Football Daily - Monday Night Club: The tale of two keepers

Episode Date: April 14, 2025

Steve Crossman is alongside Chris Sutton, former England captain Steph Houghton, and The Athletic’s Adam Crafton discuss whether Ruben Amorim’s call to drop Andre Onana backfired after Altay Bayindir’s performance in Manchester United’s loss at Newcastle.Do Liverpool really need a succession plan for their goalkeeper Allison? Giorgi Mamardashvili is joining the club from Valencia this summer, and will a right back follow him through the door? Or do Arne Slot’s side recruit from within after the emergence of Conor Bradley?Have Arsenal regressed this season? The Gunners have dropped 16 points from winning positions this campaign - which is just one fewer than they have in the last two seasons combined.Plus, why is Real Madrid midfielder Luka Modric buying a minority stake in Swansea City? BBC Wales football reporter Chris Wathan has all the details.BBC Sounds / 5 Live commentaries this weekend: Tues 2000 Champions League Aston Villa v PSG Weds 2000 Champions League Real Madrid v Arsenal Thurs 2000 Manchester United v Lyon Sat 1200 *5 Sports Extra* WSL West Ham v Manchester United Sat 1230 Women's Champions League Arsenal v Lyon Sat 1500 Premier League Everton v Manchester City Sat 1730 Premier League Aston Villa v Newcastle Sun 1400 Premier League Arsenal v Lyon Sun 1400 *5 Sports Extra* Premier League Manchester United v Wolves Sun 1400 *BBC Sport app & website* Premier League Fulham v Chelsea Sun 1630 Premier League Leicester v Liverpool

BBC Sounds music radio podcasts. This is Five Live Sports. The Monday Nightclub with Steve Crossman. Listen on BBC Sounds. Welcome to the Monday Nightclub. Step Horton, former England captains with me in studio. Hello. Hi.

I'm good. How are you? Yeah, good. Excellent. We've got Chris Sutton. We've got Adam Craften from The Athletic as well. Hello fellas. Hello. Hello Steve. Hello. Hi. I'm good. How are you? Yeah, good. Excellent. We've got Chris Sutton.

We've got Adam Crafton from The Athletic as well. Hello, fellas. Hello. Hello, Steve. Hello. Quick, join a little quiz question to get us going tonight. Adam, for you. All right.

So it's not that difficult. Who tweeted, and I promise I'll stop going on about the golf soon, who tweeted last night, the Masters is a wonderful listen on Five Live Sport. First class team in Augusta. Clue, their previous tweet, Rangers have broken the world record for celebrating a draw. Oh, could it begin with Chris and end in Sutton? I don't know, would it begin with Chris and end in Sutton?

Well, it might do, yeah. I think so, Steve. Which tweet did you like the best think so, Steve. Which one, which, which tweet did you like the best? Definitely the five live golf one, because it's one that I'm allowed to get involved in wholeheartedly, you see. I don't have to stay clear of it. We're going to start with Manchester United. Ruben Amerim dropped Andrea Nana for their game at Newcastle on Sunday. The idea being to allow him to rest and disconnect. So Alte Bayende came in for his Premier League start, first Premier League start.

I think it backfired, Chris, didn't it? Yeah, I think so. I don't have a problem with goalkeepers being dropped or rested. I don't see really why they should be any different to any other player in that respect. We know that it's not the norm. In many ways, look, I mean it's up to Ambrim what he wants to do of course, but taking him out of the firing line, I'm not so sure that was such a good thing. Byinda had a nightmare, but the whole principle of dropping a goalkeeper,

I don't have an issue with. I mean, we'll find out on Thursday whether it's done any good or not, won't we? I think it's probably created more stir around Inana rather than actually, like, he said it was a bit of a disconnect, but ultimately, everybody's gonna be waiting for that team sheet on Thursday,

whether he's gonna perform. I mean, I think he's performed quite well in the Premier League. I mean, he's had a lot of errors, but at the same time I feel as though that could be a team thing rather than just him. But, unto me, I think as a player, you wanna play as many games as you possibly can.

I don't think this would be any different, but I do feel as though this has created a bit more of a stir by taking them out of the team. It's not as if Man United are in good form in the Premier League. They need to get points and they need to play against, play well ahead of Thursday. And yeah, I think it's put, I'm running even more pressure than he is now. Adam, is it an issue regardless or is it only an issue because Manchester United lost 4-1 and Bayern did not play particularly well?

Do you think the result would have been so different if Inana had played yesterday? Might have been 6-1. Might have been 6-1, Chris says. Bayern did make a mistake, what was it, for the third or fourth goal, wherever he kicks, it's a poor pass. I thought apart from that, I didn't think he was particularly bad. I don't think he cost Manchester United that game. They were just beaten by a team that played much better than them in the second half in

particular. So I think Anana, it's not just been yesterday, it's kind of just been this week-long soap opera from the moment that he said what he said about Leon that Man United were way better. And you kind of knew from that moment on that something was going to happen in the game between Manchester United and Leon, that either he was going to be absolutely brilliant or he was going to become the story for the wrong reasons. And unfortunately, that's what happened. I think over the course of his two seasons

at Manchester United, he has cost the team a lot of points in Europe in particular. I mean, his Champions League campaign last season was really poor. And this season again, he's not been that convincing in the league he's been a bit better but you know if you're looking at you wanted someone to be an upgrade from what David de Gea was not saying de Gea was brilliant in his last season at all but Anana has not been what

Manchester United hoped he would be so far. Chris would you play him on Thursday then? Well I would, if I was Ruben Ambram, I would play who I thought was the better goalkeeper at this moment in time. And, you know, I mean there is going to be all the scrutiny on him because, you know, how will he cope after being left out for his own good? You know, how is he going to, you know, his last touch cost Manchester United a goal in Lyon, so it was an enormous game for him. But clearly it's a big decision for Amriem to make. But I can't see him picking by end or after. I know what Adam says, it was one error, but it was a bad old error.

