Finding Mastery with Dr. Michael Gervais - Reid Priddy, 4x Volleyball Olympian

Episode Date: July 4, 2018

This week’s conversation is with Reid Priddy, a 4 time Olympian for the USA Men’s indoor volleyball team, winning Gold in 2008 and Bronze in 2016.Over the past 16 years, Reid has competed at the highest level in indoor volleyball - both on the US National Team as well as on foreign Pro teams in domestic leagues all across the globe.In 2014, Reid suffered a torn ACL during competition, which required double knee surgery.In his late thirties, he defied the odds and worked his way all the way back to the top and helped the US Olympic Team win a Bronze Medal in RioReid is looking to defy the odds once more by switching surfaces to the sand – he’s working towards representing the US in the Tokyo Olympic Games in 2020.As someone who has had the fortune of being involved with multiple Olympic Games, most recently with the 2016 women’s indoor and beach volleyball teams I've seen just how challenging the Olympic quad process is... the rigorous hours and dedication required over a 4 year period to even have a shot at making the Olympics once.Now imagine doing that successfully 4 times (16 years, not including the 10-20 years of prior training just to get the world-stage) and still having the hunger to come back and do it one final time.In this conversation we learn how Reid has done it - we discuss everything from how he struggled with confidence in his early playing days, what it means to be clutch, and why he loves putting himself in situations that test his capabilities.There aren’t many people who are able to call themselves a 4x Olympian so I can’t wait for you to learn from Reid._________________Subscribe to our Youtube Channel for more powerful conversations at the intersection of high performance, leadership, and meaning: https://www.youtube.com/c/FindingMasteryGet exclusive discounts and support our amazing sponsors! Go to: https://findingmastery.com/sponsors/Subscribe to the Finding Mastery newsletter for weekly high performance insights: https://www.findingmastery.com/newsletter Download Dr. Mike's Morning Mindset Routine! https://www.findingmastery.com/morningmindsetFollow us on Instagram, LinkedIn, and X.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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All right, welcome back or welcome to the Finding Mastery Podcast. I'm Michael Gervais. And by trade and training, I'm a sport and performance psychologist, just to give you some context of where this podcast is anchored in. And I'm also the co-founder of Compete to Create along with head coach Pete Carroll of the Seattle Seahawks. And the idea behind these conversations is to learn from people who are on the path of mastery, period. That's it. We want to understand what they're searching for, their psychological framework, the mental skills that they've used to build and refine their craft. Finding Mastery is brought to you by LinkedIn Sales Solutions.

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That's David, D-A-V-I-D, protein, P-R-O-T-E-I-N.com slash finding mastery. Okay. This week's conversation is with four-time Olympian for the U.S. men's indoor volleyball team, Reed Pretty. And Reed won gold in 2008 and bronze in 2016. He is legit at what he does. He's world recognized for his skill and talent. And over the past 16 years, he's competed at the highest level of indoor volleyball, both on the national team, as well as for foreign professional teams across the globe. And in 2014, he suffered an ACL during competition, which required double knee surgery. And in his late 30s, he defied the odds and he worked all the way back to the top, helping the U.S. Olympic team win bronze in Rio.

It's rad. Reid is looking to defy odds one more time by switching surfaces to the sand. So he's working towards representing the U.S. in Tokyo in the 2020 Games. And as someone who has had the fortune of being involved with multiple Olympic Games, most recently my time with the 2016 Women's Indoor and Beach Volleyball Teams, I've just smelt and seen and understood what it takes to be part of a quad, a four-year process. It is rigorous and there is deep dedication required to be able to have a shot at making the team. I mean, it is flat out challenging. And now imagine doing that successfully four times, 16 years, not including the 10 or 20 years prior to training just to get to the world stage. And for him to still have that hunger to come back and to do it maybe one more final time,

let's see here. So in this conversation, we learn how Reed's done it. I mean, it's about passion and grit and perseverance. And we discuss everything from how he struggled with confidence in early days of playing. How cool is that to be one of the best in the world and have a hindsight perspective about how to develop confidence? And we get into that here and what it means to be clutch and why he loves putting himself on a regular basis in situations that test his capacities. And there aren't many people who are able to call themselves four-time Olympian. So I can't wait for you to learn from Reid in this conversation. So with that, let's jump right into this conversation with Reid Priddy. Reid, what's up? Not much. Glad to be here. Excited.

Me too. Yeah. This has been something I've watched you from a distance as someone who's appreciated and been part of volleyball. So it's a treat to have you here. Awesome. Thanks. Yeah. So first of all, congratulations on four Olympics. That's right. Yeah. That is rare. Do you know many people that have been to four? I don't know many people who have gone to four, but, um, I certainly didn't forecast that. And I don't think anybody else did. You know, I wasn't that the blue chip guy, you know, uh, high school,

college, um, early pro that you would have thought, Hey, this is going to be somebody that's going to have some longevity. So looking back, um, you know, when you're in it, you're kind of on the wheel. And there was times, uh, a lot of times where I thought that I potentially had memory loss, memory issues, just because, you know, my wife or friends would just be like, remember that time when we did X, Y, Z. And I'd be like, no. friends would just be like, remember that time when we did XYZ? And I'd be like, no. And they'd be like, we were there, we were at this place, it was dinner or whatever. And I just wouldn't remember fully. And, um, I just attribute that to just being so forward direction minded. And so when Rio finished and it was sort of all over, uh, there was a series of events that forced me to sort of recollect and it was very, uh,

fun and interesting. And, and yeah, four Olympics was, was quite surprising. Okay. Let's work in reverse order. What was the forcing function for you to recollect? Well, there was two speaking engagements that I had friends that had to cancel and asked me to fill in for. So Casey Patterson being one and Matt Anderson being another. And it was in those events where I just sort of they asked me to share, you know, some of my experiences where I shared and, um, I sort of saw, um, through my sharing and my message that I didn't really know I even had how people reacted to it. And there was this visceral sort of engagement that I found fulfilling and they found valuable. And that led to my first sort of camp as it were, and it was going to be in Arizona, Phoenix, where,

where I went to high school. And once all the logistics were done, uh, you know, time and place and all this stuff, I literally sat down in my garage, you know, set up a desk and it's like, okay, now I'm responsible for 15 hours of, of content. Like what, what on earth am I going to say? And I actually journaled, um, for like 20 something years. And so I had all of these journals and I just started like thumbing through it. And I just started writing like, what's important to me. What do I think about the game? What do I think about competing? What do I think about all these things? And it was actually really easy to see these themes sort of pop out. And it got to a point where I was like, I should just offer this to these campers, uh, as a take home. That way I don't have the pressure

of remembering everything. If I forget it, just refer to your manual. Okay. So you wrote a man, you took your insights from all of the years that you had been journaling. You wrote those pearls down, those practices and pearls down. And then you offer that as part of the product offer, if you will, as being a camper. Exactly. And how, how big was that manual? Um, it wasn't very big and, and these are for high schoolers, high schoolers, high schoolers. Yeah, I did. I actually, I combined three different events into five days. It was crazy. I did five sessions with 40 boys that were in high school. Um, then I did a session with coaches and then I did a, uh, a Monday evening, a couple hours, three hours, um, with April Ross for some females. And so, yeah, it was like this little pamphlet. I would say it was probably like 30 pages of thoughts and even included like raw journal notes before matches.

