First Things First - Parsons & Hendrickson contract updates, Ravens TE injured, Ben Johnson already changing Bears culture?

Episode Date: July 30, 2025

Watch clips on YouTube! Subscribe to the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠FIRST THINGS FIRST YOUTUBE CHANNEL⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (00:00) Ravens TE Isaiah Likely suffers foot fracture / Micah Parsons contract negotiations have reportedly gone backwards / Reaction to Justin Herbert being 56 on NFL Top 100 list (23:59) D. J. Moore says that Ben Johnson is changing the Bears culture / Trey Hendrickson reports to Bengals camp (37:59) Will Travis Hunter be able to play both sides of the ball well as a rookie? (43:10) Nick’s NFL Training Camp Tiers (1:06:36) Travis Kelce helps break up camp fight / Browns owner speaks on QB situation (1:16:32) What would a true WR1 mean for Jordan Love? (1:21:15) Final thoughts Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Live from New York, it's the show that is starting to believe a little bit more on an NFL team that's in the basement. But I'm making some wise decisions. You know what I mean? I like to buy low. You do. I look at teams. And then you sell once they get good. From worst to first, they call it. Can I tell.

Anyway, just to get to that, Jeff. Worse? Can I tell Brew the conversation we had earlier? Sure. Wilds has two. Wilde likes to either be like seven years too early for a team. Yeah, magic in the thunder. Or three or three months too late.

Or right after they win is when he likes them. Yes, yes. He's never like, very true. Just stay tuned. You're like, wow, Wilde's called that one. First hour or first. The giants, okay. Yeah.

Don't really. Wow. Wow. I know this is a giant. Today reports out of Bears camp that Ben Johnson establishing a brand new culture. Love it. Will it lead to wins? Meanwhile, new report out about Micah Parsons.

Contract now further away from getting done. We thought it was closer, actually further away. And finally, it's a special training camp edition of NFL tiers where the Eagles are not number one, give it away. Well, Brue gave it a number one in the last two. It's ridiculous. You guys didn't have a week ago they weren't number one.

You guys didn't have an issue. I did have. And that was before. Wild were awful, and it was it two weeks ago, And that was before we found out the Chiefs have Orlando Pace at left tackle. I mean, that's big news. He can fight. We know that.

Exactly. He can block. Yeah. Nick Wright, Kevin Wilde, it's Chris Brousard. We are starting in Baltimore. Some bad news out of Ravens camp room. Isaiah likely going to have surgery after breaking his foot in training camp. Now, Ravens open up their season in Buffalo in 39 days.

Here's Likeley's production in the last few years, 42 catches, six touchdowns, including that opening night in Kansas City, where he had nine for 1-11, one touchdown, one almost touchdown. Brew, how concerned are you about this surgery? Look, I really like Isaiah Likley. I watch him and I always find myself saying, he needs more targets. Like, he's really good, you know. But honestly, this is nothing. Really? Yeah.

They will be fine. First of all, he will be back. I don't know that he'll be back for game one. He'll be back early in the season, right? He may miss a few games. Obviously, he's not even their number one tight-in. I know you can go a lot of 12 personnel, but you got Mark Andrews,

who the only concern you can have about Andrews is there going to be a mental block with him dropping that pass against the bills? I don't think so. I think he'll be fine. In fact, I think he's coming back with something to prove. So I think he'll be fine. And look, I'm not saying Charlie Kohler is not, he's the third string tight in.

He made some plays last year. Now, he's not likely, but he made some plays. So this is my point. I'm not worried at all about them losing likely for a few games. I think they will be, have nearly as good a chance of winning their early games as they would have without him. The schedule is a monster. Early. They could win.

The schedule of a monster early. They could lose those games. Yeah, early. They could lose those games with or without likely. So they, like you said, before the buy, I mean, you got the bills, you got the Lions, the Chiefs. Every single one of the Rams and the Texans. Every single one of their tough non-divisional games is early. Is before the buy.

I mean, that's horrible. I am going to say, I am, now they could be three and three. I'm going to say I think there'll be four and two going into the buy. that's optimistic. But then after the buy, I mean, it's relatively smooth sailing. So I'm not concerned. Look, as much as I love, likely, they'll be fine. Okay.

So I disagree with a ton of that. So first of all, I think their plan was for likely to be the number one tight end this year. It seemed like there was a few months, and it wasn't because of the drop in the AFC divisional round game, but there was a period of time where the, the thought was the Ravens might be moving on from Mark Andrews because they have likely. Maybe they like Kola as well. I thought that too, but Andrews had a career high 11 touchdown. I know, but they knew that when all of us thought there was a real chance.

And even Harbaugh had been kind of cagey about what they were going to do. Obviously, they ended up bringing him back. But I think the plane was for likely to ascend to tight end one, even though Andrews had the big touchdown numbers. So I think that is problematic. for them. I think the fact that we are, and we'll see how it plays out, you and I disagree about the overall quality of

their receivers, you know, not tight ends, but receivers. I think Zay Flowers is a below average number one. You know what I mean? So I think he's a fine player, but I think if we were stuck half the league has to be. Exactly right. So it sounds right, it's not as cutting

as it sounds more cutting than it is. He's a good player, but I think. He made the pro Then you make the Pro Bowl. I mean, I get it to pro bowl. Right, but I think if you, even you were, and I'm not asking to do it. Right. If you were to name receivers, you probably named 20 before you get to say flowers. Bateman, we've been waiting on for his whole career.

He's healthy. But that's the key. He's got to be healthy. But it's not just healthy. It's been a while. We keep on being like in Minnesota. He's never going to be healthy. We're just waiting for him to emerge.

But he's solid. He's not great. I think he is a below average number two. I think they need the tight ends. Now, Lamar is brilliant, and so he is, and he's never had amazing receivers to begin with. But so this to me is, of all their pass catchers, I think this might be the one that for the beginning of the season,

they miss the most because I don't really know how much, like, they would miss Zay versus likely in this. I think it's at least close. And I do think the beginning of the year really matters. The NFL, I told you guys last year I thought it was unfair that they said to Baltimore start the season against the team that ripped your hearts out in the playoffs last year and they're doing it to them again

and they lost that game to the Chiefs. They then last year had, all right, at least we're not going to start 0 and 2 because we have the Raiders and then they lost that game and then they got rolling last year. But that was a must winning, I think, in Dallas? Right, they went Dallas and then, And then Buffalo, which people forget, but they blew out the bill. 25 points.

Nobody talks about it. But it's a very similar set of today at last year. They could be two and four. Right. And so I think they'd be fine. Yeah. So I just think this is, I don't think it's, you know, cataclysmic, but I think it's significant. And I also think the fact that I have a real hard time discerning how long players are actually going to be out

because I don't trust the national NFL reporters on this. Okay. They, they, the, every injury is, avoided disaster could be back early. And then two months later, it's like he's returning to practice because there's very little reporting and much more PR from agents these days. And so I, I would be shocked if Isaiah likely beats the projections because I think the projections are overly optimistic. Does that make sense?

You broke your foot. You broke his foot and have a surgery. And so I just. think week if we throw the schedule back up, I think week three is the most off. I think they'll beat the Browns. Well, the Browns are yeah, they usually play them tough. But I mean, but we thought in the situation. And they're awful last year, bro. And they know, I and they lost to them. Like, I again, I'm not, I will be picking them against the Browns. My point is, I think they're going to be without him until week three at the earliest. And it's noteworthy. Can I give you some,

a glass half full take, brew? Yeah. Or I'll just ask a question, not necessarily. take. Lamar's biggest struggle, obviously, playoffs, playoff pressure, you say. I don't remember the last time if it's ever happened where he's been facing must-win games in the regular

season. Well, when you just mentioned that, I know, but that was kind of like a first-things-first must-win. Got you. Where it was like you're 0-1-2. So I wonder if he starts off super slow, two and four, disaster, one-and-five, and he has to climb out of it Oh, like the playoff intensity early because they're actually really.

Does that develop a callous once you get to the playoffs? I don't see that because then you could talk about his whole career. I mean, he faced pressure coming in when one of the great executives of the modern era said he should be a receiver. I know, but I mean like nobody thought he could throw. Game pressure, not necessarily external real life pressure. Well, again, the evidence is he was facing pressure presumably against Pittsburgh last year. He overcame that. He has played well in the playoffs against Houston for sure.

