Football Daily - Rafa Benitez & the games that made him

Episode Date: August 3, 2025

A special episode from the Football Daily archives when in 2019 Rafa Benitez joined Guillem Balague to talk Istanbul, Tyneside & Madrid. [This is a re-versioned episode from the Football Daily archive. It was first published on the 25th April 2019]

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Ever feel like car shopping is designed to make you second-guess yourself? Is this a good price? Am I making the right choice? With CarGurus, you don't have to wonder. They have hundreds of thousands of cars from top-rated dealers and advanced search tools, deal ratings and price history. So you know a great deal when you see one. That's cargurus.ca.

CarGurus.ca BBC sounds music radio podcasts. The football daily podcast on BBC sounds. Hello there. I'm Steve Crossman. Welcome to the football daily. In this special edition of the podcast, we've got an exclusive interview with Newcastle manager Rafa Benitez. He talks about the matches that have shaped his varied and successful career. A legend at Liverpool after that Champions League win in 2005, and hugely popular on

Tyneside 2 where he's out of contract at the end of the season, Benitez is probably one of the most high profile coaches in the Premier League. But the 59 year old, who joined the coaching staff of Real Madrid at the age of just 26, has also won trophies in Spain, Italy and Europe and he remains as hungry as ever for success, even recently saying he wants to win the Champions League again before retiring at the age of 70. Here he is then in conversation with Guillem Balague. Rafa, I asked you to have a look at some of the games that have defined your career and

it reminds me that you write everything down. Everything means everything I believe. So is that in notebooks? When I was 13, I was just writing, giving marks to the teammates and writing everything, top scores in the team, everything. Since then, every single game is true that we analyze, not just me, now it's with my staff. We put everything on paper and then everyone watched the game and take notes and we put minutes together and after we prepared clips. Yeah, but when at 13, you didn't have a computer. So that was notebooks.

Have you got... I had notes, but I had a computer. When I was, we were using MS-DOS and after Visual Basic and after Windows. So you don't have a room full of notebooks that you can check. I had, in the attic of my parents, I had around 1,500 videotapes, VHS, with two games each one.

So how often did your parents say, Rafa, when are you taking this away? No, to be fair, it was in the attic, it was not a problem. This is where we're going to start. Valladolid 2, Valencia 5. January 1996, this is your last game with Valladolid, which was your first experience in La Liga as a number one. What do you remember of that game? Not everything, but almost everything. I will give you something that you will like.

The 15th of August we were promoted and I was sleeping. I was with the team in San Rafael, Los Angeles San Rafael and I remember that they called me. So the 15th of August we were in First Division. The league was starting the 2nd of September and we have to sign players quickly. Because this is an administration solution that was found instead of having 20 teams in the second of September. And we have to sign players quickly. Because this is an administration solution that was found instead of having 20 teams in the first division because Celta and Sevilla didn't want to go down and they should have because of financial irregularities. They remain in the first division, which means that you were signed as a second division coach. We promoted.

But were promoted. So, and I will tell you, my contract was a second division contract and everything. So as soon as you started the season with a young team, because I take I take Antia, Antia was coming with me, Fernando. So we have Javi Torres. So I take Marcos. I was for a while. So some four players from the Academy of Real Madrid.

So we had a very talented young group of players. And then we were in the first division. And then it was very difficult for me, a manager without the experience in the first division and then we went to this one, Valencia, they were doing really well, Valencia with Mijatovic, they were a very good team. And before the game, Luis Mida was the kit man man he came and he said listen boss Everything is fine. I put some garlic behind the goal of to be Zareta

