Finding Mastery with Dr. Michael Gervais - Jake Olson, Speaker, Entrepreneur, and Athlete

Episode Date: May 15, 2019

This week’s conversation is with Jake Olson, an entrepreneur, athlete, speaker and most recently a graduate at the University of Southern California.When Jake was 8 months old, he was diagnosed with a rare form of eye cancer, retinoblastoma. The disease claimed his left eye at 10 months old and in November 2009, Jake lost his right eye after battling the cancer for 12 years.He has used his experience to inspire and motivate others by authoring two books, creating a non-profit foundation to help visually impaired children and support cancer research and by sharing his story openly as a motivational speaker.Jake is also a life-long USC football fan.While in high school he learned to long snap and was the starting long snapper for his team his junior and senior year.After being accepted to USC, he was offered a walk on spot with the USC football team and had his first opportunity to snap in a live collegiate game on September 2, 2017 and was named the Pac-12 special teams player of the week.On May 19, he’ll be participating in the 7th Annual Tour de Pier in Manhattan Beach, raising money for cancer research around the globe and psycho-social support for families battling the disease in the South Bay.You can learn more at TourdePier.com._________________Subscribe to our Youtube Channel for more powerful conversations at the intersection of high performance, leadership, and meaning: https://www.youtube.com/c/FindingMasteryGet exclusive discounts and support our amazing sponsors! Go to: https://findingmastery.com/sponsors/Subscribe to the Finding Mastery newsletter for weekly high performance insights: https://www.findingmastery.com/newsletter Download Dr. Mike's Morning Mindset Routine! https://www.findingmastery.com/morningmindsetFollow us on Instagram, LinkedIn, and X.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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and that's where I never lose sight of that. All right, welcome back, or welcome to the Finding Mastery Podcast. I'm Michael Gervais. And by trade and training, I'm a sport and performance psychologist, as well as the co-founder of Compete to Create. And the whole idea behind these conversations is to learn from people who are on the path of mastery. And who are they? Those are people who have dedicated their life to both craft and self to understand the nuances of those two. And in these conversations, we want to dig to understand their psychological framework, which is how they understand themselves

in the world, how they explain events. And then we want to understand the mental skills that they use to build and refine their craft. Finding Mastery is brought to you by LinkedIn Sales Solutions. In any high-performing environment that I've been part of, from elite teams to executive boardrooms, one thing holds true tools, the right information at the right time. And that's where LinkedIn Sales Navigator can come in. It's a tool designed specifically for thoughtful sales professionals, helping you find the right people that are ready to engage, track key account changes, and connect with key decision makers more effectively. It surfaces real-time signals, like when someone changes jobs or when an account becomes high priority, so that you can reach out at exactly the right moment with context

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with something seamless, I'd love for you to go check them out. Get a free variety pack, a $25 value, and 10% off for life when you head to davidprotein.com slash findingmastery. That's David, D-A-V-I-D, protein, P-R-O-T-E-I-N.com slash finding mastery. Okay, this week's conversation is with Jake Olson.

He's an entrepreneur, an athlete, a speaker, and most recently, a graduate of the University of Southern California. He's young, but his insights are rich. When Jake was eight months old, he was diagnosed with a rare form of eye cancer, retinoblastoma. The disease claimed his left eye at 10 months old. And in November of 2009, Jake lost his other eye, battling cancer for 12 years. So he once had sight and now he doesn't. He's earned the right to understand the point of view of what it takes to adjust and adapt. And not only is he motivating thousands of people by the authoring of two books and creating a nonprofit foundation to help visually impaired children, and he also supports cancer research by sharing his story openly as a motivational speaker. Like, this is

an incredible story only met by an incredible man. Now, on the lighter side of things, he's also a lifelong USC football fan. Now, this is where it gets really fun for him. While in high school, he learned to long snap. And that's a very specialized position on the football field. It's the person who snaps the ball long distance between their legs to the punter or the kicker. And eventually he became a starter for his team, his junior and senior year. And then after being accepted to USC, he was offered a walk-on spot with the USC football team. And that was all done with this deep relationship he has with head coach Pete Carroll. And then he had his first opportunity to snap in a live collegiate game on September 2nd

of 2017. And he was named the Pac-12 special teams player of the week. Incredible. So as we pull up to current time on May 19th, he'll be participating in the seventh annual Tour de Pyr, and that's going to be held in Manhattan Beach. And the organization raises money for cancer research and the psychological and social support for families battling the disease. And so you can learn more about Tour de Pyr at tourdepyr.com. So with that, let's jump right into this week's conversation with Jake Olson. Jake, how are you? I'm good, Michael.

Thanks for having me. Are you kidding me? Like, you know what's really cool about this is that I think I've seen you, we've shook hands, I don't know, 25 times, something like that. We've got a lot of friends in common, but we don't know each other. Yeah, yeah. Right? So obviously, let's start with one of our mutual

friends coach carol yes yeah let's start there tell me about your relationship with coach carol well coach carol obviously is a a man that i know he calls me his favorite person his hero but honestly he's one of mine as well growing up up in Southern California in the early 2000s, I was hard not to be a Trojan fan. You know, it was just the dominance that they exhibited in that era was, I guess, well, now it's been paralleled by Alabama, but at the time it just was, you know, here's this team that no one can really keep up with. And so I really was a huge Trojan fan.

And then when I was 12 and obviously went through my surgery and what was going on and me losing my eyesight, Coach Carroll invited me up to a practice just because he heard my story and wanted to do something special. It wasn't through some Make-A-Wish program. It wasn't through some other program. It wasn't because he was getting publicity from it, whatever. It was just honestly out of the graciousness of his heart. And so he invites myself, as well as my family, up to a

practice. And little did we know he had much more in store than just a practice. And that was just taking me under his wing, whole team taking again my family as well under under their wing and just loving us up you know just being there for us giving us an experience of a lifetime let us enjoy the game of football um in a much more personal sense than you know just watching it on tv on saturdays and it just was a very very special time to be with that team you know it was it was a a lot of special guys i'm very close with still but i think more importantly than just having that fun experience again just being with the team and my heroes when even facing the reality of going blind was just

being around a guy like carol who as you know as well as i do michael is just someone who kind of has that positive outlook on life um who you know understands that as I do Michael is just someone who kind of has that positive outlook on life who you know understands that there's there's challenges but never lets those challenges dictate then you know how he moves on and and becomes a better coach or becomes a better team because of it you know he understands that there's roadblocks and again things might always break your way, but to keep pushing forward to never give up, to always compete. And that was something that again, as a 12 year old, being able to hear that when I'm going through a life altering challenge,

