Football Daily - PL Review: Manchester City win controversial derby

Episode Date: September 13, 2026

Rick Edwards, Luke Edwards and Charlie Austin discuss the latest Premier League weekend.Manchester City edged out Manchester United to stay perfect in the Premier League - but should Erling Haaland's winner have stood? Michael Carrick's side have questions to answer after they struggled against 10 men after Phil Foden's red card. Arsenal made it 4 out of 4 thanks to Bruno Guimaraes' stunning goal, and a very provocative celebration. Spurs still can't score, is pressure mounting on Roberto De Zerbi already? Coventry's tough start continues, but Hull and Ipswich are enjoying life back in the Premier League - so are some of the league's mainstays in trouble? Send your messages and voicenotes on WhatsApp to 08000 289 369.01:00 - VAR steals the headlines as City beat United in Manchester derby 14:10 - Arsenal battle to victory at Sunderland 21:50 - When will Spurs score a goal? 27:50 - Half-time teaser 28:59 - Can Coventry adapt after poor start? 34:06 - Hull continue to astound 37:29 - New-look Ipswich impressing

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Get more with BBC podcasts, wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows, like evil genius, good, bad billionaire, and You're Dead to Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon music subscription. Hello and welcome to the Premier League review. Plenty to get into, as always.

Joining me to break down the biggest talking points from the latest round of games, the Telegraph's Northern Football Writer, the Unthinking Man's Henry Winter. It's Luke Edwards and former Premier League striker, Charlie Austin. Hello, both, how are we? All good, mate, all good. I want to get straight into...

You're right, though, Luke. I was going to say I was all right, but then you started talking, so I didn't know what to do, and then it was really awkward, and now we've made it even more awkward. No, no, I'm all right, thanks. I'm sad, no, I'm a bit sad.

I'm so glad that we clear that. No, I want to clarify something because I was supposed to do the Great North Run today and couldn't tutor my foot in trouble. Bore off about your foot, mate, we get it. You've hurt your foot. You're not. They used to put them crutches, Luke, or not?

No, I'm off the crutches, mate. Progress. Are you in one of those stupid boots? Yes. Well, that suits you at least. Let's talk about the Manchester Derby, please. Much so I'd like to dwell on your foot. It was quite an odd game.

So 1-1-0 by Manchester City, 10-man Manchester City at Old Trafford. But I think some bizarre refereeing decisions, two main ones, which were both, well, yes, both critical. So let's start first of all with the winner. So it's originally disallowed for offside. And then that was overturned by VAR. and the Premier League match centre have said VAR deemed that while in an offside position, Fernandez didn't play the ball. So Enzo Fernandez launches himself to try and head the ball in

and narrowly doesn't make contact and then Harlan tucks it in at the back post. And Dale Johnson, who's our football issues guy at the BBC, said he would have to have been a judge to be impecc. an opponent to be offside. And I'm looking at that. And for the life of me, how is he not affecting Lissandro Marcese's trying to defend that? Like he's so clearly going for the ball

and so clearly nearly gets the ball. He just, he is interfering. He is impacting an opponent. I just, I don't know. Am I going mad, Charlie? No, mate, you're not going mad because he's flung his whole body at it to try to score a diving header.

He impacts Martinese, hence why he tries to come close. The bullet points that you've read and that come up and we see on the TV, Enzo Fernandez is in ticks three of the out of the four bullet points. So I don't really understand how it's not given as offside. It actually doesn't make sense. And this is the problem everybody has. There's no consistency. However, you can guarantee in two days' time,

the referees association is going to come out and apologize to Manchester United. and say we've got it wrong. I just don't, so Luke, I think, I think Charlie's probably right. I think we probably have got an apology in the post from whatever the referee's body is called these days. I don't quite get how VAR can look at that, and we're all looking at the same stuff,

because it just seems so sort of, so obvious that he's impacting an opponent, which is the phrase that they're, that they're interested in. I don't, yeah, I just, it just baffles me. There's a word that's coming to me and that's word is incompetence. It's, I think they got so hung up

on whether Harland was offside because that was slightly weird, wasn't it? Yes, absolutely it was. Because Harlan looks offside. Well, so the naked eye, you're just like, oh no, he's off, he's off. Yeah, he's off. I think he thought he was offside,

just like with the goal celebration. I think he thought he was. Yeah. So it's like it is human fallibility, and we talk about this all the time, about the technology is there, but if you have, humans are capable of making really bad decisions.