That's another team I think they'll beat this year early on. No, I don't see that. The last, I do think Zay Flowers would be missed the most because he's kind of their threat, you know, as a receiver. Yeah, like he's the only guy on that team that's like a deep threat of a burner. So I think they miss him most. Color me nervous. Really?

I think it's fair. I also think there is. One of these great teams is going to sink. So that's the thing. They're not going to roll back in the playoffs. I mean, Lamar is getting better every year. Now, if Derek Henry, if this is the year he falls off, then maybe something could happen. But if Henry is essentially what he was last year, Lamar is Lamar.

Like, they need to run. I don't mind him running more. It was quite historically rare what happened in the AFC last year, where the final four teams, teams, Chiefs, Ravens, Bill's, Texans from two years ago were the final four teams last year. You know what I mean? Like that is an anomaly. And now I think because of that and because the Chiefs, Bill's, Ravens have been such mainstays really over this half decade, everyone seems to just be taking it as an absolute given. Myself included that those are the three best teams in the AFC and three of the very best teams in the league. But to your point, they're usually.

Usually is a team like the Niners last year, like the Bengals two years ago. Now those were more injury related that everyone thinks going to be awesome and they fall out entirely. I wouldn't pick the Ravens for that, but this is, you know, a nervous. I'm not my nervous radar. Yeah, that's fair. I'm marking that down. I'm a nervous rate. I'm a mental note that you're nervous.

Nervous. I don't think you're a little bit. I think he's a Lamar guy. Yeah. You're a jailing. If you were a Lamar guy, you wouldn't be nervous. Yeah, you'd be like, it doesn't matter. He's fine.

Are you a Brock guy? How the 49ers still? I'm not as much of a broad guy as I'm a Lamar guy, but yeah, I'm a broad guy. Okay, I'm just saying. It's not all quarterback to Penn. He needs somebody to throw the ball to him. Checking in on Micah Parsons. Some people call him Michael Parsons.

We're going to get clarification on that. Schefter reporting that we're actually further away from a deal. There's really no conversation about getting a deal done. We've seen how long Dallas sometimes waits on some of these deals. CD and DAC. This sounds different to me. A little more personal. Okay.

Here's Stephen Jones. I have a theory that maybe you guys drag out the deals to get engagement from the media. And it's like the best two million bucks you can spend having to give DAC a few more. Well, let's just start off. We don't agree on that. We don't drag deals out. We do deals when there's an opportunity to do a deal. And certainly no one knows what goes on internally with a particular negotiation.

But, you know, sometimes agents and players aren't ready to pull the trigger. until they see other cards play. Wow. Did you hear what I heard? I don't know. From Stephen Jones? He said, we're not dragging out these deals, as is the national narrative, coming from all of us and others.

We just get played. He didn't say that. We just lose badly in the negotiations. That's what he's saying. He is saying that. He's saying CD and DAC and now Micah want to wait. they wait till the T.J. Watts are signed and the other receivers and the other quarterback.

They wait to see them raise the market and then they come to us and say, we'll do a deal. That's what he said. Is that not what he said? Well, that's one reading of what he said. Sure, exactly. Now, he might be fibbing, but that is what he said.

Our view is they dragged this out. Because the truth is they could have signed and all those guys a year earlier before they did, they waited, and Dak definitely played him. DAC is still the highest paid quarterback in the league. That's rare for you to be the highest paid at a position for this long. And so that's why I think, Nick, I think Micah, I just feel like his price is going to be a little higher than we think.

Well, listen, I think that this is so incredibly dumb. And I don't know why Stephen Jones decided he needed to go on G-Bag Nation this after this year yesterday morning. And I credit to the host who is in the spot of I've said all these things about you and now you're sitting here. So now I'm going to say them to you, even though they are the Cowboys flagship and there's a little bit of like, is that, are you talking to your boss here? And so I give him credit for that. I don't know why Stephen feels the need to add more quotes to this contract maelstrom, if you will, because you are daring Micah to act up. And if I were Micah, I would at this point have a hard time not acting up.

What are you mean? Like a back injury? Or. Well, I mean. Is that what it is? Yeah. I mean, or. What Dak

as much as he could act up did when he did the quotes of basically, I don't know if I'm going to be, I'm paraphrasing, but remember last year where he opened the door and he was like, I really don't listen to what Jerry says, and that was in the quarterbackies.

Micah could do it maybe a little more aggressively in some of his quotes. But if I'm Micah Parsons, and I see this list of contemporaries from my draft class, I am insulted. I am insulted that these 12 guys... He'd be like, Trevor?

Well, that's the one I have to say it because I like to. Give me a break. Right. That's the main one. It's a great point by you. That is a solid point. You know it, Nick. You look at all those guys in there.

Trevor is the first one. You got to be kidding me. What? Trevor Lawrence, but continue, that is a good point you're making. I'm surprised you threw this. I wouldn't do it with Patrick Sertan. I wouldn't do it with Patrick. But how much is Horan got?

Four years, 100 million. Again, well, it's all. It's a good point. I know it's a good point because you asked me to make the graphic and then you just hijacked it to make fun of friends. The point is. And put Trevor first. No, it's in the order they were picked, you doofus is.

I mean, Josh, I'm going to leave. Nick, I got a great graphic for you. Start with Trevor. Stephen Jones like, what? What? No, everybody's laughing. I'm sorry. Jerry, Dad, come here.

Do you know I was there? Trevor Lawrence. What? Jerry? What in the world? Is that real? Sorry. Did you?

I can't believe you fail for it, Nick. You're the poker star. I mean... And I make the point... Sorry. The point is, whether or not these guys you think deserved it, the point is,

Micah has outperformed everyone on this list hands down with the two of questions of, oh, have those guys, you know, Jamar, Sewell, and Sartan all have an argument. They have done what Micah's done, the best at their position. You know what I mean? But they all got taken care of.

And then this graphic, if you guys can handle it, of the next year's draft class. Those four guys have all gotten paid. That's the draft class after Micah's. So we're at 16 guys, 12 in your own draft class, four in the one after, none of which are definitively better than you, none of which have definitively accomplished more than you,

who have been taken care of by their teams. And that, if Micah is offended, he has a right to be. Because just like if right now, let's just say, Jamar hadn't been paid. And you know what I mean? We would be saying, what are the Bengals? Like, what more could the guy do? We would think it's outrageous.

I almost feel like we have given the Cowboys, not a pass, but it hasn't been met with as much shock as it showed. You know why. Because they've done it repeatedly. We all think it's in a month they're going to make. him the highest paid non-quarterback ever. But it's weird for that for him to have to wait. It's unfair for him to have to wait.

It was weird for DAC, not the DAC's Micah, but it was weird for CD. Like, this is what they do. But hold on. Can I, am I, the, was it as weird, I guess for CD? You thought DAC was going to be. No, I thought, but DAC was also a different situation. Zach was the third contract. You know what I mean?

And, and there are skepticism on DAC originally, I think, was because he was a mid-round pick. Like, there was, as good as he was early was not Micah early. And CEDY, I feel like as good as he was early, was not Micah early. So I just...

You think they played a Trump card? What's that? The franchise tag. I mean, let him play out this year. Franchising, that's where Micah has to be careful. If I was Micah, I would be like, I'm not playing a down

until I get my contract. But they do have that Trump card of... Yeah. We can franchise you. All right, quickly, we got to get to the NFL 100 We've got another quarterback reveal. Justin Herbert, Harkins Fave, coming in at number 56. Not number five.

He's ahead of Stafford, Bow Nicks, Jordan Love, Darnold, Dak, and Tua. It is a rise from number 75 last year at 56 this year. So, too high, too low. I didn't realize it's the exact same spot that he was after his first year. Oh, that's a good point. That's your point. Yeah. That has stayed the same.

No, overall. And I think he probably will end up being ninth. Because like so if well, we could show it to you. Right. Here are. Here are the guys if we can move on. Yeah. You know what I mean?

We know there's eight guys coming. Right? Patrick, Josh, Lamar, Burrow, Hertz, Jaden Baker and golf. So the I guess my point is the best he could be is nine. He might be 10 if Stroud gets. on at this point, Brew, I think Gino is, the guys are better than Tua.