Can I just ask you guys, as people who have actually played the game at an incredibly high level, what's it like? Not in goal though. You could have just said can I ask Chris and Steph but not taken. Well exactly. I was going to say you've tried at centre-back to be fair Chris, so you have an understanding of that part of the pitch. Nice compliment. So you have an understanding of that part of the pitch. What's it like when you aren't that confident

in the goalkeeper behind you? Does the team feel it? Are you feeling supportive or are you thinking, God, can you just get his act together? It's a bit of a loaded question, to be honest. I don't want to throw any of my ex-teammates under the bus as well. I think it's hard. I think obviously I played centre half all of my career and I think you have a certain relationship with a goalkeeper.

I get what Chris is saying. Goalkeepers, a lot of them do rotate in certain competitions, whether it's in a cup competition, but there's always kind of in them league positions, there's always a goalkeeper that starts. That's generally how it's been. That is just what's been happening for the last however many years in football. But I'm a bit conscious when you keep rotating the keeper as a centre half, and that's just me personally. I think sometimes you have a relationship,

but I think mistakes do happen, and obviously goalkeepers get punished for them mistakes. And I think for me personally, it was always about trying to build confidence and look, you know yourself when you've made a mistake and I think that's the biggest thing for me. I think this whole thing about Anana is, it's a bit weird in my opinion.

I think for me, like, you need to back your goalkeeper in this instance because like you guys said, it's not as if he's got a really top level goalkeeper that's kind of fighting him for competition. He's got all this experience, he's speaking about the game here, there's just no comparison at the moment.

There's just nothing that would go okay, which is the better of the two keepers because De Gea is by far the best keeper that United have had for a long, long time. So for me, I think it's hard for a manager to manage that kind of situation, but I honestly do think he'll play on Thursday, if I'm being honest.

I think Inano will be in net. I think he has to go with his experience. And unfortunately, that is the situation that Manchester United in at the moment in time. You know, he caused himself a problem with it, you know, with the comment, didn't he? And, you know, got massive egg on his face. I think in terms of, you know,

all the way through the Manchester United team, there's a lack of confidence, a lack of belief. So we can pinpoint Inana, but it is all the back of what he said. There's been worse players at Manchester United than Inana this season, but he may feel that he doesn't have that sort of confidence and connection with the three centre-halves in front of him. And I think that the consistency of our, or continuity in terms of players playing in front of him and you have that understanding of where they're going to move and how they're going to move and trust in them when he's popping the ball out.

I think that that is really important, but poor old Ruben Amerim, week in and week out he's probably thinking, who do I select? We're below par, we've been below par for a while now. Within every game it's a struggle know, it is a big issue. He'll be hoping that his decision to rest in Onana will, you know, will be one which pays off. But I think we're all sitting there thinking, not quite certain what's going to happen on Thursday night. And that's, that's been the issue of Manchester United all season. Are you willing to say then, Chris, who you think has underperformed more than Onana for Manchester United? You could say that most of the players are pretty much on par with him. Who's performed

well for Manchester United this season? Bruno Fernand times, but you wouldn't be saying the rest of them have done themselves too many favours. That's the issue and it's a big summer for Ruben Ambrim. But I think regardless of just the game against Lyon, which is massive, I think regardless of just the game against Leon, which is massive, I think it's a big end to the season for Ruben Ambrim and Manchester United because at the start of the next season, if they continue their poor form at the start of the season, he's not going to have a lot of credit in the bank if they get off to a poor start. I agree, Chris. I think you look at that squad and they are not Ruben Amaran players I think in terms of the system and he's been there so much kind of speak about how he's gonna play and ultimately he's not gonna change the

way he's wanting to play. He's gonna play that 3-4-3 system and he wants them wingbacks getting up as much as possible and I do feel as though I agree with you Chris in terms of Dalhau. I think he's had a good season I think he's consistent you kind of know what you're gonna get from him. And I think even yesterday, Barnes' second goal, I think there's nothing the keeper can do with that. I think he's ran, took it from midfield, took it out wide, brought it inside,

and not one Manchester United player can get anywhere near him. So I think in that kind of team setup, the system, I think there's a lot of things that could be worked on. And I think Anand has probably been outed and rightly so for his errors, I think, when they are that costly to a team that you're winning with two minutes to go in Lyon

and you're gonna bring the game back to Manchester at Old Trafford and give yourself a chance then. Of course, that criticism's there with a club that is Manchester United, but it's a massive summer for Amarin. I think he'll want to spend, he'll want to get the players that he needs in to fill them specific positions. We're speaking about three centre backs, they are specific centre backs that can do a bit of everything.