So I think they got so hung up on whether Harlem was offside. They then draw the line and dog whose foot's playing him on side, that they kind of lost everything else. And I totally agree with Charlie and yourself for once, Rick, is he's clearly impacting play. He's gone for the ball.

He's so clearly offside. Martinez would, have cleared the ball if Fernandez wasn't in front of him. Right. So he has to anticipate is Fernandez going to get a touch. Martinez then is drawn to Fernandez because he has to try and get the ball from him. So it impacts the play in every facet. They even zoomed in on Fernandez to see whether he'd handled the ball or whether he touched

it with his head, but then decided presumably because he'd not touched it that the goal was going to stand. Now, I don't know whether, talking about the human condition and fallibility. did the fact that VAR, and we're going to talk about this decision in a minute in more depth, but is the fact that VAR felt it might have made a mistake with the Fernandez Foden incident in which they didn't spot Fernandez booting Foden in the back and took no action, even though it still race. I don't know, but I think they got so sidetracked by whether Harlem was offside. It took forever.

It's one of those weird goals, Rick, where nobody seemed to know what was happening. I was watching it on television. Nobody seemed to know what was happening. Nobody knew why the goal was standing. Nobody knew why the goal wasn't standing. So it was complete and utter mess. And just there will be an apology to Manchester United. That is sure as day follows night, that is going to happen because it was the wrong decision.

I think they've already admitted privately it was wrong. So yeah, it's just a complete and utter mess. You'd be fewer if you're Manchester United forwards. But what I will add is that's not why you lost the Derby or certainly that's not why you didn't win the Derby. Yeah. Can we just, I get that, Chapson, totally. and we'll come on to the red card and that side of it and the goal. But I don't think we can allow VAR, we're going to because it's a big point.

But I don't think we should allow VAR and then moments to overshadow. Man United was poor this afternoon. Yes, Charlie, yes. Yeah. They was poor. And I said to you guys, I put it in the group. 70 odd minutes that they played against 10 men. I asked the question, they don't play with a number nine.

they've got 10 v 11 they don't have a number 9 Kunya is not a 9 he is a 10 or he plays wide he's never occupying the two centre halves or he drops in there's no danger going forward for me for Manchester United

like regardless of character likes Well down the middle there is on the wings to be fair Yes down the middle Rick but down the middle if you don't like CESCO well you're going to have to suck it up and play him and then out of the free it's either in Bremna or or Rashford pick up the two wide places

because I don't think you can play all three because neither of them are number nine's. Is it just then, Luke, that Carrick doesn't fancy Sesco? I think there's a body of evidence building up that he doesn't fancy him from the start. I mean, he says very nice things about him whenever he talks about him publicly,

but that's a typical manager's trick that a player is not in the team or you want to sell. I'm not saying they want to sell Sesco, by the way, but it's an old trick that you talk them up publicly. you say how good they are and how brilliant they are and how much you rate them.

I'm sure Charlie's come across that in his career countless times but it's very odd but they had one shot on target until midway through the second half after folding's sending off and then there's the win-Buemo chance really late on.

They were playing against 10 men. Cities control of that game with 10 men should embarrass Manchester United quite frankly because they were they weren't hurting them and they were also being passed through as well and like the gamesmanship in waiting the time and that turns you know it's Manchester knight were quite good first half okay they had chances in the first half I thought that period before

phodon got sent off I thought Manchester United were good but they lost their way again they ran out of ideas they ran out of steam and to play for that long against 10 men and then lose the game at home to a bit of rivals that is a that is a kick in the shins for Michael Carrick it's probably more than a kick in the shin to Michael Carrick that is that is going to cause people to really start to question the direction of travel there. He has said their start has been okay. I think those are the words he used last weekend. We're doing okay, we've done okay.

Well, that result, I think, changes that. I think that's a perception shifter. I really do. Let's talk about the sending off then. So after 23 minutes, Foden gets sent off for kicking out at Bruno Fernandez while he's on the floor. What the referee does not see, well, I guess he sees the initial foul from Bruno.

But then doesn't see Bruno then kick Foden, I mean, twice maybe? Once, once right up the Jaxie. Certainly once. Certainly one. The Jaxie. And that is why Foden reacts. And, you know, to my mind, yeah, it's really silly from Foden. And if you do that, you are really running a risk of getting sent off.