Well, that, but still. I agree with you. But they, I think the, I think the list is losing credibility. What? I mean, like, hold on. But we do it. And this isn't even about Purdy. Because I, at this point, I don't think you'll be on because I don't, I have trouble

seeing the players have him ahead of Herbert, Stafford, and Jordan Love. Jordan Love. Can I, before you go to the list losing credibility, where I will give the list credit, is I do think this is about where Herbert should be. You know what I mean? I think Herbert being, again, I like Stafford more than Herbert, but 56 versus 59 is so close. It's fine. You know what I mean?

Like Herbert in that 9 to 12 range is to me totally fair. But do you, I do not think he should be ahead of Stafford and love, certainly. I do not think you should be ahead of Jordan Love. I get, I think. And honestly, I don't think you should necessarily be ahead of DAC. Dak has had great individual seasons like Herbert. Neither's been very good in the playoffs, but Dak's been better than in Herbord.

I get that because Dak was hurt last year and Herbert prior to the playoff game last year was having his best season. And it kind of does go in line a bit with America's preeminent quarterback ranking service, if you will, where I'm just telling you, my guy, Gino is going to be in trouble. And you guys got so mad at me about where Purdy is on this. And it's going to end up being about where he is in the, he's going to be a tier lower. Not to be a jerk and derail it. It looks like it goes left to right.

What, what I mean? Like Herbert, Love, Dak, how you have. Well, that's interesting because on the bottom row, two and Darnold, who are on the list and Caleb and Drake may aren't. So. Well, that's the, like, what are you talking about? Be serious. Go ahead. No, like I said, I don't think Herbert should be ahead of Stafford.

in love, Donald and Tua ahead of Purdy. So you think Purdy's cooked now? Well, I would be, do you agree with me? I would be stunned. Well, I've been telling you he's cooked, and you're like he's going to be in the 50s.

We're still in the 50s. I thought he'd be in the 50s. I just don't, I, it's not that I mind putting him ahead of Stafford, Herbert, and love, but I don't think he should be ahead of love. But I'd be surprised if the players have him ahead of those guys. I like you.

I think you've got something with, this list has no credibility. It's losing credibility. Not losing. None. Nick knows it's... Well, look, hold on. When Patrick Mahomes comes in at, like, 14. Following or that he went out that year and had the MVP and won the Super Bowl.

So to me, that gives... Last year, they had Mahomes fourth. The fact that you don't have the home's like the best quarterback every year is a bit... Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, if you're going to make that point, then I agree with you. It is odd, brew, that you... that you think that Purdy is either number 55 or not. Like I said, I think he should be in the 50s or even high 40s.

We got half the 50s left. I don't think he's going to be ahead. And I don't know that I would you think players would put him ahead of Nick Bosa? I don't think they do it. I look at it just position specific. You know what I mean? I don't think they're going to put him ahead of Herbert. I just don't think people are going to put him ahead of Justin.

One guy can't win a playoff game. The other guy walked off the Super Bowl field. with the lead. What do you want to do? The thing, too, is they vote in December. This is before Herbert through the four interceptions in the playhouse. So that's what I wish they'd vote after the season. Ben Johnson, changing the Bears culture.

That's next on FS1, the Fox Sports Channel on Sirius X Avenue. You like that wilds? Good news, Bears. Check out the podcast if you get a chance. Coach, did you hear that we got to a million subscribers on YouTube? Do you get a plaque for that? Well, it's a good question. do.

Okay. Where is it? There's a thief. I'd love to see it. I would too. Oh. On the stack. Josh?

No, Josh said it's not his thing. He's pointing at Gianna, who stole the plaque. I heard she took a trip, too, right after the flag. Solid gold plaque. Wow. Sold it and sold it. Suspicious. Now it's really no bull zone sponsored by credible.

You get gray rates. You don't have to deal with any of the bull. DJ Morris sat down with Peanut Tillman and Mike Golick Jr. on Bleacher Report. to talk about how Ben Johnson booting people out of drills changing the culture. Take a listen. Uncomfortable. It's been the main thing.

Just them trying to change the culture around here and they done did it fast and you can tell how we practice and go about our business. The intensity, if you mess up, you get out of there. You get one chance. If you're a double offender, then you ain't going to be in on that play for the rest of camp, it feel like. Okay. Is this good news for the Bears? I think it's great. Listen, I, this side of the table has always believed coaching really matters. And so last year, I mean, it's just we have. So last year, even though, you know, the Bears appeared to be a total mess, I think it was fair,

a lot of it was fairly attributed to bad coaching. Wait, did you know the coaches were there before you? I miss. No, I mis-evaluated the coaches. is the obviously. They were four and two. Okay, yes. They were four and two, but they didn't. With those same coaches.

I'm just saying. They were four and two with those same coaches, and then they went one and ten the rest of the way with the same and then different coaches as it went. Every story I hear out of Bears camp and out of Jets camp makes me more optimistic about their seasons and kind of more frustrated if I were a fan of those teams about the previous regime.

because it's all very similar, which is like, man, sure are holding us accountable this year. And it kind of does speak to the old coaching cliche, which is players want to be coached. Players want the structure, want the discipline, want to be held accountable. And I think they're getting that in Chicago. What, coach? What are you? No, I think they do until they get frustrated with being held accountable. And then they want, oh, that's a coach that I can relate to.

Okay, well, that's fine. But we're not to that part of the process yet in Chicago. It's just whatever the cycle. And that was DJ Moore talking about how the culture is changing, right? Can we just talk about what they said about DJ Moore? Can we bring up this what might be a correlation here? Oh, Ben Johnson talks about what a great player is. Well, maybe he is.

I like DJ Moore. We're going to explore how to get him the ball more and get him in space. And suddenly the culture's change. No. But don't you think it's going to give me the ball more? Meanwhile, Luther Burton getting tossed up. But they talked about that, like that Luther Byrd and the rookie got tossed out of practice because, like, I think that. Toss out of the drill, not the practice.

The rookie got tossed out of practice. Did the best get tossed out of practice? Well, I think I don't know. Hold on. It's easy to toss the rookie out. Hey, let's go after the young guy that can't do anything. I mean, that's ridiculous. That's flatly ridiculous.

Is it? I mean, yes, to act like. Make an example of the rookie and not of, which veteran did he throw out of practice? Well, I don't know the full list of guys who have been told. to go to the sideline for the drills. Yeah. But the point that DJ Moore made in this interview was if in the play,

if it says line up two steps to the right of the hash and you line up one step to the left of the hash, you're out for the drill. Yeah. They kicked Caleb out of a drill. Yeah, I mean, so I think that the, Ben Johnson coming in and making it clear, precision and attention to detail is important,

is objectively good, objectively good. I love those things. I absolutely love those things. I just think that sometimes when the advocate is the person who's suddenly going to get the ball more, I take it with a little bit of grain of assault. And sometimes when the guy getting thrown out is only a rookie, I take it with a little bit of great assault. But I don't think he's the only guy. I do agree philosophically that accountability matters.

So I'm not, I'm not disputing that point. I just would like to hold on how aggressively this culture is being changed. Yeah, look, it sounds great. And I'm not saying that sarcastically. Like, I love hard coaching, all right? And you look at Ben Johnson and you feel like, okay, he's got the credibility. He won big in Detroit, right? The offense was great.

We are a team, a franchise that hasn't won in years. And we haven't had a quarterback in decades. Right. So we're ready to be coached like this. but you know who else could say that Matt Patricia when he went to Detroit and that hard coaching didn't work you know so Joe Judge when he went to the Giants

that hard coaching didn't work so I I believe in Ben Johnson and I do believe they need a culture change and he is changing it but that doesn't guarantee that it's going to work it all looks great right now I admit but we have to just wait and see if it works And I also, I'm not a huge advocate of piling on the previous administration. I think it's very easy to say every single problem was Matt Eber Fluse's fault.

And look, I've known Matt Eber Flus for a long time. I don't think he's a bad coach. I think it went badly, especially at the end. But to say he didn't hold people accountable, I don't buy that narrative. And I don't buy the narrative of we're not accountable because it was all their fault. Hold on. It's very clear that that offense, last year was disorganized and didn't know what it was doing.

