Football Daily - Women's Euros: England & Wales all set for Euros

Episode Date: July 4, 2025

Sarina Wiegman and Leah Williamson speak to Izzy Christiansen and Vicki Sparks ahead of the Lionesses opening match at the Euro 2025 in Switzerland. Katie Smith and the panel discuss England's build-up to the tournament, the form of their opponents France and the strength of Group D. Plus, we hear from Wales manager Rhian Wilkinson, captain Angharad James and our team of Eilidh Barbour and Danny Gabbidon ahead of Wales against the Netherlands.Sat 1700 Wales v Netherlands on 5 Live Sat 2000 France v England on 5 Live Sun 1700 Norway v Finland Sun 2000 Switzerland v Iceland

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The Football Daily podcast with Katie Smith at UEFA Women's Euro 2025. Welcome along to the Football Daily where it is almost time for England and Wales to begin their Euros campaign here in Switzerland. So Group D gets underway on Saturday and we are sat right now inside Stadion Leipzig in Zurich where England will kick off their title defence against France and it's pretty picturesque where we are sat here. I can see a few mountains in the background. It's a capacity of 22,700 in this stadium. It's a kind of arena style, a gorgeous day as well with seating that banks outwards, that feeling that the pitch is almost sunken down into the ground below you. And most interestingly, an athletics track, a

400-metre track sweeping round the outside of the pitch in the centre. Alongside me commentator Vicky Sparks and former England midfielder Izzy Christensen and I think we should talk about the stadium a little bit first Vicky because we don't normally see athletics tracks and we haven't so far in the tournament have we? Yeah it reminds me a little bit of the layout of the London stadium the the home of West Ham which of course hosted many Olympic events at London 2012 as well. And yeah, it's similar. So they're going to have a capacity for the tournament of around 22,500 and they're expecting a really big crowd here tomorrow night.

But yeah, it is one of these as a commentator, you walk in and you appreciate it from the stadium's perspective because it is beautiful. But of course, course with the athletics track where we're sitting here in the gantry you are that little bit further away from the pitch so definitely bringing my glasses tomorrow. Izzy be honest what do you think? Yeah not a fan of a track around a football pitch no I get the concept but yeah it just feels like the fans are gonna be a little bit further away but no listen the England fans are brilliant. Lea Williamson referred to the fans as well in be a little bit further away. But no, listen, the England fans are brilliant. Leah Williamson referred to the fans as well in her press conference earlier.

She knows and she feels the support from the England fans. And yeah, I'm sure they'll find a way to get closer to the fans in the game tomorrow night. We have just come out of England's press conferences pre-match. We've also spoken to Serena Vigman and to Leah Williamson, the captain. So we're going to hear from both of them in a moment. But actually, Izzy, the take home that we all said after we'd heard from them and other journalists agreeing with us that it all just feels very positive

and very calm and relaxed. Now I think it seems like the perfect aura around the camp seems like a perfect kind of delivery of match day minus one of the defending champions press conference from Serena Vigman who is very well equipped to do these types of things pre-match, pre-tournament and Lea Williamson just seems to be growing year on year in an England shirt with the captain's armband around their arm and yeah I think it's echoed listening to them both beat this afternoon it's echoed what I am perceiving the England camp to look like from the outside at the moment which

is just calm, chill, ready and focused. Have you noticed any differences, Vicky, from the number of tournaments where you've followed England around in the style in which Vigmen, especially leading from the front, has been approaching these pre-match talks and conferences and interviews?

I think the thing that's really stood out to me from this tournament, and it's something that Lea Williamson mentioned in the press conference and made my ears prick up a little bit and then Serena Wiegman went into more detail about it, is of course from the outside, fans and media, we're all looking at this and saying England are coming into this tournament as the defending European champions and what is that pressure going to be like? And Lee Williamson really interestingly touching on the fact that from Serena Wiegman's messaging that actually it's about achieving something new, this idea

of this New England. Now of course in many ways it is a New England, they've had key retirements since the Euros three years ago, they have the absentees that we've talked about so often that were made before the squad announcement, the likes of Mary Oates, Millie Bright, Frank Kirby, they're not here. They've got players at their first major tournament, this new generation, this new blood, but I think it's a really interesting way of reframing what this tournament expectation is for England, that you're not defending something that you had three years ago with all the associations of you know trying to hold on to something and get it again but you are here to achieve

