Football Daily - The Commentators' View: Stealing a march & John in the USA

Episode Date: December 5, 2025

John Murray, Ali Bruce-Ball & Ian Dennis talk travels, football and commentary. They reflect on a dramatic weekend of Premier League football and look ahead to the weekend’s fixtures. John is across the pond for the FIFA World Cup draw. Plus a glut of unintended pub names, heads up for Clash of the Commentators and which commentary phrases will end up in our Great Glossary? Suggestions welcome on WhatsApp voicenotes to 08000 289 369 & emails to [e-mail]00:25 John in Washington DC for World Cup draw 04:50 Dramatic week of Premier League football 09:25 5 Live commentaries this weekend 14:00 Unintended pub names from sport commentary 26:00 Potential twist on the theme? 28:45 Clash of the Commentators 34:50 Great Glossary of Football Commentary5 Live / BBC Sounds Premier League commentaries: Sat 1500 Bournemouth v Chelsea, Sat 1500 Tottenham v Brentford on Sports Extra, Sat 1730 Leeds v Liverpool, Sun 1400 Brighton v West Ham, Sun 1400 Fulham v Crystal Palace.All Clash of the Commentators correct answers: Acheamponh, Alderete, Ballard, Barkley, Bergvall, Beto, Bijol, Bowen, Brobbey, Bruno Guimarães, Calafiori, Calvert-Lewin, Casemiro, Chalobah, De Cuyper, de Ligt, Fernández, Flemming, Foden, Gabriel, Gibbs-White, Gusto, Gyökeres, Haaland, Igor Jesus, Igor Thiago. Isidor, Jiménez, João Pedro, Keane, Kostoulas, Kroupi, Lukic, Maguire, Mateta, Mateus Fernandes, Mayenda, Mbeumo, Merino, Mitoma, Munetsi, Muñoz, Ndoye, Onana, Pedro Neto, Rice, Richarlison, Rodon, Romero, Sarr, Sarr, Schade, Smith Rowe, Thiaw, Timber, Ugochukwu, van de Ven, van Hecke, Welbeck, Wilson, Woltemade, Zubimendi.Glossary so far (in alphabetical order):DIVISION ONE Bosman, Couldn’t sort their feet out, Cruyff Turn, Dead-ball specialist, Fox in the box, Giving the goalkeeper the eyes, Head tennis, Hibs it, In a good moment, The Maradona, Off their line, Olimpico, Onion bag, Panenka, Points to the spot, Rabona, Schmeichel-style, Scorpion kick, Spursy, Tiki-taka, Where the kookaburra sleeps, Where the owl sleeps, Where the spiders sleep. DIVISION TWO Ball stays hit, Business end, Came down with snow on it, Catching practice, Cauldron atmosphere Coat is on a shoogly peg, Come back to haunt them, Corridor of uncertainty, Easy tap-in, Daisy-cutter, First cab off the rank, Good leave, Half-turn, Has that in his locker, High wide and not very handsome, Hospital pass, Howler, Johnny on the spot, Leading the line, Nutmeg, One for the cameras, One for the purists, Played us off the park, Purple patch, Put their laces through it, Rolls Royce, Root and branch review, Row Z, Screamer, Seats on the plane, Show across the bows, Slide-rule pass, Steal a march, Stramash, Taking one for the team, That’s great… (football), Thunderous strike, Walk it in. UNSORTED 2-0 is a dangerous score, After you Claude, All-Premier League affair, Aplomb, Bag/box of tricks, Brace, Brandished, Bread and butter, Breaking the deadlock, Bundled over the line, Champions elect / champions apparent, Clinical finish, Commentator’s curse, Coupon buster, Cultured/Educated left foot, Denied by the woodwork, Draught excluder, Elimination line, Fellow countryman, Foot race, Formerly of this parish, Free hit, Goalkeepers’ Union, Goalmouth scramble, Good touch for a big man, Honeymoon Period, In and around, In the shop window, Keeping ball under their spell, Keystone Cops defending, Languishing, Loitering with intent, Marching orders, Nestle in the bottom corner, Numbered derbies, Opposite number, Park the bus, PK for penalty-kick, Postage stamp, Put it in the mixer, Rasping shot, Red wine not white wine, Relegation six-pointer, Rooted at the bottom, Route One, Roy of the Rovers stuff, Sending the goalkeeper the wrong way, Shooting boots, Sleeping giants, Slide rule pass, Small matter of, Spiders web, Stayed hit, Steepling, Stinging the palms, Stonewall penalty, Straight off the training ground, Taking one for the team, Team that likes to play football, Throw their cap on it, Thruppenny bit head / 50p head, Towering header, Two good feet, Turning into a basketball match, Turning into a cricket score, Usher/Shepherd the ball out of play, Walking a disciplinary tightrope, Wand of a left foot, We’ve got a cup tie on our hands, Winger in their pocket, Wrap foot around it, Your De Bruynes, your Gundogans etc.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Football Daily is sponsored by Spring Hill Suites, part of Marriott Bonvoy, the official hotel partner of US soccer. The road ahead is full of surprises and unforgettable moments for the US men's national team. Make your next holiday a memorable one at Spring Hill Suites. Enjoy complimentary hot breakfast and spacious all-sweet accommodation for the whole team, with room for up to six guests. Big journeys start with the right stay. Visit springhillsweets.marriott.com to find out more. To embrace the impossible requires a vehicle that pushes what's possible.