Now, we can put it all on the 22-year-old rookie quarterback. That's fine. I don't think there are many quarterbacks in the league that we expect as rookies to be in charge of the whole operation to be the one. We all watched the game on, was it Thanksgiving, when they had the opportunity after the great comeback, and they could not get a play in and ended in mortifying fashion. saw it. We all saw

the way the Hail Mary game against Washington ended, where you have a player in your secondary, your side of the ball, if you're the head coach, a defensive head coach, jawing with fans. Those to me are not items you typically see

from a well-coached team. And if there are going to be well-great coaches in this league, then there have to also be bad coaches. And so Matt Iver-Fluz might be a very good coordinator. and maybe he might be a good head coach in the future, and maybe he would have been a good head coach under different circumstances.

Maybe he just needed a veteran quarterback to handle some of that stuff on offense because he's defensive-minded. All of those things can be true. But the Bears had a lot of trademarks last year of a poorly coached, disorganized offense. And we can put it on the rookie quarterback. That seems outrageous to me. And the point I'm making is they now, now maybe it'll flip.

maybe the defense will be a mess this year. I don't know. But they now have a guy who everyone acknowledges is smart X's and O's wise. I think a lot of us had questions about will he be able to instill a culture because Dan Campbell was the culture guy in Detroit, and he is attempting to instill a culture of accountability. That, to me, is objectively positive. It looks good.

Again, I'm not being sarcastic. It looks great. So far. I like everything he's. doing, including breaking down Caleb. But let's see how it works out. Breaking news from your national home for all things, Trey Hendrickson. As you know, Trey led the NFL in Sacks last year, has been holding out in Florida. But now he's at training camp in jeans, which NFL players rarely, if ever practice in. Ben Baby of ESPN

writing that it's a good faith gesture to spark negotiations with the team. Here's Hendrickson. Those aren't jeans. I thought of fans. Prior to leaving to Florida, I was here 30 days in Cincinnati. So the goal was always to be. in Cincinnati. Some things transpired. It became public that I left to go to Florida. But it was never something that I wasn't going to be here to help the 2025 bangles. What? Really? Well, yeah, an Instagram is of a Florida highway. Florida on it. The reason he's back is because the $50,000 that they're finding him is you can't forgive that anymore. So that to me is the biggest difference between finding people now versus finding people

a few years ago is that 50K has to be paid. So it's either got to come out of the players' money or it's got to come out of the organization's money once the contract's done. Previously, you did the contract, you forgave the fine, the guy got the full amount of money. Now that's not the case, so you've got to pay up. That's why guys are coming back in the camp. And for Hendrickson to say that he was all this was always the intention. Can we pull up this from a week ago? This is where he's talking about how Doug. This is, this is a tweet about how Doug N he is and how he's not going to come to camp.

And I'm pretty sure that tweet was based off a personal conversation with the player about how dug in he was. Suddenly the 50K hits and not quite as Doug in. Yeah, coach, I agree with you. And I think what players, because we saw the same. same thing with Terry McClure. I think that they're hoping that if we hold out, not hold in, within those first few days, the contract will get done.

But once you see that it's not, then they're like, we got to get to camp with an injury and hold in. I really hope it works out for Trey Hendrickson. But I feel like if he doesn't get a contract or new one, he's going to play. I think he's a good guy. I think he's a high. And I'm not saying you have to be a bad guy to hold out because that's that's a viable option that guys I think like Michael should do it. I just look at trade.

I think even I do think some of this coming back obviously he doesn't want the fines. But it's also, you know, I just think he's the kind of guy that looking at his teammates, he's going to be like they need me out there. And I think the Bengals are counting on that. Well, I think it's pretty, I mean, his quote there, the end, you focused on the I didn't want to make it public. I focused more on the very end where he's like, I always intended to be here helping the 2025 Cincinnati bankruptcy. I would not have said that if I were Trey Hendrickson. Like I know coach pointed out he got a new deal, you know, relatively two years ago and he has outperformed it. And I will, this is something

I've said for my entire broadcast career and I will continue to say it. Nobody Batson and I ever when a player signs a five-year contract and after year two he gets cut. And nobody's like, why don't the team honor that contract? Everybody's like, oh, savvy cap management. And we're so ingrained to it that whenever a new deal is signed, usually part of the reporting is, and they can get out of it after three years. You know what I mean? Like, we work into it, like, wait, when does the guaranteed money really end?

So when a player drastically outperforms his contract and in theory should have leverage because the team desperately needs him, I will always support the player in trying to get the money. Shouldn't he be a little bit angry at his agent? So two years ago, okay, he had drastically outperformed the contract. He signed a four years, $60 million deal. Two years into it, he had done better than he thought he would do. He goes back to the negotiating table, says, I want more money. They gave him $8 million more upfront. They give him $8 million more guaranteed.

That's what added this current year on. That's why we're in this situation. Is that situation, that decision at that point, that's why we're here. But hold on. I think the end of that story, though, then is a year later, which was one year ago, he wanted an extension then. And they told him, no, we just gave you a new deal, go do it again. and he led the league in sacks.

And now he's saying, okay, now I would like the money. I think, as far as do I believe he'll be on the field in week one, I do, because of what he said there and what Bruce said. And the reporting around his deal wilds is they've agreed on length and dollars, but not guarantee. But the guarantee is all that matters for a player is it? You know what I mean? And so I do think he will ultimately get a new contract.

I do not think he will get a multi-year guarantee. And I think the Bengals will win this negotiation, so to speak. But I think that he's not doing himself any favors by showing up and then saying, you know, my plan is going to play. The way he spoke today made me feel like, you know what he's going to go out here. And sometimes that's to win the court of public opinion. And to get, you know, ideally you get the fan base on your side, like, hey, what a great guy. How come you're not paying?

I don't know. Mike Brown cares about that. He's got first things first. I'll tell you that much. He's got the first things first producers office. Tune in tomorrow for the next update. Travis Hunter playing both ways. Do you think we're the only show that talked Trey Hendrickson today?

I think every show, folks. I think he was all over the tune. Travis Hunter opens up the season against the Panthers, and he wants to be on the field all the time. Here he is with Pete Prisco. I definitely think I could play them all. If I didn't think I could play them all, I wouldn't be trying to do it.

What makes you able to do that? Nobody's ever done that. What makes you capable of doing that? Just my mental. You got to have the right mindset going into it. You got to have the right knowledge. You got to understand what you're doing. When you're going out there, you've got to understand how to take care of your body too.

Okay, do you share Travis's optimism? Yes, absolutely. And I think that sometimes guys are actually, apologies for the cliche, Gianna, don't put this on social media. I definitely put this on it. Some guys, sometimes guys actually are literally built different. And I think that Travis Hunter has, okay, that's fine. She can laugh at me. I believe it.

I understand coach is going to talk about how hard it's going to be, and everyone's going to talk about how this has never been done before. But he's got a great aura. Well, I don't care about his aura. I care about his lungs, and I care about the fact that he has been this guy forever. And the football, and I understand the people he is competing against are better. But the measurements of the field are not. The length of the game is not different.

And in fact, in pro football, you play fewer snaps than in college football very often over the course of the game. And Prisco had this tweet after talking to her maybe before. I'm not actually sure. Travis Hunter, unreal the way he runs and runs all day. He's working offense on a day. He'll work with the defensive coaches during special teams times. It will be vice versa on the days he works with the defense.

Team raves are out of stamina. Then David Ubin, who is a college football guy who's covered him forever. I'm serious when I say someone should study Travis Hunter's lungs and circulatory system. He works hard but talking to his high school coaches, he showed up like this as a ninth grader. There's something physiologically different about him compared to every other athlete ever. And so 10 years ago, if we were doing the show in Japan and it's like, hey, there's this hot prospect who thinks he can pitch every fifth day and hit 50 home runs, we'd be like, no, that's insane. And then a guy did it. So I do think Travis can just do it.

Look, I hope you're right and I hope I'm wrong. But I have trouble believing Travis Hunter is that much better than every other football player that's played. His stamina might be off the charts. I'm not questioning his stamina. He's a better athlete than Dion Sanders. And Dion, I know, like I would like to see him play full-time defense. part-time wide receiver or vice versa. Nickelback, you know, when they need him and full-time receiver.

This ain't Pop Warner. This is not high school. This is not college. It's not the freaking big 12. Like, if he can do it, then I think other players can do it. Maybe. Because I just don't think he's better than all these other great athletes. And I know the field is the same dimensions.

