Football Daily - Euro Leagues: Alvarez to Arsenal? Plus Muslić on Schalke

Episode Date: August 26, 2026

Maz Farookhi is joined by ESPN's Julien Laurens and German football expert Rafa Honigstein for this week's Euro Leagues. The team reflect on a turbulent week for Julian Alvarez at Atletico Madrid, and with Barcelona seemingly out of the running, does that open the door for Arsenal?Then, we hear more about Musiala's condition which saw him collapse in consecutive friendlies for Bayern last week. How have the club kept it private for such a long time, and is there a long-term concern over Musiala's career?Schalke and ex-Plymouth Argyle head coach Miron Muslić joins the pod to discuss Schalke's promotion to the Bundesliga, the signing of fellow Bosnian Edin Džeko, and how Loris Karius has turned his career around at the club.Finally, Jules and Raf look at who might be best-placed to challenge Bayern domestically this season.Timecodes: 02:59 Is Julian Alvarez set for Arsenal? 13:15 Jamal Musiala's seizure condition, and how Bayern have been handling it 21:22 How are Bayern shaping up for this season? How have they improved the squad? 27:18 Miron Muslić on Schalke's return to the Bundesliga 29:30 How did Miron's time at Plymouth shape him? 33:09 Loris Karius' career redemption 35:05 Signing Edin Dzeko at 39 years old 40:13 Can anyone challenge Bayern this season?

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and welcome to the Euroleagues. Coming up with less than a week remaining in the transfer window, we'll discuss the latest with Julian Alvarez after he was booed by Fletti fans during Sunday's 2-2 draw with Villarreal. We know he wants Barcelona, but at Arsenal, the only club who can afford him, we're going to be previewing the Bundesliga season as well,

discussing Byrne's Jamar Musiala after absence seizures caused him to collapse in two consecutive friendlies last week. And our Baruchia Dortmund or anyone else in a position to challenge by in this season. And finally, Shalka, spearheaded by 40-year-old Edenteco, are back in the Bundesliga. After three seasons away, their head coach, Meryl Muzlich,

will be joining the pod to discuss leaving Plymouth, getting the club promoted, and to look ahead to the upcoming season as well. So plenty to discuss, and with us this week, German football expert, Raphaelixstein, and ESPN's Julianne. Hello, both. Hello, hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. We've got loads to chat about this week. week. Just a few things as well before we sort of get into the Alvarez situation at Athlete.

We've had some teams confirmed for the final spots in the Champions League this season. And I think we're all happy Bodo Glim to back in it. I mean, we can talk about their amazing stadium in the Arctic Circle again this season. And a trip that nobody would want to be on, obviously, because especially if you play them in December or January, this is not a trip you want to be part of. It's hard enough to get there. To be fair, you need, I think, three different flights from the main European. and cities. But as you said,

with the weather, with the snow, with the wind, everything like that, and the plastic pitch, obviously. It's a trap when you go to Bodo Glint

as we saw with Inter Milan or Roma in the past or even Manchester City last season. So good luck whoever faces Bodo at that time of the year. Raph,

and I mean, this is astonishing again, that Lask comeback against Celtic, you know, that lead that Celtic had and they bottled it. So Lass back in

the Champions League as well. Yeah, crazy. my neighbour's a big Celtic fan and when he told me that he's watching the game I thought really why are you watching the second leg it's all over but it turned out it wasn't

Lasker and Krelli be strong at home they won the double last year of course with Didi Kubauer in charge and that is actually maybe unlike Borda a really fun trip it's a nice little city you can sort of drive from Munich

it's not so well connected in terms of airports but yes it's a great atmosphere 11,000, one of those modern stadiums that actually do the job really well. We should say that the draw for the league phase of the Champions League is on Thursday evening. We're recording this episode of Euroleagues on Wednesday. So we don't yet know who'll face who, but obviously we'll talk about the Champions League lots more once the drawls made next week. And obviously, as we gear up for match day one on September the 8th.

But let's get into it, guys. Let's talk about Alvarez. He played his first match for Athletico Madrid since announcement. announcing in the summer that he wanted to fulfill his dream and join Barcelona on Sunday night. He was booed by the home fans. His name was whistled when it was announced to the stadium pre-match. After the match, the squad clapped the supporters. Alvarez, of course, left the pitch.

He walked down the tunnel on his own, which is never a good look. And after all that booing on Sunday, he hasn't shown up for training today. I mean, it's pretty clear, isn't it, that the situation just isn't good for anyone? No, it's pretty sad, really, to see a play of his caliber being booed by his own fans. And of course, in a strange way, it almost helps his course because the situation has become untenable to certain extent. And I think even Adletti, who've been very hard line in their approach so far, might think, you know, we can't continue this.