Defender 110 boasts a towing capacity of 3,500 kilograms, a weighting depth of 900 millimeters and a roof load up to 300 kilograms. Learn more at landrover.ca. The commentators view on the Football Daily with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis Hello Welcome to the Football Daily I'm John Murray

and this is the commentator's view where we five live commentators talk football, our adventures and the language behind the beautiful game Alistair Bruce Ball and Ian Dennis are here. Hello to you Hello from Washington DC

which I know Ian you don't like it when I say where I am but that is where I am it's an inescapable fact I am in Washington DC And also, I know you don't like it when I wish you happy birthday, but happy birthday. Happy birthday, John. Thank you very much. And this probably is slightly misleading because when I guess the majority of people actually listen to this, the World Cup draw will have happened.

So you're going to be commentating on it, Ian, from the UK end. So on the business part of it, you'll be commentating on it where I'll be sweeping up everything that happens before and after. interviewing the movers and shakers. I have a question, John. Is there over there in Washington, D.C., is there more of a frenzy about the World Cup draw and the excitement of that, or about your birthday? At the moment, my birthday,

because as I speak to you, I've really, I've not long been here, and I've actually only just seen the place in daylight. So I'm not able to answer that question, but I will be by the time I appear on Five Live later in the day. Here's a serious question for you both. Are you excited about the World Cup draw? Are you excited to be there, John, and see the names come out?

Well, as you both know, I do love a draw, and the World Cup draw is a really special occasion because it's the World Cup. You know, it is the sort of, it's the event that really has captured the imagination, probably of most people who are interested in football, and, you know, I see it in Thomas Tuchel. When we spoke to him last month,

you know, when you talked about the draw, You know, there's genuine excitement for what it's going to be like. And it really opens the way towards the tournament next summer when we find out really the nuts and bolts. And, okay, we won't know some of the playoff teams, but generally, you know, the groups will be quite clear, won't they? Can I just say when you say that I love a draw, you don't love a draw that much

because you were given a choice of doing the draw or then doing the interviews in Washington, and you chose the latter. if you love doing the draw you'd be in Salford and I'd be in Washington I didn't say I love doing the draw I love the draw. I love the draw process right okay in answer to your question

Ali I'm a little apprehensive obviously when this goes out we'll have known the draw but getting my head around the various permutations is a bit of a head scratcher yeah I mean commentating on a drawer is an unusual thing to do I mean we do it occasionally don't we for the big tournaments but it's not something we often do and there are you know once you obviously

because it's a draw don't know which names are coming out when. You're going to have reams of information about different matchups and countries and groups and whatever. So there is a lot to get your head around there. Yeah. I might actually put on social media at some point all my prep that I've done for the draw.

So keep your eyes peeled. And also, where I'll be post-draw is an extraordinary experience because, and this will be it with bells on because it's a 48-team World Cup. All the culture, so we go into the interview, area and all of the coaches are circulating around there. So some of the biggest names in football are, you know, you are shoulder to shoulder with them and there is that scenario whereby you don't know who's going to be brought to speak

to you next. So, you know, that is also one of the adrenaline-filled parts of the day. I wonder if Thomas Tuchel, what was you a happy birthday? I doubted. Unless you've told him, he won't know. And by that stage, it won't be anymore anyway. and I know you're a big fan of making it into a bigger event than just the actual day, but I prefer to keep it to the day.

Yeah. John, you'll know, because you have a bit of German. It's Gobertsdag is birthday. How do you say happy, happy birth? Is it? Frulisher, no. Gluck, is it? Is it Gluck?

Do they wish you luck on your birthday? Is that it? Do they do that? I have to find out from Thomas, won't me? By the way, John, I just reading the script here before we go any further, we do have a special birthday surprise for you. How do you? Hooray!

Well, I'm touched. So, and it has been a busy week of football, hasn't it? With Ali, you've been in the presenter's chair. Yes. Some dramatic matches. And you've also been back to the Westfield Shopping Centre. Yeah, that gave me some jitters. So I was there last Sunday to do West Ham Liverpool.

and for regular listeners of the podcast they'll probably know what we're talking about but the last time I was there so park at Westfield Shopping Center for West Ham Home Games and the last time I was there was when there was the big fire in the car park and I couldn't get my car out after the game

and then I disappeared off to the rider cup and couldn't get my car out for three weeks and eventually got there and it was all marooned on its own behind loads of fencing and gates and whatever and drove up to the old the barrier where you come out of the car park and it asked me to pay for

490 pounds so it's the which obviously didn't do um so it's the first time i've i've been back there since but that that that that went without a problem uh i saw alexander esax score his first premier league goal for liverpool and take it really well we obviously dealt with the surprising team news that day that mosella didn't start for liverpool then didn't start again against sunderland but had the feeling uh john during the game actually you know liverpool got the win at west hand but the the the performance was not convincing they didn't play but it well and again that's sort of borne through a little bit with what happened to them at home against under Sunderland at Anfield. And Ian last Saturday I was listening to you when I was on my

way down south with what turned out to be actually quite a dramatic match, Manchester City and Leeds United. Yeah, at half time it felt very routine. Manchester City were extremely comfortable leading 2-0 and then the introduction of Dominic Calvert Lewin transformed the game and And again, I guess we saw a little bit of Manchester City with the jitters and the wobbles. What happened then against Fulham in midweek? Because Leeds were able to come back at them, drew to 2-2, and then Fulton scored an injury time winner.

And then obviously they were cruising against Fulham, weren't they? And then once again, they just took their eye off the ball and Fulham almost produced an incredible fight back. It actually brought back memories, Alley, of that game that you did at Craven Cottage against Juventus. Yeah. You know, with what they were looking to try and replicate with all those goals. But so Manchester City defensively not convincing at this stage.

And I have to confess, I will put my hand up, I thought when Leeds had that spirit to come back but got nothing out of it, I thought next thing that will happen, typical for a struggling team is, they'll then have big hopes going into the match with Chelsea and they'll lose. But in actual fact, the very opposite happened. and what an important night that was for Leeds. And Chelsea, of course, who I had seen on the Sunday, I think the same applied, as we discussed after that match. It had been such a big match and a big week for Chelsea,

you know, to have the big win against Barcelona, then the big match against Arsenal. We said the same thing about Arsenal as well, coming into that match, having played Tottenham and Bayern Munich, the two matches before, and missing Caicedo as well, that seems to have taken its toll on them. Yeah. Leeds were impressive, actually. They really went for Chelsea right from the first whistle, got the early goal.

