts of our brain but that's the way nature meant us to be. To learn to walk spiritually strong, being brilliant and full bloom and realize the soul as it is the purpose of our life that's a culture that's a

mirror i mean you might be able to see uh just behind me there in the war already intrigued me i did intrigue you yes so for people watching on youtube uh there's i i talked to my kids a lot about this stuff and we do a bit of breathing together and I talked to her about my favorite Viktor Frankl quotes and my daughter has summarized it there between stimulus and response is a space and in that space sits choice that's her summary of what daddy's been teaching her and and I thought about that in the context of the cold shower you're saying and I know breathing would come into this as well but but these regular daily practices help, you know, help grow that space between stressor and response. You make that space bigger, right? So you can actually start to choose the way you respond to the world rather than the world kind of, you know, making you almost a slave to it. So you're just responding and reacting to everyone around you. You start to be in control of your life. Exactly. You know, just over a year ago, I have mentioned this on the podcast before. I went and did something called a swim run event where you're in a wetsuit and you're trainers and you run in your wetsuit, then you jump in the ocean, you swim, and then you get out and you run, and then you swim. I went and signed up for an event, even though I'd never, ever been in the

ocean before to swim. And, you know, maybe a hundred meters in, I freaked out. I was scared. I had a panic attack. It was cold. It was, you know, it was in the UK early on in the season. So the ocean was still very cold. I had never done it before. And in that moment, I was scared. Now, I did manage to overcome it and then complete the whole race, which I was very, very proud of. But that was cold exposure. That was fear of never having been in the ocean before. And I suspect now talking to you that had I, let's say for two months prior to that, taken a cold shower every day and done your breathing practice every day, of course, I'll never know. But I suspect that maybe I wouldn't have reacted in that way. Maybe I would have been used to the cold.

Maybe I would have had a tool to control my breath in that moment. I mean, what do you think? Yes, I get people within two days, even though they are 80 years of age and never have been in an ice bath and even with heart problems like cardiac bypasses.

And yes, and they tell me. I learn to have them at ease with feeling, go into the ice bath, breathe as I've taught them. It's not difficult. And they are able to stay within two days or even within one day to stay like for two minutes in freezing ice water. Yeah.

And be completely in control. And this is only showing that people of any age are actually innately capacitated to meet their stressor. And it's built in only. We are so conditioned and so conditioned in our mindset that we panic when we do not have our control anymore, while our control should be over much more inside. But we never got into that. It's like the house, only 16% of the house you think is yours. No, it's all the house.

There is much more to meet. And the cold shows. You could stay there in the water, you completed it, but it was at the cost of a sort of a panic moment and feeling painful maybe at that moment, but you got through. You got at that moment through your own conditioning. Otherwise you you would not have survived. But your conditioning got passed. And then you let go.

And you could do it. That's what you saw. And so it is. We have a limited power through our conditioned brain. And then we are in fear with that what possibly is able to happen in our lives like stresses of any kind emotional mental bacterial any kind of stressor because we are too much learned and schooled that we are not able to take on those stresses. And I tell now the people, the cold has shown me, and the cold has shown me how to control the stress mechanisms inside my brain, which makes

me able to deal about with any kind of stress. And in the end, it is to get on my path to the realization of my soul. And the purpose is to get through any kind of stress coming to you in peace, through observation, contemplation, toward the realization of my goal. And that sounds far-fetched, but here it is. That is going to be the new paradigm where everybody is able to take on any stress and that's what we have to teach the people it is there guys we we found ways very accessible very effective and scientifically endorsed that enables you to take on the stress in your life much better because you will learn to have the control over the stress mechanisms inside of you and this was not before but now

it's here when someone's underneath the cold water right first of all how cold does it need to be does it need to be cold enough to give them a shock is the first question. Then the second question, just to be super practical, you can have cold water over your head and you can tense up and last 10 or 15 seconds if you have to, but that's going to be very different than if you have the cold water and you lean into it and you relax and you breathe. So for people who feel inspired to go, okay, all right, Wim, I'm going to try and have a cold shower. What is the minimum amount of time they need? What is the temperature they need it to be? And is there a difference if they're tense or whether they're relaxed and slow breathing. Exactly. So first of all, know that everybody is capacitated by nature,

