Fine Dining - Gino's East of Chicago: Graffiti, Deep Dish, & a Biscuit Crust

Episode Date: August 6, 2025

🍕 Gino’s East of Chicago: Graffiti, Deep Dish, & Biscuit Crust 🧱 This week, we take a bite out of the legacy of Gino’s East of Chicago — a deep dish pizza joint started by cabbies and made famous by its buttery biscuit crust and graffiti-covered walls. With a flavor profile heavy on cornmeal and sausage (sometimes too much sausage), it’s one of Chicago’s big four pizza spots — but is it the GOAT? Joining me is actor and comedian Jacquis Neal (Dropout, Last Week Tonight) as we dig into this crusty cornerstone of Chicago culture, debate sausage autonomy, and marvel at how many cab drivers it used to take to buy property. Plus, Jacquis pitches his dream soul food/Chicago fusion restaurant, and we read some absolutely wild Yelp reviews — one featuring a “phat boi” pizza and another featuring a man’s descent into customer service madness. 🏙️ Born from Taxi Drivers with a Building They Didn't Know What to Do With 🧀 Biscuit Techniques & the Quest for Sausage Autonomy 🎨 A Deep Discussion on the Urge to Graffiti Bathrooms 📍 From Mag Mile to LA to Singapore 📦 Frozen Pizzas, Flopped Franchises, & a Surprise Comeback 🍕 Deep Dish vs. Tavern Style vs. NY Slice: The Ultimate Pizza Debate 🎶 A Soul Food Spot with Yacht Rock Vibes (Jacquis’s Dream Restaurant) 🌟 Yelp Reviews That Involve Slithering Pizza & An Argument with the "Manager " 💬 COMMENT BELOW: What’s your go-to Chicago pizza joint — and how much cheese is too much? 📢 SUPPORT THE SHOW & JOIN THE COMMUNITY: 🎉 Patreon (Bonus episodes, full Yelp segments & more): https://www.patreon.com/finediningpodcast 💬 Discord (Food talk, memes, cursed Yelp): https://discord.gg/6a2YqrtWV4 🎥 Watch full episodes: https://www.youtube.com/@finediningpodcast 🔗 All links: https://www.linktree.com/finediningpodcast 🎤 Jacquis on IG: @jacquisneal | Website: jacquisneal.com Patreon Producers: Sue Ornelas & Joyce Van 👉 NEXT WEEK: We dig into our actual meal at Gino’s East. Did Michael’s cheese phobia survive? Or did deep dish change his life forever?

Gino's East of Chicago, an iconic deep dish institution started by some cabbies with a building they didn't know what to do with, Gino's East has become one of the major Chicago-style pizza joints in its almost 60 years of history. Named after nobody in particular, Gino's is among Lou Malnati's, Pizzeria Uno, and Giordano's as the heavy hitters in its subclass of pizza. Whether they're the Michael Jordan or the Scottie Pippen of deep dish, they're undoubtedly celebrated. A restaurant who stopped trying to prevent its clientele from vandalizing its walls

and instead embraced it as part of the experience, Geno's East is a tourist destination for reasons that extend beyond its food. And speaking of extending beyond, Geno's has expanded outside of Illinois to bring locations not only to me here in Los Angeles, but all the way to Singapore. This week on the show, I'll fill your cornmeal crust of curiosity to the brim with my chunky sauce of knowledge so that you too may know everything I've learned about Geno's East of Chicago.

Then we'll direct our attention to the people of Yelp to see what they're saying about the very Geno's East we just experienced. Stay tuned. This is the Fine Dining Podcast. Guarantee it'll be the perfect five

Fine dining Better than you thought, worse than you hoped Fine dining We don't treat mediocre as a joke Breaking every single place we've been Compared to the perfect five out of ten Wait, so when you said cabbies, you mean like cab drivers? So a cab driver started it.

A couple of taxi drivers and a friend. I love it. But we'll get into it more. I love that they're like, well, we have this building and don't know what to do with it. Let's make pizza. Let's do it. Hey, man, Uber drivers, y'all need to get on a good foot. Find a venture capitalist.

Come on now. Come on now. Hello, and welcome to the Fine Dining Podcast, the quest to compare all restaurants to Chili's. I am your host, Michael Ornelas. And in this podcast, we learn the history of our favorite restaurant chains one week before seeing how they compare to Chili's in week two. This week on the show, we will be talking about Geno's East of Chicago, one of the four legendary Chicago deep dish purveyors

and the only one currently operating a location here in Los Angeles. And joining me this week to discuss this brand is a fellow Chicago native who you'd recognize from Dropout, his live game show Comedian Clash, and last week tonight, I saw you on last week tonight, it's Jacquees Neal. Ah, what up, what up, what up? How you doing? True Chicago people in the house tonight. We did it.

I love it. We made it all the way to the West Coast from not a coast. And we still eat our Chicago foods. Anytime there's a Chicago restaurant that comes to LA. The fact that they're available here makes me happy. It makes me so happy. I mean, Portillo's is still one of my highest scoring. I love a Portillo's so much.

Portillo's is good. I get out there often. Yeah. Well. What's up, brother? Thanks for having me. Yeah, of course. you and i were on an improv team for about a month and a half yeah you i had 10 years ago i

forgotten about that uh i've gotten to the point of my improv where i've like forgotten more shit that i remember now yeah yeah yeah uh but then you reminded me and i was like it all came like rushing back like everybody who was on that team it's like meeting someone that you went to preschool with it's like oh you turned out a human being as well yes yes yes i am here i've been doing this i love it um well thanks for coming on man uh we're gonna talk all the history we're gonna talk some yelp reviews and we're gonna get into your dream restaurant in this episode are you ready to get going i'm ready baby before we talk about the history of geno's east i want to talk about your history with geno's east have you eaten uh at geno's in chicago i know you had told me you

had eaten at this one in sherman oats many times what's kind of your history with geno's yeah geno's is interesting because i have i've gone to every deep dish place in chicago being from born and raised there uh but gino's was probably the one i went to the least so growing up giordano's was like it um that because it so you know this and for all the people who don't know this most chicagoans are not eating deep dish as our normal pizza all the fucking time you know i know you You know, I know people think that's the only beef. Baby, you want some pizza tonight? I'm literally made of sausage.

