Football Daily - Mark Chapman Meets . . . J.J. Watt

Episode Date: June 15, 2025

NFL legend and Burnley co-owner J.J. Watt chats to Mark Chapman. They discuss everything from bench pressing with the Burnley players to the uncertainty of the NFL draft. Watt opens up on why he decided to invest in Burnley – and why once he did so, he was determined to win over the fans, just when he did after moving to Houston as an American footballer. They also discuss goalkeeper James Trafford, the difference between sports that do and do not have relegation and the contrasting schedule between the NFL and the EFL.[First TX on the Football Daily - 19.03.2025]

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Welcome to the Inside Track with me, Rick Edwards. This is the podcast that takes you inside Formula One like never before. And I'm Matt Magendie, and thanks to my exclusive access, I'll be getting up close and personal with Red Bull Racing this season. This week, I sit down with one of the team's big bosses, Dr Helmut Marko. I also didn't think that Max would win for championships. He didn't have the success what we expected from him.

Experience Formula One like never before by tuning into the inside track wherever you get your podcasts. BBC Sounds, music, radio, podcasts. The Football Daily Podcast with Mark Chapman. JJ, what? Hello. Welcome to the Football Daily. Thank you very much for being here. You've just come out of a Burnley board meeting. Do you enjoy those? I told them at the end, I said, I'm going to do a BBC interview now. You guys will see all this on TV in about an hour. Everything we just talked about, open book on it. No, it was good. It was really good. I'm going to do a BBC interview now. You guys will see all this on TV in about an hour.

Everything we just talked about, open book on it. No, it was good. It was really good. I mean, it's certainly one of the most enjoyable parts for me because that's why I got into all this, is the passion, the history to the tradition. But also, I love the competition aspect of it, the business side of it, seeing how you can improve not only on the pitch

but off the pitch, trying to enhance my knowledge base so that I can hopefully continue this journey myself. So you make sure you're across every aspect of this business, do you? I try and learn as much as I can, yes. There's certainly some that I'm much more well-versed in than others, but I love to ask a lot of questions and I love to try and learn.

And these are not only a crash course in business, but in football and personnel management, every single aspect of the club. So it is thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyable for me. Go back to when you, when did you first start thinking about investing in a British football club. And maybe also just that bit of background for people listening of your other sort of businesses and your business acumen as you were coming to the end of your playing day. Yeah, so early in my career, obviously I was just playing ball

and trying to be great at that and that continued. But the further you go, the more you learn about money management, financial, everything. I come from a middle-class family I'm we weren't rich, but we weren't poor We had it well, and then obviously I'm very fortunate to have made a whole lot of money playing a game and So as you go there's plenty of people with advice on what you're supposed to do how you're supposed to do it But I knew that as it grew and grew that I would want to do something

Especially as it got to the end of my career to keep the competitive juices flowing. So team ownership came into play there and just started looking all around America. Became really interested in English football back in 2011. And then it started to get more and more appealing to me and I really enjoyed it. There's many reasons why I love it. And then I started poking around different teams,

having conversations and a path eventually led me here to Burnley. I mean, there are so many things I could go into with you there. I mean, there are several Americans now and American groups as well, not just individuals who are invested in a lot of English football and British football actually.

You look at the 49ers about to invest in Rangers. Why? What do you think the attraction is of our football to invest in? I think each person has their own different reasons. I think that when you look at the 49ers group and their things, they're going to have different reasons than me as an individual. I mean, um, for me personally, you look at an American, American football club, you know, right now they're all valued in the billions of billions of dollars.

Well, what did Washington, Washington was last one? So now it's six, six point zero five million dollars. So you take my amount of money and you put it into that and your congratulations, you have one seat at the, at a game, not at the board table, not at So you take my amount of money and you put into that and you're congratulations. You have one seat at the, at a game, not at the board table, not at anything. But you come over here and the valuations are different and there's more opportunity. And you also can kind of choose the level you want to be at. You know, you want to go into Tottenham or man United or Chelsea or that's the American football level.