And I don't think he could have any complaints particularly. But the fact that Bruno does like, fouls him. boots him and gets him set off and escapes without any sort of punishment is just bizarre to me. Perfect crime, some would call it. What did you think, Charlie? Well, is that not a clear and obvious error

by the referee, first and foremost? Fernandez. No, that he missed the kick. The kick. So say he misses the kick, VR can see it, and that's a clear and obvious error. Yeah.

I'm not saying a red card, by the way. I'm just saying that the referee could have given him a yellow I'm not, I'm just saying, is that what the technology is there for? But that's why it's so clever from Fernandez. People would use another word to describe Fernandez as Rick did. I'm not, I don't think I'm telling tales. Don't think I'm telling tales. But Rick used a different word to describe Bruno Fernandez's behavior over that instant.

That's why it's clever, Charlie, isn't it? Like, you're, you know, there are old pro tricks, do you know what I mean? Absolutely. He's done him, Fodron, mentally and physically, and drew the reaction. is what's happened there, isn't it? He's gone away with it. Bruno has played the game and he's done it perfectly, right? Do you know what? As an ex-player looking on? Do you know,

do you know what disappointed me, chaps? The reaction, the reaction from other players. Now, I know it's what it is. It's a derby, you do whatever to try and get an advantage. But I just didn't like the reaction of the Man United players running towards him, running towards the ref

because they may have seen it. It was just, for me, that didn't sit well. I did think, I think that Umbermo chance right at the very end. It's such a good first touch. And it is a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a,

weak afoot. But I feel like he maybe, maybe should have done better. And I really enjoyed Michael Carrick's sort of home alone face reaction. I don't know if you saw that. Both, both hands to cheeks. It's perfect. But he knows that's pressure for him.

this is the thing with management, isn't it? You're stood there on the sidelines. He will know deep down, like we're saying about whether this has been a good start or a bad start. He will know that that result is going to shift the ground underneath him because that's what Derby defeats do. And the manner of it makes it even worse. So he's got a very, very expensive footballer,

a very, very talented footballer, one-on-one with the goalkeeper in the last minute of injury time to rescue a point. And it's a good save. But it's a good save, but it didn't look amazing. It's another one of those saves. I'm definitely making, I'm afraid. I knew.

It is, though, isn't it? It is. But it's at the right height. It's at the right height to save. I mean, it's not got great placement, and it's at that height that a goalkeeper can push it away. So it's a big, big miss, and those moments in football matches,

and in the story of a season, in the story of a managerial career, they're huge, and that was a big miss from MboreMov, certainly in the context of the match. Massif for Enzo Moreska, though, like a really, really big, big win, to cement what is a very good start to his career as city manager, Charlie.

Yeah, and even his reaction after the game, the way he ran to the fans. The camera didn't pan, so you couldn't actually see if he acknowledged Michael Carrick. But I think to him, that meant so much. They've just beat the neighbours. Like you said, Derby game. They've won one-nil. They've unbeaten start, four wins. Yes, they brought players in.

But you know what? The pressure is still on. And when he was at Man City previously, he was coach to Pep. So there was no pressure to him from the outside world. It was just he was back in Pepper. Now he's the man in charge. He's the face.

He's the person that has to answer the questions. And do you know what? He'll be delighted with the start. He's gone. It actually couldn't have gone any better. Let's be honest. Four out of four, they've winning the Champions League. And also, they've just beat their.

neighbours. This is completely bizarre, but you'd probably say that city are like the plucky underdogs in a title race. Because Arsenal looks so strong. You know what I mean, though? You kind of think... No. No, not having that. No, I'm not having a lucky underdogs.

There's nothing plucky underdoggy about Manchester City. I know. But you do know what I mean? Yeah, Arsenal are so strong and so they look so dogs. and obviously they won the title last year. They're the reigning chairman. I do know what you mean. We've got a good two horse race.

I think it's going to be a good battle between them. And I just cannot put Manchester City and underdogs in the same sentence. I'm sorry. I just can't have it. Sorry, Rick. Let's talk about Arsenal then from last night, Saturday night, two-nil winners at Sunderland. And the absolutely pivotal moment here was David Ryer's penalty save in the second half.

and let me tell you, I'm not saving that. It is water. You feel for Enzo Le Fay because you're like, that's a really good penalty. It's going right in the side netting. You've hit it well. And somehow David Riah has tipped it onto the post. Like when you, I don't know if you were watching, but I was watching it live. And I thought, oh, he's just hit the post because I couldn't quite believe that Raya would be able to

get there? It's a superb save, Charlie. Yeah, no, it's an unbelievable save, right? But, Rick, from experience for a player that's missed penalties, it doesn't matter if you've hit poor ones or good ones, the keep has done his job, and obviously he's saved, he's made an unbelievable save. I think now it's come to the point of where he is and where he's at. We cast our minds back to when Arsenal took him.

