First Things First - Spurs on 10-game winning streak, Jaylinn Hawkins joins the show, BUD List, Bills S.B.o.B?

Episode Date: February 26, 2026

(0:00) Spurs on 10-game winning streak, Bills Super Bowl or Bust?  (27:14) Over/Under for Rams, Packers, Jaguars (39:16) Should the NFL adopt UFL rule changes? (43:58) BUD List (01:03:17) Is Justin Herbert elite? (01:17:52) Jaylinn Hawkins joins the show Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Live from New York. It's a show that decided not to be a player's coach this morning with my kids, Brew. You'll love it. Hard-nosed, old school? Old school. I like that. These fish gonna feed themselves. They're not my fish.

I didn't, I said I didn't want the fish tank. Oh, that can no, I'm not going to do it. How about that? I love it. I ended up doing it. But regardless, but still, I got to eat. I can't have. What?

They got to eat. Can I say something real quick? Brew talks a big game, but Brew also only as daughters, and I have seen him, I have seen him interact with his lovely daughters. I have a hard time believing you were not a softie. Oh, it was tough. I was tough on that. It's different with daughters.

Yes, I knew it. He's made your wife. First of our first things first today. These Spurs win their 10th game in a row why Bruce's confidence in this team has grown even stronger. How about that? That's reason number one. He didn't even have to jump. Meanwhile, a fresh edition of over and under.

Can the Rams win 11 games next year with everybody's All-American and MVP by one vote, Matthew Stafford? You're holding on to the one-vote thing. You know, it really doesn't matter. One vote, 40 votes. He didn't win. Well, it would certainly. it would matter if the Patriots lost the Super Bowl by one point, right? No.

You would say they were closer. And finally, a 14-person Bud List. We used to get criticized on five. It might even be more. Put a whole team on there and staff members on the show alongside Chris Bussart and Kevin Wilde's. Nick Wright. There's no one on the bubble of the but list. You put several entities on that.

I thought about motivating my man Pattoe award for this year to this week. Yeah, started the IndyCar race and scenes. Did you show Blue? What? Fox Sports and IndyCar sank you some custom sunglasses. I have a confession to make if we can. Just Wilde? No, you.

What? You can draw out this open a little bit long. I have a confession to make. You decided to keep them? Well, it's this Sunday in St. Petersburg, and then I think it's Phoenix, and then it's Arlington. It's the week that Brew is, Bruce missing two days and you're out.

So I'm going to use the promo. But you guys aren't going to be here for the Arlington. So you're keeping the glasses? Brew, it's, it's. I will be here to promote the race in Arlington. You can give them to me and then borrow them. The box says Arlington on it. You guys aren't going to be here.

It's not stealing. I already picture myself on the beach with my IndyCar sunglasses. Exactly. I will be here, though, wearing them on the show. It feels like stealing. It's not stealing. We start in Denver. Potential finals preview here. Second best team in the east, third best team in the West, but it wasn't close.

Joker went for 30 and 12. Celtics had held to 84 brew on their worst shooting night of the year. Zach Cox of the Boston Herald, knowing it's the first time the Celtics team shot worse than 35% since 2022. Feels like they could have used a little more offense. Somebody up there in the main red claws or whatever they're called now, I think. Did this game prove the Celtics need Jason Tatum back? No. Last night was, I mean, look, Denver, I think, is a better team.

I think we all agree with that. But last night was somewhat of a schedule loss. It's back to back in the thin air of Denver. And I'm not saying it wouldn't have lost, but, you know, I'll give them. Yeah, they won the first three on the road trip. This was game four on the West Coast trip. They lost. Fine.

All right. But here's the deal. I didn't need last night to tell me they need Jason Tatum if they're going to do anything of consequence. Okay. All right. Like, they could have won by 25 points last night, and I still would be saying they can't win a thing without Jason Tatum.

Now, they can win a series maybe, but I'm saying they do not have a chance of winning a championship without Jason Tatum. I think you agree with that. A championship? Yeah. Because that's the goal. No.

I could see a path to the finals. The East is so... Maybe. Yes. Maybe. Yeah, I wouldn't pick them, but I'm not even going to go that far. I'm saying they won't win the East without Jason Tatum. And here's why.

Talent matters. Talent matters. You can win in the NBA if you work hard, if you defend, if you get after it and play smart, and then you can shoot the three. You can win some regular season games because every team doesn't do that. But you're not winning. When it gets real crunch time in the playoffs, you're not going to beat the more talented teams just with that formula because they're going to be playing hard too. And then they have more talent.

And here's where it shows. These Celtics, now look, let me first say this. The Celtics are having an impressive season. Yes. Right? I give them nothing but credit. Joe Missoula, Brad Stevens for. building that culture.

They have certain types of guys that work hard. And certainly the players, Jalen Brown, number one, in the MVP race. So I give them credit. But they are nothing more, and I'm not even trying to be funny.

They're nothing more than a cute team right now. Oh, come on, bro. The cute team is, they can't win the East. But they're not cute. There's winning, there's winning the East, and there's cute down here.

Yeah, I think anything else is cute. Okay, no, the Hornets are not cute. They're getting better looking, all right? They're getting on their in route to being cute. All right. These Celtics are one in five against the top five seeds in the West. And they haven't even played Oklahoma City. Well.

So that's what I'm talking about. Talent matters. They're two and five, Nick, against the top three seeds in the east. All right. Now, I took out Cleveland as four because James Harden, their new team. So, but top two and five against,

who would it be, Detroit and, and New York. They're two and five. So talent, they started Sam Hauser, who's undrafted last night. He's good. He's okay.

So, I mean, he's, you know, for an NBA player, like, he's okay. Can I just, Ceda, Nema Cada at the center. Oh, he's, he's a second round pick. He's all right. I mean, this is not top tier

championship level talent. Who's the other guy they started? Baylorshire. Yes, he's good. Oh, okay. So those guys are, they're good. They're the Pacers and green jerseys from last year. No, they're not.

They don't even have as much talent as the Pacers had last year. Not without Jason Taylor. Because a lot of those Pacers guys weren't top five picks with the lottery picks. Yeah. And that's, Brew is big on pedigree in the NBA. I'm just being on talent. He's not. These dudes work hard and grind.

Okay, congrats. I mean, it is what it is. So here's the thing. I wholeheartedly agree with Brew, but in a maybe nicer way. Like, I think what the Celtics have accomplished thus far this year is wildly impressive and should be saluted. I agree. I think the fact that they have understood who the guys are on their roster and through the front office and the coaching staff have figured out, hey, given the strengths of Hauser or Keda or Baylor Shireman, what type of offense and defense should we run to best exemplify those guys' strengths.

They are getting as much juice out of the berry as you possibly can, given that roster. And that's commendable. It's pro sports and the job is to try to win, even if Tatum was out for the year and you knew deep down if you're Brad Stevens, can't win the title. But you know what? Our fans want to see a good product win as much as we can. So I applaud that. I think the NBA is sorely lacking that mentality.

from other teams. So that's all good. That can be true while also being true that if Jason Tatum doesn't come back, they cannot win a championship. And for a team

that in the last five years has been to the finals and one of finals and has been on really perpetual deep postseason runs for the last 20 years almost, basically since the big three were here. Brown's been to what,

six conference finals, something like that, And so it is truly Elbob, Larry O'Brien or Lobbob or whatever you call it. So if Tatum doesn't come back, I would say OKC can win, Denver can win. The Spurs can win, Detroit can win. Even though I wouldn't pick them, Cleveland can win, the Knicks can win. All include Minnesota and Houston as teams that could win. And I might even throw in Philly and the Lakers as a one in a hundred.

Oh, my gosh. No, I'm saying. Above the Celtics without Tatum. Correct. The Lakers. The Lakers, I honestly think they're probably better than the Celtics. Guys, no, hold on. I notice.

They're the best, it's the best defense in the league. You just have to blindly, blindly, just say, I will give the best NBA defensive team a chance to win the title. So, and what, but I don't think you're giving them a chance to win the title. Well, I didn't, I was, I was putting a. small club of Spurs, No, I really mean, I listen, OKC, also Lakers are there. I think Sixers and Lakers purely because the one in a hundred shot,

a player like Embedeed or Luca just goes basically 2018 LeBron mode, which by the way, he didn't even win the title that year, but something like that. Which is why I'm, I've been very pro Celtics this year. I'm trying to set this up as almost a hero's journey. for Tatum because I think it is a false, incorrect analysis, folks being like, man, we love Jason Tatum, but we're a little worried that he could mess up the thing we've got going, because I think what the Celtics have going right now is wholly irrelevant if the goals to win

a championship. Yes. Because what you have going right now is an awesome story and is an awesome season, but it can't result in a title. And I'm going to add one other piece to it. And this is where, because I know you're big on, he won't be full-blown Jason Tatum for a while, until next year. I don't think that's a hot take.