to see someone with that attitude and again, more than words, but his actions to kind of replicate that really didn't motivate me as a 12 year old to move forward through blindness. Okay. So you were born with sight. Yes. And then what was the first age you received information that you were struggling with one of your eyes? Well, it was when I was eight months old, so I don't remember it. But my parents remember, you know, seeing some kind of glow in my eye and then you know a month a couple month process of continuing to go to the doctor and the doctor saying no nothing's wrong nothing's

wrong and then keep going back no something's wrong no nothing's wrong nothing's wrong finally my mom's like turn off the lights and look in his eye because something's wrong and sure enough the doctor did that and she goes oh yeah well there's actually something here go to see an optometrist and then we go see an optometrist she looks in my eyes right away and she goes you know oh dear and then she pretty much draws a circle two circles on a piece of paper for my mom and completely colors one in which is my left eye and then colors my right eye with the other circle about half in she goes here's your baby's eyes. This one is full of cancer. That one's half as full of cancer. And so immediately had to go up to CHLA.

My doctor who saw me throughout my childhood, Dr. Lynn Murphy, he was on vacation. He flew home from vacation. And so basically it was just a whirlwind. Again, I don't remember it. I was too young. But a whirlwind of obviously my parents being thrown into this chaos of now your baby child has cancer that, again, was life-threatening. They didn't know. I mean, again, it had completely taken over my left eye. It was big enough to see that glow in my eye was actually the reflection of the tumor. And the light would go in there.

It was reflecting off. It was in my retinas. It was reflecting off um the light so that's what they were seeing so you know it was it was definitely there and they didn't know if it had spread they didn't know where it was um if you know it was too late already so i mean there was a lot of chaos in the beginning and then obviously they um they they had to remove my left eye. Just even chemo radiation was not going to be able to cure it. So they removed my left eye in order for it not to spread. But again, only half as bad as my right eye. So they were able to save my right eye with some chemo and laser treatment.

And then from there, the first time I really remember being different or there's something, obviously, I'm doing that other kids aren't, was leaving my kindergarten graduation. I remember I was leaving my graduation early and my mom was breaking down in the parking lot. She was crying and she's like, this isn't fair. I didn't really understand what that meant. I'm like, you know, what do you mean it isn't fair? She's like, well, you know, you shouldn't have to do this. I'm like's like, this isn't fair. I didn't really understood what that meant. I'm like, you know what? Even when he does it fair, she's like, well, you know, you, you shouldn't have to do this. I'm like, well, I don't understand. But we were, we're going to go receive chemo up in, uh, up in CH, CHLA. I guess my cancer had come back. So that was really kind of the first time I really realized something was wrong. And then, you know, um, from there,

it was just, you realized it because your mom, you saw your mom upset. So that's, that was the context. Yes. Yes. It wasn't, if I hear it right, it wasn't dramatic for you up until that point having one eye. No, no. I mean, you know, limited in your other eye. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, obviously depending on what we're doing with my right eye, you know, I wore pretty thick glasses and, you know, I could see better than others. I remember kindergarten, you know, again, you don't really realize you can't see, than others I remember kindergarten you know again you don't really realize you can't see out of I guess one eye when you're when you're that little but I remember kindergarten we're playing uh kickball and on the playground and again I don't have my left eye so I don't have peripheral vision on my left eye and I remember seeing this ball being kicked over my head so I'm you know full sprinting to go try to catch it and you know I was looking kind of over my right shoulder to catch it, you know, the ball was coming over my shoulder and I just, you know, on my left,

I didn't see it. I was running towards a pole and just smacked into a pole. And yeah, I bruised up, bruised up some things. Um, I remember bruising, uh, hitting, hitting a certain part of my body part really hard that would not feel too good. Um, okay. So did you, you didn't have like bumpers around you. So you had limited eyesight, you know, uh, on one side and on the other as well, but your parents didn't put bumpers around your guardrails to make you safe. They didn't, they didn't hover. Have you heard of Zamboni parenting by the way? No. Okay. So you've heard of helicopter parenting, right? Like making sure you're hovering over. And then Zamboni parenting is this concept where they get out ahead of you on a Zamboni. So the Zamboni is what clears the ice.

Yes, right. Makes it really smooth. Okay. So you didn't have Zamboni parents either, that they smoothed out the stuff in front of you. No, it was, you know, I think for my parents, I mean, obviously, so I only have a twin sister. So it's Emma and me. And so, you know, this is their first time going through it as well. You know, it's their first time parenting and then to throw in that your baby has cancer.

I mean. What's the name of the cancer? Retinoblastoma. Okay. So for them, you know, I can't, I don't want to imagine the pain they went through. I can't imagine the pain they went through. It's easy for me or easier for me just because I'm the one who has it. I can kind of dictate my future and stuff.

But for them, obviously, they're kind of more out of control than I am in the sense that it's their child that has it. They don't know how I'm going to react. They don't know how I'm going to live or survive. I remember the first Christmas I ever spent was in a hospital. I was sick. They put a port-a-cath in me and stuff and so I was getting sick and it was like this I think it's called like a rotavirus or something but I was like going around and everything and so I'm in this hospital sick they're like having me quarantined I'm just in there I'm not getting any better

and my mom at the time was like in there with me again over Christmas and stuff and she goes like I was scared like you weren't going to make it because you just weren't getting better and you're just in this hospital and all these other sick kids are coming in and stuff and she's like she pulled me out like she literally took me home because she's like if I don't get you out of here you're never you're not going to come out like you're just not going to survive so you know I nine months old at the time, and she took me out just because she's like, my baby needs to be someone. I can get him better. Whatever is happening here is not getting him better. So again, stuff like that where they were kind of, I'm sure, wishing they had a Zamboni in front of them.

