Finding Mastery with Dr. Michael Gervais - SportsCenter Anchor Lisa Kerney on Growth Mindset, Vision, Being Present

Episode Date: May 31, 2017

Lisa Kerney is an anchor of the evening and night editions of SportsCenter. In this conversation we learn what it's like to have a childhood dream -- and -- more importantly how to make decisions that map-onto making that childhood dream come to life. When we see people who are doing what they always wanted to do -- they have much to teach us about what it takes to set a long term vision -- how to persevere through the ups and downs -- and how to fuel the passion that is required to "play the long game." Lisa has definitely played the long game, betting on herself, her skills, and her family structure to support and challenge her along the way. I wanted to learn from Lisa how she's seemingly been able to juggle so many facets of her life -- both family and professional. While there's no silver bullet (rarely there is), she points to the importance of going for "big challenges", really being open to coaching (not just saying that), and how important being fully locked-in and present is for her to maximize her time with her loved ones. What I loved about this conversation is that it's really clear for Lisa -- and with that clarity, how the path forward gets much easier to recognize (not any easier to travel, but easier to recognize)._________________Subscribe to our Youtube Channel for more powerful conversations at the intersection of high performance, leadership, and meaning: https://www.youtube.com/c/FindingMasteryGet exclusive discounts and support our amazing sponsors! Go to: https://findingmastery.com/sponsors/Subscribe to the Finding Mastery newsletter for weekly high performance insights: https://www.findingmastery.com/newsletter Download Dr. Mike's Morning Mindset Routine! https://www.findingmastery.com/morningmindsetFollow us on Instagram, LinkedIn, and X.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Finding Mastery is brought to you by Remarkable. In a world that's full of distractions, focused thinking is becoming a rare skill and a massive competitive advantage. That's why I've been using the Remarkable Paper Pro, a digital notebook designed to help you think clearly and work deliberately. It's not another device filled with notifications or apps.

It's intentionally built for deep work. So there's no social media, no email, no noise. The writing experience, it feels just like pen on paper. I love it. And it has the intelligence of digital tools like converting your handwriting to text, organizing your notes, tagging files, and using productivity templates

to help you be more effective. It is sleek, minimal. It's incredibly lightweight. It feels really good. I take it with me anywhere from meetings to travel without missing a beat. What I love most is that it doesn't try to do everything. It just helps me do one very important thing really well,

stay present and engaged with my thinking and writing. If you wanna slow down, if you wanna work smarter, I highly encourage you to check them out. Visit remarkable.com to learn more and grab your paper pro today. It's never a question for me if I'm going to do something. If I want to do something, I'm going to do it. And that's how I feel about everything I go about in life. So if I want to be at the highest level at SportsCenter, and if I want to do a particular show, then I will reach out to whichever boss it might be and say, hey, this is what I'm gonna do. Because what do we have to lose if we wait to and just keep to ourselves what we

want to do, then we're betting against ourselves from the very beginning. Welcome back or welcome to the Finding Mastery podcast. I'm Michael Gervais. The idea behind these conversations is to learn from people who are on the path of mastery, to better understand what they're searching for and to understand their psychological framework, which is how they see the world, how they see themselves in it, and how they understand their craft. And we want to dig to understand the mental skills that they've used to build and refine their craft. Finding Mastery is brought to you by LinkedIn Sales Solutions. In any high-performing environment that I've been part of, from elite teams to executive boardrooms, one thing holds true.

Meaningful relationships are at the center of sustained success. And building those relationships, it takes more than effort. It takes a real caring about your people. It takes the right tools, the right information at the right time. And that's where LinkedIn Sales Navigator can come in. It's a tool designed specifically

for thoughtful sales professionals, helping you find the right people that are ready to engage, track key account changes, and connect with key decision makers more effectively. It surfaces real-time signals, like when someone changes jobs or when an account becomes high priority, so that you can reach out at exactly the right moment with context and thoroughness that builds trust.

It also helps tap into your own network more strategically, showing you who you already know that can help you open doors or make a warm introduction. In other words, it's not about more outreach. It's about smarter, more human outreach. And that's something here at Finding Mastery that our team lives and breathes by. If you're ready to start building stronger relationships that actually convert,

try LinkedIn Sales Navigator for free for 60 days at linkedin.com slash deal. That's linkedin.com slash deal. That's linkedin.com slash deal. For two full months for free, terms and conditions apply. Finding Mastery is brought to you by David Protein. I'm pretty intentional about what I eat, and the majority of my nutrition comes from whole foods. And when I'm traveling or in between meals,

on a demanding day certainly, I need something quick that will support the way that I feel and think and perform. And that's why I've been leaning on David Protein Bars. And so has the team here at Finding Mastery. In fact, our GM, Stuart, he loves them so much. I just want to kind of quickly put him on the spot. Stuart, I know you're listening. I think you might be the reason that we're running out of these bars so quickly.

They're incredible, Mike. I love them. One a day. One a day. What do you mean one a day? There's way more than that happening here. Don't tell. Okay.

All right, look, they're incredibly simple. They're effective. 28 grams of protein, just 150 calories and zero grams of sugar. It's rare to find something that fits so conveniently into a performance-based lifestyle and actually tastes good. Dr. Peter Attia, someone who's been on the show, it's a great episode by the way, is also their chief science officer. So I know they've done their due diligence in that category. My favorite flavor right now is the chocolate chip cookie dough. And a few of our teammates here at Finding Mastery have been loving the fudge brownie and peanut butter.