And it's kind of cool now with this digital age, because I actually have what I was thinking before a match that you can go look on YouTube and you can kind of see like, and I think that's, you know, if, if we, you know, what is my message? I think, I think the people, um, what people resonate with is just my, um, authenticity and that like, Hey, I struggled with, um, confidence and I was, you know, I performed well over time, but it was not easy all the time. And I struggled with this, that, and the other. And, and I was pretty forthright with that. And I think it's really important. Um, there's lots of things that I'm passionate about. One is, is the idea of clutch, um, and how we sort of prop it up to be something that you're either born with or not, which I totally disagree with. I totally disagree with that as well. And so I just love to bring that message to these kids and to let them know that like,

Hey, when I was your age, I wasn't the most confident person and you don't have to be to, you know, achieve good things. So good. You know, what's great is that, um, you've been through it. You've been at the top. You've excelled at the top. You've been the American team. The U.S. team is one of the best in the world.

Making that team is hard, right? And I'm pausing because I'm just in front of me all the, because I work with the women's team for one quad and all of the females that tried out that were skilled and talented and were right there and then couldn't quite figure out how to make the team, man, that's a lot of effort and that's a lot of intensity and commitment. And so how I want to go to confidence in a minute. And I want to talk about clutch and I want to talk about why you journaled. And I also want to talk about what, what was it about you that you actually made the team four years in a row? Obviously you've got the talent. Almost everyone in the gym has the talent. Would you, well, there are ranges, right? But you had the talent. What, what were the things that allowed you to

make the team consistently? I think that it's an interesting question because there were so many more talented people that came into the gym and ended up exiting. And if I had to think through, you know, what is that one element, if you had to pare it down to one thing, um, I think it's adaptability and the ability to learn. And I think that I was able to learn and adapt and change. What was your position? Outside hitter. The whole time? The whole time, actually. I was recruited out of high school as a setter.

But two weeks into my college career, my coach said, you're going to be an outside hitter. How tall are you? 6'4". As an outside hitter i'll tell you six four as an outside okay yeah so i'm undersized right and i started uh freshman year and passing is the predominant you know you're attacker yes but you're also passing and what we've come to learn through statistics and analytics is that that's one of the most important skills in all of volleyball because it really is our proximity to the whole metric, you know, wherever that pass ends up dictates probabilities and outcomes. Meaning that if you pass well to the setter that, and they can, they don't have to move their feet much and they can put the ball right to

your sweet spot. It's likely that you're going to finish. Exactly. Right? And so, but if you pass with a twist or off point and they got to run to get to the ball, they got to twist in some kind of way that try to get that ball back over to somebody, whether it's you or someone else, it's a lower probability of you finishing that play. Exactly.

Okay. Right. So if you're just going to underhand serve a ball to a men's international caliber team, that team's going to side out at probably 80% on a perfect pass. And if you can then, if you can increase the difficulty of serve and try to get that pass at maybe 10 feet or 12 feet or 14 feet or 15 feet from the net, you can in effect flip the numbers into your favor. So instead of having a 20% chance of scoring, you can then, you know, equalize at 50% or even have

a 60% chance of scoring. What's interesting about that, uh, which kind of gets into some volleyball, you know, minutia. This is, this is beautiful though for everybody, right? Because there's, we're talking about skills and abilities. We're talking about knowing the skills that have impact and knowing the precision of those skills, the ratio of impact in your favor or not in your favor. And so before you get into the minutiae, I also want to go into, I do want the minutiae for just volleyball reasons, but like, I want to know, actually go into minutiae, but then how did you ready your mind when a serve is ripping across the net and the score is whatever we can create a dramatic, you know, I don't know, 2020 or something, or 24,

25, we can create a dramatic score. It doesn't really matter to me, but how are you readying your mind after you made a mistake, two mistakes and to be able to, and they were coming at you? I want to make sure we talk about that because I think many people, that's a worst nightmare is to be publicly exposed. And that happens in volleyball a lot. Right. Yeah. You've had it, I hope. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Well, I'm having it right now as I transitioned to beach volleyball. Oh, you are. You're getting, I hope. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm having it right now as I transitioned to beach volleyball. Oh, you are. You're getting it right now. Oh, yeah. They're like, okay, we got the new guy. Exactly. Yeah. I think that the way that I prepare, the way that I've found success in those situations is to just try to channel my competitive drive. And what I mean by that is that, uh, I'm not, I'm not trying to be perfect. I'm not trying to be overly analytical. I'm just trying to be aware.

And in the moment, um, and this kind of comes back to clutch is to me, it's the ability to hyper-focus under any circumstance and be here and now. And when you're thinking about your past mistakes, you're in the past. And when I found equally detrimental is when you're trying to like connect the dots with the information that you have in this moment. Like I know these things and I'm trying to connect the dots and complete the picture of where we're headed. And so if you're actually asking yourself the question or questions like what just happened, why did it happen? All that stuff.

Or the scores eight, four, what does that mean? You're trying to find significance. You're asking the wrong questions versus being here now aware and just sort of sensing, what do I know about the server? Uh, you know, who's in front of me blocking wise. And if somebody's really coming after me, I'm not trying to, what we know is if I overpass the ball, I've lost almost all of my, uh, advantage. If you put the ball too close to the net or over the net. Too close or over. And so, you know, what we would usually say is like, if somebody is just going back there and ripping at 75 miles an hour, then we're trying to put that thing on the 10 foot line. Like we'll take

60 or 55 or 58% versus, you know, 20% if we overpass. And so, yeah, those are some of the things that I'm thinking about when somebody's really coming after me. Okay. So you and I are going to nod our heads to what clutch means. I love how you described it. Right. And it's the same way that I talk about mindfulness being present right here, right now. And that requires a disciplined mind. The natural mind wanders. It's sloppy. It's like a drunk monkey all over the place. I don't know if yours is double-fisted like mine, but it is, it wanders. And so a disciplined mind is rare. So what you're talking about is having a disciplined mind,

independent of the stakes, independent of the scenario, independent of who's serving or whatever, being able to be right in the present moment and say, track that ball as it's coming, have my base, move my feet, keep my frame and put it on point, something along those lines, but just like staying in that clean loop, not ahead or behind. How did you train your mind to be able to be present more often? It was sort of a progression actually for me. And, you know, when I reflect back, I think of a few moments where other people sort of believed for me. And I think that's, that happens and that's okay. What a cool thought. How did, how did they translate that to you?

It's a little flimsy, right? To rely on what other people think of you. But what a gift that we can give others is to say, Hey, Hey kid, or Hey ma'am, or Hey loved one. I see so much in you. It really, I don't know. People have done that for me. It's been a game changer. Yeah.

I've never really thought of it that way. It's like, that's something you can give to other people because obviously somebody, you know, people gave it to me, but my college coach, uh, there was a moment in practice where he clearly saw that I was getting in my own way, worried about mistakes. And it was one of those situations where I was I knew that I was two or three errors away from being on the bench. And so, you know, you're constantly going through that, which is a real thing for you. Right. If you had if you're undersized and you didn't have the crazy twitchy stuff that some of the other guys had, is that the reality of what it was? When I say twitchy stuff, I mean that crazy athleticism that's like, whoa, that's 41 inches he just jumped.

What is your – I mean, it's got to be ridiculous. Well, actually, that was a good guess. So I was about the 41. Yeah, you had to be to play with 6'8 and 6'7 guys or whatever. Who are the taller guys on the team? Matt Anderson. I think he's 6'10 and he jumps over 40. He touches 12'2.