No, no, no, no. I just think you've focused on it. And you're pointed out and I think it's right. He doesn't have to be because he's not going to take minutes from their stars or close to stars. So here's the Celtics non-centers, minutes this year and last year. Derek White is playing an extra 25 seconds a game this year. Jalen Brown is playing the exact same amount to the to the second this year. Peyton Pritchard, who's having an awesome year, is playing a little bit more,

but it's also because he's gotten better. Sam Hauser is playing a little bit more, and then guys like Walsh and Shireman are playing a lot more. When Jason Tatum comes back, Derek White, Jalen Brown, Peyton Pritchard are still going to be playing those minutes. He is going to be taking minutes from Hauser, Walsh, and Shireman. And Jason Tatum at 60% is better than Houser, Walsh, and Shireman.

So, like, Brown and White and Peyton Pritchard were playing those minutes last year. They're playing them this year. So he's not going to disrupt that. But they just lost to a Nuggets team badly that didn't have Aaron Gordon and essentially didn't have Jamal Murray. He left after the first quarter.

And so it was a reminder of where they are right now in the ecosystem, and that's not a bad thing, KW. But you've got to stand up for them. You're saying we're wrong. You think they can win something without Tateau? My expectations of the Celtics before the year were obviously not championship or bust.

They were more aligned with the Pacers. Two playoff teams that had their star player pop as Achilles. The Pacers have, largely given up on this year. Yes. The Celtics are in second place. So I feel like a deep playoff run is a success. Now, if they fall short of a championship, I'm not going to be upset.

I agree with that entirely. If they get to the conference finals and have a nice battle with the Knicks, I'd be happy. I'd be happy with all of it. So I'm hesitant to rush what I think is a two-year injury, or at least a Kevin Durant 500 days of non-basketball to get Tatum back for a championship that I don't necessarily want. Not to want, but you know, it didn't necessarily expect, but you come close to it. I thought we're going to be the Pacers.

And now it's like, no, he's got to come back. Well, I don't think anybody's saying he's got to come back. I think he might want to come back. And the point I'm trying to make is if he comes back, it can only be, again, barring further injury, but would just set that aside. If he comes back, it's only positive because they can't win without him. They can't win at the level we're talking about.

So it gives you a chance that they can win. Do you think that'll be the reception, though? I think it should be the reception. It should be. I don't know that it will be. I think it should be the reception. If he were to come back, play great, close to what he typically is, and they get to the conference finals or further,

don't win the championship, though. I think that's great. I think the only way, the only way to assure it of being a positive narrative from Boston fans is if he doesn't come back. And then they, they lose in the first or second round. Like, if he comes back, the pressure is going to be ratcheted up. People, if he comes back, people will start expecting, even if he's 70% of what he typically is, people will start expecting, oh, they can win the East. And you would think maybe they can. But that's going to put pressure on it.

I don't want to be negative, but it's not like we haven't seen Jason Tatum have bad playoff games. No, we've seen him have great playoff games and bad playoff games. So if he has a bad one because of the Achilles. No, I mean, that's fair. He could get criticized. And I don't think it would be fair. But I think if he came back and they lost in the first round, maybe even the second round,

people might criticize him, unfortunately. I still don't even know what I want. Yeah, if you're all. I want to, I want to look, he might come back and play very well and give them a legitimate chance to win the championship. They think they probably have a legitimate chance. Without him, no. If you're saying the lakes. Stop it. I'm not saying the Lakers either. You said it. You said it. I can't. I heard you. Wembe had a quiet night, but the Spurs won their 10th in a row, bro. Devin Vassell stayed hot, led the Spurs of 21 after a game of 28 against the Pistons. How efficient is he? Well, the last two games, he's shooting 70% from three. Have the Spurs proven to you that they're more. than just a Wemby-centric squad. Well, look, they are Wembe-centric.

I mean, he is the hub and the anchor of everything that they do. Jeremy Sohan, who started for them the past few years, is now in New York having trouble getting off the bench. So having a guy like Wembe defensively, it helps you out because now I can really, you're picking up full court. I can get after guys on the perimeter in a way I might not be able to if I didn't have this guy backing me up. Offensively, he draws attention,

and now that opens things up for us. So they're all benefiting from him being the centerpiece. But they don't, he's not obviously not ball dominant. They don't run everything through him, which sometimes I wish they run a little more through him. But they are, they have three perimeter guys that I think are certainly all-star caliber. Deere Fox is made two all-star games.

We know he's like a legit all-star. Maybe not every single year, but he's a guy that is a multiple-time all-star. Stefan Castle, I think, is going to be better than De Aaron Fox. See, Define Castle is like, I think he's incredible. Or, you know, he's not there yet, but you see the talent. I think he's the best of their guards.

Yeah, yeah. Like, it's far, yeah. And, I mean, maybe right now, Fox, yeah. Yeah. Castle, like, if he were on another team, I think he'd be putting up big-time numbers. And he's a great defender. Yes.

Yeah, he was, like I said, he was picking up Cade. He made Cates for really. My Stefan Castle defensive graphic. Yeah, yeah. I had it in my pocket from the Pistons game since he shut down Cade. I was like, well, did Cade have a bad game or was that all castle? Wow. So against SGA, 6 for 19, two turnovers, against Luca, 8 for 21, three turnovers, against Cade, 3 for 13, 2, and against Evan Booker 2 for 9, but go back, Bruce.

No, look, that shows, and obviously he's great offensively. as well. And then Dylan Harper, he's 19 years old. Now, I think if Dylan was on another team, you know, he'd have his ups and downs as a 19 year old. But here, with Wembe and those other, because, like, he's actually really

contributing. That's not to mention Keldon Johnson, Devon Vassell, like, Champini, they got other guys that can shoot and score and all that. But this is why, and remember I said this, they're four and one against OKC. And I said, the reason they have OKC's number,

And I'm not guaranteeing they beat them in a playoff series because of the youth. But they are very similar, right, in terms of a bunch of depth, a bunch of perimeter guys that can defend with energy, athleticism, just one after the other, getting after it defensively. And they shoot it fairly well from three, right? But they're more, their perimeter guys are more talented. Like the three I mentioned outside of Shay, Jaylen Williams went to

I don't want to always be about what college they went to but he went to Santa Clara these other Fox went to Kentucky I know some of the OKC guys went to big schools too but I'm just saying I think those three are legitimate stars in their own right and they're more talented than the OKC guys that they rush at you and that's why

when they face off I think that's a big reason San Antonio prevails so look they have done I mean, look, Presti, who kind of came from that tree, and the way they run things in the San Antonio, they're superior organizations, and they're going to be phenomenal, both of them, for the next decade. Go ahead, Kato. No, go ahead. No, you want to say something funny.

Go ahead. I can see the little twin-blade. I just want to apologize to University of Santa Clara. I mean, are they a basketball power? I know Steve Nash went through. Well, we want two MVP's. I don't know. How many with the Kentucky?

I name the colleges that have produced two MVPs, North Carolina, Kentucky, Santa Clara. St. Benton. Yukon. This is tasked with the Yukon. So, none of it works without Wembe, but what they have going for them is when B. when Wimby has mediocre or poor offensive games,

they're good. And when Wimby has good offensive games, they're great. And so in games Wimby plays, 15 times this year he has failed to score 20 points. They're 9 and 6. That's a 49 win pace. That's a good team.

In the 29 games, he has scored more than 20. they're 23 and 6. That's a 64 win pace. That's a great team. And they might end up the one seed. They are one, one loss behind OKC now. Because OKC lost last night with five of its top scores out.

And they have the tiebreaker. Yeah. So if they finish with the same record as OKC, they get the one seed. So that could definitively matter. And this 10 and 0 month that there's, in the midst of, we can show to you historically, like, single month, 10 and 0 or better

by blowing people out. Now, listen, two of those teams. Oh, that's, wow. That's, since the merger, two of those teams lost in round one. You know, two of them are some of the greatest teams we've ever seen. The 73 wins Spurs and the 72 win Bulls. And then the

Spurs, the year after the Ray Allen shot year, that Spurs team. And that Warriors team, I mean, lost to LeBron. His great comeback. The 07 Mabs was the one versus eight. We believe Warriors beat them. The 13 Clippers, I don't quite remember.