So I think for the bad luck for through the red that I will be fine That was a Balethia goalkeeper at the time. Yeah, and then to be sorry that was injured during the warm-up and so it worked Yeah And then it was oh and then they put Bartual as a keeper. He made three or four saves that he said, listen, it's the man of the match. And they were much better than us. Then they decided to fire me and to fire the technical director. That was my concern. Why I was complaining about the level of the signings at the end, because we did it in a hurry. He was complaining about the lack of experience of the manager and they fired both. You go home and you're thinking you doubt your

own ability at that point you think? No, no really, no I was really disappointed obviously because I thought that we were working so hard that I thought I was wrong but in the end it's an experience so he said okay what I was doing as you say I was taking notes everything and I was wrong, but in the end it's an experience. So it's like, okay, what I was doing, as you say, I was taking notes of everything and I was learning trying to be sure that I couldn't make the same mistake. So, and the contract that I have in second division was easy for them to change the manager. Valencia signed you because of what you've done at Tenerife. What did they see that you could provide? To be fair, what they told me is that they were following me and some people were talking

with them about me and also that they tried a couple of managers with more experience than me and they couldn't get them. And they said, okay, we'll go for this one. Tenerife, as you say, was a great season. We were playing really, really good football. We were a very offensive team, creating chances in every game. We had the balance. We were playing really, really good football. We were a very offensive team, creating chances in every game. We had the balance. We were a very, very good team in attack. And I think that they were happy with that. That was in a context where young Spanish coaches were not signed.

They didn't get those kind of opportunities. So it had to work well. And of course, there was a moment in your first season, we are going to the 15th of December, 2001, Espanol Valencia, in which things were not going your way. And I know, I heard directors of Valencia saying half time, this is it, we don't want Rafa here anymore, he's going to be sacked.

Everybody's saying that, and in Val Valencia they are telling me that, all the journalists, but I didn't know at this time. So I was just focused on we are losing 2-0, I need to make changes and substitutions and I changed Eymar for Salva. So we have to change something. We did it and Ruffete scored a couple of goals and Iliad, that was a great, great striker, scored another one and we won the game. So then everything was different. But to be fair, we were doing well because we were, I think, 13 games and beaten and we have six wins and seven draws or something like that. But because Valencia, they played two championly finals

and everybody was expecting something more. And maybe at this time, so new manager,, young manager maybe is not ready. And we did well, we won and then we got career level. Do you remember who finished second that season? I think it was Real Madrid. Deportivo. Deportivo, ok. Deportivo were second.

But that was of course the first time in 31 years that Valencia won the league. What did you think about your own career at that particular time? It's like, this is it, I made it. I mean, I cannot get anything bigger, this is it, I made it. I mean, I cannot get anything bigger than this. No, I told my wife that I will win the Champions League. So she was always telling me, you told me. But at this time I was not thinking too much

about what to achieve. It's just to try to do your best every time. I have grown in the Academy of Real Madrid. So when I was 13 until I was 20, and normally you have to win, so you cannot finish second. Finish second was a disaster, so I remember my first four years we won the league three times, it's something that you have in your DNA, and then to go there it's not like,

okay, finish, no, you have to try and keep winning. After that there was UEFA Cup final, which was the last game that you played, that you managed at Valencia, and before of course won the league again for the second time after three years and then the parade where was it that was that the one that you cried and you did you did the first thing that I remember of this final is Ayala against Drogba and then the first ball in the air to Ayala was boom, smash him. He said, listen, this is my territory, so don't come around. And these kind of things are important. The character of your players and these football players,

they have very, very good character. In the group stage, you met Liverpool and you beat them 2-0, which was described by the English press as a humbling experience because actually you performed really well, perhaps should have scored by more goals and then you beat them at Anfield as well and I know by Rick Parry that they went like, well okay we need to find out about this guy and you went to a sure list for Liverpool. We played at friendly the year after also we beat them in Anfield and the carrier andher and Stevie, they told me so we couldn't create any chance. So that was for them that was a shock that this team

was so good that they couldn't create even chances against us. So and these friendly plus the other two games in the in the Champions League make them think oh maybe it's a chance. We are in Liverpool now, and I think you realised straight away that you were in a special place. And this is said far too often, but there was something magical about how they welcomed you with open arms. And this was a club that needed to win of course. Yeah you could feel this passion from the fans from day one so they were desperate to win something. But the interesting thing was a surprise for me coming from Spain, they told me in three years we want to compete. So nobody was telling me we have to win now, just try just try to stay in the, to go to the Champions League and try to compete in three years. And then we did really well. We were in the final of the Carlin Cup and after we won the famous Champions

League final. But the atmosphere in general was quite positive and especially when we were playing in Europe. So the fans were behind the team and everybody was feeling something special. We got to the Ataturk and to Istanbul, the 25th of May 2005, and we've heard a lot about it, but I think we haven't heard enough from your point of view, exactly what went through your head in the tough times of that game especially.