Everybody was questioning, really? Arsenal goalie, David Reyer. And the person he is now, from the start of his Arsenal career, he is so pivotal to that team. So pivotal. And I think that just shows the strength and depth they have. The goalkeeper, ultimately, let's be honest, if the penalty goes in,

that's a completely different game last night. Yeah. A completely different game. Then the goal to put Arsenal ahead is a lovely, it's a lovely strike from Gimmer-Rash. And obviously, his reaction as a former Newcastle captain to the Sunday. fans was world class

and I'm a complete sucker for that sort of needle and it's a funny needle isn't it? Because it's not like it's not like Gimmorice is popular with Newcastle fans. No, I mean I think he was taunted for

an overweight rat I think he was called. He said this in his on his Instagram post. I think he said it himself didn't he? The fat rat. Yeah, he said they know what they are. The fat rat wishes you a nice weekend. I mean,

Which is just, I mean, if you're going to give it, right, we've all been there as football supporters, you're in a stadium, you're goading somebody. Yeah. And then, you know, they ram your abuse back down your throat. Well, I mean, you did that in some of the most spectacular fashion I've ever seen because he's not adverse to a multifaceted goal celebration. So first of all, the goal is brilliant.

I think it comes 125 seconds after the Raya, say. So Raya goes off to celebrate with Mikhail Artetta, because, you know, that's the pivotal moment. And Charlie's right. if Sunderland scored there, as well as Sunderland were playing, I think it's a very good. Yeah, Sondon were good.

Yeah, really good. But the finish, I mean, it's incredible. I mean, it's like top corner, and then he runs off, and it's just like to have that, that, you know, the level of pettiness. Well, is it petty? I don't know if pettiness is the right word,

but he just runs around and calls them small. Like, runs past the entire away fans, calling them small, with a massive grin on his face, and then goes into the cup-teer celebration. It's a two-parter. It's two-parter. And then the Arsenal fans let him stand there celebrating audience.

So even when they get to him, they all just stand there pointing at him. And imagine being a Sunderland supporter, the rage, the absolute fury. That man is just provoked and that goal celebration. So he's not popular with Newcastle supporters. I think he'll get a bit of a rough reception actually when he comes back to Newcastle in November. But I think he reminded everyone of a black and white persuasion in the northeast. Yeah, he's quite a special player. and actually that was, from the Newcastle perspective, very, very funny.

And I think Southern sports, you know, to take it on the chin, to be honest. Yeah, yeah, it's all part of the fun, really. You must have done some wind-up celebrations in the past, Charlie? Oh, absolutely. Do you know when you come back to, Luke, when you say, that if you give it, you've got to take it. We've all been there as people that's watching the games and we've said certain things, and all of a sudden it comes back to bite you on the backside, right?

It happens. I'm awful, listen, I was centre forward, and you kind of feed off it. When they're getting after you, you kind of feed them. because you just think, I only need one chance, and then I'm giving it to you. And I think that just comes with it, and you kind of, you hope the chance comes. You can put the baller back in there.

And like I said, a couple of times you used to do it. Not even a couple of times. I was quite a lot, didn't you, Charlie? Admit it. Come on, you enjoyed goading supporters. Come on. Majority of the times, Luke, yeah, absolutely. And we talk about pettiness, right?

So this is where we're going with this one, chaps. So when I was at QPR and we beat Derby 1-0 in the playoff final, a few Derby players was upset. With you or just the team? No, the fact they lost, they didn't get promoted to the Premier League, etc. I think they're well within it. They're right to be upset. Yes, absolutely, Rick, right?

Absolutely. Fast forward to, I think it was 21, 22 season or 22, 23, whatever it was. QPR versus Derby. I crossed the ball in for Ilius Chair to score at the back post and turned around towards the Derby fans. was doing the dry your eyes celebration. And I didn't even score. That's how much you like the go, Charlie.

Yeah. So we can talk about pettiness, but I think I went to the extreme. Remember when we spoke about and you would have seen it, I failed the medical at Hull because of my knee. I did a year in the championship when we got promoted,

and then I scored a header against Hull, away and was doing the limp. That's almost better than the dry the eyes. That's almost better than the dry the eyes. That's good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a nice sort of, it's very personalized that one. Artetta, you know, he's always sort of moaning about something, isn't he?