something new and that doesn't surprise me at all about Serena Vigman because if there's one thing that I think defines her managerial style is that she always wants to look forward and that really plays into that messaging and Izzy as a as a former player would that help you particularly I guess those players who are at their first major tournament to not think we've it's just that pressure isn't we've got to come here and we've got to defend our title you know functionally it would be this they would have done that if they if they do win it but to see it as an

exciting new opportunity what does that do in terms of a mindset shift? Well I think if you compare it to club football, if you're a player and you sign for a club that's winning trophies, there is an expectation when you arrive at the club that you've got to then go and help them do it again. And I think the same sort of concept could be said for some of the players, you know, that are going to be experiencing their first major tournament as of tomorrow night. You'm Agibieva Jones, my Letizia, Jess Park, Michelle Adgerang. But actually you make a point because there's so many of them. There is so many of them, but what I'm trying to say is that it's about now, they don't look to me like they feel the pressure, like, oh no, we have to go and win it again. It

just seems like the processes are there for the younger players to come in and Leah Williamson also spoke about that in her press conference that they've created this environment which has evolved and Serena Vigem has identified that you have to evolve if you want to keep winning because every other team then evolves. When you win something, every other team evolves and progresses to try and beat you. And in this England team, if they continue to evolve, they're keeping the gap between them and other nations. Now, in tournament football, that gap gets almost shut. It's not always the best team that wins a tournament, but it's

the most tournament savvy team that will win the tournament. And it's just a case of, can England do this again? Well, we know Serena Vigman is certainly tournament savvy, has won all 12 of the games she's been in charge of at the Euros first with the Netherlands then with England and earlier Vicky caught up with her inside the stadium I'm feeling really good at the moment. I'm really calm. I feel that we are really prepared For tomorrow and for the tournament. I also feel that the team is in a very good place, the players are in a good place and that we're really excited, well I'm at least really excited to play tomorrow. I think the teams also, but you have to ask them themselves,

but what I see in behaviours and energy and body language, I think we're ready. We've spoken about momentum in the build up to the Jamaica game in particular. After a 7-0 victory, do you feel like England are peaking at the right time coming into this tournament? I would not refer too much to that game. I think it was a very good game. It was at the end of two weeks of training. And we really wanted to... what we wanted to do in that game, we did. And we know that Jamaica was not with their best team and that tomorrow we need to bring our game to a higher level to be successful.

When it comes to the tournament as a whole, obviously a lot of the talk from outside is England going into this, is defending European champions and the pressure that that brings. How do you see that? I'm not really occupied with defending our last win. I'm really occupied in the team too with moving forward and starting tomorrow and wanting to play at our best as an individual and as a team and be ready for every challenge we get in front of us. The pressure has always been on. That was at the Euros, it was at the World Cup, at least since I've been around. I've been aware of that. We just want to do really well and we're gonna give

our everything to show everyone how good we are. How important is it to start this very, very difficult group extremely strongly? I think that is important. I think that's absolutely what we want but we also know that's what France wants to and we know France have a very very strong squad too. So yes we're gonna do everything to get a group result tomorrow but we also know that's not the end of the world because it's a group stage. And just finally when it comes to France obviously it's a slightly different France to the one that we've been used to seeing for so

many years. No Eugénie Le Somer, no Wendy Renard. Will they pose perhaps a different challenge, tactically do you think? No, I think they were challenges the same as they have done recently. I think, yeah, you see football is evolving, countries, teams are evolving, players are coming in, players are coming through. So yes, sometimes you see changes. I think they're still very strong, very powerful, very quick. They have some dribblers too, but I think we're really good too. And I think and I hope we can show tomorrow that we can exploit some weaknesses too.

So Serena Wigman there chatting to you, Vicky. I thought quite interesting there that she, as she often does, tempers a little bit of expectation with those words, not the end of the world if we don't get a result against France. I think for a lot of people that probably isn't true, it does feel like it's really really crucial to get something from the game. Yeah I would agree with that, I think it you know it isn't the end of the world. They would still be alive in the group. On paper, it is their hardest game up against France. And in terms of what it could be, England and France on paper

would be the two teams that would be favorites to finish first and second. So it could end up being a decisive match when it comes to finishing first or second, but it could also end up being a decisive match for one of those teams not getting out of the group at all, because we know the Netherlands, Wales at their first major tournament looking to spring a surprise, so only the top two go through. It's really important, and this is, though, as you touched on there, Katie, it's just Serena Wijkman as well. She know, she'll be well aware of the fact