I think that was the Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook. OKC. I don't remember. Doesn't matter. Oh, that you. Yeah. But regardless, they're putting something very real together. Now, how much will playoff experience matter?

We'll find out. But what they will have when they get to the playoffs is continuity. Because if you look at the lack of different starting lineups, that OKC's had this year, if we can throw that up. Few of starting lineups this season. Spurs, the NBA average is 21. It's Minnesota, who has continuity going for it, and they've been playing together a long time.

I think that's more important for young teams than old teams. I like that. You know what I mean? Because you're getting the experience playing with each other now. It's also probably pretty important for the Rockets because they're getting used to Durant. But that, so that's a note. You know why else, Nick, that one seed is so important.

you would likely get to avoid Denver. That's right. Denver and O KC would likely meet in the second round. So if you're the Spurs, the one C is only going to have to beat one of those other two juggernauts. Not that it'll be easy because you've got other good teams, but still. Spurs going for their 11th win in a row against the Nets.

I'm willing to guarantee that one. Bills have a new coach, a new stadium, and a new spot in second in the AFC East. New head coach Joe Brady reminding everyone that this is a new beginning for the bills. Take a listen. Look, this is year one. It's not year 10, right? And I think that that's, look, there's been a foundation that's been set here. And it might be a little different in a sense of we understand what expectations and everything that comes with it, right? But this isn't just, hey, you know, Joe Brady's in and everything's just as business as usual, right? And so it's important that everybody in the organization knows it because if we continue to speak about how things used to be, then we'll never continue to go forward. And so I have so much respect for the past, but it's year one in organization right now. You buying that?

Well, look, looking at, I watched more of this, you know. And in the context, I don't think he was saying, hey, we're starting all over from scratch or whatever like that. So in fairness, I don't think he was saying that. But here's the deal. He's right. It's not year 10, but it ain't year one. It's year nine. All right?

And that's Josh Allen's ninth year. and they are S-Bob, period. They were S-Bob, I mean, before this, but the moment Joe Brady signed this contract, the expectation is Super Bowl next year, this year coming up. Because every year, it's the same thing for Lamar and the Ravens, but every year, it's more so for the bills for this reason.

They've never won a Super Bowl, and they've been good and gotten a plenty and lost. We all know that. But every year they don't win it, it is going to ratchet the pressure up even more on Josh Allen and the Bills organization, including Joe Brady. So this is, I don't care, nobody cares if they go 17 and O. Nobody cares if Josh wins another MVP.

If they in their season like they did this year, whatever round, it's going to be a big disappointment. So the pressure's on, nobody wants to hear that, oh, it's the first year and all that stuff. They got to get it done. Yeah, I just flatly don't buy this. I might buy it a little bit for Jesse Minter because he came in from the outside. He came in and you know what? We are starting.

We're going to have to start a bunch of things fresh. We're obviously going to have a lot of player turnover, staff turnover, all of it. I think I have been a little confused by some of Joe Brady's media stuff thus far. He a couple days ago, so I'm about Khalil Shakir. He's like, listen, that guy, the short version was he was saying he can do more than what he's done.

He can play inside, outside, not just catch bubble screens going on the field. Buddy, you were the offensive coordinator. You were the one calling the plays. And so I'm not going to prematurely judge it. And I do think there is something to be said for a team that's been as close as Buffalo to stick with continuity, to want to go with, hey, we needed a new voice, but we didn't need an overhaul. I think that might be smart, but it is, to me, just objectively inaccurate to be like, this is year one. No one will look at it like that.

Because the person, to Brue's point, under pressure, the face of the organization, the reason we talk about the Buffalo Bills, is about to be in year 10. It's year 9 for him. And so, and he sat in on the interviews. He got, you know, seemingly, you're really. relationship with him is what helped you get this job. Like, there is going to be, in my eyes, as much pressure on Joe Brady as there would have been on Sean McDermott. Like, now, not in that, if he doesn't get it done, we're going to say he's on the hot seat.

But the expectation for the Buffalo Bills is to finally win the Super Bowl. And that was going to be the case, no matter who the coach was, but particularly when they hire from within KW. I agree with all of that. You're worried about the bills. I'm not worried about the bills at. No, you're worried for the bills. Yes, for a friend of the show, Josh.

Yes, that's what I mean. But as a Patriots. No, you're not concerned. No. No, they, uh, welcome back to the first things first. Check out on the podcast and YouTube. Do it today. Tomorrow's not promised, okay?

Trying to get up to a billion views. You know. Inside joke. Do it today. Welcome back to the show. We're doing another round of over under, starting with everybody. But he's all-American Matthews Stafford. That was a touchdown pass against Seattle.

Those are hard to come by. For not for him, because he's got 221 games. Oh, now, now. Frank May slowly get there. Fresh off NFC championship appearance. Over under is set 10 and a half. Let's look at their non-division opponents. Their division should be pretty tough.

Their home against Cowboys, Giants, Packers, Chiefs, Chargers, and Bills, and on the road in Philadelphia, Washington, Tampa Bay, Vegas, and Denver. Very tricky. Nick, you love this team. You do. I do love this. This one looks very tricky to me.

I like the extra home game. I'll tell you that much. I never know about people going on. I haven't looked at the international. It's going to come up with the Jags. Yeah, well, I think they are the team that plays the Niners in Australia, right? I think it's Rams 9. Niners in Australia.

You know what? Fact check me on that. I could also argue the Rams never have a home. But I totally. That Cowboys game's actually on the road. No, the Rams have better home crowd. than the chargers in that stadium at this point. But I'm going over.

Again, this is all, this isn't even in pencil. This isn't like at your sketch. You just shake it. Oh, yeah, okay. You don't even need an eraser. But right now, if I had to make my NFC pick for next year, I'd probably pick the Rams. That's not.

I've been, you know what? That's not. What do you mean? He's not going to pick them, and then he's going to play around. This is a little side. You ever watch the YouTube analytics where it's just like it spikes if something interesting happens?

that's not happening. No one's like, oh, guess what? Nick is flirting with the Rams. We've done like two years of bits about it. We know. I got the over. You kind of like the Rams, but never enough to commit to the Rams. I think the Rams have been banging on the door for years.

They got through, and then the last few years, they've been right there. They have given the last two Super Bowl champs, their only close game in either of the last two post seasons. That's a good take. And I think Stafford showed last year he's as good as ever, if not better than ever. I think they'll have their key pieces back, particularly on offense. I like the over. I'm glad to see everybody's All-American back.

But there's a part of me that fears maybe should have walked away on top. Well, that wouldn't have been on top. I mean, but he had a great year. He won his first MVP. everybody loves him right now. I'm going under. Wow. He'll be 38.

I'm certainly not going to say he's half-hearted into it because he's questioned whether or not he wants to play the last few years and obviously played well. But look, Sean McVeigh, great coach, unquestionably. Three of their last four years, he's 10 wins or under. You know, so that he's not a guarantee that they're going to win a ton of games. just because he's a great coach. Defensively, they gave up, what, 31 to Carolina, 31, I believe, to Seattle and losing in the playoffs.

Second half of the season, they weren't as good defensively. So I'm going to, again, we know this all in pencil. Right now, the division's clearly tough. I'm going under. I think the Niners are going to be healthier and good. Obviously, Seattle's there, and then we saw their schedules fairly tough. So I'm going under. I agree with Brew.

Here's why. Every team's either going to be better, worse, or the same. Great take. What the YouTube analytics do on that gym of Insight YouTube's gaming audience? Thanks for that. That wasn't a take. That was a pream. Okay.

Thanks. That being said, they have the 13th toughest schedule. Yeah. But the strength of schedule is only based on last year's win totals. So the chiefs are right there with the Saints as far as the Met, math goes of six-win teams. I think the Cowboys are going to be better. I think the Giants are going to be better.

The cheats are going to be better. If Joe All is healthy, we know the Chargers is going to be better. Commanders for Jaden will be better. Raiders, a little bit. Maybe, I don't know. Broncos, Eagles might be the same. No, but that's where I disagree with you. Give me your paper real quick.

Because so, like, by that same thing you're doing, do you think the Broncos is going to win 14 games again? Well, they might not win as many games. Well, but that's, right. But they might be better. The Chargers. They won 11 games last year. I think the charge will be a tougher team.