It's not very fair. It's not very fair. Humans are not supposed to do that. But yeah, the game is being played. When he would serve, it was ridiculous. The game is being played. Clay Stanley, atime teammate of mine we won a gold medal together he touched over 12 feet as well so that's kind of like the superhuman

when guys are touching over 12 feet um and you know the game's happening at 12 feet i mean if you imagine uh the hoop it's 10 feet 10 feet right and these guys are hitting at 12 feet and and it's pretty and the blocker needs to be up Right. To put a hand or an arm or an elbow in some cases. Right. In front of it. Okay. Go back. I want to go back to the mechanics of what someone said to you. And is there a particular story or person that comes to mind? Yeah. So my coach, Rick McLaughlin in Loyola Marymount, and it was sophomore year. He clearly saw what year was this? This was 1997 probably. I graduated in 94 from LMU. Yeah. 93 or four somewhere. Yeah. All right. Go lions. Yep. For sure. Very cool. I didn't know that. So yeah, he was, we were in a, uh, I think it was a

fall practice and he basically stopped, he, he was prone to like anger outbursts. It was pretty epic and awesome. Um, and so he just stopped practice and I don't even know what I did, but he basically stopped practice and said to effect, I'm no longer going to sub you out. If you suck, you're going to have to deal with it. And so it almost came across as like, I'm punishing you. But for me, obviously it was just like incredibly liberating that it was just like, I no longer am thinking about coming in or out. And I just became like, you're going to have to suffer kid. And you said to yourself, finally, I don't have to worry about my fricking mistakes. I can just ball.

Right. And I, that was my first year that I was an all American. Oh, it was. Yeah. And I think I was LMU male athlete of the year that year. And I just sort of had this freedom and just took off. And so, um, that was one. Another one was, I was, um, it was 2007 and I was a seven year pro now and we were at the world league and we made it to the finals and my game was really starting into form. Um, it was right around when I got married and my wife loves to take credit, uh, for that resurgence. Um, but I'll give it to her, but, uh, I remember it was in a servant past practice and we were in Poland and playing in Poland is just epic. I mean, we're talking 12,000, 15,000 people just in the arena with multiple

thousands of people outside barbecuing and watching it on Jumbotrons going bananas. And so we're in a serve pass it's afterwards. And there's a coach that I greatly respect and an ex player who is just one of the greats of all time, uh, Gianni and the coach was, uh, Daniele de Ricci who coached Karch and Steve when they played there. And I played for him too. And it was just an offhand comment by those guys. It was just like sort of like something like, wow, you're playing so great. It's so good to see. And I just remember thinking that like, wow, if they believe that, maybe I need to start believing that.

And so those were sort of how other people would sort of believe for me, but it was right around that time that I started to notice a different system and it was my competitive drive. And when I started, what was the first system? Competitive doubt, like professional anxiety. I would almost call it like thoughts, like mental, like what I'm thinking, what I'm thinking about. So you watching your thoughts was the first operating system? Yeah, I guess you could call it. And maybe doubting some of like if the future could be okay?

Right. Right. Like, I mean, I don't know. I got to be perfect. If it's not perfect, I'm going to be benched or as a small, as a small microcosm for maybe how you did school and relationships and, or did it only show up in ball? No, definitely. I mean, like I remember, I remember when I graduated high school, I was selected. I don't know if you remember those, like most likely to succeed, you know, best hair, you know, all that stuff. Yeah. Um, I remember receiving several of those and literally thinking that people were making fun of me like it was a joke. And so I clearly didn't have like this jock athlete star mentality. I had, you know, like I was shy. So your self-concept didn't match the concept that other people had of you.

Yeah, I would say that's correct. Okay. And so I've got this phrase that I toyed with, I don't know if there's good science or, you know, but the idea behind it is it's nearly impossible to outperform your self-concept, you know, like, but you're, you're making a case otherwise, you know, that your self-concept was what score a, B, C minuses pluses. Yeah. I would, I would say it was probably like, you know, uh, a B, but what I did have was it never stopped me from like, I never thought of myself as, as a Jiba or, you know, these other greats of our game, but it never stopped me from believing and wanting to go against them.

Okay. So that's the second operating system that you had. And then at some point it sounds almost like you had both parallel tracks and they were competing with each other at some way. And then as soon as you got some external validation, then you said, Oh, I don't have that old operating system that I had those belief systems. belief systems, I can let go of some of those bummer ones. Yeah. And then you started to kick in on the competitiveness. Right. And I don't know.

I think it was sort of gradual. And I think the journaling probably had a lot to do with it. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Momentus. When it comes to high performance, whether you're leading a team, raising a family, pushing physical limits, or simply trying to be better today than you were yesterday, what you put in your body matters. And that's why I trust Momentous. From the moment I sat down with Jeff Byers, their co-founder and CEO, I could tell this was not your average supplement company. And I was immediately drawn to their mission, helping people achieve performance for life. And to do that, they developed what they call the Momentus Standard. Every product is formulated with top experts and every batch is third-party

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Mastery listeners 20% off. Just head to FelixGray.com and use the code FINDINGMASTERY20 at checkout. Again, that's Felix Gray. You spell it F-E-L-I-X-G-R-A-Y.com and use the code FINDINGMASTER finding mastery 20 at Felix gray.com for 20% off. What is your level of insight? Crazy question. I love the pause. You're like, what the hell does that mean? But like, are you, do you consider yourself to be an insightful person, a contemplative thoughtful? Yeah. So just the way you're articulating your sentences and forming your ideas is an indicator in this conversation to me that you've thought a lot about how you've become. You know, it's one thing to sort of live these things and experience them. And it's like your journey. And then now I'm in positions where if I'm speaking to kids or even businesses, trying to articulate some of the things that I've learned through sport has required a lot of thought to try to pull them out of experience. And even in my own life, um, it's, it's so fascinating to me of how I can be so

disciplined and focused and goal oriented and know exactly what I need to do. Like right now I'm geared towards trying to make it a fifth Olympics. I want to go to Tokyo on the sand. And it's very simple for me to kind of see where I'm at, see where I need to be and develop a system and plan to work there. But as I'm trying to pivot as well in the business world, I'm trying to figure out how to be more disciplined and how to, you know, better articulate my goals and strategies for how to achieve my goals. And it's, it's, it's weird to me that you can be so good at it in one area of your life, but then so bad at it and others and need, you know, to bridge that gap. Yeah. That translation or transformation, um, from environment A to environment B is not always seamless, but the good news is that you've got a long, large, intense, successful body of work that says, I do know how to be disciplined. I do know how to become confident. I do know how to compete. I do know how to A, B, and C, be on time,

take direction, be coached, be open to learning. And those eventually will translate. And part of it is that the question that's always begged on this last phase of an athletic career and doesn't mean final stage, but this last part of the phase is I know how to influence my culture as an athlete, right? As a, as a world-class athlete, you know how to influence it. That's going to help you and others become. And then oftentimes in that translation arc, the people that will hire you, let's say in a large firm, right? I don't know if you'll ever go into a large firm or not, but they're like, oh, this person knows how to be a leader. They know how to what, but it's like you're a rookie in the business world. And so like, how do you develop that mojo, if you will, confidence is the technical term to be able to go into a new environment and dictate.