He was very upset about the penalty. He said they decided to be really physical and very direct. And he says that kind of stuff with no sense of irony. And we had to overcome a situation that in my opinion was absolutely unacceptable at this level. I'm very worried and very sad because this can never be a penalty ever. I suspect there's not going to be a huge amount of sympathy for Artetta on this. I don't know. I just sort of, I, you look back at the replay and went, well, yeah, it's not,

if it doesn't get given, I'm not sort of shying at the TV when it is given. I'm not really shunning at the TV. It's just one of those, really. It's just one of one of his unacceptable disgrace rants, isn't it? And it's why, it's why opposition supporters find him very, very irritating and boardline intolerable. you know, the fact, the fact it's just a language he uses. It's a, it's a, probably a 50-50 call.

I've some see. Yeah, that's what I mean. It's a judo fro. But Arsenal have got away with grappling, holding, blocking, just shut up about it. Also, you've won, and it's so apparently he was saved. You don't need to say anything about it. Yeah, save the rants. Like, save the histrionics.

And, yeah, I agree. And that irritated me as well, because they said, we have praised them through gritted teeth, some people, but they are the masters of the dark arts. That is what they, that it was a big part of their success under him. And then he bleats and moans like that. And he got books of wandering out of his technical area at Sunderland. And that's about time that happened as well.

And then he was sarcastically like turning round to the fourth official saying, oh, tick in your box, tick in your box, write it in your report. He wanders up and down the touchline, like the rules don't apply to him and has done it for years and years and years. He finally gets quite rightly a yellow card for it and he whinges and moans about that. So Arsenal were brilliant. They prove that they can be street fighters as well. I mean, I was really full of admiration for them. I asked Luke and Clinton last week when Arsenal were first dropped points.

And this week, I think I'm asking, when are Spurs going to score their first goal? What do you reckon, Luke? I'm going to go. I think the way Villa are, they got Aston Villa up next, haven't they? Yeah. I'm going to go. I'm going to say I'm going to predict they're going to score a goal against Aston Villa,

but still lose. That stinks, right? That stinks of a bore nil-nil. Honestly. When are they scoring their first? When are they scoring their first goal then, Charlie? Honestly, mate, I really don't know because I look through their team and you go, do you know what?

When they score their first goal, it would probably be an own goal. But when you look through their team, tell me anybody that has attacking prowess in the 18-yard box. You say the final third, but until you get to the 18-yard box, say I've got nobody that screams double figures. They just don't. So for me, you look at it and you go... Well, you sort of think, if Solanke, and this is obviously a massive if,

if Salanki could stay fit, he'd get double figures for you. If you were starting week in, week out... Yes, but the biggest issue, Rick, is you've got to stay fit. And that's... Listen, as someone that's a struggle with injuries, sometimes... You don't remember the limp. It's out of your hands, right? It just happens.

You can't spend that much money. You can't spend that much money in a summer and not and you just and quite plausibly say that sentence Charlie. Like, do you know what I mean? Like they have spent so much money and we're talking about them. I can. I can. I can. That's what I'm saying.

You can. You can say that. That's what I mean. But you shouldn't be able to say it because they shouldn't. Yeah. You shouldn't be able to say it because they spent so much money and you've just made a really, really good point about like where they're going to score the goals from. They've got problems. They've got, I mean, I don't know whether we, shall I.

We're going to go into it more, Rick, sorry, I was going to go into them there. Yeah, yeah, I think I would probably say that they actually played all right for 20, 25 minutes. For spurs, Rick. No, Rick, that's you being polite, four spurs. Yeah, it's okay. Yeah, all right. Do you know what I mean? Like, let's be real.

Like we said, guys, if they spent the money, so that's minus 100 million off Tanali. Where else have they spent the money in attacking areas? like they haven't. But they wasn't lighting it up for Man City. I mean, I think Marmush is a good player. And Savino actually. So I don't, I mean... But Marmous Rick hasn't played.

No, well that's kind of what Deserby is saying. He's still talking about losing energy because their physical condition isn't good enough yet. But I think once you've had... There's not many of your players went deep in the World Cup. sort of, so I'm thinking of my feet a bit here. No, there hasn't, but also. You've got a decent pre-season and you're now four games in.