that to lose against France would put huge pressure on their next game against the Netherlands, and then of course the final match against Wales. She is aware of that. But I always like asking those questions because even though she's not necessarily going to give too much of an answer, I like to see where her mindset is,

and what is her messaging at this point. And as you say, you know, whether that messaging is the same behind the scenes as it is to the media and is it be interesting to hear your thoughts on this? You know, often managers will say things to the media and then it might be a slightly different message behind the scenes, but that would surprise me with Serena Vigman for the reasons that we've just talked

about that she is always framing things in a positive frame of mind, and she is very calm. She's not a manager that is going to panic. If they do lose against France, she'll have a plan for the Netherlands game and for the Wales game. They'll know what they need to do, you know, in many ways, off the back of that France result,

in terms of the likelihood of getting out of the group. Yeah, and I think that the way that, well, knowledge is power, isn't it? And I think that the way that well knowledge is power isn't it and I think Serena Vigman's knowledge in football is so extensive and you know a little bit in the way that the team has evolved you can kind of see her tactics and her methodology of evolving as well and international football is so different to club football in terms of I think I said this the other day it's like putting a jigsaw together without the pieces in front of

you but I think Serena Vigman's got such's like putting a jigsaw together without the pieces in front of you. But I think Serena Viggen has got such a good idea of how she wants her team to look and the tools that she's got to work with, you know, that are the players, how she brings everyone up to speed, how she puts a puzzle together. And she just has such a good way of, you know, tweaking things if need be. We saw that at the World Cup in 23 in Australia where she flipped the system. She went to a back three and that was genius and I do think her assistant coach had you know something to do with the thinking behind that but I think that with that level of

knowledge she has so much trust in herself and her ability to make good decisions and I think that's why she does appear like that and I don't think it's a front at all. I think it's exactly how she is. She frames things in a really positive light. Shall we talk about what potential starting 11 we might see against France tomorrow then? And of course, I think, you know, naturally, as we'd expect in the press conference, a lot of questions is around Lauren James. So she came on for just under half an hour of the Jamaica win, their last friendly before

they came out to Switzerland, got an assist, looked fantastic. This is what Serena had to say about her today. She said, this is a quote, in a good team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team,

she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great team, she's got a great. And she did also allude to the fact that matched in minus one training, all 23 players trained and all 23 players came out of the training session unscathed. So I think, you know, as a manager that's a massive tick. Lauren James is one of those 23. She's of course available to play and to start if need be. If you can play more than 30 minutes you can play

half a game. So there is a possibility she could start the game. My gut is that she won't start and I think she'll be used from the bench if required. This game is going to be tight and this game is going to be you know direct and England need to nullify France first and having spoken to Lee Williamson earlier the way that England are planning on nullifying France is by dominating the ball. I would agree I think if you start Lauren James then you know that at some point you have to make a substitution because she's not ready to play 90 minutes I mean I think that's that's fairly clear so it restricts already what Serena

Vigman can do tactically because you've already got a change that you've got to make yes they have five substitutes to make in this tournament but of course if she was fully fit if she was had perhaps been able to play, you know, if they'd had another friendly and she got two lots of, you know, substitute appearances under her belt, I think it might be different. But I thought it was interesting as well. She was asked directly if she fit enough to start, and that's when she expanded a little bit and said, well, I'm not going to give you the starting lineup, but she's played 30 minutes, so she's available to play more minutes. And again, you think she's been out for nearly three months with a hamstring injury. A hamstring injury, again, is something that you don't rush players back from and throw them in from the start if they're not ready.

But could it be a huge surprise, a sort of wild card against France to catch them out if she did start? Yeah, it certainly could be, and that's a possibility. We've seen that before from Serena Wigman. I think there's two, you spoke about the starting 11 I think there's two spots on the team well actually now I'm gonna say three which I wouldn't say are as clear and obvious as the other let me do the maths how many if that's three? Eight. There we go eight then the other eight. That's left back the number 10 roll and the number

seven roll right winger and those are the three I think I don't think I can guess right now. Can I ask you on left back because Jess Carter starting against Jamaica and Neve Charles coming on and then playing it right back and Jess Carter still staying on. Yes they wanted to take Lucy Bronze off to you know give her a bit of a rest. I would gamble on Carter starting I'm relatively confident on that. I would say I'm more confident with the other eight than I am confident in knowing that Jess Carter is going to start. I think she probably will but I think there's still a chance that that position is potentially going to be rotated. The 10 roll rotated which is

where Lauren James you know can play, she can play off either side and on the right hand side I'm going is it going to be Chloe Kelly or is it going to be Beth Meade? So going, returning to the number 10 role then if Lauren James isn't starting who is claiming that spot? Well Ella Toon, Jess Park, Grace Clinton there's three there and there's Lauren James there's four potentially because I think Georgia Stanway will play in the midfield alongside Kiera Walsh. Ella Toon looked good against Jamaica Do I think she'll start this game against France? No. But I wouldn't be surprised if she did start it.