You drop down to championship. If you want to, you drop all the way down to League One, League Two. But I saw an opportunity where I could get involved at the level I wanted to be involved at, be in the board meetings, learn, grow, while also injecting something and providing a service to the club that I feel I'm bringing something to the table myself in terms of global notoriety, more eyeballs to the game, etc so But the ultimately the thing that brings you to English football is the history tradition and passion and supporters

That's it and community as well, which is which has always been a Hugely important part of your playing career as well I mean you have bought into that right from the very start. I don't see much point in doing something if you're not going to go all in on it and so for me when I was drafted by the Houston Texans I had never been to Houston before I had no connection to Houston but if I'm going to ask those people to come cheer for me on game day I better invest in those people also. Same over here in Burnley. If I want those people to come cheer for me on game day. I better invest in those people also.

Same over here in Burnley. If I want these people to believe in me as one of the members of their ownership group, they have no reason or right to do so. I'm an American with zero ties to Burnley. Why would they do that? So I better show them that I'm willing to come over and invest in them and to put my time and energy and to learn about them. You can't just expect it to happen. Is there the other thing that always strikes me with it as well is there's a there's a danger element for you investigate investing in a in a football club

because you can go up as what you financially or emotionally but if you if you have a terrible seat and you didn't have very many but if you have a terrible season at the Houston Texans nothing's gonna really happen disastrously by you in terms of relegation. My own mental status is pretty bad obviously. Yes but relegation I understand what you mean. But and therefore your investment in something like this is much more volatile. Much more volatile. Yes, but that's also the attraction is That you can purchase in the champions. Let me know you look at Rexam. Everybody wants to talk Rexam you look at Rexam

That's the attraction is you can take a club that you buy for two million pounds and you can turn them into a ten twenty four thousand X multiple of that a 10, 24,000 X multiple of that. That's also the thrill of it. That's why you can invest in it. That's why it's so exciting and exhilarating. I wish there was a way for us to do that on our side, but there never will be. I think it's the most pure form of sporting competition that you can have when it's now you're going to go

into a deeper conversation on merit based on finances dumped into it and salary caps and things like that but when there is a literal consequence for winning and losing it makes sport as close to the truest form of sport that you can have when you know that there's nothing bad that can happen if you finish last it kind of dilutes the product In some ways have it having worked in both sports for a long time and obviously you're now heavily involved in both sports You kind of want a sort of amalgamation of the two at I agree I think that if there was a way where you can include some form of salary cap and things like that

I do think there's a benefit to the parity I think that's one thing that makes the NFL so great is that the league is designed for everybody to try and hover around 500. Now you're gonna have outliers but that's why if you finish last place you pick first in the draft. There's a salary cap where everybody has to spend in this range. That makes the product on the field that much better where truthfully you can have on any given day one team beat another. Whereas there's no, I mean, I'll never forget the stat last year on the first day

of the premier league when we were playing Man City and their three defenders cost more than our entire wage bill in the history of our club since 1882. You know, like that doesn't happen in the NFL. It's just different. But you view that, you evidently view that as a challenge. You don't view that as a sort of woe is us, how are we ever going to deal with this? There's an element, unless I'm reading you wrong, of you relishing that.

I think I would be pretty miserable if I didn't believe there was some way to change it a little bit, change our fortunes and find a way. Now, am I naive enough to think that we can win the Premier League next year if we go up? No, I understand how all this works, but I think the fun in it, in the competition in it, is in how do you make those small little rotations to get yourself up and then find a way and yeah you might have to get bumped back down but then you get up and up and now all of a sudden you go from trying to get up to the Premier League and Now you're in a relegation battle to now, you know, you're in that 17th 16th battle now

you're going up to the 12 13th battle those are the little wins that you try and make and Sure, do we all dream of a Lester style run one day? Absolutely But I think it's more in the individual little things trying to make your club better on a year by year basis I mean you obviously bring a whole variety of different expertise to the boardroom here. Do you think your insight into players and what players want and the psychology of players can transcend different sports and is one of your main strengths here? I would say that's certainly the thing that I bring to the board and to this organization that nobody else can.