They should all be up to speed. And certainly it's not an excuse to... Rick, none of them signings acted the way Alexander Rees acted last summer. So let's not act like they've just, they haven't done a pre-season. Every one of them have been up their clubs, respected clubs, and done a full pre-season. The only thing you haven't done is match minutes. That's the only thing you can actually hide behind. What I'm waiting for is we know Deserby is volatile.

Yes. We said it on the first episode of this podcast. They have given all this money and all this power to a guy who's had nine different jobs in 12 years. Now, the way he's talking at the moment, I would be worried because I think he is ready to blow. His post-match press conferences about we've clept two clean sheets or what would you rather focus on, the two clean sheets or the fact we haven't scored? well the fact you haven't scored and the fact that you haven't won a game and the fact that you're 17th in the league

and you spent on 400 million pounds in the summer the best part of it to not really improve and not the evidence we've seen so far going on to the pitch and berating tell in front of everybody Luke that's poor I think it's so early to do that you're not Pep Guardiola

Pep can get away with doing that because he's Pep can do what he wants Pep can talk to his players in the canteen on the pitch you can take them out, take them in the stands and get them straight. You can do whatever he wants, Pep. But he's not Pep, and I just thought that was performative.

I thought it was betraying a man who wants to project something. I'm starting to really worry that this isn't just an early season malaise for Tottenham. This could be a real sign of things to come. They've got that huge game against Aston Villa. It's such a big game,

the Villa game. I mean, for both of the sides, Vila also win. I mean, at least they scored losing to Forrest yesterday. But the difference is that you've seen evidence from Unaimery of being able to turn something like this around. It was just this bad at the start of last season and look at the season they ended up having.

And I don't think we have seen that from Deserbie. And completely different temperament. If Spurs were to lose that game against, Villa, that's massive Pop groups, isn't it? It's a three week international break after that, so you're going into October with us. And you're thinking

about that quite a lot, I reckon. And you're thinking about that quite a, you're stewing on that for a long time. The supporters are carrying around so much scar tissue as well. You're thinking, which player am I going to berate on the pitch to try and, you know, shifts and blow me it? Yeah, distrapped from it.

And look, Everton, Everton did what teams of learning to do with and they dug in first half. You know, they've got 18 players. You know, they're the club everyone was tipping to really struggle this season, Everton. They've gone to Tottenham. In the second half, they created the better chances.

They look more likely to win it, yeah. They look more likely to win it again at the Tottenham Hot Spurst Stadium. In a moment, we're going to talk about Coventry's pretty dismal start to life back in the Premier League. But first, half-time teaser. So Spurs and Coventry, goalless after their opening four games. Only one Premier League team has ever gone more than four games without scoring at the start of a season. Can you name them? back after this.

Has a brand new home. Welcome to a special Euroleagues. The biggest stories from across the Liga, Bundesliga, Syria and beyond. I think they can go from strength to trend. It's the kind of team you don't want to be facing. From managerial merry-go rounds to unforgettable moments.

Back to his best, just wanting the ball. I'll sort it out, no problem. Remarkable stories. And the biggest talking points from across European football. This pressure is on every manager in the league with the expectation is high. Subscribe now and don't miss an episode.

Search Euroleagues on BBC Sounds. On the Football Daily podcast, Premier League Review with Rick Edwards. Welcome back to the Premier League Review. Before the break, I ask you to name the team to have gone on the longest run without scoring at the start of a Premier League season. I, look, I think this is actually very,

very getable. I know this. Yeah, go on. Crystal Palace. Yeah, under. De Bois, was it? Yeah, yeah. The first half-time teaser

I've ever got that quickly off the back. When you said that, Luke, and said to Palace, I remember him, did he go eight games with not winning? No, it was, he only, I think it was four. Four games, was it? He did four games, then he was sacked,

De Boer, but then Roy Hodgson came back in, and then there was another thing. three games that they didn't score under him. But they did stay up. So Coventry, waiting for a first point and a first goal back in the Premier League, really tough afternoon, 5-0 beaten by Brighton. And the funny thing is, I was sort of half watching this and they looked all right, Coventry,

but just didn't have quite enough in the final third. and then when the wheels came off, they really came off, Charlie. Okay, so for me, the gap between the Premier League and the EFL is way too big. If you don't get the recruitment right in the summer, it will show and you'll be punished. Now, you can be just above average, like you say, played well and in the EFL and get over it. But in the Premier League, you can't do that because you will be punished. Now, in the Premier League, the top strikers might miss one, but let's be honest. it's the second one of the third ones going in the back of the net.