Why do you think she won't start? I think that nothing to do with Elatun in that area, but I think Grace Clinton offers more physically. And I see that as a huge threat of France, the midfield physicality. And I think that as a huge threat of France, the midfield, the physicality and I think that Grace Clinton's running power and pressing power in those higher areas are exceptional. I think if she does get the nod, I've seen it throughout the whole of the

season in the WSL, I think that is why she would get the nod. I can't decide though if Serena Biegman gave us a massive clueicky, against Jamaica. Yes, far lower ranked opponent. It was a friendly. It's totally different to a Euros opener. But starting Elatun, is that a message of trust in one of her key figures at Euro 2022? Scored two goals in that game as well. And I think her starting then, a few days ago, took a lot of people by surprise. Would we see Clinton come in ahead of her?

I think it's a really interesting question. And where I go back to is what I thought was quite telling from Serena Vigman actually when she was asked about Hannah Hampton and whether she would give either Anna Morehouse or Kiara Keating their debuts in that Jamaica game to ensure essentially that if they were to have to come in during this major tournament they wouldn't also be making their England debuts and she said no Hannah is the player that I want to focus on and actually give Hannah who has a relatively low number of cats given the fact that she's going to be number one at this tournament give Hannah as much game experience as possible so for certain players it's about the game time

and that's why I think Jess Carter is going to start tomorrow because in that scenario I think Jess Carter and Neve Charles having had such a big competition at that point I think it's this is just my my speculation but I think Jess Carter falls into the Hannahampton category is right she's going to be I think you're right that they may change a little bit during the tournament but particularly because Neve Charles didn't replace Jess Carter I think Jess Carter is one of those players that Vigman wanted to give as much game time to as possible because they have really been rotated. I don't think Ella Toon falls into that category. I think this actually was more

about Ella Toon perhaps being given the opportunity to shine in a game where you are going to play with a more out-and-out attacking number 10, possibly again a roll off the bench. I remember in the build-up to the Euros she was really experimenting with Bethany England and Rachel Daley through the middle, not to see who was going to start because that was always going to be Ellen White, but she was trying to work out who was going to be that striker that was going to come off the bench. So they got a lot of game time in the build-up to those Euros and of course, Lesi Aruso pinned down that role and did so brilliantly well. So I think Ella Toon possibly falls into that camp just because of this France

game. I agree with Izzy. I think she may want to play a light Grace Clinton in the midfield. She could surprise us. I don't think it would be, you know, if Ella Toon is named in the starting lineup, I don't think it's the biggest shock that we've ever seen. And it will tell us a lot about how England are going to approach the game. And that's going to be really aggressively of team play. You mentioned the spot on the right wing as well so we're talking Beth Meade and we're talking Chloe Kelly there so Beth Meade again starting ahead of Kelly in the Jamaica game it tends to be that way around so far from what we've

seen from Vigman this year. Yeah and I think it's like the skill set that Beth Meade offers and her relationship with Lucy Bronze at right back behind her. I think that those two have got a really good understanding of each other's games. I think there's really nice flow between them. And they've built that relationship up over a few years. And I think it looks really clean in some areas of the pitch when those two get combining

on this right hand side. And I think the skill set Chloe Kelly is a little bit more feisty. There's a little bit more kind of style involved with the way that she plays. And we know how good she finished the season. She was so strong towards the end of the season for Arsenal, especially in the Champions League final as well. And I just think that that will be a role

where Serena Vigan's probably got one of the biggest headaches and it could depend largely on the opponent as well. France's predominantly starting left back will be Selma Basher of Lyon and she's a player who you can get under her skin, you really can, and she gets a little bit erratic at times. She can be quite aggressive off the ball. She's very prone to being booked. But on the flip side of that, she's also a player that can cause

a lot of damage going forward. So it's who Serena Bigman puts on that right-hand side that she thinks will stop Selma Basher, but also knowing full well. It's all about what England are on the ball as well. So we're gonna talk about France in just a minute, but let's hear now from the England captain, Leah Williamson, who spoke with Izzy.