So I don't think they knew how to even clear it just because a was a lot of it was just kind of chaos and doing things that again, I don't think many people, especially most parents would ever imagine they're doing with their baby. In a word, and this is an unfair question I'm going to ask you, right? But just right now, thin slice of time in a word, when you think of your mom what word comes up i mean you're editing come on no i cliche i would say love i mean okay okay that's all right that's no cliche about the one of the most powerful words yeah no i know i did i mean you know there's many times now put a tone put a tone to it like like what kind of love well it's it's it's a i guess it's a strong love in the sense that not strong as in i mean obviously she loves me unconditionally more than anything but i mean strong as in you know when you're

sitting there again as i don't want i don't want to imagine this because it just, to be honest, it's, it's too sad, but I mean, to be sitting there and you have this baby and, you know, I'm not, I'm not a parent, so I don't know really what it's like to hold, you know, your, your offspring, but to hold a baby and, you know, to see how, and this is what she explains, you see how innocent this child is to see how much you love it and how much you want to protect it and then know there's something inside of it growing and that's threatening that baby's life and you really have no control that i that's just something i don't want to imagine um it's it's scary and all you can do is sit there and love your child and be next to it in the hospital and next to it in the bed and that's what she did

i mean my dad did as well but you know obviously um more times than not was my mom because my dad had to continue to work and provide for the family but you know my mom did too but my mom has had more time off but she you know was next to me in the hospital bed all the time she was there with me every single day trying to watch me throw up my guts because the chemo was making me sick, you know, and trying to see what, what, whatever food I could eat, you know, and it just was, there was a lot of difficult times, but she was strong in that, you know, she wasn't breaking down and wondering, you know, why her child had to do this. It was more just always loving me and taking care of me and making sure, you know, I was comfortable and doctors were doing what they're supposed to do. She obviously hadn't, you know, her opinions on

what they should be doing and what was safe for me researching how to keep me healthy, giving me supplements that kept my immune system good, you know, just like anything she could. She's a chiropractor, so she's a little holistic, but like, you know, she, she just wanted to help me in any way. And that's something that, again, with, can imagine your baby going through that, that could drive you crazy. But she didn't let it drive her crazy. She just wanted to take care of me. And your dad, in a word? My dad, in a word?

Well, my dad, in a a word would be integrity. I say my dad is one of the most integrous guys I know in the sense that he really, again, he could be the last guy on this earth and no one would be around. And he would just do whatever he sees fit is right. So, you know, my dad is a very supportive guy. That's the word I would use with kind of me is supportive in the sense that when I'd be going blind, he always, you know, make sure he was there for me and going through cancer, he'd make sure he was there for me, you know, he was, he would show up, you know, for the bigger hospital days of, you know, going through surgery or something. But when my dad's really become a lot supportive is just in this kind of aftermath of going blind you know from golf golf is a huge part of my life and you know he pushes me harder in the game of golf than I could probably push

myself and making me practice and wanting to see me out there I mean I think he kind of finds more joy in the in the fact that when I play good golf and I think he ever found in his own game and I think that's that's just where you know I think that's really where true support and love is and kind of it's I'm his project is just as much as my game as my project and so that's that's fun and obviously football as well and helping me become a snapper and you know practice snapping So my dad definitely has acted as a huge supporter and never letting, as you say, that Zamboni parents, my dad never was like, okay, Jake, of course you can't make that golf shot. You can't see or of course, you know, you're going to miss that shot because you can't

see. It's like, no, he's like, I've seen you make that shot before. You can make that shot. Why the hell did you make that shot because you can't see. It's like, no, he's like, I've seen you make that shot before. You can make that shot. Why the hell did you make that shot? Finding Mastery is brought to you by Momentous. When it comes to high performance, whether you're leading a team, raising a family, pushing physical limits, or simply trying to be better today than you were yesterday. What you put in your body matters. And that's why I trust Momentus. From the moment I sat down with Jeff Byers, their co-founder and CEO, I could tell this was not your average supplement company.

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Just head to FelixGray.com and use the code FindingMastery20 at checkout. Again, that's Felix Gray. You spell it F-E-L-I-X-G-R-A-Y.com and use the code FindingMastery20 at FelixGray.com for 20% off. Okay, Jake. I mean, it's the obvious question, but how does a blind man golf? Seriously, like, it sounds like a, like two men or three people walked into a bar or something, like it's a bad joke or something, but how do you do it? Well, mechanically, right? Right, right. Well, so, you know, first it was, I mean, first when, after I went blind, it was just making a solid contact with the ball. I don't care where the ball went. It was just, okay, wait. Yeah. That's actually important. So you got, did you golf before? Yeah. So I was a big golfer before my dad. So my dad was a big

golfer. And as I grew up, obviously I was only 12 when I was, when I went blind. So up to that point, I golfed as much as I wanted to, you know, as, as a little kid, you kind of go out there and you play maybe every other month or so. And you'd go to the range and like, a little kid, you kind of go out there and you play maybe every other month or so and you go to the range and like as a kid, you kind of have fun with it. You're not taking it like very seriously. But I remember right around 11 and 12, I did start taking it a little seriously. I did start actually kind of paying attention to how I practiced, making swing adjustments, getting lessons. And then obviously you throw the throw the the wrench in there of going blind and then kind of goes out the window of all the little things you're working on with your coach it's like okay well now i can't make contact with

the ball anymore so first it was again just making contact with the ball i don't care if it went out the hosel or the toe it was just swinging and hitting the ball every single time and then it was building that swing up to where what should be a good swing. The problem also was that I was 12, so I had a lot growing still, and I'm 6'4". So when I was 12, I was probably 5'6", 5'7". So in the next year or two, I grew about six inches. I went from 5'6", 5'7", to my freshman year of high school where I was like 6'6", 1". Even people that have sight, when they don't know where their fingertips are you know because they're growing so fast like kinesthetically it's a challenging awkward phase all right so

but the problem is you know here i have this golf swing now that's like fit for a 5 6 12 year old so i you know my golf swing without getting too technical you know really around my body was was not a swing that i could really produce good shots with and so it was just breaking that down even if I had eyes I'd have to break that down and figure out a golf swing so now you're you're breaking down this golf swing meant for a 5, 6, 12 year old and trying to get you know to to fit my body again and then also now I can't see the ball while trying to fix my swing which how many clubs you break I didn't break I didn't break many clubs but come on no i i didn't i didn't break many clubs but what was frustrating was and maybe it's a maybe maybe it is a benefit i mean i've learned so much about a golf swing in my golf swing i think it's it's it's really

benefited me but when you're learning to swing you know other people have the benefit of seeing the ball so like let's just say your coach tells you to do something at least you're going to start making like at least you'll make contact with that ball when i was going through lessons there'd be points in time where i'd try something funky and i'd i'd have a this feeling and my coach wanted me to feel this and you know bring the club back this way or whatever and there would be just a setback for you know a couple shots where it's just like okay i'm no longer making contact with the ball like how am i supposed to trust this is the right way to swing when i this is making me literally miss the ball it's like no keep going like okay let's let's let me interrupt you there okay you mentioned trust so were you figuring out how to trust his

instructions or how to trust your link between your mind and your body and or both it was both it was okay what, what was harder? Trusting at the time, his name was Mike Miles, trusting my coach. That was the hardest part because, again, I'd get to a point where, again, let's just fast forward to my sophomore year of high school, so I've been blind for three or four years. And I'd get to a point where I'd be hitting the ball decently, but there were still obviously mechanical corrections to be made.

