Feel Better, Live More with Dr Rangan Chatterjee - #289 How To Overcome Fear and Achieve Your Dreams with Lisa Bilyeu

Episode Date: July 5, 2022

CAUTION: This episode contains mild swearing. What’s holding you back from pursuing your dreams? What if the ‘when’ you’re waiting for never comes? Today’s guest believes confidence is a by-product of taking action – and she wants you to take action now. Lisa Bilyeu is a British-born but now American-based entrepreneur who co-founded the billion-dollar company Quest Nutrition. She also hosts a weekly YouTube show, Women of Impact, and is the author of the brand new book, Radical Confidence. It’s a lively and inspiring read – part memoir, part self-help manual for anyone who wants to rewrite their own script and overcome ‘the purgatory of the mundane’.   In this conversation, Lisa explains how she went from being a supportive, stay-at-home wife to husband Tom (Bilyeu, who you may remember from episode 110) to someone in hot pursuit of her own dreams. Being a housewife for eight years was an arrangement she and Tom agreed on, to enable him to make their fortune. But with time, her gratitude for their comfortable life was holding her back from fulfilling her potential. She explains how her own ‘radical confidence’ came as the result of taking a risk and trying something new.   I think that’s such a powerful way of looking at it, that confidence is a consequence. It’s a useful way of seeing so many areas of life where we might be telling ourselves we can’t change, be it losing weight, getting fit or getting that new job. The truth is, says Lisa, we already know what we have to do. We just need the conviction to get going.   This conversation is packed with other gems of wisdom from Lisa’s life. From the intentional communication that underpins her marriage, to the realisation that the only hero she really needed was herself. From finding the solution to her gut-health problems, to the ‘No BS’ trick she and Tom use for working out what they really want from life. All this, and much more, in this fantastic episode. I hope you enjoy listening. Thanks to our sponsors: https://www.calm.com/livemore https://www.vivobarefoot.com/livemore http://www.athleticgreens.com/livemore Order Dr Chatterjee's new book Happy Mind, Happy Life: UK version: https://amzn.to/304opgJ, US & Canada version: https://amzn.to/3DRxjgp Show notes available at https://drchatterjee.com/289 Support the podcast and enjoy Ad-Free episodes. Try FREE for 7 days on Apple Podcasts https://apple.co/3oAKmxi. For other podcast platforms go to https://fblm.supercast.com. DISCLAIMER: The content in the podcast and on this webpage is not intended to constitute or be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your doctor or other qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. Never disregard professional medical advice or delay in seeking it because of something you have heard on the podcast or on my website.

When I'm confident, when I have the money, when I feel good about myself, when I've got the guts to speak up and say I want to change, then my life will change. So many people say I'll do this when. So what I want to say is what if that when never came? Hi, my name is Rangan Chatterjee. Welcome to Feel Better Live More. What's holding you back from pursuing your dreams? What if the when you're waiting for never comes? Well, my guest on this week's podcast believes confidence is a byproduct of taking action. And she wants you to take action right now. Lisa Bilyeu is a British born but now American based entrepreneur who co-founded the

billion dollar company Quest Nutrition. She also hosts a weekly YouTube show called Women of Impact and is the author of a brand new book called Radical Confidence, which is part memoir, part self-help manual, and really is a book for anyone who wants to rewrite their own scripts and overcome what Lisa calls the purgatory of the mundane. In our conversation, she shares her own backstory, which explains how she went from being a supportive stay-at-home wife to her husband, Tom, who you may remember from episode 110 of this podcast, to someone who is now in hot pursuit of her own dreams. You see, being a housewife for eight years was an arrangement that she and Tom agreed on to enable him to focus on their business. But with time, her gratitude for their comfortable

life was actually holding her back from fulfilling her potential. Now, Lisa is a real force of nature and her radical confidence, she says, came as the result of taking a risk and trying something new. Too many of us wait around until we have the confidence to make a change. But in Lisa's view, that day will never just arrive. We have to be brave and seize it. Radical confidence is about fully accepting yourself, flaws and all, but at the same time knowing that only you have the ability to transform things. And I think that's such a powerful way of looking at it, that confidence is a consequence. And I think it's a useful way of looking at so many different areas of life

where we might be telling ourselves that it's too hard to change, be it losing weight, getting fit, or going for that new job. The truth is, says Lisa, we already know what we have to do. We just need the conviction to get going. Lisa and I covered so many different topics in our conversation. We spoke about the intentional communication that underpins her marriage, the no BS trick that her and her husband Tom use for working out what they really want from life, and the realization that the only hero she really needed was herself.

We also discussed how she found the solution to her own debilitating gut problems. This conversation is packed with so many gems of wisdom from Lisa's life. I really enjoyed chatting to her. I hope you enjoyed listening. And now, my conversation with Lisa I really enjoyed chatting to her. I hope you enjoyed listening. And now, my conversation with Lisa Bilyeu.

For people who are struggling at the moment, who maybe they feel lost, they are not pursuing their dreams, but actually they don't even have the courage to even start pursuing their dreams what would you say to them what is the story you're telling yourself every day of why you're not like for me has to be i have to ask myself questions to get to the answer because to your point I didn't think some people even know and so I think it's important to start asking yourself questions like what is the belief that you have that you're not going after your dream is it you're not smart enough you're not good enough you don't have confidence you don't have money so many people say I'll do this when

and so what I want to say is what if that when never came would you still live your day today like you do now that is powerful it reminds me of something I read in your book about confidence and many of us think that you know we need to achieve certain things in order to become confident whereas in the book you've reframed that and say you know that actually it's by doing new things you're going to get the confidence. Can you unpick that for people? Yeah.

I mean, this is beautiful, actually, because it goes with the when. I used to say to myself, when I was stuck for eight years, I thought my purpose was putting clothes out for my husband and cooking for him. Very traditional Greek wife mentality. And that was how I was brought up. So I kept saying, we'll make a change when I'm confident. We'll make a change when I have the money, when we have the time, when Tom is happy, all of these things. And I really thought the confidence piece was a huge part of it. I thought when I feel good about myself, when I've got the guts to speak up and say, I want to change, then my life will change. And what ends up happening is if you would never

get the confidence, you never make that change. And what I realized was radical confidence means that you don't actually have confidence in yourself. You don't necessarily have the right skill sets. You don't necessarily have the right mentality to attack something. And so you believe that you've got to be smarter. You've got to be better at something before you get started. But it's like, that's actually to me, putting the cart before the horse. It's how do you get started even when you're insecure? How do you get started even when you don't believe in yourself? How do you keep moving forward?

Because so many people would say to me, Lisa, I want your confidence. How do I get confidence like you? And I'd be like, who are they talking to? There is no way they're talking to me, Lisa, I want your confidence. How do I get confidence like you? And I'd be like, who are they talking to? There is no way they're talking to me. Because if you heard how negative the voice in my head is, that is telling me that I'm not good enough, then you would realize it's not confidence. What I do is I take my insecurities. I accept the things that I'm not good at. I embrace them and I move forward in a way. And it's in the action that you build the competence and then the confidence becomes the byproduct of taking action. Yeah. It reminds me a lot about health and when I see patients, let's say someone is really struggling

with their weight. They feel they've got excess weight, they want to lose it. Often you hear narratives like, you know, when I've lost one stone, two stone, three stone, whatever the goal might be for that individual, then I'm going to do this, then I'm going to feel happy, then I'm going to buy that dress, then I'm going to do this, whatever it might be. And what I've learned in 20 years now of seeing a lot of patients is that that's the wrong way around. You've got to like who you are now. You've got to accept yourself who you are now in order to lose that weight. And it's kind of, I feel like you're sort of saying a similar kind of thing, but not through the lens of health, through the lens of confidence and achieving our goals, achieving our dreams.

A thousand percent. And it's how do you hold two competing ideas in your head at the same time to motivate you forward? So let's just take wealth and health. So it's maybe you do want to lose weight and maybe you're like, hey, you know, for health, for me to live longer, I do need to drop some pounds. and maybe you're like, hey, you know, for hell for me to live longer, I do need to drop some pounds. But I'm good enough as I am. How do you hold those two? Because they seem like they conflict. But to me, you're 100% right. You have to say, who I am right now is beautiful. But I still hold myself to growing, to changing, to pursuing transformation, to pursuing the unknown. And if you can change your mentality, that then gets you to start acting. And it's in the acting that makes you realize, I can actually love myself just the way I am. And yet I can still demand more of myself. I can still expect myself to show up every day. Because I think that we think of ourselves as who you are today defines who you

are. And I think that that's actually holding us all stuck. If I can say who I am today does not dictate who I can be, but it's still the foundation of where I'm starting from. Now, it's not about beating yourself up for where you are, right? We're all trying to change and you even said when. It's not about beating yourself up for where you are, right? We're all trying to change and you even said when. What if that when never came? How do you get started right now and believe that you're good enough to get started right now? Yeah.

I really like that. It's not like self-denial. It's not about just imagining a future and going, yeah, that's the person I'm going to be. It's like, no, no, hold on a minute. I'm going to take step one, which is accepting who I am, warts and all, insecurities, all these kinds of things, but then also opening and holding that possibility of change. Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think because I used to beat myself up for the person I currently

was and that didn't serve me. It just made me feel worse about myself. Like, oh, look how bad you are at this. Well, look how bad you are at this. And it just made me spiral into a downward spiral of thinking negative thoughts about myself. But if I can say, oh, Lisa, who you are right now doesn't define you. It just means that's where you are in your timeline. And so if you can just admit and be honest, candidly and beautifully honest with yourself, the great news with that is now you can actually lay a path to where you wanna go without beating yourself up. Now, it allows me to pull out of myself

and look into the future. And so when I'm able to do that and say, who I am today is just an accumulation of all the things that I've done in the past, then that also means that everything that I do right now can become an accumulation of all the things that I've done in the past, then that also means that everything that I do right now can become an accumulation of the person I'm going to become. And it's that mindset, that reframe allows me to accept myself and at the same time still push myself to want more, still push myself to achieve more. And it's in the growth, it's in the learning,

it's in the falling and getting back up that I've learned to attach my identity to because that becomes unbreakable every time I fall if I say to myself but Lisa you're the person that can get back up yeah allows me to always take a dent but never to be on my knees and stay there you write about being the learner in the book, and I've had the fortune of speaking on many occasions with your husband, Tom. Tom talks about this a lot as well, this idea of taking on the identity of a learner. And I would absolutely say in my own life over the past few years, one of the biggest things that's helped me with my own health, but certainly my happiness, is letting go of the need to be right or wrong. It's always about learning. What's the

growth opportunity here? What can I learn here? And that seems to be something you very much take the baton off and run with it in this book as well. Yeah, he was definitely the one that introduced it to me because I was always getting in my own way. I was always so worried about failing that it stopped me from moving forward. I was always worried about even just changing my identity. So going from a supportive stay-at-home wife to an entrepreneur, I was getting so many accolades for being the great wife that I was worried about making that change. And what if I failed? If I went over to the entrepreneur side and I failed, does that mean I'm a failure? And so sticking to what you know, because you get the pats on the back, is I think the velvet handcuffs.