Leah, here you are, another major tournament as captain of England. Kind of feels like it's been a long time coming. How are you feeling? How are the players feeling? Personally, I'm very excited. I feel like a kid again. Just in terms of especially, you know what it's like playing a tournament away from home as well, like it's you get to take it in a lot more. I think obviously the Euros was incredible, but it was home and everything was familiar. So I'm really, really excited.

And I think the girls are too, like we're in Switzerland's beautiful and like just, I don't know, just going out and being a bit more relaxed and and having that that mindset of we've got so many girls at their first tournament. They just they want to enjoy it as well as be ready to perform. It seems from the outside like yourself and your teammates like just seems so chill like and obviously people speak about defending champions but there just seems to be no expectation. Is that how it feels? Yeah yeah because it's a factual thing of course it's a fit like and we did and

I'm so I don't want to disregard, because I'm so happy that we are. Yeah. But it's not, this is a different team, a different time, a different, everything. Like the world of women's football has changed so much since then, largely due to that win. So it's just, yeah, it's just about, you know what it is, it's control what you can control,

play what's in front of you and see what happens. In terms of tournament experience, obviously we speak about Lucy Brown's seventh major tournament. Are there any nuggets that you've taken from Lucy? You know as well, more when you watch Lucy. If you just watch Lucy you'll pick up what you need to know. I think she's professional, she does everything that she needs to do. You know, in terms of, even when I think when you get to a tournament, you struggle with your schedule, you sort of, you faff a bit, trying to figure out like what your new routine is and in this new place, in this new hotel, whatever.

She just seems to have it on lock. So I just sort of watch from afar and I'm like, yeah, I'll start doing that. And in terms of obviously the game tomorrow, we know England v France historically, massive in any sport, huge. So what do you identify as the key threats of France and how are you feeling about facing them? I think the physicality, athleticism, the pace, they're incredible and they're all blessed as athletes in that way. I think the more the better we play the more we nullify their threats and I think in terms of a mindset and mentality obviously we

overturned like the defeat in the Nations League last year and qualified in. So I think we have what we need it's just about making sure that we you know where you maybe don't dominate a game physically you have to you have to play good football and you have to come up with that way so I think it's to really to be we're aware of their threats that to really stop them we have to play good football and you have to come out of it that way. So I think it's, to really, we're aware of their threats, to really stop them, we have to be good on the ball. Absolutely, and of course somebody who might play a massive part in helping you stop France is Alex Greenwood,

who's potentially going to hit 100 caps for England tomorrow. Incredible. Talk to me a little bit about her. I think, do you know what it is about Al? She's like constantly, I think, do you know what it is about Al? She's like constantly I think throughout her career she's just she's just risen and risen and risen and got better. She's never sort of just stayed in one place it's always something new, she's always chasing something new it's like this

monster mentality. Besides the fact I absolutely love her and she's one of my best mates so doing a tournament with her is a lot easier than without from a personal perspective. But I just think she deserves like 100 caps for England is obviously an incredible, incredible achievement and she deserves it. So I hope that's what happens. Welcome to the Inside Track with me, Rick Edwards. This is the podcast that takes you

inside Formula One like never before. And I'm Matt Magindy, and thanks to my exclusive access, I'll be getting up close and personal with Red Bull Racing this season. This week we address the Verstappen Mercedes rumours. You want to be with the very best car next season. And look forward to the British Grand Prix. Lewis Hamilton loves Silverstone. He does. Could he challenge?

Experience Formula One like never before by tuning into the inside track wherever you get your podcasts. Five Live has the perfect lineup of podcasts to accompany the Euros. You get all the latest analysis, interviews and debate from Switzerland in the Football Daily podcast. Have them experience players that have experienced winning with England. That Welsh passion, we never know when we're beaten.

Hello, I'm Maisie Adam. And I am Suzie Ruffall. And together we host the women's football podcast Big Kick Energy. The award winning. Oh yes, award winning. Yes, very much so. And join Lionesses, Ella Toon and Alessia Russo in the Toonie and Russo podcast. I know where I'll take you for your hindi.

Benidorm. Oh, yes. I would like that. Take the Euros with you this summer. Search Women's Euros on the BBC Sounds app. The Football Daily Podcast with Katie Smith at UEFA Women's Euro 2025. So, Leah Williamson in conversation with our very own Izzy Christianson there. You've turned journalist now.