And I forget what else you referenced, but those cats he's playing against, they're built different than the cat he was playing against at Colorado. These dudes are all good, and we can make a baseball reference, and maybe he hits and he pitches. He's not getting hit. He's not on the mound getting hit multiple times. So now you're talking about 12 games versus 17 games.

Then you've got the preseason. Maybe the playoffs. All the athletes you're playing against are that much better. And to some degree, you can run him into the ground if you want to. But the smart thing is to try to protect him from himself. Right. Usually, like, you want him to be there for a long time and you want him to be productive for a long time. So if you go out and beat him up early on in his career, I mean, that could be doing him a disservice as well.

But don't, aren't there so many of the guys that we look at as one-of-one freaks, so to speak. Dion was, Deion did it differently by playing multiple sports. Mike, like, if we were to say, hey, there's, well, yeah, so Bo Jackson's, well, I wasn't saying he was the only. one I was just grabbing. Like Michael Jordan, forget the baseball piece of it. It the idea of like hey what could you play 54 holes of golf before a playoff game the day the day before you'd be like no that's insane you got to be resting your body. I have a cocktail or two. Right, right. But he you know he could like there the there are nobody had ever done what the triple double in the Olympics like bold and they needed a triple triple.

Like guys, certain guys can just do something no one's ever done and then someone's done it. And I just think Travis, I think we would be selling him short, his team would be, if they didn't let him have a shot at it. I think that's fair. I don't think Travis is on the level of the guys you mentioned. Now, maybe, like I said, hopefully I'm wrong. I think they're right to give him the shot. Like, I think you're right to let him see. And he may just see him.

I think he could be for an awakening. I just want him to be great at one or the other, though. I think he can end up being solid at both. I want him to be good. Live from New York, it's a show that's starting to believe in Florida Gators basketball and football. I just like the idea. It's all about the 7 foot 10 inch kid. Something.

7.10, I mean. Second hour of first things first. Today, brand new video out of Cleveland. This is Shador against the first team defense. That throw wasn't good, but the other ones are pretty good, I think. We'll discuss that in a second. Meanwhile, coach, you can't be mean to everyone. It was a tad wobbly.

It was a shallow cross. Two yards. That's literally called the playoff. More good news for Jordan Love. Uh-oh. He sings the praises of his wide receiver one. I like it. But right now, we're in for a real treat.

Last night on a Bahamian fishing dock clouded in a fog of vapes smoke. This is funny. What? Did I get that wrong? Yeah, you got it all wrong. You actually got everything about that wrong. The committee didn't meet on a Bahamian fishing boat? No.

Clouded in a fog of vapes smoke? No, they didn't. Go ahead. Sounded out. An elite group of analysts, savants, and skinny Luca truthers. Do skinny. Fought and toiled and burned the midnight oil to concoct the best. segment in all of sports it's an honor and a privilege it's time for a special

edition of training camp tears indeed it is now obviously not a ton of reason for movement from when we did this a couple weeks ago but there has been some new Stafford's back you know what I mean there's been there's been some pieces of news I know his injuries right so there so a little bit of movement nothing substantial Caleb got kicked out of the drill yeah Ben Johnson's like what's going on here this is is a disaster. Caleb scrambling.

Scambling. Scambling. Yeah, you can't do it. We can't tackle you anyways. Bottom of the tiers. Legit bad. So I just, I don't know what else to say about these three teams. I can't fain.

Oh, I know the Titans are one of wild teams. Hey, bylaw. And I do want to, I'm rooting for Cam Ward. The Browns, all we can talk about. is their third string quarterback. And the Saints, I'm not, listen, Saints fans and media, I'm not here to say I told you so for the last three years about the salary cap coming home to Roos, but I told you so in the next three years it's going to be a lot of this.

Next, can't even fake it. So I, I would like to be able to sit here and say one of these four teams could be a sleeper. I just don't believe it. Wow. I don't, I think that Seattle made a legitimate, jarring mistake in going from Gino to Darnold, we'll see. It is not, the reports out of the Colts camp that Daniel Jones and Anthony Richardson are neck and neck in the quarterback competition and it's not because Anthony Richardson came

back a lot better. That's a little disappointing. Yes. And I think the Falcons are going to have real, real trouble. defensively and I'm also a I am cautiously I guess optimistic about pinnicks we need to see more and I think the Panthers last year they got some add-a-boys but I still think they have a ton of holes even though I like Tett McMillan all right now to you know 25 teams that I think there's a little

more reason for optimism for something to like it's the two New York teams so with the Giants it's very simple the reports out of training camp are so overwhelmingly positive for Abdul Karz and that he is the latest report I read was he looks markedly better than Burns and Tibido. And now you can maybe say Tibido, you know, hasn't quite lived up to the top five billing, but Burns is an excellent player and Carter's been their best guy. You add to the fact that they already have a great first team or all pro D tackle. Could they have the best defensive line in the NFL? Wow. Could they? And if they, is that alone enough to raise your

floor to a place we haven't seen with the Giants in a couple of years. And every Jets player that gets interviewed is like, man, it's amazing a difference having a coach can make. And so, like, I think Aaron Glenn's done an awesome job thus far, at least according to what his players are saying, and Justin Fields avoided major injury. So I think there's something to like for both of those teams. Five teams with huge variances. That's the next group, which is the Cardinals, the Cowboys, the Steelers.

the Dolphins and the Vikings. I feel like you could make a case for 5 and 12 through 12 and 5 for these five teams. Now, where for the Cardinals, Jonathan Gannon finally gets the defense going. Marvin Harrison, a big year two. Kyler puts together a full season. Like, we know what the downside is. For the Cowboys, it's that their stars play like stars. Micah gets taken care of and they don't need to run the ball because they're throwing it all over the field.

The Steelers, it's what the Steelers optimists are. It's like, well, we win nine games no matter who our quarterback is, get above average quarterback play. We can be good. The Dolphins we saw it a couple years ago. And for the Vikings, it's that we just won 14 games with Sam Darnold. You don't think we can win a bunch of games. Now, the downside risk of all these teams, I don't need to go through it, but it's pretty obvious what it is. So I think these teams have wide, wide variances.

popularity test. So here's what I mean. These three teams are going to test the popularity of this show. Oh, oh. Because great take. Wow. From a strategy standpoint, from a cares about ratings standpoint, we probably shouldn't talk about any of them.

However, we're going to talk about all of them. We'll talk about the Jags because of the print. We'll talk about the Raiders because Bruce's lifelong hatred of Gino. We'll talk about the Patriots because of this guy. So we're really going to be testing how much the audience likes us when these three teams come up. I think all three of them have a more than viable chance of being AFC playoff teams this year. I don't think we're going to get the same teams we get every year in the AFC playoffs. I think this year it shakes up a bit.

And I think you might see one or two of these teams in the playoffs this year. Healthy skepticism from the committee about these four teams. So these are very, these are four very trendy contenderish picks. The Niners with the same projected win total as the Lions. Everybody loves the Broncos this year. ESPN said they have the sixth best roster in football. The Chargers, year two with Harbaugh and the Bengals, if only they have a defense, we know how good they can be.

From the committee standpoint, the Niners, last year was ruined by injuries. They're already getting bitten a bit by the injury bug, at least the wider Cedar position. The Bengals, same defensive problems they had the last couple of years. And I not sure why we expect the Chargers and Broncos to take these massive leaps that everyone is projecting. Similar to last year, sure. Big leaps, I don't know.

Next, bright, present, and future. I think most people think these three teams have three really sharp coaches and three really good young quarterbacks. And if that is where you're at right now, you're. should be good right now and have a long runway with Caleb and Ben Johnson, J. Lo and, oh my goodness, what's the. Flour? Thank you very much. Matt LaFleur and of course, CJ and Domingo. There are holes on each of these teams. I think the Bears secondary leaves a lot to be desired. I think the Packers lack of blue chip personnel anywhere is, you know, is maybe a bit of a concern.

and I think the Texans offensive line, but they have the most important pieces they should have the most important pieces in place. Cubey Reliant, so you might say this is every team, but these two teams in particular, I think either one of these teams could make the Super Bowl out of the NFC, but they need 17 or at least call it 15 healthy games

from their quarterback, and they need both of their quarterbacks to play at the highest level they've played over the last few. years. Like not higher than they've played, but equal for Baker, equal what he did last year, for Stafford, equal what he did a few years ago. Explosive offenses. I don't think the Lions in Washington are going to be able to, let me rephrase it. I do think they are going to have to beat teams the way they beat them last year, mostly outscoring. Now, the Lions defense should be a little healthier, but the loss of Aaron Glenn is obviously significant. And Washington looked at

their team last year, which had an awesome offense and a crummy defense and was like, let's spend more resources on the offense because we have an awesome young quarterback. So I think the offenses are going to have to be great, and I think they will be great. If not now when, Ravens and Bills, we could have been saying this about these two teams last year and the year before. We now how good the rosters are. We know how good the quarterbacks are. We know at some point the chiefs will stop making every Super Bowl.

