Football Daily - TCV: Tuchel talks Trent, Clinton clasps & Gerónimo!

Episode Date: September 18, 2026

John Murray, Ian Dennis & Ali Bruce-Ball catch up on life as football commentators. Hear from Thomas Tuchel after his England squad announcement, Ali’s raffle secret is revealed, and Ian’s ankles get exposed! Will Ian finally win a Clash of the Commentators? And which terms will be added to the Great Glossary of Football Commentary? Messages and voicenotes welcome on WhatsApp to 08000 289 369 & emails to [e-mail]01:00 Will John say Gerónimo Rulli? 05:30 Ali mesmerised by Merino, 08:00 Secrets from the golf raffle… 12:30 Dennis White Sox, 14:25 Thomas Tuchel talks to John, 23:30 The Nations League awaits! 27:15 5 Live commentaries this weekend, 27:50 What’s on the menu at Forest? 30:20 Man Utd misery returns, 36:00 Can we shake hands on the handshake debate? 43:40 Clash of the Commentators, 49:50 Great Glossary of Football Commentary.5 Live / BBC Sounds commentaries: Sat 1500 Brighton & Hove v Arsenal, Sat 1500 Newcastle v Hull City on Sports Extra 2, Sat 1730 Nottingham Forest v Coventry, Sun 1400 Bournemouth v Liverpool, Sun 1400 Man City v Sunderland on Sports Extra Sun 1400 Leeds v Crystal Palace on Sports Extra 2 Sun 1630 Fulham v Man Utd.Great Glossary of Football Commentary: DIVISION ONE 50p head Agricultural challenge, Back of the net, Back to square one, Backside and elbows, The Beautiful Game, Booked, Bosman, Bullet header, Caretaker manager, Channel of joy, Coupon buster, Cruyff Turn, Cultured/educated left foot, Dead-ball specialist, Draught excluder, Elastico/flip-flap, False nine, Fox in the box, Giving the goalkeeper the eyes, Grub hunter, Head like a biscuit tin, Head like a sheriff’s badge, Head tennis, Hibs it, In a good moment, In behind, Lollipop, Magic of the FA Cup, The Maradona, Need one to get in off their backside, Off their line, Olimpico, Onion bag, Panenka, Parachute payment, Park the bus, Perfect hat-trick, Postage stamp, Put his cap on it, Rabona, Roy of the Rovers stuff, Schmeichel-style, Scorpion kick, Spursy, Stick it in the mixer, Sweeper keeper, Taking it to the corner flag, Taking the match ball home, Target man, Tiki-taka, Towering header, Trivela, Where the kookaburra sleeps, Where the owl sleeps, Where the spiders sleep, You could have two goalkeepers in there and they still wouldn’t have saved it.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. With a subscription to the BBC website and app, you can now get early access to your favorite BBC podcasts. Listen to shows like, You're Dead to Me, In Our Time, good, bad billionaire, and more. Plus, there's all the other great benefits you get with a BBC subscription, from live streaming the BBC News Channel and acclaimed documentaries to in-depth analysis and features.

Visit BBC.com forward slash subscription. to find out more. Commentators' view on the Football Daily with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis. Hello, it's the Football Daily. I'm Ian Dennis, and this is the commentators' view where we five live commentators talk about the football,

our travels, and the words we use in football commentary. And for two-thirds of the TCV, for this episode, we're coming live from Wembley Stadium, myself and correspondent John Murray. Hello John. Yes, hello, Ian, from across the room. And joining us from somewhere else, Alegreys Ball.

From Salisbury, Ian, from Salisbury. And do you know what? This weekend is going to be the first in a few that I'm not going to reacquate myself with the M6. I've actually got a game on my patch on Sunday. I'm doing Bournemouth against Liverpool. So I'm quite looking forward to a shorter drive this weekend. A local game.

Well, before we get into England and all of them got a look to get through as well, all the correspondence and various topics. John, here is one for you from Connor McNamara on Five Live commentary on Thursday night when mentioning the Manchester City backup goalkeeper. That goes all the way back to Geronimo Ruli. And I'm looking forward to hear John Murray say, Gerrano Ruelly when he gets to commentate on him. That will one that will just roll off the Chief's tongue.

Yeah. Here is O'Reilly. How would you like to respond? Well, I heard a little bit of Connor and Chris last night when I was on my travels back on the road, but I didn't hear that bit. So that has come as a surprise to me. And well, shall I do it now,

or shall I keep it until I commentate on them? Well, bearing in mind, he's only going to play in the cup competitions. You might as well do it now. Otherwise, you'll forget. Well, who knows? If Don'teroma gets injured, then he'll be in, won't he? Well, don't keep us in suspense? I'm going to keep it.

I'm going to keep that back. And I'd tell you, I'd say what I find interesting is that I don't know whether you two get this, but I quite often, or let's not say it quite often. Occasionally, people will come to me and say, can you say the name of someone? Just two things on that. So I think Connor half attempted a John Murray impression there and sort of gave up on it halfway through. So I think you've either got to go, you know, all in there or not bother. And Chris didn't pick him up on that, which is unlike Chris.

Unlike him. It is unlike him. I also think that I've commentated on Geronimo Ruelly playing international football and use the very obvious gag about what he shouts when he comes through a cross, basically, through a packed six-yard box. which of course he could do within the laws of the game. Did you hear Chris's terrible gag, though, about Geronimo? No. No, go on. Where at one stage he said he's not,

instead of saying he's not attach on him, he said he's not attach on him. Oh, no. No. And I was thinking at the time, Connor should have said, you're a lone ranger on that one. Or he's gone tonto.