So I don't think when we say, oh, it's a tough division. It is a tough division. It's damn near impossible for the division to be tougher than it was last year, and they smashed the over. They would have smashed this over last year. The Niners, the two other teams in their division were playing each other for the number one seed in game 272. Yeah. You think the Niners will be better, though?

I do not think the Niners will have a better record than they did last year. Maybe not record, but be a better team. It might have a better record. And I don't think Seattle's going to have a better record than they did last year. Probably not. So when it comes to just picking win totals, I'm less truly concerned about overall quality of, you know, are the Niners better? And it's more about there's only 272 wins to be had across the league. How are they going to be dispersed?

And so they can get got. They can get guys. They've been, I mean, they're great against Seattle. Look, he's not going to pick them. He's going to pick Chicago and then flirt with the ranks. No, he's not going to pick. Chicago because Danny is on that Chicago point like nobody else.

This is second. This is second. Don't pick Seattle. You know, I pick it. Packers win total is at 10 and a half, bro. Are you going over or, oh no. You don't even need to ask me.

Falcons, bills, Panthers, Cowboys. Ooh, that Cowboys game in Green Bay is fun. Texans, Dolphins, Rams, Patriots, Saints, Jets, Bucks on the road. Packers. I think I may have been. a year early on my Packers to the Super Bowl pick. Michael

will be back maybe for the start of the season week three, four for sure. They're going to be, remember last year they were, we don't think of this because they've been in the playoffs a few times. They were the youngest team in the league last year. All right? Jordan

Love had his best season and seemed to get rid early on he had some moments where you're right, the Jordan Love moments. But later on he was strong. And look, I would love to see them, and I guess it's possible. They get a better receiver. Maybe Gordon, Matthew Golden, will turn into that true number one.

They need a true number one. But assuming Micah's back healthy, Matt LaFleur, too, who I think is a very good coach, is on the hot seat. Yeah. And I think that'll motivate him. I don't think he, I guess you can say he should be if you just look at the results. But I think it's crazy to have him on the hot seat. But again, I think that could work in their benefit because he knows, man,

I got to have a great season. And so I think they're going to be the over. I take the under. You still have a good season. Still will make the playoffs hit in the under. That's a big number. You lost your defensive coordinator to a head coaching job, which means you lost it.

It's always more concerning to me when you lose a coordinator because he was so good that he got plucked rather than we are making this choice because we think we can improve in that spot, meaning you didn't want to lose him. I think that Micah's return from an ACL is a bit of a black box at a position and a style of play where every, you know, what makes him so special. One of the things is his speed, his burst, his athleticism. So even when he is back, how long until he looks like Micah? And I do think that the, and it's also their star receipt or tight end, Tucker Kraft coming off a major injury. Now, he'll be back, but it's all...

The backup was pretty good now. And the backup was supposed to be the better player. The craft just kind of exploded onto the scene. All of that aging, running back, I'll just take the under for now. I'm also going to take the under. I'm waiting for Joy and Love to make the leap. We can't have this conversation every off-season. No, but he could, but he also, I bet Brew will agree with me.

He could never make the leap and just be solid. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like somewhere from the eighth to 12th best quarterback in football year over year. You can win it that way, obviously. And, like, Jack Prescott, I think, never made, like, the leap. Like, he was consistently, you know, he had. I mean, he was like an MVP.

He had an MVP candidate year. And I think Jordan Love might have one of those in his future and still never, but never just be like the perennial elite quarterback. But he's in the MVP mix. Yeah. Well, I don't know if you remember Bruce. He was, yeah. He had a few weeks on the ballot.

Let's head down to Jacksonville. Speaking of a guy was in the MVP mix. Yeah, I mean, top five. It's his second top seven MVP. That is an amazing stat considering his career. Well, I mean, what do you mean? I mean, you wouldn't think he's been in the top seven twice. I would have thought he would have way more than that.

Amazing. No. Home against the Browns, Patriots, Eagles, Steelers, and Commanders on the road against the Ravens, Bears, Bengals, Bengals, Cowboys, Broncos, and Giants. He's back to be in the Prince. Hit the trumpets dust. She was. Over under.

Nine and a half. That's an insult. I was going to say. That's a slap. Vegas doesn't believe. That's a slap in the Prince in Jacksonville's face. They've just got the good announcement from a couple days ago. Once again, back-to-back London games.

That's a good announcement. For the Jags, it is? For the Jags, it's an advantage at this point. They are all six games in Florida. But here's why I think it's an advantage. They're used to it. And whoever is coming over, they're like, okay, this is our one Europe trip. Maybe they haven't even gone to one previously.

They have to learn it. The Jags have a system for when they go over there. And the second game on that Europe trip for them, they'll have been there for 10 days already, and the other team will have just gotten there. So I do think that there is something of an edge in that compared to the opponent. I also, I think the Titans are still building and far away. I think we don't know who's playing quarterback for the Colts. Yours on about an Achilles being a two-year injury for Jason Tatum.

Daniel Jones popped his four months ago, sadly. And I know you have recreated the 2025 Texans into an amalgamation of the 85 Bears 2000. It's just the stats when you look at them. You're lying right up there with Ray Lewis and Ed Reed. But I just, I think that this is a tough off season for CJ. And the Texans still have real questions all across their offense outside of CJ. Just the offensive line, the skill position guys, all of it. So that division, that quarterback, that schedule, I love the over for Jacksonville.

I'm not as high on them as you. And I really had trouble with this answer, but I'm going to go over. Like you said, the division, I don't think Tennessee's ready. Jones probably won't be back for Indy. And I do think C.J. O bounce back, but still, you know, we'll see. So I like Liam Cohen. I'm not convinced the Prince is like, okay, this is who he is now. But 10 wins, I think they can get there.

And we didn't even mention it, KW. Travis Hunter. They're going to get more from Travis Hunter next year than they did this year. NFL hasn't made any rule change. The UFL has made several and several awesome ones. Starts in about a month. We've got a few rules that we're going to go over and see what you like. Here they are.

There's more. These are the notable ones. 60-yard field goals are worth four. A catch, you only need one foot in college rules. No tush push. Bang. No punting inside the 50. And you get a, you can have a three-point attempt after touchdowns.

The eight. The eight. One pointers from the two, a two-pointers from the two-pointers. They don't have a few. No, you go for it no matter what. It's a one pointers from the two, a two pointers from the five, and a three pointers from the eight. So you in theory could get a nine point score.

It touchdown plus the three. Okay. I have it committed to memory, KW. You're going to fact check me on it. One point conversion is a 33-yard field goal. Two-point conversion ball placed at the two. At the two. Okay.

And the three-point is ball placed at the eight. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So if you just want your old school. It's like the NFL except for the three-point. Yeah. And so listen.

I'm taking three every time. You're going for three every time? I think so, right? I mean, I think it would be a game time score situation. But can I say this? Getting rid of the tush push, love it. And they're not doing it because one UFL team's awesome at it. They're doing it because it's bad for TV and it's not a football play, so I love that.

And I love forcing coaches into aggressiveness by saying, once you're inside the 50, you're not allowed to punt the ball. Go for it. And so I think that is, I understand that the NFL wouldn't ever take that agency away from its coaches,

but I like that a lot. The idea that once you're closer to the end zone than you are from your own end zone, you should either be kicking a field goal or going for it, not punning, and we're just going to mandate that by rule. I like that a lot. Yeah.

I like some of these too. Look, I like the 60-yard field goal. Being worth four? Four points. No. I like that. The price of my Brandon Aubrey take is aging by, yeah, day. No, he could demand $15 million if that happens.

Tush-push, I'm fine because for me, it's the ability to officiate it. Or inability, or whatever you want to call it. I don't want the one foot in bounds. I think the best receivers are the, I'm. obviously in the world or in the NFL, and they're capable of doing it with two. Has anybody, maybe I missed it. Is anybody complaining because the NFL players have to have two feet in?

When have you been complaining about it? Privately. I would prefer, I'm a fan of the spectacular. I agree. And it is a very, it's not, it's a rule change that's not revolutionary. Just like, let's do it like college, and it would lead to more spectacular catches. I'm also tired of looking at blades of grass and this and that and oh, toe tap.

I think it's just cooler. You still might have that with one foot. Maybe not as much. But, you know, that's. I understand Bruce's point, which is at the absolute pinnacle of the sport, what makes it the most spectacular is it's the hardest to do and you can do it. Right. So I think the U.FL doing one foot makes a ton of sense because that, like, as far as. Receivers aren't as good.