I know, Stuart, you're still listening here. So getting enough protein matters. And that can't be understated, not just for strength, but for energy and focus, recovery, for longevity. And I love that David is making that easier. So if you're trying to hit your daily protein goals with something seamless, I'd love for you to go check them out. Get a free variety pack, a $25 value and 10% off for life when you head to davidprotein.com slash finding mastery. That's David, D-A-V-I-D, protein, P-R-O-T-E-I-N.com slash finding mastery. Now this conversation is with Lisa Kearney. Lisa is an anchor of the Evening and Night Editions of SportsCenter. And in this conversation, we learn what it's like to have a childhood dream and how, more

importantly, it is to make decisions that map on to making that childhood dream come to life. When we see people who are doing what they've always wanted to do, they have much to teach us about what it takes to set a long-term vision and how to persevere through the ups and downs that come along that journey, and also how to fuel the passion that's required to play the long game. And Lisa has definitely played the long game. She's bet on herself, she's bet on her skills, and she's bet on her family structure to support and challenge her along the way. And what I wanted to learn from Lisa was how she seemingly has been able to juggle so many facets of her life, both family-wise and professional-wise. And while there's no silver bullet, there rarely is, she points in the importance of being able to go for big challenges.

And we talk about what she means by that and how important it is for her to be really open to coaching and not just saying that, but being really open to getting better and to learning and to taking that feedback and how important it is to be fully locked in and present so that she can maximize the time she's with her loved ones and while she's at work as well. And what I loved about this conversation is that it's really clear for Lisa. And with that clarity, how the path going forward gets so much easier to recognize, not necessarily easier to travel that path, but easier to recognize the path that is right for each one of us. And so with that, let's jump right into this conversation with Lisa Kearney. Lisa, how are you? I'm well, Mike. How are you? I'm doing great. And, you know, I'm just thinking as I asked that question,

is that it's one of those questions that we don't really ever answer. Like, how are you? Well, if you really want to know, I'm... Great. Yeah. So, like, for real, like, how are you? I mean, you know, I'm very well, I can say that I'm, I'm happy. No one ever says, Hey, I'm happy. Um, I'm very happy. I'm very, um, I've found a space in my life as a mom, as a professional,

as a friend, a sister, a daughter, um, a partner, best friends, my husband, who's amazing, that all of those worlds are seeming to collide at a really awesome time. And I'm kind of riding the wave right now, Mike. So I am, in fact, very well. And thank you for asking. Yeah, that's okay. Cool answer. And then, okay, so you're a couple years into being a regular studio anchor

at ESPN, right? And how long has it been since you've been a regular anchor? Yeah, I just reached the three-year mark. So I just literally right at the three-year deal. Okay. And then when you say three-year deal, is that like literally the business? Is it a one-year, two-year, five-year? Like how do the contracts work at ESPN for folks that are on air? There are a number of different ways to go about it. My contract I initially signed, I signed three years and then, you know, an extra year option for ESPN, which they recently picked up.

And it was it was a couple of days before Christmas. And I'm really good friends with the guy over at ESPN that does the contracts and all this stuff. And so we text every now and then. And I get this like sticky, you know, the like FedEx sticky note on your front door that says you have an official package from ESPN. And so I'm like, really? Like, I have to go all the way to the post office, get this package. It's official, you know, official documentation. And I go standing in line at Christmas time, you know, a couple days before.

So I'm standing in line forever and everyone's got all their packages and everything and i step up there and they hand me this like tiny little letter and i walk out and it's just you know the form letter saying oh we've we're excited to let you know we've picked up your option and i texted rob my friend and i said really rob you had to put me through that you couldn't just text me like a thumbs up emoji? Really? Yeah. Well, congratulations. Yeah, congratulations. I'm very pleased. And yes, I'm blessed to be hanging on for another year.

Very cool. And so when you say hanging on, there's like before that we jumped on this call, your travel from home to work is, it's a significant commitment every day, right? It's like an hour plus every day. It is. It's a, it's about an hour 20 every day, one way. And, and for anyone that lives in the Northeast and specifically in the greater New York area, you know, that traffic is a crapshoot no matter what time of day it is um i work only at night so i do all sports runner at night shows and so my commute is uh it can be anywhere from an hour 20 to it's taken me over three hours before um i actually have posted that on twitter i'm like

i'd like to congratulate myself on an awesome three-hour commute to work today thank you everybody for accompanying me on the road literally everybody yeah okay so everybody everybody i mean that's like so people see turn on sports center and they see you and they see you having a good time and asking good questions and giving commentary and at the epicenter of um sport media and likely miss what it takes to get there and have some sense of idea that this is what I hear all the time. Oh, well, you know, she or he got lucky or he or she must have known somebody or he or she did something to, you know, cheat their way to the top. There's like the overnight success. You know, there's lots of ways that people rationalize or think about people that are doing something that they love or are, have a public, um, what's, what am I saying? Like a public facing job. So can you pull back the curtain a little bit about your process to

be one of the evening anchors at SportsCenter? Sure. I mean, um, my journey has been a long one, a winding one. Um, you want me to take you all the way back to 2004, my first job? Yeah, we're probably going to go back to like, you know, when you were 10 or 9 or 5 at some point. That's also significant. We can definitely get there. Just from a professional landscape, I mean, where I started, I started in Butte, Montana. And the funny, funny story about that, because I finished up my, my college education, and I played basketball down at Lynn University in Boca Raton, Florida. And I had planned actually to

go back and get my master's degree. I mean, I love school down there, I wanted to be a grad assistant. And just I just wanted to keep learning and at the same time really anxious and excited to break into the business because I knew that I wanted to be a sports anchor. And so over the summer – When did that happen for you? When I was about five or six. Oh, so we do need to go back. Yeah, we do need to go back. Okay.

Okay. Keep going with your story and then we'll go back earlier. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So just starting after when I graduated from college, I knew I always wanted to do sports. And as I just mentioned, I always just kind of organically felt that this was my path. And I'm very blessed that it worked for me.

So I sent out, so I applied to 10 different jobs on this website called tvjobs.com and I got two job offers and one of them being in Minnesota, one of them being in Butte, Montana. And I was on the phone with Phil connecting my news director. I'll never forget him. Um, and he was kind of describing the job and then, you know, everybody wants to know, right? Like does this conversation end with the, like the price tag? Right. So I'm like, Oh man, what does a job like this pay? And then he says, so, so, you know, we pay you $18,500 and I was like, Oh man.