If the fans had it been slightly more relaxed, maybe there would be a way back. but of course once you come out publicly and talk about dreams and so on but still turn up at your old team it's not great so financially I think it's the biggest issue once it used to be the case maybe a few years ago that one player of this kind of caliber would come out publicly it was all apart sort of about the negotiation ploy it was about you know the money and so on but usually you got the sense that he would only do this, he would only take that risk for his own reputation and so on, once there's a good indication that the two clubs will eventually find an agreement. Now, the situation, I think, with Atletico's ideas of what he's worth and Barcelona's ability

or willingness to pay, I think there's still a significant gap, which is why this hasn't moved on at all, and we're at the end of August already. So I still think a transatlantician. So I still think a transfer some sort is the most realistic outcome, but I'm not so confident having seen how little movement we have had over the last month or so since this has first surfaced. The thing is, you can understand why Alcatico don't want to sell him to Barcelona, it's just not to not strengthen a direct competitor for the league, for example. So that makes a lot of sense. The problem, and we've seen a lot of those transfer sagas through the

summer every year, sometimes even in January. Look at Alexander E-Syck last season. He was as toxic as this situation, really, in a way. The problem is, if Alvarez really wants to live atlittico, that is first choice, be Barcelona. Sure, but surely if Barthag can't happen for whatever reason, he still wants to go. So a club like Arsenal, I know he doesn't want to come back to the Premier League

and he left, obviously, Man City, to go to Spain. but there's worse team than Arsenal for you to go to, really, when you think about it. So I've got no sympathy for him. I think he put all of that upon himself, some of the decision that he made, some of his communication, like Rafi said, publicly saying about Barcelona and leaving. I mean, Athletics could spend a lot of money on him when he forced to move out of city because he felt he didn't play enough. They built a team around him.

He scored a lot of goals for him, but they've also paid him a lot of money to come be there over the last two seasons over a six-year deal, by the way. And yet, now he throws the toys out of the prime to get a move to Barcelona. And by the way, I think we should also say that his agent is also NC Flix's agent, who is the Barcelona manager.

And I think there's a lot of that in it too. I understand it, no problem. But if your priority move can't happen, you still want to leave. Just find an agreement somewhere else and still be happy because clearly he's not happy ways right now. I think you're right, Jules, but at the same time

I have some sympathy for him because he would have been told before he went public that there's a strong chance of this happening. I don't think he would have just woken up on the Tuesday and said, you know what, today I'm just going to talk about Barcelona. So whether that information was accurate or not or whether he's been slightly misled, but I think it feels to me as if he'd been hung out to dry a little bit by the people in the background. Because as I said earlier, I think you don't really get to that point as a player before you feel. you have a realistic chance of this deal actually happening? And he would have been encouraged by the people around him to make that statement. From an Arsenal perspective as well, as you're sort of saying there, Jules, you know, do you want then a player as well who so publicly sort of had the situation play out the way it has

and made it so public that he wants to go to a different club? And as you say, sort of ended Manchester City when he was last in the Premier League on a pretty sour note as well, that chapter. No, you're right. It's not ideal if you're Arsenal, although the football qualities that he has would fit this Arsenal team and the way Mikhail Ateta plays. So brilliantly that you can also think from their point of view, okay, sure, he wants to go to Barcelona. If that doesn't happen, we're here.

If he opens the door, we can make this happen. And once he's an Arsenal player, he will forget about Barcelona. You would expect him to play at his best. And again, in a team that is working so well, that is so strong, that could win him more trophies because he's already completed football, by the way, let's not forget. He's won everything possible of winning.

The Champions League, the World Cup of America, the Copa Libertadores, just everything in the Premier League, except in Spain obviously, he has a Mon La Liga, but for the rest, everywhere he's been. And again, there's that chance for him, Arsenal. So from an Arsenal point of view, you probably see, okay, this is not ideal, we get that. However, once he's here,

you would think that as a professional and a player of his caliber, like we've been saying, there should not be really any issue over his commitment, his attitude, the behavior, the motivation to help this Arsenal team to win him more trophies. If the price wasn't so big, what you could do, of course, is just take him for a year and then sell them on to Barcelona and then everyone's happy. But I think the dimension of financials here involved will make this kind of sell-on deal too complicated. Also, he's, you know, if they really want 150 million euros for Hul and

Alvara, he's not worth that. This is not the right valuation of a player like him. He's only 26. He's a really good player. As we said, he was very successful in terms of winning. He scored 20 goals last season in all competitions for Athlete, 20-09 the year before, 19. I think the last season he left Citi as a kind of super-Serb impact player.