Right. They're not. And so, and it does reward the spectacular. So I like that rule for the UFL. I agree with the Rue about the NFL. The three point, that's interesting. I mean, look, like you said, aggressiveness, more offense. Because I do think, I don't know if the numbers play it out,

but it does look like defenses. Remember a few years ago the offens seem to head of the defense. It feels like the defense are, have adjusted a little bit and catching up a little bit. So this puts more scoring into it. So yeah, maybe I'm, I'm. I'm fine with the other thing that having the three point extra point, if you will, where a touchdown can be worth nine, it would also, my guess is. Games closer.

But it would cause, it would force more aggressiveness from teams who are ahead. That if you're up, right now, if you're up six, you're like, oh, okay, one field goal from us and it's a two-score game. Not if somebody can get nine, you know what I mean, in one score. so it makes you continue to try to accumulate points. I love it. I like all these. I like them.

It's a nice thing. Every single one of them? Wow. Well, I mean, I've got three pages of them. I don't know if I love every single one. Live from New York, is the show that had to make a quick run to the post office today. Not too much traffic post-Christmas after Santa's letters.

Second hour, first things first. What a show we have today, huh? We're all just lucky to be alive. Today, Aaron Run. Rogers to the Vikings. Very interesting. Viking GM said, you know what? Everything's on the board. Brew, I think Brew likes it. Brew pitch it as a question. Sometimes he pitches questions that he wants to just roast. And like, hey, brew you like. He's like wrong. Why would you think that? Meanwhile, the Patriots, Jalen Hawkins, number 21, joins the show. I've got 50 questions. Nick and

and Brew have two. So we'll see how that one goes. He makes some nice picks. He's a great player and very versatile. Also a free agent, so I'm gonna try to do this. You might not even be with your team next year. Yeah, that would hurt my feelings. Right now, it's time for the most motivational segment of all the sports. Also, a time where we read some viewer mail. We get all sorts of mail, all shapes and sizes. Sometimes I get huge packages, sometimes just little notes, almost like little notes. Little notes. With no address or stamp on them? I don't know. How do they just get delivered to the mailbox or like slid under your door in your shared office? It was just here.

It just ripped it in hat. Doesn't matter. It's so little. Dear Wilds, love the show and glad everyone is back. Well, you and me both, friend. Is it true? As Brew mentioned, Nick was just playing cards out on the West Coast. Here's Ryan and Brian.

I try to say no. Brew said yes. And then Hobbs, who does follow, is a bit of a card player himself, said, we do have some visual evidence of you out west playing cards. in a vest. Do you wear a vest? No, what is this? What?

Jackson Bleeds there. Jackson Blaine looks great. I look terrible. It's not, he can, well, he said you were at guacamole joes. No, it was artichoke joes. And you don't have your highlights in. It's part of the problem. Or your dogs out.

He told me, he's like, do you want to watch a poker, uh, poker highlight? You were about to show. I was like, sure, I'll watch one. I sends it to you. I haven't seen it yet. We're gonna watch, Bruy and I are gonna watch you in the break.

How long is it? Four minutes? Yeah. Wow. You wanna watch it? Not for four minutes. 40 seconds, maybe. It's four minutes.

All right, let's get to it. At number three, La Mello Ball. Here we go. I said something in the break that I think this will surprise you guys. Just initially, once you think about you, be like, yeah, this makes sense. Okay. This is his sixth year.

Yeah, that makes sense. That didn't knock you a little. That was it? Maybe because he's been injured a bit. He's, you know, kind of off the radar because the teams, it just feels like, man, he's already been in the league six years, you know? Came in as such a Ballyhooie rookie. Was rookie to year over Anthony Edwards somehow. But anyway, all right.

Same graph class is Anthony Edwards and James Wiseman. Yeah, yeah. It just feels like he hadn't been in that long. But six years, you're a veteran. Yeah. You're a vet. See, calling him a veteran would shock. There you go.

Okay. Now you're there. But you're in six years. You are a veteran. I know he came in early. But anyway, here we go. Lamello, you have to decide what you want to be. Do you want to be like a guy that plays in the playoffs,

all-star games, and has legitimate success, maybe reaches your full potential as a player, which is a very high potential. Or do you want to kind of be this underground legend that rebels really love on the streets? They low, yo, mellow, that boy is bad. And, you know, there's always somebody in a debate that wants to stun you with the answer you didn't think. You know who really is the best player in the league?

La Mello ball. Like, do you want to be that guy who people love because you're like an and-one mixtape guy in the NBA? Or do you want to be the guy that really has legitimate success in the league? Or third option. Paddle Award, race car driver. Oh, well, that, yeah. I'm trying to stay away from that.

That was a little more demolition derby, by the way. But anyway, here's the good news, Mello. Because you want street grid. You can be both. Wow. You can be both. You just, and you are on the right track. On the court, off the court, you know, on the court, you're on the right track.

This year, you have taken your shots down from 21 a game last year to 17. That's a four-shot drop good on you. Your turnovers are dropped from three and a half per game to below three a game. You're starting, I've been clamoring for this for the last few years. You're starting to play winning basketball, all right? And you got two other young guys to run with you, Conniple, the rookie's playing well. Brandon Miller, who's looking like maybe he'll be a future star as well.

You guys could be a nice big three. You've won 12 of your last 15 games. You've gotten into the play-in spot. I don't know if you can get all the way up to the playoffs legitimately in the top six, but maybe you can get there by winning some playing games. But keep up the good work. I do believe in your ability, and I'm pulling for you, Little Mello. All right, at number two, Nick's guy, Joel NB.

Now, Nick thinks you are still a top 15. Was it top 15 or top 10? Top 15 player in the NBA. I'm skeptical because you're a part-time player. Let's just keep it real. That's what you are now. You're still great when you play 26 points a game, only about seven and a half boards.

But, hey, I get it. Your body's been sacked because of injuries and things like that. I'm not putting all of that on you. It is what it is. But here's the deal. And Nick kind of mentioned this. If his plan, Nick's plan, is correct that, hey, just get Joel to the playoffs. And just have Joel be healthy for the playoffs.

If that happens, Joel, I want to see something. All right? Because here's the deal. With Embed playing, they are 20 and 12. That's a 51 win pace. Without him, they're 12 and 14. All right. So if you are indeed healthy, Joel, for the playoffs, guess what?

Philly is not entering these playoffs with a healthy Joel Embed as the sixth seed, a typical six seed. You are entering as a team, a 50 plus win team. And guess what? In a mediocre Eastern conference, I want you to do damage. I want you to do damage. If that's the plan, if you are healthy come playoff time, Joel NB, I expect you to lead the Sixers to some wins. All right.

Now, you haven't been a great playoff guy. You've been injured, missing a lot of games when you play, you're 70% or whatever. So I get it. But if you are healthy this year, I want some playoff success. What is success? When will you be having? It's first conference finals. Conference finals?

Yeah, I mean, look, if he's healthy, if he's legitimately like 90-something percent, and he's playing with Tyrese Maxie who's having an all-N-B-A year, and then you got Edge Come, you got some other decent players. I don't think, like, you can write them all. I shouldn't say. That's why I had a on my list earlier. You might not pick them for the conference finals, but you can say they have a legitimate chance. Also, KW, did you get the bar?

You got to read it out. I like it a lot. A healthy friend is a friend in B. I didn't get it at first. And then I said it in my head. I was like, I got it. Excellent. It doesn't qualify for the spot bonus, but it is good.

I'm pulling for you. All right. At number one, the Knicks. The whole team. Everybody. Because I could just focus. I put him on the butlers before. I could just focus on Cat, Carl Anthony Towns.

But it's not just about Kay. He has to play better. He has to play strong. When he's at his best, they're a different team, a better team. But I don't want to just put it all on Cat. Dalen Brunson, Mikhail Bridges, Josh Hart, so on and so forth, Mike Brown, Leon Rose, who has done a very good job with the Knicks. However, Leon Rose, you are the guy that fired Tom Tibado after he got to the conference finals

and brought in a new coach, who I like Mike Brown. But also Leon Rose, you're the guy that gave up five draft picks, first round picks from McHale Bridges. And if you had some of those picks left, guess what? Janus would probably be a Nick right now, or certainly in the future. And so the whole organ, heck, I'm throwing them all in. Spike Lee, Fat Joe, Tracy Morgan, Ramsey. Ramsey, our guy here.

Bob Dean Sharper. I'm throwing all of them. Yes. Everybody had me here in the front rows cheering on the Knicks, the old Knicks. Yeah, Susie. Larry Johnson, all those guys, too. All right, because here's why. If not now, when?