So in that first half, I saw that you were a lot of conversations with Paco and trying to analyze. The point here was at the beginning of my time in England. So my English was quite bad. Now it's not amazing, but it was quite bad. Then you have to spread yourself, and especially at halftime when you are losing three nil.

So it's quite difficult to give a message, be emotional and then go into the head of the players and then make them believe. And I was taking my notes 2-0 down, taking my notes and then we concede the third goal. It was very difficult. I remember the player with the head down talking with them, said, listen, come on, if we score one goal, we will be back in the game. So we need to score the goal. The game plan was thinking about ourselves. Okay, we are doing well, we can compete.

But we have the injury of Harry Kuhl early, then we have to change. So we concede three goals. They were really good. We were not doing well. And then I knew when we were talking about that, that we have to change. I told Paco, Paco, I will give the team talk and then take Didi Hamann to do the warm-up as soon as

I finish and then we will play three in the back and we'll play Didi with Alonso in the middle. That's Paco Iestera who was your assistant at the time. Yes, and then when I was talking about that, three in the back and I said to Jimmy Traore, go to the shower and then we said to Jimmy Traore, go to the shower and then we'll play with Finan, Carradon and Kipje. And then when I finished, I said, we have to score one goal, we go back into the game, baba. And then Dave Galley, the official, was treating Finan and he told me, I don't think that

Finan can play the whole game, 45 minutes. Are you sure? Yeah. And Finan was furious with him. Then I said to Tarrick, come back. And then I changed Finan. This is after he was in the shower, practically, or just about to change into the shower. But it was nearly there, for sure, because it was eight minutes, maybe nine minutes after.

So and Paco went with Didi Hamann and I was talking with Dave. So I changed, I was Traore on the left with Hippie and Carrara on the right and then Hamann obviously in the middle. And then he said we have to put, we need this side because we have to protect this side. We have the change of the substitution of Keywell and we have Esmeiser and Esmeiser was not playing for a while. So on the right we have to maybe if we put Cissé, no if we put Cissé we'll be 12 players. It's true, okay, because I didn't have Luis Garcia. Then that's it. We went outside with three at the back and then changed everything and we scored one goal

and then quickly... At that point, at that point, you score a goal, which is what you said, that it may change everything. What was going to happen next is you scored two more, the three goals in six minutes. But at that particular moment, you think there is nothing to touch, let it go. Yeah, no, no, no. We were better than them. We have more control and you could feel the fans atmosphere that they were really, really worried. and you could feel the fans atmosphere that they were really really worried and

then we scored the second goal and everybody was excited and we had the control of the game at this time because if you think tactically two strikers and a player behind with our three centre-backs we were controlling that with the two holding midfielders we were controlling that so it was a question of Gerrard running forward or Barros or whatever So we had the control of the game and then we scored the third goal and you could see that they needed to react. Jersey too, they made a great save but after an extra time we were better than them. So we had the control, we were creating chances and Cissé had a couple of chances that he could do a little bit better. So we were there

and I had the belief that we could win in extra time. But I was also convinced that we could do it in penalties because people talk about Carras telling Jersey today about the grovel art movements, but then Ocho Torrena and the world keeping coach, we had a database with all the penalties and over five of the penalty takers we knew four of them. So we have an advantage that in a final is massive. After the three goals, the 3-3, at that point you still had to intervene a lot. You had to move Gerrard out of position.