Yeah, there's a first time for everything. Yeah, quite nervous when I got the call up this morning. Yeah, obviously I'd prepared okay. You just take it interview by interview. Yeah, it's just business as usual. But yeah, obviously one game at a time and yeah, we'll see, see what happens in the next one. Anyway, let's talk about what she had to say. What I particularly took from that, again,

was that great energy, seemed so calm, really happy to chat, was cracking jokes, all of that, but actually so important to acknowledge the fact that she is back as well. She missed the World Cup with that ACL injury. So I think for her, and she kind of acknowledged it in the press conference as well. She missed the World Cup with that ACL injury. So I think for her, she kind of acknowledged it in the press conference as well, said there was a bit of anxiety for her, which you don't expect with Leah Williamson. Well, she's very open and honest with the way

that she's feeling. She wears a hat on her sleeve. And I think as a professional sportswoman, you should always have the capacity and license to do that. And I think I love the way that she kind of has the aura about her but She also isn't afraid to say how she feels and you know tell the world as well And I think we've seen the best of Leah Williamson towards the end of the season in an Arsenal shirt Champions League final She was hands down the best play on the pitch in my opinion and she just seems to be super calm super composed Really focused and she's coming into this tournament her third major tournament calm, super composed, really focused. And she's coming into this tournament,

her third major tournament. And I just think that she's got all about her and I can't really quite put my finger on it, but the amount of calm that that filters through to the rest of the team, it's perfect. And it kind of epitomizes where I see this whole England team at right now. I actually loved it the other day,

Mark Chapman on the Football Daily saying she's the kind of person who says something. And even if normally you wouldn't believe them because you think They're just saying it with her you're like, yeah, I believe You're saying that what we thought was really interesting is he though we were talking about this before you did the interview You said to me right? I'm gonna ask her what what she thinks of France how they're gonna attack it And you said for a very specific reason. I'm gonna ask this question I'll just read you what you said, what she said,

and then you can tell us why. So she said, they have physicality, they have athleticism pace, they are blessed as athletes. The best way that we can attack them and get a result is that we play our best and we can nullify their threats. Yeah, and of course as a player, when you're in that kind of match day minus one prep, which is the game, which is the day where you are absolutely refining the

game plan. And as a player, you've already taken in the detail match day minus two, the game plan, you know your role in and out of possession. Match day minus one, you refine that. And as a player, you tend to pick up on buzzwords that the manager is speaking with, the language that they're speaking with in the meetings, on the training pitch, and you pick up, you could potentially pick up just one word

that then is something as a reference point for you throughout the game that you know you need to do that certain thing in order to have a good performance, and that's your role tactically in the team. And the reason I wanted to ask Leah about, you know, what they'd identified as Francis threats, and it was no surprise that she said that direct their powerful, their brilliant athletes. In that they know that the best way to stop that instead of going toe to toe with them is to just play with the ball and the saw an unbelievable level of ball speed at times in that game. And I just think that is exactly how England need to play tomorrow night against France

in order to nullify those powerful threats that they've got. So clearly Leah's, you know, very aware of the task in hand and I'm looking forward to seeing how she can perform tomorrow night. So we're going to talk about France's threats then, Vicky. And one threat we know absolutely won't be here is Wendy Renard, the long time captain who was quite controversially left out of the squad. She's been talking about that actually this week

using words like disbelief, like injustice. But the big news we've had today after the press conference is the current captain, also central defender, Grigia Mbok, is also ruled out. Yeah, she's been struggling with a calf injury and it was confirmed in the press conference just a few moments ago, while we've been in the stadium here,

Laurent Bonadet, their manager, saying that she is not going to make the game tomorrow. Firstly, I think it's quite interesting that he has said that. I think we were talking about it before we started recording this podcast. And, you know, I think we were talking about it before we started recording this podcast and you know I think it's it does mean that the French media have 24 hours to come to terms with this and all the you know the controversy that again is going to ramp up on the decision to leave out Wendy Renard given that Mboc

is now not going to play this this first huge huge game for France but also it lets Serena Vigman know that Grig Mboc is not going to be this first huge, huge game for France. But also it lets Serena Vigman know that Grig and Pock is not going to be playing tomorrow. But it really does focus it in, doesn't it, on Wendy Renard? As you say, it was a controversial decision. She was actually, along with Eugenie Le Sommier, France's record goalscorer, left out of the final Nations League games