It's the thing that keeps people where they are. And so, but being the learner allows you to come out of that and say, if I'm the learner and I step into, let's say, this room and there's 10 guys and I'm the female entrepreneur that doesn't have any experience, and I walk into this room, there's 10 other male entrepreneurs that say they've got experience, I would be petrified. I would feel the imposter syndrome, all the negative thoughts would come in. Who do you think you are, Lisa, to to walk into this room and it would stop me from walking into that room which would then prevent me from growing to then reaching my goal and my dream and having the life I want but now I walk in with the identity of the learner if someone knows something more than I do what do you think I was like oh my god

tell me more because I'm the learner I want want to learn from you. If I make a mistake and someone corrects me, there's no more ego involved because as the learner, I actually like the fact that I've been corrected because my North Star is learning. So I realized that all my insecurities by shifting my identity instead of being the best at this or amazing at this or being the best Greek wife, at this or amazing at this or being the best Greek wife. I was like, if I'm the learner, nothing can touch me from progression. I think if everyone adopted the identity of the learner, we'd see a lot more harmony and peace in the world, less biting at people, less fighting, less protection of ego, all those kinds of things, which I think cause a whole host of problems. Lisa, you are someone who is incredibly successful. And from the outside,

there were some really quite poignant bits in the book, which surprised me. Because from the outside, I think we can perceive successful people as having all their stuff sorted out. I want to delve into some of those stories in the book. But before that, could you maybe explain for my audience who may not be familiar with your journey, how did you go from growing up in London with a traditional Greek upbringing to now living in LA and being the co-founder of a billion dollar company. Can you talk us through that a little bit to give us an understanding of where you were and where you currently are? Yeah, absolutely. So growing up, Greek Orthodox in North London had massive dreams to be a movie director in Hollywood.

And so that was my dream. I want to be the first female to win the Academy Award. And so I wanted to study filmmaking and my dad didn't want to be the first female to win the Academy Award. And so I wanted to study filmmaking and my dad didn't want me to. My dad's very traditional Greek. So he was just like, study something like math or science, be a doctor. And so I was like, I didn't want to be a doctor, but we just started arguing. And after a couple of weeks, he was like, well, you're going to be a stay at home wife in a way. So it doesn't really matter. Now, at the time, I was like, at least I got what I wanted, but it was definitely a subliminal message of what, as a young girl, was expected of me. So I go to film school. I'm just super excited that I get to go to film school.

I meet Tom. I had this summer course that was in America. So I come to America for eight weeks. My teacher happens to be Tom. So he was actually the office guy when I first got there. And then a week in, my teacher had a wedding to go to. So Tom stepped in because Tom was also teaching film. And so he's my teacher. So he just ignores me, which of course makes it even more interesting to me. We then go out on our first date. And literally, he was the complete opposite of what I expected in the guy

or what I normally dated complete opposite so he rolls up he's straight from work I'm used to a guy he's got the cologne on he's like got the gel in his hair he just rolls up straight from work his car and again I'm used to at least from where I was from the car was the signal right so it's like if you had a beefy car it meant that you were wealthier which meant they could take care of you more and so a lot of the girls went after the guys with the really nice cars so I was used to guys being flashy with their cars and so I meet Tom and he's got this old man Buick with like his back seat is just like full of crap in the back and I'm like who is this guy and then he opens the car door for me. And I was like, I was 21 years old and not one guy had ever opened the car door for me on a day before. And so I was like, who is this guy?

And that became the catalyst to kind of like us just being ourselves. Neither of us thought of it as like anything serious. I was there for vacation. You know, I wasn't there for long. I legally had to leave the country. What was the worst that can happen? And so each day, neither of us put on any airs or graces. And so because of that, we had the most beautiful, open discussions that I didn't, like he challenged all of my beliefs on that first date. Like he asked me why I believed in God. And as a Greek Orthodox girl at 21 years old I've never once been asked that because it was just a given where I was well so I was like because my dad told me to like that was actually my answer um and so we just really fell for each other it happened

very quickly it was kind of like what are you doing tomorrow nothing let's hang out what are you doing tomorrow nothing let's hang out and then before we knew it four weeks later he was like i need to come visit you in england so we definitely had a whirlwind romance um and then i don't know how quickly you want me to go but cut to your time he proposes alexandra palace because he wanted to basically it be the the highest point in england because he's like i want to shout it from the rooftops that i'm in love with you and i want to marry you. So he found that Alexandra Palace was the highest point in London. So my friends tricked me into going to Alexandra Palace. So he got down on one knee. And then we had just had big dreams and it was like, babe, we're going to go to America

and we're going to make movies. And, you know, he started filmmaking as well. So that was our dream. going to make movies and you know he started filmmaking as well so that was our dream and then we got both got these potential gigs we moved to america got these gigs on movies and we both hated it so i was on a film and an actor like threw a matchbox at me just as one example of how hollywood um you know you kind of hear these rumors it is actually like that um tom had wrote a script and they just they they butchered it. So he was like trying to get his name taken off the script. So eventually it was just like, you had these big dreams and we didn't know how we were actually going to make it happen. And that's when Tom was like, well, babe, if we made enough money, we can finance the movies ourselves.

And now no one, we can control the resources and we control the art it's like oh that sounds fairly easy enough my my the naive to the beginner and so this is the point of where we sat down and we thought okay let's lay out our goals let's say lay out what it's going to take to actually get there and then you know we're going to work our asses off to do it so he just read an interview with steve jobs that said at the time that um he doesn't actually care what he wears so he always wears a black shirt and jeans because he doesn't want to spend one iota of brain power deciding on what to wear because he only has you only have a certain amount of

clarity in decision making so we were like okay babe if you went to work and you did every, all the hard business work, and I took care of all of the decisions from what you're going to eat, to what you're going to wear, to paying the bills, to where we live, to what we let, everything. If I took care of everything else, that seems like quite a good strategy. So we pinky swore on it, this will be great. We're going to do this for a year year and a half so he found these entrepreneurs they had built a company and he's like oh they built a company before i'm going to work with them and they said to him any um you can see yourself as any type of position that you want in the company if you see yourself as a um a business partner then show up and act in accordance and you'll be a partner. So Tom took

them seriously, which meant we played a game called no bullshit, what would it take? Now, no bullshit, what would it take is a game that you play when you say you want to dream and then you assess what it's actually going to take to get to that dream. Because how many of us, let's just take weight again for health, will say, I really, really want to lose X amount of weight. But they don't show up to do the work. And then maybe a year down the line, like my mom is a perfect example. She kept saying, I can't lose the weight, I can't lose the weight. But when you saw her actions, they weren't aligned in what she said she wanted. Now, how many times do you think she beats herself up over the fact

that she couldn't lose the weight? Every day. I can't do it. I can't do it. But the truth is, she can. She chose not to. So when you play the no bullshit warrior to take, let's just say it means you have to, let's say, that Coke that you love drinking every day you're going to maybe have to take that out your diet you maybe have to walk three miles a day let me take go back to my example with Tom what would it take for him to go out and earn enough money the no bullshit answer was I would have to take care of the family the house and he would go out and he would work really hard and make the finances that was our answer to no bullshit, what would it take to make enough money? Now going back to, sorry, actually him being a business partner, what would it take for him to actually be a business partner? And so we said, okay,

well, right now we live an hour away. If you're a business partner, you need to be in it, which means that in an emergency, you've got to be there within, Tom said seven minutes. I don't know why he had seven minutes. He just said seven minutes. I was like, fine, let's just say the seven minutes. And we're like, all right, no bullshit. It would mean that we would need to live by his business partners so that we can get there within seven minutes. Because if there was a business emergency, seven minutes is an acceptable amount of time. Okay, what else? No bullshit. I would have to stay home and take care of all other decisions so he can go all in on business. So this was the life that we created based on the game that we played. And then we just said, are we willing to do it? And that's

the beauty of the game. You don't actually have to say yes. So if you were to say to somebody, in order for you to lose 20 pounds, you would have to do X, Y, and Z. And then it's up to the person to decide whether they actually want to do it or not. But at least they have the information. So we played this game. Great. We're both in. We move. So literally we were timed from his business partner's apartment to everywhere we looked to see if it was less than seven minutes. So we went all, we called it the Steve Jobs effect. So we went all in on the Steve Jobs effect. And so for a year, a year and a half, I was cooking, I was cleaning. He was working from the moment he woke up to the moment he went to bed, all in pursuit of a goal that we said we wanted. Now, what ends up happening very often, I don't know if your

listeners can relate to this, but you say, I'm just going to sacrifice for a while. It's just going to be a year. It's not going to be that bad. And then something happens. And then you convince yourself, it's just another year. I'm going to sacrifice, of course, it's just for another bit. And then what ends up happening is you keep sacrificing over and over and over again. And what you realize is you've sacrificed for everything and everyone else except yourself. And that's what ended up happening. I was sacrificing for everybody else, for the pursuit of Tom's dream, for movie making. But it never was.