You'd make those mechanical corrections and all of a sudden it would just like I said it would be like taking a hundred steps backwards like okay now the ball is going off the toe of the club again like I don't like why am I doing this I was just hitting the ball kind of fine like why am I now missing the ball again so it was tough and then it's just kind of really feeling and understanding well you're having this feeling and because of this, now you got to correct that. And that's making your, you know, shoulders kind of dip too far, you know, to the left and now you're swinging on the inside of the ball. So like it was frustrating, but you know, it was kind of that real, I mean, it was a waltz in the sense of what it was four steps back and then, you know, five steps forward. How were you wired looking back? Did you deal with challenges with frustration, with intensity, with go with the flow?

Like what was your approach with the challenges? I mean, a lot of it was, was a frustration. I mean, it was a lot of frustration. I mean, there's, there's definitely, I'm from a golf standpoint. I mean, there's a lot of rounds where you just walk off the course and I wanted to snap a club just, you know over my knee or something because it just was so frustrating I meant snapping the club like just digging no digging on the yeah well I mean I wasn't necessarily strong enough at that point to probably my swing speed wasn't that fast at that point yeah good point but um so frustration was the way that you deal yeah so I mean a lot of it was then humor I mean give it a couple you know

let it let it settle for a day or two and then you can look back and just laugh and be like i don't know what the hell happened out there so i mean a lot of it was just you know not taking life too seriously one of my favorite quotes is you know they don't take life too seriously because you'll never make it out alive so a lot of it was okay you know i am this blind guy who just recently went blind trying to play competitive golf in high school. So you're trying your best, but it's not the end-all, be-all. I think there's another good quote. I think it was John McKay, Essie's old coach.

And he basically, after a really tough loss, this media was just hammering him about the loss. And he just was like, at the end of the day, there's a people over in asia right now that don't give a rat's ass about this loss and it's kind of like well it's true i mean at the end of the day i mean you want to it means a lot to me because i'm putting the work in but if you have a bad day on the golf course things didn't go your way i mean life life's going on for everyone else you know just keep moving forward don't don't let that ruin your expectations then Then the next time or your overall belief in yourself and your potential in the game of golf. I mean, just go out there and learn what you made a mistake. But don't act like somehow it's the end all be all because it's not.

And it's not for anyone else. So, you know, that was a lot of it. Just kind of not taking it too seriously, the failure, but instead learning from the failure, using it to make myself a better golfer and understanding my swing. Like I said, a lot of it was, you know, you asked me today. I mean, when I talk about my swing, it was training my mind to use that muscle memory to feel literally every part of my swing, to feel what went wrong in that shot. And today, I mean, it's tremendous. I mean, this is what's helping me become a great golfer and and honestly what probably led me on to long snapping as well

and that when people taught when my coach started teaching me how to long snap it was okay i can use my feel just like a golf swing and knowing what that ball feels like coming off my fingertips knowing to bring it bring it back in a straight line to kind of have all that muscle memory and then repeat it. I mean, that's, I think that's literally a part of the mind that you just have to train like, like anything else. Okay. So there's two things I want to go and I want to understand how you developed imagery, like what imagery is like for you because you had sight, you could see things and then you lost sight. And then you, I would imagine you would have a unique advantage based on the, the patterns that you had once seen to be able to use imagery to conjure up patterns so that

you have some frame of reference versus somebody who was born without sight. So there might be an advantage there that I'd like to explore. And I wonder if you're better at imagery than 99% of the rest of the world, because that's a major skill that you've had to develop. But okay. I like that answer. Okay. But there's a cost as well, is that being born with sight and then losing sight, I'd love for you to first take us, take me down the path of when you realize that you are no longer going to see your loved ones again, when you're no longer going to be able to see what you once did. I mean, that was tough. I mean, I learned on October 1st, I was going to go blind on November 12th. I did go blind. So there's a month and a half there

really living with that reality of knowing you're going to lose your eyesight, which, you know, would torture any man. And it was tormenting for me as well, in the sense that, like you just said, realizing this is the last time I'm seeing X or Y or Z. And so, you know, how did you do that with your 12, right? Yes. How did you do that with your parents? Like, mom, I'm never going to be able to see you again. It was sad. I mean,

did you say that out loud or? Yeah. I mean, literally the first night, I mean, the first, like it was, it was obviously, uh, I think the first emotions when I found out was, no, this can't be possible just because, I mean, a lot of it was at first was the frustration of, I just fought this cancer for 12 years this thing came back eight times like we we had an answer every time I've gone through so much chemo so much radiation so much treatment like what like what the hell why can't this why does this thing keep coming back and now we don't have an answer for it like like what the actual hell did you see yourself or feel like a like an ass kick a warrior, like, or did you have a different sense,

which it was something like, man, why me? No, I, I, I never really said why me. I mean, it was when I cancer came back, it was like, okay, let's just figure out another way of doing it. It was kind of steady as she goes. I mean, it wasn't like even aggressive, like ass kicker. It was just kind of, okay, like, let's just, you know, we're working through this like we did and let's just figure out the next way of kind of being real pragmatic about it. But, you know, again, I was having fun as well. And there's, you know, there's plenty of fun opportunities and things to do in a hospital between talking to other kids and just having fun. But so again, like I said, not taking things too heavy. But again, it was there was, like I said, a lot of sad moments as well. And that the first

night I found out I was gonna have to go blind I mean I remember sleeping in my parents room and like breaking down as I did for the you know umpteenth time that day where it was kind of like I did realize you know what those that those uh thoughts kept creeping in and and making me more aware of the reality and that I was like yeah I'm not gonna see your guys' faces anymore, which was sad. I mean, my, my mom eventually learned to, to like that again. I always see her as like a 45 year old woman. She never ages in my mind. So she likes that now, but at the time it was, you know, sad. So like, it's fun to laugh about these things, but I, I want to know how you dealt with the hard part. Adversity is a real deal. If we're not

careful, it's just like a word that we throw out there. And so you faced it down. You're facing it down. And so I'd love to, if you could teach how you've been able to do that. And I'm pulling some thin slices out. Like you feel emotions, you put words to emotions. Um, you keep it even keel. You've got some frustration that you deal with. And then a couple of days later you, you put in perspective and then you laugh a lot, you know, and maybe that's it. Maybe there's, you've already shared it and there's nothing more to really add to it, but I'd love for you to like, how have you done what you've done? Again's so one i mean it does take a village you know i think obviously there's seven billion people on this earth for a reason i think

you utilize the people that are around you you utilize your loved ones because they do love you and support you like my parents my sister has my friends have uh and then you you utilize the opportunities that people give you as well i mean a lot a lot of it is, hey, a lot of people think they're not good enough. They're not strong enough. This person would never help them. It's like, well, just go ask. I mean, people like to feel important. People like to feel like they made an impact in your life.

