Football Daily - Monday Night Club: O’Neil withdraws from Wolves & disturbance in the goalkeepers’ union

Episode Date: November 3, 2025

Mark Chapman is joined by Andros Townsend, Shay Given and Rory Smith on the Monday Night Club. With former boss Gary O’Neil ruling himself out of the running, what type of manager would be attracted to the Wolves job? Should the club be moving away from the ‘usual’ pool of Premier League managers? Ryan Leister, host of The Wolves Report, joins the pod to consider the wider issues associated with Wolves’ recent decline. Shay offers insight on the dynamics in a goalkeeping group and the considerations when writing a book following the fallout from the publication of Mary Earps’ autobiography. Former Scotland forward James McFadden joins to chat Old Firm derby. How different are Celtic under Martin O’Neill? Are Rangers improved under Rohl? The panel consider Ruben Amorim’s tenure so far as Saturday marked his one-year anniversary in charge at Old Trafford.Plus, have West Ham turned a corner? Did they make the right call in appointing Nuno Espirito Santo? Timecodes: 1’33 Managerial vacancy at Wolves 19’30 West Ham 27’21 Nottingham Forest 30’08 One year of Ruben Amorim 39’38 Old Firm derby 50’50 Mary Earps’ autobiography 5 Live / BBC Sounds Commentaries:Tuesday 4th November CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: Slavia Prague v Arsenal 1745 KO – live on 5 Live. CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: Liverpool v Real Madrid 2000 KO - live on 5 Live. CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: Spurs v FC Copenhagen 2000 KO - live on Sports Extra. Wednesday 5th November CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: Qarabag v Chelsea 1745 KO - live on 5 Live. CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: Manchester City v Borussia Dortmund - live on 5 Live. Thursday 6th November EUROPA LEAGUE: Midtjylland v Celtic 1745 KO - live on Sports Extra. CONFERENCE LEAGUE: AEK Larnaca v Aberdeen 1745 KO - live on Sports Extra 2. EUROPA LEAGUE: Rangers v Roma 1945 KO - live on Sports Extra. Saturday 8th November PREMIER LEAGUE: West Ham v Burnley 1500 KO - live on 5 Live. PREMIER LEAGUE: Everton v Fulham 1500 KO - live on Sports Extra. PREMIER LEAGUE: Sunderland v Arsenal 1730 KO live on 5 Live. WSL: Arsenal v Chelsea 1200 KO - live on Sports Extra. Sunday 9th November PREMIER LEAGUE: Nottingham Forest v Leeds United 1400 KO - live on 5 Live. PREMIER LEAGUE: Brentford v Newcastle 1400 KO - live on Sports Extra. PREMIER LEAGUE: Aston Villa v Bournemouth 1400 KO - live on Sports Extra 2. PREMIER LEAGUE: Crystal Palace v Brighton 1400 KO - live on Sports Extra 3. PREMIER LEAGUE: Manchester City v Liverpool 1630 KO - live on 5 Live.

This is the Monday Nightclub with Mark Chapman on the Football Daily podcast. Welcome to the Monday night club, Andros Townsend, Shadegiven, Rory Smith with us. Just want to say get well soon to Chris, who's not feeling very well. That's sent me a message this morning saying he's got an infection that has left him

slurring, confused and disorientated. And you can obviously do your own gag about not knowing What difference that would make. And also, I tell you what, Andros, I'm disappointed because I thought you were going to do the whole show in a vest, which is how you were sitting there for the last five minutes. And only you out of this panel, with all due respect, show, can carry off a vest. Excuse me, chaperse. I've just been to the gym this morning, you know,

but yeah, you're probably right. Do you want me to see if there's a vest in the office? No, no, no. I probably look like Rabsey-Nesbitt. Jack Duckworth and an elite footballer. Of the show. So have you, you've got against the vest now, Andros? Well, two minutes before the show, the producer said to me, would you like to put a t-shirt on?

I took that as put a t-shirt on now, you scruffy, so-and-so. Rory, I'm sorry, I didn't include you in the vest chat, really. It's fine. I also don't want to wear a vest. Okay. Yeah. So we have a lot to get through. We start with Wolves, though.

Vita Pereira sacked on Sunday morning. They were beaten at Fulham. just 45 days after signing a new contract. Rumored contenders for the Wolves' job have included Gary O'Neill, their former boss, Brendan Rogers, Michael Carrick. Does it look like they're recruited from the same pool of managers as opposed to trying to something different?

Yeah, I do find it. I mean, I think Gary O'Neill is going to be a really good manager when he gets back in. I just don't feel it's the right fit, if I'm being honest, and it could have be totally off the radar here. But, you know, you got sacked a year ago, whatever, because you weren't good enough. and you couldn't keep the team up supposedly by the owners and the powers of Bate Wolves.

And now the Sacked the manager brought him to replace you because he was better. Give him a new contract a matter of weeks ago. And now you're suddenly good enough again to come back in and manage the team. I'm really, I don't know, I can't get my head around that. I don't really understand maybe football sometimes or people who make these decisions. But I just think he will be a good manager at some point somewhere else. I just don't think it's good to go back. Why would Gary O'Neill want to go back?

You assume that Gary O'Neill does not need to work immediately to pay his mortgage, which would be a valid reason to take a job. Surely he looks at it and thinks I'm a young coach. I've had two mixed experiences at Bournemouth and Wolves, where I have showed some promise, but at the same time I have been let down by, like, extenuating circumstances or the pressure of the circumstances in which I found myself. That's maybe a better way of saying it.

Surely what Gary O'Neill needs at this point is to go into a club for a football, for a full pre-season, probably in the championship, maybe abroad, where he can kind of put his methods into place away from this intensely pressurized situation. So I find it's slightly surprising that he'd want to go back after a year. Do you shy? Not really, no, purely because there's obviously being a manager in the Premier League is where every manager wants to be.

And there's only 20 jobs, as we all know. A lot of them positions are ticking, a lot of them positions are in a safe thing, So I think when an opportunity comes up, I think most managers would love to manage in the Premier League. I'm going to bring Ryan Lester, host of the Wool's Report podcast on now. But as I do that, with, I mean, with slightly comic timing, I suppose, David Ornstein is reporting for the Athletic

that Gary O'Neill has just withdrawn himself from the... I haven't done that deliberately, I promise it. I was a late substitution, to be fair, so... I know. I might get so back off again if Chris is feeling any better. So he's withdrawn himself from the process to become, according to David,

to become the next Wolves head coach after initial talks. It was understood that he felt the opportunity to make the return to Molyneux was not right for him at this time. Is that what you thought was coming, Ryan? I thought you was going to announce him

and that would have been really bad. So I'm kind of pleased, to be honest. Now, I respect Gary as a coach. I think he's going to do really well. But the last few months at Wolverhampton Wanderers was utterly abysmal. There was fallouts with players.