by birthright, to go into this stressful natural environment called the cold. So a cold shower is cold. A cold shower you are able to take on any day. That's the first one to know. Now, if you are in a vascular condition which has been alienated from going into the cold stress ever, then of course you have to take it step by step. But it goes very fast. You begin with a hot shower and then you get into the last 30 seconds of cold. Turn it

to cold and then your vascular system is very well able to, in this case passively, because you got into the heat of the hot shower, then it works like a sauna and then you have a cold dip. It's passive because you've got a lot of heat. And so you are able to lose a lot of heat passively through taking on the cold shower. But 30 seconds to begin with is activating, igniting the memory cells within you the genome expressions in the cell to adapt to the situation that's the way the dna works so in 30 seconds it's able to be activated spark of neural activity that initiates a different neural activity that directly influences into the vascular system. The vascular system and the neurology are tied together and they know how to act.

And in the 30 seconds to begin with anybody can do that and from 30 seconds the other day you do 40 seconds 50 seconds up to two minutes in 10 days everybody is able to take for two minutes a cold shower two three minutes and at that point you are back at your natural condition of your vascular system is when you are able to get into say natural bodies of water like in the UK in wintertime and we are in the end mammals guys and it's great to feel the mammal inside because it's very powerful you know that mammals are very powerful in weather they sleep outside in rain and the cold and this and that see how far we got away from that yeah so once a day getting into a cold shower everybody is able to do and with that uh it's it the outcome is tremendous it's many books

can be written just on the outcome of what a cold shower is doing physically mentally uh astrally uh spiritually uh emotionally it's all different bodies at work because it all relates to a great blood flow. The transportation of hours, the vascular system is being upturned through the cold shower. So in the winter in the Netherlands, if you were to go into a lake, a cold natural lake, you're going to go with no wetsuits. Is that right? Oh yeah, absolutely. And... Wetsuits, no. And okay, so...

I have no money for wetsuits, so... Okay, so look, let's say then, it's July now in the UK as we have this conversation, right? If I have a cold shower from now, every day until winter, right? from now every day until winter uh right do you think i can in november or december whether here or whether i fly out to see you do you think i can also swim in a lake that's super cold without a wetsuit yes always take it take it easy. Remember the breathing. The breathing, we haven't been talking about the breathing yet. We're coming to that. We'll get to that for sure. Yes.

So I say you think it's you think it's possible? Yes, absolutely. I train people within two days to do incredible stuff. And it's amazing because it's only two days yeah what is the what is happening when people suddenly double their push-ups without breathing when they are suddenly able to do endurance feats and they they thought of they could not do even the half of it and then within two days it doubles what is that and then going into the cold like freezing ice water how to do that and going yes within 25 minutes up to three minutes without air in the lungs yeah that is tapping into a greater potential within yourself and that is only the start that's only the beginning. The start. Yeah. So I want to get to the breath. But just to

finish off on the cold Vim, if you don't mind, when they're in the cold shower, do they then need to do anything with their breath? Or you know, is there something people should be trying to do? Or they just need to tolerate the cold for as long as they can? What is what is Don't cramp up, follow is what is don't cramp up follow the breath don't cramp up don't no contraction of your muscles you get what what do you do is when you really feel cold and i it's not cold right now guys the cold shower is good

it's thermogenesis you are exercising the vascular system when you take a cold shower now that is great but in winter you're going to meet your true self within the elements of nature and that is a great experience and that for that we condition our vascular system and it always goes through long out breaths. This is the way you go into the cold shower and then the body is able not to get into panic, not into paranoia, no it's able to adapt. The thermogenesis is able to do what the body is able to do. If you do this then the body is not able to do what the body is able to do. If you do this, then the body is not able to do what the body is able to do. And then can you build up from this into, let's say, if you have a bath in your house, you can run a bath with cold water and then you can take a cold bath as well.