Coventry have finally that at the moment. Again, do you see enough in that team to score the goals, win the games? I see them collectively as a very good team, but not a very good Premier League team. And that is the worry. That is the worry because it can soon get after. It can soon get away from you because you're always looking. We're still on zero. We're still on zero goals.

The kind of, the reason I'm cautious about saying too much about, Less so about the Zerbian spurs just because of spurs. But last season, look at what Daniel Farker did with Leeds and the turnaround after that half-time team talk against City, wasn't it? They've got Premier League experience, Rick. Yeah, no, I know. And then look at what Emery did with. There was just a number of teams who looked like they were banging trouble

at the start of the season and then pulled it out. So it is possible. It is possible to adapt. And I think it's fair to say that Frank Lampard is growing as a manager and won't be, I don't, this is pure speculation on my part. I don't think that he is unable to be pragmatic. I don't think he's going to dig his heels in and say, no, this is definitely how we're going to play.

I think if he feels that he needs to change something about the setup, I think he will. I don't know. Do you agree? with that, Luke? I think he's going to have to, would be my answer. I think...

But there have been managers who very clearly would do have to and have a... Well, Vincent Company at Burnley is the classic example who came up with the same principle. Russell Martin.

Russell Martin. But Vincent Company did it with Burnley and then got the Bayern Munich job. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. And he's doing all right. And he's done all right for himself, Vincent, it turns out.

But yeah, no, I agree with Charlie. I think they're a nice, pleasing on the eye team. Yeah. They look like a team that's come up from the championship. They were the best team in the championship last season

and they were one of the best the season before that as well. They should have really have beaten Sunderland in the playoffs semifinals. They were the better team over the two legs. But I think they've come up and they're still trying to play

that style of football and they're still trying to take that approach to games. And I'm not sure what the difference maker in them is. You know, you look at a whole city and they're defensively sound, big, strong, organized,

don't mind not having the ball, hard to beat, capable of getting a goal. Ipswich have signed a completely new team. They look like they've got real pace up front. Well, they've done the kind of, they've taken the Sunderland approach. They've taken the Sunderland route.

I'm not sure what Coventry really is. I think, you know, they're minus 10 goals. Minors 10 goals already, and it can slip away from you very, very quickly. Of course they're not out of it. One win would lift them out of the relegation zone. Of course not out of it. But they've beaten at home to hole

and they lost a whole to a good Brighton team today. But Lewis Dunk is popping one in from 30 yards, like the centreback. Do you know what I mean? It was that sort of game where actually Brighton were taking the Mickey out of them by the end. And I think that is really hard to deal with this early in the season. So I think Frank is, to answer your question. I think Frank is going to have to find a different way. He's going to have to start turning them more pragmatic.

I think if they go in with this attitude and this approach over the course of the season, I think they're going down. Huller doing a great job at the moment. I mean, yeah, a drawer against Chelsea is a good result anyway. But realistically, I think they could have won it. There was that actually very annoyingly. I don't like ever praising Emmy Martinez. But he fumbles at 2-1, fumbles the shot.

At 2-1, fumbles the shot, and then McBurney follows it up. And it's a really, really, because I think I didn't quite see it in real time but on the replay it's a really good save with his leg and that would have made it 3-1 and you couldn't I don't think you would have said that Hull didn't deserve it particularly

also I love the whole shirt I think the whole shirt is so good it just adds a completely different palette to you to the Premier League it's sort of a nod to the old school but it doesn't feel like it's just sort of needlessly retro it's a great it's a great shirt I'll add to that, chaps.

And the reason why you've just brought that up, Rick, and Luke you've agreed, is because of their performances since the start of the season. Yeah, that's probably true. If they were not... If they were not... If they were not being bothered about the kit.

Wouldn't care less about the kit if they're bottomed with no points. Yeah, we've got to think about it. What they've done, Man United opening day, I'm saying, like I said before, it was a free hit, and they got the free points. They go to Coventry and both teams don't want to lose,

but they're the ones you look for the fiction and go, we want to win. They get a draw against Aston Villa, another one, can we get something? And then they go to Chelsea and a free hit, and they get a point there. The way the manager has got his players, his mentality, thinking of places, and his comments. He come out and said, the players that are trying to get in the team have got to show me something because the players that are playing at the moment deserve to be starting. So there's no favourable stuff going on.

Like he's picking the best players available on form. The proof's in the pudding. You see Holwin, who really expected Hold to go to Stanford Bridge? Not me. No. And pick up, no, nobody. But they did, and it's credit to them. It is, of course, credit to them.