We have unbelievably brilliant minds in the boardroom. I just left a meeting with all of them and I listened to them speak whether it's on finances or organization and they're brilliant. The one thing I can definitively speak on more knowledgeably than them is what it's like to be in a locker room, what it's like to be in a competition. What it's like to be at this point in the season and fighting for things. And just yesterday I was at the training ground most of the day and having breakfast with players in the locker room with the players in the weight room with the players just talking to them.

In the weight room with the players. Yeah. I like, sometimes I like to let him know. I was going to say credibility comes quick when you got 400 pounds on the bar, you know. But it's, those are the moments to me that I'm the most useful to this club because I can sit down and have a conversation with a player. Um, whether he's going through a rough stretch and I can talk to him about that rough stretch. You have to remember these are 22, 23, 24 year old kids. They're going through all this for the first time. I'm fortunate enough to have been through this before and so I can talk to them like how do you mentally handle that? I know what you're feeling or we're going through a great stretch and we need to keep it going and we can't get complacent. These conversations to me are

the most value that I can bring to the club. Do you look at them sometimes at 21 and 22? And I do. My eldest is nearly 22. And I look at them and think, my God, you're still so young. And yet you're having to carry all of this responsibility. And even though you're a lot younger than me, do you look at them and think, my God, you've got to carry all of this. And yet you would have had to have done the same

when you were drafted. Yes, and I think that you try and help them understand the balance of burden versus beauty. Like it's such a, yes, you could on one hand look at it as a burden and that's the part where if somebody's struggling, it can crush you under its weight, you feel that whether it's the team the fans whether it's your future contract possibilities all that all of a sudden

weighs down on you and you have one bad performance but on the flip side you try and get them to understand the beauty of a it's only one performance B look at everything you have in front of you Look at all these opportunities and how much you can change your life your family's life future generations forever Not only in your own life, but in your town's life like I when I watch these games and I go to these matches with these fans and these supporters I Told our players this last year in one of our meetings I said you truly do not understand how you affect these people day to day. You control their attitude for an entire week based on how you perform.

And I'm not talking winning or losing. I'm talking how you perform in terms of attitude, in terms of effort, in terms of intensity. And that's the thing that I'm proud of, of our guys. Is when I watch our matches We celebrate clear outs just as much as we celebrate goals, and I think that's really cool and there's actually Sort of no better example of that within the Burnley squad than than James Trafford really who? Had such a tough season in the Premier League last season not not certainly not all down to him but but given the

style of football and the pressure that you were constantly under. And yet this season is part of a defence who has put together this remarkable run and tried to get you to come out of retirement for Cincinnati as well. I mean, that is the perfect example of what you've been talking about. Exactly. Exactly. It was a young kid, extremely extremely talented thrust into a situation where he's now number one on a Premier League club at a very young age especially especially for a keeper and It didn't go as well as he hoped it would without a doubt and that would mentally destroy a lot of human beings But instead James Trafford knows who he is. He's confident in who he is. And he came back this year and is putting on performances. I mean, two penalties within

10 minutes. Like, he's doing things that you're just watching. Like, there's no chance. There's nothing. Sure enough, every single time. But that's because of the belief in himself and the amount of work that he's put in for it and he deserves everything that he gets but I was also okay with the 2-1 win. Were you even a little bit starting to be worried about the fact? Not a little bit I was actually starting to get like I because my wife I've said this before but so my wife came up to me before the last match and it was, he had saved 12 matches in a row clean sheets.

And she was like, cause it started to get picked up real big in America. I mean, he was everywhere. Like it didn't seem really in Cincinnati. No nationwide. It didn't start to get picked up until about 10, 11, but then once he hit 12 and they put up that graphic of man United had 14 and that was the only one higher I mean it was on every single show. So my wife one day came in and she said you're not serious about this Are you and I said well if he truthfully does 24 matches straight without letting in a goal