There was people put down with discipline issues. There was red cards all over the place. For me, it was just simply unacceptable. I'm delighted he's withdrawn from it, to be honest. I put a survey out on my ex the day. 93%. We had about 2,500 results. 93% of Wals fans said they did not want him to return.

I mean, that's a staggering number. Did they say who they did want, Ryan? No, I just did a yes or no. I didn't put a survey out there. Because my first thing. social media and my Twitter today, my WhatsApp has been going absolutely crazy and then I mentioned I'm speaking to you guys

and they're like, you need to tell them we don't want him so I think I don't know if Gary Neal just go on social media that much but if he did today he would have seen that he probably wasn't wanted at Wolverhamter Wunders. I think this would have been a bad move for Gary. I think it would have been a bad move for Wolves. People talking about all kinds of things on social media

so for me this is the right decision and I mean I don't know who wolves are going to get now but Gary O'Neill and Wall they've already had one bad relationship, they don't need to make it too. And fans of clubs are often the most honest, actually. Do you think it's an attractive job at the moment? Absolutely not, no.

And there's a really good point. I think Rory raised it then. Why would Gary O'Neill go back to Wolverhampton Wonders? I think that's only fair. Why would you? Anyone now, I'm not saying Gary O'Neill's good or bad, but any manager of a decent calibre that wants a job in the Premier League,

I think you've got to be pretty desperate to go to Wolverhampton Wonders at the moment, getting someone of a real high quality that has the credentials to give wolves any chance of staying up. I'm not sure wolves are capable of attracting that. The ownership has made it clear that they aren't ambitious anymore.

The self-sustainable model that's been happening for the last few years, 21, 22, 10th, 22, 23, 13th, 23, 24, 14th, 25, 25, 15th, this season 20th, has been an incremental decline because the self-sustainable model is just not working. We did the graphic on match of the day,

last night, the players that have left Wolves since 2003, and we did it in formation, basically. Pardon? Is it a good team? Well, I'm not being funny, there were two good teams.

Like, genuinely, there were two players for, I would say, nine of the 11 positions that had left. And people may scoff at some of the suggestions that were on there.

You know, Craig Dawson was on there, for example. But Craig Dawson was a vital player for Wolves. You know, it doesn't have to be constant superstars. So four centre halves had gone, right? But two fullbacks on either side had gone. You know, two, you know, and then you've got Neves and Matino and you've got Netto and you've got Mateus Nunez and you've got Raul Jimenez. And then the other point, in amongst all of these names,

is that the last three summers I'm thinking, Ryan, you've sold your captain. Yeah, it has been, as I said, there's been an incremental decline. You look at Brighton, Brentford, to an extent, Bournemouth, the data-driven clubs who are pretty much self-sufficient, and they do brilliant. They've got a plan. They release their manager, it gets poached. They've got their best players. They go, they've got a succession plan.

Someone comes straight in. It feels, like, to all's fans, particularly me, that there isn't that plan. They seem to be winking it now. I know the data-driven stuff I know it splits people with XG and I know people have got their opinion on it but these are some of the best run clubs in the Premier League

wolves feel like they're winging it and I've got to be honest and it hurts me to say they deserve to be with either more because the club's been running appallingly badly and the football hasn't been much better Andrews do you think actually Ryan's point is that when a lot of these clubs

are looking they aren't in great positions and we've been looking at it from the clubs thinking we don't want to take a risk on a bright young thing Do you think there's an element, as Ryan said, if you are a bright young thing, why would you risk the damage to your reputation here? I know you may only get one opportunity and so on and so forth, but it would be a hell of a risk.

I think it depends what bright young thing you're talking about. If it's, let's say, Robbie Keene, for example, is he going to have many opportunities to manage in the Premier League? Probably not. And like that competitive nature, a Robbie Kear, I'm just using him, for example. or he would be like, no, I trust my philosophy. I trust what I believe in. I trust my work on the training pitch.

If I did get the job, I'll definitely be able to get a tune out of these players. I can do this. I can do that. So I think for a young manager who hasn't been linked with the Premier League many times before, I think you would jump at the chance to managing the Premier League, even if it is in dire situations like Wolves are in this season. I think it depends a little bit on the context. So I think it wolves in the summer.

is probably quite an attractive proposition. It is a Premier League club, which means you have access to a sort of wealth that even in Wolves' kind of reduced status is like way more than every other club in Europe. You know, they can't. Wolves is self-sustaining model gives you a bigger transfer budget

than being manager of Benfica, which is probably not that healthy for European football in general. But then I saw that Rui Borgias, the sporting managers on the list. Sporting are in the Champions League. They're second, I think, in Portugal. He's in his first full season.

I don't see why he would go to Wolves now and that's the problem wolves we've got by giving Pereira a contract and three-year contract what, 45 days, a month ago and Ange Poster Coddlu at Nottingham Forest ago they gave him a new contract which was after the form had turned and Rein will correct me if I'm wrong

he was brilliant for three months Fittor Pereira between January and April and then things tailed off once they were safe basically that it's not like they ended the season on a massive high and obviously they didn't start the season on a massive high So it seemed, the timing of that seems weird, to be honest. Yeah, the timing of the new contract was really strange. Wolves broke one of their own records.

They won six Premier League games on the bounce. And believely, that was over six months ago since their last win when they beat Leicester 3-0. But you would have thought then, reward the manager now. This is fantastic. We've got the squad, the fans. He's out having a beer in the pubs. There was a real feel-good factor about it for Wolves,

which hadn't been there for a little while. So to wait so long, I mean, Wolf's sort of were safe, the form dipped off. you can kind of understand when there's nothing to play from in either direction. That happens in football sometimes. But at the start of this season, it's been really, really bad. We haven't even looked at games and thought, well, we're okay today. It's been genuinely quite bad.

There's been a couple of missed opportunities. So to have a bad start to the season and then to reward a manager whose average stays less than 12 months across his whole career is quite phenomenal to give him a three-year contract. Absolutely stunning. But I say stunning. I shouldn't be staggered because this is the life and times of Wolverhampton Wunders over the last four years, which has been quite incredible. Ryan, you said you've been on X all day today speaking with the fans.

What kind of manager would the fans want? Would they want somebody like a Noon or like a Moy? Somebody you can come in and get them up the table short term? Or do you think they want the risk? They want the Eriola. They want the Oliver Glasner. Somebody you can potentially take the club to the next level. I think looking at the table now, where it is, we just like a win to start with, to be

honest. We talk about survival after that. But I think it needs to be a follow. firefighter. The problem is now, if you look long term now, and you brought a manager in with a philosophy, a bright young thing that was going to come in, he could be damaged by the start of next season, because if you have an appalling end to the season, you've got this guy that's all like, you're excited to have him in. If he's in position and you've lost another 15 games, and then people like, well, he's not up to it, he's not going to get the chance.