I am made of Italian sausage. Well, you can still get the Italian sausage, but you know, we got the tavern style. We got the thin crust, the square pizza. That's what we have the most. So whenever we would have deep dish when I was growing up, Giordano's was the one we would go to because Gino's only had like one or two locations. Yeah, Giordano's only had a couple either as well, but they had one closer to us. And then as I got older, high school, college age, I would go to a few more local joints more often than like Geno's. But I've been to Geno's a lot. Yeah. And I know you said that this one you've been somewhat regular at.

Yeah. Yeah. I probably go to the Geno's in L.A. like what, like maybe two, three times a year. Yeah. Like even when they first opened, I was there. I was there like that first week. I was ready. I famously do not like cheese. I know I do eat pizza, but deep dish is kind of a challenge for me. So I had mostly cheese. It's a lot of cheese. Yeah. And so I had been avoiding this and I was like, oh, I'm going to bring Jackie's here because we're Chicago boys. And then I'm going to hit him with like, but I'm probably not going to like it. listen did you are you are you lactose intolerant in any way like i know most of us are i love ice cream i like i have no problem with lactose it's like a conceptual thing with cheese it's the concept the conception of cheese yeah what does that mean like like just the fact that it's like oh we let like mold grow and like cultured it like just like what it is at its core i don't approve

and it kind of grosses me out and then you have the same problem when people eat like bugs you're Like, yeah, this is dirty food. Yes, that's fair. Yeah. And so, you know, hey, people can eat what they want. I'm not going to yuck their yum, but I will yuck it for myself. Of course. And we'll get into it next week when we talk our review of Geno's.

But do you want to hear the history of Geno's East of Chicago? I've been waiting for this my entire life. I can tell. Give me the history of the place that's not named after anybody. We're going to jump into this week's Eat Deets. Geno's East was founded in 1966 by two Chicago cab drivers and their friend who bought a building near the Magnificent Mile, and I quote, but didn't know what to put in it. According to Sam Levine, one of the founders, someone said, put pizza in it, but we didn't know pizza from nothing. I'm assuming that's how he said it.

That's how Chicagoans talk. I just I'm literally imitating my my grandfather. Like, yeah, that's how he sounded. You know, it's wild about that. Not that not that people just was like, yeah, let's let's make pizza because that's how most restaurants start. That cab drivers was making enough money to buy a building in 1966. Crazy. Crazy.

It's a few bucks. Yeah. It's twelve dollars. Go on groceries today or property. You know, that's that's what I'm most intrigued about. what was what was these cab drivers making back in the day or how cheap we're building i will say it was two cab drivers and a friend and a friend so there was a third person friend was al capone my great uncle by marriage he's like married my like into my grandmother's or my grandfather's

sister's like family where your building's at i don't know but they're loaded with syphilis Okay, that's fair. That's fair. So I don't go near him. Then they brought in Alice May Redmond, a former cook at Pizzeria Uno, to create their dough recipe, which she modified with biscuit making techniques to make the crust softer and butterier than competitors. Her recipe became the cornerstone of Gino's signature deep dish, known for its rustic cornmeal crust and chunky tomato topping. Mm hmm. That's interesting. I think Pizzeria Uno's is trash and it's still around, which is surprising to me. But that is so interesting that she left there and was like, I can do better. Yeah. And did better. I don't know if I've ever had pizzeria Uno proper. Yeah. When I grew up in Austin, there was a restaurant that was like inspired by pizzeria Uno called Uno 360. That was the highway that it was off of. Yeah.

Highway 360. Logo suspiciously similar. It was a knockoff restaurant basically. And it was pretty good. So like I have good associations with Uno, but I recognize it's not the actual Uno. Yeah. Also, shout out to what's her name? Anime.

That's not right. That's Tina Turner. What's her name? may redmond alice may alice may redmond shout out to alice biscuit techniques yeah in the crust and uh i kind of see it yeah yeah yeah that's right yeah geno's became famous for laying a disc of sausage over the entire pie creating a full layer of meat below the sauce this indulgent sausage patty pie became one of its most recognized offerings and is still a favorite today I don't love the full sausage

are you not really a sausage guy or it's just like too much I'm a sausage guy I don't like them crust pizza in deep dish pizza I'm actually you know this we just had it I'm a more cheese only and then I'll do pepperoni I will do sausage but I like it better

when it is chunked and the reason being is because sausage can be hit or miss so if it's good sausage that's fine but if it's bad sausage you're committing to the whole thing to have that bad sausage for the entire fucking pizza i will say one of the things that makes pizza beautiful is when an ingredient isn't hitting they're usually pretty easy to remove to remove and they're taking that autonomy away from

you yeah they took away your bodily autonomy they took my time they took away my sausage autonomy yeah mad put that on a shirt give me back my sausage autonomy uh gino's yeast became known for its graffiti covered walls yeah starting in the 1970s guests began leaving their marks with pens and carving tools and the restaurant eventually leaned into the tradition by offering markers to patrons even after moving locations and rebuilding the original site gino's carried this practice forward making it one of the most iconic parts of dining there it's very interesting too because that to me that feels like a very chicago thing even though this gino's east in la does not do that because they're like well it's all brick well yeah it's all brick but you can