Like, I never looked at my life and said, you keep sacrificing. But at what point do you stop sacrificing for your happiness? When do you stop? Yeah. And that ended up being me stuck at home, perpetually cooking and cleaning for my husband for eight years. To the point he would wake up, his clothes were next to him in bed. He would put his clothes on, he would go to the gym, he'd come back, his work clothes were waiting by the shower. He would get changed, he would walk out with a lunch bag. And so over those eight years,

he would walk out with a lunch bag. And so over those eight years, I became stuck. Now, I never hit rock bottom. How many people do you know make a change because they hit rock bottom? That's what jolts them interaction, right? That's what sparks them. That's what motivate where I've got nothing else to lose. I may as well go for it. But when you're like someone like me who didn't have it, like I didn't hit rock bottom. At the first year and a half, I was just using gratitude. Like, it's so beautiful. Look how I'm so grateful. I don't have to work my husband out. Like, yes, I'm cooking and cleaning, but I've got a husband that loves me. I've got a roof over my head. By year two, as I started to be like, is this really the life you want? Yeah. I used the gratitude again. But Lisa, how grateful are you?

Don't worry your sadness. How grateful are you? By year eight, it became, don't you dare voice your opinion because how ungrateful are you if you do? Yeah. And that voice, that whisper got louder and louder. The gratitude that was a beautiful part of my life in the first year became exactly what was the massive handcuff in year eight. I mean, this is so powerful, Lisa, so much there. You call this the purgatory of the mundane in your book.

It's a very powerful phrase, I think. I think what you've just articulated, so many people listening will relate to that. Particularly that moment where you said, I'll just do it for a little bit longer. Just six more months. Just one more year. Like this. Whatever that like this is in someone's life, whether it's being in the wrong job, not pursuing a goal, being in the wrong relationship, you know, whatever it might be, it's really, really powerful. Like when you share that story, and I had it circled down and wanted to talk to you about this no BS game, because I think it's really powerful. It strikes me that you and Tom had something very special at the start, something

that a lot of relationships and couples don't have. Not until at least they've gone through some stuff to get it. There seems to be a real kind of transparency and honesty. You know, the no BS game, what would it take? That's a pretty profound game. The book's called Radical Confidence. What I hear as I read page after page, I hear radical transparency, radical honesty. It's like you can't be radically confident until you actually put that mirror there and look at your life, you know, warts and all, but you go, no, this is the situation the way it is. I'm not going to kid myself. I'm going to accept it the way it is. And then I can be empowered to make a different decision. So you guys go, well, what would it

take? Or we will take this. So you're going to become the housewife. Tom's going to work. A lot of people wouldn't do that. And I think, is this a similar game that you played around your intentional decision not to have kids? Because this is also very powerful. I think a lot of women I know have contacted me in the past to say, but we've intentionally chosen not to have kids, right? But much of society doesn't appear to speak to us, right? Everything seems to be around, you know, getting married or getting together with someone and having kids. And I thought that part of your story is very, very powerful. You don't have any kids and that's been an intentional decision, hasn't it? Just taking a quick break to give a shout out to AG1, one of the sponsors of today's show.

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So just to give people perspective of I wasn't someone that was like, well, I don't know if I want kids. I thought I was going to have four. And as we started with Quest and Quest just blew up. I mean, we grew at 57,000%, which literally takes you, we were the second fastest growing company in North America, and we went from zero to a billion dollars in just five years. So that's real growth. And so in that growth, I went from shipping bars off my living room floor as the good supportive wife one day to a year later, two years later, I had a shipping department of

10,000 square feet, 40 for zero employees underneath me alone. And I had zero education running a department or being a leader or anything. I would spend eight years at home. So as we were growing, as I started to realize what I was capable of. That was where I understood radical confidence and understood that it doesn't mean about feeling great all the time. It just means about being honest with where you are, being honest about your skill sets, being honest about what you're capable of right now, and then believing in yourself that you can get good. And that absolutely means you have to be honest and acknowledge where you are right now. And so when it came to then thinking about children, this was a big part because I was like,

that part of me still really wanted children. And yeah, I loved what I was doing. And so you're getting all this external noise, right? The external noise from my Greek parents and all my Greek family that's like, okay, you've been married long enough now you know at this point we've been married you know almost 10 years or something so they couldn't understand why we weren't having children i was getting asked are you okay like can you actually have children as if that that would have been the reason why i wouldn't right because no one would in my family or community would have assumed that it was a choice yeah even to the point where once i don't want to derail too much, but I was in a car and it was an Uber driver and it was this lovely woman. And so we start talking and she was like,

I think she may have been Hispanic or like, she definitely had a very traditional belief system. And so I'm in the car and I'm asking her about her kids and she's glowing. And she's like, oh, what about you? And I was like, oh, I don't have any her kids and she's glowing. And she's like, oh, what about you? And I was like, oh, I don't have any. She goes, it's okay. It's okay. Maybe you're just a beautiful aunt. I was like, why is she being so weird about it?

And I was like, oh, it literally like that. I was like, she didn't even consider the fact that it was a choice. She was just trying to soothe me thinking that I just couldn't have children. So just understanding where a lot of cultural backgrounds come from, especially women, they just assume. So my family, my Greek background assumed that I was going to have children. So as I start to realize, I love entrepreneurship. This is so amazing. We played the no bullshit. What would it take if we were going to have kids or not? And so to me, it was about no judgment. I just need to address the realities of the situation and then see what feels right for me.

So what I did is I call it like, basically take your average Wednesday because we can all get convinced when it's a Saturday, it's super fun. Or if I can convince, like let's talk about kids for a second. I'm sure. Tell me a couple of sentences about the birth of your children, the day they were born.

How did it make you feel? Yeah, I mean, immediately I'm going to elation and, oh, it was a wonderful day. It was great. You know, I became a father. I actually can't remember like a lot of the reality of the day, or I'm sure my wife may have a completely different perspective than I. reality of the day or I'm sure my wife may have a completely different perspective than I but it reminds me a little bit if when you ask um or when I ask patients um tell me about your diet they don't tell you their worst day they give you the best oh yeah no I have this

it's the same kind of principle yeah do you know what I mean exactly so we all know again going back to just be radically honest with yourself, we all freaking know that we can convince ourselves on anything of why it's amazing. Yeah. Right? So it's like, I totally know. I can completely convince myself why I should have children. From a kid, I was like, oh, but the baby kicking inside me, a little Tom running around with his ears. Oh my God, like, come on, I could like melt right now. And so I understood the power of focusing on something beautiful. And so I was like, what would an average Wednesday look like? I actually need to see what my life in totality

would look like. And is it the life I choose? Because unlike a business where you can just like, oh, I actually don't like doing this anymore. I'm going to change. I'm going to pivot, right? It's like, you've got so many accolades, you write and you still do a podcast. So it's like you grow, you evolve. There's new things that you want to try out. But with a kid, there's no like going back. There's no like changing it. It's like once you have a kid, you've had the child. And so for me, I was always like, I was very aware of that. So we played the no bullshit. What me I was always like I was very aware of that so we played the no bullshit what would it take look on like an average Wednesday to have children and so I saw three options ahead of me option number one is I am a stay-at-home mother option number two is I'm

a working mother and option number three is I don't have children and I'm just a working lady, woman, whatever you want to call me, lady. Lady. Call you a lady. I'm a lady. So I said, okay, with all transparency and honesty, I have to sit with Tom and ask him what kind of father he wants to be. Because whether I'm a stay-at-home wife, whether I work, I need to know how he sees being a father. And so we sat down and he said, babe, you know the man I am. You know who you married. I'm ambitious. I'm never home at six, seven o'clock at night having dinner with the

family. I'm working on weekends. You know, like I'll climb into bed and I may not have said two words to you all day. Like he's just like, so from Monday to Friday, I'm going to be incredibly ambitious, which means I'm not getting up in the middle of the night to feed the babies, even when they're newborn. I'm not going to be changing diapers in the middle of the night because I need my sleep, because I'm not going to be able to run a business or show up and crush my business if I'm exhausted. So he said, but I would love to spend time with him. I want to be an amazing father. So I'll spend time on the weekends. So I was like, great. he's just being honest like take away the judgment the man was just honest with me take away the judgment that's that's key there

isn't it take away the judgment be honest yeah because it's like he's just telling me his truth and now if I'm going to punt quote unquote punish him for telling me the truth he's not going to be honest with me again so I was just respectful I like, thank you so much for saying that. Now knowing his truth, what does my average Wednesday look like in these three buckets that I laid out? So if I'm a stay-at-home wife, I'm basically a single mother Monday to Friday. If I'm a working mom, I'm having to juggle both because he said that he's not willing to do both. Okay. Well, what does that actually look like? Do I want half my time to be split between? I know many women that do it. So it's not even like, oh, it's not possible. No, no, it is very possible.

Is that the life Lisa Bilyeu wants? Yeah. And so I just said, what are the things I love about my business? I love going all in. I love like going hard. I love staying up to whatever time I have to, to figure something out. And so can I honestly do that with a newborn? The answer is no. Now I can have help. So then I went down that, do I want help? Do I want someone to live with me? The answer was no, I don't want someone else to live with me. And so as I like, literally, I didn't even judge myself for answering these questions. I just said, what would it look like for an average Wednesday? And once I had what, like as screenplays, I think in movies, right? So if I imagine you have like these little screenplays

of what each scenario looks like, which is the one that makes your heart sing? And mine was the one I was already in. It was the bucket I was already in it was the bucket I was already in it was the not having kids and going hard for my business yeah in your book as you articulate this story you also add I think that you know it's so incredible to see how in love you and Tom are with each other I mean you told me just before this conversation you've only been away from him for two days first time since covid and you are missing him so much it's so so cute and it's it's just it's just really awesome to to see that and to hear that but I think one bit you mentioned which really stood out to me was am I prepared to go down on Tom's priority list yeah because if he's running his business Monday to Friday, if he's going to spend all weekends with the kids, then there's going to be less time for me. And again, there was no

emotion with it. It was just logical transparency and honesty. And you thought, no, I'm not prepared to do that. And my question, Lisa, is where does this come from? Because many people never do that exercise. They end up having kids because they think that's what they should do. That's what their parents did. That's what they see their friends doing. They end up down that route. And then often, let's say using the example you've given, by not having that conversation, let's play that out. You didn't have a conversation. Let's say you ended up having kids and you've never had that conversation. And then Tom's busy working Monday to Friday. Resentment, frustration, anger.