So for me, this can only be a firefighter now. People have mentioned Robbie Keene. I mean, he's obviously in the other direction of his career. It's a risk for him, but obviously he started his career off at Wolverhampton Windsor at Coventry. Great player for us, Kno was. I'm not sure some boss fans forgive him when he scored for Villa against us though, so they probably might need to let that go if it comes. And then there's an old two-footy cruncher

and Kevin Muscat. That was certainly livening things up. So again, he's done his time a little bit like Angi Posta Cogler. I think he's worked in Australian. I think he's worked in some of the Asian leagues. He's done really well. Somebody like Kevin Muscat, I can't give you a name because I'm worried that we're not going to be out of track anybody, but somebody now that's going to install a bit of steel and some fight and some bravery

because the players have been brave in terms of tackles but no one's been brave in terms of responsibility taking the grain by the scrub of the neck creating chance, he's driving the team forward nobody has done that this season and as a result, I think Wolves have scored seven goals which is the worst in the Premier League. Rob Edd was asked about the vacancy by BBC T's today

who obviously has his connections to Wolves. Middlesbrough going well in the championship, he said. I was told about the wolves links by my daughter yesterday. I can understand the links to my former my club, but my full focus is on the brilliant job that I have here. It's hard for me to comment and speculation and anything else that isn't

Middlesbrough. All I care about is trying to win the game at Leicester tomorrow. You would say, Shea, Rob Edwards, you'd be better off staying where you are, wouldn't you? Yeah, definitely. You know, sitting second in the championship, doing a great job, had a brilliant start

to the season. And again, he's in a job. He's in a really good club in Middlesbrough, with a fantastic owner, Steve Gibson. you know, everything seems to be rosy in the garden. So why would you jump out of that into, as Ryan says, it seems to be the opposite, you know, with the boardroom, with the decisions they're making.

And, you know, it's just strange that Ryan was saying about, you know, the manager and he's down the pub and the fans liked them and the connection with the fans and stuff. At what point do the fans say, well, it actually wasn't the manager or it's not the next manager comes in? It's actually maybe the board or the players on the pitch or, you know, who do you think, Ryan, sort of the, you know, who does the blame sort of lie with a bit with the position they're in?

Yeah, first of all, just jumping about Rob Edwards, from his team at Luton and the players that Wolves have got now, I could see a direct link up there. So in terms of his style of play of the big guys at front and getting the ball in the box, that's something that could work with them. But in terms of the bigger picture in the board, this is all about Jeff Sheehanfos, and it is, I said that there's been an incremental decline. We're not obligated to expect them putting their own money in, pumping it in left, right and centre. but if you're not going to do that,

you need to run the club really well, and they've not done that. They're failing badly. We've been slipping down the table, as I mentioned, year after year. So for me, Jeff Shee, there's a lot of disconnect with the fans. I mean, I've watched Wolves in League One,

and many of my mates go, I don't recall feeling worse than this watching Wolverhampton Wundress. We went down to League One, but you know what? I felt like I was enjoying wolves. Now there's disconnect with the owners. The stadium's tatty.

They're not looking after that. They're trying to do this self-sufficient model. So for me, blame, he's firmly on Jeff Shea and the conglomerate that he's frozen. By the way, just for accuracy when you compare the wolves and the Luton squads, I think he had better wingers when he was at Luton just to... I know, sorry, a bit slow with that, Andros, I got there, I got there. Thank you.

Rob Edwards, Michael Carrick are there as the sort of younger ones. Then you have the out-of-work ones who are Brendan Rogers and Eric Tenhaug and Poster Coglu, I suppose. although that's a bit more far-fetched. And then honestly, and I think this is genuine, I'm assuming this is genuine and not a producer trying to wind me up, who has just showed me a list of the odds that has Allardyce's favourite.

Like, odds-on favourite. Sam Aladice played for West Bronx. He's from the black country, aren't he? Yeah. But is he not the other side? Yeah, I mean, Aladice is your ultimate firefighter, I suppose, although his last firefighting job, and I said there's...

For anyone's listening to the car, Ryan's shaking his head. here, shaking his head badly. His last firefighting job, Chap, which I brought you a lot of delight, was Leeds United, and it didn't go very well. Surely he got two, he had a couple,

many games did he have at Leeds, Rory? He had literally like, handful of games. More than he had wins. Yeah, but how many games was it? Like, does anyone? Not many, I think four,

but it was very few, wouldn't it? It looked less like an attempt, a last sort of gasp of salvation, more like to surrender, to be perfectly honest. I think that would be, in a way,

kind of instructive of where wolves are, because it would be the ultimate kind of hail Mary of an appointment, I suppose, can Sam Maldives recapture what he was able to do seven, eight, nine years ago? I think, as Ryan's touched on, the issue with Wolves is there is no vision. Whoever you get as manager will be working with a squad that has been incrementally but consistently weakened for the last four, five years. The final one then, Ryan, you know, you look at candidates that have been mentioned there

and there are others. and unlike most vacancies, and maybe this is quite harsh, you can't actually see a right fit, can you? Like with so many clubs when a vacancy comes up, you sort of think, okay, like Dyshe and Nottingham Forest. Yeah, I can see that. I can see it. With any of these, it's a bit like, oh, crikey, I'm not sure.

Yeah, you could see New No, West Ham as well. That made sense. And you mentioned, that made sense. You look at that list, and if Gary O'Neill, favorite. Obviously, he's redrawed himself now. I like Michael Carrick, but I think he's going to want to play a purest kind of board, possession-based game. I'm not sure the wolves have got the players

for that. They might keep the ball, but it's not going to go forward. So I think Carrick's a fit, if it was a rebuild. I'm not sure Wolves have the players for that. I can see Stephen Gerard, I don't think so. Ange Poster Coglu, no way, thank you. I mean, guarantee me a trophy, Angie. I'm not sure you're going to be able to do that, though. I don't think you're sure you're going to guarantee us a win.

Talk of Bruno Lodge, as well, who was at Wolves a couple of years ago. So, I mean, then I go back to Kevin Muscat and Robbie Keen, and they seem like that might be top of the list at the moment. But Rob Edwards as well, direct style of play suited. Obviously, Luton, now the better wingers, apologies. But that style of play, that directness, I think, would suit Wolves the most with the player they've got

because also the little bit of some people with the manager, he's been, he was dealt a really poor hand with an utterly dreadful window. Wolves have spent 120, 130 million pounds, and they've downgraded in every single position. and as a result, we're at the bottom of the league. Ryan, thank you very much for coming on. Appreciate it.

Cheers, guys. Thanks, Ryan. See you soon. Ryan Lester, host of the Wool's Report podcast on the Monday Night Club. You'd be surprised knowing Rob Edwards, wouldn't you, Andross? That would have to be the romantic pull of the club, wouldn't it, for him to switch? Yes, but I know Rob Edwards. He's very emotional.