So there's a good player there. But this is not a 150 million euro player for sure. As we keep saying, we're recording this Wednesday, and obviously things can rapidly change in a matter of minutes. But say if Barcelona were to show their hand and for example say the deal can't happen and at the moment it kind of indicates

that that's the direction it's going. Do we expect then sort of Alvarez to decide he's ready to sort of settle for Arsenal in a sense? It's interesting because I think if he, if really he was keen to go to Arsenal this would have evolved already. I think Rafi is right as well in the sense that he must be taught right now

And for him to not show up at training as well, she said, I don't worry, this Barcad deal is going to happen again. We said about his entourage, the close links with Barcelona, all of that. I don't know how you force Athletes' hand to sell him to Barcelona, to be honest. I don't think Barcelona right now can afford him 150 million euros plus his wages. But maybe they can find that money somewhere. I just think that time is running out now. And really, if he had thought at some point, even last week or the week before,

okay, bansar is not happening. What else can I have? Arsenal is still a really good option, let's be honest. Then I think he would have done that already. And the fact that he hasn't done that probably shows you that he's definitely not opening the door to Arsenal. And it kind of feels in that scenario, Rafa, that Arsenal hold all the cards in that situation.

Well, I don't know if they hold all the cards. I think this is going to be an opportunistic move if it comes off for them. They know that this is a case of, as we say in Germany, when two is each stride, which roughly translates. When two people are fighting, the third one is laughing. But I don't know if they can really bet on that. So I think the hand, if you want to use the analogy, is actually not that strong

because it depends on things falling into place elsewhere. And it's only ever going to be a contingency solution. I'd be really interested and maybe Jews can shed more light on this, but whether they're thinking we can pick up Alvarez if it sort of happens or if it doesn't, we are strong enough. We don't need another striker because to find another striker that's really going to help us is going to be so difficult in this market. So it's either a case of almost like a bonus player or nothing.

And in that sense, they can be quite relaxed, but I don't think they're fully in control of the situation either. No, I agree. I think bonus is exactly that. I think they'd be very happy with the squad, even if they lose Martinelli, and we expect that deal for Martinelli to Al-Hael to go through. I think if the Martinelli deals go through, then I think they might look at another winger to be on that left-hand side with Tolis, with potentially EZ, or even Madweke,

Diamond can probably play a bit on the left-hand side, even if the right is their preferred position. But Alvarez is very much the bonus, the icing on the K, you know, the cherry on the cake you're saying after what has been a really good transfer window already for them if that happens, they take it, they have kind of that kind of moneyish and it's available if Alvarez doesn't come

and again I agree with Rafi they're not really in control of that deal but they're there, they're there if again the door opens but then yeah I don't think they'd be too disappointed if that one doesn't happen. Right, let's look ahead to the Bundesliga season. Miral Muslich will be with us very shortly. But we have to start with Byron. The big story at the club this past week has involved their 23-year-old Jamal Musiala,

who has revealed that absent seizures caused by a neurological dysfunction were what caused him to collapse in two consecutive friendlies last week. Since then, Vincent Company has revealed that the club has been handling his seizures for quite some time now and that a slight change to his treatment caused some side effects. Raff, his treatment mentioned there, How are the club handling this? I mean, it's an incredibly tough situation all round. Yeah, first of all I think it's really important to say

that the club have been aware of this for 12 months and over. This thing kind of started raising its ugly head when Jamal Muzialla had a car accident in spring. And as a result, started no longer driving himself, but came with a chauffeur. And a lot of people took note of that around the club. that's a bit odd, you know, for a young player not to drive himself. And since then, Munich was rife with sort of whispers and rumors,

but to the credit of the club and certainly the team, they've all kept underwreps for well over 12 months, which is incredible. If you think about the amount of people who would have known this, also, of course, in the national team, where there's the same team doctor that by and half travels with the national team. They were, of course, aware of this or another layer of people, but they also kept it quiet.

And it would have been able to keep it quiet more if, according to Vincent Company, a change in medication, as you said, hadn't brought this to the surface on the pitch. What happened in the past was that he would have these episodes, but it was not on the pitch or when it happened on the pitch. People didn't quite notice it because it wasn't that apparent and the team very quickly sort of closed ranks around him and no one really knew, apart from the real insiders.

And now is the big concern, of course, can he come back? Can he, first of all, get rid of it somehow? The experts that I've seen commenting said, this thing can disappear after a couple of years, but nobody really knows. There's no hard rule. if it's under control, which it has been by and large for that 12 months, can they control it enough without it interfering with his football?