These sort of things build up all the time because people have never played a game like that and been that honest. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. I think it comes from the fact that we both come from divorced parents now my parents divorced when i was eight years old his parents divorced when he was an adult but we both were very open about the experience of divorce and how we felt about it and we don't ever we you know we were very transparent like we don't agree that people couples should stay together if they're miserable for the sake of the kids i think that actually can become more detrimental to the child now look i'm not an'm not an expert. I don't have kids, but

this was our conclusion. So it's like, okay, we've seen where divorce leads. We think his parents were unhappy for a very long time and neither of them spoke up. So we definitely don't want to go down that rabbit hole. My parents divorced when I was quite young young and then they just had to figure out their dynamic after they divorced so my mum went from giving up her job that she loved to be a stay-at-home mother and you know she admits that she loved her job and she was so sad and so kind of understanding just and talking to other people with experiences on relationships that was just step number one then we came together and we said do we just agree that our North Star is being happily married for the rest of our lives? Not married for the rest of our lives.

Happily married for the rest of our lives. Do we just agree on that? The answer is yes. Amazing. If we have the same goal now, we have to be aligned on how to get to that goal. And that alignment means what? Do we agree that we're always going to be honest even when it's fricking tough? Yes. Do we agree that we will never apologize even when it's easier to say you're sorry and end an argument? Yes. We make these

rules before we're there. So even like, it was like maybe a month ago now, and I actually started laughing. We were in the middle of a debate or something and we were like going back and forth and tom was like you know what it'd be so much easier if i just said i was sorry right now he's like but i know i can't you know and it was just like he just admitted it and i was like yeah you know if you're not sorry you can't apologize and so we just kept talking about it because what ends up happening is if you're just trying to shut the argument down or you're just trying to, you know, this is too much hassle, you're sweeping it under the rug. It will come back later. It will come back.

And it's like, I'm sure you know the marshmallow test, right? The marshmallow test is would you rather have immediate satisfaction or would you rather have, what is it, like temporary dissatisfaction for long-term goal gains and that's what the marshmallow test technically is right you leave a marshmallow in front of the kid and you're like okay i'm gonna leave the room and when i come back if you haven't eaten it i'm gonna give you another one a lot of kids will eat it because they want the immediate satisfaction even though they know it's better for them later on yeah it's almost like the same with marriage it's like sometimes it's easy just to freaking eat marriage. It's like, sometimes it's easy just to freaking eat them. It's like, you just want to say, sorry, get on with it, right?

That's eating the marshmallow. But I just know that if I wait, it's going to be better for my relationship. So I know with apologizing, it won't serve the relationship. Unless you of course mean it, then you definitely should apologize, but don't just say you're sorry for not. So these are all agreements. These are all discussions tom and i had way before we ever got ourselves into those situations and then the last thing is just making sure that you do want each other to win when you argue most of the time you just want to win and so we just said do we agree that when we debate something it's not about ego and you've got to freaking leave your ego at the door because let's face it it doesn't really matter who's right or who's wrong if we both have the same goal don't we just want to be aligned

and so it's about re um re-giving like giving yourself a different perspective a different way to think about it making rules that before you get there you've already got these rules in place um and then just utterly respecting each other and never using each other's vulnerabilities against each other it's about intentionality isn't it it's about being very conscious about what decisions you're making what choices you're making it's wonderful to hear and i think a lot of people around the world who watch you and Tom, especially when you're interviewed together about your relationship, you know, you see a lot of the comments, people find it very, very helpful. There's a real transparency, honesty, and that thing about wanting each other to win. I think

that's very, very clear when people like me watch you both talk. It's like, you may not agree on everything, but you both have the same goal, the same North Star. In one of those conversations I watched on YouTube, I remember Tom saying, sometimes the arguments end up being really, really long because it would be easier to just accept something or say, I'm sorry, and long because it would be easier to just accept something or say, I'm sorry, and just shut it down so you can have a nicer evening or whatever. But you guys, it seems, have both learned that actually, no, we need to go through the ups and downs of this, get to the end with transparency and honesty so that we actually process this.

We don't just... It's kind of the same thing with health, really, on an individual level. When we suppress emotions, when we're not honest about them, they always come back to bite us. Always. Exactly. So just call it what it is, you know, and like be honest with the situation you're going with. And if you can remove the judgment, it does become such a different discussion, right? Because it's not like, I can't believe he said that. Like, it's just like, oh't believe you said that like it's just like oh my god I didn't realize you know you're embracing each other's

opinions even if you don't want to hear it what if someone's likes the idea Lisa and they go okay yeah but sometimes when I'm chatting to my partner yeah I'm just feeling so angry and worked up that I know I'm being triggered but I don't want you know, it's very hard in that moment for people to take the ego out of it. Do you have any advice on that for people? Yes. Cause I'm actually like a couple of months ago, just dealt with this, which is why I love this question. So I realized Tom and I were starting to argue about the same thing. And it was like, it was always like the same thing that would arise like in different discussions, but it would still arise. And I would take things personally. And it was like, I don't normally take things personally I mean in business you can't

right so it's like I don't normally take things personally I don't normally get emotional and it was like this one thing that I kept it kept bothering me and I kept saying to me you keep upsetting me and so we really spoke about it I went away and I did the internal work because it all has to start with you so I did the internal I was like, why do I keep getting upset every time he says like X, Y, and Z? Like he's bothering me. And now I feel like I'm being too sensitive because I do think that there's like, I don't actually think he's done anything wrong. I think that it's me, he's triggering me in some way. So I started to really go, oh, he is triggering me in some way. What is he triggering me on? Oh, why do I have that trigger? Okay. It comes from childhood. Oh, I get it now. So I why do i have that trigger okay it comes from childhood oh i get

it now so i started to trace back my trigger and it all came to the fact that growing up with a brother and sister who were naturally more intelligent than i was um we would sit at dinner table and my dad would throw out math quizzes and my brother and sister are bam bam bam and they were very much they were better academically than i was in everything. And so I always felt like the stupid one. And so I realized I carry that with me as an adult and I don't get triggered by anyone else, but just by him, that if I feel stupid around him. And so I realized, oh, it's when you say certain things that then trigger an insecurity in me that makes me realize that I feel like I'm a child.

And he's like, okay, so, you know, and I said, look, the trigger's my issue. The trigger's not your issue, babe. But as my partner, I need your help. So I said, this is my trigger. I'm going to be very honest with you about it. I'm going to be honest with you about why I'm being triggered, but I need you to know I'm working on it. Just accepting the trigger is kind of like going, well, that's who I am. It's like, no, that doesn't serve my relationship. So why would I accept the trigger? So I go, it's going to take a while. I don't judge myself for having the trigger, but I just go, I need, I recognize it. And now I'm going to adjust it. So what I said to him was, I just need your help as I'm working through this trigger. Please do not say this word, this

word or this word. And he's like, but what if I forget? And I was like, don't worry, I'll remind you. But do you at least commit to trying to help me alleviate this trigger? And he said, of course. I said, great. So now when we have these discussions, I'll be very honest. And I'll be like, oh, babe, I know you probably didn't mean to, but you've triggered me a little. And how I'm aware of the trigger is I've done the internal work to know, oh, when my heart starts racing, when my face feels flushed, I've identified the flags in myself of how I can, I know I'm getting triggered, how I know I'm ratcheting up with my emotions. And so now when I see the first flag, I tell him, oh, babe, I felt this.

I'm working on it. But again, it's not blaming him. It's saying, I get it's me. But together, going back to doesn't he want me to win? Of course he does. So now he helps me on the trigger. Yeah. It's so beautiful. You said you did the internal work.

Yeah. My experience these days is that a lot of people are simply not aware of when they're being triggered when they're having these automatic responses often they come back to childhood conditioning of course and even just being aware of those little signals that are um that your body is you know trying to wave at you and say hey look this is what's going on we we many many people i think struggle with that i'm interested as to when you started to become in tune with that when did you start to become aware that oh my body starts to change my heart's going or you know what's going on here and also i know you've had real health issues with your guts for many, many years.

I'm wondering how that plays in here, because obviously the gut is so central to how we feel, to our emotions, our intuition. So I'm just wondering, have your struggles with your gut in some way also helped you tune into what your body's trying to tell you oh that's an interesting question i didn't see you going that way with the question because i was going to answer that my gut has has made it worse for me to be in tune with my emotions because for a long time for about at least a year i wasn't really able to eat much at all so i was 10 pounds 20 pounds lighter than you see me now my hair was falling out my nails were brittle I couldn't stand up for longer than five minutes at a time my gut had protruded so far out it was like out to here so I was really

malnutritioned so what ended up happening was when you're malnutritioned right my emotions were all over the place so it was like the very first time actually I cried at work it was when quest had become big never cried at work before and then all of a sudden I'm in a meeting and there's like five of us or whatever. And all of a sudden Tom really upset me. And so at the end of the meeting, I go into the restroom in his office and I start crying and he comes in because he thought I had stomach pain. He's like, baby, you're all right. And I'm just crying. He's like, what's wrong? I was like, you were so mean to me. And he was like, what the hell is happening right now?