still draw well you can still draw on brick because well go ahead what were you gonna say i had it in my mind i was like should i bring sharpies and we deface this place and when i went in i was like that would be the worst idea they clearly are not inviting this in any way they're not it's not an la thing that is the one la culture that they have adopted at the genocs la is like don't draw on our fucking walls yeah uh but you you can still do brick but it but it comes off one uh easily but it's with chalk so okay that was one of the one of the big things when the cubs won their world series uh in 2016 we were down 3-1 against cleveland right before game five instead of cub fans like we always do saying like we're about to fucking lose this

everybody went to wrigley and started writing on the walls and like writing on the sidewalk and stuff like that like y'all got this we still believe we defeated the billy goat if we did what was before they won so it was like basically inspiration to be like well that's what i'm saying it was counteracting the curse counteracting so in nasa very like you know genos east chicago like drawn on the walls and like you know leaving your mark in that way so that's tight the one thing that also stood out to me is carving tools yeah i have never in my life carved understood it i don't get it like and especially when i'm in a bathroom and i see it on a toilet seat i'm like oh people that carve on the toilet that means someone was like kneeling on the ground and like

you just think about the logistics of how it gets there and i'm close to boo-boo man what are you doing too close to that dookie have you ever felt that impulse to draw on a toilet just to like carve in anything no not really i guess like i've had the impulse to like dig it like a like the school desk like sometimes where you may like dig into and if you have something to do that with but like i feel like that's more defacing than actually trying to like carve yeah like in the ways that people carve i would never carve in the if i see a carved toilet seat i immediately think is filthy yeah uh because like your boo-boo chips your skin your ass chips your ass skin is in them crevices man ships and ships is in the crevices like the the fucking toilet seat is

smooth for a reason so you can easily wipe it up but if you put little crevices in there it's holding on to it you're giving it fingers giving nah man you can't i can't do that i can't do it Yeah, I remember driving home from San Francisco, stopping at a gas station, using the restroom and the entire restroom. It was like a trailer. It was like a separate building. I guess that's an outhouse technically, right? By all definitions, head to toe, ceiling, toilet, sink, mirror, like walls, door, everything was drawn on and carved on. and i was just like who's who's doing who's muse is this outhouse who's in here being like this is where i paint my masterpiece i don't know i don't want to be in the bathroom that long and i love i love to i love being in the bathroom using it once i'm done yeah we get the fuck up out of there yeah i'm not looking to hang out i'm not trying to hang out and like create i'm trying to lose the best script you've ever come up with you're just like oh i gotta get this down i mean listen

you you do come up with stuff in the bathroom but like but you have a phone inspiration of here that you take out of the bathroom i'm not trying to leave shit in the bathroom it's like severance i am leaving shit in the bathroom i'm not leaving anything else beyond i think it's like severance like what if you leave the bathroom you forget everything you're out yeah that's fair yeah that's fair anyways that was a tangent that was supposed to be about geno's east but i think god into a deeper philosophical practice that I had to address. We had to, we had to.

In the 80s and 90s, Geno's East expanded to several Chicago suburbs and even briefly opened a California location. They tried planting their flag in Manhattan Beach in the late 1980s,

but the California experiment didn't stick. Of course not, not out there. Suburban locations like Wheaton and Lake Geneva, Wisconsin had more staying power and catered to Chicago expats or tourists looking

for the city staple. yeah yeah manhattan beach ain't nobody gonna it's a vibe dish pizza and then like let's go to the beach it's a vibe that's incongruent with the with what genos is offering because like even if you got abs after you eat a deep dish pizza you are going to feel bloated i want to go nowhere near a beach right now no i don't want to be seen i don't even want to be seen with my shirt on right now not really i'm like yo bro let me you know the the heaviest thing i could eat on my way to the beach as a sandwich i think it's it's like a tupperware of blackberries like that's that's the beach meal yes uh to serve fans outside the city they launched a frozen pizza

and mail order business that allowed patrons to have gino's deep dish shipped anywhere in the country this move helped build national name recognition without stretching the brand too thin i uh recently just saw a gino's east frozen pizza in the uh grocery store i have such a self-imposed stigma against grocery store versions of restaurant food yeah it's usually not good yeah and it's just like to me you're already you're kind of cheapening your brand i I mean, yeah, people do have an understanding that if you go to the restaurant, it will be better. So it's not like it's going to trash your reputation and it does up brand awareness. But I'm always just like, I guess I'm a big believer that I always want the best version of the thing of this thing.

Yeah. And, you know, there are grocery foods that I love that aren't, you know, tie in brands or they're just grocery brands. And I'm happy with those. Yeah. I don't need CPK's pizza next to my DiGiorno. I'll just take a DiGiorno and it's fine. You know, it's not going to be the best pizza, but it's not tarnishing a brand. That's fair. I will say the one brand that has a in-store version as well. Don't you say White Castle? That is coincidentally the worst restaurant.

But I think their frozen sliders are better than like the. When your bar is that low. Yeah. You know? When I pop them things in the microwave and I eat them, I'm like, it's not bad. Even sober? Even sober. I mean, I'm not having it often, but like the couple of times I've had it, I was like,

I remember this more fondly than I do the slider. Yeah. At the restaurant. At the actual restaurant. And I grew, I mean, White Castle is a Chicago joint. I grew up with White Castle. They're a Wichita, Kansas joint. Well, I mean, yes.