Tanaka then scored a fine second. It was a deserved win for Leeds. And now they go into the Liverpool game, and you know about Liverpool's frailties on the road, looking for back-to-back wins. And I always think down at the bottom of the table for any side that is trying to avoid relegation, if you can get those back-to-back wins, and they only did it once when they were in the Premier League last time, and fun enough, it included a game against Liverpool. but if they can achieve those back-to-back victories,

that will give them such a huge lift. Bearing in mind that many people, and I included, didn't give them much hope of getting anything from teams such as Manchester City, Chelsea and Liverpool for such a tough week, if they can then get, whether it a point or three points against Liverpool, I think that would be a good return for them. Just a very quick one on the title race as well, John. I think what's so, you know, just on the top two in the title race at the moment,

they're so different, aren't they, as teams in the way they're going to? about it this season. In terms of you wouldn't see Arsenal involved in a 5-4 win at Craven Cottage. That is not Arsenal. That's not how they go about it under Mikkel Artetta. But if Manchester City are going to try and chase them down and, well I say chase them

down, they're close enough at the moment, but they're clearly going to do it a very different way because they're going the will score more than you route at the moment. So that contrast between those two's is really good at the moment, I think. Well, you mentioned Leeds Liverpool, Ian, and this is going to be slightly confusing.

isn't it for listeners this? It's going to be a little bit like me being here in America where it's, we haven't had our breakfasts yet, and you've probably both had your lunch. And that's what's going to happen to listeners this weekend, because the three o'clock commentary on Five Live, Ali, you're doing it with Francis Benarly, Bournemouth against Chelsea. So that's on Five Live, as ever. These days, there is a choice of commentary at three o'clock on Saturday afternoon, and that is Tottenham Brentford on the Sports Extra and you, Ian, have slipped into the 5.30 slot. When was the last time you commentated on a Saturday 530? Not for a long time. That's what I thought. I suspect that'll be

raising a Chapman eyebrow. He'll be wondering why that's happening. And also, importantly, Mr. Chris Waddle is with you. Looking forward to that. I mean, I message him on a regular basis and and I knew he was penciled in for that game probably before I knew I was doing it so yeah I'm looking forward to seeing the Waddler did you see the interview with Roberto Deserby a couple of weeks ago Marseille I did ahead of the Marseille Newcastle match

yes it was talking about I sent it to him yes well I just said it I saw it probably half of the Western world but it did say it Ali I don't know if you saw that it deserved to be talking about the influence of Chris Waddle on his footballing life. Oh, I see. So obviously as Marseille coach,

so not just talking about the sort of waddle effect in Marseille, but actually on Deserbie himself. Yeah. Not to undersell our game on Saturday. So Bournemouth Chelsea's the 3 o'clock, which I'm doing with Franny Benarley. But I think Leeds Liverpool, just looking at the fixtures over the weekend,

that looks like the game of the weekend to me in terms of the match-up leads coming off the back of that win and Liverpool's still in their struggles. And the atmosphere, you know, you're going to get there on a Saturday night. I think that is the game of the weekend. And still with Arna Slot under scrutiny as well. You know, I mean

they tried their might to get a late winner after equalising and Vert's I think thought that he probably scored his first goal but it took a deflection didn't it so it went down as an own goal but I think Sunderland had been a breath of fresh air to the Premier League this season. They really have and Leeds United have still given themselves a

fighting chance of staying up with Sunderland. So those are Saturdays. matches on Sunday on 5 live at 2 o'clock, Brighton against West Ham, which will be Jonathan Pierce and Danny Gabidon, should mention Jonathan will be doing the commentary on the World Cup draw on the television on the BBC, while Ian will be commentating on it on 5 Live on drive. So Jonathan at Brighton on Sunday, and then at 4.30, Fulham against Crystal Palace with Connor McNamara and Rob Green. And then we've got European commentaries. next week as well on Five Lives

so Inter-Liverpool Ian you're off to Italy with Stephen Warnock Tottenham Slavia Prague is going to be on Sports Extra on Tuesday night, Connor McNamara and Andy Reid and I've got the small matter of Rail Madrid, Manchester City next week with Jonathan Woodgate so going back to Madrid with Jonathan Woodgate

which is always an enjoyable thing to do Woody might say to you Felice Complianios and he also might say Felice Navidad of course but there's a time of the year and I must mention as well and if Hare Chapman is listening this will cause him to raise an eyebrow because I have done quite a lot of

schmoozing this week because I was at the Football Supporters Association Awards dinner on Monday night which was an excellent occasion to tremendous and really I find it incredibly uplifting that event just because of the

the way that supporters of many of the clubs you know of way down the pyramid in some cases. And, you know, the men's and the women's game get a little bit of a moment in the spotlight. And, you know, it does remind me that event about really what it's all about, you know?