Because there was a sense that as much as these medications help him deal with the illness, perhaps they blunt him a little bit when it comes to performing at his best. And they clearly tried a different regime and it hasn't worked so far. but maybe they can I've read about a few footballers I don't know how much this is in the open

so I'm not going to mention their names about footballers who've dealt with this throughout their careers and nobody really knew that they've been suffering from epilepsy so I think there is a way and right now we have to wait and see but he will be in the squad

for Friday's Open against Stuka which is a really encouraging sign he wants to play the doctors want him to play he will be training fully and I think he'll get some game time and I think the reaction in the stadium when he comes on and from his teammates

is going to be amazing so as much as it's a tragic story I think there's actually a lot of things that are encouraging A in terms of how they've been managing it so far before everyone really knowing but also the way he's been handled

I think the understanding the openness the love also within the club and maybe a sense of this can work in the long term. So fingers crossed I think it's the best we can say at this point. I think there's so much to unpick there but I think that the point that you make, Raffer, about the fact that a lot in the club

and in the national team were aware of the situation but the level of support that he's had to keep it confidential until it absolutely couldn't be and it had to be out in the open and therefore this explanation had to be given is striking really because we don't see that now in the modern game

people keeping things like that confidential, do we frankly? I think it shows how much they like him as a person because you know this is the sort of thing if somebody is maybe not as popular in the dressing room and people feel he's taking a space that I should have you know, why is he playing, why I'm not playing, I'm fully fit, this guy's not fully fit, this is the sort of thing that agents

or people around the club would have leaked quite happily but I think there is a universal sense within the club and beyond I would say that he's such a nice, nice man and that he deserves all the help he can get. And of course, keeping it quiet, keeping it confidential was the first step. Now that it's out in the open, they can even do it in a more active way, in a more apparent way, if you will. And Vincent Company is also once again shown in the way he communicated such a sensitive topic almost to perfection. that he is really cut out, I think, for managing at this level because I don't think many managers would have handled it so well the way he spoke again in front of the media

and explained everything. And the guy has just a lot of things going for him when it comes to dealing with difficult issues and this is just one of them. I thought, Arthur Musiala in his social media post to explain what happened was amazing as well in the transparency and the honesty. of him just explaining.

He could have just said some things, thank you for your well wishes or whatever you say and this kind of thing. But for him to take the time, probably with maybe not just him on his own, maybe he had his team around him helping him to draft that social media post. But just to explain,

and the thing as well is saying that he was not worried, you know, that he's been dealing with this, kind of exactly what Raffi explained also on his own before, and there's nothing to be worried. But when you saw Saibari's face, who is his new teammate who just arrived in the summer

after the World Cup after he collapsed on the two friendlies where he obviously he lost consciousness or he fell on the pitch Saibari looked so, so worried. So I think even that,

even just communicating to your fans or to the football fans around the world whether they're buying fans or not, it doesn't really matter so much. But also to your teammates and everything about what you feel

and how you feel it and what happened and what will happen. I think it was beautiful. And I think a lot of players should also take notice of the way Muscella himself has responded to everything that happened to him. What it shows as well, Raff, is just the sort of tight-knit sense of community within Byr and every aspect of the team, the players, the squad, the support staff. You know, it just speaks volumes about that as well. Yeah, and this is not something that perhaps would have happened a few years ago when a dressing room had a very different dynamic.

But you're right. I think that is one of the big takeaways in Munich, which is such a leaky club, but there's always noise and there's always agendas and there's always malls in a dressing room. This thing did not leak. As I said earlier, there were whispers. A lot of people had heard stuff without really knowing what was going on. There was this big rumor in Turkey when a journalist was even arrested briefly saying that Galatasarai might take him this summer. and some people in Turkey were sort of hinting at issues that Bayern were having or that he was having.

So even they had heard whispers or rumours, but no one confirmed it, no one leaked it. And that for Bayern especially, if you know all the history of the club, is a very good sign at the moment. On Bayern more widely than the season, you mentioned Murcialla will be in the squad when that kicks off that match. weekend. For them, I imagine the main objective will be the Champions League this season, presumably. 100%. Last year, it was very much the double plus. So the double is a must because they hadn't won the Cup in five years and that was a big thing for them. Now they've done it, all the focus would be on the Champions League. But it's easier said than done because you know the Champions

League is going to come down to one or two games in April and May. I mean, what do you do until then. You can't just say, or maybe you can. I mean, maybe Jules as a PSJ, aficionado, will tell us differently. You can't just say, let's just not play until it really gets to the knockouts. Bayern can't because they are expected to win every game and every draw is a major talking point and a major crisis.

Now, of course, and maybe we'll get to this, I think the competition are not strong enough to take advantage, even if Bayern were to drop a few points. But the way they're playing, the way this team is jelling, the way that even Jamal Muziala not playing for long stretches last season and not playing always at his level last season, that didn't have that much of an effect either. So now that they've strengthened that position with Sibari

and even Brown who can play there, as we saw in the Super Cup against Dortmund, Bayern look more or less untouchable domestically. So yes, the focus, And perhaps even the pressure, which so far hasn't been felt by company, but now I think the pressure will ramp up for them to get that extra, make that extra step in the Champions League. But it's a long, long time until we see if that step happens or not. And in the meantime, they can just play at their best as there's nothing else they can do.