But they are in Chicago. They started there, but there's a lot of White Castles in Chicago more. A lot of my mom's side of the family was straight up like, oh, you're doing White Castle? I was like, don't listen. You're not going to like what I have to say. Due to structural issues,

the magnificent mile location of Geno's East was demolished in the year 2000. But another location opened just two days later, less than a mile away. Yep. Buena Beef,

one of Chicago's premier Italian beef joints, built a new restaurant on the original property in 2003 before selling it to Geno's in 2006, putting them back in their old stomping grounds. I remember all of that. It was it was it was funny. That was also like the boom of like deep dish pizza, too. And then in like the tooth, like when I was in high school and college, I went to college in 04, like Giordano's, Gino's, all these places, Lou Malnati's, Eduardo's, so many places has started to get so many locations where it just like expanded so far where it was everywhere.

um and so like that was probably kind of the start of it when they left their mag mile uh location and then was kind of back in there in like four years yeah it was like no now we got multiple locations close to each other yeah yeah um and i really kick-started not only multiple locations in the city but them going even like national yeah uh new ownership in the 2000s brought a fresh round of expansion attempts especially in the south starting in 2014 franchise agreements led to openings in texas they had houston dallas and san antonio uh georgia and eventually nashville the reception was mixed some stores lasted only months while others became regional staples literally none of them are around now yeah i i looked all their locations are just

uh they still have one in wisconsin all the rest are chicago here and singapore yeah the the one that's had the largest sticking power out of the brands is giordano's yeah like they've they've expanded nationally and they've stayed and like a lot of the places they've gone to uh everything else has not done well surprisingly because i think everybody you know people think all we're eating this deep dish pizza not true uh in chicago we're eating like i said the tamar style thin crust pizza. But when you go as someone not from Chicago, that's what you're going to get the most. And you realize, like, I only need this once or twice a year. Yes. Right. Yeah. So those restaurants, Giordano's, Gino's East, you saw this today, like they have full menus. Yes. That

you're supposed to actually like go on a consistent basis. And yes, people are going, they're like, I can only do deep dish. And they're just like, whoa, whoa, don't paint us in that in that corner, You know, and so because of that, they don't do as well in places that don't have huge Chicago like expats and things like that. I definitely think there's something to that. Yeah, I'm actively excited to go back to Geno's. I'm almost sad that I had like assumed it would be like too much of a turn off the cheesiness. That's dope. I'm excited for your your additional my blossoming.

Yeah, you're you're re Chicago awakening. Yeah. In 2015, the flagship Chicago location added a microbrewery, Gino's Brewing Co. The in-house beer lineup won several national medals, adding a local craft spin to the deep dish experience. Around the same time, Gino's also became the first of the major Chicago deep dish chains to offer vegan cheese as an option. Disgusting. i'm so big on and like i get it if you uh became vegan versus like have always been vegan i get wanting replacement versions or substitute versions of food but i'm kind of like i don't know just make your own like food stop trying to imitate yeah deep dish uh my partner is uh she's vegan and my partner before that is also vegan although she would still eat non-vegan food and now she's not vegan anymore but like vegan cheese from what i've heard is the hardest thing to

replicate yeah and so to have something yeah that is mostly that cheese but like there are some good vegan cheeses and now is probably better than like you know 2014 when it was starting when it was first starting i always find it funny when uh when i when i tell a restaurant i don't care for cheese the number of times they'll be like oh would you like a vegan cheese it's not real cheese and i'm like worse look i'm not trying to have something even mimicking cheese my problem with cheese is like i don't i don't like the flavor you know so why would i want something that's trying to emulate it yeah and gonna be worse yes very likely but like cashew cheese just like it Sounds, and I love cashews, but like that, that sounds weird.

I love a cashew nut, but not a cheese. Love a cashew nut. Yeah. Geno's East officially returned to Southern California in 2020 with a location in Sherman Oaks. This outpost gained strong local support and was named Best Pizza in the Southland by L.A. Times readers multiple times. Co-owned by members of the founding family, it became a rare success story for Chicago Deep Dish on the West Coast. I love them, man. I mean, you know, every time I told you this before and then we kind of experienced this while we were there, they the owners are very involved in the customer experience at this Gino's East.

Yeah. Which I think is really dope. And I've experienced this in other Chicago restaurants throughout the country. I love when somebody is from Chicago. Yeah. Because, I mean, you know this, but, you know, I had deeper roots in Chicago probably just from being there for so long and living there. there's nothing more chicagoans love talking about than chicago i am uh you you put something in my head that uh i think i just had a realization that i i do believe rings true i think maybe more than any specific type of restaurant i've ever been chicago based or chicago style restaurants are the ones where the owners are just more of a fixture in the everyday dining experience. And I think that almost speaks to like the culture of like, it's a very proud city. Like Chicagoans love that they're from Chicago. I love that I'm from

Chicago, despite the fact that it's really been a while since I've spent a significant amount of time there. But like, I really love that city. And I get excited. Like whenever I see the Chicago flag, I mean, you can see I've got that little sign behind me that mimics the Chicago flag. I got Chicago twice on my tattooed on my body. You know, you know, I there's something about it that just feels so like I know the experience I'm going to get there is a very unique hospitality experience. I won't say it's necessarily like better or worse than other types of service experiences you can have. But I know there will be a sense of pride in it. It is still Midwest. So it's still like a Midwestern. So and Chicago has. Hence all the cuisines are going to kill you.

Yeah, you're going to have high blood pressure and diabetes probably. But like you'll eat well on the way there. But like it's like a very like social town. And there are so many bars. It's a very huge drinking town. And I don't know if this is still true. But when I was a tour guide in Chicago for a while, for a little bit, Chicago had the most bars per square mile in the country. I can see that.

