Football Daily - Women's Football Weekly: Manchester City sack Gareth Taylor

Episode Date: March 11, 2025

Ellen White, Jen Beattie and Ben Haines discuss the sacking of Manchester City manager Gareth Taylor days before the League Cup final against Chelsea. Ellen and Jen share their insight on interim boss Nick Cushing who they have both played under and why he is the right fit. Hear from City’s Vivianne Miedema on the departure of Gareth Taylor heading into crucial run of fixtures. What happened to Arsenal who were put out of the FA Cup by Liverpool? Plus Ben sat down with Lucy Bronze as she prepares for her first final with Chelsea as Sonia Bompastor’s side go for the quadruple!00:20 Intro 01:00 Gareth Taylor sacked! 07:50 Vivianne Miedema 11:10 Nick Cushing 20:30 Liverpool cause an upset 30:00 Lucy Bronze on the League Cup final 41:30 Ellen & Jen on Lucy’s mentality BBC Sounds / 5 Live commentaries this week: Tue 11 Mar 2000 Liverpool v PSG in the Champions League Wed 12 Mar 2000 Aston Villa v Club Brugge in the Champions League Thu 13 Mar 2000 Man Utd v Real Sociedad in the Europa League

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Hello, I'm Robin Ince. And I'm Brian Cox. And we would like to tell you about the new series of The Infinite Monkey Cage. We're going to have a planet off. Jupiter versus Saturn. It's very well done that because in the script it does say wrestling voice. After all of that, it's going to kind of chill out a bit and talk about ice.

And also in this series we're discussing history music recording with Brian Eno and looking at nature's shapes. So listen wherever you get your podcasts. Music Radio Podcasts. Hello everyone, welcome along to the Women's Football Weekly. I'm on the road this week, again this time at Manchester City, ahead of the League Cup final this Saturday. And what a time to be coming to the Etihad campus City's training ground. Off the back of a huge announcement yesterday that Gareth Taylor, their manager, has been sacked ahead of the final. Nick Cushing will be coming in, the former Man City manager.

He'll take charge of the side for the rest of the season and to help me break it all down, plus lots more today. As always, Jen Beatty and Ellen White. Ellen, where do we start with this one? Firstly hi what a time for you to be at Man City by the way absolutely and great timing thanks because it's perfect time if we're asked for the podcast as well. Yeah I just very odd timing I would say it's super strange obviously at the weekend Man City through to the semi-final of the FA Cup

in the League Cup final on Saturday. They play Chelsea four times back to back. It's just, I just can't, yeah, I just can't get the time in. It's just so odd. And I was just saying to Jen kind of off air. It almost feels like, I don't know, someone at Man City has kind of gone, just look to the table and we're fourth, that doesn't seem right. That seems a bit weird. We should be in the Champions League spot. I don't think that, yeah, it just seems very odd and they've gone right.

He's gone basically. And I do, I feel a bit sorry for him because a lot of injuries, obviously semi-final, league final like I've just suggested but I think you've got to kind of throw it back to the club at the same time to be like, are you investing into this team? Like where do you want this team to go? He could have gone months ago, last year potentially, so and I don't think they're in that bad a position at the moment. Yeah, I just think it's just the weirdest time ever. I think I felt more for the players if I'm going to be totally honest. I think five,

five days before a cut final, you know, if I'm a player and it's either your first or, you know, 20th chance to lift a trophy, it's still a really big week and one you want to have the best prep for and be focused on the football. And you never want to see anyone lose their job. But for me, I went straight to the players. I was like, you've got some huge games coming up. This chaotic time where you're about to play Chelsea about 40 times as well. And that's who I, yeah, to go back, it was the timing for me. Absolutely wild.

Five days before a cup final and day before a media day. Also, where you're put in front of people who are gonna ask you a million questions and all the players will want to do is focus on the football focus on the cup final but they'll be asked all the questions about Gary Taylor and that's where I really feel for them but I understand the decision don't get me wrong the focus in the statement is being around the league and the positioning of the league regardless of where they're at in the Chamleys League right now or leading into a final, the statement

was all about we need to get Chamleys League next year. So six WSL games left in the season, that's been the focus. So I understand the decision making behind that, but I do think the timing was really, really unfair on the players. Do you think that will galvanise the players though, Jen? Obviously I totally agree with what you're saying because it is a horrible situation for them to be in and five days out from obviously League Cup final. Do you think this will really kind of put them together and be like, right, it's all about us fighting together and what we can achieve on Saturday will be something almost even more special than what we could have maybe dreamed of before? For sure and look if I was in that dressing room that's 100% what I would want the vibe to be,

just be like look take control of what you can, we've got a cut final, we've got an opportunity to lift a trophy. I'm thinking of players in that dressing room with Alex Greenwood and big characters that are really going to rally around and bring everyone together in a chaotic time, they're the kind of people and characters you need in these moments to be like, no, right, okay, shut out the noise. It's wild, but what we've got is a big week and a big month, to be honest, and a big few months coming into the end of the season. So no, absolutely.