Just don't know if that's this year. near the top of the tiers, the defending Super Bowl champions, and their tier name is Make Up Your Minds. And by that, I'm just talking to Philly fans, who have really skyrocketed up the list of annoying fan bases. They were always pretty high. I know, but now they are high on their own supply in a way. And here's what I mean by Make Up Your Minds.

You cannot simultaneously be yelling at sports TV and radio and podcast personality, qualities for this is what they will argue. You guys are not giving Jalen Hertz enough credit for everything he's done and arguably being a top three quarterback in this league. Here's the other thing they're yelling. We have the best offensive line, the best receivers, the best defense, the best running back, the best everything. You got to pick.

You can't have the best roster everywhere and also your quarterback is wildly underrated when the reason people are in theory underrating your quarterback is because they think you have the best roster everywhere. And then atop the tiers, Trent Williams 2.0 and 3.0. Not better, but newer. They got Trent Williams back up, and now he might not even be good enough to start

because they got Josh Simmons. Spun this into a positive. What do you mean? What that they got? I know, but that was not your plan. What do you, what do you kept on saying Trent Williams 2.0? Yes, exactly.

And then Josh. And now, and now they somehow got a guy even better. And so exactly. So you go from a dearth, of tackles to a surplus of tackles. That's the latest years. Well, look. Is that not a positive wild?

I think it's a positive. Okay, so it's not spinning. Go ahead, go ahead. Coach, go ahead. Not bad for pre-suit and tears. Yeah, not bad. Better than I expected. You know, I don't, I don't love where you have Chicago.

And I was high on Chicago. Too low? Too low. And then I think you have San Francisco too low. I think you need to switch those two teams. And as much as you want to hope that Caleb is going to take that next step, and ideally with Ben Johnson, he's going to take that next step. And ideally, the offensive line is going to lead the NFL in sacks

and the new vibes and all that stuff is going to play out the way you want it to. And I get that you're down on San Francisco because of Brock. But when you look at it, when you look at it collectively, when they're healthy, with the easiest schedule, and compare these two teams and the addition of Sala, look at where they were last year. So as bad as San Francisco might have been, they were still 13th in points per game,

fourth in yards per game. Their biggest problem was 29th in opponent points per game, but I think Sala is going to help that significantly. And they were top 10 in opponent yards per game, as opposed to the Bears where they're pretty close to last in almost every category except opponent points per game. So I think the injury bug could be an issue. We see it a little bit with the receivers,

but all three of those guys should be back by the start of the season. They've got the easiest schedule. They've added a better, you know, they've transitioned to a defensive coordinator that's shown success in that system. And collectively, they're a lot more healthy than they have been. Coach, I know it's confusing because it's July. It's not the power rink. It's kind of an odd time to do tears.

But it's the 2025 season. So all those numbers from the 2024 season. I mean, those would have been useful in, like, February if I had the Bears ahead of the Niners. But we're looking forward. And while you are giving the Niners defense a lot of credit for adding Robert Sala, I feel like the Bears' offense for adding Ben Johnson would be getting similar credit. Well, I was just saying you're adding someone who's proven they could do it in that system and be very successful, where you're adding a guy who has been successful as a coordinator.

but we haven't seen how he's going to be as a head coach. Fair, and I like Sala. I like, well, but here's the thing. Sala has proven he can do the Niners when they had this. And I think Salas is a very good coordinator. I think he'll do a good job. But it's not the same personnel that he had when he was there and they were dominating. This is, that is to me, you think my Niners skepticism.

And Ben Johnson doesn't have the same personnel as he had. No, he probably is, I mean, honestly, maybe better. Um, but, uh, the, the, the, the, the, the, you think my Niners skepticism is purely. Brock related. It's partially Brock related, but it's also, I think one of the more underrated stories of the offseason is this is the least talent that Niners defense has had since Shanahan's first year there. And I think that that's almost universally accepted. With the losses they had on the defensive line, the entire secondary is remade. Obviously, Warner and Bosa are great players. But aside from that, Slim Pickens, go ahead, Drew. I do think Atlanta

should be hired. I actually think, yeah, I think they could have a decent. I agree. I think they're a threat, like, to the, to the Buccaneers in that division. Pennix, obviously, is good. I think they got some good receivers and the run game, obviously.

So I think they should be hired, but my main thing is the chiefs can't be number one. Why not? They just gave up 40 points to the team that's number two. The team that's number two, Philadelphia should be number one. I mean, they just, they destroyed the chiefs.

I know we keep showing the highlights of Xavier Worthy catching touchdowns in the last few minutes, but they annihilated the Chiefs, all right? Before that, then after that, the Chiefs played well. But they added an offensive lineman. Right, right. I mean, really, like, John Simmons is just going to change everything. And obviously the Chiefs are going to be really good. I'm just saying there's no way they should be ahead of the Eagles.

The Eagles have, as much as you like Simmons, Eagles got the better offensive line. Yes. Eagles had the better running back. Eagles have the better receivers. Eagles, defense, if you could call it a wash. But right now, the Eagles from last year certainly had the better defense. They lost nine of those players. They still got Zach Bond, who was almost defensive.

They have Zach, John and Carter and the two rookie defensive backs. And, yeah, Dejean and Mitchell. I mean, that's four. And they got the defensive coordinator who turned the whole thing around. And they lost the offensive coordinator. They lose offensive coordinator every year. Right. I mean, that's nothing to Jalen hurts and a winning quarterback.

So, and then we have to look, Andy Reed obviously has the coaching edge, although he didn't look great in the Super Bowl. Why is that? But here's, okay, this will support you, Wilds. I'm not ready to say Siriani's better than Andy Reed. That's what I'm saying. Are you ready to say that Wilde?

But I'm not willing to say it's obvious when I saw them play and one guy, the score was, what was the square half? Hold on. Can I ask a question then? I'm not ready to say Andy. That's Marriani, who's been to two of the two Super Bowls and just, they just played a Super Bowl. And who did I have had a better coaching job? Hold on.

Wait. I would probably go with that. I mean, hold on. Yeah, I mean, I would go in Andy Reed. I'm just, I'm just saying not obvious. No, right. It's their argument to make. No.

Yeah, I mean, it's not. It's not obvious. You can't say it's obvious when they have coached against each other. But so hold, this is the question that I'm asking. Okay. Is that, is that, is that every, is that? because it feels like that's the argument you make for everyone on the Eagles against everyone they win against. Is that in this instance, so is that, I'm just curious, if that's just across the board how it works.

Well, I'll say this. Since Siriani has been a head coach, he has won more, a higher percentage of games than Andy Reid has. No, let's show. Look at this. I think he has. Hold on. Look at this. Since he has been.

Siriani was the coach. Right. Since Siriani, go ahead. Look at the graphic. Go over it. Since Siriani, he is the third winningness coach in the Super Bowl era. Yes. Since he's been coached.

70%. I think I thought I had that. He's the only super. He's the only coach ever in his first four years to make the playoffs every year and make the Super Bowl twice. And so. And he is, that was a four-win team when he got this. So I was going to just say Siriani is a very good coach and you got to give him props. I wasn't ready to say he's better.

Of course. So let me now address this piece of it. Can I say what you're saying? I'm not saying he's better now. I'm not willing to concede he's Andy Reid's obviously better than Sirian. I understand what you're saying, but I now want to address the other things you said. What is not accurate is that since Siriani has been a head coach, does he have a better winning percentage in that time frame than Andy Reed? Absolutely unequivocally no.

That I thought I have that stat wrong. Josh, can you tell me in the ear what our Siriani stat is that I keep on getting wrong? I mean, it's not that he has a... It's really close. He doesn't have a better winning percentage over the last four years or five years or whatever than the chiefs head coach because the chiefs have won more games than every team in the league over that same time frame. All right, then I must be getting something wrong.