There's a bar on every fucking block in Chicago. So, like, you become locals and it's your local dive bar and the owner is very much there and like just around and you know the owner and the owners are. It's a very Chicago thing. And I think it's dope that it expands out of the city to other places is really cool. The brand has dabbled in global ventures to opening locations in Mexico City and launching a pop-up turned permanent restaurant in Singapore. International menus stayed mostly true to the Chicago roots, though portions and toppings were adjusted for local tastes. These locations served as test cases for how far deep dish could travel while still feeling authentic. i love that note that portions yeah yeah are adjusted for local tastes which is their way

of saying y'all motherfuckers eat too much like come on bro we don't need we don't need big ass we got the too many joints yeah and we were even full off i was full off of that half of mine yeah but we got that because we wanted different toppings we were going to get like the regular joints the big old boy and those slices would have been even bigger and we probably still would have ate the same amount of like and or the same amount of actual like you know in hand slices i came home with a full bag of leftovers yeah that doesn't even account for what i ate there yeah yeah i'll be eating good for a while we're eating good for a while man yeah but in singapore they're not you're not getting that yeah no they're like no we only need we need a

serving size yeah i thought they had a pasta with roast duck on the menu uh at their singapore location at the geno's east yeah that's interesting yeah that's funny i looked at their menu and it was like they had a lot of pastas a lot of noodle dishes yeah which makes sense asian country right uh geno's east has been featured on food network and travel channel and remains a fixture in deep dish pizza debates while it isn't as widely franchised as lou malnati's or giordano's It maintains cultural credibility with a fiercely loyal fan base. The sausage patty pizza was highlighted by Duff Goldman on the best thing I ever ate. And the superior street location continues to draw locals, tourists and even the occasional rock band or politician.

Yeah, it's funny, though, you know, because like I said, Gino's East was definitely never number one, you know, number two, even in Chicago. even with the chains i mean obviously it's somebody out there it's like geno's is my favorite i know but like and when we talk about averages uh geno's was always a little lower down because you had like giordano's lou malnati's then you had local joints um and then you know like i said thin crust pizza was eaten more widely than anything else i love a good thin crust pizza i'm also i mean maybe i'm a traitor i do think new york has the best pizza overall I really do I mean New York pizza is good

it's a good slice you know it's good for what it is I think that tavern style there are I would there are 10 tavern style pizza places that I could have before any New York pizza place

I'll say this a tavern style pizza is great for literally a tavern or sit down restaurant setting New York style pizza it's just kind of a different oh it's good for walking yeah yeah it's good for on the go but like yeah 100 which is uh usually how i want my pizza because if i'm sitting down i have to live with my decisions sure but here's the thing we also have that in chicago too that's why i say chicago is the best pizza town like because new year whether whether you whether you are a new

york pizza fan fine whatever that's cool but like we have slices too we have the slices you can just like eat and walk yeah just like chicago just like new york but we also have the tavern style and then we have the deep dish we have every type of pizza that you want and you will find a pizza joint that does it well multiple pizza joints that do it well and you just have more options do you feel like i'm a traitor for what i said yes and that'll do it for this week's eat deets uh jacques i hope your ears were gobbling up those eatery details like a factoid hungry pac-man because the next few minutes are all about you and your dream restaurant it's your turn to pitch

the establishment that will leave your mark in the realm of fast food or casual dining next few minutes are yours this is the restaurant of your dreams but to intro this segment we need a theme song oh okay and uh give me a style a musical style that we want to hit oh um i want to let's hit like you know those old like like family matters full house whatever happened to predictability it's like that yeah yeah all right so this is a restaurant of your dreams And it's gonna fill your belly to the seams It can be deep dish pizza or chicken wings This is the restaurant of your dreams

All right, Jacquees, tell me all about a restaurant concept that is missing in the world and you find its absence deeply upsetting. something that you would raise as if it were your child. It must be practical, delicious, memorable. Three, two, one, go. I think we need more soul food restaurants in this world. Yeah. So my place is going to be a Chicago slash soul food place. So you got Chicago foods, but it's also primarily soul food. Now, the cuisine, I'm talking baked mac and cheese. i'm talking like dressing and you know for white people stuffing because i do like stuffing too but we got dressing what's the difference uh i thought the base so dressing is more cornbread

based uh okay and stuffing for some reason i thought they were just two terms for the same item no i mean no but you can some people do put dressing in the turkey uh and stuffing obviously in the turkey and you can eat both outside of the turkey as well but stuffing is more the box shit yeah and uh dressing is corn is cornbread so we're gonna have dressing we're gonna have candied yams we're gonna have ham with glaze and pineapple and everything we're gonna have fried chicken we're gonna have everything that you got and you want but then you also are gonna have some like chicago staples some italian beef the italian combo you know the sausage and the beef we're gonna have you know i don't need we don't need hot dogs we don't need hot dogs

and i'm like i know the chicago hot dog is up there but i was always like whatever about the hot dog yeah i don't give a shit uh we're gonna have a little bit of pizza and everything like that but that's the cuisine the experience though yeah the experience is it's gonna be a true lazy man's experience like you remember that episode of curbing enthusiasm where larry david created a restaurant it's gonna be like that like there's gonna be bells at every at every fucking table if you need something you just ring a bell yeah and it's not like rude it is like hey i need you know part of it it's part of it so like people are going to be trained not to just be ringing the bells all the damn time yeah you know they ring it when you need it right uh is going to have

cards at each table too because i want this to be family style i don't want it to just be sit down everybody on your phones i want like uno at the table a deck of playing cards card games Hell yeah. Because I want you like playing and talking and fellowshipping and like having a good ass time. Right. If there is a wait, I want the waiting area to be just as seated as the restaurant area. I want nobody standing to wait, especially, you know, if we're in places that's cold, you got to be inside. Of course. And then I also am going to have samples given in the waiting area. Hell yeah. So like I am a fan of hot water cornbread or cornbread in general, but I love. So that's going to be the sample. Just little pieces of hot water cornbread, hush puppies or like honey cornbread. Just something to like, hey, little taste. You can also get your drinks in the waiting area so you can like start drinking now.