Did you hear, Ian, you know sometimes when you listen to a Chris Sutton co-commentary. I sometimes wonder whether the commentator is just ignoring Chris's gags or they've, you know, sometimes you've just got not time to respond to them all, particularly in a Saturday 3 o'clock and he did one in the Liverpool Fulham game. I heard that. Which you completely ignored.

He ignored. I heard that. And I don't know whether it was because you were just exasperated raising your eyes to heaven or you just missed it because you were concentrating on something else. But are you thinking the same one as me, John? But when Kevin gets on the ball. Yes. That was it.

That was it. I heard it. I ignored it, but he did, it did make me laugh. Yeah. But, yeah. Behaving like a teenager, didn't he? He went for the Kevin's a teenager game. Yeah.

And it was really sort of shoehorned in, but it did. But it did, it did actually, it did also. It did make me think, has he caught that? No. Has he clocked that? I did. I clocked it. Yeah.

Just going back to Geronimo Ruelly, remember when Omar Mouche first arrived and we all said, particularly John, we said, well, look forward to hearing John call Omar Marmush. Fulham last week have got it. And again, I would like John to hear this, David Afengruber. And I really did accentuate the gruber, but at which point I know Ali was listening, because I'm sure that Chris missed out the affin and called him Gruber. And I then made a joke about Diehard and Hans Gruber, but Ali, you sent me a great, thing about Paddington, didn't you?

A text message. So Mr. Gruber was the chap who owned the antiques shop. I think it was an antique shop. He used to have sandwiches with Paddington, which was another Mr. Gruber that sprung to mind when Chris had got the wrong grubber. But I enjoyed that. And equally,

and I enjoyed the fact that you've got a lot going on on a Saturday 3 o'clock. But when Chris makes the rare mistake that he does make, you were in like a shot. I was. Yes, I wasn't going to pass up that opportunity. And you kept your powder dry and then used your own Mr. Gruber.

in 606. I did. I did. Just before we get on to the England squad, because I know you chaps will have lots to say on that, two very quick tales from this week to tell you at the start of the pod that I think our listeners will enjoy. One actually is a question to you two. Have you ever had the pleasure of Mikhail Marino's company? No. No. No. Well, what a charming, engaging, thoroughly nice fella. I interviewed him, and I don't do many post-match interviews nowadays, but I was in the tunnel at Portman Road on Tuesday night after Arsenal had convincingly beat Nipswich in the League Cup

and Mikhail Marino was put forward as the Arsenal player. And, you know, quite often you'll do player interviews and not get much out of them. He was fantastic, articulate, eloquent, gave thoughtful answers, insightful answers. I just came away thinking, what an incredibly nice fellow. So if you get the chance to interview Mikhail Maria, he's now my favorite Mikhail at Arsenal. And you actually, Ali, witnessed Max Dowman, didn't you?

With his two goals on Tuesday night. You must have enjoyed that. So that's, well, Mikhail Marino gave a very good answer on him, actually, as did Mikhail Artetta. Yes, that was exciting, John. And it's quite something, isn't it, to be, I mean, we talked about him last season, but to be 16 years old and to genuinely be able to justify a place in one of the best squads in world football, we're going to see more of him. And obviously the message afterwards from Mikhail Artetta in particular was,

go careful, don't rush too much too soon. But the dummy, I don't know if you've seen the dummy for his first goal where he's got Ezra in loads of space on his left, ignores him, barely moves his shoulders but just gives it enough and Kippein buys it hook, line and sinker. It was a fabulous bit of football.

Yeah, he's going to be a special talent. I had him on the list, actually, as a potential to be in this England squad, but it wouldn't surprise to me. I think he will have to, he'll have to play, he'll have to start in the Premier League,

I think, in order to get into the England squad at some time this season. But one would have thought that he, if all as well stays fit, that he'll be certainly in contention for a place in the score for the euro

should England qualify. What was the other thing you're going to mention? Right. So this one, I think you two will definitely enjoy. I think our listeners will really enjoy. And this might come as news to our friend, Hare Chapman. This might actually be a reveal on this podcast.

So if he is listening, or if his sources, his spies are listening, this might be the first time that he gets wind of this, which will be lovely. I saw Hair Chapman for some golf on Monday. So Andrew Murray, who was a long-time colleague of ours, we all know extremely well. John and I have worked on the Five Live Golf Team

for over 20 years with Andrew. He is one of, along with Mikhail Marino, one of the nicest men in the world, has always got time for everyone and does so much for other people. And I was playing in his final charity Pro-Am event on Monday. So it's an event he's run for 35 years. They have raised hundreds of thousands of pounds for some really worthwhile causes doing that.

And this was the last one. Andrew decided that this year was the last one. Incredible turnout for it, 28 teams playing. I was lucky enough to be invited. So I'm on a team with Hare Chapman, Rob Northman, who's got plenty of mentions on this podcast, and Andrew Murray, Andrew, who's running the event. We didn't really trouble the scorers. we had a great afternoon. Our golf wasn't, wasn't quite up to it. But come the end of the evening, and it's time for, you know, prize giving and speeches, and I tell you, the standing ovation that Drew got from the room, from a packed room at Brammel Golf Club was, it really did put a lump in your

throw, actually. It was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was fantastic. Did he, did, did, well, his, his children were all there, uh, daughter Hannah had come over from Vancouver, son Matt had come over from Oregon. I mean, just an incredible effort that everyone had made, but this is the point of the story. Mark Chapman's had to go by this point. He's hosting the Monday nightclub, so he's not present at the prize giving. We didn't win anything, so he wasn't going to have to go up and receive anything. He is very good at leaving early. Yeah. Well, he also made mention of possibly retiring from golf as he headed for the car park. That kind of gives you an indication of grump, grumpily. Ever so slightly. Anyway, it gets