I don't think Hare Chapman would be surprised to hear that you've been schmoozing. I think you're very good at schmoozing. Yeah, well, it takes one to know one. Now, we always love your WhatsApp and voice notes to 08,000, 289-369. emails to TCV at BBC.co.uk and we have had all sorts of unintended pub names from sports commentary this week and some especially good ones as well. Last week's highlights were

the swivelling gack pole, the stumbling Williams and the flapping duck from the Ashes cricket commentary on BBC sounds. And just to explain, these are phrases used in any commentary that you hear, not just ours, any that you hear, that could be pub names. We also mentioned the draft excluder and Steve in Hitchin writes in Dear Fine Gents Surely the draft excluder would have to be a pub or bar

that only sold bottled beers Exclude in draft Matt in Gloucestershire has alerted us to something Five Life Boxing's Steve Bunce said about Rick Edwards in last week's episode I've told Rick if he shows up without socks on

which is the you know which is which is famously popular at the moment, I will be bringing a pair of socks for him to put on. I'm not, I'm not doing boxing shows with a sockless man. Let's put it that way. Matt says the sockless man can just imagine the logo, a bare ankle in some swayed boat shoes. I think this would be a central London pub for city types. Very good, Matt. Yeah, very definitely in the metropolis, the sockless man. We miss that. So when I listened back last week and then put it in the group text chat that we have, we miss that.

Steve's saying it, the Sockless man. Yeah, we miss them all the time, don't we? We do. You sort of, you know, our listeners are listening out for them. I think we're just talking normally. Well, the worst one we missed was the easy tap-in. Yeah. Also, by the way, and I should have put it in the commentary. I only mentioned it after the goal had gone in.

But the second goal that Liverpool scored at West Ham on Sunday was scored by a swivelling Gakpo. He chested the ball down, swiveled and smashed it home. And I didn't have the presence of mind to say, scored by the swivel and gag by, which is annoying. Jacob, Crystal Palace fan in Dubai, says, to the club of commentators, I've been trying to come up with a football expression,

which I think would fit into both Division I of your great glossary of football commentary and be a great pub name. I've thought of one and can't keep it to myself anymore. So I'm really hoping it hasn't been mentioned previously. The manager bounce. I can't think, says Jacob. of any other sport that it would be used in as no other sports feel the need to chop and change managers quite so regularly. And I'm sure this would be a great pub, maybe nightclub name.

Not sure what it would look like, but for some reason, I can visualize it being in Watford. All the best shake of back, which is a fact. Actually, I think surely it should be the new manager bounce. Yeah, definitely. the new manager bounce definitely but whatford is that's a good suggestion very good yeah we've had this from brentford fanny in love the podcast listen to it on my Tuesday morning run just heard a pub name during a goal update from forest you call for goals alley we have one for brighton deserved opener for the visitors scored by maxine de kuyper well found inside the penalty area unmarked and he slid it beyond the sliding cells forest nil brighton one sliding cells chris coals with the goals half time at the london stadium Clinton Morrison is here, West Ham Nill, Liverpool, nil. So Chris Coles said the ball went in under the sliding cells.

That's a great name for a pub, says Ian in the Brentford fan. And it was actually Chris, wasn't it? He came up with the reckless pulp as well, which is one of my favourites of recent times. And also the mention of Clinton there takes us on to the next one. So Clinton was sitting next to me at West Ham. He was also sitting in the studio with me on Tuesday night as we went round the grounds. and Rams fan Liz has got in touch. Dear TCV, I'm slightly alarmed by the fact that everything I hear on the radio nowadays

is turning into an unintended pub name in my head. So I was listening to Ali talking to Chris Warburton on 5 Live Drive ahead of the Newcastle Tottenham match that night when Chris made reference to Clinton Morrison. I like Clinton a lot, actually. I'm a Clinton fan. He is good, I bet he is. Smells amazing, by the way.

I've just greeted him. He smells incredible. A good cologne, is it? Oh, amazing. Yeah, like a cedar wood. Like one of those many stuffings you were talking about on Christmas Day, this sort of wafed of apricot. Right, okay, I'll let you go and take in the scent of Morrison

and have a good one, Ali, good to see you. Liz has actually gone for the scented Morrison, which I think is really good. What a lovely little indie wine bar this could be. There could even be an exclusive chain of them in all the football town cities that Clinton has played in or played for with the flagship bar being at Crystal Palace. Wouldn't Clinton just relish being on the pub sign outside the Scented Morrison? Although when I was on my way to the Football Supporters Association awards the other night, I went down a little street that when I heard that, I thought I could definitely see the

centred man on that street, probably a couple of doors down from the Soccles man. The Scented Morrison. James from Suffolk says in the TV coverage of Spurs against Fulham, there was mention of The Covering Udoggi, which sounds like the name of a pop-up gazebo in a pub garden, the covering udoggy. Thank you, James. Buki in Essex, hi, gents, love the pod. I heard Ian Dennis mention the dancing docu during commentary of the recent Manchester City

against Leeds game on Five Live. And later on, Chris Sutton was trying to get in on the act as well. Docu tries to get around the back. Dan James was watchful, needed the touch off his head to concede the corner kick. Dangerous Doco Behind Daniel James Good little flick But they've got a corner to defend

Needs United before half time Was that your attempt In an unintended pub name On the commentator's view podcast The Dangerous Docu The Corner is taken short From the Dangerous Docu Where is the final ball

And it comes now Oh and I thought the header Was goalbound by O'Reilly Did it hit him on the shoulder What a chance for O'Reilly Six yards out All whipped in from the Dangerous Dros Doku should have scored.

Now that goes down as an intended pub name. What about the In For Me and Dennis? Behave. Here is Justin. There is the halftime whistle. Saved by the bell, I think you'll find. You also said the final ball there. As the cross came in, the final ball.

There's another one that's just suddenly popped in. Chris was... Chris joining in on the In For Me and Dennis, though. He was irked though last week. Well, the reason that he said, in for me and Dennis and loose lips sink ships because our producer Nathan had sent him a picture of the AI bar sign from last week but also Chris was was irked because I must have mentioned the TCV podcast three times during the first half he went you're going to keep on

mentioning your podcast there are other podcasts available you know so I was getting under his skin she's never a bad thing no that is never a bad thing and actually Paul in Croydon says the dangerous doku is not so much a pub name but maybe the name of the house shot served in that pub which is which is a good line what about Natan I think it will be do you think in Haifa in Israel dear TCV I caught an unintended pub name when Fulham scored their first against Manchester City very clever header actually the ball clipped up from the right hand size Smith Rose probably about 10 yards out when he meets that but he manages to guided across goal beyond the stranded Dona Ruma, who didn't really move the Manchester City goalkeeper.