And so he's like, babe, you've never said that I've been mean to you during a work meeting. And I was like, yes, but you were so disrespectful. And I couldn't see the reality of the situation because of my gut. And so he very eloquently walked me through it because A, do you trust the person that is the messenger, right? Yes. I'd been married to Tom at this point for like 10 years. So I knew who he was. So when he was saying, babe, is it possible that right now you don't see that you're being emotionally reactive because of your gut? And of course at first you're like, what do you mean? It's not my gut issue. And he's like, you know, who am I you know who am i and you know we were kind of talking i was like okay does he love me that's

always the question i go to does he love me does he want me to win and when the answer is yes then i know there's no malice in what he's saying so then i go okay just listen to him and he's like is it possible you've never you know we've been doing this now for five years or whatever you've never once cried at work. You never once made this personal. You're saying you're mean to me. You've made it personal. And you've had the worst gut issues in the world.

You can't eat. So of course you're going to be emotional. And so in that moment, even though it didn't feel real, the logical part of my brain, I had like the logical and the emotional, right? And it's like the logical part was like brain i had like the logical and the emotional right and it's like the logical part was like oh he's right so i actually can't trust my gut right now now as i started to heal i started to realize the gut was the central nervous system that is telling me when something's not right and something is but i had to repair my gut in order to be able to function to be giving me the signals that I could listen to. Yeah, very, very powerful.

Just to hear that when your gut's off, your intuition goes off as well. That's very, very powerful. Lisa, when you write about your health problems, your gut problems in the book, you get to this point where you talk about them being 100% your fault. And it definitely makes you stop and reread that section. And I'd really like to expand on that because when it comes to illness and symptoms being fault or you know even even as I say that I sort of move away I can see you uncomfortable yeah as a doctor as someone who always tries to

approach people with compassion I'm very conscious of how that could potentially sound having said that I think you write about it beautifully in the book and it's definitely not about blame, but the message I got, it was about responsibility and agency. Can you maybe speak to that a little bit? Because I think it's very, very powerful. Yeah. So the reason why I use fault is because it triggers me to act and words are powerful. So I think of a word triggers you and makes you feel badly about yourself, stops you from acting, makes you retreat, and you definitely shouldn't use the word for, but use a word that gets you to move forward, to take the agency. What is that word for you? Now, word for stings a little enough for me to want to take action yeah so that's why

i use the word for but a hundred percent i'm with you do not use it if it becomes triggering and it makes you want to backtrack now the reason why i recognize it was all my fault is for actually i tell you the story of when it first happened yeah at least it was one of the most beautiful most exciting days of my life. Quest Nutrition had become a billion-dollar company. Tom and I, in days where we were really struggling to build the company, we would go on drives around Beverly Hills, and we would look at all the beautiful houses.

And we would do it. Funny, we would actually even argue about, like, what type of house we would buy. We had, like, a Ford Focus. I still drive a ford focus do you have a hole in your exhaust though that's the no but i've got a uh a broken wing mirror on my left oh my god that's amazing so we i don't love it okay so we had a ford focus there was a hole in the end in the exhaust so it made this like really loud noise and the steering wheel would shake. So this is real fantasy. Like you're nowhere near making the money to have a place at Beverly Hills.

No, no, no. Oh yeah. Total fantasy. This is way before that. Okay. So this is early, early. We literally were, what the hell are we doing? We're in hairnets. We're giving up our lives. We don't see our family anymore. We sacrifice, sacrifice. We're in this full focus that if you go over 60 miles an hour the steering wheel would literally shake like and so we would drive around beverly hills and that would be our motivation so for me i like to have a feeling i can't just like have a dollar number that doesn't appeal to me so i wanted a feeling so i'm a 90s chick so i was like babe i want to get a waterfall and i want to do one of those 90s hip-hop movie like music videos where

I pour like Dom Perignon on my body and I twerk for you like I was like that's the dream right now that's the dream so cut to we finally Chris finally becomes huge we finally get the money we actually buy a house in Beverly Hills it actually has a waterfall I actually have a Dom Perignon bottle in my hand like the dream is freaking real and I'm standing there. I take a gulp of champagne and like that, my gut felt like it erupted. I had no idea what happened. I scrammed. I was like, I didn't want to tell Tom because I didn't want to ruin the occasion. So of course I run and I hide into the bath. I was like, what the hell is going on? Now, let me give you some backstory. Leading up to this, for 15 years, I had a very unhealthy relationship with food. I thought fat was bad.

I thought carbs were bad. I didn't want to get fat because I was so insecure that I tried to stay as skinny as possible. So I basically ate protein and vegetables. And I thought that I wouldn't allow myself to eat certain foods. And so what happens is when you get vegetables and I thought that um I wouldn't allow myself to eat certain foods and so what happens is when you get more and more restrictive as you know 70% of your immune system is carried in your gut I'm like saying that to a doctor so I'm like that is right right um that's what I've been told and so I started getting sick and so every time I was getting sick the doctors were giving me antibiotics. And so I would take them. Now you do that for 15 years.

Right before my gut erupted that last year or two, I was probably on antibiotics three or four times a year. And my gut just got worse and worse. But I was like, oh, it's fine. It's just me, right? How many of us are just like, it's just me. It's just me. I don't need to go to's fine. It's just me, right? How many of us are just like, it's just me. It's just me. I don't need to go to a doctor. It's just me. Well, that day was the most beautiful day

of celebration and the worst day of my life. That was the day that started my entire health journey. After that day, I couldn't stand up for more than five minutes at a time for at least, I couldn't wear a bra. My husband couldn't hug me. I could barely eat anything. I was on a fatty protein diet. So I could just about digest fatty beef, lamb, pork, coconut oil, and salt. If I put a bit of, I put a pepper on my food once, I was in so much agony. Tom almost rushed me to the emergency room. So just to really give people an idea of how bad I was. I mean, my face was just so gaunt and I kept blaming the doctors. I was like, well, these doctors gave me the antibiotics. It's all the doctor's fault. So I was going to the doctors to fix me. So I was literally going to the doctors

like, can I take a pill? Like, what have you got for me what can i do what can i do give me whatever's going to fix me and i just kept saying like fix me fix me now there's one day that is um we've got this like photo shoot going on so this lasted for years the gut issues so i'm on set still dealing with my gut issues never knowing when it's going to flare up or not and i'm on. And all of a sudden I have a massive flare up where it literally like it almost drops me to my knees. I can barely breathe. So I try not to do it in front of the team. I excuse myself. I run upstairs into my bathroom. I fall to the floor on my knees and I'm clutching my stomach. And I'm like, I need my husband to get me. I can't breathe. I need my husband. Now, Tom and I have rules. And the rule is, because we're business partners as well, we have rules.

If I call him three times or if he calls me three times, it means we're calling as a spouse. And that means you have to pick up. It doesn't matter who you're with. It doesn't matter what you're doing. If you're interviewing the President of the United States and I call you three times, you drop what you're doing, you answer the call. That's just the agreement we have. And we've never needed it until this moment. So I call him and I'm like, I need my husband. I'm on the floor. I'm clutching my stomach. Call once, he doesn't answer. I call twice, he doesn't answer.

I'm like, okay, he's going to come and help me the third time. I call him the third time, doesn't answer. And I'm like, oh crap. How the hell am I going to get up? I need my husband. And in that moment, I was like, I don't need him. I want him, but I don't need him. Lisa, you are your own freaking hero. Get the F up because you can save yourself. up because you can save yourself. And that moment, that idea, that mindset turned into every aspect of my life. So when I then looked at my health, I was like, I'm turning to the doctors to save me because I'm blaming them. What if this was actually on me? The doctors didn't force antibiotics down my throat. I swallowed them. When the doctor said, you know what, probably shouldn't give you this many

antibiotics. Not once did I ask why, and not once did I go home and Google what happens if you take too many antibiotics. So here I was blaming the doctors, not taking any ownership over it. And what I realized was the knock-on effect was that I wasn't taking ownership over healing myself. And so now if I just pivot and go, oh my God, this is all my fault. That is beautiful because now I can change. I'm not waiting for someone else to save me. I'm not waiting for someone else to fix me. That changed how I showed up every day. That changed everything about my health. I took full ownership over it. And what that meant was I immediately got out a diary. I bought an

aura ring. I got a continuous glucose monitor and I started to make correlations between how tired I was when I was on paper. I was getting like 10 hours sleep. But when I correlated my continuous glucose monitor with my aura ring i was noticing i was plummeting down into the 40s and my aura ring i could see would disturb my REM sleep so i was like well no wonder i'm tired i'm having these crashes in the middle of the night i don't realize i'm having these crashes it's disturbing my sleep that i don't realize is disturbing my sleep um i think i'm is disturbing my sleep. I think I'm getting 10 hours sleep. I'm waking up exhausted. I have zero brain clarity and I'm forgetful.

And so I started to write down what I ate every single day, what my levels were, how I was sleeping, what my bowel movements were, and how I felt every single day. And I started to make correlations between what was painful, what wasn't, what I could digest, what I couldn't. I took ownership and went and got my own blood panel. I took ownership and got my own hormone panel done. That's how you go from looking outside yourself for someone to come and help you and then saying, looking outside yourself for someone to come and help you and then saying, it is all my fault. I am my own hero. Yeah, it's so powerful.

Firstly, that day, the day where you guys find out you are owning a billion dollar company. And it sounds like there's this bittersweet moment. On one hand, I'm guessing more success and wealth than you could have possibly ever dreamed of. At the same time, in that moment, the complete depths when it comes to your health. Now, as we talk now, looking back on that day, first of all, how long ago was it? And if you can now put yourself there, how does ago was it? And if you can now put yourself there, how does it feel for you looking back?

Before we get back to this week's episode, I just wanted to let you know that I am doing my very first national UK theatre tour. I am planning a really special evening where I share how you can break free from the habits that are holding you back and make meaningful changes in your life that truly last. It is called the Thrive Tour. Be the architect of your health and happiness. So many people tell me that health feels really complicated, but it really doesn't need to be. In my live event, I'm going to simplify health. And together, we're going to learn the skill of happiness, the secrets to optimal health, how to break free from the habits that are holding you back in your life. And I'm going to teach you how to make changes that actually last. Sound good? All you

have to do is go to drchatterjee.com forward slash tour, and I can't wait to see you there. This episode is also brought to you by the Three Question Journal, the journal that I designed and created in partnership with Intelligent Change. Now, journaling is something that I've been recommending to my patients for years. It can help improve sleep, lead to better decision making, and reduce symptoms of anxiety and depression. It's also been shown to decrease emotional stress, make it easier to turn new behaviours into long-term habits, and improve our relationships.