two, all the prizes are handed out and it gets to the raffle. And there were two fantastic prizes in the raffle. So the raffle was 20 quid in. You must have had over 100 people in the big tombola who could have been pulled out to win the raffle prizes. There are only two of them. So two names are going to come out of this tombola. One of the prizes is a really kind of state of the art lab putter. I mean, these things cost hundreds, if not thousands of pounds and are guaranteed to improve your gain on the Greens. And the other one was this enormous professional golf bag in a very gaudy, green and white with sponsors' names emblazoned all over it. And as Rob Nothman said at the time, you would actually need a caravan to get that golf bag to the course before you even use the bag

on the course. Anyway, so the raffle starts. Rob No's hand goes into the hat. And you know where this is going, don't you? Guess guess whose name out of over 100 envelopes comes out of the hat? It wasn't David Affengruber, was it? It wasn't David Affingroober. Hair Chapman's

name is on the envelope that comes out of the hat. Rob and I looked at each other and I could see the thought process go, and we were both thinking exactly the same thing. And we had, we had, Rob basically had a choice here. It was either give Chapman

a golf bag, he'd had to have gone for the golf bag, that he would have absolutely detested to own. It would have been a nightmare to transport, and he would have absolutely hated it, or just stick the envelope back in the thing and let someone else, basically, someone far more worthy, get the prize. Rob No, made exactly the right decision.

Chappas name just disappeared back to the bottom of the barrel. And so he won the raffle, but he didn't win the raffle. And he might be finding out about that for the very first. the first time. So let's hope so. Don't tell him that on Saturday afternoon, Ian. No, I won't, but somebody.

I'll say somebody. I do tend to speak to him on a Saturday morning. So loose lips sink shifts. I will have to pretend that I don't know that story. And let's see if he finds out. He'll find out. He'll find out. Oh, he will find out.

You'll also enjoy, Ali. And I know we need to hear from Thomas Tucker. we've got clash of the commentators, etc, etc. However, there is another story that you need to know in that Ian and I both at Wembley. Ian's on his way to Brighton for the Brighton Arsenal commentary. Ian, tell us what happened yesterday on your way down to Wembley. Well, I travelled down.

It was a nice day when I left home, so I've been wearing my shorts and trainers. Travelled down, went to put my shoes, trousers on today, and I realised that I didn't pack any socks. All I had was a pair of ankle socks from yesterday. White ankle socks. White ankle socks that didn't really go with my brown pair of shoes and trousers. And therefore, that every time that I've crossed my legs, you just saw a flash of white.

So when he walked in the room, the first time I saw you today, Ian walked in the room, sat down. I thought, that's a not choice. I had to make a point of not crossing my legs. and Thomas Tuchel came in the room, I stood up. I mean, if you've got no sock, that's fashionable, isn't it? No sock is very, you know, it's very football manager. Yeah, that would have, that would also have caught my eye

if Ian turned up in trousers, shoes and no stock. Well, Ali, as you know, the big man doesn't miss anything. And let's swiftly move on from that, because as John says, he's been talking to Thomas Tuchel, who's named it, Sorry, who's getting a little bit emotional, who's named his squad for the upcoming Nations League fixtures, and the headlines are Col Palmer, Trent Alexander Arnold, are in, Phil Foden again misses out,

and John's been chatting to the England manager, so let's first hear from him, on why England couldn't beat Argentina to reach the World Cup final. It is a difficult road to go down to and trying to find this one puzzle piece that was missing. First of all, I think we're closing the gap constantly. we need to recognize the record that we have now, how close we are. We arrive in finals, we arrive in semifinals, we win bronze medals in euros and World Cups consecutively,

but we don't push it over the line. We have to acknowledge that as well. To look for this one thing that was missing, like I think there's a very difficult, maybe impossible road to go down. We're looking at a lot of things. So you look at the fatigue of players, you look at the fatigue of players, You look at the season that they come from. We look at our very demanding style of play that we had in the tournament.

That is also our biggest strengths. We look at travel fatigue. We look at miles and planes. We look at, of course, at substitutions. We look at formations. You look at all these things. We look at training. We look at recovery.

We look at sleep. And is it one thing? I doubt it. I think it's very common. It's very complex, don't underestimate the element of luck in football. Maybe we did nothing wrong. It was just like the cross with the right foot from Messy. Didn't see him do that often.

I mean you can torture yourself with these reviews and with these trying to analyze it. I can assure everyone that we are very critical, very critical about ourselves. But I have to say to a certain degree. And then we focus on the 90, 95% that ever went so well and keep pushing from there. And for this squad, first squad post-World Cup, it seems strange that the inclusion of a Rail Madrid player will attract a lot of attention. But Trent Alexander Arnold, again, you mentioned behavior. You say you want to see the best version of him. He's only played, I think, about less than half an hour of football for you as the England manager.

do you feel you've not seen the best version of him with England? No, for sure not. For sure not. So otherwise he would have been in camp with us straight away again. But on and off the pitch? I'm not even blaming him. It wasn't a difficult, difficult window for him, for all of us. We didn't play well.

And he just managed even emotionally, but also physically his switch from Liverpool, which was not easy in the end, if you remember, into Real Madrid, which is never easy, I think, to enter a club of that size. So was it always fair? Maybe not from my side, but if you remember the next camp was September and we were suddenly flying.