And like now people are probably going, Oh geez, $18,500. But me, I was like, Oh my gosh, that's money that I would make all by myself. And like without my parents, I'm so independent. And my dad asks me, so how much are you going to pay you? And I tell him and he said, well, you told him no, right? And my dad's thinking, you know, the education and go the route that can can make you the most money and and you know be highly successful in that regard and I was like no I told him this is great like sign me up let's go um it's all about fulfilling our passions right and and what

makes you happy is is your day-to-day and I I knew that this is what something I wanted to take a stab at and that was my opportunity so I went to Butte Montana I wanted to take a stab at. And that was my opportunity. So I went to Butte, Montana. I was there for literally one year to the day. And there's a moment that I'll never forget. First of all, I lived in low income housing. And that was an experience in and of itself in Butte, Montana, which is awesome that I qualified for it. But I was at the grocery store.

And again, it's like, you know, I don't know anyone in the entire state. I'm completely on my own for the very first time. I'd always been a part of a team, basketball team, soccer team, you know, tennis track, whatever it is. I grew up in a big jock. And so here I am in the middle of nowhere. I don't know anybody and feeling my way around. I'm at the grocery store and got all the groceries going through.

And there's a bundle of grapes, green, big, perfect grapes. And she scans them. And I said, whoa, hang on a second. How much are those? She said, oh, $6. I was like, $6 for grapes? I can't afford that so I'm putting back six dollars worth of grapes because at the time like there's no way I can afford that and eat like the rest of

my dinner you know it's either grapes or you know the chicken that I was going to make that night so um that's certainly a a lesson that has learned that has stuck with me for a very long time. Okay, so when people talk about starting a long time ago and it was rough and you had to pay your dues, you understand it. Living in low-income housing, having to put back grapes because you couldn't afford them. And then you left Montana and then you went to Seattle, I think. Yes. I went. Yeah.

So from Butte, Montana, I went to Seattle, the NBC affiliate there, King 5. And it was an amazing experience full of incredible growth. When I got there, I was very, very green in the 13th market in the country. And probably a lot of people looked at me and were like how in the heck what is she doing here you know and i'm and i'm i'm gonna go get her and so i just hit the ground running and okay let's let's pause right here for just a minute okay so you're sorting it out and you have a one-year job, you're just getting your feet wet, you're not making much money, and then you're thrust into one of the top markets in the world, 13, right? Uh-huh. And then did you – I'm going to say this phrase, imposter syndrome.

Did you ever flirt with the idea that, oh, my God, they're going to find out that I don't know what I'm doing, and it's just going to come crumbling? Or did you have another way to do it, which is, you know, there's 100 different ways, but did you have something else that was like, you know what, I figured things out, like, let's go? Yeah, so in my internship, I actually learned something that has also stuck with me. I interned the summer of my junior year back in Kansas City, and I was at Metro Sports. And one of the anchors there told me, you know, just fake it till you make it. Like no one knows if you're really good at faking it until you make it. And you truly believe that you should be there, then the whole faking thing is going to dissolve and you're just there. You

just gave yourself a head start. And so for me, that definitely applied with my job in Butte, Montana. When I took the job there, they're asking, you know, can you shoot a camera? I'm like, oh yeah, yeah, I can shoot a camera and white balance and all that stuff. Absolutely. I know everything. Took the job and I'd never turned a camera on Absolutely. I know everything took the job and I'd never turned a camera on. Like I was like, Oh, I got to go back. You know? So I'm like, absolutely. I can do this. And you know why I can do it? Because I'm going to learn how to do it before I get there. So I showed up and, and knew, knew how to work the camera and all that stuff. And, um, knew exactly what I was doing from that standpoint, but I had everything else to learn.

My friends at my internship taught me how to run the camera, and I learned a lot about just the industry and the business itself. So when I got to Seattle, to answer your question, did I feel like an imposter? No, I didn't. I felt like, man, I've got really good stuff, And here I am in the 13th market in the country, and I'm crushing it. And at the same time, you got to kind of step back. And I never did this in this in this short period of time. And I'm going to give you a story here in a second. Like take a step back and assess with like the reality of your situation versus like the ideals of it in

your head so I was living in the ideals in my head and I'm like this is awesome you know I've got an awesome job at this huge company and this is NBC and here I am and and then I get this call from the news director that hired me Pat Costello who I'm very close with to this day. And he calls me into his office and he's an imposing man, first of all. And, uh, he sits me down and he says, so what do you think about Spokane? And I'm thinking, uh, what do you mean? Like, have I ever been there? Or like, what do i know about it i don't know anything the only thing i know is and this is all processing very quickly in my head the only thing i know is we have a sister station in spokane and i was like oh you mean like what

about what do i think about me going to spokane like a huge demotion to send me like back to the D league to learn a little bit, you know, polish my stuff and then come back. And I was like, Oh no, no, no, no,

no, no, no, no, no, that's actually not going to work for me and I will get better. And I swear it to this day, you will never have to have this conversation with me again.

And it was a huge, again, like what, like another moment that I'll never forget. I'll never forget how I felt in that moment. And it just, it launched me really, because from that second on, I, I learned like, it's okay to reach out to your colleagues and say, Hey, would you check out my stuff and just tell me what you think? And how can I get better? And from that moment, like, I have consistently, sometimes every day, every week, with my colleagues even now, I'll ask them, like, hey, how did you think that went?