They can bring the ball out, they can defend in the wide channels, they can defend centrally and they're tough positions to kind of fill without spending. You can't just not spend money, you have to go and spend money for the players that he wants to get. Can he spend Adam? I mean, you know, the FFP stuff, is it as simple as that? He said one or two big players, didn't he? That's what he said the summer would be about. Yeah, but what's a big player, you know, in value?

Is that a 40 million pound player? You don't get that much now for 40 million sometimes. Who was the centre back they signed last summer? Yoro, you're looking at close to 50 there. So I think from a summer point of view, I think a lot is going to depend on the next few weeks because if they get into the Champions League, the entire complexion of Manchester United changes from a club that won't be in Europe whatsoever to a club that has all that money that comes from the Champions League. If they don't win the Europa League and as they are currently trending, it's not impossible they finish 17 in the Premier League. You look at the table right now, what is

it, two or three points above Wolves? And actually, if they get through to the semi-finals, they're probably going to drop more points in the Premier League because they'll be building up for these big games in Europe as well. Now, even between 17th in the table and 13th, there is an £11 million difference in terms of the merit payments that you get for finishing in those positions. Now, that's pretty much the savings that Man United were trying to make from the latest wave of redundancies. So that would be swept away straight away. So really, it's going to come down to what they do in Europe this season. If they get back in the Champions League, for sure they've got money to spend. If not, they are going to have to sell to buy in a really, really significant way. And that's why,

you know, people keep, keep kind of mocking when United players leave the club on loan and do well. But actually someone like Anthony doing well at Real Betis or Rashford doing a little bit better at Aston Villa is exactly what Man United need to happen because they're going to need to cash in on some of these players. I just think Chris, that's where Ohnana is so interesting is that because they haven't got or unless they get in the Champions League, they're not necessarily going to have an absolute tons and tons of money to spend. Amorim said one or two, so you can read that into a couple of players in big positions and people might say they need a centre forward, people might well say and do say they need a central

midfielder. So if O'Nanagh is safe in that sense from a goalkeeper, why do this? Why have this kind of... And obviously it's a story that's got out as well. They've tried to handle O'Nanagh being dropped in a very sort of PR savvy way and I'm just not sure it's quite landed. What can they say really though Steve? Nothing? But then to say nothing and then we'd all come up with our own sort of idea on why they left him out and say that he's dropped. It was a big call and we've all talked about why we think he made that call to take him out of the firing line, but he would have had his own reasons

and feel for that. And you know, Amram has been in, look, he's a young manager, but he's still been in management long enough to understand the risk involved. He felt it was the right thing to do. And look, we'll find out on Thursday night, if you know, Anana comes back and he has that he has that sort of demeanor where you know he struts his stuff and you know he on the outside he's brash and and confident and you know let's see what he does on Thursday. He never should have got involved with the you know with the stuff about saying that Manchester United were you know a much better side than Leon.

That was, you're just setting yourself up for a fall. And for Manchester United players to, you know, put their head above the parapet, you know, with stuff like that this season, when they've been absolutely bang average, it was really, really odd. Yeah, I think that just a little bit less talk and a little bit kind of doing what you need to do on the pitches. Probably the right way to go about it. Obviously, Matich's comments probably got into his head

a little bit as well. There's no way that he could hide from what he said. But ultimately, I think for me psychologically, for Leon coming to Old Trafford on Thursday night, I think as an opposition, if Onana's in goal, then I think they'll be so if O'Nan is in goal, then I think they'll be so positive with taking shots, taking chances, and this is why it's just a bit of a weird situation because ultimately I get hammering in terms of being a kind of

that human element of trying to protect the keeper, trying to protect him as much as possible and giving a bit of rest to kind of mentally kind of get back into the game. But ultimately that kind of would, if that was me and I was going to be playing against Manchester United on Thursday in a Europa League game, then it's like, you'd be like, okay, as much as you can take a shot at him, put him under pressure from corners, whatever that might be. And that psychological element probably lies at advantage with Leon at this moment in time. Shoot from kickoff. That's what I'd do.

Shoot from kick off? Yeah, but have a pop. Do they still, you've been in a dressing room most recently Steph, do they still put up opposition quotes on the wall, do they stick them up or is it handled slightly differently these days? Not for a long time but I think with social, yeah it's a big like air free piece of paper but no I think with social media you can't hide from that now, I think even social, yeah it's a big like ear-free piece of paper but no I think with social media you can't hide from that now I think even if you're trying your best not

to look it gets out somehow and you hear it whether it's on the radio or on Instagram or whatever or even one of the girls would just say something and just try and wind you up so there's no way you can hide from it to be honest. Have you ever done that Chris? Well we had a game at Celtic against my old club Blackburn where we beat Blackburn Rovers 1-0 in the UEFA Cup and Graham Souness and Blackburn actually played better on the night and Graham Souness said it was men against boys the game but I don't know whether that was a bit of a panto because he was ex-rangers managers but stupidly from his point of view they'd lost the game but I don't know whether that was a bit of a panto because he was ex-rangers, managers, but stupidly from his point of view they'd lost the game 1-0 and when we went down to Blackburn, I think it was, I don't know where the story came from that we'd pinned

up on the dressing room wall at Blackburn, Sue Ness' comments, men against boys, that never was the case. I think from, although that story's been around for a long time, from a sort of player's perspective, we were just disappointed with our own performance that particular night and wanted to put it right ourselves. But I think you do, I think it's sort of human nature that you do want people to get egg on the face if they say stupid things. And that was certainly the case with Suvnash. But you can use that as motivation. That's not the worst thing. It's whatever floats your boat, whatever motivates you, then that's not a bad thing. But you know, Anana saying that stuff, I don't know the

Lyon players, but I'm sure they would feel that they really want to put one over on him. That's sport, isn't it? I don't know if you noticed, Steph, when you walked into the studio, but there is a little sign blue tacked up which just says, Chris Sutton says you're a poor man's Mark Chapman. So that's what I read when I walk into the... Had to build his energy up when I came in as well. Yeah, yeah, I was really down, Chris. You really affected me.