Yeah, because they play Serginho, they put Serginho on the left side as a substitution that was a very good move for Ancelotti. Then they have to move Gerrard because as a maestro he couldn't follow him. And Gerrard finishes sometimes as a rifle back and after he was going forward as a winger. So that was another crucial point for us. So we managed tactically, we were stopping them. And if you see their teammates was really, really good. So we saw character, tactically we managed, but especially we saw characters on players. They give everything. And in the end, we were a little bit lucky, but in the end, especially, I say penalties, is because we knew exactly what could happen. Right at the end of the game, I spoke to a couple of the players and also Paco Istarán.

They fell down. They felt almost like depressed, like they had obviously no energy. You're giving everything emotionally. You were completely empty and they just had to lift themselves up by giving themselves a little bit of sugar and whatever. Did you go through that as well? No, I was fine until four or five in the morning because we have a party and everybody was around there. I don't drink and so it's just the party, pictures and the fans and friends. I say a friend of mine wanted to go in the party and they didn't allow him to go. And then they called me and I have to go outside to talk with the people that was there. And then we were one minute outside and then when I tried to go inside, they didn't allow me to go in.

And then the security said, oh you cannot. And my friend said, listen you know who is this man? No, he's God, he's God. So that was the situation that we have this time. Obviously to God you have to let them in, whatever that is and that was to the hotel. You should have said that you were one of the Gemme Carragher's cousins. There were about 45 of them on that hotel that night. Yeah, could be in the hotel, but in the parties, you never know, so it was a lot of people and everybody was enjoying. Did you get to sleep that night?

Yeah, I think a little bit, not too much. And then you did the parade through the city center. Massive and very dangerous. I remember because I have the picture at home and it was full of, the city was incredible everywhere, fans everywhere, but I remember when you finished, you go back, so everybody has gone home, and you go back with the double decker. And then the players, they were at the top, and it was quite fast. And then you could see the

trees, the branches, and then the players were like, hey, be careful too. And it was quite dangerous, so I remember that. Paco Herrera told me that the thing that remembers the most is that you were so slow at some point and there were people in the windows, a woman who was an Everton fan with the Everton flag, there just congratulating you in a way by just being there but reminding you that Liverpool is not just yours. I remember you had the greatest thing that

has been invented after, has been brought here after the potatoes. One flag that was put, something like that. Who was that? You? Yeah, they were talking about me. That was the most important thing after the potato coming to England, something like that. Before we finish with Liverpool you get home after what had been an extraordinary 48 hours for all sorts of reasons You get home and you've been surrounded by thousands and thousands of people But at that point you're on your own sitting in the sofa having wine or water or water Water. Do you remember that moment where where Urias must have been hurting from so much noise, but you were at that point on your own? To be fair, no.

I remember everything, oh everything, the parade and full of people and after, as you say, maybe I was so exhausted that then just go and stay with the family and that's it. So I remember the days after because we were thinking about the next season, we didn't have too much money so we have to sell players and buy but that's it. This time it's just enjoy with the family and I don't remember exactly all the details. After Valencia and Liverpool it's difficult to follow that up but of course once you are at the elite you want to remain in the elite this is logical so you go to Inter Milan the game we're gonna pick from that is one that perhaps is not in the memory of many fans is the TP Mansempé

0, Internationale Milan 3 that's the 18th of December 2010 and that made a title. Obviously we were not expecting Mansempé in the final because... This is the club world cup final. Yeah, the club world cup final. It was massive because it was a trophy that Moratti's father won 41 years before and he was desperate to win this title and then we won and he was so happy. But at the same time it was a problem because obviously when I went to Inter, they promised me signing, we didn't sign anyone. And I said in a press conference that it's the time to sign players or to support the manager and then change, and then they changed the manager.

That happened a few days after, but let's put the whole thing in context. You decide to go to Inter Milan after they won everything and after they, Jose Mourinho had left to Real Madrid. Looking back at that decision, is that something you would do differently now? Yeah, maybe, but maybe not. The team was good, the players were quite professional, the majority of them. The only thing that was wrong is just they promised to sign some players and they didn't do it. AC Milan, they signed Ibrahimovic and they won the league and it was difficult for Inter to compete when AC Milan was coming back.