Or how could I have gone about this question in this interview better? Or let's watch these highlights back. Oh, that was really bad. Like, like just, just to be open with myself so that I can welcome improvement and that criticism to get better. You know, do you find that that's easy for you? Or is that challenging? And I want to tell you a funny little story before you answer it is that I was watching some sort of highlights on, it was an NFL highlight reel and it was a mic'd up edition where they had a microphone on one of the players and he walks over or the referee walks over to him and says, hey man, you got to keep your hands off the guy. Like you're all over him. And the athlete kind of

jumped at the ref because he's animated and he's competing. And he's like, no, no, no, I'm not doing that. That's not what I'm doing. And the ref goes, seriously, you got to keep your hands off the guy. And he goes, oh man, I'm so defensive. I get defensive. I'm so sorry. I get defensive so early, so quickly. And so it was like this nice little moment where the athlete jumped in to be defensive and then had this meta awareness that oh man there's my defensiveness thing you're right you're right i gotta get i'm gonna do better and so i'm wondering like in that story for you is it that easy for you that immediately you say oh okay i'm gonna do whatever it takes to get better or do you do you have some sort of internal

argument about, no, no, no, I'm good. And the reason I'm asking you is because people that are exceptional, they tend to be open to learning and they believe that they're great. And those two ideas are hard to work together. And that's a really long story and question for me to try to understand how you've balanced those two concepts. Yeah, that's a fair question. And I, and those are two, two that certainly rival each other. Um, so to live at peace, um, I will honestly tell you, I'm more of an apologist and can step back and say like you know what that's totally my bad and for I want to learn from that moment and I'm not even just saying that like I really someone just asked me literally two days ago you know what's the next step for you

you're at ESPN and you know what's the next step was like, I don't I don't have a step planned out for me. Every moment on TV is an opportunity for me to just get better. I want my my Pelicans highlight that I just did a second ago. To I want that to exist as it did. And I want to be better now with my bull's highlight and with my calves highlight that I'm doing next, I want it to be better than my bull's highlight. And I want, I want to, and you know, Pete Carroll talks about this a lot. He talks about living in the moment and be very present. And that's, that is, that is exactly what we do in our industry and in his too. I mean, it's frenetic all the time and you have to live in that particular moment.

And for me, I just want, I want to get better from moment to moment to moment. And, and that really is my plan is to just continue to get better. So to answer your question in kind of a roundabout way, like I am always coachable. And I, and I kind of, when I first got to ESPN, I told everybody that everybody I reached out to, I was like, I want to make, I want to be a part of, you know, sports center being great. I want to, I want to not only just, you know, anchor sports center, but I want to help in an innovative process to make it better and better and better. And to do that, I want you all to know I'm coachable. So with me being one of the faces of what SportsCenter represents

and what we are, come to me with anything you have, any thoughts you have, shoot me an email or just say, Hey, Lisa, you know, like, let's not do that again. I'll be like, you know what? You're right. So I'm totally like, I am confident enough in myself to step back and be like, you know what? You're right. So I'm totally like, I am confident enough in myself to step back and be like, you know what? I'm not the best thing out there. I just am always trying to be. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Momentous. When it comes to high performance, whether you're leading a team, raising a family, pushing physical limits, or simply trying to be better today than you were yesterday. What you put in your body matters.

And that's why I trust Momentous. From the moment I sat down with Jeff Byers, their co-founder and CEO, I could tell this was not your average supplement company. And I was immediately drawn to their mission, helping people achieve performance for life. And to do that, they developed what they call the Momentus Standard. Every product is formulated with top experts and every batch is third-party tested, NSF certified for sport or informed sport. So you know exactly what you're getting. Personally, I'm anchored by what they call the Momentus 3, protein, creatine, and omega-3.

And together, these foundational nutrients support muscle recovery, brain function, and long-term energy. They're part of my daily routine. And if you're ready to fuel your brain and body with the best, Momentus has a great new offer just for our community right here. Use the code FINDINGMASTERY for 35% off your first subscription order at livemomentous.com. Again, that's L-I-V-E, momentous, M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S, livemomentous.com,

and use the code FindingMastery for 35% off your first subscription order. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Felix Gray. I spend a lot of time thinking about how we can create the conditions for high performance. How do we protect our ability to focus, to recover, to be present? And one of the biggest challenges we face today is our sheer amount of screen time. It messes with our sleep, our clarity, even our mood. And that's why I've been using Felix Gray glasses. What I appreciate most about Felix Gray is that they're just not another wellness product. They're rooted in real science.

Developed alongside leading researchers and ophthalmologists, they've demonstrated these types of glasses boost melatonin, help you fall asleep faster, and hit deeper stages of rest. When I'm on the road and bouncing around between time zones, slipping on my Felix Grays in the evening, it's a simple way to cue my body just to wind down. And when I'm locked into deep work, they also help me stay focused for longer without digital fatigue creeping in. Plus, they look great. Clean, clear, no funky color distortion.

Just good design, great science. And if you're ready to feel the difference for yourself, Felix Gray is offering all Finding Mastery listeners 20% off. Just head to FelixGray.com and use the code FindingMastery20 at checkout. Again, that's Felix Gray. You spell it F-E-L-I-X-G-R-A-Y.com and use the code FindingMastery20 at FelixGray.com for 20% off. I really do want to know what it was like as a family unit. Those experiences are so fundamental to our psychological framework as adults. If we don't have that context, we miss who you really are working on becoming. So yeah, take us back. Okay. So I'm a middle child in a family of five kids. I have two older sisters, younger sister, younger brother, and all of us played sports. I come from two parents that are, uh,

great athletes and also incredibly hard workers, um, and also incredibly competitive. And so our family unit just I think we existed in this like elevated atmosphere of constant competition so you know growing up um I played basketball I played soccer and I played AAU basketball and I played premier soccer and um and all we just played outside all day long all the time i mean we never played video games we you know we rarely watched movies like i'm probably like the worst when it comes to have you seen this movie i'm like no i was outside like running around like i didn't ever have time um so anyway so so we all five of us kids were pretty close in age. And we would, growing up, we loved to get the family video to the camcorder. And we would do videos and stuff.