Not for the first time. We'll be back very shortly to talk about Alisson's heroics for Liverpool with a new goalkeeper arriving in the summer. Have Arsenal taken a step backwards this season? And why is Luka Modric buying into Swansea City? Weekly is back. And we've added five more WSL trophies to the team. From the biggest talking points in the women's game to hearing from the biggest names. To have a little dip in the road is absolutely normal

and I think that makes the environment a lot healthier. The club have been amazing, the girls have been amazing. I've been in the women's game for a long time now so I know a lot of faces. The Women's Football Weekly podcast drops every Tuesday. Listen now on BBC sounds. This is Five Live Sports. The Monday nightclub with Steve Crossman. Listen on BBC sounds. Let's keep it with goalkeepers. Alisson, brilliant for Liverpool on Sunday, back from injury, keeping them firmly on course for the Premier League title. They beat West Ham 2-1, Virgil van Dijk scored a really late goal. Actually

they could be champions by close of play on Sunday. Whatever happens it's in the post. Arna slot said after the match, the second half was just all about Alisson. They could have scored two or three in two or three moments like when Fulham did. Today we were just lucky that Alisson saved us a few times. It's quite interesting, Adam, because it's sort of the opposite situation to Manchester United. Liverpool do have a succession plan for Alisson. They've got Mamadou Shvili coming in from Valencia in the summer. Alisson's contract is up in 2027. They just don't look like they'll need the succession plan anytime soon. No, I mean, he some injuries doesn't he? Probably more so than some of the other leading

goalkeepers you'd say, but when he's fit he is the best in the world you'd probably say at the moment and some of the saves yesterday were incredible. I thought they really missed him, although Kelleher has been sort of dependable and good when he's come in, I thought in the Cup final against Newcastle, I think Liverpool struggled without him in terms of how they build up, build out from the back, how they play. Even the Dan Burn header, I think Alisson might have saved, to be honest. A bit harsh maybe. You're not that sure then?

What was that, sorry? You're not that sure he would have saved. to be honest, a bit harsh maybe. You're not that sure then? What's that, sorry? You're not that sure he would have saved, you said might. He just remembered how big Dan Burn is and backtracked out. And what a great header. It was a great header, but I think maybe Alisson moves his feet a bit quicker

and has half a chance of saving that. But that's more a reflection of how brilliant I think he is more than anything. I think for me that experience counts for Liverpool. I think that is in times in this season where, especially these last few games when they haven't been on top form, I think you've obviously probably got a little bit of an eye on winning the league, which rightly so and they've maybe not performed as well. But I think Alisson has been a key player and not just this season for a number of years. I think you can't ever replicate that experience but also like them

players that can kind of stand up in big moments and yesterday was just another not perceived as probably a massive match for Liverpool but ultimately I think in the kind of grand scheme of things and like the way that the league's going to go that could be a massive important three points for Liverpool and like you said Steve if they can wrap they could of things and the way that the league's going to go, that could be a massive, important three points for Liverpool. And like you said, Steve, if they can potentially wrap it up on Sunday, which a big three points could be the difference of getting it done earlier than later. They're limping over the line Liverpool, aren't they? It's a shame for the Premier League

that Arsenal haven't put them under greater pressure. Their recent run, Arsenal, hasn't. They've been dropping points left, right and centre. But as both Steph and Adam have said, there's nothing surprising about Alisson, though. I mean, we've become to expect that. I actually think Kelleher has been a brilliant backup for him. I do agree with, I don't know whether this is Adam's point, but... Let's make it Adam's point. Yeah, but you get to a cup final, you play your best goalkeeper. I do think that. I never understand why managers don't do that. You've got a chance of winning silver, why on earth

Kelleher the good goalkeeper, which he is. Why on earth wouldn't you play your number one in that situation? I've never, ever understood that. But yeah, he's come good once again for them. Big saves, big moments. But as I said, we've come to expect that from Alisson. Another money question you, I'm afraid here, Adam, on the similar lines to what we were just talking about with Manchester United. I think it's going to be really interesting to see the impact that the Mo Salah deal and the imminent Virgil van Dijk deal will have on what Liverpool can do this summer, because there's a lot of money. I mean, new contracts obviously different to signing plays, but there is a lot of money going out there for those two to stay.

And yet there's talk of Andy Robertson maybe being replaced at left back. Certainly there's a lot of talk about right back with Trent Alexander-Arnold expected to go. Central midfield. So do you think that is going to have a significant impact? I think it'll have an impact, but it's not to the extent of if you sign someone and then pay them that money on top as well.