I think that's when things are so crazy, it's almost like, okay, you have to sort of numb it down and be like, right, what can we focus on? So I do 100% think that that's surely what has to happen in the changing room and the dressing room right now, especially going into the day. They'll all be prepped to going into the day, ready for questions and be desperate to just get on the training pitch, to be honest, and focus on the football going into Saturday. For fans of other clubs, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, who have all had big results this weekend, don't worry. We're going to get stuck into all of it, and we will look ahead to how we think that the League Cup final might play out, but

we have just got to delve into this just a little bit more, because I think it's so interesting what you're both saying around the timing. One thing that jumps out straight away is that you're going into a final this weekend that actually has no bearing on European qualification. So in terms of the timing, do you think perhaps there's a thought process there of, well, if he wins silverware, it's harder to make this decision? Or in terms of the timing, is it to try and get a bounce there with Nick Cushing coming in potentially? I think, you know, sometimes when you bring someone else in, it brings that freshness,

something different. You know, it gets the players maybe excited, maybe a slightly different sense of formation. Obviously, you know, Gareth's been there for a number of years now, and maybe it was time for him to move on and something different. But it's really challenging because obviously it's a really, really important time of the year for them now. Like we said, they're fourth in the league, one point behind Arsenal. Arsenal still have a game in hand though. They've got the League Cup final on Saturday, played back-to-back Chelsea four times in a row in the League, in the League Cup final,

and the quarterfinals of Champions League. It's huge for them. It could go amazingly well. It could go on and win everything and it could be absolutely phenomenal. But yeah, you just don't know at this time. Their statement says that obviously they want to be competing in the Champions League. So is that the priority then in the league? I don't know. Well, let me just add two more games into that just in terms of the fixtures. So it's League Cup final this weekend, followed by Champions League quarterfinal first leg at home, then the league game against Chelsea, then the second leg of the quarterfinal in the Champions League away, then Brighton, then the FA Cup semi-final on the 13th of

April against Man United and I imagine also the performance of Man United will have played a little bit of a part in this, just in terms of how they're performing league-wise as well at the moment, Jen. Sorry, go on. I was just going to say, I wonder if there's a bit of influence. We've talked about managers being sacked quite a lot on this podcast lately, or parting ways, whatever the language has been used. But we have seen a reaction from teams off the back of that, whether it's Arsenal when Rene came in, the reaction of the players,

the turnaround that happened, Liverpool getting a huge result of the weekend, which we'll talk about more after just Matt Beard being sacked. So there's I don't know if there's a bit of influence and that's a question that maybe is for, you know, someone else or a different day. But I would, I would wonder if there is, Man City would be influenced to be like, right, okay, we see the reaction that it's happening on other teams and the turnaround that's happened. That's what we need to do. But to go back to your point timing, it was, was still absolutely wild. So as mentioned a little bit earlier Ron I am down at the City Training Ground at

the Etihad campus and we were due to speak to Gareth Taylor that has of course not happened but we still had a chance to catch up with Viviana Miedema. It's obviously definitely been pretty full-on and I think first of all I've had a really good relationship with Gareth. I'm really happy that I appreciate that he's actually made me enjoy football again. Obviously coming in this morning we're professional footballers and the switch needs to be on straight away. Nick came in, Nick left a really really good impression straight away, a lot of energy and I think the most important thing right now is to to move forward to the big cup

final on Saturday. Is it as simple as we have to just flip the switch and go? I think so. I mean if we want to be successful on Saturday then that's definitely what we need to do right now. I think we're really, really clear as a team that we want to be winning things. We are in a really good position obviously, semi-final of the FA Cup, quarter-finals of the Champions League, Conti Cup final coming up on Saturday.

And I think that we're all ready for it to come now. How was the atmosphere this morning when you came in, just in terms of what you felt when you looked around the group? I think it's difficult, I think especially for the younger players who maybe have not been in this position before, it can be challenging. And I think for me and for some other experienced players, we need to make sure that the group stays together, that we can help the younger ones as good as possible and focus again on football. Hence I said that I think Nick

coming in this morning, he's done really well. He's lifted the spirits. It was really positive in training out there today. And I think he can really help us prepare as good as possible for the game on like Saturday. Have you had a chance to speak to Nick yet one on one, or is this still too early? I've been extremely busy today with a lot of different things. Not speaking to Nick yet, but obviously, like in the next coming days like we will definitely have that chance to chat I mean I've played against Nick a lot of times sometimes he probably doesn't want to remember all the times I wasn't

really that happy about it but it's really exciting to get the chance to work with him this time around. You're someone who thinks deeply about things and doesn't just take stuff at face value when you get news like this over the last 24 hours and when you think about potential change in your life now moving forward, does that mean nervous or are you excited to look ahead? I'm not very good with change so it was definitely something. I think first of all I always reflect back on myself, like is there anything I could have done differently? Could I help better?