I can see the pub sign for that, Donoruma, standing, feet apart, hands apart, looking up, eyes looking into the top right corner. That ball out of shot disappears over his head. And Natanz says, I think that would be a pub on a lonely country road that might even have a couple of rooms to stay. if your car breaks down in the middle of nowhere and you're stranded. Maybe the pub manager would even be a car mechanic, the stranded Donoruma. Oh yes, is this that road where the stranded Donoruma is? I do quite like though now that the correspondence not only is coming up with suggestions, but also ideas of where the actual pub is.

Imagining the scenarios and the descriptions of whether these unintended pubs could be around country or indeed the world. And Claire in Germany has spotted something from a recent Champions League debrief episode. Bayern couldn't cope with a sack a corner as they conceded the first timber glancing ahead of past the Grasping Neuer. Vince and Company sigh were level 10 minutes. Claire suspects some deliberate club naming there. No, I deny that emphatically on this occasion. But last week you did admit to doing it deliberately, didn't you? Yes, I did. Which one was that?

It was the Mozambique nutmeg at Sunderland. I did that. I did do that one deliberately, the Mozambique nutmeg. So Claire's accusation does have a degree of substance. It does have an element of truth in it, in it. George in Clapham says, Hello, Gents, a very belated Ashes entry for the UPN segment. That's the first time anyone's called it that,

that unfortunately didn't get voiced, but was hanging in the air as Brendan Doggett was bawling to Ben Duckett. Now, this is my favourite email of the week, this one, with regard to the pub names, because George says, how about the Doggett and Duckett? Come on, Agger's shrug emoji, enjoying the pod and all of your radio work. What a great call, that is. That is brilliant. And similarly, actually, Vipple from Milton Keynes has got in touch.

Love the pod and the humour the three of you have, which feels like you could all be sat in the easy tap in whilst recording this pod. Speaking of pubs and pub names, I was watching the first Ashes test, and I saw Brendan coming into Bolter Ben. This could be a sister branch to the traditional dog and duck, exactly with the dog it and duck it. So Vipple on exactly the same lines there. Also with Rob Edwards, having recently rejoined the Premier League as the new Wolves manager,

I thought he has a canny resemblance to the Brighton manager, Fabian Hertzler. Thoughts keep up the good work. You see that? Still not as good as. And I feel that now he's come back into our domain. He looks even more like the person than ever before is Norwich City's Philippe Clomont. He might think looks so much like Dan Rowan, the BBC Sports Editor. Yeah.

I think they are so similar. Yeah, yeah, definitely, yeah. Yes, I would agree with that. No, no, I would agree with that. I'm not quite sure about Rob Edwards. and Fabian Hertzilla. No. I think Rob Edwards has got his facial expression.

Always reminds me a little bit of the guy used to play some mothers do have him, Michael Crawford. Michael Crawford. Just he's around, if you look at sort of like the lower half of his face. Yeah. Well, maybe one day I'll be interviewed by Betty Glover. Ooh, Betty. That's not one for the younger listeners.

Anyway, if you spot an unintended pub name in any sports commentary, do let us know TCV at BBC.com. Or WhatsApp to 08,289-369. And I am going to say it. I'm going to float it now, because I mentioned it to you, because I was driving in Leicestershire this week as well. And I drove past a pub, I think it might have been a pub stroke hotel called the Italian Greyhound. And I thought, that could provide us with another twist. here because I thought that's the kind of pub name that could actually be the nickname for a football player and I thought I wonder if and I couldn't actually think of anyone that actually fits the nickname the Italian Greyhound but there's bound to be one and I thought I wonder if our listeners might have spotted other pub genuine pub names and where they are and the players that those pub names could apply to Are you suggesting that Italy has not produced a quick player?

Hmm. It did get me thinking, though, about Italian speedsters. And I couldn't particularly come up with one. Well, I was the same. I mean, the only one, so I stuck it on the group, but it was more because of build and look was Inzagi. It was Philippo Inzagia. But he wasn't really a greyhound.

He wasn't. No, he wasn't. I was just thinking more long and lean. Yeah. But, I mean, it would have to be a winger, wouldn't it? The Italian greyhound would have to be a winger. Yeah. Remember when Italy played England in the Nations League a few years ago,

Nonto was playing? He was quite nippy then, wasn't he? He was nippy, but he's not a greyhound. He's not an Italian greyhound. I did think of him, Ian, but I dismissed that. And that's build, because he's short and stocky in speed, isn't he? And I think to be a greyhound, you've got to be taller and long legs and wiry, I think. Yeah, that's what I thought.

Yeah. So anyway, we'll leave it with the listeners, TCV at BBC.co.com. WhatsApp to 08,289-369. So that is the UPN for this week. Now, Ian, it is time for COTC on the TCV. Welcome to the team behind the team. A new podcast series in partnership with the Open University, where we'll be showcasing the people, the tools and the techniques

to help athletes and teams reach elite level. Like all elite sports, it's a pyramid and everybody's trying to get to the top. It's not just my vision. It's a shared vision amongst the team. What is this? This is not the way I see the game. The team behind the team with Katie Smith. In partnership with the Open University. Listen on BBC Sounds.

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Visit springhillsweets.marriott.com to find out more. It's 5.23 p.m. One of your kids is asking for a snack. Another is building a fort out of your clean laundry, and you're staring at a half-empty fridge and thinking, what are we even going to eat tonight? Or you could just hello-fresh it. With over 80 recipes to choose from every week,

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Canada's number one meal kit delivery service. on the Football Daily with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis. Clash of the commentators, where two of us take turns to answer a question and give as many correct answers as we can in 30 seconds.