And I think that's really challenging. And so I offer that to you because that's coming down the road, maybe at some point, unless you're going to do some entrepreneur stuff, then, then there's a little bit more space to create your culture. But, um, you know, there's a phrase that a couple of my friends that have been special operators say when you're selected to the team, Navy, Navy, or, or, or otherwise, when you're, when you're selected to be on the seals or in the seal team, you're expected to lead like you're, that's, that's what you're doing. There's a chain of command. Yes. But when you're in the amphitheater, you're a leader. And so, I don't know, I just love that phrase. I don't know

why I'm sharing with you now, but I think something about that translation is important. Oh, that's good. I think, uh, I mean, I've had friends that have made this transition as well. And you know, it's, it's not easy to go from, um, an environment to where at least scheduling wise, you're not making decisions to an environment where, you know, I'm just trying to prioritize my day. Like what's more important, what's actually going to move pieces across the board today. Uh, it's so much easier as, as, as athletes to, uh, just show up and bring hard work, enthusiasm, leadership, uh, as it relates to culture and getting better and being a great teammate. But in terms of logistics and, you know, trying to accomplish business goals, it's a whole new skill set. Even knowing which are the right goals.

What happens for many people is that space that you just kind of breezed over like it's no big deal is really hard. The space between I know where I am now and the goals that I'm going to have to get me to the places I want to go. The space between your vision or your long-term goals and your current state is so anxiety provoking for so many that they diffuse out. They don't make it. And so world-class athletes, and tell me if I'm wrong on this, have a better, tell me if I'm wrong about for you, I guess, is they have a better capability to manage the unknown, that space of anxiety that this is where I am. And I'm making a space like a low middle part of the ladder. And I want to get to the top of the ladder or even extend the ladder that no one's ever gone to, but I don't know exactly how to get there. I don't, you know, I know other people have tried and done it and whatever, but I don't know exactly how I'm going

to do it. And that for unknown creates a lot of anxiety for people. How do you manage anxiety? Wow. This, this could turn into some marriage counseling because I mean, that's exactly where we're at in our family. Like I, I don't know how we're going to get there business wise. Like, does that mean financially? Right. Yes. And, but, um, I had the same exact, and actually we were dating back when I, before I was a pro, uh, so in 2000 and she actually broke up with me then. And a lot of it had to do with being directionless from her perspective. She was directionless or thought you were? Me. Thought I was. Yeah. Did you think you were?

You had already been to two Olympics? No, I had been to zero. Zero. And so I didn't even know you could play professionally overseas. Okay. And I ended up doing it for 14 years. But I didn't know. So she's appropriately taking credit for getting you going.

Yeah, that's great. So, but the concept of trusting that it's going to work, I'm going to put in the right work, and I'm going to learn along the way, but not having this script, I'm way more comfortable with than my wife, obviously. And I think that has some gender implications as well in terms of security, et cetera. Um, but yeah, that, you know,

when you say that, I think of my discussions with my wife where I'm not quite certain how this transition is going to go, but, but I do know that I think we're going to be okay. Um, so there's a basic fundamental belief that the future works out for you. Okay. So let's talk about that optimism and pessimism. Are you by definition an optimist? Yes. And then how did you learn that? That's a good, good question. I don't know that I've ever thought about how I learned it, but I come from a faith-based family. And I happen to, even as I look back on my path, it seems as though there was an architect, so to speak. Whereas it was doors opening, doors closing, with me not really having a clue. Like I was being faithful with the current moment, but, um, I wasn't, uh, you know,

my parents were not the stage parents and I didn't have the presence of mine or even the knowledge that professional careers could happen in volleyball. There was just this passion that turned into obsession. And, um, and so I, and, and things have worked out. And what's, what's interesting about that is that people who know my story, it was not rosy. Um, there was tremendous adversity and I've come to appreciate that that was part of the story and part of the journey. And through that, I, I believe that, you know, character values, you know, it was kind of like gold refined in the fire type thing. Can you take us to a time that was really hard and walk me through what that was and how you move through it and see if we can learn about resiliency and the skills underneath adversity.

Well, I think the most recent struggle was probably, is probably the best to talk about. Um, you know, in 2014, I'd been a starter on the team for 14 years and, you know, it was, it was at a time when there was a new coach, uh, John Spraw and this new crop of athletes that I was much older than. So a lot of my contemporaries that I actually won a gold medal with were phasing out of the game, some gracefully, some not so gracefully. Um, and that was hard to see, to kind of feel like I'm one of the last men standing. And I remember it was, it was in the beginning of May, just really struggling. Where do I fit with this group? Like, is it time for me to move on, et cetera.

And so we ended up going to Bulgaria. Okay. I want to pause right there. How did you wrestle with that? Did you just say, forget it? Like I'm here. I should keep going. That's all I've got.

Was it desperate? Was it aspirational? Like,'m here. I should keep going. That's all I've got. Was it desperate? Was it aspirational? Like, no, I want one more. Like how did you wrestle with that? You know, I don't feel like I had, um, I didn't feel ready to be done. Um, but I certainly wasn't scared of not playing. Uh, it was the first winter that I took off. So I had, I picked up golf and it became like a huge passion too. So I know that there's a competitive outlet beyond, uh, volleyball. And I'm not super worried, even though I've spent 12 months in the real world of being able to do something else. And so I just sort of was faithful for the day and worked hard, but certainly,

you know, at home with my wife was just sort of like, I don't know, you know, like, I don't know where I fit. But going to this first event, it was a world league. We were in Bulgaria and we warm up, we're in this dingy smoke-filled gym. You know what people, people don't realize, like, I don't know on the men's side, but down in Rio, we would i guess i could say that the country like serbia like the serbian team it they tended to uh they tend to perform before us on the female side and they would leave the locker room and it would smell like smoke now these are the best competitors in the world and they're back there you know smoke smoking right it made

like i was blown away. And all the other gals on the team were like, yeah, that's kind of what, you know, Serbia does. And I don't know if it's in a, you know, something from Europe or I don't know, but I was blown away by it. Right. And it reminds me of this one thing. There's no clear one path to mastery, to high performance. Right. There are many ways to get there. And Serbia is one of

the top countries in women's volleyball. So like there are many ways and it's not as clean as people think. So anytime you hear somebody say, well, this is how they do it on the world stage. And if I say that, kick me in the ass, because that's not what I mean. But many do, I feel like it is safe. But anyways, sorry for that. Like I was blown away by it. So you're a smoky Jim, right? Smoky Jim. You know, I think 10,000 plus people were warming up sweaty and we line up before every match and they play both anthems. And so our anthems going, I'm sweating, I'm feeling the adrenaline and the excitement and the anticipation. And it was sort of at that moment where I was just like, this is why I do this.

I love this thing. I love this moment. I love this experience. I love to compete on this stage with these stakes and be tested and constantly be pushed. And that particular night, we got down 0-2. So we're in Bulgaria. We're down 0-2. 0-2 in Bulgaria. We're down 0-2. 0-2 means two games.

They had two games on you. Exactly. And so we actually come back and win in five. And John, I've heard say several times that that was one of the best. It was sort of like that sort of encapsulated what he hoped for our team, that we would, through thick and thin, you know, fight no matter what the score was. And sort of, you know, we had this resurgence and I sort of played the role of steady veteran. You know, like there was guys in the gym now who could outperform me physically, but there wasn't any situation that I hadn't seen. So I was prepared to provide leadership

in any of those situations. So having those two moments that night was like the moment for me where Rio was by far and away the destination. And my wife the whole time was like wanting me to go. So she was not like, Hey, let's be done with this thing. She was all for it. But I really needed to sort of sink my teeth into the vision of where I fit. And it was the very next night. That's a really cool phrase, Reed. Like the vision of where I fit. That's a really cool phrase because it's using your imagination to say, how do I add to this, you know, and using some reality

in there as well. It's like, I love, I love that phrase. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I mean, it, it was weird. It was a weird experience because it was almost as if like, you would expect, like, I'm the veteran. I've been to three Olympic games now, that I would be sort of imparting my wisdom to this younger crop and group. But the culture was actually subverted to where it was kind of all about the character of these guys and how they played and how they related to one another. And, and so I was actually used to a pretty abrasive, honest, competitive environment of the team that won in 2008. So that first eight, I mean, like there was a lot of practices where there was, um, confrontation and it was very aggressive in your face.