But we have to say something about the fact that Chelsea looked really vulnerable in defence. I mean, good going forward, for sure. But they've conceded a lot of soft goals, taking nothing away from the finish, but holes equaliser, a ball bouncing in like 10 yards out of the, like it is, you see that in Sunday league? If that goal happened on a Sunday morning for under 10s, under 10s, 11s, 12s,

you'd be very disappointed, let alone in a Premier League game. I mean, I know he sort of misjudges the flight of the ball, but it does look crazy. But you're looking to, thinking to yourself, you're in the crowd there at Stamford Bridge, you'd be going, don't let that bounce. Yeah.

Get your head on that. You almost don't even think you need to say that because obviously he's not going to let it bounce. Just whatever you do, right, with that ball, don't let it bounce in the area. And it's just the way he looks as it loops over his head. It's like a kind of like, oh no. And then just, oh, I've balls this up overnight.

Yeah, and he's saying, well, I hope he doesn't make a good concept with it. Oh, my God. He could still miss this. It's a lovely finish. It's a lovely finish, but you should never have the opportunity to make the finish. No, it's brilliant. It's brilliant, yeah. let's talk about it switch

who've as discussed very different approach to Holland Coventry they've gone with the Sunderland model to look at their so they beat Crystal Palace 3-2 Crystal Palace down to 10 11 of the 16 players

they used at Palace were signed in the summer but then alongside that and again I think that Sunderland did this really well they have got a few who have been there for a long time who are also doing really well.

So I'm thinking about Leif Davis is probably the best example, Luke. Yeah, Leif Davis is so important to the way they play. He really is. And he was good the last time. Then they, when they came up, I think he was going to understand out players. He's certainly been very good in the championship. They've got Enceiso up front, who I really, really like. He's a live wire.

They've brought Fleming, who scored the winning goal at Palace. I think he's a really good signing. You can get it wrong. It is risky. You can sign all those players and it go horribly wrong. So I think there are risks attached to bringing in so new players. but you've touched on it there, Rick, that they kept the core as well,

they kept the leaders in the dressing room, the likes, Moshay, isn't there, as well, who I think is really, really important to them. So I think they've got the, at the moment, they've got the balance right. And let's not forget, they lost, you know, Kiran McKenna, the manager in the summer as well,

who led them to free promotions. And Gary O'Neill's come in, and he knows what it takes to survive in the Premier League. That's what I would say about him. He's got that track record, and that's a big, big win for them. and we talk about, you know, Ipswich, both of them,

Hull have taken all the spotlight, because obviously they're, you know, they're in the top four. But I've also started his two wins out of four games so far, and that gives them a real platform to go on and achieve their age, which will be to stay in the league. Absolutely, of course it will be. They won't be aiming for anything more at this stage,

but it's good for them. And I think, you know, we talked about Fulham last weekend as being one of those teams who were vulnerable. And Clinton, of course, who is a formal Crystal Palace player, Clinton Morrison. He actually said he was worried about Crystal Palace, didn't he?

He tried to say he hadn't said that and that they would be fine. But that's also a really, really bad result for them at home for the newly promoted team. So Hull and Ipswich being good and hopefully Coffieldry to recover from their bad start, I think that is very important for the Premier League and that makes it more entertaining for the rest of us.

You know, well, I mean Spurs. Spurs, Fulham and Palace, the teams who narrowly avoided, no, Fulham has been a good season last year. But no, certainly Pallis were in a little bit of trouble last year, obviously had European football which was a distraction. But yeah,

they, Palace and Fulham, I think, will be nervous. All right, that is all we got time for. Thanks very much, Charlie. Thanks, Luke. Cheers, guys. You're welcome. Lovely. Next up on the Football Daily feed will be the Monday nightclub. The EFL has a brand new home.

Hello and welcome to 72 plus the home of the EFL from Five Life Sports. Aaron Paul and Joby McEnough tackle the biggest stories from across the championship. League one, League two and beyond. A minimum of one week's wage is fine. And we may be even right to your wife and tell you what you've been fined if you carry on. And the biggest talking points from across the football league.

I always spoke well as I'll be and enjoyed working with him. It's my show too now, but yeah, thanks for that. Sorry, I don't know. Search 72 plus, the EFL podcast on BBC Sounds. Get more with BBC podcasts. Wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows. like evil genius, good bad billionaire, and you're dead to me,

with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon music subscription.