We've all played the same number of games because I beat John last week on the recent goal scorer against Liverpool, so I am top, six from eight. The champion Ali is mid-table, four from eight, and John remains languishing, rooted to the

bottom two from eight. And so today it's all about who can try and close the gap on my good self. Allie against John. Allie, you've won each of your last three, but who wants to go first? Shall I go first? Go on, John. Bearing of mind, I've only just got up here. I'm also probably jet-lagged. Already. Yeah, excuses are coming in, yeah. Do you know what? I'm going to put my hand up there, and I totally agree with that, and I do feel for John on that front, and this is all self-inflicted, but I set my alarm for 3.45am this morning

so that I could get across the entire first day from Brisbane. So I'm a mix of sort of bleary-eyed and very over-caffeinated. So I could say anything in Clash of the Commentator. So, John, I'll let you go first. Thank you very much. Right. Allie is going to unplug here. I have to say, I mean, I have watched more or less most of the games this week,

but because I've also had one eye on the World Cup draw, I was quite relieved when I got the two. text knowing that I was actually going to be the quiz master rather than taking part and looking at the answer I'm even more relieved because good grief and bearing in mind this is at the time of recording so it's before Manchester United against West Ham but Arsenal's Mikhail Marino scored yet another header in midweek he scored the most headed goals in the Premier League this season with three and since the yes I didn't know that yeah and since Since the start of last season, no Premier League player has scored more headed goals in all competitions than Marino, eight from 14.

I want you, John, to name any player to have scored a header in the Premier League this season. Your time starts now. All right. Okay. Marino, Harland, Danny Welbeck, Semenio, Phil Foden, Phil Foden. Ollie Watkins Um Neto

um Drowo Pedro Oh Gabriel Saliba Um Van de Ben Romero Was that last one in time

Of course it was It was yes Yeah, of course it was Right I was well in time I could have got another one in there Yeah I was actually

Totting them up, I think that's a competitive score. Give Ali the thumbs up. He'll get more than that, which is good because it'll bring your lead back down to one. Hello, Ali. Hello, I can hear some sniggering. Right. Mikkel Marino scored yet another header in midweek.

He scored the most headed goals in the Premier League this season with three, and since the start of last season, no Premier League player has scored more headed goals in all competitions than Marino, eight from 14. I want you to name any player to have scored a header in the Premier League

this season. Your time starts now. This season? Ah, crikey. Rodon, Gabrielle, Timber. No, Riven Diasis wasn't a header. Who else is good at the set pieces? What about Belenkovich,

Marillo, that wasn't a header? Tarkovsky, Brantthwaite, Collins, Vandenberg, Um, I'm out. Romero. Romero! Romero! That got in before that... You did exactly what I did. But I don't think you did what you normally do, Allie.

Yeah, unfortunately. Alley's was just out of time, unfortunately, whereas mine was in time. Well, I didn't rattle enough off? No, you'd normally say the part of the answer from the question as one of your first... I don't think you said Marino. I didn't say Marino. However, I think even without Romero. I don't know how many are right though, John. I've had a right old flap at that, to be honest.

I think quite a few of them were right. Not Bramphletes, he's oddly played. I'm not even sure he's been on the field. There's a long list. I mean, I won't go through all of them, but from Josh Atchimpong, Oma Alderete, Ballard, all the way down to Martin Zubimendi.

Yeah. His head. But we'll wait for the confirmation. I think John's got this. Do you? I do. I thought Ali might. 9-4 to John.

Wow. Wow. I can see that. That's a big win. I must come to Washington more often. That's an excellent win. Yeah. So congratulations, John.

That's good news for Ian, of course. But it's good news for me. Let's be positive. So John, that's your third win from nine. Three from nine. Yeah. Allie's four from nine. Yeah.

Yeah. And that means that I'm top of the tree for Christmas, surely six from eight. Yeah, win percentages high there as well. Still got a couple of weeks to go to Christmas. That's true. So, John, your correct ones were Marino, Harland, Welbeck, Foden, Netto, Zhao Pedro, Gabrielle van der Ven, Romero. There were your nine.

And Ali, Rodon, Gabriel, Timber, and Romero. The others were all incorrect. Yeah. I didn't go strike because I was looking for centrebacks, but I mean, not to say Harland is just, you know, Beyond stupidity, isn't it really? But there we're a snigger. You said it.

Another snigger. Well, what an exciting episode that was of that. I think we'll all agree. Now, our great glossary of football commentary, where we add listener suggestions of commentary terms and phrases to our collection. And we have Division 1 and Division 2. Division 1 for football exclusive terms and Division 2 for terms used in football commentary,

but also used in other. sports and last week, we added Schmeichael style into Division 1, although Tom in North Hans writes in, I would argue that as this was a technique that Peter Schmeichael developed while playing handball in his native Denmark, would this not be used in their commentary? My point is somewhat flawed as I have no way of checking, so this is more of a hunch as my Danish handball commentary is non-existent. And Palis van Jez says, not to be too much. of a pre-Christmas Grinch, but I don't think Schmeichael's style can go into Division I of

your glossary. He himself has said that he learnt that style of save from playing handball where it is very common. Now, I know we don't get too much handball commentary over here outside of its four-yearly appearance at the Olympics, but we don't get that much hockey commentary either, and there are lots of Division II entries due to the possibility of a phrase applying to hockey. However, they're talking about the style of save. We're talking about how it's, that save in football has been termed, which is Schmeichael style. Exactly. So in handball, that wouldn't be called Schmichael style. If you were watching Danish handball, it wouldn't be called Schmichael style because Schmichael has got the style from, it might,

there might be a famous Danish handball goaltender, who was famous for making saves like that in Danish handball and it was probably Hansen style or Jensen's style That's going to need some research that Unless there was a Schmeichael who played handball Well there we go

I think for the moment And I think for the moment I'm happy with that in Division 1 Because I don't think you will hear that Schmeichael style In anything other than football So you know I agree

I agree Good Good Excellent Sorry Tom and Jess Sam and East Lothian I was listening to Ian and Chris on Saturday afternoon. They were commentating on Manchester City against Leeds.