He gets very attached. And I think when Luton got relegated, probably the smart thing was for him to, step down because his stock was so high even though Luton got relegated but he's emotional he wanted to he was he wanted to get them back in the Premier League he wanted to do it for the

fans and he didn't see the bigger picture so now he's doing well at Middlesbrough he's in love with the fans the fans love him I'll be very very surprised if he could drag himself away from that to have another crack in the Premier League let's move on to West Ham

you watch this game you did this game for television yesterday Shay did what you see or what you saw from West Ham change your overall picture long term with them? I think it was a huge victory. I mean, Park, Newcastle did one side for West Ham it was a huge result, obviously the first victory under the new manager.

You could see his emotions after the game where any staff was very special. I mean, when they got their noses in front of 2-1, they took off the striker, Callum Olson, on the 60th minute mark. And Sucheck came on, and at that point it looked like Nottingham Forest

in disguise they went into a defensive block obviously the third goal came late on but it was very much that sort of system and tactical the way he set up at Nottingham Forest and I think that's what he needs to do go back to basics in the sense that build the foundations

concede less goals obviously and hopefully with the pace on the break that they will cause teams problems but it was a massive victory you can imagine the atmosphere now today West Ham's training ground and the mood among those players and even the manager and the staff and stuff because

you know the fans were getting on their case on the board's case I think there's still a bit of a you know a bit of a sort of a fans were having to go after the game still after a victory yesterday but it's amazing what a victory can do for morale within the dressing room you know and and they'll be buzzing after that result yesterday and and we talk about who's the perfect fit for for for wolves I think Nuno seems that fit that can get West Ham out of trouble because you know there's still a long way to go but I think a victory especially at home as well

what's have struggled that I think it's a sort of a big stepping stone for them really I think it was a massive victory Shane especially you look at their

next two fixtures Burnley at home Bournemouth away they've got a real opportunity now to get themselves out of the relegation zone I'm not saying

those two games are givens but if you want to survive Burnley at home you need to be winning if you want to survive in the Premier League so they've got a real

opportunity now to drag themselves away from the hole they've got themselves in yet again. Yeah, it's keeping the teams above them in touch, isn't it? I mean, Ryan was talking about wolves looking like their they're kind of at risk of getting caught adrift. That would have been true of West Ham as well

if it had taken too long to get that first win. So it just kind of, it gets them into a position where another win and they potentially are not in the relegation zone, and that I think psychologically is massive. Maybe it's time to trot out my age-old theory again, Andros. I always think, if you're a club like West, Tam, and you've had a really difficult start to the season, and the fans understandably are not happy, Burnley at home could easily become a, if you were in a Luton, if Luton were

Burnley at the moment, you would be rubbing your hands when you're going to the London stadium thinking, we could make this a nightmare for them today. Yeah, when you put it like that, if I was a Bernie player now going into the game on the weekend, I would be saying, right, guys, the first 10, 15 minutes, we press. them high, we kick long into there, we put pressure on then, we try and do something to make the fans turn on the players, and that's just the nature of the beast. And I think those players will be targeting, maybe can we press them high? Can we win a couple of corners? Can we get the players and the fans edgy and just get the atmosphere at the London Stadium to turn

a little bit? What Nuno did do yesterday, Shea, though, was actually pick certainly a midfield that was more to the liking of what the fans have wanted. The fans have wanted a younger midfield, legs in midfield. And Michael Carrick on match of the day last night, I was saying, you know, Freddie Potts wasn't running here, there and everywhere, you know, it wasn't sort of terrier-like. He was incredibly calm, incredibly composed, and was always in the right place at the right time. And the fans have wanted that balance in midfield for a while.

Yeah, they've struggled a wee bit in midfield, haven't they? I think, you know, Sue Chek is getting on a bit. Ward Proust and the legs getting around the pitch and covering but Pots was brilliant just the only thing you felt for him was the goal was disallowed I think he got a goal but at VAR and Davina was off-sized I think Souchick was just offside with a knockdown

but you know it was an all-round performance I think he's dad at the minutes on the coaching staff as well and the camera sort of panned in on him as well would have been the perfect day wouldn't it for the family imagine that but it was a perfect day it a great game Mark he really had a brilliant performance and again look very comfortable

I was on the TV yesterday with Matt Ritchie And he knows Potts really, really well. And he says he's got a big future ahead of him. He's got really bright, really good on the ball. And again, he's got legs. And people look at the Newcastle 3 and midfield. They think, you know, they're one of the strongest midfield three in the country. And Potts and his partner next to Fernandez yesterday,

I thought we're absolutely brilliant. They really were. And again, it gives them that sort of protection, the back four. They're sort of mopping up in front of the back four. I know it's only one game, and it's early stages of his career at West. time, but what I've seen yesterday, I was very, very impressed. Chey, he was obviously

at the game. Callum Wilson, somebody who when he signed, there was a lot of criticism online about his sign and about his age, his injury, history. He started on the weekend. Have the fans now taken to him? What was the atmosphere like at the stadium? I think it'll take time. I think, you know, Callum, obviously, known

from Newcastle and, you know, any striker just wants to get on the score sheet, didn't he? He would have been desperately to score yesterday of course against his old team. But again, it's a bit, I suppose, like, an Isak or whatever at Liverpool he's not I wouldn't say he's 100% fit yet he's not played enough football

but again there was a bit of criticism because obviously he had this injury record at Newcastle, Fulcrig as well we know who can't keep him fit as well so West Ham fans are frustrated why can't we get maybe a younger one who's going to play more games perhaps you know but Callum I want to prove a lot of people wrong as well

but Rory I mean Michael Carey said I really hope by the way he doesn't get the world's job because I'm going to lose half my material here because I keep pointing him but And he's been really good to work with it as well. But Michael Carrick said on last week's match of the day, you know, if you have that four of Wilson, Packardar, Somerville and Bowen, that's a four that really a lot of teams would probably like to have.

Now, if you have that balance behind it, then really they shouldn't be in the situation that they are in. But it needs someone like Potts behind them on the evidence yesterday, or be it his first Premier League start. Yeah, but the balance is the key thing, isn't it? Because that's a good front four. Pachatar in particular, is a genuine star. Wilson proven Premier League player.