We stick to the same squad in October and that was basically it for him. So there was never a chance for him to come back, be it fair or not fair. I just trusted the guys who were in camp and I had evidence for. So Jordan Henderson said it so, so impressively well. before the match against France you just never know when your next England match is coming so guys this is it

this is the next England match you play to the fullest you show up with the right attitude and you give it all because you never know and it's not even a shout out to trend it's a shout out to everyone that's a mentality that we want to have if you come to camp

it's not an international break it's an international window and this is this is important and this matters. And you don't come to relax, you don't come to take a break, you come to perform. And it's difficult to perform for England

and the guys who performed now they have our trust and the guys who come new into camp, yeah, we demand the highest of them. It includes Trent, but it's not exclusively from him. That's for everyone who comes to our camps. It's not exclusively for Trent,

but it seems as if he can't help but feel it is directed towards him. You do feel that. And I think also, would Trent Alexander Arnold actually have been in this squad if Reese James had not been injured,

which he is, and Ben White as well, and Jed Spence, too. But the fact that they're not in this squad means that Trent Alexander Arnold has this opportunity, and that sounded like a very clear message

to him from the England manager. And I think more widely, Ali, I thought it was, I was so interested to see what Thomas Tuchel was going to be like today, how he was going to approach this. And now he's done some in-house interviews with the FTA, which were released earlier this week.

But this is when he was speaking to the media at large, the wider media, and whether he would dwell on what happened, whether it would be all, well, let's move on, let's turn the page, etc, etc. I think we saw a little bit of both of that. But I thought the word that he used, I thought really put his finger on how I felt, I think how many England fans will feel about what happened and how it ended for England. And that was unfulfilled. He used the word unfulfilled.

And I thought, do you know what? That is absolutely. Because even though we had the thrills and stills with England, even though there was then that extraordinary final match against France and yes, England can say, finished in third, highest finish of the World Cup since 1966, I'm afraid the memory that stays with me from that Will Cook was that it slipped away in that half hour. It was there. England were 1-0 up and for all of those variety of reasons that he outlined there when I asked him about whether he had made conclusions about what happened, that in the end, the feeling was unfulfilled.

Yeah, I mean, I remember listening to you, you know, to the commentary in the summer and that last 20 minutes and those closing stages. And yes, and feeling exactly that with England. And now, I don't know about you guys, but in terms of where this international window now sits and we go into Nations League games, and I know England's first game, you know, is against Spain,

which is a really sort of mouth-watering fixture. You know, by that final performance in the World Cup, they did end it on a high. but I almost put that game to one side in a sense because it wasn't the semifinal, it's not the be all and end all. Finishing third in a World Cup, yes is an achievement,

but to me that's a semi-final defeat. I don't really think about third or fourth. Four games in quick succession here. And I feel with the sort of England supporting public at large, there's a bit of work to be done, isn't there, to win back some support. And yet when you listen to Thomas Tuchel, He says that 99% of the supporters aren't talking about that half an hour against Argentina.

He says that they're talking about the fight back against D.R. Congo. They're talking about the game against Mexico. They're talking about the extra time win against Norway. And yet, from my point of view, and I was watching the game as a fan, like John, I still reflect on that 30 minutes where we didn't seem to take any risks. we surrendered it. We relinquished any, and I speak we as an English, an England fan. I felt that we had an opportunity or England had an opportunity and they didn't take it. And I felt that the substitutions that he made were negative. And I said at the time on Five Live,

that if you look back to the Croatia game, which was in the balance, he made positive changes in that first game, which they ultimately went on to win by four goals to two. On this occasion, he made defensive changes and it came back to bite them. I think on that night, as a set up time, I think he lost a percentage of the constituency of England fans

and I think they'll take a lot of winning background and probably the only way they will be won background is if England actually win a trophy. And in terms of why it's happened, I thought the thing that stood out to me today and he mentioned it there in the interview but he also referred to England not being what he called the most economical team.

He said, and that's because of the Premier League. He said, you have to max out. And he said he felt that the team, the England team at the World Cup, maxed out in every single game. But I think the point he's making is that the maxing out of England players is not the same capacity as the maxing out of players in other teams because of the intensity of the Premier League. That's how I understood it.

Ian, did you feel the same way about that? Yeah, I probably would, actually, yeah. Just to say as well that Sammy Mockbell was here for the BBC Sport website. So the ins and the outs of the squad, we don't need to go it through now. You can check that out on the BBC Sport website. And also, I'll ask you two a question, actually, about the Nations League. But England starts against Spain at home. Scotland have got Slovenia away.

Wales have got Portugal away, your favourite, John? the new Portuguese coach, George Jesus. I was waiting for you to say that. You're a little bit slow on the update there. And Northern Ireland, they're away to Georgia. But there'll be four games played. So what are your thoughts on this new extended international break?

Or in Thomas Tuchel's words, international window. Because there are now only two international breaks before Christmas. The October schedule disappears in favor of this extended three-week window. Well, I like the Nations League, and as you two know, I'd like to see this extended into the qualifying procedure for the next tournament. I'd like to see them adapt this and make this the qualifier for, as it will be this time, the next euro. So I think it offers Thomas Tuchel, and he was talking about this today, as he said it, like, what they would like to think would be a 10-match cycle, so they play the 6-3. group matches and then they'll have to win the group to probably have to win against Spain as form in that first match to new world champions if you're going to win the group.

But then if you get through to the final then you potentially have four matches there. You know, that is the target to win a trophy. If they win a trophy and I know people who say, well, it's not the World Cup, it's not the European Championship, but if they win that trophy, then I think you have a slightly different standing because you've won a trophy when it comes to playing in the next European championship for England if they qualify it would be on home territory. Yeah, and it does feel to me, I was going to make that point that they should take it very seriously because I know some people would look down their noses a little bit at the Nations League.

I think I'm right in saying in terms of Nations League finals and reaching the Final Four and having a chance to win that tournament. It was only in the first edition that England managed to qualify for that Final Four, isn't it? Yeah. So, no, I agree, John, and I think that would go. I think that would go. I think that would go. long way to trying to help England get over the line in a major tournament and also, as you say, you know, winning some favour back with the fans from Thomas Tuchel. It does feel, it does feel like, I know what they're trying to do with this. It does feel that international football has returned. It was such a mammoth, Monster World Cup. I don't feel quite ready for,

ready, no. For international football at the moment. I understand that. And on the Nations League, Spain and France regularly get to the finals of those tournaments and that does them no harm at all. And as regards four matches, let's just see. I think it's going to feel a little bit like the World Cup all over a game. Four matches with England talking to Thomas Tuchel, pre-match, post-match, four times in a row.