Well, that's a good point. Tyrese Halliburton, gone. Janice Antigupo, gone. Jason Tatum, gone. There are other teams that meet. I mean, if not now, Nick's win. You've been waiting 53 years. 53 years.

This conference will never be as bad as it's been for many years. It'll never be this wide open. Detroit's only going to get better. All right. Halliburton's coming back. Tatum's coming back. It will never be this wide open. You guys are the most intact team,

the team that has all of your stars healthy and ready to go. What win? If not this year. And here's the thing I want you to avoid, New York. The boogeyman. Don't create another boogeyman. There's always a Knicks boogeyman. Michael Jordan.

Hakeem Elijah Wyn, Reggie Miller, Trey Young, Tyrese Halliburton. Is the next one, Cade Cunningham? Wow. Is he the next one? You got to avoid that, Nix. So I'm putting all of you on the bud list. It's motivation.

All right? I can't say I fully believe in you. I can't necessarily even say I'm pulling for you. Gee whiz, why not? But good luck, Nick. Why wouldn't you pull for the Knicks? Good luck, Nick. Wow.

I'm not pulling against them. I just say it is what it is. It sounds like. I didn't pick them. I think Detroit is the best team in the East. My goodness. Well, it's 412 on a Thursday, which means you're in for a real treat.

In addition to the Budlis, you get a special edition of Sports Media Ombudsman. This week's edition of Sports Media Ombudsman would like to shout out a reporter. Charlotte Harper of the Athletic, who I thought asked at the very beginning, and we're going to play the question and then the answer. The very beginning,

seems like an outrageous question, one second in, but then she expands on it to legendary skier Eileen Gou, about a week ago at the Olympics. And I am playing this because, as the show's grandfather, and because we now also need to, as Gianna has told me, you know, reach a younger audience. I think Eileen Gou, who I understand for some people is controversial, just don't worry about that for a second

and just listen to what she says. is some of the best advice for young people out there about controlling your own destiny and becoming whomever you want to become I've ever heard. And it was inspired by a great question. So shout out to Charlotte Harper of The Athletic. And for everyone on this show, 30 and under, listen to this, what I consider,

legitimate wisdom from, go ahead. What about us? What about me and? Well, we're kind of formed. I can't, there's nothing we can, so brew we're out. It's going to be, we're not out, I'm not out, but this is, you know what, it's advice everyone can take, but particularly for young people. I'm a lifetime learner, you know that. Just give it a listen.

It's about 90 seconds long. Do you think before you speak, because you answer questions so quickly and so comprehensively, whether it's about geopolitics or your sport or aerodynamics? Like, can you take us into your brain? Thank you, Charlotte. That's very kind. Oh, man. Do I think? I think overall, I'm just a pensive person.

Like, I'm a very introspective, I'm an introspective young woman. Like, I spend a lot of time in my head, and it's not a bad place to be. I journal a lot. I break down all of my thought processes. I think I apply a very analytical lens to my own thinking, and I kind of modify it

because it's so interesting. It's so interesting. You can control what you think. You can control how you think, and therefore you can control who you are. And especially as a young person, like I'm 22. So with neuroplasticity on my side, I can literally become exactly who I want to be. How cool is that? Like, how empowering is that, right? And so the fact is I get to become every day the kind of person that me at age eight would revere. Like, I would be obsessed with me today. Are you kidding? I would love me. And I think that's the biggest flex of all time, that you can have little younger you be proud of you today. I guess for me, it's like, yes, I spend a lot of time in my own head. Yes, I think a lot. But it's not really like in an egotistical kind of way. It's in like a tinkering, like a scientist kind of way. I'm always like trying to modify. I'm trying to think how can I be better?

How can I approach my own brain the way that I approach my craft of free skiing so that I can be better tomorrow than I was today? I just thought that was awesome. And I think the lesson being for young people of particular, you literally can just become the person you want to become. doesn't mean you're going to be a gold medal winner or whatever. You can't necessarily have, just create the professional success. But the person that you want to be, you can just slowly but surely become,

I think is incredibly well put by Eileen Gou. Agency. Yes. Never give up your agency. And I think too many people are doing that nowadays. Like I can't, oh, this is the problem. That's the problem. She is right.

You still, no matter what problems are out there, There are obstacles out there, but you have your agency to determine what you want to do every single day, how you want to think, how you want to move. I loved it too. That was great. Well, I expect you guys to keep that same energy when I said, Drake May will play better next year. He's going to get more experience and went through some of our sleeves. I am putting NBA goaltending on the budd list because it turns out most people, including the Lakers, Luca, JJ Reddick, me, the broadcast, everybody, don't quite know the rules.

So with Celtics Lakers, we'll run the full clip here. LeBron gets blocked by Keda. Ball finds Ait, and Katie's back said, give me that. He puts his hand through the rim. He hits the rim and the net. Jalen comes down, ends up being a three-point play. Lucas is like, wait, he put his hand through the rim. What's going on here?

JJ Reddick said, he put his hand through the rim. That's goal-tenth. I think next thing you know, this play doesn't, Mark it's smart, like, see what happened? He's like, no, no. You know, he put his hand through the rim. Luca goes up and gives an explanation, put his hand through the rim.

JJ Reddick during a timeout, he put on his sneakers, lucky he wears him, put his hand through the rim. Turns out, however, not goaltending, Brew. You are allowed. He hit the room too, yeah. You're allowed to do it. So JJ Reddick was fired up, but the next day, he's like, guess what?

I learned something after talking about to the NBA's SVP of REF development. Take a listen. Truthfully, he said it wasn't a goal tank. So, you know, I don't know that we want to endanger our guy's fingers, but it is, like, if I was Luke Cornett or Wembe, I would literally every time somebody took the shot, I'd stick my hand up in the rim and just not jostle it because I think it's an incredible return. So there we go.

New defense. We talked about Luke Cornett, the Cornett contest, where you just kind of block your vision, bro. but do you view this as now a viable deterrent? No, I view it as something the NBA should change. Like, you can't, I always thought like Reddick that if you hit the rim when the shot is going up, it's gold tended. So I think I think that part is because Reddick says as, you know, and you don't jostle it. Yeah. So I think that did.

I mean, you. So I think that part's a mistake. But I think what they're saying is if you put your hand through the basket and don't touch the ball and bring it down, that's in and of itself not goal tending. So what Redick is saying that Wimby is saying if you don't hit the rim, you don't hit the rim or the ball. But I think you're allowed to hit you can hit the rim and he said it wasn't gold. It's just like what's jostling? Oh, okay. But I don't know. Like what's? It just, if you hit the rim like that, it should be yeah. Yeah, it like it in like a playground. I guess I understand like if somebody's going up for a dunk

and I'm trying to block it and I hit the rim. Yeah. It shouldn't be a, you know, automatically. a basket, but... What about the idea of what he's saying, which is Wimby, if somebody's taking getting ready to take a shot from the three, three point line, and he's under the basket, Wimby jumping and putting his hand straight through it just to

distract him, because that's what he's talking about. He's saying, and all of a sudden the guy's trying to see the rim, and all what's going on? Yeah, so I don't know. That doesn't seem... I put that in the same bucket as the tush push. This is not good for the game. Well, except it doesn't happen.

been nearly as much as the tush push. Right. And it also thought it was illegal. Yeah. Right. It was unintentional. But now it's intentional. And the league just changed. The whole world just changed. Wow. Next time I play pickup. KW.

You'll grab the net. You're playing on eight footrooms? No, I'm playing on 10. I'm going to try, okay? Did we not learn anything for your thing? You could try it in your mind. It doesn't mean your hamstrings are not going to give out. Well, I'm going to give it my all.

Okay. Isn't that what the Bud list is about? That's true. Motivation. I think it's been a long time since you've grabbed the rim, buddy. That's not true. Oh, really? What do you consider a grab?

Is Herbert still an elite QB? Next. Fastest racing on earth returns to Fox. Indy car season launches St. Petersburg Sunday at noon eastern, live on Fox. Guess what we have on tomorrow? Friend of the show, Alex Pillow. We kick around friend of the show a lot, but Palo is might be one of our most recurring guess. Probably right.

One of it, but he's also just friend of mine in Brooks. He made it very clear that he doesn't like it. He made, there was no uncertain terms. Tough but fair. Afternoon headlines sponsored by Kraft Mac and Cheese. Kraft Mac and Cheese, the best thing ever. Let's head to the combine in Chargers GM. Very confident in the new Mike McDaniel Justin Herbert

combination. Take a listen. Mike is a coach that will literally create his scheme, create his offense based around the players we have. And it's not that you go out and find this specific player. So I think his flexibility as an offense coordinator and play caller is one of the things that makes him great. And just knowing the offense, I think Justin's going to take off in it. Do you still consider Justin Herbert elite or will you with this combination of Mike McDaniel?