So go ask if there's a way that person can. Can you give an example of how that's worked out for you? Well, for instance, a lot of it was, uh, when I, when I first go blind, I ran into a guy named Mike miles and his, I mean, he literally told me when I was going blind or after I went blind, he said, here's the deal. People are going to want to help you utilize those people. Like, don't, don't shy away and say, Hey, you know, like I feel like a freeloader or whatever. No, utilize it. Thank them be really appreciative, but utilize those people. And to be honest, the first example was using Mike Miles, my golf coach, when he was at a country club named Virginia Country Club.

We weren't part of Virginia Country Club. Mike Miles is a really good golf coach, and he cut down the rate and let us come to Virginia Country Club to practice and play. And it just was like it wasn't necessarily for any other reason he saw this kind of this blind guy who wanted to learn golf and was took interest in it and wanted, you know, to help me in every way he could. And so, I mean, that, you know, I was having the first example I learned of like, yes, people are going to want to help. So let them help. Um, and so that was kind of the first thing, the other thing though, back to your original question of like dealing with it of dealing with it, I never tell people to ignore their emotions. Of course, I was angry. I was sad. There's times today. It's okay to let that run through your veins. I think it's important to feel anger and sadness sometimes. I let it envelop me sometimes in the weight room or just alone in my room or whatever.

And I let those emotions kind of settle. But then you do realize and you have to then understand in your mind that, of course, you're angry about that situation. It's not fair. It's not cool. Life didn't treat you right in that aspect. but you still have so much in your life to be grateful for there's so much meaning still in life there's so much so many blessings in your life and that's where i never lose sight of that you know i i never lost sight that i had a parents that loved me i i had amazing opportunities coach carol was gracious enough to invite me to hang out with my favorite team to have those memories you know there's so many other people I can mention that have given me things in life and have, you know, been there for me. I mean, I'm sure I was going blind, but I still had two legs and two arms to play football with and two legs and two arms to swing a golf club with.

And a very capable mind that could humor people and make them laugh and engage. And, you know, I was charismatic enough to have beautiful girlfriends, you know, like there's so many things in life. I'm just saying six foot four funny, you know, like, no, that's what I'm saying. Like, I think, I think a lot of people would say, you know, like it's awful. You went blind and it is. And again, I let the anger sometimes completely, you know, let that, let that settle in me. But I, I think it would be very shameful if, like I said, I threw all the rest out the window and was like, you know what? Cause I went blind at this. Like I, I, I, I'm never going to live life the same. I never be happy.

Could you understand that for somebody that has gone through something difficult and they're like, you know what? Life, life sucks, the same fare and I'm throwing in the towel. They don't say it like that but they're just bitter and pissed and you know can't quite figure out to be to live gratefully to be completely honest with you i i have hard time sympathizing with that i've always had so when you see somebody that's stuck right and they're stuck in the toxicity of difficult emotions how do you respond to it well i mean inside mean, inside I get frustrated because I, again, I, I believe, I believe in a potential someone, I believe in their ability to, to move past what's

happened in their life. And so many people have, and that's, and the crazy thing is, it's like, you see all these people who do crazy things and overcome a lot. And I, you know, I'm just one example of that, but it's just, they're normal guys. I mean, they just, they've, they've just made their mind up that they're going to now let life give them the other hand, which is, you know, loved ones, which is opportunities, which is, you know, whatever life's going to give you, which it gives and takes, you know, I mean, you got to take the good with the bad. And so when I see people do throw in that towel where they're where they're now faced a situation where they've lost their spouse, they've lost their ability to walk, maybe they're born in not a great home or whatever. And it's like, sure, that's a different adversity than I ever faced.

But the fact is, it's still adversity. And you're going to have to still have that same mindset of it not letting you stop you in life and continuing to do the things you love. And when people don't realize that when they just throw in the towel, it frustrates the hell out of me because I'm just like, no, you know what? You, you are still good enough. Like you still have so much meaning and ability and potential in life. Like, what are you, what are you doing? Letting this, this stop you? Like it's, it's sure it's going to make it tougher. I'm not trying to lie to you. I'm not telling you you're going to be, you know, live the same life you thought you were going to live or things are going to be the same, but that doesn't mean that they have to be bad. Now that doesn't mean that you have to throw in the towel. And so that's where

I kind of get frustrated. I think more than anything with people in that it's like, I understand it's hard. I understand, but it's hard for everyone. Everyone has excuses. I mean, literally you could point at anyone in life and say, well, they at one point had an excuse where they could have thrown in the towel or said, you know what, this is too hard. I mean, even billionaire business people just think they have the easiest life. Trust me, I'm starting a business right now. Like anyone who's taken a business from zero to where it's at now has had to go through some shit. I'm telling you, it's not easy. Like life isn't easy.

If it's easy, there's a reason. It's not a good one. Like it's not easy, but the people that make it through the people that end up on the top of the mountain and achieve their goals, they saw those excuses said, you know what? I'm not going to let these excuses stop me. I'm going to push forward. I'm going to get hit. I'm going to be frustrated. I'm going to go through tough times, but I'm going to continue to move forward and utilize the things that life has given me, utilize the people around me that care about me and want to help me and find my way to the top. There's your philosophy, isn't it? Yeah. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Cozy Earth.

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I'd love for you to check them out. Head to calderalab.com slash findingmastery and use the code findingmastery at checkout for 20% off your first order. That's calderalab, C-A-L-D-E-R-L-A-B.com slash finding mastery. Okay. What is the hardest part about being blind? And this is probably unique to you. And I don't think this is like everybody would have the same answer. But for you, what is the hardest part? Because when you came in, I saw you flipping through your phone and it was like a text to speech.