That will be one of the greatest performances in the history of sport and I would be ridiculous not to honor my side of it. A bass at bat. Yes. So I had been training slightly differently for about three weeks leading up to the goal and I did take a day off after he scored the goal. I was serious. I was going to because of how insane it would be and how much respect I have for it. Now I'm very curious to see if he finishes the season with none and it's only the one if he tries to coax me again but a deal's a deal I'm sorry. Am I right in thinking that when you when you sort of were first around the place that you you thought with a bit with a few years of training that if you were gonna play football you'd be a goalkeeper? Yes

without a doubt. I am an athlete by nature so I'm very confident in myself. I thought keeper, I'm like just stop the ball. But then as I've said many times in interviews my wife was a professional footballer for 10 years and she said okay big shot go hop in goal and let's see. And I was quickly humbled. I was quickly humbled and I no longer believe I could be a keeper at the Premier League level, no matter how much training I have. I'm not sure. I mean, are there any NFL stars who could transition over? It's just, I think the problem-

If it's not the ball over the top for Tyree Kelly, probably run on through it. I think the issue with it is the technical, tactical skill. You have to have a ball at your feet since Birth to be able to do what these guys do though the touch the control everything they have is incredible Could we keep up from an athleticism standpoint? Absolutely speed those types of things But there's no way we could ever do what they do with the ball at their feet when you look at the How players are treated in one sport compared to another it goes back to our sort of comparisons between NFL and football. Do you think there are

Greater things that can be done over here to help our players I mean they play such ridiculous number of games, you know, and and we look at parity and contracts, you know There is no collective bargaining agreement over here, which is an integral part of your sport, isn't it? Yeah, I think and it's a very interesting conversation to have from the ownership side as somebody who's been a player. Yeah, because the player in me says these guys are playing an insane amount of games. They don't get a lot of time off, not only in the off season, but also in between matches. I mean, I'm here right now watching a Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday situation, which is crazy.

Obviously, on the ownership side, I understand why it's been formatted like that from a financial standpoint and from a maximization. But the player in me does think that especially especially the top six clubs who are playing in multiple competitions and making it far in those competitions, it's extremely difficult. I think there should probably be something to alleviate that, whether it's from how you build the squads or how you space them out. But you look at the calendar and there's not a good answer. If there was, I'm sure it would be done by now, but it's, I,

I definitely sympathize with the players. The other, but then the footballers I work with when we talk about NFL, particularly around this time of year, then say to me, but they don't have any choice where they go. And I go, well, no, no, no. I mean, you said, you had no idea you'd be going to Houston and that that's the flip side They're like boy. So you could end up anyway. Yeah, you could end up anyway. Yeah. No, it is a very That is certainly an aspect of it the or just had a conversation with a bunch of the players yesterday where they were asking me about off seasons and they

They said how long do you guys get off and I was explaining and I'm like they were like that's a lot of time I was yeah, it is. It's very nice. I'm not gonna lie And I'm like they were like that's a lot of time on yeah, it is. It's very nice. I'm not gonna lie But also it's actually more offseason if people don't know there's more offseason than the non season yes, but It is a train crash every play so it is a very different game from that standpoint But yeah, it's they're completely different even the first thing I noticed when I came over and I started watching training sessions with the guys and the meetings and things much shorter days than our days But I was talking to Vince at the time and I was like man guys come in late

We watch meetings we go to practice then they go home. I was like, that's a short day. Should we not have been longer? He's like, well, how many matches do you play here? 16 and he's like, yeah, well, we have 46 so you can't grind them every single day for nine months straight, you know, it is it's just a very different, completely different system. The Football Daily Podcast with Mark Chapman. Welcome to the Inside Track with me Rick Edwards. This is the podcast that takes you inside Formula One like never before. And I'm Matt Magendie, and thanks to my exclusive access, I'll be getting up close and personal with Red Bull Racing this season.

This week, I sit down with one of the team's big bosses, Dr. Helmut Marko. I also didn't think that Max would win for championships. He didn't have the success what we expected from him. Experience Formula One like never before by tuning into the Inside Track wherever you get your podcasts. He didn't have the success what we expected from him. Experience Formula One like never before by tuning into the Inside Track wherever you get your podcasts. The EuroLeagues on the football daily.

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Just on you, so you drafted in 2011, so do you go back to that? Do you play that in your mind and think what if Houston hadn't taken me with that pick? Yeah, I mean it's just weird, isn't it? Your whole life can change, yeah. And, it's just weird, isn't it? Your whole life can change, yeah. And also that it's completely different over here. You're correct in that players over here can also force their way into different situations. You can kind of do that a little bit.