So let's just say how it goes. Well, this international break actually creates an international window because we might well do a little bit more Q&A over the next couple of episodes during the break from the domestic football. So please do send your questions over. You can email TCV at BBC.co.uk. Don't forget the WhatsApp thing, the messages and voice notes is 08,289-389-369. This is how the weekend looks on Five Live.

The Clash of the commentators, oh great, that's on its way. As is the Great Glossary. Friday night, Brentford Chelsea. That's into Premierly kickoff with Rick Edwards. Saturday lunchtime, updates of Spurs Villa. That's into Five Live Sport with Hare Chapman. Spurs looking still to continue their search for their first league goal. And then the commentaries, Brian and Hobelian against Arsenal.

I'm joined by Curtis Davis at 3 for the usual goal service in the commentary for what is a cracking game. got to say. Newcastle Hall City, that's our alternative listening on three on Sports Extra 2. John, you're up at 5.30 with Deon Dublin, Nottingham Forest Coventry. Yep. First visits in Nottingham Forest to the city ground this season. They've already sent the menu, which I was rather surprised by, that they're going to be serving us in the media room tomorrow. And what is it? I think it was braised beef and carrots. So that's something to look forward to. But then the match, first time to see Coventry City back in the Premier League, really looking forward to that.

But I must say, Ian, I think Brighton, Arsenal is, I mean, that's as good a game as there's been so far this season, potentially. Yeah, it's funny, you're looking at the screen to talk to me, and I'm looking at you across the room. It's throw me a little bit. Can I just say as well, Forrest have really raised up there, Auntie, with the food this year in the press room. Have they? Yeah, I've been there twice. and a bit more variation.

But you're right, going back more seriously, Brighton in the last two seasons have beaten both the reigning champions in Liverpool and Manchester City. So that'll be a real test for Arsenal. And then on Sunday, Ali, you're not presenting. You're back doing the day job. Hurrah, yes.

I'm on commentary duty at 2 o'clock alongside Rob Green, who had a good chat to earlier on today, didn't see him during the World Cup. So had a good old catch up with Rob Green. And we are doing Bournemouth Liverpool, which on paper is a really tasty fixture. I think, I mean, Bournemouth's excellent win in their first European game this week. But that does make it tricky for them on Andonia Aeola's return, because obviously played on the Thursday night away from home.

And if you look at the Bournemouth lineups so far this season, Marco Rosa very clearly relying on a core group of players. So I think it's 10 of them have started all the Premier League games and played most minutes in them and the European game as well. And that turnaround is quite quick. And Liverpool, you know, unbeaten under Iriola, but not fully firing as yet, are they? So I think this one sets up really nicely.

Yeah. I noticed as well that both Bournemouth and Crystal Palace for their respective European matches on Thursday night as well went with unchanged sides. and obviously it's been a perfect start for English clubs in European competition because Palace travel to Leeds, which will be a really tough match for a two o'clock kickoff. Commentary of that is on Sports Extra 2 because Leeds are playing very, very well. And then full of Manchester United with Vicki Sparks and Clinton Morrison, Craven Cottage 430,

and John Ewer at Old Trafford where you witnessed Manchester United losing a home game, having held a half-time lead for the first time since May 1984. Yeah, and I've seen and commentated on both of their defeats in the last week, the two defeats in the space of four days at Old Trafford. And before that, Michael Carrick had a brilliant record. In fact, he'd won all of his matches apart from the home defeat against Leeds towards the end of last season. So that match last Sunday was the first time Manchester United had not scored in a match under him at Old Trafford. And then that fact, which I was reminded by Bill Edgar in the times, and the number of times that I've said, that over the years. And after the match, I saw, I saw it. And I thought, oh, of course, that's it.

Now, they've finally led at half time and then lost the match, first time since 1984. And also, the first time that they've lost after having a two-goal lead, I read post-match at Old Trafford since 1976. And the worrying thing, I think, from a Manchester United point of view, those are the sort of records, the records you don't want, that have been falling regularly for a series of Manchester United managers. And as Michael Carrick said, post-match, things seems to have conspired against Manchester United very quickly. And he was referring as well to the match before that

when they conceded that late equaliser, Natal and Niles goal against Everton. You know, and it does feel, I thought the reaction on Wednesday night, the loudness of the booze on the final whistle. You know, it just felt that, you know, history is kind of threatening to repeat itself. You know, that match on Sunday is so important for Manchester United.

But as you say, you saw Fulham last week. I heard you say it, you know, that they were impressive at Anfield. Yeah, they were. I thought they were the better team in long periods against Liverpool at Anfield last week. And they obviously got a victory in the league cup in midweek as well. but I don't know about you, Al. I mean, it is a huge game because the media narrative

is that the pressure is building on Michael Carrick, but I don't know about you, but I just feel that the players have got to take some responsibility. They're 2-0-0 at home. And I just think that you can't keep going through the same cycle of getting rid of managers at Manchester United. If that's the case, then the hierarchy then need to have a long, hard look at themselves as well.

I think the players have got to step up. Yeah, no, I'd agree. you in and I think I think this was always going to be the case this season if Manchester United didn't start well because the debate that everyone got into at the end of last season was you know even though Michael

Carrick has done extremely well with Manchester United towards the end of that season should we should Manchester United go looking for a manager someone to manage the club who has managed at a a higher level, more consistently for a longer time and more successfully than Michael Carrick.