Yeah, yeah. And I thought to myself like, right. You know, like what a luxury I have to flip open my phone and see, you know, emails coming through. And then I hear people complaining about how many emails and I get caught up in how many. And then I'm thinking I'm watching you going, holy snarkies, like you can't go to a website easily yeah i mean you can but it's totally different yes it's totally different right right and that's that's my other philosophy in life is that if there's a will there's a way you know using text-to-speech is not as easy as looking at a phone and just doing it but guess what there's still a way i can do it so i'm going to

utilize that way cool so what are the hard parts for you the hard part for me is i'd say there's it's kind of twofold and one is hard because it impacts one part of my life and the others impacts the other part of my life so the one that bothers me sometimes people are on either spectrum it's let me hold your hand because i don't think you can do anything or it's i'm gonna be stubborn i'm not gonna find i'm not gonna work with you and be flexible and find a way you can do it and if that's professors if that's just people i'm around like there's a lot of times where like people again will either baby me it's like no i don't need you to hold my hand through this like i can do it or there's time or it's like come on man like i just need

i just need you to get a little flexible here like i i can do this assignment or i can do it or there's time or it's like come on man like i just need i just need you to to get a little flexible here like i i can do this assignment or i can do this example um so for example i had a professor in college who literally like would not let me take a test without her without the professor because she just didn't think like people were going to do it right. Or like, I wasn't going to learn correctly or whatever. And it's like, I under, I appreciate, I really appreciate you wanting me to learn this, but like, like don't baby me. Like it's frustrating. Like I have the same learning potential as anyone else in this class. Like I can do this. I'll ask you for help. I'll ask you for the extra teaching moments if I need them.

So you get more agitated when people go above and beyond to pamper you. Sometimes, yeah. More than the rigidity of somebody that's like... The rigidity motivates me to work harder. So you use that as kind of fuel. Oh, yeah. When somebody's like can't do it yeah yeah whether it's playing football as a long snapper golfing or building

a business right yeah okay and then so but you're not fueled by anger but you use that in a way for motivation yeah how does that work uh anger no like using somebody else saying you can't do it. And then in return, it's like, okay, I'm going to show you, which has a little bite to it, has a bit of anger in it. But I don't see you as being an angry man. Well, I'm not an angry man. I mean, like I said, there'll be times where I'll let anger in. I love kind of feeling that side of me. Again, I just don't let it overwhelm me to the point. Do you think you do anger better than most?

Maybe, probably. I think I use it in a positive way and what more than most like how do you i don't let it frustrate me to the point where yeah i'm angry i can't then i can't you know work anymore i can't it's almost like no here's anger let me work harder how do you flush it though when you feel it because you know anger is like a fire, right? And when the fire burns, it can warm you. It can also burn you. So how do you flush it? I get productive because of it. So I utilize it. But I also, again, to flush it in the sense where I don't let it become destructive is, like I said, I remind myself, like, yes, missing this golf ball is extremely frustrating.

And I'm angry because I just spent the last two weeks trying to do this thing and I cannot believe like this is a result I'm getting on the course right now but hey look there's oxygen to breathe I'm under a beautiful sky right now my dad's taking the time off work to come out here in this tournament with me I have an ability to walk on green grass right now and swing a golf club like that's something i'm going to appreciate as well as the fact that this is as frustrating as it can be so you use gratitude yes as the um the way to manage emotions yes right so that okay and then when you compete in golf are you competing against other folks that can't see are you competing against so in in high school it was you know just the normal the normal golf team so against who could see. I will be playing after my college year. I will be playing in blind golf championships and playing against other blind people.

I want to take my game further than that, and I can absolutely compete against other-sided people. What do you shoot? So right now, I have a hard time playing 18, especially throughout the years, just because between football in the fall and spring, it was difficult. But I was shooting anywhere from 38 to 41, 42. So over, I guess that's from 76 to 84. I mean, like if I went out there right now and I shot anywhere from like maybe like a 79 to like 82, I'd be happy. I'd be really happy.

Okay. Sorry. You said 79 to 82., I'd be happy. I'd be really happy. Okay. Sorry. You said 79 to 82. Yeah. And par 72. Yeah. Par 72. Yeah.

Okay. On a difficult course. Yeah. I don't golf. So like I understand the game and it's complicated and it's difficult. And like I'm amazed that you can swing because I watch folks that have all their physical faculties but not enough internal facility to manage the game of golf yeah and it drives me crazy like it right because what's on what's on the line for most golfers nothing right money and money and recognition those are the two

things on the line and golfers right now are rolling their eyes like, oh, you don't understand. It's so mentally hard. I get that. But there's no intense consequence if you make a mistake. You don't get shot. Yes, yes. For the normal Sunday golfer, yes. You know, right.

But in pro golfers. Where I think golf becomes more – so here's my philosophy on golf and why i think it's so frustrating one i think because in baseball you give up a home run here's your next batter uh in volleyball you let the you know you you don't you don't get the ball up you know okay now they're gonna serve it over again like here's the next play in golf you have a bad shot now you gotta go deal with that bad shot now that shot's gonna make you even hit a tougher shot now that that tough shot went bad now all of a sudden you have a nine on the hole and you're and that ruins your round i mean it's very hard if you get a triple quadruple bogey on a hole to shoot a good round i can't even fathom

how you know where the pin is no i mean i mean i've let my dad line me up for that i mean i don't know i'm worried about it there but so i think but even the distance right i wouldn't you're right i wasn't even thinking direction so the distance like okay that's 100 yards that's well i mean you know you just have normal conversations with you know caddy golfer how do you know what 50 feet is you you practice it and you know what it feels like that's rad um so i think there's compounding consequences in golf like that doesn't happen in other sports. I think then also personal responsibility in life I think is one of the toughest things humanity has had to deal with. I think it drives people crazy when they have to kind of sit back and really come to that moment with themselves of, hey, I made this decision.

This is why it's happening. I can overcome it., I made this decision. This is why it's happening. I can overcome it, but I made that decision. And in golf, what do you, what do you blame in the club, the ball? Like it's, it's, it's you, it's, it's absolutely you and your practice and your ability to hit that ball. And the time you put in, I think that's why between the weight room and golf, why people hate those two things the most is because at the end of the day, it's you and your personal responsibility and the work you put in. I think that really doesn't sit with people well. What are you driven by? I'm driven, again, we talked about kind of people telling me I can't do something. I'm driven. I'm stubborn. I like the challenge. I like testing myself, testing the limits, testing, you know, that because i want to talk about your business

but i get the fuel comes from when people say you can't okay and you double down right but what is it that you want what are you craving in life what do i crave i crave like anyone success I crave the satisfaction of hard work paying off into success and successes success is having a million dollar companies success is winning major golf tournaments success is being a great you know dad one day being a great husband, um, success is being, being a person people can look to for inspiration, being, making a lasting impact, making someone say, you know what, if Jay Golson can do it, I can too. Hmm. And then what are the upsides of not having sight? Uh, I think the major upsides of not having sight is I get to focus on kind of, I think it lets me be more present. I think if that's in literally a physical activity I'm doing,