There's no transfer fee for those players. What you do have is Liverpool didn't make that many signings last summer. So you're almost looking at two years of spending potentially moving into one summer. Now what Arna Sloc's done is kind of just exceeded and what the team's done is exceeded everyone's expectations. They're kind of well ahead of schedule. But I know that one of the things that Liverpool looked at when they hired Arna Sloc was actually how at final there were times where he lost players and had to replace them and had to reshape a team and reconstruct a team and build a new one. So I think that's a skill set we've not really had to see from him yet, but I think it's one that they factored

in when he came into the club, that he was someone that could deal with change. And I think how they move forward now is going to be fascinating because Trent Alexander-Arnold, who we now presume will leave, I think that's everyone's presumption now, how you reshape a Liverpool team. And if Robertson was to go as well, without those fullbacks that have been so, so key to when you think about this Liverpool team for the last five or six years or so as well. So that's going to be, I think we'll see a lot more about what Arnaut Slot's style really is next season. Will Do you think Chris that they have the answer at right back with Connor Bradley?

Chris Yeah I do. Came to the fore there were always question marks about him defensively. Everything which I've seen of Connor Bradley. Is he as good technically as Trent? Well, probably not, but how many players are in that position? He's on a different level to virtually everybody ability-wise. His ability to pass a ball long and short, Trent. But in terms of athleticism, Conor Bradley can still play. I think defensively, 1v1 situations, I'd say maybe he's better than Trent. I think that in that right-back position, I think Liverpool are well-cated for with everything I've seen from Conor Bradley. I think the left-back position is fascinating because you said you said Steve and the the

The sort of rumor about Andy Robertson having you know, maybe of having had his day at Liverpool. I'm not so sure simicasse is In a real top level. So I think that that's a position which Liverpool will be looking at and uh, and darling Darwin Nunes I think the centre forward, you know, he's, he's been quite critical, hasn't he, of Darwin Nunes? And while I think it's been massive for Liverpool to get the Saladil done and on the brink of the Van Dijk one, I do think that it's remarkable, Arna slot winning a Premier League, well they've got a little way to go yet, but they are going to win the Premier League with very little change.

But I do think that there's an element where this summer, it feels like there has to be a bit more freshening up of the squad and players to come in to really lift the players who are already there. I think I totally agree, Chris. I think once you win that league, and I think it's so important that you don't stand still, like Slots come in, he's taken over Klopp's players and he's done remarkably well, I think they've been so impressive this season but I think that

strength and depth, I think we spoke about the full back areas even though Connor Bradley can replace Trent if he does go, I think you still have to have somebody to back him up and maybe a different type of right back, I think Connor Bradley, like Chris described probably better than what I will, but he can do a bit of everything and he can one v one defend very well, he can join the attack and even though Mo Salah's signed a new contract, will he necessarily play

every game that he has done this season and produce that level? Potentially not, I think this is where I think Slott needs to be a little bit not, I think this is where I think slot needs to be a little bit clever and I think that number nine position, I think obviously my husband's a Liverpool supporter and he's not very keen on Darwin either. So I think they're all desperate for a new number nine

to come in and I think for me when you win things, it's not about just standing still and going okay. I think you take Man City off last season, they didn't sign Gundogan and they made some signs in January, but look where they are, they've underperformed this season because they didn't freshen up the squad. So I think generally that is the way that Liverpool will go over it and rightly so. I just wonder, Chris, whether Darwin Nunes is, there is a similar line there to what

we were talking about with Onana. And what I mean by that is he is who he is now. You know, you look at Onana, you know what he's going to do. Darwin Nunes is going to be inconsistent. He's going to do some brilliant things. He's going to miss some massive chances. That's just who he is. Isn't he's not going to change now or no? Um, no, I don't think he is going to change.

He's had long enough at Liverpool, but it's just, it's more about the public nature of the calling him out from on the slot, where, you know, he could have done it in the confines of a dressing room and kept his criticism under wraps. The fact that he's, I can't remember him calling out too many other Liverpool players, Steve this season, but for whatever reason he's singled him out. That, let's get it right, that doesn't bode well does it for Darwin Nunes. It is about, I still think that you have Darwin Nunes off the bench coming on for 25 minutes, 30 minutes, he's still a nuisance, but you're right.

You're not quite sure what you're going to get from him, but that's the whole point, isn't it? Arna Slocs, not quite certain what he's gonna get from him, especially in the art of goal scoring. So that's the issue. So he'll be looking for an upgrade there. I feel as though with Nunes, I feel as though he needs like a run of games,

but I think at this stage in the season and probably around Christmas when you've got Champions League big games every two or three days, I think slot coming out and seeing them comments, it says to me that he doesn't really have that 100% trust in him and he's trying to get him to have a reaction by saying them things and it's probably just not worked the way that he wanted to but I think Nunes is a striker that lives on confidence, lives on games but ultimately when you're fighting for a title and you know what works, the likes of Jota or Diaz playing in that nine, it's hard to change that. I want to talk about Arsenal. So Arsenal obviously drew with Brentford, they're now 13 points behind

Liverpool. So they're going to finish second again, you know, I'm not breaking any news there, they're going to finish second again. So'm not breaking any news there. They're going to finish second again. So two seasons ago, second five points off Manchester City. Last season, second two points off Manchester City. This season, second at the minute 13 points off Liverpool. So the big question, Chris, are Arsenal getting closer to a Premier League title or further away? It depends which way you look at it. I think the maximum points they can get this season is 81. I think last season was 89. I think the alarming that you're looking at Arsenal this season, the goals they've scored 57. I can't remember how many they got last season, but I think they're 30 odd down on last season.