So as soon as the results didn't go well at the start of this season, this problem was always going to come. I think, I think you're right, Ian, in terms of what you say about it being just as much on the players, if not more. I think they've got a slight problem at centre forward at the moment in that Matthias Coonier has not been that impressive as impressive as he can be at the start of this season. Michael Carrick doesn't seem to really trust Benjamin Shesko, I wondered even about maybe, I mean, Rashford looks sharp at the start of the season, whether he would be an option playing through the middle for Manchester United.

But yeah, and saying that, if they hadn't conceded the goals they considered at Everton, and I know that's ifs, buts and maybes. There's a slightly different complexion on the season then if they hold on and win that game, isn't there, I know. But now the only Premier League win is against Ipswich, who pushed them for about an hour or so and then sort of subsided towards the end of the game. But you're right. there's pressure. There's pressure on this game.

But also the hierarchy, they should have strengthened their defence as well in the summer. I do think that they've missed an opportunity there. And also the fact that when the results were going their way, they were by and large a counter-attacking team. Manchester United are still don't think we're at that stage where they could impose themselves on teams and pass the ball. They still need to rely on being a team on the counter-attacking.

attack or transition if you'd want to use the more in vogue phraseology. In the 90s, women's tennis was having a moment. This is a match that will live in the memory of all of us forever. Steady had been so dominant. Suddenly along came Monica Sellis. She hit the bar big, she hit two hands off both sides. And just when tennis fans were licking their lips at the prospect of a rivalry that would push the sport to new heights, one of the strangest and most sure.

Shocking sporting crimes brought it to a grinding halt. Monica Selesh has been stabbed by a spectator. This man stole her story from her. Sports strangest crimes, tennis's darkest hour. Listen on BBC sounds. With a subscription to the BBC website and app, you can now get early access to your favorite BBC podcasts. Listen to shows like, You're Dead to Me, In Our Time,

good bad billionaire, and more. Plus, there's all the other great benefits you get with a BBC podcast. BBC subscription. From live streaming the BBC News channel and acclaimed documentaries to in-depth analysis and features, visit BBC.com forward slash subscribe to find out more. The commentators view on the Football Daily with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis. TCB at BBC.com.com.com. 08,000, 289-39369. I tell you what, we had a lot of the correspondence on the hand clasps versus the handshakes debate from last week's episode. Fears growing that the old-fashioned handshake may be a thing of the past.

Everton fan Sid, who started this clasp nonsense? It's an abomination. Nick says, I missed the handshake. Granted, the clasp going down the line in football is a lot quicker. That, man, it just looks so limp, says Nick. correspondence from Hong Kong this is Geoffrey who says in Asia nobody shakes hands anymore

after COVID we do fist bumps rather than a clasp we were discussing the fist bump as well last week and Marcelo it gets worse they're doing high fives in the Portuguese league games gone and this from Tranmeer fan Mike

Morning chaps hope you are well and love them being back in the swing of things I know me and Mrs Wallace are very happy that we can want a game fall asleep to your voices. Anyway, I'm emailing to say I was very disappointed to hear Chapman criticizing your conversation about our handclaps and how handshakes have changed. As a local non-league referee in Essex, I was on the way to a game and I thought I was going to put your theory to the test.

When I wore both teams out, I made the point of doing a formal handshake rather than the clap. Five players looked at me like I was from another planner. The others just brushed my hand very quickly, but the best part was three players genuinely did not know what to do. They couldn't clap or shake hands. They got completely confused. So there you have it, chaps.

Prove that you are correct. The handshake as we known it has gone. Keep up the good work chaps. Your voices are much more pleasant than Mrs. Wallace's snoring throughout the summer. All the best, Mike. Oh, sorry, Mrs. Wallace,

that you had to hear that from Mike. You can berate him back in the homestead. Do you think if Mrs. Wallace goes through a night without snoring that he high-fives are in the bed? No, I don't. Good news though from Jack in Essex who says, I was reminded of your conversation on handshakes in sport when I was as an old rule Suboutio tournament at the weekend. And when playing at my club, the world famous RAS, which is Rochford and South End casual substitute. Rochford and Southend casual Subutio Club.

There were indeed handshakes between players and referees after the games. So good to see handshakes are still alive and well. Moving it on from the handshakes, but plenty more correspondence. TCV at BBC.co.com. Richard in Oxfordshire gets in touch. Listening on a Sunday morning walk around Blenheim Palace, I like the term Manita, if I've got Hall, was a Manita. But as an Oxford United supporter, my thoughts immediately sprung to our stalwart, that's a good word, Cameron Branigan, who once scored four penalties in a match against Gillingham.

Surely this feat deserves its own special term. And can you remember witnessing any other such unique achievement? Did Justin Cliver score a hat-trick of penalties last season? He did. I've done it in the notes today, John. against, I'm going to say wolves, Jose Saar was the goalkeeper. Yes, that's correct.

Yeah, but not for, like Cameron Brannigan. No. And just while he'll, Ian flicks through his boot, just going back to the handshakes and blasts. Rather amusingly at Old Trafford, first time I've seen Clinton, Morrison, this season. As Clinton walked towards me in the press box, he came towards me in a clasping style,

and I managed to turn him back into a handshake. It wasn't last season. When was it? It was the season before. Because it's not in last season's Red Book. Ah, you're right, Ian. And that will be in my notes. And Kleiber didn't play that much last season.

Actually, did he? He missed quite a lot of the season with injury. He did, yeah. Season before. In November 2024, Gary. Gary's here, football producer Gary, so he can't ring in during this record of the pot. He could do.