Somerville, a little bit kind of erratic, but really exciting. And Jarra Bowen is, I mean, lots and lots of clubs, I think, would like to have Jarra Bowen in their squad, if not in their team. But the issue is that you can say that of the attacking four of quite a lot of Premier League teams. I mean, Nottingham Forrest in 19th. They're below West Ham.

and their front four is probably of that level if not slightly better and I mean maybe walls are an exception maybe Burnley and Leeds just they're newly promoted but other than that

you know Everton have got Jack Greelish cost 100 million pounds four years ago in place for Everton you know the level is so high that everyone has talent everyone has quality and it's about how well organised it is

how how kind of how well it fits together I think that's often the defining factor in the Premier League now is do you have like you they've all got good players, do you have the right players for the way you want to play? And at West Ham, maybe there's been, as Shea maybe says,

maybe there's been a little bit too much emphasis on kind of experience, kind of battle-hardenedness, that kind of quality, rather than excitement, energy, dynamism. That's been a little bit lacking, certainly last season and into the start of this. Also in the bottom three then, as Rory says, are forest, the positive, I suppose, Andros, from their draw with Manchester United and we'll do United in a few moments

is that maybe if you go back a month it felt like a match that both teams would have lost and neither of them did so there's positives for both but let's deal with Forrest first Yeah I think that's what Sean Dyshe is in for he's into

like keep chipping away at the points telly like you said they probably second best if I'm honest Man United were the better side but after Mademite went ahead, they sort of took their foot off the gas and allowed Nottingham Forrest back in the game. Sean Deich is known to pile the pressure on the big teams

with more direct style, with set pieces. I think their second goal was a set piece. Their first goal was a cross into the box. So it's Sean Deich pool coming to effect now for Nottingham Forest. I'm sure once Wood gets fit as well, you'll see a more direct style of player and more suited to Sean Dice. But, yeah, I think Northern Forrest now,

now they've got Sean Dice in. they'll be all right they'll start climbing the table or start chipping away that points tally with the draw inns although they may have scored

their goals from set pieces but show they conceded from set pieces as well both the goals they conceded from set pieces arguably one of them shouldn't have been given

but anyhow so they've conceded nine for the season from set pieces now no one has conceded more I know set pieces I know everybody's scoring and conceding set pieces

but that is high what's that nine in nine set pieces of conceded from in ten games. That's high. Yeah, but I think that's something that Sean Dice will go that's not acceptable.

That's not good enough and Sean Dice is renowned for actually set plays for and against. I mean, the first goal, it was a simple, yes, it shouldn't have been a corner but I think we all agree in that

but at that stage then you have to get your focus by concentrating what's happening in the game. I think it felt like the Notting and Forrest players sort of switched off for that brief second

because it was a decent ball in by Fernandez and Casasemara seemed to just stand, jumping, head it was the most basic sort of goal you will see from an attacking point of view probably all season, but from a defensive point of view, you wouldn't see that in any league. It was so poor from a

Nottingham Forest point of view to concede such an easy goal really. So you would think Sean Dice would get a handle of that and maybe the set up next week might be different or whatever it is, but that was a really poor goal to give it. Ahmad's goal was an absolute wordy, wasn't it? He sort of half cleared at the edge of the box and

he's just produced an absolute worldy to get the equalizer. You know, I don't think there's a lot, Sean Dites could have done about that, but the first goal is something you look at, you know, we cannot concede goals, I guess if we want to get out of the trouble. The other side of the coin there, not from Nottingham Forest,

but from Manchester United's point of view, one year since Ruben Amarim took charge. The first thing I'm going to read your show is one of his post-match quotes, which is difficult to argue with. In the past, if we've had this kind of bad five minutes because they conceded two in five minutes, if we'd had this kind of bad five minutes

and we suffered two goals, we wouldn't recover. So today is a different feeling. Is that the positive? I think when you're losing away from home in the Premier League, I think, and you get a late sort of equaliser like they did at the weekend, I think he got to look at that as a positive. And to be fair to Ahmad, he had another strike, I think, from another corner, actually was cleared off the line from Morello.

And it was kind of, you could look at that both ways. They're unlucky not to get the winner at the end, Man United. Or you could look at that from a nautic enforcement. If you can think that sort of clearance from Morelo is something that will give them a huge lift to get away from trouble. but going back to Man United I don't know I believe that he's building something

I believe there's I don't know when someone speaks I know sometimes we said in the past on here that he's too honest sometimes that some of the stuff he comes out of me

but I think he's very honest to his players I think he strikes me as you know he's had to get rid of a certain amount of players because they weren't pulling their weight

you know on the pitch like a Nottingham Forest at the weekend had players in the past that maybe weren't should all hands to the pump and trying to push

for an equaliser or even at Anfield the week before you got Cooney and Muemo tracking back at Anfield and holding the ball up and buying fouls and just working so hard

for the team that takes time I think to build it at any football club and the team spirit and togetherness it feels like it's back for me at Old Trafford and that comes from one person

and that's the manager and that doesn't happen overnight or over a couple of games and it's probably took longer than even Rubin has wanted to tick but at the same time you know I think the recruitment was good in the summer

I still still need more from Cisco I think I think there was times at the weekend where his holder play wasn't good enough Mark he needs to do better

but Cunia and in Buemondon there's definitely an improvement on last season's attacking players would would you be as positive as She is about United

at the moment andros 100% I like the balance they have in that side especially down the right hand side you rarely ever see two left footers playing wide

and in the half space and it just works with Amad and Bremo in like the sort of the right number 10 position. The left, you've got Cunio, you got Casamiro sort of holding, and you got Fernandez sort of roaming, and then the three defenders give you the balance. So I think they've got a great balance for their side. I think the next step for Man United now is when they go one-nearhead,

can you keep pushing? Can you sort of like Man City, do like Liverpool's score? Can you keep going and get two and three and four? What they did on the weekend is they scored one because they're not used to winning football match. like a Man City, they sort of retreated and they allowed Notting Forest to get back in the game.

So for me, that next step is can they go, can they go two, three, four and really kill teams off when they're on top? There's an argument at the moment, Rory, that he's working with quite a tight squad really. And certainly when it comes to the starting 11, there are probably eight or nine who are guaranteed and maybe a couple who rotate.

So one of the articles may have been in the Times highlighted, you know, there could be one injury away from it all going a bit wrong. Now, the other side of that is they actually have the fewest injuries in the Premier League this season. They've had eight. And going back to the times in March, they actually said when Liverpool were actually looking at Amram as a candidate to replace Klop. One of the things they really like was that he scored top of their metrics among leading European coaches for keeping players fit. So he does have a record with this.

Yeah, I mean, there's a little bit of luck, I guess, in injuries, isn't there? Like, you can avoid muscle injuries too, and you can not avoid, but you can minimise muscle injuries by managing training load. But at some point, if someone gets kicked in the knee, then they're going to be injured. So that feels like a, that feels like a very much job thing. Yeah, I was like some of the physios and sports scientists you were with Andross, that kind of in-death medical knowledge.