During the first half, they went to the League 2 game between Chesterfield and Swindon for a goal update. During the update, Nile McCorn mentioned that the Swindon striker had stolen a march on the Chesterfield defence when scoring his goal. And it's gone the way of Ian Holloway's Swindon Town. Fullback, Finley Monroe, stealing a march at the back post after a dangerous crossing to the area.

They know they can go back top of the league if they win and Walsall fail to win. they have the early lead. Chesterfield Neil Swindon Town 1 and Sam says I think this is one of those terms that could be used in any sport however I don't think I've heard it used elsewhere i.e. outside of sports

commentary so probably Division 2 would you not say is there not other arenas where you'd steal a march could you steal a march in the supermarket queue I think I would hear that in horse racing cycling and athletics but what about away from sports commentary

can you steal a market march elsewhere. Can you do it in politics? Can you do it in Hollywood? Probably you can in politics. Yeah. I think you can steal a march. Yeah. When you mentioned supermarket there, Ali. When you're in the supermarket queue, do you sort of like do, not a commentary as such, but do you sort of like gauge as to where you are in the queue and thinking, I do it the same in the passport line going through Schiphol, where I'm thinking, right, I'm three from the front now. And the person who is in front and he's gone to another line and he's two from the front

but I'm coming back. Do you not do that or is that just me? I don't commentate on him in my head. No, no, but no, I don't say commentate but do you have sort of like that race going on in your head? As you're going past them, do you say, I've stolen a march on you there?

Come on, do you not do that? I think I'll probably register it, but it's probably more in the, you know, when you get into that queue, you probably have a choice and then you make the wrong choice and you see someone smugly go too ahead of you on your left,

You can't switch. I know what you mean. I do know what you mean, yeah. Yeah. So do you do it? No. John? You do it.

I don't think so. You do? No. We should have mentioned that now. Anyway, Gareth from Shrewsbury, which Gareth says, is the graveyard of ABB's cricket ambitions. Well listened, Gareth. Garth says, this is one that might need some explanation, and I will leave its potential

division decision to you. The term is a slide rule pass to describe a measured pass by a midfield maestro. Its league placing will of course be subject to the hockey protocol, but with regard to slide rules, I saw one as a child, and I know they have a mathematical application, but I have absolutely no idea how they work. Perhaps you clever chaps, no. Slide rule pass from Gareth, We have actually, in the very, very early days, we accepted slide rule pass into the glossary, but it's actually in our list of unsorted terms. So we are yet to place it into Division 1 or Division 2. So, Ali, if you've got your Sortang hat.

Yeah, I think it has to be Division 2. I love it. I love it because it paints such a brilliant picture. You know, if you're a regular listener to football commentary and you hear a description of a slide, rule pass you know exactly you can picture that perfectly can't you but I do think it's used I mean it would be used in hockey definitely I know we always fall back on

hockey but possibly other sports so I think it has to be div too but I do love it div two for me I think division two I do love a slide rule pass though you can actually see it in your in your mind's eye can't you a couple of voice notes to finish here's Tim in Northern Ireland

hi guys I love the pod really look forward to a Friday for the new release on the football daily I have a couple of of suggestions if you don't mind. The first is the referee has pointed at the spot. I can't think of any other sports where the referee points at the spot thereby indicating that a penalty kick has been awarded. I thought about Snooker and the referee after a coloured ball has been potted replaces the ball on the appropriate spot, but they don't point at the spot and I can't

think of any other sports where the referee would do. So my second suggestion is the go-keeper is off his line or off their line. I did think about fishing and perhaps one of you might have experience in this field I certainly don't but is there a chance in fishing

that the commentator might shout he's off his line after a fish has been caught and then has managed to escape and look forward to hearing what other people think. So that is from Tim I think I know Tim

I'm pretty sure that's the Tim I know in Northern Ireland so thank you for sending that in I don't think you could start shouting in fishing commentary, could you? No. That would be against the... It would be more golf voice, wouldn't it? Commentary, if you're commentating on Fisher.

You'd soon get hooked, I think, wouldn't you? What'd you think? He points to the spot. I love points to that. It's a great... I love that phrase. Yeah, exactly. And again, it's just so... It's exactly what the referee does, and as a radio commentator,

when you're describing the action in front of your eyes, you just immediately those words go into your head. Yeah, I think that's because, you know, know in rugby if they're going for the post the referee will take both hands and point to the post but doesn't point to the spot so i at the moment for me unless someone tells us otherwise i think that's division one i think that's really really good yeah and off their line could keep us off the line possibly downhill skiing he's gone off their line oh oh yeah off the racing line yeah rather than off his goal line the things if it had to pass the hockey test

there, John, you don't often get lobbed as a goalkeeper in hockey. You come racing... Well, no, it can happen. You can flick it. But a goalkeeper might come racing out to a metre forward and they dribble round them in hockey. But being off your line would be less of a thing in hockey than it would in

football. You can't score from the halfway line like we've seen recently from Richardis and the... What about the starters for 100 metres? He's come off his line. Well, they've come off their line. No, they go to the line and they come out of their blocks. I think this has been, incidentally, in Tim's mind because of the number of goals that we've seen scored from the other halfway line recently, where in almost every occasion, surely, I'll probably set it myself with Rasharleston's goal, when Raya was off his line, the goalkeeper's off his line.