And John saw that as an assistant and was like, that is not who I want to be. Um, and so I almost had to adapt and learn their game, which was humbling because at times I was just like, I should be the one imparting, you know, experience, et cetera. But I learned a ton through that. And I think it was very good for me from a personal level just to have to adapt again. And now it was, you know, in, in how these guys communicated and, and learn to compete a different way. What did you do to adapt when I'm imagining other athletes, you know, dog cussing or rolling their eyes or throwing their hands in the air when you're not performing well enough

or coaches doing the same? Is that close to being right? Yeah, it was a culture to where he, um, so our, the word accountability and the definition of it, like, is a little bit, I don't know that John, I even heard a recent interview from him, where he's still sort of trying to define accountability. And as it's normally defined, it's sort of the idea that players are sort of telling other players and criticizing other players what to do when. The accountability that I appreciated from the earlier team was that I have a role and I'm being entrusted to do certain things. There's certain rules about how we play that I'm supposed to block line in this scenario. And if I don't block line, I'm letting the team down. So it felt good and empowering to be trusted. Um, and I knew that if I let my teammates down,

I would hear about it. And so that was the extent of the accountability that I, um, appreciated. I certainly don't like demeaning, criticizing. I never respond to that. Uh, you know, I respond to teammates, um, being more encouraging. Uh, but the new, it was almost like, because he was reacting to that, it became a little bit more of a benign, super hyper encouraging, like overly encouraging. This last quad. Yeah. And so that was sort of the adaptation that needed to be made to where I need that work for you guys. There is a balance. The reason I'm asking, there's a balance between support and challenge and too much support, not enough challenge. You miss the sharpness, too much challenge, not enough support. It's too much

of a razor's edge. So I'm wondering, did you guys, cause I, this was similar to my own journey in Rio is the culture before I got there, uh, had some challenges. And then the three, three and a half years we spent on getting the culture right, where people could trust each other, communicate, support each other, have each other's back, know that they could let it rip, make mistakes and people are going to take care of them. So that so with the idea to be super progressive, to become great, to be great. So, but I wonder if we under indexed on challenge and over indexed on support. Looking back, it needed to start that way because the foundation had to be built. So I'm wondering for you guys, and it doesn't matter. Outcome doesn't matter to me in this question, but did you underperform, overperform?

Did you meet your normal metrics? So I think we had the potential to win gold medal. So it felt like underperforming, but at the same time, we had so many new... You put a point on the board though. It was a bronze? Yes. Yeah. So there's a point on the board though. It was a bronze? Yes. Yeah. So there's a point on the board.

So you got a medal. Was that your second medal? Yes. Yeah. Right. Gold and bronze. Congratulations. Thank you.

Yeah. So under... And you're saying bronze medal with a potential underperforming. Right. But I think that the guys, the team was really close and still is, you know, I think the bonds that were formed. So like you said, I think it was, it was parallel in that starting the culture. Like I would assume that John, this quad is probably, you know, picking up the pace in terms of, you know, that player to player, whatever that is, whatever you want to call it.

Like, again, it's not criticizing. I think we all believe the same things like fundamentally. Um, but I think that the guys, it definitely created a culture of togetherness. Yeah. You guys stay tight. I was watching one of the games where you guys got your asses handed to you. Right. Which game was that? I don't want to be rude when I say it, but it was like, Whoa, Italy, probably the first time. Yeah.

And I was like, okay. So you guys got punched in the mouth for sure. And then, and so we, we shared the same hotel, right? Yeah. We're in the same hotel. Right. And I was watching you guys like, okay, but you guys stayed together. There wasn't fray and maybe, maybe you're just keeping it, you know, like whatever, but it didn't seem like you frayed at all.

And you came back and battled and battled and battled. And so you did have that competitive way about you. And I didn't see you guys tighten up too much. Often, there's always moments that we all tighten up, I think. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Cozy Earth. Over the years, I've learned that recovery doesn't just happen when we sleep. It starts with how we transition and wind down.

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That's calderalab, C-A-L-D-E-R-L-A-B.com slash finding mastery. How do you articulate competition? Competition. Cause I'm going back to those operating systems that you had. Oh yeah. So the first one was, um, a lot of thoughts, maybe some concept structuring that wasn't clear. And then you had that parallel track of competition. And then at some point competition started to take off. So how do you think about being a competitor? Yeah, I think that, you know, to me, the idea, and this kind of runs parallel to how, you know, my thoughts as it related to being down 0-2 in the Olympic Games in Rio in terms of the competitive drive. That's right. You were down 0-2.

Yeah. Two matches. I mean, we were one match for the, for the bronze. No, no. Okay. We were down. Oh, two for the bronze, but we were, we were down two matches in the Olympics playing against the host country, Brazil at a 10 30 PM match in front of the entire country. Crazy in the arena. The place was on fire. My hair standing up just thinking about what was it like for you? Yeah. I mean, again, I think the guys responded. It was amazing to watch. And I think that... Because if you lose this match... We're out.

We're out. We have no chance of... The giants, the USA giants out of the tournament. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I sort of wrote a letter to the team that I never sent. But like my version of how to respond to that issue is it seemed like we were spending so much time trying to convince ourselves that we could do it.

We had what it took. And that's like those conversations and meetings like we're OK, we're OK. Yeah. And it's sort of like, you know, to me, it was sort of like trying to plant the seeds of like, you can do it. You can do it. We can do it. We can do it. And this, this goes to my definition of competitiveness, uh, which I don't think it's a clear definition, but my thought was we shouldn't do it. We're too young. Like we're really young. When you go to the Olympic games for the first time, it's about exposure. You have no idea what's expected and then do it again against France and then again and again and get all the way to the semis was phenomenal. But the thought that I had before that match was we don't need to think that we can do it. Like when we were standing on that 80 foot cliff in high school, going to jump into the lake, we weren't sitting there talking to ourselves saying,

you have what it takes. Like you can make this jump. You were trying to test the edges of your ability. And I have always been channeling that side of my competitive drive where it's just like, I get the thrill out of being at the very edges of my ability. The outcome is unknown and I'm out there trying to do it. And, and to me, you know, I've been on the best teams in the world. I've played for the, our version of the Yankees for a couple of years where it got to where winning was an expectation and it doesn't bring the best out of you. And it was pressure packed because it was like, you win, you're supposed to, you lose, we've got major issues. And it just sort of takes you out of that kid. Like,

you know, like, let me see if I can race that running back football player. Who's the best. You know what I mean? Like just that, that sort of sense of like, what me see if I can race that running back football player who's the best. You know what I mean? Like, just that sort of sense of like, what's possible? What are the edges of my ability? Okay. God, there's so much in here. Where does pressure come from? Outside forces.