And then we won the Super Cup. So we won the Super Cup against Ranieri with Rome and after we won the World Cup. So we did what we could do and it was a question of investing and trying to change the team because the team has 15 players over 30 years old. 15. It took two years before you got the next job and was it a mixture of not getting the right offer, the right timing? I had some offers, some meetings with people and we were close and I was even watching

games with the director. So and then I have a phone call and then Chelsea come around and then that was the opportunity because I was in England, was a top side and it was the chance to win something. I spoke to Avran Gran a couple of days ago and he said that he got a report from a very close friend of yours of how good you were and everything and he went straight to Roman Abramovich and said you have to sign this guy. I don't know if you know the context of the situation or if he was Marina Kranoskaya who at the time and still is the top boss at Chelsea or Roman himself who spoke to you at that time. I was talking with Abramovic at that time. I was without

a job so I could do what I wanted. Yeah, I was talking with them and it was just to know me, as you say, the character face to face and I think that they have enough reports and after they make a decision. From that period we're picking the Benfica 1 Chelsea 2. This is the Europa League final of course, the 15th of May 2013. What do you remember of that game? It was very difficult, very difficult. I think I was a good team. We thought that we were better than them, but they were quite good on the ball. I put David Luiz as a midfielder and the first half we didn't do well, but the second half we were much better and we were practicing set pieces they

were doing solid marking in corners but not on the on the six yard box it was like a diagonal line and then we were practicing set pieces corners with the Mata taking the corners and Ivanovic coming to the second post and during training sessions nothing was right so he he was taking the corner, it was a disaster. Juan and Nafter, we did it, we blocked the last man and in the last minute of the game Ivanovich scored and we won the UEFA Cup, the Europa League UEFA Cup at this time. So then everything that you were trying to do in the training session you couldn't't do it well. And then it was right during the game. Can you be fully, fully, totally, 100% honest on the feeling that you had when you won?

Was it relief? Was it there you are, there you are, this is your title? Didn't you want to win something? No, no, no, no, no. Believe me, my time at Chelsea, people has a wrong perception. I was really pleased. We were fine. We were living in Coban. The people was really pleased. We were fine. We were living in Coban. The people

were really nice. They were supporting us. In the training ground, the atmosphere was fantastic. The staff, everybody was happy with our situation and the way that we were treating people. A couple of players, maybe they were not as happy because they were not playing. Maybe one of them was not playing, but the rest of the people was happy. And I didn't have any problem with Abramovich and with Marina, with Emenalo, that was the technical director. Nothing, everything was fine. Some fans or maybe some players, they were not happy, but the majority of them were fine and the atmosphere was really good. So my memories are quite positive, no negative. And still I have a lot of friends and, and relationship with people there.

Right. Okay. I don't want to spoil that memory, but I was a lot of those games and some of the things I heard from the fans, from your own fans. But no, the fans are a lot of fans. Always I say the same. So at the beginning, they were not too many after there were more of them, but the majority of them, they were fine. And I am telling you that the crucial game was against Miedersbraa in the cup. We beat Miedersbraa 2-0 in the cup away, and then I gave an interview live and after the press conference, and I said listen, I am a professional, I will do my job, I will try

to do the best for my team, that is Chelsea Football Club, and that's it, you don't need to complain about me, because I will leave at the end of the season. Some of them maybe they were worried, fine, but the rivalry between Liverpool and Chelsea when Mourinho was there and we were winning with Liverpool, we played 16 times against Chelsea at this period and we were winning especially massive games in the Champions League and they won some of them but we won the important one at the beginning. So I can tell you I was going to the supermarket, I was walking around Coban, I was going to a restaurant and the people were really nice and they were telling you, they were supporting me and I will tell you even more. Newcastle, I came here by train one day and I was waiting for my family that was coming later from London