And looking back on these videos, literally when I'm like 6, 7, 8, 10, 12 years old, I am the person interviewing in the video every single time. Like I'm always the interviewer. I always have a hairbrush or a Popsicle and we're like pretending to do these interviews and these like sit down, like, you know, Phil Donahue type talk shows. And like, I'm always hosting these different things. And a lot of the time we were, we were making up different sporting events and I was interviewing quote the, the athletes as they came off the field. And it was like my sister coming off the driveway and we're just pretending. And, and, um, you know, I came,

came up with ESPN and sports center. And when people would ask me seriously back when I'm six, seven, eight years old old like what I wanted to be when I grew up I expected a traditional answer of you know a doctor or a you know a lawyer or something like that and I would tell them I want to be on ESPN I'm gonna go to ESPN and I was just so like matter of fact about it that I I never remember not saying that. And I feel like it's been this organic process and competitive nature has been like intrinsic almost in the way that I was brought up and the way that I went about my life and is just always there. I didn't mean intrinsic, I meant innate in that I was just born with it.

That's a phenomenal story that you knew from such a young age. And then I've got a question about this experience in just a moment, like what you and I are doing. But before we go there, what, what, what, geez, I just lost my thought. Oh my God. You should try doing that on the air live. Has that happened to you?

Oh, yeah. No, no, no. What do you do? Oh, I was in a – so many women out there know when you're pregnant, you have this thing called pregnancy brain. And it is so real. It's so real. It's so real. So I'm doing an interview with Steve Young. We're in a double box, which is, you know, I'm in one studio and he's at his house. And we're talking to each other through the camera.

And the viewer at home can see us in two boxes. That's called a double box in TV. And so I'm asking him, you know, about Chip Kelly. And I was like, you know, what is it about, you know, he's a very, oh, and I was stuck. Like, could not, I could not for the life of me think of the word competitor. Competitive. And I was like, you know, he likes to win a lot. And I just, you know, Chip, he really likes to win a lot. And I just, you know, Chip, he really likes to win a lot.

And I'm like, I mean, he was like, the senior on SportsCenter could not think of the word competitive. I'm like, wow, this is a moment to embrace and laugh about later. So like, okay. I remember what I was going to ask you, but let's stay on the speed for a minute. What did you do? Like, what did your body did like what did your body do

what did your mind do what did you do in that moment so i just answered your question about where confidence comes from experience i've had a lot of years in television and so in that moment um kind of just took a beat and was like well that word's not coming so i'll just try to backdoor it with a like a long explanation of the word i'm looking for and so yeah i just kind of said you know like likes to win a lot and i felt the freeze moment i felt the freeze moment where it's like this word is not coming oh god i i so know what you're talking about. And, okay, so let's do some biology stuff really quickly. You know, anatomy, is it fight, flight, freeze, or submission? Those are like the typical responses to a threat response. yeah um flea is like okay i gotta get out of the box i'll take this mic off of me and then submission is like just to roll over and allow whatever's going to happen to happen oh it's total submission so you're totally like dude you know what please steve save me here because you

know what i'm trying to ask you just go just start talking okay then then then after the mic after that little red dot turned off and you were taking your mic off and did you know that other people knew that you struggled or what was that experience like well maybe you know your listeners and our viewers at home don't know is we have what's called an ifb in our ear at all times so we're hearing conversations we're hearing people in our head throughout the entire show sometimes when it's while we're talking and while we're delivering a highlight or doing an interview we also at the same time simultaneously have someone speaking into our ear um so you're never like actually on an island out there by yourself in the studio there are other people in the studio and then always again people in a control room they're about probably 15 people or so in the

control room you've got your producer that's talking to you the director talking to you the coordinating producer talking to you so you've got a ton of different voices and so in that moment I just you know we we go to commercial break the the red light turns off, as you say. And I just start laughing. I was like, again, and I told you, and this is so real, I own my moments. And I was like, dudes, so sorry about that. I'm so sorry. Pregnancy brain happened. And that is what it was.

And we move on because live TV is like, you got to get ready for the next moment. You got to keep going. Okay. And then, so the idea, so you're hitting on that idea of being present as well, like owning it and being authentic and being vulnerable in that process. And you described a lot of internal noise and distraction, literally somebody talking while you're talking in your own head, like hearing that voice. What do you do to prepare yourself to be more present? Is there any way that you train your

mind to be more present? Or are there activities that you do? How do you develop that skill? You know, we've talked so much about like the professional side, but I think my kids are like, I need to thank them for being like my coaches and training and being present because the moments we know with our kids, like they're so fleeting, right? I have a five-year-old, a three-year-old and 19 month old twins. And my five-year-old, I swear is already like 13. I'm like, where did this attitude come from? Or when did we start doing this? It is like the they grow up in front of your eyes so quickly. And so I think I as well as you know, a lot of us are so guilty sometimes of trying to like half give your attention to your kids while also half holding the phone in your hand and scrolling through emails or trying to read.

We get research emails constantly all day long. And I'm very much a statistics, numbers nerd. Everybody at work knows that I love stats. And I'll just walk by and yell stats at me. I'll be like, I know. I saw that one. It's amazing. I love numbers. And so we get these research emails. And so I've got like, you know, I'm good

friends with the research research department. So I know that these like gems are sitting in my email box and I can't wait to dig in on, you know, the statistics and the analytics from the night before and what, you know, the games coming up tonight or, you know, the next couple of days, like different storylines linked to statistical figures that we're putting out. So, um, knowing that that's there and also knowing that I have these precious moments with my kids and that I'm a full-time working mom and I only, you know, my time here with them is their time. And so that has been a constant exercise since my kids were born of just really constantly trying to be better and better and better and maintaining

mindfulness and peace and presence. And in the moment with kids that, you know, it can be incredibly stressful moments a lot of times, but always, you know, it can be incredibly stressful moments a lot of times, but always, you know, love, just, just the overall pictures is just full of love. And just living that to the fullest is, is a constant exercise. So it's not like something that I've achieved, you know, 100%, but I'm just always striving to, to be in that present moment.