You see the NBA do it a little bit more than the NFL. But yeah, it's also just understood, I guess, on our side, like you make millions and millions of dollars. Yes, I'll go where they tell me to go. Yeah, it's like you're signing up for that. It's okay. But yeah, because on draft night, there were multiple scenarios that could have played

out in my situation. Arizona had been talked about, Dallas had been talked about a couple of different things. So that whole day you're playing out in your head, like, I wonder what it would be like in your head, like I wonder what it would be like to live in Buffalo. I wonder what it would be like to live in San Diego. Completely different sides of the entire country and you have no idea. Are you playing those scenarios out in your head on draft night or are you just going, do you know what?

I'm just gonna have to just wait and see. Were you in the actual, were you in the booth? Yeah, I was there. I was at Radio City music hall Sitting with my family at the table. I had my parents my brothers and my two high school coaches we were all at the table just hanging out and You know a Range so I knew I knew within probably 15 picks of where I was gonna go

So I'm looking at about 15 teams where I'm like anywhere in there. I could possibly go of where I was gonna go. So I'm looking at about 15 teams where I'm like, anywhere in there I could possibly go. More leading up to the draft, you're talking about it, than on actual draft day. On actual draft day, you're just kinda watching, and I know for myself, the first five picks, I knew I wasn't gonna be in the first five picks.

You're just watching, and I got friends who are going, I'm happy for them. But then it starts to get a little more tense. And then you start to lock in, and you know, you're at the table and it's a little quieter. Not as many side conversations with my brothers or with my parents. And then I'll never forget how it all went down.

One of my buddies who I had been training with got drafted to pick before me. And I went over to give him a hug and I had five and I was hugging him and I felt a tug on my jacket and my agent said, you might want to sit down. And then I went and sat down and my phone rang and everything else is history. And when you went there,

were you encouraged to have other, going back to the business interest, was that something that was encouraged within that locker room and that group of people for players to have other interests? Or was it at that stage, was it football, football, football? It was football football but understanding that this is much bigger than football also you know football is a business the whole thing is a business

and I also knew if you play well you get more opportunities so it certainly started out as just football and all I wanted to do was prove worthy I mean they booed me on draft night when I got picked in Houston. They didn't necessarily want me. There was another guy they wanted. Did they? Yeah. So I had a mission from day one to prove those people why I was worthy of their pick. And I wanted to turn their... I wasn't angry at them. They don't know me. They have no right to cheer me or boo me. I don't't care but my whole goal was to come in and show them that I'm worthy and so everything was about putting it on the field and the community

everything I could do I mean that could break it could break other people that couldn't it I mean let's be honest with ourselves there's a there's you know 12 million dollars they were handing me and I'm coming into a great place. I can't be too mad. And that guy said they don't know me. So they in their minds, whether it's media, whatever it may be, they had somebody that they wanted and it wasn't me and that's fine. I mean, there's things that I think people do wrong, whether it's team selection or

whether it's signing players. There's things that I think might not be right at the time. Everybody has their own opinions. But I just looked at as an opportunity so this would be pretty cool if we can change their mind. When you look at it at the moment at just just that sport in the NFL moment there are a lot of teams that have loads of cap space at the moment and yet therefore is there is there a reluctance to play players is Is there not enough players, talented players to go round to earn the money at the moment? I'm fascinated on

that business point because there's a lot of money but it's not going to the players so what's happening? Well there's a the cap is going up every year. I mean the NFL is an extremely successful business so that salary cap continues to rise every single year so those contracts are getting larger and larger every single year but every situation is different yes some sometimes you're paying a guy because you do have to fill some cap space and maybe you know and then there's other times where you're trying to find a way to possibly get a guy to fit underneath your cap but that's why this side of, the ownership side of it is so interesting because every

team decides to structure their team differently. What percentage of the cap do you give to your quarterback? What percentage is the pass rush worth? How do you spread it out? Do you want more vets? Do you want more rookies? Do you want, are you an offensive driven team or are you a balanced team or running team, passing team?