It's just that we've seen some teams already who played like the German Super Cup, Ph.D in France, Citi in England, in similar games. being ready yet, you know, physically, probably even mentally, some players still coming back after a lot of their superstars at those clubs usually go far in the World Cup. And yet, Bayan shows up suddenly for that first half against Dortmund and were incredible, I thought. Like to the level where we know how good they are, obviously, but for the first game of the season, like this, to have to be, to look so sharp already. And the second half was not as convincing, okay, but the first half, I just thought they were outstanding. So they're ready already. I agree with. I agree

with Rafi, I think it's a long time until those key matches in the Champions League. And really last season, all the Champions League campaign came down to that second leg against PhD after an incredible first leg, obviously, in Paris. But that game in Munich, if they go their way, I think they go and probably win it all as well. So it's those 19 minutes, half an hour, 60 minutes in one key game at some point that will, I think, decide their fate in the Champions League especially. but I just look I thought they look so sharp already

I think if you're another German club starting with Sturgat on Friday night you have to be scared because I think they could literally smash every single team in that league. I mean this argument has been raging in Munich for a long, long time you know, is it better not to have any competition so you can take

it easy and then you can focus on a champion seek or is it actually a disadvantage because you don't have the sharpness of playing top teams every week and then when you suddenly have a top team you can't make the make the step up. I think it's less of an issue in two cents. One, the squad is not really built to rest many players.

It's still a fairly small squad. And last year, you know, Kane, yes, you can take him off after 70 minutes if he 4-0.0. But he rarely missed the game, Olise rarely missed the game, D.S. rarely missed the game, because that is sort of how the squad is built. And even now with the players that have come in, it's still a fairly small squad. so Bain want that almost that pressure on the big players to play every week and the second thing I think that's changed is the concept and the format of the

Champions League with bigger games in total in sheer numbers and a real sense certainly in Munich that you want to win everything because you want to have the best possible position in that table and they really, you know, they won every game apart from the Arsenal one. I think that keeps the level perhaps slightly higher than in the days gone by where after four games you were qualified and then you had two games where you didn't play your best players at all and then you only really start in February or March to play again. I think now the Champions League is longer and is a bit more taxing even though the jeopardy is

is not as strong, but at the same time you have stronger opposition for more games and for longer, it's helped a team like Bayern to keep the pressure and intensity going. Five light sports. So here's the first ball of this series. All the cricket you laugh. Lives on BBC sounds. Smash straight back down the ground. This girl.

Here ball by ball coverage of the biggest competitions on the domestic and international circuits. It's a fourth cricket and it's the huge one. Chish, wash. Settle down, sorry. Cricket on Five Live Sport. Oh, I've lived in every ball of this. Listen on BBC Sounds.

Five Live Sports. The Euroleagues. Listen on BBC Sounds. Well, after three seasons away, one of Germany's biggest football club, Shalka, are back in the Bundesliga. And I'm delighted to say that the Shalka head coach, Miram Muslitz, joins us now on Euroleagues.

Hi, Miron. Good afternoon, everyone. How are you guys? We are great. And great. speak to you. So talk us through how you are feeling, though, just a few days away from Shaka's first Bundesliga match in three years this weekend. Yeah, we're very much looking forward. It's been a long, long time. And I think we are ready.

We face now a seven-week intense, of course, pre-season. I think we are well prepared technically, technically, mentally. By the end, you never know. But we are looking forward to the open of the season Sunday away against Augsburg. And like I said before, it's a huge, huge challenge. It's an ex-its last challenge. But we are shalky. We are humble, but we are ambitious. These moments, these days building up to that first match back in the Bundesliga

and must be the reason why you took on this job. Yeah, we had a plan, I think 14 months ago. We took over after the most devastating season in 125 years of history. of Shalke, so it was a little bit of a mess, but we had the bravery and the courage from day one to turn things around to implement, not only a new style of play, to implement, just a new mindset. Shalke is still a giant. I think we have over 120,000 members. I think only by that we are the six biggest club in the world. Every single home game is sold out with 62,000. Then you know it's big.

But the reality is also that we've been now for a couple of years in the second Bundesliga and getting promoted in the Bundesliga, it's also a big jump. Not more difference maybe to the jump of getting promoted from the championship into the Premier League. The task is just a huge one. But we are brave. We're going to face this with courage. And hopefully in a year ago we're going to still be a part of the Bundesliga. That's the plan for sure.