I have to focus a lot more on what I'm hearing, what the room sounds like, if there's something in front of my face, how I'm navigating it. Like I think it helps me really be present. I think more importantly than not, I've really, in the last 10 years since going blind, I've enjoyed meeting thousands and thousands and thousands of people. And to be honest, I thought going blind, I would have cared a lot more about what people look like. I would have asked that question a lot more to people. And there's just so many times in my life where I've never asked what someone looks like in my entire life. I just, I don't

care. It just doesn't really matter. I know what their voice sounds like. I know what, by what they say, what they, you know, who they are and what they believe in and you know, what kind of person they are. And that's, that's all that really matters to me. I think that's, that's a cool way to live life. Would you call them benefits or have you, cause what you just said is really profound, right? The two things that you just said, which was I live in the present more often because it's part of my survival. It's part of the way I need to thrive, to live and listen more deeply. And the second part is I'm free. I'm free from what people look like, you know, like that doesn't, it doesn't burden me in any way. So really very powerful thoughts and ways

to live life. Would you call that a benefit or is that like you, if you wanted, or if you could, would you would take your site back? I would imagine would it's a kind of a crazy you know the like it's a crazy argument or conversation like would you you know like so i don't want to be unfair about it no i i i would if you hear i mean this is when people ask me that like i i think most people expect me to say like no i would not i would not take back if you said jake you can never go blind I don't know if I would do that just because I've learned lessons. I think who I am today and my personality is because of what I went through. And so I don't want to lose that. I like who I am because of that.

Really cool thought. I would never trade that. However, I think I'd be stupid to be like, hey, if you want your sight back. No, I'm good. Give me my sight back like no i'm good like no like give me my sight yeah and is it because of the like you know we're laughing and it does it but it does not seem callous in our laugh i've watched you in this entire interview and you've had a smile almost the whole time yeah and even when we're talking about difficult things. So are you, in this conversation that we're having,

when you're talking about losing your sight and some of the adversities you felt, do you feel them now? Or is it washed over with like, listen, I've done that work. I feel healed from that. And that's what gives me the ability to smile and, and, and talk. And I, I don't need to go back to those things and feel them completely. Um, well, again, I, I, I do like, I, I'm, I like to smile. I like to have fun. I think there's a lot of, of beauty in life. Uh, Helen Keller says, you know, we live in a broken world full of suffering. It's also full of overcoming. And so I recognize that, you know, I've, I've overcome a lot and I can smile and be happy about that and enjoy where I've gotten myself in life. However, yeah, there's plenty of times where it's, it's frustrating. Like if I'm walking to class and I get lost, that's very frustrating. Frustrating or scary? Frustrating. So what scares you?

There's not a lot that scares, snakes scare oh come on i hate snakes there's all that scared me i i like like for instance i'll tell you so this past year this this this past year in my senior season of football we were doing some stuff in the fall camp um for team bonding and one of the things was um a they brought like those blow up like like intense laser tag it's like you know they bring the blow up things you hide behind him that's like a you know big like you know 25 on 25 people laser tag you know and so i really couldn't play and people asked me if i wanted to and i just i knew i just wouldn't probably have that much fun with it and so i didn't i didn't play and i kind of felt left out during that whole experience and

it was kind of sad because like everyone's out here having fun and yeah I could but it'd be stupid I mean I'd run in there I'd probably get shot and like I would be out of the game like it's it really just wasn't even worth in my mind me doing that but and it was okay I mean like it was a sad like I stood there I was kind of sad about it I wish I could see at that moment and hang and have that kind of bonding experience with my teammates and, you know, be able to go out there and shoot some people down. But like it was at the end of the day, again, I let myself feel sad about that. I didn't try to suppress that because guess what? I did feel sad about it. But at the end of the day, it's not like I'm going to go back and now be bitter at all my teammates. And the fact that I can't see all night long, it's okay like I'm going to go back and now be bitter at all my teammates and the fact I can't see all night long it's okay I'm still at fall camp with the SC Trojans here you know I'm still

being able to play football like that's something that again I don't want to lose perspective on when I do feel sad and then what scares you I don't there's not a lot that scares me I I I really there's not a lot that scares me. I, I, I really, there's not a lot that scares me. I can't imagine. So we didn't, we did a, uh, sensitivity training when I was in college in a psych program and we had to be blindfolded for X number of hours, days, I think it was 24 hours. And I can't imagine like what it would be like to be lost and not be able to see. Obviously, you're going to talk to people. You're going to sort it out. So when I get lost, there's still parts of the SE's campus where I don't know as well.

But there's times where I get lost. But in those moments, it was actually – and maybe this is weird how my mind works. But in those moments where I got lost, sure, it was very frustrating. There was times where it was hot outside and it was very frustrating. And I was like, just pissed off that I couldn't get the class because I was trying to get the class. But there are other times where I'd be out there. I'm like, okay, I actually have no idea where I am right now. So let me just feel where the sun is. Let me hear where traffic is. Let me like, just kind of really take everything in and try to figure this out. Cause it's like a puzzle.

And then you walk one way and you're like, do i recognize anything around here like is anything making sense and then you just kind of like of course that's how you do it yeah and then you get present you get grounded you use your senses your faculties and then take a step in a direction yeah right app metaphor for life isn't't it? Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Okay. And then there's an award after your name in the performance science Institute at USC. Want to talk about that a little bit? Yeah. So it was very cool. Dave Belasco, um, kind of offered this up, um, a year ago, basically to create a award for it's called the Jay Golshin vision award. And basically for students who want to come and have overcome a lot in life, who have made that courageous and that decision to take personal responsibility of their life to say, you know what, life wasn't fair. Something happened to me, regardless if it was my fault or not, that I have to live with the consequences of that for the rest of my life now.