before the squad was announced. So there was a bit of a sense that this potentially was coming. But Laurent Baudelaire saying in general about that decision as Einstein said insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result I want different results so I've gone for a different selection he is going to face so much scrutiny now in the French media given that Mboc is now out and they don't have the experience of Wendy Renard 168 caps 39 goals France, but I guess on the flip side as a manager he will say look

if I've decided that she's not in my 23 and she's not in my plans and I want to go in a different direction and not keep doing the same thing over and over again then an injury perhaps isn't going to change that. He has faith in the players that he has in the squad. The way her legacy and her the way people view Wendy Renard, Izzy, was even translated into the the England press conference where Serena Vigman of course asked about it didn't say too much but she did call her a trailblazer, a legend, an icon. You obviously know her from your time at Leon. Were you shocked that she even if maybe she wasn't going to get many minutes, that

her presence and experience weren't felt necessary in the squad? Yeah, it's really interesting because there's so many little sort of subplots and dynamics around that whole narrative around the French team coming into this tournament. And I still personally label them as dark horses in this competition because it feels to me like these really big decisions that Bonadé's made prior to this tournament, he's clearly backing himself to have made the correct decisions in order to catapult France forwards because they haven't been successful in recent years and looking at their squad they kind of should be successful. Now that is a very difficult task is to change that

success round but I just think Wendy Renard, she was the captain of France and she's now not the captain of France. That can propose so many difficult dynamics for you as a player to then still be in the squad, not having that responsibility. And I think if you speak to anybody and how they would label Wendy Renard is her leadership and her presence is just, you could feel it in the room.

And the way that she can lead a team is incredible. And the fact that she's been not just, not stripped to the captaincy, but not in the squad. I just think it's crazy. However, you have to sort of back and respect the manager's decision that he thinks it was right, because it's so glaringly obvious not to pick her her that there must be a really good reason as to why he hasn't done it. So as we've been saying with England we've got to I guess at

some point stop talking about the players who aren't going to be and Boc is a new line that the captains are missing. Just quickly where are France's threats going to come from against England then? I think the wide areas I think the front three in particular I think Diani, Kototo in particular Sandy Baltimore the supply line tofielders are going to be going to be in the wide areas. I think the front three in particular, I think, Deani Kototo, particularly Sandy

Baltimore, the supply line to them is just going to be crucial for the way that France want to play and whether they use the space in behind space into feet. And I think that their midfield is so technically gifted, powerful as well. But I think

that connection between how their midfield connect to the forward line will determine how successful France are in the final third. They'll be dangerous on transition. And I just think this game is going to be so cagey. But do I back England to play their way out of problems, play their way out of pressure? Absolutely, because this team is full of England, team is full of technical players who can, you know, relieve pressure with the ball. And I can't wait to watch them tomorrow night. So we're building up to England's opener against France 8 o'clock on Saturday night. Before that kicks off though, over in Lucerne, Wales have their historic first major tournament game

kicking off against former champions, Netherlands, and Ailey Barber and Dantny Gabadon will be providing commentary for that opening game. Here are their thoughts on Wales' chances. Well here we are in the beautiful city of Le Cern, ahead of this game between Wales and the Netherlands. The Welsh making history, their first ever appearance in a major championship. Danny Gabbard on alongside me. It was, we've just been to the press conference and heard from Rhianne Wilkinson and Captain Anglade James and it was it was actually a really emotional press conference and also the only press conference I've ever been to that started with applause it

was lovely. I thought they absolutely nailed it I have to say manager and captain as you say it was yeah very emotional and I think you could feel the passion you could feel the the excitement I think of what's ahead, the acknowledgement and the respect about previous generations of players that have kind of helped to get this team to where it is. I just thought they got the press conference absolutely spot on and yeah really excited now to see this team perform. It was really nice to hear how important those women that have gone before them have been in this journey that that Wales are on that have brought them to this major stage to this platform where they can showcase Welsh football in front of the

world and it's been a real collective and Anra James particularly spoke about that but Rhian Wilkinson she's got such strong connections to Wales she was her mother was was Welsh brother here as a child, so she understands that as well. But when you hear the players speak about it, it just sort of shows how much of a togetherness there is in Welsh women's football. Yeah, there is. Look, it's been a long journey. It's been a process. There's been a lot of sacrifices. There's been a lot of disappointments for these women and to finally get to the top of the mountain almost I would describe it as an amazing feeling but it's taken a

long time and like I say a lot of players in the past have kind of paved the way for this generation of players now to kind of benefit and finally get the team here so I think they're really going gonna enjoy this moment. The first game of a major tournament, something they've never experienced before. The last kind of 12 days, I'm sure a lot of things have happened to the players which they've never experienced before.