and someone approached me and said I'm a Chelsea fan, thank you very much for what you did for us, you did well. So I have had this competition so many times that still you say okay bad memories, no good memories. Next game is Real Madrid 8, Malmo 0, which you mentioned already, and Liverpool 8, Basique's nil. Those are games that you managed, record in the Champions League in terms of goals,

and goes back to the idea of perception, the fact that actually you get seen as a conservative coach. Will it be fair to say, because you're trying to balance your teams, and sometimes you have to defend, sometimes you have to attack? Always be fair to say because you're trying to balance your teams and sometimes you have to defend sometimes you have to attack? Always I try to say that balance people and you they can see your team organized they don't say oh it's expansive football but you have a lot of teams talking about the expansive football and relegated so you need to do what the fans are

expecting from you that is they have the hope and they believe that you will get something that they are expecting. Obviously, everybody would like to see a team scoring five, eight goals every game. Sometimes you cannot. You have to use the tools that you have and try to get the best from your players. So normally we improve players. Normally we improve the teams. And normally we get what we are looking for or we achieve what we are looking for. But that doesn't mean that it has to be always defending, could be attacking, could be pressing high but the balance is to defend well and to attack well.

Then this Valencia that I told you before was continuing less goals than anyone and scoring one less than Real Madrid and we won the league with seven points ahead advantage so that is what you are looking for a balance between two attack and then create chances and score goals and defend well. Newcastle United as a team we were not giving too many chances to the other teams for a period and we were not scoring too many goals but we were creating chances. So when you create chances it's a question of accuracy and at the end what I say always is the final third you can improve players and teams in the back, the organization and

everything the final third is more difficult because it depends on the talent you never know what the defender will do so then when you go to buy players in the final third they are more expensive it's more difficult and normally they are in the top sides that is the reason why you can be organized you can keep your balance but you will score less goals so then you have to find this balance between to create more chances without being exposed in defense and. I want to play nice football, good football, but you have to win. Nobody remember AC Milan in the final of Istanbul, even if they scored two goals and they played great in the first half. They remember Liverpool

because we won the trophy. So you have to find this balance between to win and to win playing well, that you will have more chances if you play well to win games. On that game against Malmo, Ronaldo scored four goals. What was your relationship with Cristiano? It was fine. So in terms of people was trying to create a mess at the beginning, but I was talking with him every day and two weeks before to leave, he said they're doing a great job so he's he's a professional he take care of himself he's always focused on what he wants to do and that's it so we have the situation over there was that then they

didn't allow us to go through because we were two points behind Barcelona with one game in hand four points behind Atletigo Madrid So we were in the league we were first in the Champions League and we were out of the cup because a Problem an administrative problem, so we were doing things right, but they decide to change and that's it Going a little bit full circle here. That was the second time I saw you crying when when you were presented as a Real Madrid manager. It was a dream. Yeah, more than a dream because I had the offer in the past three times. So that was the one that I had to say. Well, you said three times no to Florentino Perez?

Not just Florentino, but there was three times, different times. And I said at this time, I have to go because it was an opportunity and it was a good team and then to do well. Obviously, when you have been in Real Madrid since you were 13 years old until you were 35, so it was emotional time. After the roller coaster emotional times at Real Madrid, you go to Newcastle and from that period, we chose a game which was extraordinary for many reasons. Newcastle 5 spurs 1. This is the last game of the season, 15th of May 2016. And Pochettino told me that that day you were kind of saying, don't worry, don't worry, Pochettino. You were, oh, Newcastle has gone down. But you were actually trying to cheer him up. And it was a game in which the fans chanted your name for 90 minutes. Yeah, that was a massive game. So that was another fact that made you think, oh, this

is massive clue, then you can do something with these fans behind and with the city behind, to be fair. Then it was a great game. So everybody was pushing. I think it was, Mito was sent off, no, this game. So we're playing with 10 players and we were attacking and they have to win. It's not that they were playing for nothing, so they have to win. But everything was right, the fans were amazing. That was a key factor in my decision. I was talking with Mike Ashley after the game and he was telling me, what do you want?

We were talking about what we thought was ideal to promote and then after a couple of days we were talking about the future.