Are you trying to be, now go back to competition. Are you trying to be your best or the best? I'm trying to be my best. And how do you practice getting on the edge? Because it's at the edge of instability where we become most alive and we learn the most, but there's most at risk. That's emotional vulnerability, physical instability, right? That, that edge is where it's the, it's called the envelope in, in math for a reason, right? As soon as you get to that place where the power ratios start to be unstable is where we're turning at the fastest radius at the most optimal radius. You know, it's a NASCAR and flying and formula one. So that edge of instability is where

the good shit happens. Okay. So how do you, how do you practice it? It's hard. It's very hard. And then I want to ask how you recover from it. Well, so the way you practice it is to put yourself, you know, try to play against the best. And, you know, this last weekend I was in Brazil and I've got the chance to play against the world champions. And some would say that that drill was that draw because we were the last seed is awful because we got eliminated from the tournament early, et cetera. But to me, that was the moment. Like I can't learn. Like I was able to see how I fit against them. What are they doing? What's making them the best. And I tell people all the time, like, if you're not paying attention when you're playing the best teams, like they'll tell you what you need to work on. You know, how is Phil dollhouse or serving me? How, what is, what is his game plan against me?

What is, yeah, it does. He keeps serving to my left. What did he, what did he scout? Right. He knows I can't move that way or whatever. And sometimes we get so wrapped up into other things that we're not paying attention to. So how do you do it in practice? I love where you're going. How do you do this in practice? You love where you're going. How do you do this in practice? You know, for me, practice comes down to, I'm trying to do two things. I'm trying to get better control of myself and I'm trying to control the ball. Okay. And so let go of the ball one for a minute because now we're going to speak to everyone on the planet. How do you develop better control of yourself? I think it's just awareness and feedback loops. Okay. I love it. And then how do you, how do you become more aware? What has been your training strategies to do that? Journaling has been very helpful. Video feedback has been very

helpful. Uh, so it's just feedback, feedback loops, like how many different cycles, like I'm doing this thing and now I'm observing, you know, how did I do? Um, what, what could I have done better? What worked? What didn't work? Will you play things back in your head after you've done it? And it could be you're in a board meeting for a VC pitch and you put your hand up and say, okay, I've got an idea guys or whatever. And, and then afterwards, would you play that back up and say, okay, I've got an idea guys or whatever. And, and then afterwards, would you play that back to see from different angles, how you could have done better? Probably to a fault. So you would go to a place of critique and you'd play it too often? No, I just mean that like, definitely I'm, I'm constantly trying to analyze and modulate like

how, you know, what could i do better in every scenario so if that's a skill the the analytical mind for you how do you dampen or quiet the analytical mind during more animalistic mind challenges animalistic meaning more like non-thinking where you just read react respond and so how would you temper that natural strength you have to be smart? I think that that's where the ball comes in, in my particular context. But I think that's where like mastery over the fundamentals, the skills gives me the confidence that I don't have to hyperthink. Like I don't have to think so much about doing these actions.

So I'm in control. Okay. So self-talk then sounds something like this to you. I've put in the work. Yeah. Okay. So that phrase allows you to not have to think about having a good frame or where to move your feet

or where to put your eyes, right? Like you might think about those things occasionally, but that statement I've put in the work helps you be able to get free. Right. Okay. And then when self-doubt or critique start to pop in, how do you move that out or how do you work with it? I don't want to say move it out. How do you work with that biting self-dialogue? I think this is where that competitive drive comes in. So I think it has to do with, I started to recognize that I did not fear playing against Brazil or Jiba. So it's a whole model, right?

That's your model. Like, like I run to the edge. I want to get, I want to get better and these opportunities are going to teach me how to get better. Right. Yeah. So it's a looking forward as opposed to being afraid of. Yeah. And I, and a lot of the pressure that we faced is from a professional athlete standpoint is here's this owner that's paid you a bunch of money to be there. And now they're sort of expecting you to, to perform like a video game. Like I bought you with these statistics and you're not delivering these

statistics. And whenever I would feel sort of the pressure mounting of outside, outside pressure, I would usually find a coffee shop corner of a coffee shop, grab my journal and just sort of remind myself like, this is who I am and this is what I'm doing. And this is why I'm doing what I'm doing. So is that prescriptive? This is who I am. This is what I'm doing. And this is why I'm doing what I'm doing. Is that pretty prescriptive? Yeah. Without knowing it probably. Yeah, I think it is. And it would always get me to the place where it's just like wait a second i want this more than this other guy these other people like and what is the one what do what is it that you want this now we're getting into drive right yeah i think i think it's i believe i can do it and i want to beat brazil i want to beat you know xyz i want to i want to I want to beat, you know, X, Y, Z. I want to, I want to, I want to perform at my best.

Which, which one is it? And you, you don't have to pick one, but is it be your best or kick their ass? I think that, um, you know, cause I'm, I'm not very results driven, but I have the belief that I can win. And so it's a fine line. Okay, so let's play a scenario. Okay, how about let's take world championships or Olympics and you barely contribute and you get gold. Scenario B, you kick ass. You're on fire. PRs, stats through the roof.

You're running shop. It's amazing. Two guys choke and you take a fourth. And I don't want you to get confused about a selfishness to to the team like right right which one would you rather have there's probably other scenarios we can play yeah i probably have better like if we did it like it as an individual sport that would be an easier okay let's do it that way yeah because i know you're you're so i'm just learned something about you is that you're really considerate of other people. Like you think about other people's wellbeing, maybe above your own. Um, I don't know about, um, you know, I can, I can be pretty selfish as well, but I've

come to appreciate that we're better together. And, uh, you know, that was especially through my team sports. And so now that I'm in beach volleyball, um, it's a huge annoyance to me. And I'm trying to break the mold of changing this collection of Mavericks into more of a team minded, you know, operation. And so that's what I'm trying to set out to do. So I definitely thrive of contributing to something larger than just myself, but it's hard for me to hear that scenario and be okay with my performance, but other people, you know, like, so if you, if you came back to me with golf, I'm a golfer.

Yeah. I don't, I really don't know what it is. I don't know how to decipher the two or distinguish it between the two because when I fail, there's still a win. What is your definition of failure? if I, if I were to not make an Olympic team or, you know, lose the game, there's still more to learn through that experience. And, you know, I think for me, it was really important to sort of understand that when I'm operating at the outer edges of my ability and competing hard, what I think about myself doesn't matter anymore because I have a job to do. And once I sort of saw that, like, wow, I'm not having to like overcome my mind. I just don't need to think about myself. So much freedom in that.

I'm just competing. Yeah. And that's, that's the gift of being completely absorbed in anything you do is that you don't have to monitor yourself and evaluate if you're okay. If I'm not okay, am I doing, is that thought work? No,

it doesn't work. Let me change the thought. No, no. It's like everything is absorbed. Nearly everything. Majority of your resources are engaged with what you're doing. And that's where you start to,

you know, you hear about the zone and flow state and the pocket musicians call it. What percentage of the time did flow state and the pocket musicians call it, what percentage of the time did you spend in the pocket? I think that, uh, I became pretty good at, um, basically bookmarking the matches, the competitive, you know, so, you know, it especially started in probably like 2007, 2008, where I would literally go through the mental routine of, okay, I'm here to work. And I'm tying my shoes. I'm in the locker room and I'm earmarking the next three hours. I'm going all in on the current point.

And before we won the gold that year, that was probably the most pure competitive months that I've ever been a part of because there was no expectation of what winning was like. We hadn't won yet. And it was the most, uh, the best compliment I've ever received from a team that I've been on was you could never tell the score by looking at us, whether we were up by eight or down by eight. And that's just, we were, we were all just sort of in the pocket. And I think that, you know, when you start to put expectations in there and, um, you start to get ahead of yourself or you're thinking, you know, that pulls you away from that current moment. And it's actually kind of interesting now that I'm

competing now in tournaments versus matches that these are, you know, I'm having to get up and in that zone and then I'm down. And then two hours later, I got to get back in it. And it's been sort of a new discipline and rhythm. What do you do to train your mind? You've got a really strong, sturdy framework. You look forward to challenges. You know what it feels like to let go of the analytical mind to get into the now focus, whatever that is. You're less consumed with making mistakes than figuring out how to grow, correct? And so like your framework is sturdy. How do you train your mind? Do you like, let's do confidence or calm or deep focus? What are you doing to train those?