I've never considered him elite. Never? He's never been elite. He has elite traits. Elite traits does not make one an elite player. DeAndre Aiton's got elite traits. We're going to talk about him in a minute. And I'm not...

You're not putting him in a little. No, I'm not, but I'm simply saying having elite traits does not mean you are an elite player. And being an elite player does not always mean you have a ton of elite traits. Almost all elite players have some elite traits. I like that. But most of Justin Herbert's traits, measurables, are better than Tom Brady's. Oh, yeah.

You know, he's got better size, he's got better speed, he's got better arm. Brady had a really strong arm, but Herbert, I think, stronger, all those things. And they're in different stratospheres. Like, there can only be a handful of truly elite players at any position, or else the word fails to, you know, loses all meaning. And what can you point to from what Justin Herbert has accomplished in his career that is elite? his record is not elite his overall statistical profile is not elite

It's like a bunch of yards It's a bunch of yards But it's not as far as where he ranks you know Over his career or Early on he threw for a lot of touchdowns Right but at this point He doesn't drop down he doesn't have elite

Statistical seasons as of late He's never had a gaudy win-loss record in one season He's obviously never Doesn't have any signature moments because all of his playoff games have been three very different types of horrifying failures. And I just, there are, and I'll let you go brew, and then maybe we can list some quarterbacks. There are pretty easily 10 quarterbacks that have a stronger case to be considered elite than Justin Herbert. And there ain't 10 elite quarterbacks in my book.

A third of the starting quarterbacks can't be elite. In the grand scheme of things, sure. What do you mean? You meet a guy at a party. Oh, yes. He's an elite quarterback for human beings. Yes. Yes.

But for NFL quarterbacks, no, yeah. Yeah, I'm on this similar vein. He's an elite talent. You know, I don't think he's elite. He just, he's 0 in the playoffs. Statistics are horrible in the playoffs overall. And like Nick said, you know, last few years, his numbers haven't been huge.

I do think, though, and I don't think one season does it. But I think this year he will, have an elite season with Mike McDaniel. Really? And then going, I think Mike McDaniel is great offensively as an offensive mind. And now he's, well, the verdict's out on head coaching.

But as an offensive coordinator, I mean, look at what he did with Tua. Tua had a phenomenal year. They scored 70 points against the Broncos one time. So I think Herbert, who is talented, is incredibly talented. I think he's going to be in the MVP. conversation.

He was at points early last season. You got a first place vote. That was kind of right. But their offensive line, assuming it's healthy, and I know we joke about that, but two really good offensive tackles that were out this year for the most part. He'll have them. I would like to see them upgrade the receiver. Ladd-McConkie is good.

Quentin Johnson is good. But I'd like to see them go a bit higher if they can. But bottom line is, I think he will have an elite season and have a chance to win MVP this year. Now, I don't think, I don't think necessarily even be an MVP. Oh, that would make him a leap to me. I don't think that. I don't know if everybody always considered Matt Ryan elite. We have had MVP's who weren't elite.

I think five current quarterbacks of one MVP. I mean, I mean, I think you have to go, like a few years. I think Matt Ryan was considered a little. the year after he won MVP. Maybe not three years after that. Okay, but I'm saying, like, Lamar is Mahomes, Josh, those guys are like elite

for a decade. You know, that's to me what I'm thinking about when I say elite. Even Joe Burrell. He would have a gaudy statistic. It'd be an elite year. Yeah. And maybe going forward,

he would become elite. But I'm just saying, bottom lines, I think he'll be in the MVP race and have a phenomenal year under McDaniel. The only way that I think he would, wouldn't be considered, universally considered elite if he won MVP, was if he had another disastrous playoff game, his first playoff game. I think if he wins MVP and first round just gets clocked like he did,

that I think could take him down. But I just, I... Here's your 10? Well, Mahomes, Alan Lamar, Stafford, no doubt, right? Those guys have all won MVP's. Stafford and Mahomes obviously have also won a Super Bowl. I would still I still consider Joe Burrow elite

Okay so now we're at five Guys and that to me by the way Is the end of the list Of the elite quarterbacks But guys who are in line If it's club superstar In line on the outside And ahead of Herbert in the line

I think you have to put Jalen Hertz ahead of him I think you have to put Jared Gough ahead of him I think you have to put at this point Sam Darnold ahead of him. You guys wouldn't. I personally would put Trevor ahead of him.

I don't think Herbert has ever had a year as good as what Trevor just had. I don't think he ever has. Never had one nearly as many games. Never finished as high as MVP voting. Trevor also obviously has won a playoff game against him. But again, I knew Trevor would be a controversial one. But for me, and he is to me in the same portion of the line. So that's nine guys I just mentioned as Dak and Jordan Lowe.

love and they're there. Now, the two young guys, Drake May and Caleb Williams, I would say also have absolutely have elite traits. They're different. But I think as far as their physical traits and tools, they are elite like Herbert, but they have not yet accomplished enough to be elite. I think Drake is closer than Caleb is obviously on that. But I don't have him as a definitionally elite quarterback yet.

I don't have Caleb. I don't have Jaden. And so like that's, we've now listed half the league. And so I just think he is closer right now to 10th than to first. So you don't think, do you think it's not on the table that he'll have an elite year with Mike McDaniel? No, I don't want to say I don't think it's on the table. But I would not predict it. Really?

Yeah, I don't. So what do you think? You think he's just going to kind of be what he has been the last few years? I just don't, I am not as impressed as I think others are by this player. I think that I have never judged quarterbacks by show me their 10 best throws of the year. By that standard, he's an all-time great. And I think that we are too deep into his career for it to have just always been someone else's fault. now maybe he will go on the Stafford trajectory

where but the Stafford look there's a lot of guys obviously he wasn't as bad as Baker darn old guys like that but later they took a huge jump and he could make a similar jump he just was better you know he was jumping from a higher level

than them I think all that's on the table because he does have incredible talent and traits so here's what just frustrates me And this is where I think it's different than maybe Baker or Darnold or whatever. I do not think overall he has had these just awful situations. No, I agree with that. I think that since Harbaugh's been there, gotten there, he's had excellent defenses each year. Two years ago, had the number one defense in football.

To your point, I don't think he has had great receivers. I'm not acting like he's had great receivers. But when he started, he had Keenan Allen and Keen Allen is still very good. He had Austin Echler early on who was good, particularly. Mike Williams. Right. He had Mike Williams, who people liked it. He got hurt a lot. They have spent high draft picks on receivers.

Now, it's not his fault. Quentin Johnston hasn't hit. I think Ladd's a good player. And, yes, this year, the offensive line was a disaster. I understand that. But it has, I think he has had pretty close to, like, average overall situations. You know what I mean? I thought his coaching was bad early on with Brandon.

I know, but Brandon Staley, by the way, wasn't his first coach. Anthony Lynn was, and I thought Anthony Lynn was average. And he had a great, he had some great years early on. Yeah, that's true. I mean, individually. We're going to stay in L.A., but going to the NBA, where DeAndre Aiton, according to Dave McMenaman, not thrilled with his roll brew.

After a loss to the magic, here's what Aiton announced in Dave wrote, quote, they're trying to make me. Clint Capella, he said, referencing the Houston Rockets now backup center, who a decade ago made his impact

as a lob-catching rim-running big on a team that made it to two conference finals. I'm not Clint Capella, your reaction.

Well, I'm not going to kill a, look, he has more talent and ability. We're just talking about the ability with Herbert than Clint Capella.

But he has to understand because of the way his, the early part of his career has gone, he kind of lost that benefit of the doubt, right? And now the best thing for him to do would be to play like Clint Capella for the Lakers. And then once you kind of establish yourself as a valuable piece and indispensable piece, then you can start doing, if you get your mind right, using your talent to go to a higher level.

It's like some role players who've entered the league, a Bruce Bowen, for example. You're trying to just hang on and play in the NBA. You know what? Let me be a 3-and-D guy. I'm going to hit the corner 3 and D my butt off, all right? Do that. You establish yourself as that guy. Then eventually, if you have the talent, you can start taking guys off the dribble.