What was my role in the season so far? I think looking back at it, I have literally done everything I could to the max potential, which is really, really nice for me to know. I think going back into everything today was quite challenging. You don't know how it's gonna be.

You don't know what's gonna change. But I think I'm at that point now that I'm just really excited to see where it's going, what's happening, what's going to be changing. I think the form I've recently been in gives me a lot of confidence to hopefully obviously help the team in the next coming games and also like to flourish it maybe even more on the knick and yeah I think that's something really exciting to know be part of So as we spoke to Viv about there the man coming in is is Nick Cushing really crucial time for the club at the moment

I wonder why is he the right man for the job now? I worked kind of a little like short time with him I'm sure Jen could probably give a little bit more information But I feel like he understands what Man City is about. He understands the club, the expectations, and I think he's a figure that a lot of people will know. He's worked in the women's game. He's won things in the women's game. And I think he's got some great ideas. He's very diligent. He's very tactical. He's good at communication and he loves being on the grass and on the field and he's a good coach, a very very good coach and it's a very tight

turnaround but obviously you know he could potentially go in there and you know change tweak a few things maybe get the team excited playing football that they maybe slightly tweak what their philosophy has been recently. And I think for me, it's going to be really interesting because Sonia Bombastore is going to be looking at this Man City team going, what are they going to be doing? I've got no kind of scooby what they're going to be doing. So I think that is massively in Man City's favour, that they could go out and do something completely different.

I know he's only got five days to actually create this plan that he's potentially going to put in place, but I think it does work in their favour in that sense that Chelsea are going to be a little bit on the back foot come Saturday. Well, this is really interesting that you say that, Ellen. That was exactly what we asked her about four days ago. How well do you know this Man City team? How well do you know what they'll be doing? And she kind of said, I know pretty much everything there is to know about this team. We've analyzed so much of their game. We have plans for different potential scenarios, depending on what they do. It's a blank slate now, Jen. You're really having to completely guess,

right? Yeah, I'd be really interested to see how much Nick changes though, especially over a short space of time. And I think regardless of what she said in those moments, they're playing each other four times. They can't do the same thing every single game. Both teams are going to adapt and do things differently. So I think regardless of how much analysis you've done on what Man City or Chelsea have done over this course of the last season, they will change things, maybe not game to game,

but 100% formations will change, they have to. No team can get away with doing the exact same thing. But that's where I'm really interested and my opinion on Nick is in my experience under Nick, Nick had this like unbelievable ability to make you focus on the task at hand and to be able to shut out the noise. Exactly what Ellen said, unbelievable tactician.

And if there's one guy that's gonna do it coming into this time in a short space of time, his focus will be purely on the football and exactly that changing from game to game and little tweaks, but he will be able to allow the girls to shut out the noise, focus on the task at hand. He was unbelievable at that. He really had an unbelievable and still does

ability of simplifying the game so you know what your task is going into it. And I think that's exactly what this team needs right now. They don't need to change too much, but they will have to adapt from game to game. And yeah, I can't speak highly of Nick and I think coming into it, it's a short space of time to do it, but he will be able to take this chaotic time for the team,

simplify it and allow them to focus on the games. Playing a team four times in a row and having to change formations and stuff like that. And it just suddenly dawned on me. Do you think that's something that they thought about, City? Because Gareth did not change what he did. His philosophy, I was there, we did not change, I was stuck in a box and like it was quite frustrating to stay so rigid. Having someone else come in, someone like Nick Cushin, you've played under him for a lot longer than I did, Jen, he tweaked things, he did actually change things, he brought subs on, he made different formation changes, so that, I don't know, I'm just throwing it out there, is a different

personnel coming in that is able to do that or wants to change their philosophy and throw a spanner in the works against a team that you're going to play four times in a row, which is quite historical as well. I remember thinking when I was at Man City, right, this is the most structured build up and press I've ever been a part of and I loved it. I loved like, I'm quite a logical thinker and I like to simplify games so if someone was telling me, you know, if they press this way this is how we're going to build up and this is exactly how we're going to set up. And Nick, again, philosophy of Man City was, yes, we have our structure and our shape, but you can adapt to what other people do and you do have a bit of flexibility within that formation. Then when I left Man City, I was at Arsenal, I heard