Amheron, you spend six months in England with Plymouth. What did you learn from that experience? How was it for you? And I guess, you know, if Shalker comes knocking, you know, this is a kind of project that you have to go for. How were those six months in England for you? Looking back to the six months in spending in Plymouth at Argyll, I just enjoyed every single day.

It was always a dream for me as a coach, as a guffa to work in England. The English style of play, always admire the passion. It's just an honest, straight, aggressive football. You can win the crowd with a tackle. You know what I mean? So I always admired this. So I enjoyed every single day in Plymouth. I just learned also how difficult, how tough,

how competitive and super competitive the championship is. It's a brutal fight. You have to earn every, every point. But that experience just helped me to take also the next step in my development. a coach and of course it helped me then yeah to find the next the next level in my coaching career with shalki. Mirren, I had a chance to see your team train in preseason and I was amazed how in this little Austrian village in the Alps hundreds of hundreds of Shaka fans in middle of summer

were congregating and following you. Were you having known about Shaka Sai still taken abacki by just how much passion and how much kind of connection and community exists between the fans and the team and can you harness that to help you and the team survive in the Bundesliga? Of course I think

you do your research before you entering a new project before you choose a new club and then you know that the Chalker is big that they have a massive massive fan base but then when you hear you realize how big they are actually so the Shalker fans are like

crazy. This is This is something you don't see a lot of often in world football. So we had a preseason camp in Austria, and we had around 1,500 Shalker fans and families spending their holidays so they can be with us and they can be every single day on the pitch. So you need to take advantage out of this. Because I remember when we arrived 14 months ago, the team last year, they have been scared to play in the Felton Serena in front of $62,000.

and it was like a heavy backpack. But we turned this completely around because I just realized this support and this energy of the fans, this can never be a disadvantage. It has to be the biggest advantage for us. So we tried to work on this bound between the team, the club and the fans again

just to reunite because we knew then if we can manage this to get the fans there anyway there, but getting really back, supporting this new project, this can be a massive boost. This can be a wave almost unstoppable. And in the end, we found this connection back again.

And then we got supported. Not only when we're playing Gelsikirchen, we had games last season, second division, second Bundesliga, with 25 to 30,000 away fans. So that's just crazy. Yes, some season last year, Mirong. Can I ask you about Loris Carrius, and obviously the part he played in the club's promotion last season,

because obviously it took a little bit of time, I imagine, to sort of revive his career, get his mentality back so he had confidence in himself again. Lord is Cardius. I love to speak about him, especially for BBC Radio 5, because the English audience, I guess, is very curious. He's a key performance player for us. He is the face of this new Shalke,

the face of this new resilience, this new mindset, after I think tough years behind him. He found a new home. He found new trust. So he was able, like so many other players from Shalke, who shared not only his experience, he played on a completely another level,

but also had some rough moments in their careers, but they found a new home. They found a safe heaven. And then it was just about, let's do this together and let's start from scratch. and let's do it in our way. And I think Louris, he played a huge, huge part. He was the, you can just trust him.

You can just rely on him with your eyes closed. We knew he's just there. He was, like I said, key performance player. So we are very happy to have him. And we can count of him also for next years. Miran, just listening to you speak, it really strikes me that the part that you, the part that you seem to really love about the work that you do

is that sort of relationship that you build up with the players and sort of almost putting an arm around them as you obviously have been able to do with Loris. Of course, but I think that's the point of being a coach. Coaching is nothing else than changing behaviours. And we try to change the behaviours from day one, knowing that everyone has an own story. Everyone has something to prove,

but also something to hide. It's just about us to stuff to find the right way to get everything out of the players. And I think we are just on a good, good way with Shalki. And you signed Ed and Jekko in January of this year as well. Tell us more about how that move came to happen. What convinced him to sign for the club when they were at the time in the second division? I'm telling you honestly, he called me Christmas. He called me Christmas and he told me, look, boss, I really want to join Shalki.

And then I was like completely speechless, you know. I grew up in, I'm from Bosnia, you know, I grew up in Austria, but I'm from Bosnia. And Eddie Njikov for us is Gary Lineka. He's our Johann Kroef. He's our Franz Beckenbauer. He's just an idol. You know, he's a hero on and off the pitch. And then when you got a call by Edyn Jeko, and I thought he was maybe tried to ask me about some other players, some profiles.

but he was so eager to join Shalki. He was like full of less do this. I can't wait to start. And then we started some things in the background to make it happen. Does he still surprise you now? Because, you know, he joined in January, like you said, halfway through the season. He played a part. He's his part.