You can start doing a little more because you've earned that. That's where he has to go. Now, now he feels like as a number one pick overall. former number one pick, I shouldn't have to do it. You bungled the early part of your career and now you have to do it. Nick, this is where I disagree, like

a few days ago, you said if the NICs, if the Lakers get rid of LeBron this off season, it's going to have to be Luca, Austin Reeves, and like three new starters. He could play a role on the Luka team. He has more ability than Gafford

and any of these guys that Lucas been with before. If I'm the Lakers, what I would be doing is talking to him all the time about this is what we need you to do to play with Luca. He can be a rim. He can be a rim runner. But he doesn't catch a lives. He did it the other night.

He literally doesn't want to be. Look, you try to get through to him because the dude is talented. Several. He ain't the problem with the Lakers. I'll tell you that. Oh, I agree. He ain't the problem. He's not the answer either.

He could be a part of the answer going forward if he gets it right. You know who would really help the Lakers right now? Rockets Clint Capella. Oh, yeah. I mean, that is for what the team is. I agree with you, Brew. He is not, the Lakers have bigger problems than DeAndre Aiton. And for what they're paying him is a good deal.

So I'm not trying to voice this on him. But he is the same draft class as Luca. And so I look at, you know, I don't, I think that those guys who have been in the league now eight years are kind of who they are. And the DeAndre Aiton doesn't get it all the time. Right. And doesn't.

And so it is what the Lakers desperately need is a defensive first, rim running, lob catching, big man. Which is why J.J. Reddick is trying to make him Clint Capella because that's what the team needs. or young Jared Allen or, you know what I mean? There's been a lot of archetypes of that. Nick Clack, for real. A lot of archetypes of that is exactly what they need. Daniel Gafford. And you're right.

He has a better pedigree and more. I like Daniel Gaffer. Yeah, but Daniel Gafford, do you agree, would be better on the lake for the lake. Yeah, because he understands his role and who he is. Patriots, Jalen Hawkins, free agent. Hopefully future Patriot as well, joins the show next. Joining us now, number 21 for the AFC champion New England Patriots team of the century. A lot of people call them.

Even though he's a free agent officially is Jalen Hawkins. Jalen, thank you for joining us. Can we just get this out of the way? And this might not be the most professional thing in the world. I know what you're about to do. Don't do this. I'm just, I have no power of the Patriots. I was just saying on behalf of every fan of the Patriots, including and the Wilde's family,

who I said, hey, we're going to talk to Jaylon Hawkins today. and Billy Wilds was like, tell him, I said hello. We would like you back with the New England Patriots. So how is your free agency process? I know Elliott said he wants you back. I assume Vrable wants you back. Continuities very important. You know, we did go to the year.

So what does your free agency process look like? I would say right now, you know, it's a lot. You're just waiting on calls. And obviously, you're going through the process of talking teams and your agents figuring out what's best and prices and all that type of stuff. But, you know, overall, man, I'd love to be back, you know what I'm saying, in a Patriot uniform. I love the culture, the infrastructure, the coaches that we have over there, Ray Bull, everybody, man. I feel like it's home over there, and I'd love to be back, to be honest.

Heck yeah. Congrats on an awesome season. You know what I mean? You've had a long career, but I think it's fair to say this was your most productive season by a decent margin. I don't know how much of that you attribute to. to Mike Vrable and to, you know, the new Patriot system, if you will. But I am interested in Mike Vrable's story or anecdote. Wilde loves him.

I think everybody has an affinity for him. We saw him in the preseason, was it? When he, like, gotten one of the fights with one of the players. We saw him in the playoffs. His mouth's bleeding. Tell us something about Vrable. Man, Vrable is a cool. Like, it's like having a big brother as a coach.

You know what I'm saying? with a little bit of father figure in him, you know what I'm saying? Because he got that disciplinary. And then he just also understands us. You know, he's been in the league, played for a long time, had a successful career. But I understand this as players and wants to get to know us

and actually takes the time, you know what I'm saying, and it's very detailed when we go out to practice and in his teachings and what he does, man. So I just think overall, man, he's a great coach. One of the best I've ever had, to be honest. And yeah, man, good dude. Jalen, how? How long does the Super Bowl loss stick with you?

Like, are you over that already? Or do you ever get over that? Or do you use it as motivation or what? I'm not going to lie, I mean, I feel like it's stuck with all of us, man. Because, you know, I mean, you work so hard to get to that point, you know. And, you know, to end up with a loss, man, it hurt. I'm not going to lie, that wouldn't hurt me. One of the tougher losses that I've taken in my whole life, to be honest.

But I think, you know, we use that as feel for sure, man. going on to this next year. And yeah, you got to use that as feel for sure. But I mean, still ultimately blessed, you know what I'm saying, to be in that situation and to get there. So, yeah. I just want to ask one Super Bowl follow-up because watching the game,

it seemed like your guy's defense had a very, even more so than usual, aggressive approach in that game. Early, the first pass of the game, I forget who it was, but almost, Darnold completed it, It looked like it was this close to being a pick the other way. Was your guy's game plan in that game more, I don't know if aggressive is the right word, but risk-takey than maybe in other games because you thought you were going to have the opportunity to create turnovers? I think we just went into the game, you know, obviously with the mindset of creating turnovers.

So, like, yeah, we caught it aggressive. I called it aggressive. We played aggressive, man. I feel like everybody, you know, we was confident in our cover. confident in our prep. And, you know, he went into it, basically, like, we're going to go out there and basically better on ourselves and play our game, you know, and try to dictate theirs and not let their game dictate them up.

The offense dictate us. So, yeah, that was the initial thought process, man. We trusted what we, what the plan was. But, you know, like I said, came up short. But, yeah. Jalen, one part that I like about the Patriots defense, your game, specifically, is that you're all over the field, right? You had one and a half sacks.

You had five QB hits, and then other times you've got four picks. You're also a great tackler. What do you take specific pride in? What do you like, you're like, you know what? I'm best at this, or do you just like being totally versatile everywhere? I like being versatile, man. Obviously, wherever I got the team, but I like playing all over the field. I feel like that's one of the things in the ball.

You know what I'm saying? The ball, I feel like that's something that's always been real important to my game. since I was a kid, but especially playing offense, you know, growing up playing receiver and converting in the defense. You know, I always try to play emphasis on getting the ball. And our coach is playing emphasis on takeaways in the ball. So, like, I really appreciated that about our defense, man. And, yeah.

All right, I'm going to put you on the spot. You faced a great receiver in the Super Bowl in Jackson Smith and Jigba. Who do you feel like you have a great vantage point? Who do you think is the best receiver in the league? It's a tough question. I mean, I feel like there's also some great receivers we didn't play, you know what I'm saying,

that are doing good things. JSN is obviously a great receiver. You know, every team has their guy. You know what I'm saying? So, like, it's hard for me to say who's the best because, like, everybody has different attributes to them that make them special.

Like, every one on the team, like every receiver one on that team has a different attribute. And obviously, like, JNN, you know, it was the MVP, and his season was incredible. but I feel like everybody we played against had a guy. You know, it's kind of hard question to answer. I ain't a lot. So every number one's equal.

Everybody has different matches. No headlock. You did a good job there. We have a running gag on this show. I don't know if it's gag. Sorry, KW. What's that mean? You take it seriously. But we call almost every great catch of the year.

You might have had catch. of the year against the Browns, I think it was. I think we can roll it for you. Take me, I'm just always curious how fast or slow your brain is going from the moment the ball is released to the moment you come down with it or if there's no thought process at all and it's just, you know, it's just kind of muscle memory at this point. But say, man, muscle memory with also a quick thought process.

I feel like every interception you can't really like process it very slow. Like I see the ball coming and I'm looking it all the way in, but like it's happening so quick. So my mind is processing it in it quick. Like I see it. I'm focused to the tuck if you can see on the film. But yeah, I feel like this is obviously reps though. You gotta do ball drills.

I do hella ball drills after practice, man. I catch about a hundred balls. So like, it was cool to see that happen and see, you know, the hard way pay off from that. All right. You also didn't have a lot of game film of Dylan Gabriel throwing it that far. So you had to be right. Okay. That was me. That's a great.

That's a great piece. Jayland, thank you very much. I'm sorry we have to say goodbye to you because I'm going to personally get on the phone with Elliott Wolf to get your contract done. So thank you very much. Hope to have you back and have a relaxing off season. Hope to see you back in Foxborough. Appreciate you guys.

Also, I appreciate the door of destiny. Let's go. See? Don't be eye out. Thank you. Absolutely. Thank you. Congrats on a great year.

We can send it to you. Thanks, man.