So by the time you sit down, you already kind of juiced up. You juiced up and ready to go. Straight up. This place sounds like a last meal someone goes before they die. listen when you come out you might have to go to the doctor to get your blood checked this doesn't sound good for you but it sounds good for you it sounds so good for you i also want there to be like light music i am of the age now where music is too loud yeah but it's still nice to have so like you know we're playing like motown joints yeah you know uh we're playing r&b

soul and we even got some white people music in there that like but you know like michael mcdonald we got yacht rock yeah maybe some tears for fears bobby caldwell's you know it's going to be something that makes it feel like you are having dinner with your favorite black family yeah like you know with your favorite black family and it's all about family and friendship and laughs and like actually coming and enjoying yourselves not just having a meal the meal is what you are doing because you're there yeah but you're there to enjoy yourselves of all the restaurants that have been pitched to me look people have pitched good ideas before people have pitched menus that i like yeah what you're pitching is an experience that i am genuinely getting lost

in as you are describing it yeah i am immersed i am there day one day one like i i because that's the thing about restaurant like i'm like what it what's fun it's about eating it's a social experience it's a social experience it's a social experience where like if you need something you go get it or somebody brings it to you but it's out of love you know what i'm saying it's like i'm here to feed you and make sure you're because like you know care of whenever you have somebody who's cooking what's the thing you all especially in a black family what's the thing you always got to tell the person who cooked sit down and eat your food you go get your plate you cooked and like no no you go ahead you go ahead like i want that vibe yeah where it's like no no you go ahead

this is about you we want everyone to just have a good time and a full belly yeah and uh and the waiters are also the people who serve the food are also like you know out you know it's capitalism it's a big family it's capitalism so nobody likes to work but like if they're having good days they are happy to like yeah come sit down and like get in on this car game real quick which may you know make service slow but you know that's the black portion of it the service gonna be a little slow yeah but we're not rushing you out of there yeah yeah you know i feel like we don't need to turn the tables over uh and if you are there you're waiting the waiting area is also gonna be it's taking care of you yeah you got little bites to eat you can drink you can sit we're gonna have

some music fuck it i have a day like people might get up and dance in the middle of the dance floor in the waiting area i just want the experience junkies uh thanks for going over all of that with me i now have a better insight into what you dream about yeah one last time that theme song but like just the the line and i don't remember the melody this is the remix yeah yeah this is the All right, now let's bring things back to reality and see what other people think of the Genoese East of Chicago that we went to in this week's Yelp from Strangers. So get a little Yelp, a little Yelp, a little Yelp from strangers A little Yelp, a little Yelp Give us those complaints while you literally white and die

Yelp! Alright, this is Yelp from strangers Our segment where we turn to Yelp and read out our favorite One star Two star Three star Four star five star yelp reviews yeah yeah yeah we did it yeah tried to make it collaborate i'm so sorry i

was drinking water i was hydrated i was hydrated uh do you mind if i start us off with the first review let's do it five star review all right this is a five star review from philip d from studio city california september 3rd 2024 d five alarm chicago fire this is not a drill this is the real deal if you know a white man wrote this shit absolutely ain't no black person in america would start their fucking sentence like what if i show you his profile picture there's a black person do i have a surprise for you if it is you know that that meme of the white dude who's like calling the police that's what he's gonna look like the black dude is calling police that's what it's gonna look like it's gonna look like that if you're one of those

impoverished souls who did not know what Chicago-style deep dish pizza actually was until as recently as I did while traveling in the Midwest, then imagine my joy at finding it within LA city limits. Get your ass over to Gino's East.

That sentence was a lot. There was like parentheses. It was structurally a problem. I love how excited this person is. I truly, I know I'm going to make fun of it and I'm laughing at it, but it is a joyful it is roast it's very joyful joyful roast yeah uh the polar opposite of the wicked fast cooking neapolitan pizza these fat boys take a whopping 45 minutes to bake by the way fat boys p-h-a-t

fat boys b-o-i-s this is insane i've never heard anybody like actually call a pizza neapolitan i'm gonna start the sentence over just so you get the full experience of how it ends because it's unreal okay the polar opposite of the wicked fast cooking neapolitan pizza these fat boys take a whopping 45 minutes to bake hustlers and bustlers ye be warned my gosh i listen i know you was like what if i showed you a picture and it's a black person i would bet my entire bank account it is not it's not i already know what this person looked like i saw their profile but i don't know what this person looks like but i can almost guarantee i bet i know what He looks like it is down to the jaw, down to the fucking jawline.

And it makes me so goddamn like, does this person, did you see a picture of this person? I believe I remember what does he, does he have glasses? He did not have glasses. Okay. Okay. He looked like you'd find him at a board game convention. I love this person. So sit down with some friends.