But he's almost the same age as, you know, as you. He's just a little bit younger. But despite being this idol and the legend of not just Boston football, but European football and world football, were there still sometimes last season when you looked at him and said like wow he still surprise you in stuff that he was doing for you yeah he's surprising me almost every single day

so but in a positive way it's just a it's just a role model for everyone I remember the second home game we played at night so we finished we finished above midnight and everybody's like returning home at 1 or 2 o'clock in the morning and the next day and the next day I came into the office 730 7.30 7.35 and eddie and jaco was already there

So there's no coincidence why this guy is still able to perform I don't want to name his to give the number of his age but that's not a surprise that's not a... Come on, he's 40 years old and he's still able to perform that means he was super super

professional the last 25 years that's why he's a role model and that's why he will also have his impact and he will leave also his fingerprints in this upcoming Bundesliga season. Mirren, we know that you are very influenced by the high pressing game and the counter pressing game. But when you have somebody like Edin, who is a more mature player,

that's nice. That's what I'm saying. How do you then adapt without compromising your principles too much? But this is all about you have to, it's not about the way you want to play as a coach. It's about the profiles you have in your squad. So if we have Edding Jacob, then it's not about pressing and counter-pressing. It's about how you can take advantage of one of the most little strikers in the last 20 years of football history. So you know what I mean.

It's not about adding pressing or counter-pressing. It's bringing adding into the box so he can finalize. There's always a good, good balance without leaving your or losing your DNA and your style of play. But it's the balance. And I think we coaches can be everything, but not stubborn. There are always ways. It's not only one way. Mirren, just before we let you go,

I've got to ask you one more about a huge, huge match we're going to see at the start of December, the Derby against Dortmund. 60,000 fans. The first time this match is going to be played since March 2023. I mean, how excited are you for that one? To be fair, I'll leave this then for this time

because I'm so much in this next game approach, next game approach. I never lose my focus. And of course, everybody is looking forward for this big, big derby. I think whole Germany is waiting for this match. But let's play first the first 11 until we are there. And then we will also be there to face them, no doubt. Miran, thank you so much for being with us on Euroleaks. Guys, it was a pleasure.

Thank you very much. We speak soon. Ciao, cha. All the best of the season. Bye-bye. Raffa Jules, really fascinating to speak to Miron there. And, I mean, what do we think? Do we think Shalko have got enough Raffa to stay in the Bundesliga this season to avoid relegation?

I think so. I think they're strong enough, especially with the support. With the way that they play, we heard about him, you know, finding a natural space and solutions for Eden Jekyll, but they are very, very good off the ball. They make it very difficult for the opposition to play. And they use, I think, that energy of the crowd really well. So I think I think they'll do it. It's not going to be easy.

There aren't many teams. where you look at them and think they are definitely worse than Sharke, so they can't take the status for granted. It is going to be a fight for survival, but I'm reasonably confident that they're going to do it. So we talked about Sharke, we've talked about Bayern Munich, and how they're going to hope to challenge in Europe. Big question is if anybody can actually challenge Bayern

in the Bundesliga this season, Raffa, and we'll get the sense from you certainly earlier that you don't think so. I mean, is there anybody that we can really talk about who could put together maybe something of a challenge for companies team? A challenge, I'm not sure, but I think it's worth talking about Dortmund because they have really refreshed aside and we saw glimpses of that in the Super Cup. They were outplayed, as Jules said in the first half, but in the second half we saw enough of them, especially of the new players,

Caritas and Constantilias, the new Constantilios, sorry, the new two Greek players that they bought who are very creative and looked really interesting. and I think along with Christos Stollis from Arsenal might usher in sort of renaissance of Greek football a little bit there's a lot of talent suddenly appearing and they play, dare say, more attractive than the 2004 European winners did with a lot more creativity

but yeah, Dortmund I think have quality everyone is waiting for sort of the next step up under Nikukovych Kovach has done a wonderful job stabilising the side it looks as if they might not even make it for the Champions League when it took over after Nui Shahin then last season was solid without being spectacular they struggled usually against the bigger sides but beat the smaller sides easily enough or comfortably enough

and now can they actually get to the point where they can challenge and at least in the short run beat a Bayern Munich beat an Arsenal, beat a man's city in the Champions League can they get back to that level where as Klop always said we don't have to be the best side but we can beat the best side on our day and that's going to be I think the big

story about them so they have to succeed on their own terms it's not going to be about fighting by and for titles but being a lot more consistent and being a much more better version of themselves and I think that is why Dortmund are actually an interesting story

and you know this is a side that only two years ago were in the Champsick final so we can see see that there is quality there. If they put together a good run, then why shouldn't they, at least in Europe, challenge and also, for example, in the Cup where even Bayern can have an off day, push them hard. So I think Dortmund are going to be an interesting story, especially now that they're good

neighbours and friends Shalke are back. I think there's going to be a lot of attention on the rour side of football. And I think Dortmund might be a really positive. story for this Bundesliga season. I think I think Dortmund are probably the most likely, right, to compete or to be the best of the rest, really. I mean, I'm interested in what Rafi thinks about Bia Leva Cousin, because it's a new coach in Carlos Martinez, who we had in France.