So they haven't put up a challenge and a fight. And while you can think second place is okay, I think we all thought this was the season where Arsenal were going to really push for a title and that hasn't happened now. I mean, if Miquel Arteta wins the Champions League, it would have been a brilliant season. But if he if he doesn't win the Champions League and I'm not so sure they will, then I do think there'll be Arsenal fans thinking, well, do you know what? We have gone backwards this season in terms of a challenge in the Premier League. We have gone backwards this season in terms of a challenge in the Premier League and you know Mikel Arteta has been there a long time and that makes this summer crucial because last summer he could get away with not signing a striker because you know he talked about the goals coming from all

areas of the team but having Marino play as centre forward next season I don't think that's going to wash with the Arsenal support. Yeah definitely won't I don't think there's going to wash with the Arsenal support. Yeah, it definitely won't, I don't think. You're thinking when Saka gets injured, I think that was a big blow for Arsenal's title hopes automatically. I think you take his goals, you take his assists, but also the fear factor that he puts into defences when he's playing and he's playing on that right-hand side, I think that has been a big difference and obviously Havertz with his hamstring they've had key injuries to key players and ultimately that says a lot about the squad as well when you're having to play a midfielder as a nine, like there's no replacement as that nine. Obviously Jesus

did his ACL as well so you have hit a button lucky in injuries but you look at them players, you're not going to probably guarantee 20 plus goals per season. The only player that you are going to do that is with Saka and he nearly hits that target pretty much most of the time. So I think obviously he's kind of put all his focus on this Champions League game against Real Madrid and rightly so, especially after that first game at the Emirates where they were unbelievable in terms of the intensity, the aggression and what style of football that Arsenal play. But I think Chris is right in the sense of what happens if that doesn't go to plan? What do Arsenal fans think of where their season has gone, especially around Christmas time and when Liverpool are potentially

dipping in form, they've not really been there to kind of put more pressure on? Yeah, I completely agree. I think you can't discount the injuries as a factor. I know we always like to say, oh there's no excuses once you're at a certain level, but you know if Liverpool had lost Thala for two months, you know between January and March, then you can imagine what might have happened and also they lost Urda Garde earlier in the season as well, and obviously J. Zeus as well. But I still think if you look at the season as a whole, I think everyone would still say they would have had a better season if they'd have signed another forward in the summer, whether that's a wide player that scores goals from the wing or a centre forward,

however you want to say it, because you can get goals from across the forward line now in a way that maybe wasn't the case 10, 15 years ago. I think also when I've watched Arsenal this season, they have seemed too over-reliant on set pieces for me. Although it's been a big strength of theirs, there's been certain games I've watched them in where they need to score a goal and they would take so long at times over these set pieces, you know, whatever routines that it is that they've worked on, that it almost takes some of the intensity out of the games. It was what I thought was so impressive last week in Israel-Madrid, where that intensity was back. They were actually taking corners quicker and every set piece was a bit quicker as well and I think when they play at a higher tempo they are a scarier team to play against whereas some of these league games which they've drawn they've just been a bit a bit slow really

and I don't think they've really believed they could win this league since November December to be honest you know when you've watched them play, although Liverpool have actually dropped a decent amount of points. How can you measure that, Adam? How can you say that they haven't believed that since November, December? That, I don't know whether that's... What would you base that on? I think you can see it in the conviction with which a team plays, the intensity with which they play. How many times have we seen them in the Premier League

play with the intensity and speed that we saw against Real Madrid last week? But is that down to injuries? You mentioned Odegaard missing a large part of the start of the season, Saka out. Can we, you know, can we... But they had injuries against Real Madrid. Gabriel was out of that game. They still had Marino up front. It wasn't a perfect situation. I just felt like they went into that game thinking there's really a trophy on the line here in a way that when I saw them at Everton recently, saw them at Man United recently...

If they'd half a team, the old white flag was out at Everton. The old, we've given up, we're concentrating on Real Madrid. That was the Everton thing. Which is fair enough, surely, Chris, isn't it? Well, it is if you beat Real Madrid 3-0, for a couple of set pieces. It worked alright. That's the thing as well, I mean, like you've all said, if Arsenal win the Champions League, it's been a spectacular season because they'll have won the Champions League. But I sort of wonder, Steph, whether the answer

to the question is kind of somewhere within there, talking about Arsenal and a centre forward, because sometimes one signing one player can be transformational in of itself. So if Arsenal are a centre forward away from winning or coming incredibly close again to winning a Premier League title, then they are getting closer. So it's a question of whether that's the case or not. I think with a number nine, an out and out number nine who can cause, you look at Harlan for City, he came and within his first two seasons, the numbers that he hit was scary and them teams when Manchester City were coming against a low block, they were able to find

ways to get Harlan to score and I think that was the difference between the Real Madrid the other night for Arsenal. They had to play with intensity because it was a transitional game and Madrid commit so many bodies forward like Mbappe, Vinicius, Bellingham, Valverde from right back so like literally it's kind of like an attack v defense as soon as Arsenal win the ball, so the gaps were massively open. So whereas Arsenal in the Premier League, they come across, teams have figured them out in a sense of that they probably only have a few ways to score and I think if you can defensively sound, take Brentford on Saturday, I know that Arsenal didn't put out their strongest