You'll need them to make a dent in these dense delights. order some drinks and some spicy kale caesar salad and await the sloppy slutty majesty of a gino's east pie slithering inside to hug you from within oh my god a haunting sentiment the slutty slithering inside you i never thought slutty would come up in a review that had also ye be warned in it listen i've gotten that review before if you want a slutty slithering inside of you that's easy you be warned uh any of the deep dish pizzas are fantastic my favorites include the diavola truffle oil spinach margarita and chicago fire end of review that's crazy i thought so that's great i thought that was a but i love an unhinged way to leave a review i love it i love

it two-star review matt m from los angeles california who has four italian food reviews he wrote this on september 5th 2023 a day in infamy uh hands down gino's east of chicago serves the absolute best pizza in all of los angeles all right what an interesting way to start this book well he's prefacing like look if it's on food alone okay i have dined at the original location in chicago on numerous occasions and the one in sherman ilks is every bit as good all right unfortunately they also have some of the worst customer service in the entire city which is the reason for this two-star review let's read it i also love two two two two sorry in case you can't see the letters twl here it is in numeric number two all right two-star review

here it is let's see what you're talking about matt i called in to place an order for a deep just pizza so he called in i usually get it to go all right but on this particular evening my friend and i decided to dine in that's a very interesting thing because as a chicagoan like calling in to place your order before you even get there feels so uniquely white suburban and as a white suburban guy yes let me say i understand it when it's a thing that takes 45 minutes to make where you're like can you get this started yeah i get that if you're getting a sandwich and you do that that's wild i get i know why people do it but it is a bit like i said it is a very uniquely suburban because if you're from the city you'll just go but a lot of times

what i've done is with people you'll go you'll put the order in and then if they say yeah it's an hour and a half wait or however long you just go to a bar like if you're from chicago you just Go to a bar. Go have a drink. Go do something else. You know that's what the experience is going to be. Yes. So you kind of plan for it ahead of time.

Yeah. As these pizzas can take 40 minutes or more to prepare, our plan was to order it in advance so the pizza would be in the oven while we were driving up to Sherman Oaks. Insane. A 20, 30 minute trip from our area of town, which is Larchmont Village. Which, by the way, Larchmont is not a far enough trek to feel the need to advance order. Just fucking go to the pizza. place and order the pizza and like sit and be with your damn friends like if you're coming from

anaheim i get it yeah large month is it's also like see you can't sit with your friends for 40 minutes and just enjoy each other's company yeah like that's half the fun is being there with your homies unless you have dare i say where to go all the fun like that's all the fun i want to go that's why you want to go fucking eat it's that time like and all right here we go i'm already not on this person's side the gentleman on the phone told me there was no way this could happen i thought he was joking but nope he absolutely positively would not do it mind you this was around 8 30 i specifically asked and was told that it wasn't busy and that there were plenty of seating available here's the thing i agree with this person because what's the number one thing that you've you know

about la people or one of the top three things you know about la people they use like baby's blood to make their skin better number two they're flaky oh yeah absolutely it's a flaky fucking city yes i'm not gonna start a pizza if i do if i'm not certain that you're coming yeah i'm not gonna do that that's not and by the way i know friends who will be like yeah i'm on my way and they haven't left yeah yeah i'm almost there and they haven't and then that pizza is just there then it's cold now they're like i'm giving you a cold pizza if you're not here right on time yeah Like they're flaky. Of course they're. Of course. I guess I'm on this person's side. I'm on the owner's side. Yes. I've ordered from this restaurant numerous times over the years and it is always worth the drive. After explaining all of this to the gentleman on the phone, I once again asked if I could preorder my pizza. He wouldn't budge. After some back and forth, he put the manager on the phone. he didn't put the manager on the phone you requested the manager you asked yes yes and then

i i want to point he puts manager in quotations as though the position is in doubt the manager like okay all right matt i very kindly explained the situation yet again that's in parentheses with the exclamation point to him and even offered to pay for the pizza with my credit card over the phone, which should have been more than enough to end this ridiculous stalemate. I will say now, if you're paying for it and the restaurant is not losing money, I do think it's reasonable. Here's the thing I learned in retail. The customer is not always right.

Oh, I know. Most of the time, the customer is wrong. Most of the time. Yeah. Right. So like if I'm an owner of a restaurant and an important part of that brand to me is i want to make sure this food comes out to you fresh ready and hot i am under no obligation to break from the sacrifice that for whatever reason product yes quality even if you pay for it like

at this point we're talking you're almost here bro just fucking come yeah right this is boy i he would have wrote a one-star review if he was talking to me but this guy was relentless he just kept repeating himself over and over and over again all right okay fine i told him i would just order the pizza to go but upon so now his friends don't even want to fucking like sit down and enjoy themselves like they just went fine i'll just take it to go they're on a fetch quest now but the all right so what comes next is the part of the review that i thought was the most interesting and the whole reason i picked this yeah but upon arrival if there were any open tables i would reserve the right to dine

in nope no can of course not bro these he's not stupid just say all right i wanted to go but if it's tables then i'll make you take all the food out of the go packaging and then put it in the fucking like insert you're basically asking me to do the same thing you've been asking me to do just in a different way yes like we're not we're not stupid bro i asked him why on earth wouldn't they want to seat us and then sell some beer and wine and make even a salad or two on top of the pizza we were already ordering this manager let me know in no uncertain terms that even though I thought I had found a loophole. We absolutely would not be welcome in the Genoese East of Chicago dining room. Now this is in parentheses. The weird part is that he actually seemed to be

enjoying himself. It was wild. I guarantee you, Matt, he would have rather been doing anything else than talking to you. Like anything else. At this point, I had been on the phone for a solid 10 minutes and talking to this guy was an absurd surreal exercise and futility i couldn't stop laughing at the sheer ridiculousness of the entire situation i felt like jack nicholson in that scene from five easy places what an obscure fucking like i looked up that scene as a result have you seen that movie five easy pieces i know about it but no he's just in a diner and he's like asking for like his meal a certain way and he just wants toast on the side

and there's like no substitutions. He's like, all right, give me a chicken salad sandwich. Hold everything but the bread. And they like wouldn't do it. Yeah. Anyway, I'll go to Pax's from now on. Their pizza is almost as good,

but thankfully they don't have such a horrible customer service. Never again, Geno's East of Chicago. That is the most entitled bullshit that I've ever read. And I 100% am on the side of the restaurant. I'm more toward the middle. Well, one, his his review is ridiculous. His review is ridiculous. And I know you're I know you said also, like, if he offered to pay them, just why not do it? But him saying, well, if they're I reserve the right. So it's just like, bro, you are finding a loophole.