There's a million different things that you can do same over here I mean are you gonna be a low block team and you're gonna play super heavy defensively are you gonna be a big body team that can box people out and you can aerial balls over the top are you gonna be a in transition team or a tiki-taka team like all sorts of things you can there are two other things that are different though I think first of all everybody knows what everybody gets paid in the end. I mean, it's released. I agree.

It's released. So were you always comfortable with that? It's always been that way. So I never knew any difference. So it never bothered me at all. And I also do think it... So one thing I've noticed over here, and it's slowed down a little bit over the years, but I mean, we've all seen

they'll put Marcus rashford on the front page and say he took his bugatti out for dinner. Can you believe that i'm like well Yeah, I can believe it. He makes a ton of money. What do you mean? Well, do you know what that was that was gonna be my next thing. So a player in the nfl gets paid. I don't know Miles garrett gets 40 million dollars a year or whatever and people go, oh, it's his last big payday. Fair enough. He fully deserves that. Erling Harlem gets £400,000 a week of it and we're like, how in the... There's a real difference between the two days, isn't it?

That's exactly what I'm saying is that over on our side, everybody understands it. We understand the supply and demand economics of it. We understand that it's printed on the paper. This is what this guy makes. So when you see a guy with a brand new diamond chain we're not like how could he no he that's we know how that works that's what shocks me so much over here when everybody gets all up in arms I'm like you're you see the TV deals that are signed you see the stadiums packed you see how many

jerseys are sold worldwide you saw you I guess because it's not printed on the paper every single time exactly what they make maybe that's the mystery behind it all but We're not fooling anybody. We know these guys make an incredible amount of money. I don't know I think it's just something to get mad about Yeah, I mean the other thing though is I would say and you have been at the forefront of it certainly in Houston is It's very important to giving back is very is very important the NFL has a has an award for that which you've won the Walter Payton or that the sort of community man of the year across the NFL that that's

a massive that's also a very big message. Yes and I think quickly on the last conversation I have to say there's certainly a debate to be had on whether we should be paying athletes who kick a ball or throw a ball or catch a ball hundreds of millions of dollars no question I believe there's a conversation to be had there but the reality of capitalism and economics that's just how it is but yes I think that there are many athletes who give back in incredible ways that Denver get the credit that I do because of how publicly viewed it was and everything.

But I also am so fortunate to have that platform to have been able to raise $42 million for Houston after Hurricane Harvey and give it back. Not to mention that there was money raised from over here, there was money raised from all over the world. And it was one of the most beautiful things that I've ever witnessed because I got to see the positive side of humanity in the midst of a real struggle. And that gave me hope for the future at a time where there wasn't a lot of hope to be had.

Just finally, I mean, you're loving this, aren't you? You are absolutely relishing everything that comes with being part of this football club. I love it. It's a beautiful place. This has been a great weekend for us. I love the people. I love the passion.

I love what it means. I think that's the whole reason I got into it in the first place and that's what makes me so drawn to it. It's why I love, I walked from the hotel to the match the other day just because I want to be amongst the people From my very first game I knew that I wanted to be a goalkeeper The buzz and the adrenaline that I got from it The dream was to always represent my country I remember saying I know I've got what it takes.

And Curran shall say from us... You have to be obsessed. Marriott to the surface... You just look at some of the saves that she makes. Not everyone can do that. I really had no idea really how far I would go. England around dawn at the day. It felt like my world was ending.

That was the moment. I was in pieces on the kitchen floor. You have to hit rock bottom to understand what you really want. Mary would put herself in front of anything and feel like she could stop it. I've done something that I've always dreamed of doing and never knew if I would get the opportunity to do. Mary Earps, Queen of Stops. Watch on BBC iPlayer. Welcome to the Inside Track with me, Rick Edwards. This is the podcast that takes you

inside Formula One like never before. I'm Matt Magendie and thanks to my exclusive access, I'll be getting up close and personal with Red Bull Racing this season. This week, I sit down with one of the team's big bosses, Dr Helmut Marko. I also didn't think that Max would win four championships. He didn't have the success what we expected from him. Experience Formula One like never before by tuning into the Inside Track wherever you get your podcasts.