I mean, this is just handing it out for, you know, just to the public at large chappas. No, I think the thing that I agree with what Shane Andrews have said about United, it does feel as though there's been a corner turned, et cetera, which is not a phrase Amarim lights. Grimsby feels a lifetime ago. Like that moment where it felt impossible that he would make it to a year

feels like it's gone. And in a way, it seems like he's the strongest. His position is the most secure it's been in months, to be honest. And it's amazing what winning at Anfield will do, I suppose. But I'm conscious that with United, it doesn't take. much either way for the mood around the club to change

completely. So three wins an accreditable draw at Forest I think and it feels like their Manchester United are back. If they go and lose a couple of games in the next three or four weeks, nothing major will have changed in terms of the growth of the team but the entire atmosphere could shift again

and so I'm a little bit reticent to make any kind of main at what stage does it not flip from one to the other so consistently? I mean I think if they're like third in February or March and they're sustaining a challenge for a champion's lead place,

I think that would be a realistic target. The one thing I would say about the injuries about the fact that Amarim's methods do seem to be taking hold is he is kind of in a sweet spot, isn't it? Because they have a squad built to compete in Europe, but no European football. So that helps you keep players fit

and it helps you get your message across and you are thinking about one game a week, especially if they conveniently got knots out of the Caribar Cup by Grimsby. So you kind of look at that and think, well, there should be, this is a real opportunity for him. him, to get that system in place with that squad, that core of that squad, and to build

to something when he has absolutely no distractions elsewhere. But then the other side of that, Andros, is he's likely to have more disgruntled players than if they did have European football, because there are several of them who aren't getting any starting time whatsoever. So come January, he then might have another battle to fight. with some players who might not want to be there in a World Cup year. Yeah, I remember when I go back to my Crystal Palace days and when we used to go out of the Carabal Cup,

Roy Hodgson always used to say after the game, you guys that I've given a chance, don't you dare knock on my door to ask for game opportunities? Because Carabelle Cup was your opportunity and you lost, you got knocked out to Grimsby, so please don't knock on my door for opportunities anymore. So I feel like Ammarin's sort of got that out to say, listen, that was your opportunity.

It's now gone. Don't knock on my door until January. Yeah. So did you? Did players still knock on his door? Oh, always. Have you ever met a footballer? But then I wonder if the fact that Ratcliffe and the kind of powers to be United

have been so all in on Amarim, whether that changes the power dynamic in that conversation. Because Amarim can say, well, look, you're not getting me out. You know, I've hit the Grimsby feels like the Nadea, and they have built from that. I've hit the bottom point and I'm still here if this turns into a test of strength

then I'm going to win and that might change the way the players behave in terms of manifesting their disgruntlement chappas think it would show I just I mean it's difficult because if we sit on here and we go

he needs to freshen up and put new players on then they don't doesn't give a steady 11 like a chance to get them partnerships going the pairing of the understanding of say the front three for example what I don't to agree with Rubin is he always seems to change the centre half for whatever reason I'm not so sure about

but it's something he you know we always think about rotating and Andrews probably tell you better it's always the forwards normally get rotated or taken off or rested I've never seen the manager in the past always take a centre half off it's normally especially in the heat of battle as well it's a strange one but he must have some sort of reasoning behind it

and I do agree with Rory about saying about there's only the Premier League they can focus I know the FACCups coming in the new year but you know no European football and this is for me this is a huge opportunity for Manchester United. You know, now they seem to be on a good run. Four on beating this whole season's an opportunity.

It's a chance for them to get back up to European places. I think, I've been brutally honest, I think Champions League's beyond them this season. But if they can get back up in the top six or seven, back into the European football, then I think it's going to be a good season for him and build again because we know the financial power that Manchester United have.

If you need somebody in January or next summer, then he will get backed. And I think Jason Wilcox said that even last week, that if they're not. the right player becomes available, man you and I have the financial power to go and get them. Welcome to the team behind the team, a new podcast series in partnership with the Open University,

where we'll be showcasing the people, the tools and the techniques that help athletes and teams reach elite level. Like all elite sports, it's a pyramid and everybody's trying to get to the top. It's not just my vision. It's a shared vision amongst the team. What is this?

This is not the way I see. the team behind the team with Katie Smith in partnership with the Open University listen on BBC Sounds this is the Monday nightclub with Mark Chapman on the Football Daily podcast

Danny Rolls Rangers beaten 3-1 yesterday by Martin O'Neill Celtic in the League Cup semi-final so Celtic into their final they'll take on St. Mirren, James McFadden with us to talk about this

and as there's no Chris they'll have plenty of time to get a word in evening. Which Chris are you talking about? Well that's a very good point. I mean this has got nothing to do with Rangers Celtic yesterday but honestly I watched because I did say

this last week one of my favourite things is watching the buildup to whatever the game is on a Sunday lunchtime with when it's you and Boyd and Sutton and maybe another guest. Honestly, I think last week you and there was one other person in that studio ahead of Hart, Celtic,

you mustn't have said anything for half an hour. Yeah, I mean, I don't mind. It happens every single week. It happens every single week. It depends what the topic is. But yeah, I normally tell them, listen, five minutes, get out of the way, will you? So we can actually get on with our jobs.

We had an email from Ray Stevenson into MNC at BBC.co.com. Surely the reaction to Martin Aneill at Celtic is completely over the top. He couldn't beat a poor Rangers team who were down to 10 men over 90 minutes. Would you say to Ray, it's less about the performance

and just the changing atmosphere and intensity? Or does Ray have a point? Well, Ray's points to the result rather than the performance. I think the performance was good. I thought there was a lot more energy. there were players that transformed and he's not

had a lot of time to work with him and Martin Neil's not a coach as such, he doesn't do all the coaching but the players that, you know, dies in mind as a prime example this season, there was talk of him going to Brentford, bids rejected telling him he couldn't leave

and it seemed to be affecting his performance I mean, I'd probably use that as an excuse but every single player the levels from last season were night and day at the start of this season so slow, lacking in energy, no real cutting edge or not a lot of cutting edge.

But the performance yesterday was full of energy, you know, playing the ball forward. Not every time you can, but with a real purpose to go forward. And a rejuvenated side, I would say, it sounds strange to say that, you know, your eight or nine

league games into the campaign. But it certainly, he's come in and give the players a lift. And you can see that in the performance. and also the introduction Johnny Kenny, which Johnny Kenny had to play anyway because there's not too many options up there, but Callum Osmond

coming from absolutely nowhere, you know, Brendan Rogers has been complaining about the signings over the summer and I do understand and I have supported that viewpoint and that he wants quality that's ready for the Champions League, but Kalam Osman was available to play in

the qualifier for the Champions League and he looked outstanding yesterday. I'll come on to those players in a moment. Andros, as a current player, do you, if, and I'm talking me personally here, whenever you spend time with Martin O'Neill, he tends to put a smile on your face and you come away having had a really,

having had a really enjoyable conversation or a couple of hours if he's done a game with you or whatever. And it's fun. Now, that's just when you're presenting something. I appreciate for footballers, you're at work. And we live in an era of XG and tactics and tactics boards and so on and so forth. But simply giving the place a lift,

do you think it can still work with the modern footballer who are demanding of all the other stuff that comes with the modern coach? But sometimes 73, just give them a lift. 100%, especially in the short term. When you're having a bad set of results, confidence is low, the atmosphere is not great, just having somebody come in with just fresh sort of enthusiasm

of fresh fault and fresh ideas, can make the world of difference. That's why we see managers when they first come in. They make a massive impact because they don't have the baggage of the defeats of the past. They come in with the fresh ideas and everyone's lifted, everyone's confident, everyone gets a pat on the back and the atmosphere is amazing again. So I don't know how long it can sustain that sort of managerial ethos, but 100% in the short term, it does make a big difference.