Is that like a progression along the sort of cold exposure? Oh, yes. yes, absolutely. Before we get back to this week's episode, I just wanted to let you know that I am doing my very first national UK theatre tour. I am planning a really special evening where I share how you can break free from the habits that are holding you back and make meaningful changes in your life that truly last. It is called the Thrive Tour, be the architect of your health and happiness. So many people tell me that health feels really complicated, but it really doesn't need to be. In my live event, I'm going to simplify health and together we're going to learn the skill of happiness,

the secrets to optimal health, how to break free from the habits that are holding you back in your life. And I'm going to teach you how to make changes that actually last. Sound good? All you have to do is go to drchatterjee.com forward slash tour. And I can't wait to see you there. This episode is also brought to you by the Three Question Journal, I can't wait to see you there. improve sleep, lead to better decision making and reduce symptoms of anxiety and depression. It's also been shown to decrease emotional stress, make it easier to turn new behaviours

into long-term habits and improve our relationships. There are of course many different ways to journal and as with most things it's important that you find the method that works best for you. One method that you may want to consider is the one that I outline in the three question journal. In it, you will find a really simple and structured way of answering the three most impactful questions I believe that we can all ask ourselves every morning and every evening. Answering these questions will take you less than five minutes, but the practice of answering them regularly will be transformative. Since the journal was published in January,

I have received hundreds of messages from people telling me how much it has helped them and how much more in control of their lives they now feel. Now, if you already have a journal or you don't actually want to buy a journal, that is completely fine. I go through in detail all of the questions within the three-question journal completely free on episode 413 of this podcast. But if you are keen to check it out, all you have to do is go to drchatterjee.com forward slash journal or click on the link in your podcast app

and listen if you if you don't make it just take on one of my we have a free app you know we built a app yeah that app is for free so it has all what you need yeah what's it called uh i don't know what's called but it's the wim hof method yeah dot com and there is an app i never i used the app once i know together with my son my son. And I have to say, it works. And I took it on. I was listening to myself. I did the breathing together with my voice, together with my son. And we had a great time. But, you know, man, I don't know how I got there.

It was my son who activated the app on the phone. So I don't know exactly, but it is for free. Every month we make sure we, I don't know, we pay about 10,000 euros a month to better the app and it's all for free. So we want everybody to know this, that health is at your choice, that the breathing, the cold, exercises, endorsed by science, are fully there, fully exposed. So there is no confusion about it. It's very clear, very effective, very accessible, and very powerful. It really is.

So that's about the cold and the breathing yeah let's go to breathing yes let's move to breathing i mean before we do could we just say the cold if all you do right is take a cold shower each day and you do nothing with your breath right even that i'm guessing will have some benefit but the benefit is magnified if you also do the breathing is that right absolutely absolutely here comes in the power of the mind because once you learn to control your breath going into the cold shower you enter into changing a getting a hold on the stress upon the body through holding your breath, to stay on with the breath. And with that, it's the beginning of getting into the stress mechanisms inside the brain. And then the unlocking of the potential to neurologically control the stress mechanisms of your brain is beginning.

And it can go very fast. It can go very fast that you learn to control what you could not control in the past, which then created fear instead of confidence. Now you will learn to have confidence because your brain now is able to be entered into these stress mechanisms to activate it whenever you need it. It's like instead of being helpless, suddenly you have a gun in your hand. You are powerful. You are powerful against the stressor coming in. I'm not into war, guys. I'm not a cowboy, I'm into peace and bringing peace is bringing a true confidence that you are able to confront yourself with any kind of stressor. That is the way you bring

peace to yourself because you are not on the watch out hey is it gonna come oh oh my work over this oh that all that you learn to pacify within to observe that's what the cold does and and the breathing together exponentially is a stairway to the mind. And that's what we have shown. It's quite mystic. It was all very esoteric before. And now it's gone and become very accessible

and effective for people. Let me tell last little thing. People who are doing mindfulness for years four hours a day cannot get as deep as we do when we get into this breathing technique inside of our brain so people doing four hours of mindfulness for years have been compared four hours of mindfulness for years have been compared inside brain scans to the brain scans being taken where people doing these breathing exercises these breathing exercises they bring you right into the depth of the mind and that is only the logic because breathing is the life force and you are able to stop it to manipulate it to slow it to accelerate and but thus