No, it is. He might have a higher career winning percentage than Andy Reed because Andy, we're talking about a 25 year career for Andy Reid, but you're saying since he came into the league, who has the better winning percentage. Also, it is very impressive that Nick Siriani has been to two. two of the last three Super Bowls. And he has been to two Super Bowls in his four years as the Eagles head coach, right?

It's almost as impressive being to three of the last three Super Bowls and winning two of them. They are one and one against each other in Super Bowls. And this idea, like, I don't- What Sirianni's two and one against him? Two and one against, the last three games. Well, I didn't play one other time. I think they played one.

Three games, Siriannis. They're two and two, they're one in the regular season. They're one and one in Super Bowls. And it is, we can't, we cannot be. If they both went four and 12 this next year, Seriani would be on the hot seat and Andy Reed wouldn't. Yeah, like I said, I'm not ready to go. So if Andy reads a great coach because he wins and Siriani is also just wins,

how come Andy reads automatically better than Sirian? Because we have, Wilds, the same reason why if we were six months removed from the 2017 Super Bowl and someone said, I'm not ready to say that Bill, Belichick is obviously better than Doug Peterson. You would say that's ridiculous. Was Doug Peterson winning at a historic rate? At that point, yes. He won a Super Bowl his first year.

Well, give me one. Or was it was his first or second year. You guys can correct me. But it was he won a Super Bowl with a backup quarterback right when he got there. He was winning at a historic rate. Yeah, he ran a Philly Special. Exactly. And so like, I mean, we, I'm, I'm the sample size is much.

It's too small. I mean, it's just, it's just outrageous. It's not outrageous. What's outrageous is we saw the Super Bowl. You talked all year about a dynasty. A guy and a quarterback came in here and demolished the Kansas City Chiefs. But all of a sudden, there's no consequences to anyone's reputation. Patrick Mahomes is still the best.

Andy Reid is still the best. The defense is still the best. Travis Kelsey is still great. There has to be some consequences for the Chiefs for getting humiliated in the Super Bowl. That's just fair. They were on the verge of doing something that no other team is. that no other team had ever done. This is bananas.

Okay, I get it. But here's what. It was a bad game. It was a bad game for him. But like historic, they were on a doing something historical. You are, I agree. You're saying there should be harsher consequences for the chiefs finishing the most successful three-year stretch in history of the league.

That they should be not for that. That's what you're saying. They should just be number two on the team. Well, that's a separate. If we want to say that the Eagles should be ahead of them, that's like I understand that. And the Eagles were ahead of them in the, final tiers of the 2024 season. We've now turned the page of the 2025 season. That's fine.

But this, this, the, the idea that we must be, and again, the Eagles were extraordinary in that game. Hertz was extraordinary in that game. And Siriani turned it around from after being on the hot scene in week four to only losing once the rest of the way. And he deserves credit for that. But we were, the fact that we were all in. agreement that going into that Super Bowl, it was, we were one game away from there being an argument of is Andy Reed unequivocally a top two coach of all time if he wins that game? And now you're saying it's now a fair argument. Is he a top two coach in the league right now? I'm not willing to say it's obvious. I'm just not letting that pass on the show. It's obvious he's

better. I'm like, I don't think it's super. I don't know if it's super obvious. Okay. One of the reasons it's not obvious is there was a televised matchup between the two coaches. It's not like it's obvious this boxer would beat this boxer and the one boxer knocks the other boxer out. But it's still it's obviously he's about like I'm not but instead of it being boxers it's teams right. Yes, but it's the head coach of the team. Yeah, so what's the head but it's so it's the okay I mean I how do you want to judge the coach vibes. Hawaiian shirts I think hamburger consumption I think overall body of work is fair. I think I think that should

sure let's look at it let's look at then then it's not obvious when one guy's winning percentages here and the other guys winning percentages there that's obvious yeah because you're because you are and then when they play head to head in last three there there and what's what overall success oh since your guy's been a head coach I didn't even know you were the serious like I don't even think you're believe what you're saying I don't like the obviousness of it it's not obvious when the score is 36 to not who's the best head coach in the NFL right now yeah remains to be soon

Okay. I'm a McVega. I'm a great guy. Better video of yesterday's Chiefs fight posted today. Left tackle Josh Simmons in the middle of it. Travis Kelsey training camp fight veteran breaks it up. Coach, you don't want a soft team, obviously. You also don't want a UFC matchup in training camp.

Your reaction to training, this training camp fight, training camp fights overall. Hate training camp fights. I love Travis Kelsey breaking up the training camp fights. I think training camp fights are an. indication of lack of discipline, not an indication of this is a fight or intensity or toughness. It's easy to be tough with a helmet on. You're going to go punch. Well, that's why he took them out.

That's why he took that one off. I mean, what are you, what are you achieving? All you're achieving is that you're just showing that you can't control your emotions. That's it. And you want your team in the most intense moments when things, when things do get heated in a game and the other guy throws a punch for you not to do it. So they get the penalty and your team moves forward, not. lack of discipline where you're punching something.

Can I, can I? Can I, I know we love training camp fights. I don't love training camp fights. I don't love training camp fights. But I am, I am asking you, is there something to be said for running this type of camp though? Where they are, where they are in the heat, in pads three days in a row going that hard and to where it is going to lead to some of this. and as long as it doesn't lead to a lot of this, and as long as the veterans on your team then step in and debt it,

that the flip side is a camp where guys are going half speed or they're not, you know, they don't have as much of a reason to be angry as the wrong word. Look, I like the intent. The offensive lineman is trying to finish the play, and that's what gets the defender frustrated. So I love the fact that he's trying to finish the play. And defensively, if you don't like,

like what's happening to you, if you don't like the fact that you're getting thrown out of the club, then do something about it the next time you line up. They're doing this, like throwing the punch after the fact that, that doesn't help you as the coaches are evaluating film. No, it'll help you go line up and actually hold your ground and don't get pushed seven yards of the sideline. We're getting a gatorade from the practice official. True. I loved it. I mean, look, obviously I'd feel bad if one of them got hurt and that'd be a problem for the team.

But here's the thing, it didn't go far, it didn't go too far. And what I like, when Simmons walks off, like, it looks to me like it's done. Like this is not going further. We're not going to see you in the locker room and then we're going. Like it was like we had our little scuffle. We're both intense. We're both competitive. And now it's dead.

We're teammates at the end of the day. It's over. So I think this is good. And they were one of the other offensive. was asked about it afterwards and was like listen it said exactly that like that we're all you know we're all friends basically 20 hours a day and then four hours a day we're trying to knock each other's heads off and so like this is obviously you're like you break your hand it's a disaster and you run the risk of it but the guardian caps I think blend itself yeah that a little

another layer protection for everybody we're going to head to Cleveland For this hot topic, Brown's owner, Jimmy Haslam, weighed in on the Brown's budding QB controversy. Not there yet, but we're controversy adjacent. This is fresh video of Shador going against the number one defense. First team defense. First team defense. Here's Haslam on who made the draft calls and when we're going to see the rookies in a major way. Take a listen.

At the end of the day, that's Andrew Barry's call. Andrew made the call to pick Shadour. Just like who's going to start or what play we're going to. going to call is Kevin's call, but that's Andrew's call. He made the call. Do you talk about we need to see these rookies in game situation before you have two first round picks in 2026? Absolutely. Absolutely. So, but I mean, that's Kevin's, Kevin is aware of that. He knows how important quarterback is and he and Andrew talk about those kind of things all the time. It's a daily ongoing conversation. So important. Important. We have five quarterbacks on the roster.

Brew your reaction. Well, first I'll just say this is with the first. film that we showed or the tape. Like he's going against the first team defense with what, the second third string offense. So I mean, there's something maybe to be saying for that. If he looks good against the first team defense, he's not doing

it with the first team offense. So I do like that. I agree with Haslam in that obviously you need to see what your rookies can do. And I do think they think of Gabriel as like a backup, like a career backup maybe. So I, what

can Shadour do? I think it's important to see what he can do this season because if he's good then maybe you have your franchise quarterback. I'm not saying throwing him in there if he's absolutely clearly not ready but if he's clearly not

ready then you know he's not our franchise guy. But the thing is Arch Manning is hovering. Of course. And with that last name, the thought is he's going to be I mean he already looks great. But with his pedigree, you would think, no, he's not going to, you know, be a tease.