Yeah, I mean, he has, Martin Nail's gone in as the figurehead, but has Sean Maloney beside him, who's a young coach manager and Mark Fotheringham has gone in who's obviously had his shot in management he's been over in Germany working under Felix Magat and on Sean Mooney

when he was at Belgium under Roberto Martinez was about the details you know they're going into how they looking at the performance the analytical side of it and Mark Fotheringham is an extremely

bubbly character with modern views and modern an approach so there is a mix there it's not just that martin neal's going in and you know doing everything on his own but i do agree with andros i mean that when you when you go from one extreme to the other almost you get that lift it's not really what happens in the short term it's how that how that looks in the long term and i agree with that but i think he's got a good um coaching staff in beside him to help him with that yeah and in maloney and fathering he should have that modern element jepa that you talk about you know that they are young i mean they're both early

40s, I think, I might be making sure Maloney's slightly older than he needs to be. He's early 40s, I think 40 and maybe just turning 40. So they're young and yeah, O'Neill, you know, there's everyone around Celtic to stress this, that O'Neill's kind of the figurehead that he's got, like,

he's in like a supervisory capacity, but Maloney and fathering with the people who are like at the cold face, they are doing the coaching day to day. And if you combine that positivity that O'Neill's presence and his legend gives with modern coaching, then Celtic do still have the best squad in Scotland

despite James is obviously right that they had a strong I just wouldn't go and tell them what the XG was for the game I wouldn't be telling them all we had the high XG today gap I think what Martin brings as well he probably simplifies a lot of things you know because I think the modern day game chap

is going to get bogged out in this stuff about XG and Blading assists and pre-assists and Blading Royal had you with some more stuff in a minute but it's just like sometimes you can have too much information when you cross the white line really can

like you've got motorbikes going off in your head and sometimes simplicity in my opinion is genius and I know Martin will say that

and he'll probably go back to his Brian Clough days and what he was told when he went on to the pitch and his managerial style is a wee bit like that as well and I'm not saying Brendan was overcomplicating

I'm just saying that Martin will be a voice he's a leader obviously he's brilliant and motivating people and again simplicity sometimes is genius

well Callum Osmond himself has said that. So, and James has mentioned him, so signed from Fulham's Academy this summer, hasn't had to look in under Brenda Rogers, must have heard or, well, will have heard, all the noise about transfers and

how the summer wasn't successful and so on. He said Andross, you know, O'Neill has given me the confidence and the trust. It only takes one person to believe in you and push you on. And you can see that, can't you? You can see him probably just saying,

maybe I'm doing Martin a disservice here but literally probably saying to Calamazman go on then go and play and have some fun and that just the experience of Martin O'Neill to know that a player

sometimes just needs a pat on the back and a little G up to get going again I remember a situation when I was at Crystal Palace and I was in terrible for him and Sam Aladais came in and he called me into his office first day and said like you want to play on the right or the left

I said I don't mind I said no no no you want to play on the right or left. I said, okay, the right. He said, okay, that's all I'm going to say. You're playing on the right. Go and do your thing. I know how good you are. And I went and did my thing. And as a player, sometimes that's all you need. You just need a manager to come in and believe in you just to bring that confidence back into your game. So I think Martin O'Neill, with his experience, he's a perfect man to sort of get Celtic's confidence back and get them playing the way everyone knows they can play. Where are they then with their managerial

search then, Celtic? I think that, you know, Martin Neal coming in with probably a being a stopgap which it still probably is but I think seeing such an improvement in performance levels may well allow the board or afford the Celtic board time to get this

decision right the difficulty that you then have is the longer you leave it and the better the performances are and the better the results are then the temptation may well be to leave Martin in situ for a little bit longer so

the other say that as I don't know. I think it was a case of such a turbulent week last week as much as the form and results was poor for Celtic and there was total disconnection between the manager on the board and that has been from the summer. Then

it was still a shock so I think it was a case to get to the League Cup semi-final and then we can start focusing on the hunt for the manager or certainly putting more emphasis on it but to be honest with you I don't really know where they're at with it. James you spoke before about Martin O'Neill buying

himself some more time with a win on the weekend but would it be the worst decision in the world to maybe give it to him until the end of the season and see how well he can do with Sean Maloney who like Robbie said is a young modern coach who worked with Martinez and what have you so would it be the worst decision

in the world to just give him a go until the end of the season and see how far he can get? No, I don't think it would be but I think then you're in the same position come the end of the season. You know, whoever comes in, the bare minimums to win the league I think that you don't have to be a top level manager to be able to win the league

and this sounds terrible to win the league with Celtic because you have the best players you should be able to win the league and the focus and the unrest is based on the lack of preparation

for the Champions League Celtic would be playing in the Champions League they're not, they're in Europa I don't think it would be the worst thing I think that it has to be probably a view

to be the long term either that Martin Neal steps away in the summer unless you still get the energy to continue and then you're looking at potentially a Sean Maloney but I think that it needs to be that whoever is in is not just to see out till the end of the season

and then you start planning for next season there has to be an eye on a continuation for the club going forward. Very quickly, positives for Rangers? Yeah, I think there's improvements for Rangers Danny Rills come in and made them harder to play against which Rangers don't want to be harder to play against. They don't want to be that team that's hard to beat

but they've been far too easy to play against and I think that Danny Rills come in you know and had a positive impact and such a short space of time so yeah I think there will be more improvements to be made under them. Thank you James. We're going to talk Mary Earps next.

She made headlines over the weekend after extracts from her autobiography were released ahead of the book being published this week. She says in the book that she told Serena Vigman she was rewarding bad behaviour when Hannah Hampton was recalled to the squad after previously being dropped

for being disruptive and unreliable. Now, there's an extended interview of Mary Earps on the Women's Football Weekly on BBC Sounds that's available to download now. She has said, Rory, that she did not write her book to tear anyone down, and the reaction to it has been distorted. Can reaction be distorted to an autobiography? Yes, because if you're relying on excerpts, then the context can be, not twisted,

but slightly misrepresentative, I think. That is, I've not read the full book, so I'm not in a position to say whether Mary Ops is right or not. I think sometimes, maybe more frequently, what happens is that people don't fully understand, because why would you? Like, how a story that you tell in your own words in your head is perceived from the outside.