There are, of course, many different ways to journal. And as with most things, it's important that you find the method that works best for you. One method that you may want to consider is the one that I outline in the three-question journal. In it, you will find a really simple and structured way of answering the three most impactful questions I believe that we can all ask ourselves every morning and every evening. Answering these questions will take you less than five minutes, but the practice of answering them regularly will be transformative. Since the journal was published in January, I have received

hundreds of messages from people telling me how much it has helped them and how much more in control of their lives they now feel. Now, if you already have a journal or you don't actually want to buy a journal, that is completely fine. I go through in detail all of the questions within the three-question journal completely free on episode 413 of this podcast. But if you are keen to check it out, all you have to do is go to drchatterjee.com forward slash journal or click on the link in your podcast app. Six years ago. Is that all? Yeah, I still fight. I still have to travel with supplements. I still have to call every restaurant and make sure that they don't use mixed oils because I can't.

Like canola oil just wrecks my gut. I can't have soy. I can't have sesame. So I've identified all the foods. I have to be – I try to make sure that I eat and have peace around me so I can't be in the middle of a business call. peace around me so I can't be in the middle of a business call um I you know like all of these little things of like lifestyle changes that I've made is all because I've had I've identified things along the way that day is the best thing that ever happened to me because of my gut it's so cliche but like if I could like wave a wand that is the day it should have happened. Because I realized on day one, oh, success doesn't buy happiness.

It really doesn't. Like it was like, obviously I'd already done the damage. So in an ideal world, of course, I actually would have realized that before I'd actually done the permanent, not the permanent damage to my gut, but a very, you know, distressed damage to my gut. But I was like, oh, all right, I see it. Now here's, I don't know if you know this, that's what led us to creating Health Theory, Tom's health show. So because we were still at

Quest, we were transitioning, we were moving the studio and we were going all in on content. So we started with Impact Theory and then Tom was just trying to help fix me. And he was like, babe, is your husband? Like, I need to help. I need to help. What can I do? And so he was just reading all these books, all these health books. And so he came across, I think the very first book was Mind-Gut Connection. Yeah. And so he read it and he's like, babe,

I can't believe it. Like, you shouldn't work and eat. It was like one of the, you know, back then it was like, like, oh my God, what? That's a new, I didn't know. Like that lifestyle had made a difference on your health. So like there's a there's a mind-gut connection and he's like but i need to like follow up like there's so many questions there's so many unanswered things in this book and he's like i just need to be able to ask these professionals and then we kind of look at each

other and it's like oh we've got a studio well if we just started a health show and it becomes like, you know, who are you fighting for? You know, it's like, I think it's Mother Teresa that would say like, no, not everyone, no one's going to fight for the masses, but everyone will fight for the one. So it's like, you want to believe my husband's going to fight for me. So when he started the health thing, he's like, oh, I have to fix my wife. And so that's why he was so obsessed with getting health people in and experts in. I didn't know that. It's amazing hearing that. And as I hear that, you know, I'm drawn to my own story, which is my desire to do what I do today,

to learn all the things that I share in this podcast, that I share in my books, all came from a desire to get my son better. Right? So I'm driven by someone close to my life who I want to sort out. That drives me. Tom's driven to get his wife better. That drives him. It's amazing how many people that we know and we see and we like to learn from have got that strong personal motive. So that's powerful to hear. The other thing that I found incredibly powerful from you was that in that moment, you firsthand had arguably one of the most powerful lessons anyone can have, which is success, material wealth does not buy happiness. Because I'm guessing, I don't want to put words in your mouth, so maybe I'll just put the question to you.

Is it fair to say that in that moment, and maybe the following weeks when you are struggling with crippling gut pain and gut symptoms, is it fair to say you would have traded in some of the wealth yeah well so here's the thing it's interesting because as long as i can keep the mindset i have because the the perfect gut wouldn't have taught me so many lessons and so if i traded the money in for a perfect gut like it was those moments was like oh my god this is all my fault that was after two years or so of like freaking trying to figure that things out try different things go to the doctor to the point like i was just blindly listening to the doctors and i wasn't even going back to trusting your gut i had spent the only thing i said was like fatty beef was the

thing that actually ah like i can actually eat it and it not distress me out and I go to a doctor and he was like you shouldn't you've got they did an allergy test and they're like you're allergic to beef you shouldn't eat beef I was like what no that's all I eat he's like you need to eat raw vegetables now I'd spent over a year at this point I can't remember the timeline but I'd spent so long realizing fatty beef was great for me and that vegetables weren't especially raw. And when the doctor said, stop eating beef, eat raw vegetables, what do you think I did? I stopped eating beef, started eating raw vegetables and it wrecked me again. I never listened to my intuition. I never listened to what felt right. Those are the lessons I take with me in relationships now, in business. It's all my fault and trust yourself.

Trust your gut. Yeah. And, you know, I now understand the incredible wisdom that you've packed into Radical Confidence. I understand it better. I understand where it comes from because actually the lessons in that book are really quite profound. And what you said, Lisa, about even now, you're very careful with what you eat and you know you can't be rushing when you eat. This is a big missing piece for me in health and gut symptoms when we simply focus on what

we're eating. How we're eating, I'm finding more and more is arguably as important. And I've come to the conclusion with some of my patients, they're not actually reacting to the foods. They're reacting to the way in which their nervous system is operating whilst they're eating it. When they can relax and chill and not be doing their emails at the same time, they no longer respond to certain foods that they used to. It's really quite profound. So hearing you say that you figure this out for yourself, I find that very, very empowering. Oh, it's literally, I would have thought, if you'd have said this to me three, four years ago, I'd have been like, that's so woo-woo. How does it make a difference on how I digest my food if I'm working? That's such a load of rubbish.

And now I'm the biggest advocate. I'm the biggest advocate. I'm the biggest advocate on self-care. And yet I go hard for my business. And yet taking care of myself is priority number one. So during the quest days, so I was grinding very hard. I was, I felt like I had to work harder than anybody to prove my worth because I didn't feel worthy myself. And so I didn't take time off. I stopped. I love art. I draw. I stopped art. I stopped all the things that I enjoyed because I thought that I had to spend every hour on the business and that's where I was going to get my validation from. So when my gut health just completely deteriorated, I was like, what are all the things? Like, how do I focus back on me, the self-care, the internal?

And so I just, I started to set boundaries. And so one of my boundaries was every Saturday morning, my phone gets switched off. I don't care who you are. You can't reach me. Every Saturday. And what I do is I just draw. Now, here's the thing. Even with my book coming out, it's like the amount of things that come at you as you know how busy you are. I had to sit there and go, Lisa, you're still going to

draw. Now, I take like five, six hours and it's just me. And so first of all, let me actually back up. First of all, so when I first set the boundary, all of my family, all of our of our business everyone was like you can't do that well what are we gonna do if we how we're gonna reach you and said okay let's take one thing at a time if you're part of my business and something goes wrong you've got tom's number if you're my family you live in england there's no speedy drive down the road in three seconds and get there it's a 12-hour journey at least call tom and so but i also got pushed back was like but what if we don't have tom's number from certain people and i was like said with massive love if you don't have you know someone that knows someone that knows someone

that knows tom that couldn't reach me we're not close enough for you to warrant disturbing my self-care and once i stuck to that everyone complained, now this has been like two or three years, the amount of people that will be like, oh, I'm not going to call you on Saturday, Lisa, that's your self-care time. I was so strong and sticking to it. Now, even with my book release, I had to process, Lisa, you put in these six extra hours. You never know. This could be the difference between not a New York Times bestseller and a New York Times bestseller, right? You look at all the hours you have. And in that moment, I said, okay, what do I know? What have I learned over these last six years? It's all your fault. So right now, Lisa, if you choose to let go of your self-care because you prioritize your book,

you've been down this road before. What is going to happen after week one, after week two, after week three, if you keep working and eating at the same time, if you don't take your supplements with you, if you don't take deep breaths before you eat, if you don't make sure that your food is good quality, all these things that take time and energy and focus. If you don't do these things, you know where you will end up. You will be in bed holding your gut for two or three days where you're not good to anybody. So I made a promise to myself that my self-care comes before my book.

And that was a conscious effort that I had to do because I knew my personality. I'm always trying to like, like accept and just acknowledge who I am and who I naturally am and then go, does this serve me? And so I said, I know myself. I know that I'd want to go all in, but that won't actually help me in the long term. So what am I going to do over these next three weeks, right? And I literally just sit there and I just process, okay, I'm about to travel. What does that mean? It means I have to make sure that I've got food for the plane.

It means that I have to make sure I've got my supplements with me. It means I have to have water. It means I have to, right? Like I just lay right like I just lay out and I don't bitch I don't moan I just go this is my life and the most amazing thing is that I learned my lesson six years ago when you know we bought the house and I'm I'm not gonna turn a blind eye to that again yeah it's so powerful what you just shared and I hear I hear this on this show time and time again, that people often say that actually getting sick was actually one of the best things that happened to me because I learned to do this, this, and this. So thank you for sharing that.

The other thing I really liked, and I know you write about boundaries in the book and why they're so important, but I love the fact that you decided on a Saturday, I'm creating this boundary. And it sounds like you played that almost that no BS game again, but a version of it. Like, okay, well, you know, instead of this story, well, what happens? It's like, okay, let's go through it. Let's go through systematically the scenarios that might occur. And then let's tackle them. You know, this, and again, that's a theme that comes up time and time again, this real ability to be rational, not get caught up in the emotions. Actually look at what it really means. And I also love the fact that as you educated the people around you on your boundaries,

initially there's a bit of pushback, week after week month after month year after year things start to change people get your boundaries and I imagine some people probably are like oh man I kind of like Lisa's boundary I I want to do my own boundary like that a hundred percent people they they push back at first right because I think that that becomes a reflection of them and then once someone sticks to it it then becomes oh you can like oh you can actually do that and then it sometimes can give you permission to then do it as well um and so i just think the self-care we don't you know we i know it's so cliche it's so cliche but it's true for a reason all cliches as you get older you're like there's a lot of truth to these cliches. Yeah, there really is. It's like that oxygen mask.