But strangely enough, in keeping with the tradition, one of our other football producers, Rob Schofield. has actually tried to ring me. During the recording of this podcast, so it's catching. And not too far down the road from Richard, Penelope and Wilcher says, in a world of sensationalist news and internet noise,

I find TCV a much-needed retreat into a world of glorious sports-related tangents and sooth and chat. Viviana Medemar scored a double hat-trick for the mighty Arsenal against Bristol City. A few years back, says Penelope, as part of what remains the record-winning margin in the WSL. Perhaps therefore, the double hat trick could be branded a VIV in her honour. And the VI could even be Roman numeral. Roman numerals for six.

That's good. Yeah. That is very good. And just on that note, that's very good, Penelope. Is that our first Penelope, do you think, Colin? think Penelope might have been into it before. I think so too. Okay. Not crucial, not crucial, but thank you. But just picking up on that, Bill Edgar from the Times, who does all that wonderful stat stuff in the Times. Great, great nuggets in there ahead of a weekend's football commentary,

has been in touch. And Bill says you were discussing the big individual goal tallys in English top flight games. The record is seven goals by Ted Drake for Arsenal, away to Aston Villa in December 1935, and after that, six players have scored the double hat-trick, six goals, with the Jeff Hurst case in 1968. So Keith, do you remember Keith got into this last week, West Hamfan, who I think was there to see the Jeff Hurst double hat trick. That is the only one since the Second World War. And then Bill is very kindly, I won't read out the list, but sent me the list of six players.

Steve Blum is in that list, actually, who've scored six goals in top-flight football. but Bill finishes by suggesting that the term for a seven-goal haul should simply be a drake. A Drake. I like that. Although, although, according to my notes, so I carry this one around with me, because if there's one player who's going to score seven in a game, it's going to be Harland, isn't it? And according to my notes, so on my Manchester City notes, I've got this at the very top. Neville Tin, Coleman, was the last to score seven.

was in the second division in 1957 when Stoke beat Lincoln City 8-0. So maybe rather than a Drake, it should be called a tin. I can see Nathan, as quick as a flash, put a note in the script here, that apparently we have had a different Penelope in touch before. That was Penelope. Pit stop. The often mispronounced town of Hoyke. Oh, right.

So two Penelope, another penelope. I think Ian, the time has come. Yes, I know, I'm afraid. For you, my friend, it is time for Clash of the Commentators and another chance for Ian to get his first point on the board this season, the defending champion, don't you forget. Here's the league table. After I beat Ian last week on Manchester Derby players,

so Ali is top of the table because he's played two, one-two, and then it's me, just slightly behind Ali, played 3-1-2 and then a long way behind us two. It's Ian. Don't rub it in. Who has played three and not 1-1 yet. That was done in a Nicholas Parsons style from the old style, just a minute, leaderboard.

So Ian and Ali are going to take turns this week to answer a question and give as many correct answers as they can in 30 seconds. and because Ian is sitting with me in this room at Wembley Stadium, but we won't have to have the usual carry on if who is going first and who's going second. So we are ready to go. Ali has unplugged and Ian, this week's category comes from listener Tavill. Good day from the Czech Republic, he says.

Interestingly, he doesn't say it. The day from Czechia. He says, good day from the Czech Republic. and he's there. Here's one for you ahead of England's home and away games in the upcoming

international break. Name as many players as you can from the Czech Republic to have played in the Premier League. So quite simply, Ian,

Czech players who have played in the Premier League starting now. Pavl Sernichek, Vladimir Sufau, Thomas Sochek, Patrick Berger,

Petritschek, Horny Horny check Newcastle Derrida Was there a Derrida? He played in the Premier New York City

I'll enjoy your strategy there of coin for players who have a check in their name Right, let's call Ali back in Yes, here he comes Here he comes Yes, yes, yes Right

Right Ready? So Yes This week's category comes from listener Pavel And he says, Good day from the Czech Republic, not Czech here.

He says the Czech Republic. He's there. He says, here's one for you, ahead of England's home and away games with the Czech Republic in the upcoming international break. Name as many players as you can

from the Czech Republic to have played in the Premier League. So quite simply, Czech players to have played in the Premier League. Your time starts now. Thomas Sue Chew-Cech, Pavel Sernichek

Patrick Berger Um Oh blimey No Deno's going to win this one I can't think of a single Czech players Oh repka was check Wasn't he Thomas Repka for West Ham

Um Oh no this is dreadful Um I'll say Petter check Because he's Czech Oh well You went down a very similar line to Ian in naming

Czech men who have Czech in their names and actually you started off with almost the same player which was interesting so you The one of this was Smeitzer Oh that's good yeah So Ian No, Derrida Ian who you mentioned

did not claim the Premier League So Ian said, Sernichick, Sofowl, Sochek, burger, check, and horny check. Ali said, Sochek, Sernichek,

burger, repka, and check. So by my calculations, Ian has won it at 6, 5. Oh. Oh, that was close. That was close on. I thought it was going to do. Do you know what that is, Ellie?

Yeah. That's checkmate. Oh, it is. And Ian, congratulations on your first. win of the season. Well, I've got to say, I'm glad I've got that burden off my back. Well done.

I can tell that. I can tell that. Have we, I mean, obviously. John, some of the other ones that you've missed. Yeah, I was going to say, John, what are the obvious ones? I mean, I'm annoyed. I've not said so foul, having said Sochek. That's stupid, because they come as a pair.

I think you've got most of the ones that I think that you might have mentioned. Oh, there's a Ludec, McCloscoe. Yeah. You know, the sad news this week. He would have been on the list. What an outpouring there was after the announcement of his death this week. Carol Paborski. Carol Paborski is...

Yeah, that's a good one. Is Kinski? Kinski. Tottenham. Is he a Czech? Yep. Anthony Kinski is on the list. Who else is on there?