And also, I want to make another point as well, just in case there are any referees or officials or would-be officials listening, it is, from a commentator's point of view, desirable that when you give a penalty, you do. actually point to the spot. Yeah. Just on goals as well, John. You just reminded me there because I was thinking other goals from the halfway line and one was obviously Kenny McLean for Scotland. It did tickle me that Ailey, Barber, was at St James's Park for the Romero overhead kick, having had the McTominee overhead kick already this season. And McTomoneys was definitely better than Romero's.

But it's just, it's funny how that works, isn't it? As a commentator, you can go to a game and see a couple of sort of similar-ish goals that you don't see that often, but in quick success. you might see a couple back to back like the halfway line or you know something like that and if any referees are listening john that was commentator murray who said that it does annoy me though if you're commentator saying on a match and you're not sure if a penalty's been awarded or not really oh yeah for a generic point given a penalty yeah is he given a penalty or is he not given a penalty here yeah yeah you know let's have clear pointing to the

spot please and and actually on the subject of goals off the line on the way through Washington on the metro last night as I was arriving here I actually came past a station called McLean which I thought how apt is that that there should be a station on the way to seeing Scotland appear in the World Cup draw I've got one other just before we go I've just made a mental note to myself that I want to I'm not it's not going to get into the glossary but I just want to mention it because I heard it on the cricket today and I've never heard it before so I want to run it by you two as judges to see what you make of it but I'm going to leave that right till the end. Okay so today's final message comes from down under. Hi my name is

Mitchie. I'm from Melbourne Australia and I really enjoy the podcast. My suggestion for division one in the great glossary of football commentary is the expression to walk it in. Once referenced in the IT crowd, the phrase could be applied like so. The problem with Arsenal is they always try and walk it in. Maybe that doesn't apply now Arsenal have discovered a set piece coach, I'm not sure. While I'm here, I thought I'd also take the opportunity to mention the Australian rules football is filled with lots of great glossary examples as well, including a worm burner, which I think is the equivalent of a daisy cutter and used in Australian rules football is a firmly hit pass that barely goes above the grass before being marked or caught by another player.

Ball burster. This is a thunderous strike of the ball. If it replied in football and not Australian rules football, one might say, what an absolute ball bursts are struck high in the onion bag right where the spiders sleep. The fat side of the ground. This is an area of the ground where players are less populated at a particular moment in the game, and one might kick to the fat side of the ground and the space it provides to attack the game. And finally, it's specky.

So this is a spectacular mark where a player climbs unaided onto the shoulders of another player to mark or catch the ball. it would be great I think for a goalkeeper to attempt to specky one day very well delivered I must say by Mitchie an excellent contribution for him lovely accent as well didn't he have to go to the original one walk it in I think in rugby you can walk it in American football you can walk it in yeah I don't think we can have walk it in you can yeah don't you walk it over the line walk it over the line

yeah yeah walk it in yeah division two I think so for walk it in specky i mean if we said that in a commentary people would think we were you know that that would have an entirely different meaning i think for our list isn't they i think yeah all he could also be talking about spectators yes yeah so there we are summary for this week we are putting into division two steal a march uh slide rule pass uh walk it in yeah going in there as well and for the time being in division one schmichael style remains and two new additions into division one off their line and points to the spot. Excellent. So the one I want to put to you to just before we go is I have watched and listened to

a heck of a lot of cricket today and it's been an enthralling days test cricket again, listening to various voices. Late in the day's play, Australia were on a bit of a go slow. They were trying to slow the game down so that he didn't have to come out and face any England bowling if England lost their last wicket. And Stephen Finn, on commentary, was making the point that the umpire should step in and warn Steve Smith

or the Australian bowler that they needed to speed up and keep the game going. And he said the umpire needs to step in here and word him up. And I've never heard the phrase to word. I have a word, but to word someone up. Can you ever see referee Taylor wording someone up, John? Immediately makes me think of the cameo hit.

Exactly. Was that the 80s or the 90s? 80s. 80s, word up. Word up. Yeah. But not word me up. Word me up.

He's got to word him up. Have you heard that, Ian? No, not heard that. No, no. No, I don't know whether that's a thing or whether Stephen Finn has just come up with something there or, you know, just got the words jumbled. I don't know, but I loved it.

Good. So, listen. out for being worded up this weekend or indeed at any point during the week. Good luck you too with all of your various travels and actually I'm not sure if we're all here next week. Anyway, we'll leave that open. We'll leave that open. We'll leave that as a mystery to listeners to tune in next time and find out who is actually there. Keep the glossary suggestions coming in. Remember if you hear an unintended pub name in a commentary, send it in to TCV at BBC.co.uk.

Voice notes, very welcome on WhatsApp to 08,000, 289, 369. We had some excellent ones of those this week, but that is it for this episode of the Football Daily. And remember, you can find each and every episode of the commentator's view by scrolling down your Football Daily feed. I'm only one behind you now, then, Allie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I was trailing you and then put three wins in a row,

which suddenly got me ahead of you, but, you know, I was never complacent enough to think you weren't in it, John. I mean, you know, you're the BBC's football courts. So most of those I mentioned, well, most of those I mentioned must have been right then.

Correct, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I'm just looking at the list because they've gone into the script of the ones you've mentioned. Okay. Yes, and lots of them are in bold, so mainly correct answers. Most of mine were wrong.

Steve bold. Steve bold. Steve bold, not this season. This winter, cricket's oldest rights. rivalry is re-ignited. England and Australia do battle to compete

for the Ashes. Hear live ball-by-ball commentary on Fife Sports Extra and get analysis and reaction of every day's play with the Test Match Special podcast. The Stamps out of the ground. Test match special at the Ashes.

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