It's like the truth is I won't be good to anyone else if I don't focus and take care of myself first. And so when it came to, yeah, the self-care, it's like no bullshit water to actually take to make sure that you can show up and be strong every day. It's like, oh, I have to have self-care. What does that look like? I have to do, you know, like, and so I think it would be important for people to lay that out and look i understand that not everyone can shut their phone off and the truth is most of the time it's actually for the whole of the saturday the whole of the weekend but like i make sure no matter what that i have my time on saturday mornings and it's like if you if you show up every day and you respect your own boundary other people would do one or

two things they'll either push back and not respect it and then you just know who they are or they'll respect yeah one of the boundaries i put in place maybe four or five years ago with my with my network and particularly my family was that look i'm prioritizing my sleep and i like to go to bed early so that means after 7 7 30 i don't want calls about stuff that i need to do yeah right or um things that need solving or fixing unless it's emergency right because i you know my mom's elderly you know my brother and i help look after mom um so of course for an emergency no problem at all right very happy but for run-of-the-mill stuff, for me personally, I'd like it to wait till the following day because I want to be winding down for bed.

And initially, that was a bit of friction. But now, I can't even remember. I mean, it's just, everyone knows. You don't call wrong enough to seven. You just don't call unless it's something important. And it's amazing how quickly these things can change. There's a few more things I wanted to talk about. I know I sort of hinted before about some of these stories in the book. Of course, people can get the book to read them all. One in particular I liked was when Gary Vaynerchuk sent you and Tom an email and invited you to an event that he was running. So maybe explain who Gary Venchick is in case anyone listening or watching doesn't know. And Bea, I'll tell you from my

perspective, Lisa, I was shocked to read it in a really nice way. I was like, oh, Lisa's super successful. Her and Tom are this like power couple. of course Gary's invited them both to this thing how why on earth was Lisa feeling insecure about that really really powerful perhaps you could elaborate thank you yeah so Gary Vee is like one of the big I don't even know what you would how you would describe the biggest entrepreneur on the planet the biggest social entrepreneur I'm not even sure but he's just an incredible human and he invited tom and i he sends this email and invites us and before i can even respond like i was like oh yeah i'd love to go tom emails back no sorry i can't come oh man and i was like what he did ask both of us like is it rude if i just like ask if i can go

and so i was unsure so yeah i go to tom normally we like bounce things off so can i just clarify that you assumed that the invite was really for Tom, I think. Yes, yes. Even though it said, dear Tom and Lisa. So is that an insecurity, do you think? No, they had worked together. Now look, I, well, so here's the thing. I say they, we, we had worked with him before,

but because I was behind the scenes, I was never in front of the camera at all. So I was definitely behind the scenes and not very well known. So everyone knew who Tom was, but people were like, oh, you've got a wife? Oh, she runs your business. It was kind of not that bad, but it was kind of like that. So he kind of knew me. I'd met him a few times, but it was definitely like people thought Tom was front and center. So I don't think that that was insecurity, but asking him whether I could come

and did he really mean me or not was definitely an insecurity. So I went to Tom and I basically, you know, we're each other's soundboard. So I was like, babe, what do you think? Is it inappropriate for me to ask? And that part of you is just like, I really did hope he'd be like, yeah, babe, you shouldn't ask. Because it was that get out of jail free card if I, you know, didn't ask. But he's like, no, of course you should ask. And I was like, okay, damn it.

Now I actually have to ask him. But even just asking, putting yourself out there, I was petrified. And I was, you know, and I talk about in the book how the fear of hearing no, like I really did think that that was an echo of who, that would be a reflection of me. So if someone says no to me, it means I'm no good. I'm not valuable. I'm not worthy to come to his party. And how many of us think that that's what no means to us? And so many of us do. And so I was like, okay, well, at least there'll be over email. At least he doesn't see my face. And if you never ask, the answer will always be no. So I told myself that, okay, well, at least I need to ask because I know where it gets me if I don't ask, just where I am right now.

So I put this email together. I must've read it, dude, like 30 times. I was like, do I put an emoji? Do I put a dot, dot, dot? Do I put a smiley face? That's how insecure I was. Finally, I'm like, okay, just press the bloody send. So I press the send button. I'm waiting on waiting. Then he says, yes. So he emails back and he's like, of course. I was like, oh my God, that's so nice.

And then it dawned on me, oh crap. I actually have to go to the event by myself now. So it was like the hurdle that I was so worried about just asking that I couldn't even see past the next hurdle. So that's when the realization came that I've had massive gut issues, massive gut issues. And this was like at the height of it. So I'm like, I've got these gut issues and I'm going by myself to an event where I don't know anybody. Oh, God, what if something happens?

And that fear, right, that flooding of everything coming i'm not capable and i was like okay going back to the like the logic of just like take one thing at a time because you said it and i didn't want to interrupt you but the reason why i'm so logical is because i can get so taken away by my emotions so i'm that's like the antidote to me being very emotional and so i recognize that if i just let my emotions take me away i would never show up to anything i would be so like scared and embarrassed and shameful and everything that comes with you know anything trying anything new or anything like that. And so I need logic to pull me out of my emotion and show me a path. Because as long as I have a path, if I have a step-by-step, no matter how I feel about myself, I can still follow the steps.

Yeah. But if I don't have a step-by-step, I'm just going to get trapped in my emotions. So even with Gary Vee, I was like, oh my God, I can't believe I'm going to go by myself. And it's like, all right, just pause. Come up with a game plan. What are you actually worried about? Well, I'm worried if I have a health flare up in the middle of the event and I'm by myself. And it's like, okay, well, what would I do if I was with Tom? I'd still have to leave the place. So all I need to do now is just identify the exits, right? Identify the closest restrooms. Identify, okay, if I eat something unusual, it may come on unexpected. All right, Lisa, so don't bloody eat anything unusual.

Well, hang on a minute. How am I not going to eat anything unusual? Take food with you in a cooler. Okay. So literally, I packed a whole cooler. I put packs in there. I took enough food for like two days. And so I just like literally took each thing that I was worried about, each thing that

I was insecure about. And that's what radical confidence is. That's why I wrote the book. Because people may go, but you turn, oh my God, I thought you were so confident because you went to the Gary V event. Why yourself? And the truth is it has zero to do with confidence, but it had everything to do with radical confidence. I took all my insecurities, all the fears that I had.

I identified them one by one. I created a game plan that would have something for me to go to if and when that happened. And then my anxiety starts to lower. I start to feel more confident about just walking into the room. And so now I just identified all these little things. I was able to take steps forward yeah if you don't ask the answer is always going to be no yeah such a powerful lesson isn't it oh my god i mean i could keep going on about the word no on just like i could tell you actually

if we have i don't know how we're doing on time but I would love this is a long form chat you go where you want so um I learned a very powerful lesson with the word no um Maria Menounos I don't know if you know who she is only from reading your book actually yeah so yes she's um she television host growing up I was in such admiration of her I come to America we've now got Impact Theory, the show. I've got Women of Impact. I hear that she's doing interviews. So I reach out. I was like, you've got to get Maria to my team. I was like, you've got to get her on the show. So we reach out and she says no. Now in that moment where she says no, I can take it as being

a dent to my, like about me. Now here's's the thing it is a little about me because if oprah asked her to do an interview do you think that she said would have said no so there's moments where how transparent honest can you be with yourself yeah and do you let that den your ego and derail you from your goal so when she said no and i was like okay is you was like, okay, it may not be just about me, right? I can't just take it about I'm a bad person. But if Oprah was to ask, the chances are she would say yes. Okay. This is the honesty piece, isn't it?

This is the honesty piece, yeah. Because you could just go down the routes. Oh, you know, she doesn't get it. She doesn't, you know, whatever story we might want to say. But actually, yeah, if Oprah asked her I'm sure they would have got a yes reply straight away so there's a real honesty there is because the first thing that came to mind was Lisa it's not about you and I'm like well hang on a minute what if it is about me like I can't learn by just saying it's not about you it's not about who you are but it's

about you yeah it's not about me as a human but it absolutely is maybe where I am in my hosting career yeah so I just said that the chances are Oprah she wouldn't say no to Oprah so instead of letting that dent my ego I just say like one of my favorite um quotes of all time Steve Martin of all people the comedian be so good they can't ignore you and in that moment I wasn't good enough which is why I was being ignored. But that's okay. Like, I don't say, well, that means that you're a bad human, Lisa. No, I can get good. And so I said, all right, Maria Menounos, I'm going to get so good that you can't ignore me. And that means practice. That means practice your craft. Get so freaking good at what you do.

And so in that moment, I was like, all right, I'm not going to let, I'm coming. I literally was like, I'm coming for you, Maria. And so I spent the next year, I like to say wax on wax off like the karate kid, right? So like I was just practicing. I was getting good. I was like refining my skills. And then eventually it turned out she was doing a podcast and she um had connections so we got invited me and tom i was like now's my chance now's the chance to blow her away even though she was interviewing me and tom i was like now's your chance lisa be so good yeah so i went on the interview and i was like i was like oh my god i love you like she was greek and so i was like i was greek

too you're giving me you know like you gave me a lot of motivation thank you for always showing up anyway by the end of it we got along really. I told my team to hit her up again, ask her to come on my show immediately after. And I got a yes. Now that was a year period. She found out, realized who we were. We got to me. We had this connection. And then she looked into my stuff. And now here's the last part. We became good friends. And there's one night that we're just hanging out, just us two. And it was like, I can't remember after a long party. And so we were just like so tired. And so I was just like, you know what, Maria, you know, you said no to me the first time. She was like, what do you mean?