What's a real rogue one that's on the list? Okay, yeah, there's a few of those. How about Marcel Getschoff, who played for Fulham in 2011, 2012? Is that rogue enough for you? Yeah, that is rogue. Yeah. Very good. Yeah, well, on the table.

So Ian now wins his first point of the season. That means we've now got the other end of the table. We are now all square, aren't we? Ali's played three, one, two. I've played three, one, two. So Ali is top of the table on alphabetical order. And then Ian, bottom of the table, with one win from four now, here.

But I know you claim that I was a long way behind, but I'm actually now only one behind you. I'm within touching distance. I can tell you from personal experience the last two seasons how difficult bad he is to claw back. Right. Let's get straight on to our great glossary of football commentary as we build a collection of commentary terms and phrases.

Division one, remember, is for football exclusive terms, Division two, for terms used across various sports. Last week we added, you could have had two goalkeepers in there and they still wouldn't have saved it. That went into Division I. and on that theme, Dan from Gloucester says, look forward to the pod every week, and I'm studying for my A-Levels this year.

Just again goes to show about John's theory that if you're under the age, whatever, what is it, 30? No, teenager. Teenagers, absolutely. Teenagers writing voice notes, you'll get on. Anyway, Dan says, my suggestion is, gone for the spectacular. I've only heard this in football

and think this is a Division I entry, keep up the good work. So that's gone for the spectacular. At the other end of the scale, Jez writes in and says, as a Crystal Palace fan of many years, I'm frequently left hoping that one of our strikers

will find their shooting boots after just needing one to go in off their backside. This latter suggestion, says Jez, might be accounted at the Division I because I can't think of any other sport where this would be allowed as a goal. And I heard Dionne Dublin

used this last weekend just need one to go in off their backside, which I think he was referring to Coventry City. Yeah, I mean, I think Jess may well be right there, but then what interests me is what is the equivalent in other sports? It doesn't matter. No, I know it doesn't matter,

but I'm interested in that, John. I'm interested in what's the equivalent of one going in off your backside in tennis. If you can't win a point, you need someone. One going in off the net post. Well, exactly. Exactly. That's what I'm thinking.

But on the gone for the spectacular, I think you could have that in something like tennis. Because if you go for that spectacular, you sort of cross, yeah, yeah. So I think that's probably a dip two. I agree. I agree. From way, way out.

Yeah, I think down the suggestion's got to be div two. Yeah. Yeah. But going in off the backside has got to. It's got to be Division 1. Division 1. Got to be. Yeah.

I cannot envisage that being used in any other sport. Snooker wouldn't happen, would it? No. Depends who's playing, actually, doesn't it? Mark from Ontario in Canada, our global reach. Again, hi T-CV, love the podcast. I'm 15. Hurrah, there we go.

We need a fan. fair for that, don't we? I'm 15 and me and my family all listen each week on our Saturday afternoon. Bike ride. All listen together on a bike ride. That's interesting, isn't it? Riding as a group, all listening to the pod at the same time. I feel almost burdened by that.

Yeah. We're all lifelong Manchester United supporters. I hope one day to come to England to watch them play. My suggestion for the great glossary is this. When a player scores a hat trick like Bruno Fernandez did against Ipswich, I had to sneak that in there. They're often described as taking the match ball home.

Now, surely this is only used in football. What do you think? Thank you so much for making my week better. Well, I've got to do that, Mark. Yeah, thank you very much, Mark. And I can tell you as well on Bruno Fernandez in advance of their matches, just as I'm commented on them this season. So I did have a listen

to the Premier League pronunciation, the videos that were being sent. And it's still right up there. Brun Fanan. It's still. right up there as one of my favorite connotations. Bruno Fernand. Taking the match ball home?

I should know this, but in rugby if you score a hat trick, do you take the match ball home? I don't know. I don't know. Hockey? Don't know. Why don't we pose that one for the listeners to get in touch on? But for the time being, we put in in Division one. So, in summary, gone for the spectacular,

Division 2. For the time being, Division 1, taking the match ball home, but definitely in Division I and getting the John Murray seal of approval needs one to go in off their backsides. And just finally this from Kenneth in Glasgow. Hello Wall. Now that you have a newly found battalion of teenage listeners, I expect you will have been deluge with communications regarding the evolution of the handshake. You're quite right, Kenneth.

My 17-year-old son confirmed for me that to greet your opponent using the clasping manner is to dapp or to dapp up the other party. I look forward to hearing this in some forthcoming

five live commentaries very Murray-esque. There is a challenge for you then, John. You've got to tap up. I am taking up that challenge, Kenneth. I'm going to take up that challenge this weekend, Nottingham Forest against Coventry. I'm already looking forward to

the dapping up ceremony. Well, that's it for this episode of the commentator's view. So thank you to John and Ali and all of your questions and correspondence. And don't forget, they are always welcome as well, especially ahead of those two potentially Q&As that we're going to do during the international break. So TCV at BBC.com.com.uk. And you can send us a message or voice note, voice note, even on WhatsApp to 08,289-369. And the next episode of the Football Daily will be the football interview with Alexander Isak. You know what?

I'm a little bit upset that you're not doing Manchester City and that Geronimo Ruelly doesn't deputize for Donna Rummer. And then you can say it's Geronimo Ruelly is dapping up late. With five live sport and BBC sounds.

Hit all the live, exciting action from the WSL. And it's bigger and better than ever before. Get all the latest news and interviews from the biggest stars of the women's game. Alexa Vitesse, welcome to the women's football weekly. I love competition, I love football, I love training, I love to improve. To win a league like the WSL, you have to be at your best every single week. Listen with the BBC Sounds app.

Get more with BBC podcasts, wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows, like evil genius, good, bad billionaire, and You're Dead to Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon music subscription.