But that's not going to stop me. I'm going to go to a school like USC. I'm going to get my degree. I'm going to make something in my life. And I think that needs to be rewarded. And so that was really cool that we came up with that. And hopefully, um, over my lifetime, I'll be able to grow that into something really, really big and cool. And again, reward those people who, again, that it takes courage. It takes strength. Um, it takes resiliency, takes grit and again i want to reward those type of people okay let's talk about mental imagery you gave some clues of the importance and then some hints that you might be better skilled than others at it so can you walk through how you do mental imagery and what it's like for you so from from a standpoint of just like

understanding a lot of people don't know how like i get around or they think I'd be perpetually lost and disoriented. So a lot of that imagery for me, even walking into a room, is just kind of almost like a grid. I find my mind working a lot like a grid. So it's understanding where things are. It's understanding just the layout and kind of making that shape in my head and literally just like from a bird's eye view pointing putting things you know a couch there a tv there i know over here is this table and so i can kind of see that so when i'm walking through i can almost kind of see myself walking through that again from like if you're looking down on it like a diagram um for images like having a grid snap or hitting a golf shot, it's not really seeing

myself make that. So as much as like, you know, Jack Nicklaus used to say he would, you know, see himself make that shot every single time. For me, it's when I'm going through that practice swing or I'm, you know, going through the motion of knowing what that feels like almost just like trying to three 3d print that in my mind and then literally just do the same thing 10 seconds later when you're over the over the ball you know just kind of really knowing what a good swing feels like not caring what's in front of you what if there's a thousand bunkers that there's water nothing but to the hole I mean

it's just let me put a good swing on this and do what I know how to do. And it's just kind of keeping yourself like in that, I guess my mind, my mind in the box. And I kind of talked about earlier about being present, but like I said, just my mind in the box right there in front of me and doing the things I know I can do and control the things I can control. Jake, I love this conversation. You know, it's, you take the awkwardness out of it by being authentic. Yeah. Right. And when I say awkwardness, I mean, the ability for me to ask the questions that I'm really curious about and not be, uh, I don't know, searching too hard to find like the socially appropriate thing. It's like, I feel like we're two folks talking about like what it's like to be you and what are the, what are the upsides, downsides, challenges, and the ways that you look at those challenges. So, uh, thank you.

Of course. Yeah. Okay. So I've got a couple more questions for you. Tell me what you're doing with your company. So I created a business called Engage and it's a let's engage.com. Basically it was because my manager and I had a difficulty, started getting difficulty in the demand that was coming in for me to speak. I've been a motivational speaker for about the last 10 years. So people wanted to hear me speak, wanted me to come to places just through the word of mouth and at whatever. And we had a couple of problems. One, there was no way to really reach me. If they had my manager's email, great. If they had my mom's email, great. She can forward it on. But there was really no way we were getting stuff through USC's PR department.

We were getting DMs on Facebook. People were reaching out through my site. Like it was just whatever way you could reach me, you tried to reach me. And then the other problem was that there was now becoming a lot of bureaus that had no, never talked to me, never reached out. They were now starting to represent me. And that's just something I didn't want because I don't know who they are. I don't know what they're saying about me. I don't want people thinking I'm affiliated with them. And I just didn't know what was going on. So, okay, let's find a way where we don't have to rely on these bureaus that we never met. And let's figure out a way where people can just simply contact you and

whatever they want to submit, submit it. So we know what we're dealing with when they contact us. So we created this online platform called engage. And it's that way when people reach out, they can go to my profile, they can submit a request. It's all digital. It's not answering the same questions. You submit a request, you submit what it's not answering the same questions you submit requests you submit what the what the event is what you want do you want me to speak for 25 minutes what about what are you willing you know what's your budget what is going to go on in this event like everything is there so it's not hey are you jake's manager yes hey we want to speak at this event okay great where is it like it you can see the email chain running out 25 emails, right? And you've doing that every single time it gets really cumbersome. So basically we created this online platform that digitizes it, makes it more efficient. Um, and then on top

of that, what's really cool is we've also created a way for you to book our talent more than just a speech, but whatever the talent wants to do, if that's, you want to go play 18 holes with me, let's go, you know, submit requests. I'm willing to go out there golf we have a couple of guys who do really cool things with martial arts that love you know would love to do that we have cool things with people who are ex-army people who you know would take you to a gun range or you know who uh i've got a couple people who are um are movie stars who are also top chefs that would you know could cook like there's there's so many cool experiences out there that I think people would enjoy a lot more than just hearing me speak about golf for 25 minutes.

Why not go out there and play with me? So there's a lot of cool things out there that we're trying to work on with our talent. And it's really coming together. It's been a very difficult road to obviously get the tech company up and running, the platform going and fixing bugs and get investors and get people on board. But we're about 18 months into the venture now and we've got about 150 guys on platform. We raise money, we're rolling, we've been able to create revenue. We're doing well. And that's something that I know we're going to

continue to put our hearts and souls in even after we graduate. Great. And it's let's engage.com. Yeah. Let's engage.com. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. And one of our mutual friends, John Hirshberg has been part of your life as well. And he also is the founder. I think he's the founder for tour to peer. Yeah. So Hirshberg is a sc grad um from marshall so about just very soon here we'll both be the co-graduates from from marshall um and he is a very very cool guy he um asked me to come speak to his company jr uh 286

back in the fall and actually was the first customer through engage um it was reached out and said hey put your request through engage and it was the first customer through engage. Um, it was reached out and said, Hey, put your request through engage. And it was just that simple. You get, we got it done. And so came and spoke. It was an awesome event. It was just a sales, um, they're a sales meeting. And then basically, um, Herzberg started telling us about how, you know, his dad actually dealt with cancer, um, and he lost his daddy cancer and how close he was to his dad and how he wants to make a positive impact through that. And so he does this really cool tour to raise money for patriotic cancer. And I would love to be part of it.

And that's something that we're going to be doing, I think, on May 19th, which is going to be really, really cool. It's going to just be a bunch of guys cycling to raise money for cancer. And I know I'm going to be really, really proud to be there with him doing that. Tour de Pires in Manhattan Beach. When you say guys, men and women. Yes, yes. Right. Yeah. And it is literally the image is, I don't know, scores of stationary bikes. Yes.

And it's an all day the night before as well people riding and they're riding for a certain amount of time so you you buy a bike and you donate and there's they're raising millions of dollars to go back towards cancer in general but certainly pancreatic cancer which is i think the color is purple right you're asking the wrong guy that's too funny okay yeah so i think it's purple but i'm not i'm not exactly sure um yeah so uh if you're interested and you're local come get a bike tour de pierre and it's riffing off of tour de france that's the the bike piece in manhattan beach and then you can also like if folks want to be engaged uh that you don't have to buy a bike you can just make a donation and i'll tell you what, their numbers are staggering about their overhead is so small.

We went through some of the business numbers recently. Their overhead is really small and it is outrageous how much goes back into the community. And so it's awesome. I'm stoked to be part of it as well and support them and so i'm looking forward to seeing you down there as well yeah yeah cool jake thanks for your time mate of course michael looking forward to seeing you up at the seahawk soon here yes yes yeah yeah we'll see what coach care has in mind yeah go hawks take care All right. Thank you so much for diving into another episode of Finding Mastery with us. Our team loves creating this podcast and sharing these conversations with you.

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