Yeah, I love that. Like the idea, there's an idea that meditation and mindfulness training will help us be more present. And it's the training part of it. And there's, there's lots of other ways to train to be present as well. But that certainly has a lot of good science. And, you know, 2500 years of history of, you know, the traditions of meditation practices. And then there's a counter-argument to that as well, which is, well, what if you did 1,000 minutes a day or seconds a day spread out? And those seconds, you were completely mindful. And what if you did 500 two-seconds stitched together. And it sounds like, and that's like an endurance approach or an exercise that you were talking about, like the exercise of being present is that you've got some triggers, your kids, or opening up an email where it forces you to be all in. And do you take more

of that latter approach, which is the thousand time a day being present? Or do you sit and do more traditional mindfulness or meditation work? My mindfulness meditation work is in the moment that demands it, that requires it, that I'm, that I am actively working to just only be engaged with my five-year-old or whether, or my three-year-old or the twins or just all of them together and just not thinking about what I'm going to make for dinner later or which babysitter I've got lined up and making sure that that nanny schedule is coordinated so I can go to work and then my husband isn't left without any help here you know it there's so many moving parts in everybody's life and there's so many different distractions and I think especially now Mike when you think about you're constantly sorting through just waves of information whether it be you know on your cell phone that's like tied to us, right? Like we've got Twitter and Instagram and Snapchat, you know, sports center app is, is literally like sending me notifications every three minutes. And you know, like you're like, unless you just throw your phone away for a while and really just actively focus

and, and be mindful as we talk about being mindful that, that this moment is what it should be and that you are keeping your mind there and focused. It's just a constant exercise. And it's not like anything that I'm stepping away doing any processing to try and help myself be better at that. I'm just trying to build upon that exercise every day. It's really cool. It's a really cool way of, of a phrase, you know, like constant exercise. Now, Lisa, how do you do it? How are you a, you know, just kicking ass professionally, um, and having all of the mother responsibilities that seem, I don't know, like

the social pressures to be a mom are very different than the social pressures to be a dad. Not that they're more important, less important or any of that, but like, how are you doing it? Well, I think first of all, you have to accept those social pressures and know that they exist and then take a step away from that and be like, all right, well, you got to know what's comfortable and right for your own family and between you and your husband and the partnership and the teamwork that you have and the way that you decide to run your own family and not worry about, you know, the mom's cocktail party on Tuesday night that you're not going to go to, to talk about, you know, who's doing great at soccer or who's in the most, you know, dance classes or taking Mandarin, you know, who's doing great at soccer or who's in the most, you know, dance classes or

taking Mandarin, you know, like I am so 100,000% comfortable and confident in what we're doing with our family. And my number one job is mom. And I, I will never waver from that. And my family comes first and my husband comes first, all my kids. And if they ever need me at the drop of a hat, I'm here. And knowing that that is never a question and that's never something that's going to be trumped makes it really kind of easy, you know? So then you deduce from there. So make sure that family is taken care of. And, um, and I will take this second to talk about my husband for just a moment, who is the only reason, um, you, you so nicely, you know, talked about my professional life and, um, getting the opportunity to really, um, exercise my passion

at the highest level with ESPN. It's, it's a blessed opportunity, but one that I'm only able to, to take advantage of because of my husband, like Patrick is the most amazing, amazing father and supportive husband, partner, best friend, everything in the world. And when I married him, I knew I loved him to death. And like he, you know, we were have this wonderful life ahead of us, but I never imagined that he would be the father that he is. And his favorite moments in the day are with, with our kids. And he works from home and, um, flies out, uh, for meetings and different things as needed. He's, as I mentioned to you before we started, after he retired from football, he played 11 years, very successful years, eight years in Atlanta,

three years in Seattle, two-time All-Pro. He reached a point after 11 years and he realized that he could not train. His body physically couldn't train at a high enough level to maintain the level of performance that he had his entire career. So he decided to hang it up and he went to get his MBA at Columbia. So that's Columbia, New York City that brought us to the East Coast. So here we are over here and now he is working from home, as I mentioned, and working individually with NFL clientele. And it's a, it's a passion project for him. And he is, he, I tell him, I tell him, you'll laugh because, um, I tell him all the time, like, man, how did you end up with me? You're like, you are way too smart

for me. Um, he, he's, uh, incredibly well-read. He's very passionate and he just he's a smart cookie so he's trying to help guys hang on to their money a little better and he's he's kicking ass yeah thanks for bringing that full circle because it allows me to pull on a couple different ideas which is I still go back to that question super you are super successful as a professional, have your heart placed squarely in the home. Your husband was a pro bowler, two-time pro bowler in the NFL, played at the highest level, then was part of the 1% that was recognized as a pro bowler, and then successfully made a transition from professional sports into business, where I think I know you guys know the number, greater than 80% of NFL athletes when

they retire are broke, divorced, or both within two years. So what I know there's no secret sauce. I'm not looking for that. I'm looking to better understand the thoughts that guide you as a woman and guide you as a contributing member of the family and as a professional, like what, what have you come to learn and realize that are so organic that you at one time said them over and over again, or you still do? Like, what are those thoughts that guide you on a regular that's a very good question. Um, at my core, I am, as we mentioned, very competitive,

but I'm also very genuine, authentic and very loving. Like I, when you asked me about my kids and I light up to the moon, like my kids are my everything. And where do you feel that in your body? Everywhere. I hug my kids with everything I have every single time. There's never one time

that I, there's never one opportunity to hug them or kiss their faces that is ever taken for granted. And I actually have a story about that. And I think this might help you understand a little bit about the way I about my competitive nature, maybe. So I mentioned that I played soccer. And back in high school, I was a sophomore in high school, I was playing on the varsity team. And our varsity soccer team went to a tournament. I was in Kansas City. We went to a tournament in St. Louis. And on the way back, our team van actually got into a really bad car accident on the highway. Our team van, we were going from one highway up an on-ramp. And when we got to the top of the ramp,