You know, I think, um, what am I doing? I think that you might say journaling. You might say, yeah, I would speak to myself and write out my thoughts to make, make them better. Yeah. And the only reason I started journaling was because it slowed me down. Like I can't write very fast. And so I, you know, it's not like a, you know, I went to McDonald's today and that was really cool and it felt really great. You know, it's, it's sort of like, this is the thing that's on my mind right now. And,

um, it's, it would slow me down and help me to stay on, topic. And so I definitely think journaling was one or is one. My goal is to get as close as possible to objectivity. I want to know what actually happened and I want to be able to process that as soon as I can. And I think that this is why I'm employing this team concept to the beach is I know how our emotions can cloud our judgment. And it's hard for us to actually see what is taking place. Perfect example is I had a new partnership this year that the first couple of days was anything but the honeymoon phase. It was awful. And had I judged by that moment, I would have jumped ship and just been like, this just isn't a fit. But by recommendation by Todd Rogers, um, somebody who I reach out to a time and again for some advice, gold medalist from 2008 on the beach side, he said, why don't you guys have a meeting,

set out some roles and expectations, you know, get some people around you. And we did that. Did you say roles or rules? Roles. Roles and expectations. Yeah. So this is what you're doing. And how large is your team? It's a two person team on the sand. Two person team, you know, in that particular meeting we had two other people, um, a stat analytics coach and, um, what I call a body optimizer, somebody that's sort of just trying to keep my body in check. But just sort of going through that exercise, established a framework and it was night and day. And we went on to have our both of our collected best finishes the next tournament. And it was he was a joy to play with, you know, good guy to play with.

So, um, still your current partner. No, that was, that was actually Madison McKibben. Uh, my current partner, Ricardo Santos, um, four time Olympian from Brazil. Um, but I, I think that, uh, one of the major game changers for me was actually when I was journaling. I was in Russia. It was the day after a match. I was having coffee. And I was sort of just kind of going through the night before and bemoaning how I should have gotten more balls, more sets. I should have gotten different scenarios. They should have been in this scenario, not that scenario.

And all of these reasons why I wasn't succeeding. And it was sort of like a moment of sobriety when I, when I just hit me that I was just like, I've written this before and I've probably written it a dozen times. And it's been about, you know, 12 different setters from probably 12 different nations. And so that was sort of the wake up call that was just like, okay, there's one common denominator in this exchange and that's me. And what I learned from that was not just how to take responsibility and personal responsibility, but how the solutions can be so easy. And so my solution offensively was simply a two-step shuffle to the left. That's all that was happening and why I wasn't being very offensively effective. And from that moment on, I mean,

we went on to win the championship that year in Russia. And offensively, it was a game changer. And it was simply because I finally stopped blaming and was able to recognize, okay, what is actually happening? So as it relates to like my mind game moving forward, like I'm constantly just trying to get to objectivity. And so writing is part of your process to do that writing. And now that we have analytics and stats and video, like any sort of feedback loop is in, in, in, from the business. And, you know, now we have all these great analytic tools, um, you know, what's working, what's not working. It's such a huge part. That's why the, you know why these major businesses are paying major dollars to have those departments because feedback loops are so important. Of all the things in the world that are available to you to do, why is it that you have chosen volleyball?

It was love at first sight. Was there a particular moment that that happened for you? You know, so it was like I was a freshman in high school. I was introduced to it in PE. I had played all the other sports, but there was just something different. I just wanted to play. It was simply just a passion. We had success that year.

I wasn't even big enough to play in the front row. It was like five foot two, my freshman year. And we went like 11 and 0 in the conference. And then we moved to Phoenix and didn't even know if boys volleyball was available in Arizona. It just so happened that that had to, that was the first year that boys volleyball was sanctioned as a high school sport, uh, in, in Arizona. And it was just one of those things where we were playing at lunchtime, we were playing two men, six men. It was just something that I, I, it was, it was just pure passion and passion sort of merged with my sort of obsessive desire to figure things out and pick the lock. Um, and, and it just led into a career where there

was no plan personally. Um, I had no idea that you could make money doing it. I was extremely fortunate to have played when I did because various markets opened at certain times, which, you know, created a, an even, you know, better professional opportunity. And so it was just one of those things that one thing led to another. And now I look back and it was, yes, it was a profession, but it has shaped me as an individual and it's really molded me as a person. What are you most hungry for? What are you, what are you searching for at the deepest levels? Answers. I'm, I'm drawn to pick the lock and, you know, I think that I haven't really thought of that question until you ask it, but I think that, uh, you know, I'm just in every subject of life. I think I'm just constantly searching for like, what's the best way?

What's right? What's true? Optimization. And, you know, golf is a great example of I don't just go play golf. Like I'm trying to get it. And it annoys some of my friends, but it's like, that's how I'm wired. Okay. And then when you, when I think of how you wake up in the morning, what do you do? Cause you're really intense. Yeah. So what do you do with

the first thing out of, uh, out of bed? Well, I make, uh, the best cappuccino, you know, this side of the tell you how much caffeine do you have? Oh, not a ton. Um, one cappuccino, you know, this side of the Italia. How much caffeine do you have? Oh, not a ton. Um, one cappuccino, two cappuccinos, two cappuccinos in the morning, potentially a cold brew in the afternoon. If I don't get a nap, is that like, are you a napper overseas life? Um, and you know, from the women's side that it's just so much slower, so much more healthy, but, uh, yeah, that was definitely a part of our deal where, you know, morning workout, nice lunch, you know, 45 minute snooze and then kind of rally for, for another workout and go out for dinner. What kind of sleep do you get?

Probably six, six to seven hours. Where are you best? Sleep wise? Yeah. Probably in that range. Okay. But I would say that an afternoon snooze, I'm even better. Six to seven with an afternoon. Right.

And you said 45 minutes or is it less? Yeah, 45 minutes. Okay. And then what does your nutrition look like? I take it pretty seriously. My wife helps me with that. She's massively into non-GMO organic. How close can we get to original source? So she's had a big influence on me. You know, I was especially around like 2006, 2007, especially in this tournament, the World League, it's six weeks long and we're playing two matches every weekend in a different place over the globe. So it's crazy demanding. And for like six years in a row, I was in the top five of every statistical category only to limp to the finish line and just totally decline. And it was then that I was introduced to recovery shakes and I could really, and it was in finding recovery shakes. It was

sort of like a three carb to one protein recovery shake that you have right away. And that sort of buffers that need to go get food. But the three to one, you know, we call it a protein shake, but it's, it's really more of a carb shake. but that sort of turned me on to the idea of like, I used to think it was just calories. Like I'm expending 2000, 3000, 4000 calories. So I just need to replace those calories to wait a second. If I choose specific different calories, I have a different output. And so that's when I really started to take it more seriously and kind of cut out sort of the bad stuff, sodas and highly processed foods and try to eat more clean. Okay, brilliant. And then when I think about gratitude, who comes to mind for you? Gratitude who comes to mind for you? Gratitude.