Literally, my my point is conceptually, I don't strongly disagree with what he's asking. Yeah, sure. And I say that as a person who and again, the restaurant doesn't know this. I'm not a flaky person at all. Right. I'm coming. I'm going to go. I'm going to get the pizza.

Right. Like there there is barring I got in a car wreck. I'm showing up and I'm getting it. Yeah. So you're not losing anything. If I get there at the time where it's warm, I would love to eat it there. I don't think that's a crazy request, but there are certain phrases he used in the review, like put the manager on or I told him I would reserve the right. There was an entitled tone that lets me know that the way he handled the interaction on the phone was not how he's presenting it.

Well, 100 percent. The way he did it was probably much closer to like a Karen entitled attitude. One hundred percent. Because I have also found that, yeah, while the customer may not always be right and in many cases is wrong, most the times you can get what you want as a customer if you're just chill. Yeah. Like the number one rule professionally, like in any industry or like anything, just come at it like you're trying to be likable. yeah you know i mean there is a way to do this if i'm on this phone and they said no i'd be like yeah if you don't mind let me speak to your manager just to i know you you're doing your job like i'm not mad at you you know you don't make the rules can i speak to your manager just accent yeah that already diffuses the situation yes right and then like hey this is a manager

call but it's not coming from a place of anger right already yeah it's not coming from a place of anger you said no you have a job too you want to make money bro i get it then when i talk to a manager, even if this isn't true, I would just be like, Hey, so here's the situation. We are literally on our way. We don't have that much time. We have like something at 10 o'clock to go to. Um, so I'm wondering if I like pay for what we want, I come there a lot. Love it. If I pay for what we want, can it get started? We'll be there. My GPS says I'll be there in 25 minutes. That way that allows us to eat, enjoy ourselves and make our next thing on time. Yeah. If I hear that as a manager why would you say like i would consider that more yeah than how this person is how this

person approached it absolutely i guarantee he opened hot 100 he opened he's like hey i'm like can you just throw in our thing now yeah like and here's the thing i know what you're saying i know i'm on the manager i'm on the restaurant side mostly because this person seems like an asshole yeah but also as somebody who has worked in customer service for a very long time if that is not the policy of the place i am not going to get you to change your policy of your restaurant sure sure sure being an asshole right and i can think it's dumb i can be annoyed by it but i'm not going to change it if i'm rude about it i'm also going to say the one thing that uh I'm good at that I don't think he is because like I'll make requests, especially if it's like podcast stuff.

And I'm like, I really want to see what the best of the restaurant is. Like, I really want to get the full experience or whatever. I make special requests sometimes. I might call ahead, ask for a manager, but like take the no, take the no, bro. You know, you don't have to come. Yeah. So it's just like ask. Don't expect.

Yeah. I think that's a great way to navigate it. And just like you're not going to make enemies. I'm not going to do this. mostly because if i'm proven wrong i don't want to be proven wrong on live camera but i would bet 50 that i could call genoz's right now and get them to do and get them to do this i think so too i really do i really think i can get them to do this yeah this is a user failure yeah and if they wouldn't do it obviously i'm not really coming but like i wouldn't be upset

guess you know why by the way imagine you do it they start it you don't show up and they're like This is why we don't do this. This is exactly why we don't do this shit. I'm the reason Matt is mad. But here's the thing. You know why I wouldn't get upset? Because I called you to ask you to do something that I didn't know you could do in the first place, which is why I was fucking asking you. Yeah.

So I already knew the answer might be no. Yeah. So how am I going to be mad when I get the no? Right. That makes no sense to me. Yeah. Crazy. Crazy two-star review.

How about those two Yelp reviews? You can get three more over at my Patreon, the extended Yelp from Strangers segment at patreon.com slash fine dining podcast. In addition to that, you can get a free full fine dining episode every single month that covers a restaurant that is exclusive to Patreon. Recently, I've done Boston Market. I went to one of the 16 remaining in the country all the way in New York City. It was not great, but I got to cover it. And for September, the September semifinals and finals episode will be my exclusive Patreon episode. However, it will be free.

All you have to do is go to the Patreon to hear it. Otherwise, you're going to have to wait an additional week to hear how the tournament ends. That's patreon.com slash fine dining podcast. Thanks so much. Hope to see you there, Dynomaniacs. And that's part one. tune in next week as we tell you uh what we thought about our meal at gino's east of chicago in the meantime jacques where can people find more of you online uh uh at jacques neal on

instagram i also have a website jacquesneal.com great and you can follow the podcast on instagram tiktok and blue sky at fine dining podcast or fine dining podcast.bsky.social i have a discord if you want to get in there talk food talk pet photos i've got a pet channel now people can post dogs that's relatable that's fun um and i have a patreon if you want a full exclusive new restaurant episode every single month i do that uh i've got my september tournament coming up here soon so stay tuned for that i'll be posting brackets on my website on the discord uh you can enter that and we will find out who's going to take home the championship belt for september year three in the meantime we're going to be here for just one week waiting on our table thanks so much for

joining. Thank you for joining. In the meantime, have a fine day. Waiting on a table, waiting on a table We gotta continue our search for mediocrity Yeah Waiting on a table, waiting on a table We'll be waiting and dissipating Waiting on a table, waiting on a table We're sleeping in, next week we're digging in

Cause we're waiting on a table, waiting on a table We've got an appetite for just a type of Waiting on our table, waiting on our table Search will continue when we see you next week But the language is Waiting on our table, waiting on our table Have a fine day!