I was like, I reached out to you. My team reached out to you to ask you to come on my show. And you said no. She's like, I can't believe. No, I didn't say no. I was like, yes, you did. So when was it? So we calculate the dates. And we realized when I reached out to her to ask her, she had told her team to say no to all interviews because her mom had stage four brain cancer and she had just been diagnosed with a brain tumor. So she finds out her mom's got stage four cancer. She's dealing with that. A few months later, she then finds out she's got a brain tumor. She immediately tells her team, I'm not paying attention to work. So any new things that I haven't committed to say no. So now you can imagine I've told myself this story about what it meant about me. Now, luckily,

the story I told myself was empowering. So it meant about me. Now, luckily the story I told myself was empowering. So it kept me going, but imagine somebody else who is insecure, that old Lisa, I definitely would have taken that about me and would have felt this means I'm no good. So I wouldn't have tried to progress. I would have taken that as a, you know, a fact about me. And then I don't know, you know, would I have continued my craft? I don't know. Yeah. That's the power in that story for me. A,

there was a real honesty at the start. B, you used it as a way to improve yourself. I go, no, all right. Okay. I'm not good enough yet.

I'm going to, I'm going to keep practicing. But then that, that end piece of the story is beautiful because the whole thing was a story actually, in the sense that she never said no in the first place. She never even saw it, you know? And as you say, if you have that, you know, self-defeating, disempowering narrative, people can give up on a story of something that may or may not have happened. And, you know, that's the other thing when I think about the things I learned when I watch you and Tom talk about your relationship,

And the things I learned when I watch you and Tom talk about your relationship, there's no BS. There's no kind of, you know, this is one of the things, you know, I've been married now for 14 years, over 14 years. And I'm incredibly happily married. And I would say that, you know, I would say that we're as happy and contented as we've ever been. That doesn't mean we weren't in the past, but it gets better and better with each year. Yeah. As you become more transparent, as you, I think, I don't know what your view on this is, I think it's a lot of the things

that get people stuck in relationships is unmet expectations and desires that have never been expressed. That we think our partner should know that this is how they should behave because that's based on our experience and our childhood, but we never expressed it. So we start getting annoyed with stuff that hasn't happened, but your partner doesn't even know that that's your expectation in the first place. And it comes down to communication, of course, but what's your expectation in the first place and you know it comes down to communication of course but what what is it what what's your take on that a hundred percent even now tom and i talk about base assumptions like even now we're about to celebrate our 20 year wedding anniversary

congratulations thank you in like a month i know i'm so excited so and so even now when have we been together this long we still have absolutely miscommunication. We bicker. I mean, it's like I want to make sure people never think that we have a perfect relationship. And that is why it's so powerful, right, is that you navigate these moments. You navigate these things. And so when we're not communicating, it's like you're arguing like, but I don't get it. And then we always go, what's your base assumption?

And then as soon as you end up realizing what someone's base assumption, you're like, oh. So your base assumption, no wonder you think I'm nuts. If you come with this base assumption, you think that this is the reason. Any act that I do after that is going to seem crazy to you because you have a different base assumption than I do. So if you can communicate and not judge each other, right? There's no right, there's no wrong, which I used to do. I was like, I can't believe you do that. And it's like, hang on, I just passed judgment on him. That's so cruel. That becomes like the bickering that then becomes a fracture in your relationship.

And so for me and Tom, it is always about what is the base assumption you have right now on this thing? And do I agree with your base assumption you have right now on this thing? And do I agree with your base assumption? Because it comes to language. Like even with like Tom and I, we joke about it, but we should have our own little dictionary. Because we say like, okay, if you use the word important, like literally I could call Tom right now and I'd be like, babe, this is important. If I said, babe, this is important, you have to come to England. He wouldn't even let me finish the word England. He'd be on the way in his car to get a flight because I've said the word important. Now I say that word important maybe two or three times a year

because we both need to know that when I really need him, no questions asked, what is that word we're going to use it's like the three phone call rule right it's like you have to be on the same page of the language you're using and the behavior like even when you're working with your partner it was so tough because tom works 120 hours a week i mean he's insane i can't my health i just can't work that much i don't want to work that much so it got to a point where we were bickering because he kept asking me questions when i'm in my self-care time yeah and i'd be switched off in the evening and he'd still be going so he'd walk in the room and he's like babe i need to ask you and i'm like i'm trying to relax but it's just a quick question right my wife produces the show oh my god perfect so uh this is

there's a lot here that's ringing true okay so now So now I go, we just keep bickering. And now it's just, we have different behaviors. So what are the things that we're going to agree on, whether it's words or behavior that we can acknowledge that is communicating to each other in certain moments. So for instance, I said to him, you work way long more than I do. I need you to stop coming to me when I'm in my self-care time. And he's like, but how do. I need you to stop coming to me when I'm in my self-care time. And he's like, but how do I know when you're self-care? When you work from your house,

how do you know when self-care time ends and begins? And so I said, okay, have you ever been to a Brazilian restaurant? And I'm actually asking you, yeah, have you been to a Brazilian restaurant? I think once. Okay. You have these little things where it says meat, no meat. Oh yeah. And so it's like, if they're meat, they come up to your table if you know me they leave you alone I was like oh let's do something like that so babe when I'm relaxing I'm gonna have a signal so that when you walk in the room you don't even have to say words you can just see if I'm working or not so I did a lamp and so I was like when I've switched off for work and I'm now in my self-care time, I will switch the lamp on. So when you see the lamp when you walk in the room, that means it's self-care. The very next day he walks in the room and he's like, hey, babe, love you.

And he sees the lamp on, walks out. I love that. You put a lamp on. That's just so fantastic. So it's like, right? Things like that. It seems so simple. right things like that it seems so simple it's this thing that if we didn't have that conversation and come up with a strategy we may still be at each other's like like you know it's about agreeing

mutually agreeing rules being transparent having the conversation the lamp works for you it may not for someone else but there will be their version of that and as you said the word important I thought of you know Aesop's fable and Crying Wolf. And, you know, I think it's very powerful there because if you use important every day, oh, this is important, this is important, this is important. Then when it really is important, that word has very little value. Whereas you've agreed together, and that's key, isn't it? That you both agreed to this, you both signed up, this is our agreement. When I i use the word important it really is important i think that's really powerful we'll even stop and be like this is i don't know if it's important

let me have a think i'll get back to you and that's literally what we'll do like i'll get back to you if i actually want to use this word because to your point you can't overuse it and everything comes out with time, right? So it's like if someone's going to abuse the word, that will come out in time. If someone is going to respect the word, that will come out in time. And then if you just going back to what we said earlier, if you truly, really have the same goal, successful, happy marriage for the rest of your life and you both agree on it and you both want each other to win you then sit down when you find yourself having these like head to

head and you're like okay this isn't working yeah like do you agree this isn't working i agree this isn't working okay now we both agreed do we both agree we need a new strategy yes okay what strategy is it and then we just like fumble the light thing was like after maybe a couple of other things where i'm just like babe i've told you but please don't right it becomes a that ended up being the strategy that worked but we don't give up we don't just whoa that didn't work so forget it um we don't ever just throw our hands in the air either so like these little things are just like oh we've got the same goal so yeah of course we're going to be aligned in trying a technique together yeah oh lisa i love it i've so enjoyed talking to you i don't think i've even covered a fraction of the things that i wanted to but

there's a lot more golden wisdom in the book radical confidence 10 no bs lessons of becoming the hero of your own life lisa to finish finish off this podcast, it's called Feel Better Live More. When we feel better in ourselves, we get more out of our life. Of course, you know that firsthand from suffering with debilitating gut issues for many, many years. Given everything we've spoken about, given everything you talk about on your show, everything you've written about in this book, I always like to leave the listeners, the viewers with some practical things that they can think about doing. The people who feel inspired by what they've heard, who think, yeah, you know what, Lisa, you're giving me confidence to go out there

and go after my dreams or do something differently in my life compared to how I do it now. What are some of your final words? I think you actually need to be so concrete on what you're trying to achieve. Like if I want to live my dream, what does that dream look like? What is that actually? So even if you say, I want to impact people, you can do that in so many different ways. It may be hard to know exactly what a North Star is, right? So it's like impact how, impact who. So for me, it's about taking that end goal, taking that mission, making it one or two sentences,

because once you have that, I promise you, anytime you try anything, you're gonna fail, you're gonna fall, you're gonna have obstacles. So how do you know, how can you align yourself that you keep getting back up so that when times are tough, right? When you stop believing yourself, let's say they've listened to this, they feel really motivated.

This isn't going to last, right? We all know as much as we wish it would, it won't last. Your motivation won't be there all the time. So how do you keep showing up even when you don't feel good enough, even when you don't feel like it? You have to tie your idea and what you're trying to do to a goal and a mission. And you have to be so succinct in the mission that you know where to pivot and where not to. So for me, it's not just I want to create impact, it's I want to create content that impacts 14-year-old girls to believe

in themselves so they don't spend the next 20 years like I did having to unwire their negative mindset. Now, I've become so tied to my mission, that's how I can say it so succinctly, because I need the what to create content, the who, the 14-year-old girl, and the why so they don't spend their 20 years having to unwire a negative mindset like I do. Now, having my why, having my mission and my goal, now every day when I don't feel motivated, when I don't necessarily feel good enough, I just remind myself of what I'm trying to do. And then I give myself the grace to show up that day in a way that aligns with how I feel, moving towards that. Sometimes it's a toe. Sometimes it's a big giant step. Sometimes it's a leap, but not every

day is going to be the same. But having that North Star so clear is where I believe everyone needs to start. So empowering. So inspiring, Lisa. I have loved talking to you i really really have i think you're doing incredible things the book's great it's going to help so many people thank you for coming on the show i hope we get a chance to do this again at some point yeah you get to chat with a hubby i've just been glad that i get to hang out with you yeah it's been brilliant thank you so much. Thank you. Really hope you enjoyed that conversation. As always, do have a think about one thing that you can take away from that conversation

and start applying into your own life. Thank you so much for listening. Have a wonderful week. Always remember, you are the architect of your own health. Making lifestyle changes always worth it. Because when you feel better, you live more.