you change the biochemistry not only all to the neural activity you are able to control and to enter into the deepest of yourself because you are the light you are neurology you are the nervous system it's all there and it's very simple within seven minutes we go deeper than somebody who is doing four hours of mindfulness for years so follow the breath. The breath is amazing. This is the way to enter into the brain, to activate 100% of the neural activity and to change for the good the pH levels in the blood, which is going into the brain. So the biochemistry of the brain,

you are able to alter, and then you are able consciously to enter into any part of your brain because your the neural activity needs the right biochemistry and then the will is able to enter into any part of the brain and that is only logical and this is the new paradigm this is what we want to show to the people amen you are the owner of your brain and the owner of your own emotions so be responsible be a happy person jolly good we is a jolly good fellow he is a jolly good yeah that's me jelly every day and so yeah that's my answer now i love it so the breathing technique that i have done of yours in that auditorium but also i did i did a couple of rounds this morning was that sort of 30 or 40 uh you know breaths in let out the breath

and then hold that's a specific type of technique, right? Where you are blowing off carbon dioxide, which is the driver for us to breathe. And so, you know, we're able to hold our breath. That's quite stimulating, right? So, I did it this morning before breakfast. Actually, I actually was drinking my coffee and actually reading your book and you were talking about it. I thought I should actually do this. I've not done it for a little while. So I went into the garden actually because I thought, you know, it was a nice morning here in the UK. The birds are singing. I thought, let me do it here. And I did two rounds and I felt really energized afterwards. It's almost like having a caffeinated drink or

a cold shower. Is this the kind of thing that you would recommend people do in the daytime, in the morning, but not before bed because it sort of gets you amped up or can this be used before bed as well? Oh, yes. Oh, yes. That can be done. Yes. Because it resets the endocrine system. Can be done, yes, because it resets the endocrine system. Right. And what do you want when the endocrine system is there? You want to get rid of the cortisol, of the existing cortisol, a remnant of it in the bloodstream, which is impeding the melatonin to set in. So what you do at that moment is spike the adrenal axis,

this is what we do with this breathing exercise, and then everything gets in order. Everything is a reset, because what happens when you are in a dangerous situation, you need to be at full functionality. That is nature. So what nature does through these breathing exercises is bring you to full functionality,

and your body knows it needs sleep. And then the melatonin is able to uninhibited do its work. And you go to sleep. Or you take even a cold shower it's also to spike to spike the adrenal axis a moment it goes very fast down and with that the cortisol goes down it resets it all so uh the the recommendation is uh for the best is to do it on empty stomach in the morning but if you are really stressed out in the evening because of this and that take the cold shower or do the breathing because it will pacify your hormonal system absolutely and i just just so we don't mislead anybody um these breathing these

hyperventilation breathing certainly should not be done before going in the pool or or the sea is that right not in just on a sofa or in bed yeah you want to learn to hold your breath and go under the water do free diving yeah free diving courses apnea courses and all that this is a strong medicine we are talking a strong medicine yeah and we are learning how to deal with the biochemistry through certain kinds of breathing exercises and don't mess with it under the water because then you get a different component to it and you are yet not in control of the breathing exercises what they do within the body so don't do them in a swimming pool or outside first get to know what this is all about on a sofa or in bed yeah and when you get

good at this are we saying that you, well, it's not about getting good, right? It's about the practice. It's about seeing where that leads you. But once you start a regular practice of exposing yourself to cold every day, of doing some of this breath work every day, do you find that away from that? Let's say you were swimming that afternoon, right? Hours away from the breath holds that you did in the morning. Those techniques are building up your resilience so you're better able to face the cold. Absolutely.