team, but if you defensively resolute and you can get bodies behind the ball it's difficult without that number nine or without another winger that is like a sucker to be able to create some magic and in them spaces Arsenal struggle but I think a number nine for Arsenal this summer is priority without a doubt. Aston Villa have the big task of overturning a two-goal deficit against Paris Saint-Germain in the Champions League tomorrow night. Let's hear from Morgan Rogers, got their goal in Paris, they took the lead, ended up losing 3-1. Here he is. We're here for a reason, we deserve to be here. We've taken on any battle and opportunity that we've had in front of us this season, especially in this competition, and we've

won the games that we needed to to be where we are. So, yeah, you can maybe look and think our name and club probably don't deserve to be here, but that's not how we look at it at all. We look at the players in the group we've got and we think, yeah, we fully deserve to be here and we're fully competing and we want to keep going and keep pushing. The first leg, I think we gave a pretty good account of ourselves. Of course, there's details and areas that we want to improve on and learn from for the second leg, but ultimately we know what they're like. Now we've played them, we're kind of more comfortable in that sense of already playing them and this and we know there's a task at hand we know what we need to do but we're excited under the lights at home playing in this competition in the quarter

final there's not many places better to be and if anyone's going to turn it around it's going to be us and it's down to us and I think we're excited for that challenge we're looking forward to it we know it's going to be difficult we're not saying we're going to do it by any stretch of imagination but we're definitely going to give it we know it's going to be difficult. We're not saying we're going to do it by any stretch of imagination, but we're definitely going to give it a go and go out to win 100 per cent. Chris Morgan-Rodgers looks born to play in the Champions League, doesn't he? Yeah, he's probably been the best young player in the Premier League this season. He's been a real shining light. I've really enjoyed watching him. I'm looking forward to the game against PSG and

you think I was at the Bayern Munich game and the roof nearly came off the stadium when John Durant scored that brilliant goal. But I just, I can't, I can't see, I can't see how they will go through against PSG. I think PSG will win the Champions League. I think they are such a well-ballot. Well, it's not wow. I don't think it's a wow. We've all watched them play. All right, Frikey.

I think it is a wow. Do you really? Well, they've never won it, so yeah. Well, they've got rid of all the big hitters now. But they've been here a lot. They've been here a lot of times before, Chris. And Barcelona are looking incredibly strong. So I think it's a wow. Yeah.

But I don't see them not going through against Villa. They've got Ligue 1 wrapped up already, haven't they? So they can concentrate on the Champions League and they just ooze class and quality. What man? Aston Villa, 24-25% possession over in Paris, they're going to have to take the game to PSG. I think PSG quite enjoy teams who come at them with the pace and the quality they have in forward areas but they have they use class and I'm hoping Aston Villa can do it but yeah I think it might be a difficult one for them. Most people like to be wowed

out Steph. I know I thought that was an appropriate wow for Monday night club groups. Thanks very much, I appreciate it. It would be interesting if Villa get an early goal in terms of that dynamic I think being at home at Villa Park and I think Chris you mentioned that Bayern Munich game I think that's obviously historic in the sense of a big game at Villa Park and to kind of set their Champions League group stage alight really and I mean we talked about Morgan Rodgers, I think if Villarra are to do anything tomorrow night I think it's about them types of players, about people that really enjoy playing their football at the moment, he's full of confidence. But I think for me PSG are strong, they look like a together team whereas previously with

the likes of Mbappe there, it was kind of just about what he needed and what to try and get the best out of him. Whereas this is a team that is so brave by playing out pressing, committing bodies forward and that's what we've seen against Villa a week ago. They do have Adam, who I would say has probably been the well player in the Champions League this season, even above Rafinha in Kvitschekvaretskelia. Yeah, and I'm glad you said his name. I think we're all wowing that I got it right, to be honest. That's a wow moment. Absolutely. No, he's been really good. I mean, the other wing, a duet, has been sensational the last

few weeks in the Champions League as well. They just look really in control whenever you watch them play. There was a kind of probably a half hour period at Anfield where they were under a lot of pressure, but apart from that, it was one of the best performances I've seen against Liverpool over the last few years. They made Liverpool look like a poor team, which is in the first leg in particular, which is just really unusual to see that in a big Champions League tie. So, yeah, PSG, I completely get what Steph's saying about if Villa get an early goal, the crowd will be up.

When I watch PSG at the moment, I feel like there's enough composure and calmness in that team that they can actually, okay, we've got a goal down, we'll keep the ball through a bit, we'll calm things down and work our way back into it. What could be an amazing tie is then Arsenal against PSG in the semi-final as well, potentially. Or Real Madrid against PSG, as well potentially. Or they'll Madrid against PSG if that goes in a different way. So I'm not as confident as Chris that PSG will win the tournament just because I think sometimes you can almost peak too early in these tournaments and maybe they've done that. But Aston Villa, I think it's going to be really tough for them. But they'll have Watkins back right for this one. Yeah, they will. They will. Is Adam going to have a prediction for the tournament or is he just copping out then?

No, I'm just expressing scepticism about your predictions. That's better. That's fine. Many people do. I think Arsenal will win it, personally. No wow from Chris for that one. No wow. No, no, no, just ridiculous.

Is it? No sender forward Arsenal, but Declan writes a couple of free kicks in the final. It's like another type of wow. Do you know what? Set piece, they were set piece Arsenal 20 minutes ago, now they're going to win the Champions League. I would just always back a team that can defend in these big, you know, these over two legs every L time for the season.