it was raining that day. And we spun out, flipped back down the hill, back down the embankment to the highway we were on previously. And so we just rolled all the way down. And I was thrown out, a couple of my other teammates were thrown out. And it was, it was a really, really bad scenario. So I was a sophomore in high school, was thrown out. I broke my back in the accident. I was unconscious for a long time. And, you know, other details that I can spare you. But when I was in the hospital and we were talking to doctors and I actually don't remember, you know, like being in that moment speaking to the doctors, but I just kind of like have this like vague memory about that whole process and how that went um I don't remember the accident itself just pieced together different things from pictures and stories that were told to me and in the in the hospital afterwards you know I've got this broken back and you know crushed vertebrae and they're taking bone from my hip to fuse around my spine I've got all this metal back there. And the doctor saying, you know, we're, we're, we're pretty confident she can walk

again. Um, you know, we'll, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna see how this goes, but we're, we're pretty confident. And that wasn't, that wasn't my question. Mike, my question wasn't, am I going to walk again? My question was, when am I going to play basketball again like that's the walking thing is not a question that's that's going to happen and so the way the story goes is is you know a few weeks later then I do in fact get out of the hospital bed and I'm on the walker and I start walking and and and I, for anyone out there and, and, you know, God forbid anyone has been through this experience, but learning to actually physically walk all over again and actually remembering what your body feels like to, to not be able to respond to something your mind just did on its own, you know, you did it on its own. Like, well, this is, this was a process that, that was incredibly

challenging from the very beginning, but never, ever, ever once did I waver on my plan to play basketball again. And, um, from that point forward, my, my path changed a little bit because I was playing AAU basketball and being recruited at the time by Kansas State and Kansas and Harvard and, you know, different division one programs that were, um, you know, elite at the time. And, and in my mind, like, yes, this is, this is where I'm going. And Texas was on my list. I really love Texas and the big 12 and, um, love Jody Conrad down in that program. I loved everything about it. And when you break your back and you're a sophomore in high school and these college coaches here like oh no you're a recruit

she broke her back like that kind of changes their recruiting plans a little bit so I did in fact go on to play division two basketball um on scholarship again, like, just telling that story is, is to help you understand, like, it's, it's never a question for me, if I'm going to do something, if I want to do something, I'm going to do it. And that's how I feel about everything I go about in life. So if I want to be at the highest level at SportsCenter. And if I want to do a particular show, then I will reach out to whichever boss it might be and say, Hey, this is what I'm gonna do. Because what do we have to lose if we wait to and just keep to ourselves what we want to do, then, you know, we're, we're betting against ourselves from the very beginning.

Finding Mastery is brought to you by Cozy Earth. Over the years, I've learned that recovery doesn't just happen when we sleep. It starts with how we transition and wind down. And that's why I've built intentional routines into the way that I close my day. And Cozy Earth has become a new part of that. Their bedding, it's incredibly soft, like next level soft.

And what surprised me the most is how much it actually helps regulate temperature. I tend to run warm at night and these sheets have helped me sleep cooler and more consistently, which has made a meaningful difference in how I show up the next day for myself, my family, and our team here at Finding Mastery. It's become part of my nightly routine. Throw on their lounge pants or pajamas, crawl into bed under their sheets, and my nervous system starts to settle. They also offer a 100-night sleep trial and a 10-year warranty on all of their bedding,

which tells me, tells you, that they believe in the long-term value of what they're creating. If you're ready to upgrade your rest and turn your bed into a better recovery zone, use the code FINDINGMASTERY for 40% off at CozyEarth.com. That's a great discount for our community.

Again, the code is FINDINGMASTERY for 40% off at CozyEarth.com. Finding Mastery is brought to you by Caldera Lab. I believe that the way we do small things in life is how we do all things. And for me, that includes how I take care of my body. I've been using Caldera Lab for years now. And what keeps me coming back, it's really simple. Their products are simple and they reflect the kind of intentional living that I want to build into every part of my day. And they make my morning routine really easy. They've got some great new products I think you'll be interested in.

A shampoo, conditioner, and a hair serum. With Caldera Lab, it's not about adding more. It's about choosing better. And when your day demands clarity and energy and presence, the way you prepare for it matters. If you're looking for high quality personal care products that elevate your routine without complicating it, I'd love for you to check them out. Head to calderalab.com slash finding mastery and use the code finding mastery at checkout for 20% off your first order.

That's calderalab, C-A-L-D-E-R-L-A-B.com slash finding mastery. Okay, so I'm going to get down into the weeds a little bit. But when something doesn't go the way according to plan, that you've prepared, you've worked, and it's not going that way. And we can use the car example, a car crash example as a marker in a story. How do you explain events to yourself? Is that internal versus external, meaning that that was my bad or is it external like listen some somebody somebody did something stupid and it's just things outside of me i can't control that oh that's a good question um i think it's certainly circumstance. I've tried, honestly, and this is like it's an ongoing thing, right,

where we continue to just always try to be a better version of ourselves. So if it's a moment where, like, you know, like there's road rage or something, or, like, you know, I'm trying to get in somewhere. And you can look at it both ways. It's like, come, you know, like there's road rage or something. And I'm like, you know, I'm trying to get in somewhere and you can look at it both ways. Like, like, come on, man. I'm like right here. Like, let me get in. Or, you know, did I, did I assert that like uncomfortable moment, you know, with, is it that it's like my fault or his fault or, you know, what I really, especially for whatever reason, lately in the last year, I don't know, really tried to take like, kind of more of like deep breaths, deep breaths approaches to, to hide sensitive situations. And just maintain like, equilibrium. I've really tried to do that.