Or is it that you want to get to the stage where, let's say you want to beat an ice bath for 10 minutes. Is the goal at some point in company to do it just before you get in or is that am i it's not about it's about these separate things or can they be done together well what i say with people who are into endurance sports and or fighting matches or anything that is stressful and where they have to be at full functionality, I say breathe before. Do the breathing because it brings your pH level to the right level, 7.4, say, 7.4 say and which is the residue the chemical biochemical residue which we normally have will up play itself when you exert your body and or your mind and it will come from the lymphatic

system which was considered to be a closed system we cannot enter because of the lymphatic system which was considered to be a closed system we cannot enter because of the lymphatic knots and now we are able through these breathing techniques to cleanse this storage of a slightly acidic presence within us caused by could be oxidative stress inflammation whatever it is the wrong biochemistry which you do not need at the moment when you are in to performing into performance so for those people who are going into performance or even just being alive and cleansed they i say do the breathing because then you enter into the lymphatic system past the lymphatic knots and this has been shown to get into the lymphatic system and cleanse whatever is acidic

bring it to the right ph level which then when the performance is on, shows itself to be, there is no resistance, there is no soreness, there's no acidity. Hey, I can keep on going. How come? Yeah, that's what we do. We cleanse the body before we go into performance.

And then your performance will be always better. So if I was to run a marathon, you would recommend how many rounds before you go and do that event uh you know how many rounds of breath outs four rounds four rounds five rounds and then remember when you run always breathe more than you feel you need because through our conditioning we have a more or less shallow breathing shallow conditioned breathing patterns and that is okay when we live normal our lives

covered up de-stimulative behavior it's all all right but when you exert your body then suddenly you have more oxygen flow from the depth needed so into the lymphatic into the mitochondria into the cells into the deep tissue you want to bring more oxygen so what i say to the people who are doing endurance sports and haven't got that condition i say hey breathe more than you feel you need just be more conscious about that breathing then you will see after 30 kilometers when normally there is a breakdown it's going down because the deep tissue is becoming very acidic and the biochemistry cannot be influenced anymore so you feel much lighter and you are able to keep on going why because during your uh exercise during the exertion you were bringing in more oxygen yet than you feel you need it past your conditioning and that's what you need i want to be respectful of your You were bringing in more oxygen than you feel you needed.

Past your conditioning. And that's what you need. I want to be respectful of your time, Ben. I'd love to keep chatting, but I don't know how long you've got. For people who are listening, I wonder if you have time to take me through a round of the breathing. And see just so people can see it and they can feel it. And then download your app, get your book and actually learn how to do it okay and everybody seated being there listening all right relax a relaxed body is able to store up oxygen when you're tense you you're not. So make sure you are relaxed.

Okay? Here we are. We have a belly. We have a chest. They're all connected to the lungs. That's why I want you to move your belly when you inhale. And then your chest. Fully.

And then you let go. So fully in. Letting go. Fully in. Letting go. Fully in. Letting go. Be with your mind, just with the breath. Fully in.

Letting go. Fully in. Letting go. Fully in. Take them off. Fully in. Letting go. No holding back. Let's go. Foulier. Letting go. Foulier. You become lightheaded, looming the body all right, tingling all is okay. Foulier letting go. Fully in, let it go. Keep on going. Fully in, don't mind, just go. Fully in, let it go. Fully in, let it go. Fully in, let it go. The life force coming in, oxidizing all cells in the death. Passing lymphatic knots. We are going in. Fully in. Let it go.

Fully in. Go. 10 more. Fully in. Let it go. Fully in. Let it go. And fully in.

Let it go. Fully in., letting go. Poulier, letting go. Poulier, letting go. Intensify. Anything that is different, intensify. Let go past the conditioning. Poulier, letting go. Three more. Poulier Let it go. Three more.

Pull the air. Let it go. Pull the air. Let it go. Pull the air. Let it go. Here comes the last one. Pull the air.

And let it go. And stop after there. Exhalation. Relax. Witness. Be. All be. Just be.