Well, Kivio looked all right the other day, didn't he? He might be back for the final. Can I just say that? And I won't say who, I won't say who. I can say a former Premier League player, because I work with loads of them. A former Premier League player that I work with said to me the other day, the second Declan Rice free kick was genuinely amazing. The first one quote, give me five goes and I reckon I could do it. So there you go. Wow. Wow. Indeed. I don't think you would be able to. You can't name that player. No, I don't. You can't. Yes, you do. No, I don't.

Yes, you absolutely do.. No I don't. Yes you do. No I don't. Yes you absolutely do. No I don't. Come on Steve. No I don't. I think Jo Hart might have been able to do that. Come on now. I'm just going to introduce a guest now. I'm not going to do the story until afterwards because it's just too good. Welcome to the Monday Night Club, BBC Radio Wales football reporter Chris Watham. Chris, lovely to have you with us Hello, Steve. Good evening everybody. Good evening. Um I'm just gonna do it. All right. You ready Steph? Yeah, I'm gonna do it Is Luca Modric about to buy some of Swansea City Chris? Yes

co-owner Minority investor Luca Modric. I think he might have a chance of emulating that Declan for a rice free kick by the way But no, he's not going to play at Swansea. I think he still fancies chance of emulating that Declan Rice free kick by the way. But no, he's not going to play at Swansea. I think he still fancies his chance of getting in the side at Real and a certain World Cup next summer. But yeah, Steve, it's as bizarre if you want as it sounds, as astonishing as it sounds. And this is from a patch where I've covered Ryan Reynolds buying Wrexham.

So yeah, it's caught a lot of us off guard, I'll be honest with you. And I think the club are quite surprised and quite happy. It hadn't leaked before today. As you put it, Luka Modric has bought a very small stake in Swansea City. Chances are we won't know how much money he will have put into the club. And to be frank, it's not about the money from the club's point of view. It's about the fact they can tap into Luka Modric's experience. He's looking at life after football, he's already got some business interests and he clearly wants to get into football ownership and I think this is a chance to perhaps whet the appetite.

So, I'll just throw in here that I started my career in Swansea and I love Swansea, but still I'm going to ask why? Very good question and I look forward to trying to pin down Luke Modric and ask him the very same thing. Look, you know, as you mentioned, Rexam, we keep on asking why Rexam. What I understand is that Swansea's ownership group have been working on Attracting someone of modric's ilk for some while and this opportunity came up. They didn't want to go down the celebrity route per se I think they wanted someone with real football coups with someone who can

Create a real buzz that perhaps could create interest for future investors that could Persuade a signing to come apparently Apparently the training ground is already abuzz when you think that Luca Modric might be paying a visit. Might not be anytime soon. Season to finish with Real, of course. This is about what he can bring. And look, it's become quite de rigueur. And I don't know if you guys will know, you know,

Kylian Mbappe has invested in Cannes in the French second division. And we've seen Fabregas and Henri get involved in Como will know, you know, Kylian Mbappe is invested in Kahn in the French second division and we've seen Fabregas and Henri get involved in Como in Italy. It's perhaps, it's a, it's an easier route than management perhaps for footballers to spend their downtime. I don't know, that is a really, you know, key and intriguing question and hopefully we'll get the chance. There's no why Swansea have done it. It's obvious. They get to associate with Luka Modric and his 37.2 million Instagram followers, also him holding a Swansea City ball and saying that he's joined the club. Is there any chance as he gets towards the end of his career that he does a season at

South Wales? Well, I think you'll know better than I do, that I think he wants to stay on at Real, even though he's out of contract. He's got a World Cup to think about. Look, the Gower is lovely, as Steve will tell you, but whether it is more attractive than a move elsewhere before the World Cup, we'll have to see. And plus he has to get Joe Allen up the side, you know,

so that's another thing to get there. Chris, lovely to have you with us. Thank you very much for that. Thanks all. Great stuff. Chris Watham from BBC Radio Wales. Just remains for me to ask Chris, did you never consider investing in a club? Don't be stupid, Steve. That's a great way to part ways that Chris. Cheers. I find this whole Modera thing, I mean, this caught me completely by surprise. I mean, that whole sort of, you put it well, why Swansea, Steve?

You just didn't come out and say it like that. But that, you know, it does. It's great for Swansea. But what you know, what's what's the connection there? Has he ever played against Swansea, do you think? When he was a child? Well, they had one season in Europe. They had one season in Europe, didn't they?

Because they won the League Cup. But I don't remember that happening. Has he ever has he has he ever just flown into Swansea? Does Swansea have an airport? Just to visit the... no well I think it's Cardiff isn't it so... has he ever flown Ryanair into Cardiff and then got the train to Swansea? All right, investing in an airline are we? Right that's it for the Monday Night Club, Big thank you to Chris, Steph and Adam. Subscribe to The Football Daily to get a notification every time we upload a new episode. Jose Mourinho

speaks to us in How to Win the Champions League, there's the Women's Football Weekly with Ben Haynes and reaction to Tuesday's Champions League quarter-finals. As always, thank you so much for listening. Premier League titles, six league cups, three FA Cups, one Champions League. And they're four for E! And more than a hundred charges. Somebody turned up at the Etihad Stadium and effectively served papers. I'm Clive Myrie and this is Football on Trial, the Manchester City charges. They believe they've got irrefutable evidence.

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