Are you a rule follower or risk taker? I would say I would skew more towards rule follower, but I do like to take risks because really, if you don't take risks, I feel like you're take risks i feel like you're not going to grow you're not going to find out if you can push those limits and if that's a positive thing or if the response is negative then you know you grow from that okay so as we're nearing kind of the end of our time together here is there a word that cuts to the center of who you are? Poised. And is there a word that cuts to the center of what you understand most? Love. And what you do the best be a mother that's awesome okay and then so here's some quick hits you can take your time and water them and or like or just kind of you know just announce them but street smart or

analytical do you say i can say both yeah we're certainly what is your like what are you better at are you more street savvy and you get the lay of the land and you know what yes i'm street savvy yeah like yeah yeah yeah okay and then do you prefer slow-paced environments or fast-paced environments fast-paced no doubt okay and then do you have a high need for control? Yes. Do you? Okay. And then do you feel as though you place your effort in things that are in your control

or do you place most of your effort on things that you can't fully control but you want to get right? Let me soften control with the preference to lead i like to be a leader yeah yeah yeah uh and i'm sorry ask me that that follow-up question one more time no no no that's good that's totally good so this is towards yourself are you more critical or more positive i again i've i i have my entire life been way more critical on myself than I have been positive way more. So I'm trying to, again, for whatever reason, over the last year or so,

really balance those scales a lot better and pat myself on the back more frequently. And, um, I think it has a lot to do with having had children too, because as every woman who's had children out there knows, when you have children, you're, the way you look at your body is differently. Your body itself is different and you're accepting stretch marks and soft spots and you're embracing them with love because what those, you know, scars or for lack of a better term, have given you, a greater love than your heart's ever known. So since I've had kids, I have learned to be a bit kinder to myself. Okay.

And then optimism or pessimism, how you look at the future optimism always yeah i think you said that earlier and then do you make fast decisions or take your time i've tried to pull myself back a little bit patrick's a really good balance for me a very good balance for me when it comes to that because i have a tendency to get like really excited about stuff um whatever it might be so he you know is the one that always is like the grounding force that asks like all the pertinent questions that really I should be asking myself um so I typically have a quick trigger and he has saved us from me buying like the world and saying like, Oh, babe, no, yeah, I just rented us this house in China.

What? For lack of a better example, it's just, yeah, I tend to have a quick trigger. I get very excited very quickly, and he is a very good stabilizing force for me. Okay, where does pressure come from myself and it all comes down to my family and then how do you define or articulate mastery this concept of mastery yeah i've done a lot of thinking about that, given that our conversation was forthcoming. You know, mastery in its definition is kind of like you've reached the end, right? Like this is we have mastered it and this is the best it's ever going to get.

But for me, mastery is more of a constant exercise of execution at the highest level consistently. You know, it's more of a journey, not an end point. As for me, being a competitive mind, a competitive spirit, ideals of mastery continually elevate as you excel. So when you feel like you've mastered something, you really just open the next chapter because mastery then takes on a whole different definition. It's like a perfect game, right? It's never actually perfect.

There's a great deal of quality fulfillment in that accomplishment, but likely a batter still made contact or the release point on your 47th pitch of your game wasn't exactly where you wanted it. So while the rest of the world is celebrating a perfect game, you yourself as the artist of that is probably still picking at yourself going, you know, I really could have made that perfect game more perfect. Okay. So on social media, after we're done with this, I want, because you're right at the epicenter of seeing so much phenomenal sport taking place,

I want to challenge you and we'll do it on social media if you're into it is like the next time you see a moment of mastery, let's, let's, let's call it out. And then you can give me some direction and all of us listening, like where that moment of mastery that you saw, you know, publicly, of course. But if you're into it, I'd love to do that with you. Yeah. Give me a hashtag, Mike. Okay, we'll do it. All right.

Cool. All right. So where can we find out more about you? Like where can people get connected to social media and other ways? Sure. in other ways sure so i am uh you can see me most every night on sports center sports center at night um late night stay up late it's where it's where it's hopping um and then on social media on twitter uh lisa at least lisa kerney espn l-i-s-a-k-e-r-n-e-y espn and same handle um on instagram at lisa kerney, E S P N.

Lisa, you know, thank you for walking us through your journey and how you think about life and people and your efforts and talking about the challenges you've been through. So thank you for your time. Thank you for your insight. And it's been a gift, uh, for me to have this conversation with you. So really appreciate it. The gift is all mine. The pleasure on my mic. I really appreciate your interest and I wish you the best. We'll keep in touch.

Okay. All the best. Take care. All right. Thanks Mike. Okay. Bye. Bye. All right.

Thank you so much for diving into another episode of Finding Mastery with us. Our team loves creating this podcast and sharing these conversations with you. We really appreciate you being part of this community. And if you're enjoying the show, the easiest no-cost way to support is to hit the subscribe or follow button wherever you're listening. Also, if you haven't already, please consider dropping us a review on Apple or Spotify. We are incredibly grateful for the support and feedback. If you're looking for even more insights, we have a newsletter we send out every Wednesday. Punch over to findingmastery.com slash newsletter to sign up. The show wouldn't be possible without our sponsors.

And we take our recommendations seriously. And the team is very thoughtful about making sure we love and endorse every product you hear on the show. If you want to check out any of our sponsor offers you heard about in this episode, you can find those deals at finding mastery.com slash sponsors. And remember, no one does it alone. The door here at finding mastery is always open to those looking to explore the edges and the reaches of their potential so that they can help others do the same.

So join our community, share your favorite episode with a friend, and let us know how we can continue to show up for you. Lastly, as a quick reminder, information in this podcast and from any material on the Finding Mastery website and social channels is for information purposes only. If you're looking for meaningful support, which we all need, one of the best things you can do is to talk to a licensed professional. So seek assistance from your healthcare providers. Again, a sincere thank you for listening. Until next episode, be well, think well, keep exploring.