We have blown off the carbon dioxide. We have changed the biochemistry within the blood. There is nothing going on for the wrong. The biochemistry is very pH high, very alkaline. And the body is able to do what the body is able to do. You are the alchemist. You have changed the biochemistry

to the top. What now happens is that the saturation of oxygen is going down while you are still alkaline. This triggers the brainstem while being sort of high. You feel high yet your body is in deep deep stress right now and thus the brainstem is at work to fight the flight fully in yeah okay take a fully in and hold squeeze it to your head is bringing this cerebral spinal fluid to the brainstem three two one and let it go and you can let it go Rangan good this is to show the people everybody how to become the alchemist how to get into the fight- flight mechanisms, the stress mechanisms. We have been in deep stress. You were longer than a minute without air in the lungs.

Well, you have been quite sort of high. So you didn't experience stress, yet your stress mechanisms were really activated. And thus, because you are doing this consciously, you activate neurological pathways to the stress mechanisms in the brain. And whenever you need it out there, when stress is coming to you, you are like observing like you did right now in your breath and this is the mirror like the cold is the mirror take him on guys because you will be ready to take on any stressor in the world coming to you future is yours your happiness strength and health that is who you are thank you for taking me through that. And what was, yeah, I didn't know that was over a minute.

But then when I took that in-breath afterwards and held, I suddenly started to see, it really felt like I was accessing a different state of sort of calm. And that was very different when i when i when i held on the inhale afterwards that felt incredible it really did amazing life is amazing let's take part of the amazingness of life every day yeah i've got to say this on the surface sounds like oh this is breath work or this is cold exposure but actually the more i hear you speak the more i read your book the more it's it sort of comes over me that this is not it's not really about breath work or it's not really about cold

exposure it's about finding yourself it's about really trying to dissolve the ego and actually figuring out who you are so i think it is incredibly spiritual at its core wow that is a great resume thank you very much and it's a great message everybody has so much more coming that is the future paradigm let Let's embrace happiness, strength and health, all of us. Because it is so bloody interesting to enter in the full potential of your own mind

and the beauty of the soul. It's awaiting. Yeah. Well, Wim, thank you so much for all the work you do. I very much hope that I can attend one of your courses one day.

I'll definitely come out very soon once we're allowed to travel again and sort of have the freedom of movement. But good luck with everything. And thank you very much for your time today. You too, Rangan. All the love and understanding. Thank you. All we need is love. All we need is love.

Love. Love is all you need. that concludes today's conversation i really hope you enjoyed it and feel positively uplifted by vim's amazing energy he really is a unique and incredible human being. Please do remember, if you are going to try Vim's breathing technique, please do follow the advice carefully and do not do it before swimming or entering open water. As always, with all of my shows, my advice would be to keep things really simple and think about one thing that you can take away from today's show and implement into your own life. It may simply be that you're going to start having a cold blast at the end of your hot showers. Whatever it is, please do let Vim and I know what you thought of today's show and what you are planning to do on social media. And you can visit drchatterjee.com forward slash 127 to see all the show notes.

Vim's book is available now, The Vim Hof Method. Activate your potential and transcend your limits. If you get value from my weekly podcasts, I have a favor to ask of you. My request is that you stop right now and take a moment to share this episode with your friends, family and work colleagues. A really impactful thing to do is to choose a few people who you think would really benefit from hearing this episode and send them a link with a personal note. It is a great gift to give someone else, but it's also a lovely act of kindness, which has benefits, not just for the other person, but for you as well. So please do have a think about which people in your life would benefit and send them a link as well as a personal message.

And don't forget, each episode is also on YouTube if they prefer to watch videos as opposed to listen to audio podcasts. A quick reminder that my third book, Feel Better in Five, is now out all over the world, UK, US, Australia, Canada, India, New Zealand, and it's coming very, very soon to Holland and Sweden. So please do check it out if you're interested. It is available in paperback, ebook, and as an audio book, which I am narrating. And the message within my book is entirely consistent with implementing VIMS techniques. You can actually apply some of VIMS practices within the five-minute framework that I outline in the actual book. A big thank you to my amazing wife, Vedanta Chatterjee,

for producing this week's podcast, and to Richard Hughes for audio engineering. Have a wonderful week. Make sure you have pressed subscribe, and I'll be back in one week's time with my latest conversation. Remember, you are the architect of your own health. Making lifestyle changes always worth it. Because when you feel better, you live more. I'll see you next time.