It seems like the whole squad is in really good spirits, really excited, really enjoying what's happening, maybe enjoying the attention, the added attention that they're getting. but also look really calm and really focused and really ready for what is going to be a really difficult opening first game against the Dutch. It will be really difficult and Rhianne Wilkinson, so much experience from her playing career and her management career, but her playing career she spoke about being present in that moment and how important it is to live every

second tomorrow. They're making history here, it will only happen once. These are the girls that will get to do it and get to experience it and she said as well it's about ensuring that they arrive here with the confidence to play. What do you expect tomorrow in terms of what the girls can do out on the pitch but also just the atmosphere that's going to be in this stadium? Yeah I think you know the red wall is going to be here in their numbers so we don't have to worry too much about this stadium generating atmosphere either the Dutch as well will bring a decent following and the fans that red wall are very important to this Welsh team you know the players and the fans are very connected and there will be difficult moments in this game where

the players kind of need the fans to kind of get them through but look I think you can expect a performance kind of full of passion, full of grit, full of determination, hopefully bits of quality in there as well and this group of players they will leave everything out on the pitch. They have that never say die attitude, that Welsh passion and they will give it everything that they have. Now if they can add a bit of quality to that as well, hopefully Ryan Wilkinson will get the team set up correctly and tactically right and they can maybe expose some weaknesses in the Dutch. If they can put together a decent all-round performance, they'll have a fantastic chance of getting

off to a good start. They've got the second highest ticket sales. So I hear. Of all the nations competing here, which is incredible and it just goes to show how much Wales is embracing this moment in the history of their women's game. I'm so excited to be here. There's bucket hats everywhere. You're going to need to try and find yours. I'll just steal one. You've not picked one up yet.

I'll get one later tonight I think. I'm sure a fan will be generous and maybe lend me one for the game tomorrow. Now let's hear from the Wales camp. Here's head coach Rhianne Wilkinson and midfielder Angharad James Turner at their press conference earlier today. Until probably today. I can't really speak for Angharad but I think until today, even when even though the tournament started you watch it on television It's it's been in the future. It's been something that's upcoming and then today Driving into Lucerne seeing the advertisements Seeing all the the logos the emblems for this tournament and then arriving at this beautiful stadium

You're like, this is it. So I think from my end, just really excited and I can't wait for the bus to arrive to watch these women walk out onto the field to see where they're gonna get to step on and make history. Yeah, I think for me personally, it's been a very long journey and for most of the group too. It's been something that we've always strived to achieve

and we've always come short, but not anymore. We're here. We've worked so hard over the years and to give that moment to a lot of these players is truly special. To see the Welsh flag and to see, you know, Wales being on the biggest stage of all is truly something that I didn't know if I'd be able to experience personally.

And to be here today is an honor and the group is just really excited to get out there. Rhian, you've done it all as a player and as a coach. How do you think this is going to rate in your illustrious career? Because I know Wales is incredibly close to your heart. Yeah right up there, right up there. We had my former teammate Dinah Matheson come and speak to the team yesterday because I'm their coach and they don't listen to me so I guess someone else in. And my team when I was a player for Canada managed to have a similar experience, and I want them to take it all in. This is not about anything other than being

just unbelievably present. They've earned the right to be here. This is a wonderful team, great people, fantastic footballers, and we're gonna be tested against some of the best in the world, and that's exactly what we've been wanting, to showcase Wales as a country and this team and their talent. And I think from my end, it will be right up there in the greatest moments of my career to stand there and watch these women take the field. So commentary of Wales against the Netherlands at 5 o'clock. Following that, England taking

on France at 8. All available full commentary on 5 Live and BBC Sounds so let group D commence. Could it be the group of drama we await to find out. Thank you so much though to Ailey, Dani, Vicky and Izzy and we'll see you next time. Welcome to the Toonie and Russo show on BBC Sounds. I am here with two of football's most famous friends, Alessia Russo and Ella Toon. I know where I'd take you for your hen do. Well, Benidorm. Benidorm.

Oh yeah. I would like that. It's Keely Hodgkinson. Hey! How long's like your training sessions? Like what do you do? Just run around. Do you think we're best friends for life? Erm, oh my God. Between Ian Russo Show with me, Vic Hunt.

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