You know, my dad comes to mind. You better say your wife. We'll just say your wife now. Yeah. It's just good to say. But really it's your dad popped up for you just in this conversation. Yeah. Yeah. My dad popped into my mind. Obviously, you know, he just, you know just level-headed, always would think through an issue. I could trust, obviously, my mom as well. But just my dad has this real even keel. What did he do for a profession? He was a musician, a professing musician, who became a pastor.

And that didn't happen overnight. It was sort of like this progression and now he's sort of in organizational consulting and, um, you know, does some writing and, and stuff like that. Uh, he, one of the greatest displays of love actually was something that he did for me when, um, right after the 2004 Olympic games. So we finished fourth, which is hard. You get to, you played in the bronze match and you lost and we lost. Yeah. Winter goes on and high fives and jumping around and you're like, what just happened? Right. Yeah. And up to that point, you know, my dad was a baseball player, football, basketball, and I fell in love with volleyball. And so they just supported, you know, there wasn't a ton of X and O's that they could offer. Um, and they just sort of were just supportive in there and

would just watch. And so here I, I rose to the national team and went through four years, and I just finished my first Olympics. And he wrote me this super long email, hadn't said a single thing about X's and O's for 10 years. And he's like, hey, you know, from my perspective, this is what I think went down. And it was so like right on that it was just like, he's not in practice. You know what I mean? We're not having these conversations to where, but he had just been, you know, it just,

I guess for me, it just made me feel like, man, he, he hasn't just been here. He's been here. Very cool. And, um, yeah, really cool. And so that was, um, that was really special. And of course my wife, um, has been great. And I think that, you know, from, we talked about insecurities and things like that, you know, when you're sort of complete that relationship, um, I think it sort of completes yourself in a way. Um, and you know, my weaknesses, her strengths, just that molding, um, of our beings, I think was incredibly impactful on, on me moving forward and starting to recognize, cause I think maturity is really important. And I think just by virtue of it, no longer just being about yourself, you know, that relationship really starts to teach you that

there's more to life than just, you know, getting on with your day. I love it on that note. What are you doing next? Like, what are you doing in your transition from sport? I know you're going to, you're making a push for one more Olympics and beach. And then what is the business stuff? What are the transitions that you're making for the next phase of your life? You know, I'm, I'm trying to answer questions. That's how, how, how I'm trying to start. And so instead of trying to think of, I've always had an entrepreneurial heart of wanting to start something. And obviously being within volleyball, I've seen the gaps and I've felt the desire to, man, I really wish this was happening and it's not. And so there's certainly things that I want to do, especially from like a media production standpoint,

you know, volleyball is having a very difficult time communicating a full and coherent and complete story. And so I want to sort of bridge the gap in that, but instead of just going out there and trying to build a product that I think is great, I'm sort of opening up myself and giving access to those I'm connected with via social media, um, my newsletter, et cetera. They can fall. People can follow what you're doing. Exactly. Yeah. Cool. And I'm asking them, what questions do you have? And that's really setting up for the material that I'm producing. So I've written a book. I've put out sort of... What's the title?

Max Potential Playbook. Max Potential Playbook. Yeah, cool. And people can get it where? They can subscribe to my newsletter at readpretty.com and get it for free. R-E-I-D-P-R-I-D-D-Y. P-R-I-D- D D Y.com. Yep. And then, uh, what else, what else are you doing? Doing some speaking engagements. Um, I'm helping out with some of the local colleges. What is the central theme that you talk about or that you want

to talk about to organizations? To me, it's, it's how to respond to adversity. Um, so like if someone is listening, they say, and they're at corporate A, B, and C, they say, you know what? We got tough times coming ahead of us and stock market values or the trends that are taking place and, or our expectations from shareholders are really high or entrepreneur stuff. Like, you know, the bouncy road that, that we're on, we'd love to bring you in. They can find you at read pretty.com. Exactly. And then, and then your main, the thing you'd love to talk about the most is managing adversity. How many, how many surgeries have you had? I've had three surgeries, but one was double knee surgery at the same time. Same time. Dude, how do you do it as a professional athlete did you just say i'm

gonna have to shut her down for a while let me do them both at the same time so i have a chance at the next season i basically had to choose the graph site uh so i tore my acl on my right and which is where we're going with the bulgaria bit um that happened the second night so right when i had clarity of of no this is this is where I fit with this group. It was, it was 12 hours later or 24 hours later that I had a torn ACL. And so I chose, I couldn't use the graph site on the same knee because of all of patella tendinopathy. And so they took it from, I had to either choose a cadaver or use my own tissue and

it had to come from my left side. And so that's why it was a double knee surgery. Got it. Okay. Brilliant. Okay. Um, phenomenal. And then is there a way that people can support you on your journey? Is there something that you have that people can be connected to? And that could be social media, which is, um, free and follow along and anything in between of being paid as well? Yeah, I think, you know, just engagement. You know, I think that people who are interested in this journey and these kinds of conversations can follow me on social media. What's your social media handles? Just read pretty both on Twitter and Instagram and then official read pretty on Facebook.

Okay. And then here's two more, and then official Read Pretty on Facebook. Okay. And then here's two more kind of really challenging questions. My philosophy is? My philosophy is I want to live a life of significance. And I think that there's constantly this battle of how our world culture, um, and I don't, I don't say world and culture as if I'm above it. I'm a part of it, but there's this waterfall river of, um, influence that talks about success in certain terms. And especially I just turned 40, you know, I'm right there in the midst of it trying to think, you know, like what, what is life about? And, um, I want to make a difference, not, not just a dollar. Um, and, and so, you know, I, I want to live a life that, uh,

you know, that is based on those terms. Is there a belief that you would hope people could install or consume or water or whatever the right phraseology would be that people could take with them that you wish you had maybe at a younger age? You know, I think it comes back to, and this might even be, you know, even as you were sort of asking me about like a speaking engagement, like what, um, as you were sort of repeating back to me, my answer, the idea of team came to mind as, as something that I'm really passionate about too. And so like the idea that we're better together would probably be something that I would, you know, be super passionate about spreading, you know, that news laying that seed was that we're just better together. Jack Clark is the university of Cal rugby coach. And he says, you know, something that sport does that none of the

other interdisciplinary or discipline arts and sciences at universities is we get a PhD in team. That's a really cool thought. Is that a PhD in team? Yeah. Okay. Brilliant. And then it all comes down to, it all comes down to love. Is there a word that cuts to the center of what you understand most? Faith. Is there a word that cuts to the center of what you do best? Compete. Love it. And then how do you articulate, define, or think about the concept of mastery? You know, to me, mastery, the way I view it is sort of, um, having the tools, experience, and ability to handle any situation. And so like, for me, you know, I, I really fought perfectionism for a good portion of my career. And I think that the martial arts sort of nailed it with sort of like the black belt. Because when you get a black belt, you're not perfect.

You're proficient. You're prepared. You have the tools necessary to handle what comes your way and so that's probably how I define it brilliant read it's been a joy to see you rip down in Rio it was fun to see what you guys have done what you accomplished and what you did and how you did it it was a joy to spend this time with you here today. So thank you and thank your family for the time that we're able to spend today. And, um, you know, I just want to wish you the best and we can follow along on read pretty.com and hopefully, you know, that it's everything in the future that you hope it

will be happened the way that you see it. So thank you. Thank you. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. All right. Thank you so much for diving into another episode of Finding Mastery with us. Our team loves creating this podcast and sharing these conversations with you. We really appreciate you being part of this community. And if you're enjoying the show, the easiest no-cost way to support is to hit the subscribe or follow button wherever you're listening. Also, if you haven't already,

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