He's going to be great. So you got to see if Shadur is anything special. And what's the worst thing that can happen if he goes out there and he's not special? You have a terrible record, which gets you a better chance to get Arch. Well, but I think the owner, I think you can talk to ownership about that. Like, I think the fans he's proven he's a good coach. He's a good football guy. Ownership should be like, look, let's see what these young.

kids can do. I mean, I don't know that they'd say this to you, Coach. You're not getting fired if we're terrible. They're going to be terrible. I was told that. But they're going to be terrible. If you make this move, you're not getting fired. It doesn't matter what your record is. I got fired. They're going to be one in seven or two and six out of with flack. Talk about what was said. So it was it was Barry's call, right? He controls the roster. Right? But both these kids need to see game time, which means both those players are going to be on the roster. So, The owner just told us that both those quarterbacks are making the team, but it's Barry's call. But both those quarterbacks are making the team because the owner just told you. And then it's Kevin's call who plays, but both of them need to play. So is it Kevin's call who plays or absolutely both of them need to play? So I think they're both playing, right?

So they're both on the roster. They're both playing. Now that's just a suggestion. I'm just making a suggestion. That's it. And if it works, it's a great suggestion. If it doesn't, like, hey, I just put it out there. I'm just the owner.

Your call. Before I give my take, I want to add something else to the conversation for Kevin Wilde, especially because last segment was a little tough. For you. For our relationship. Oh, gosh. I just thought it's even worse. To be able to see it now.

I don't care that it's not idle. There we go. It's fine. He was the best one. Well, no, Gabriel had a tough. touchdown. Okay. There's a watch.

But he was facing the first team. This offense is bad in training game. They average 21 points a week. They're running the ball. They're playing the first team. So here's the, here's what's so interesting about where I find myself with the Browns. Of everyone on the show going into the draft, I was the only Shador skeptic, right?

Like the only one. I think you thought like the Steelers would make the only one. Yeah, I want it. You only one at this desk? Oh, no. Sorry. I mean, of the three of us. I wanted the Steelers.

I thought you didn't have to trade up. Right, exactly. And you liked him more than Cam Ward. And I said that I think that I wasn't as certain as everyone else that he was a franchise guy. And yet he has found himself in maybe the only situation imaginable where I would be arguing he's got to play. Because he has found himself with Kenny Pickett, who is not an NFL. quarterback. Flatly not an NFL quarterback. We have seen it. Every

chance he's had, every opportunity he's had to play. Flacko, who I just think if you're the Browns, what are you doing? Why? Unless they think they can actually make the playoffs. And so if you want to start Flacco at the very beginning of the year, so be it. Starting to the buy. Right. Or

even less than that, but so be it. And then Gabriel, who through no fault of his own, commits one of my cardinal sins of quarterbacking, which is he's tiny. And so, I mean,

he's tiny. And so when he's competing with those three guys, I want to see him. And the fact that whatever those training camp stats are worth and maybe it's next to nothing, it's not nothing,

and it's not zero percent that they're worth. And every time we show him, he's at least in line with everybody. And so I just think there is... Generally better. I think there is close to a 0% chance that 3 years from now, the Brown's starting quarterback is Joe Flacco, that three years from now, the Brown starting quarterback is Kenny Pickett,

and that three years from now, the Brown starting quarterback is Dylan Gabriel. And so even if I think there's only a 5% chance that three years from now, the Brown starting quarterback, Shador Sanders, I'd want to find out before next year's draft for those exact reasons. And I'm not a Shador. You sound like you like. You look. He loved him.

I like it more than the group. Packers drafted Matthew Golden with the 23rd pick. First time the team had drafted a wide receiver in the first round in over two decades. Jordan Love, very impressed. Take a listen. He's been doing a great job. He's been in the book, and he's been getting more comfortable with knowing where he needs to be. So let's just keep building that.

But I think the playmaking ability is there. You see that. When the ball's in there, he's going to go get it and make that play. So we always talk about the Packers not having a true number one in just a bunch of number two's. The only teams without any singular wide receiver having more than 900 yards, just the Packers and the lowly Patriots, we're going through a rebuild at that time. Brew, what would a number one wide receiver mean for your guy, Jordan Love? It'd be huge. I mean, I think a lot of us have seen, we feel like he's got the talent to be an elite quarterback.

He's shown us that playing with number two and three receivers. And look at all the great great quarterbacks in the league. Mahomes, last two years, having been good individually for him, he hasn't had a number one receiver. All right. Lamar and Josh don't have number ones, but they're like historically great running

quarterbacks. Everybody else has Burrow, two great receivers. Jalen, two great receivers. Jalen Daniels, Terry McLaurin. Like, you go, all of them have one guy. Stafford with Pooka and Cooper. Right.

I mean, you can't, The only one is Herbert, maybe, you know, but he's not universally accepted as elite. A lot of people think it's, but every other quarterback you would name golf, you know, has some guys. And with Josh Allen even, Stefan Diggs helped him get to the elite level earlier in his career.

So I think this would be huge for Jordan. And it's what all the other great quarterbacks have. What's up, Coach? I mean, they got paid a bunch of money recently, didn't they? Because he's such a great quarterbacks. Love it. And then what do they have to do? They got to go do something they haven't done in two decades and draft a quarterback in the

first round. Then what do they have to do? Oh, let's get him another offensive lineman. Then what do they have to do? Let's get him another receiver. Okay, well, he's got 18 number two receivers supposedly. But the narrative just a few years ago was that we had a young quarterback with this great young receiving cord that was going to grow together and become this explosive offense.

And now it hasn't quite worked out that way, so it's obviously got to be the wide receiver's fault, not the quarterback's fault. that we paid a billion dollars to because he was so good. Do they have a number one receiver coach? Do that is this guy a number one receiver? We hope he is. He was drafted in the first round. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. But, but again, they went and got a really good running back last year.

And he was very productive for him. And that should have helped significantly. So now we're doubling it. We just keep doubling down. Let's do something we haven't done in two decades. for this quarterback that's going to be elevating to the highest level. Oh, and then let's go get him another one two rounds later.

So here's the thing for the Packers that I think is interesting. They have more good players than almost any team in the league without a single definitively great one. With maybe the exception. I don't know that he's still great. I don't know that he's still great. Like their safety is really good. Pretty pretty good.

Okay, so all right, if we want to, I think running back is it's hard year to year, but fine. But the point that I'm making is they have a surplus of B minus and Bs, which from a salary cap perspective can be really helpful. You know what I don't know that they have, aside from their safety, a guy who's consensus top five at his position right now. Because I don't know if Jacobs's consensus top five because running back at the top all of a sudden has gotten really deep.

And so they, I don't think that's necessarily a bad way to try to build out your team. But it seems like they feel like they have hit a competitive ceiling, so to speak. And I think they expected one of those receivers to pop. And none of them did. The guy's pre-golden. You know what I mean?

They clearly, they didn't expect that we would just have a bunch of number twos. They thought we were going to, one of these guys was going to assert himself, and that didn't happen. I also think it's fair to say that Jordan Love last year was a slight disappointment

from what people expected him to be after his first season. He was battered up. Yeah, no, that's true. He got hurt immediately. That is true. Special edition of the Bud List, Brew, I know you spend most of the night

working on it. Do you have any hints saying you point us in a little bit? I got to be on. I have even given it a thought. Okay. Okay. I will though. I'll be ready.

Well, thank you. You just make sure you got a funky introduction. I will. Let you know how nice I am. All-fame game tomorrow night. Chargers Lions, Tray Lance under center. Something? Nick's guy.

Something? Yeah, something. Last time we saw Tray Lance play in a preseason game. It was one of the most entertaining preseason games of all time. That is true. Facts. Five turnovers, like 500 yards. You never see anything like.

see anything like. So yeah, I'm excited to see it. I actually think this is a good pickup for the charges. Running quarterback. Yeah, that he's going to play much, hopefully, because you don't want injuries, but. Trey Lance can't play much? No, he's saying he's not going to play because you got Justin. Oh, yeah. I want to see Tray Lance. Yeah. It makes it very much. Yeah. And the little. I'll see you tomorrow, three o'clock. The Budliss at four o'clock. We're going to work on it tomorrow. What's at 4.10?