He was at Toulouse where he did a, I thought, a good job considering the way the club is run with a lot of young players, a lot of movements, in and out. So it's not always easy to find consistency for a young coach like him. And I thought some of the recruitment from A. Sean, this new German prodigy to Afonso Morera, who they spent, I think, quite a lot of money from Lyon, but who's a very interesting player for them to have. I wonder what you think of this biolivacrucund team. And without going back to the invincible of Chabia Alonzo, obviously not that long ago, but if they could maybe certainly push Dortmund for that second place,

Bayern is probably too far ahead. But maybe certainly for championship places, but maybe even second place. Yeah, I think on paper what you said, it looks really exciting. I just don't know how much time it's going to take with this new coach and a new team to gel. We saw it when they lost all their big players after the double. How two successive managers had a really hard time making this into a functioning side, especially after Shaka left. He was such a key player in bringing the dressing room together and having that leadership

that traditionally Leverkusen have lacked because of the profile of the players. when you always sign players who are sort of on the cusp of becoming something bigger and then moving on, you don't necessarily get that coherence in the dressing room and that professionalism and everybody wanting to play for the shirt because everyone's sort of thinking, what is my next step after this? You know, I'm here for two years, but, you know, where can I play after? And Shaka and Alonso changed all of that. So I think it's a bit of an unknown.

The quality is there and the players, I agree with you, but whether it can work collectively. as quickly after a short preseason or relatively short preseason with everyone being there I think that we might it might take them another season before we see a fully fledged challenge for the top two for them what about Leipzig Raffa

I mean obviously they're sort of starting this chapter without Jan Diamanda and that's obviously a big loss for any side regardless yeah it's a big loss he was one of the outstanding players in the Bundesliga and in European football, really, and of course had a great work-up. And replacing him, like-for-like is going to be very difficult

because they picked them up for very little money 12 months ago when perhaps other clubs were a little bit scared by the difficult situation around them when it came to his agents and so on, and they took advantage. And now it's a bit of a rebuild as well for them because they have Martin de Michalis, who's come in after Olaverna had a decent season and a lot of people were surprised that he got sacked. But for the liking of the bosses and Juergen Klopp was one of them before he moved on to become German national coach,

the team weren't aggressive enough and weren't playing the Red Bull style enough. It was too passive, a little bit too intricate. And De Mikhailis is supposed to bring this back. But of course, he is still relatively unproven at this level as a coach. He's had experience, of course, in Argentina. He's had experience in Spain to an extent. but to be now in the Champions League, to be coaching a team that has an ambition

to be fighting for titles, maybe not the league, but certainly the Cup, which they've won a couple of times in the past, and to play a decent role in Europe, I think it's going to be a tall order. And my sense is that they might have a difficult season in this combination.

We are rapidly running out of time, guys. Just before you go, though, and I think I already know the answer to this from Raffa, given the Bundesliga starts this weekend. Anything you're looking forward to in particular in the coming weekend? I'm just happy the Bundesliga is back. I didn't know what to do myself on weekends. I tend to go to see a big Premier League game on Sunday,

but the Saturdays have just been so empty. I don't know if my family will appreciate me saying this, but I just didn't know how to pass my day. So I'm happy to have a bit of structure back in my own. my life and at 2.30 is that place on my sofa where I just know I'm going to be there for two hours and then probably fall asleep at some point. Oh, beautiful, Jules. Yeah, I agree with Rafi. I think it's going to be a great season. You've got the big boys like Shalke and Hamburg who obviously stayed up from last season who are there now and they've been missing and they've

been missed too at this level and then plus, plus Bayern and how much they dominate can they go and beaten the whole season, that kind of stuff. We will finish second. I think there's a love, there's a love, interesting little stories within that, within that. season in the league. So it should be a lot of fun. And the Bundesliga is always great to watch. It's always fun. It's always attacking. It's always intense. So I think, you know, a lot of the listeners should pay attention.

That is it from us, guys. Jules Raffa, thank you. Thank you, Mars. ESPN's Julianne and German football expert, Raffa Honigstein, with us. Euroleagues will be back next Thursday, the third on BBC Radio 5 live from 9 o'clock and will, of course, be available as well as a podcast shortly afterwards. And if you're currently listening to this on the Football Daily,

podcast, Euroleagues will soon be moving to a new home. Just search for Euroleagues on BBC Sounds or the podcast platform of your choosing for a brand new Euroleaks-only feed. As always, thank you so much for listening. As they go in, up and down the leagues. This is Five Live Sports. It's all right for the light. Stop to stop up.

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