So it may well be that Mary Ops has been slightly surprised by how much of a storm that particular opinion has created, because it might seem, in her mind, a perfectly reasonable sentiment to express. You know, player is removed from a squad because of, you know, disruptive behaviour, whatever the form that takes. You then say to the manager,

this isn't a great idea of bringing her back. That seems, when you say it like that, like it doesn't seem that kind of earth-shattering, but because it's kind of an insight into the inter-Nesign politics of that incredibly successful England squad, and because it plays into this narrative, I think, that started in the summer

with Mary Earps and, and Millie Bright pulling out and retiring from international duty I think, yeah it's maybe not being misrepresented

but it's maybe been a larger impact than Mary Ops might have anticipated Shee, you've written an autobiography Oh nice chappers nice that'll plug there

Yeah You probably find it somewhere And it's called Any Given Saturday I'll have what you've done that Lovely Did you come up with I was between that

And 50 saves of Shea But I went with Any but they could only find 49 so I mean the reaction from us suggests you should have got with 50 shades now I interviewed Mary Upps last week for a podcast

and I think before she'd done any publicity for the book and I think it would be fair to say that sitting down for an interview she suddenly realized that she would not suddenly realize but it brought to the thought that she was now going to have to talk about what she had put in the book. And I think there is this thing with writing an autobiography, I'm guessing, where it's cathartic and you're telling these stories

and you're pointing them down on paper and you're explaining everything that's gone on in your life, and there's the book and then it's done, and then the realisation may hit that you're going to have to talk about what you've made public. Did you feel that? I mean, Rory's looking a bit puzzled of what I've just said there, but did you feel that at all?

Not really. I mean, I'd done a book a few years ago now. And I've done a full sort of media day around the book. And I was asked the question about Roy Keene or something. And the headlines the next day was Roy Keene has a funny side. My whole autobiography and it was like the headline was about someone totally different. So it's just so random where people can tick different things, you know. But yeah, I think when Mary's written this thing's down and she's,

She's obviously, she's got a bone to pick with Hannah Hampton. And when it's written down, it's in black and white then, isn't it? And then it feels like maybe she's scrambling around and maybe not backing it up. And she's saying things like, you know, she's getting rewarded for bad behavior in the squad and all that kind of stuff, you know. But, you know, Hannah Hampton is in the same position. And maybe that's why she retired from England and all that kind of stuff. I don't know. I mean, I don't know the history of most sort of goalkeepers unions.

I've been involved in it. I've got on really well together. and there was a respect between the goalkeepers that the manager picked the team even when you're competing because it is different to any other group you know and Dross and three other wingers you know it might be able to play on either right or the left

they might be used as a wingback or they might be tried out as a fullback whereas it's different isn't it you are in direct competition for one place but then again you know the coach the goalkeeping coach or whatever doesn't pick the team and Mary Earpson doesn't pick the team Han Hampton, it's the manager

so in a sense you know that's taken out of your hands in the sense you've got to do your best for the team you've got to show in the training ground every single day that you're the best goalkeeper and it's down to the manager it's not you know Hannah or Mary's decision

really so the goalkeepers unions I've been part of we've all really worked well together and got all well together but there is you know I think it was Al Munia wasn't it and Lehman at Arsenal for example they supposedly hated each other and I'm sure there's other examples as well but you know 95%

of the union is normally really strong together so I'm surprised that Mary's come out and said this The other thing that I find quite surprising about at Andros is this has come out whilst you know not retired not five years down the line

at the end of a career there's a risk in doing this when you are current I think when you're trying to sell a book it's obviously a lot easier to get the headlines, to get the sales when you are currently playing, if that makes sense. And when you're doing a book, you have to be controversial. The media's not going to pick up any quotes. I don't see any problem with what Mary Eurps has done. I don't see any problem with the reaction to what she said, to be honest. I think it is possible that Mary Epps

absolutely means the stories as they were told and wasn't necessarily expecting the reaction. and so has tried to kind of shape that a little bit because, yeah, the stories, as you see them, might not be the same as the general public sees them. And also you have to remember that Hannah Hampton has had quite a good year. People quite like Hannah Hampton. She was the hero of the Euros win. So it's a strange time to pick a fight with her. It's honest.

As a former ghost, Andros, I wouldn't say you have to be controversial. If that's what's putting you off doing it, then you don't have to be controversial at all. it's about Would you double Would you, as a ghost, would you double, quite like this image now, would you double check

that, you know, would you get, are you sure you want to put this in? Or would you just say, blest me, this is good, I won't double check, I'll just stick it in. This is an interesting moment for me,

Chappas, because I've been doing this show for more than 10 years and this is the first time I get to talk about something I actually know about. It's a real privilege. Well, no, you do, you do the,

coaching of your lads team as well yeah that's true yeah I do a bit of a bit of under age coaching as well a bit of commentary around that he made a rate save this weekend was he in goal he was he was he was meant to be

full full stretch I know but sometimes at that age they make a good save if they're left back because they kind of forget what position they're meant to be in is there to be saved no so I've done a few ghosting jobs and always really

enjoy it and part of it is trying to coax out of the subject the interesting stories. And they're not necessarily controversial, but they're the things that kind of offer an insight into what it is to be a football or to be a manager. But I think part of that relationship is you have a responsibility to that person. So I did, I did Rafa Benitez's book. And a lot of that was kind of trying to persuade Raffa that the things that he thought were quite boring might be quite interesting to other people because to him the kind of the day-to-day of it isn't nearly as interesting as like the zonal marking scheme but I was much more concerned about the kind of the day-to-day

the emotional impacts of it than where he put Jamie Carragher and then I did a couple years ago I did Micah's and because I've known Micah for a long time and because despite his betrayal of the Monday night club I quite like it I felt a bit more of a kind of duty of care to him to say you need to think about having this in and was one story that he told me that would have been like headline news and as a journalist as part of you thinking you've got to put that in because that is the thing that you will sell books on and Mike who was uncomfortable with it and in the end we decided not to put it in and what was that story of breaking news that I am not going to tell that story oh god that is I signed

a contract no and it's I think you do have a little bit of a responsibility to the to the player and I don't know who ghosted Mary Ops's book or or even if she had a girl she might have written her but I would imagine during that process if there was anything that she felt uneasy about, I think any decent ghost would say, do you, it's brilliant describing yourself as a ghost, I'm really enjoying this.

Halloween's over, Halloween's over. Any decent ghost would say, are you sure you won't be haunted by this? Sorry. I would say like if you're uncomfortable with this then maybe we need to think about it. And I would, like it's her book. She gets

final say as to what goes in. You can't say, well, journalistically, this is the best thing to put in. It's up to them. It's their memoir. It's their autobiography. They get the final say. That's it for the Monday Night Club.

Thanks, Andros Shea and Rory. You can search for the Women's Football Weekly on BBC Sounds to find that interview with Mary Earp, speaking more about the release of her new book. He scored goals, lifted trophies and broken records along the way. It's a day to remember for Wayne Rooney. And now, he's a day to remember for Wayne Rooney.

He's got a podcast. Welcome to the Wayne Rooney show. Wayne Rooney, Kay Curd, and me, Kelly Summers, break down the biggest stories in the Premier League and beyond. Plus, we'll hear the funniest, wildest and most outrageous stories from Wayne's career. I've never seen the manager go with someone like he did. No way someone's getting in. You just feel like saying, come on, leave him now.

There's no way could have played for Man United ever again. The Wayne Rooney show, listen on BBC Sounds.