the chat of Garrett Taylor, it was like even more that way and I remember thinking right it can't be more structured than what it was. Oh it can. And hearing you speak now of you being stuck in the box I was like okay that's rigid, that's not showing any sort of flexibility whatsoever but you can't you cannot do that. If you did if we played against each other, I sent her back in striker for four games in a row and you did the exact same thing, four times 90 minutes, you'd still beat me over 90 minutes every single time. I don't know exactly what you're going to do. But I think if a striker is adapting or doing different things or dropping into a 10 or running the channel or doing different things for 90 minutes across four games, then I'm

thinking, right, I've got a mental challenge and a physical one, whereas that's what these teams have to do, I think, over, and I think Nick has beyond got more than the capability to do that with a team. Can we go back just a tiny bit there? I think that's really interesting what you were saying about the coaching style, Ellen. Do you think players will have found

that lack of flexibility difficult, or perhaps that unwavering approach and commitment to a style difficult with Gareth? Yeah it is challenging. I probably was being a little bit exagerative in the sense that you could move a little bit more. I think it's just being given a little bit more freedom. I think Alex Scott says freedom, was it freedom in the framework? That type of thing. But it was very structured. You're kind of, you're quite rigid in where you can move, not getting too much into the build up, especially for a nine being in

in and around the box. So it was quite challenging. And Meadema has spoken about that as well, kind of learning to adapt to that. I think she is given a little bit more freedom in fairness, but it is hard when you want, you see what's happening in the game. You want to be able to make that difference on the pitch, but you can't because of the framework and the structure and the philosophy, the Man City way of what he wanted was very much in the pockets, stay in your structure, obviously moving through the thirds, obviously playing out from the back. It's quite challenging and I think I'm interested to see whether there is a

little bit more fluidity in the sense of where you're able to play, especially in that midfield I would say and upfront having a bit more fluidity and be able to move with a little bit more freedom in that formation and whether he does tweak it a little bit, which will be interesting to see and how the players maybe thrive in that. I don't know. And just in terms of player management style, Jen, what will the Man City players experience when Nick Cushing gets to grips with the team? What's the type of style that he has in terms of his management? This is an interesting one for me because I think when Nick was my manager when I was 24,

but he was already quite a young manager as well. So he was adapting and changing his sort of ways to manage. And he's been away for five years now. We're talking 10 years ago that he managed me and as much as players adapt and change their philosophy, managers do as well. So I'm not sure if he'll be the arm around you, give you the conversation or be a bit standoffish, but I will say he's much more experienced now and he'll be

tailored to his style to the task at hand. And I think he'll be really intrigued as well to see how the women's game has gone and how it's grown and developed. Because me and Ellen were talking a little bit about that off air before we came on. And, you know, he left in 2020 and we talk all the time about how much the exposure of the game has grown and what the players and the pressure that they're put under. But I do think he's got he's way more experienced now and he'll be, you know, ready for that challenge to look after the players in this really difficult time. Yeah, all eyes on his first press conference I'm sure.

There'll be so many people eagerly waiting to see what he says and his approach for the weekend. We will come back to the League Cup final. We'll talk about the Chelsea side of that one very shortly. But let's just move over to the FA Cup. A big upset in the FA Cup is Liverpool beat Arsenal 1-0 to make it through to the semi-finals. And a really impressive display, Ellen, from Liverpool, not just nicking their goal, but also the way that they approach the game, their press, and their mentality to get over the line here. Exactly, and I don't want to be harsh on Liverpool. I honestly thought Arsenal would win this game and I think you've got to give full credit to

Liverpool. The way they came out they pressed Arsenal, their relentlessness, the diligence, defending and I think their togetherness as well. It was an amazing result for them and I think, you know, they probably could have nicked a couple more as well. And I think, I do feel for Van Donslaar, I do. She made obviously a few mistakes and obviously it came off the post and hit her and went in the goal, but I think you've got to give credit for Liverpool, the way they set up, their energy, their enthusiasm, the intensity. Arsenal had one shot on target, one shot, which is just crazy, I think.

But you've got to say, Liverpool obviously frustrated them and congratulations to them to get into the next round. Perhaps that one shot on target, maybe six months ago, Jen, you might have said, yeah, that does sound like the story of Arsenal at the moment, but they've really turned a corner in terms of just how much cut through they've had in their attacking play. So what went wrong against Liverpool? Yeah, I mean, I think Renee Slayers was talking about a big emphasis on the Arsenal way and them trying to really continue that style of play. And that's what we've seen so much of. But I think we've seen so much of that of them playing at the Emirates. I think a

game at Bournemouth, you know, when the pitch is struggling just after winter and it's getting dug up and it's not in the best nick, playing the Arsenal way is so much harder. And I think Liverpool took advantage of that. They're pressing your goal. If you're trying to play passes across a six yard box which at the Emirates is clean football and it's gonna happen and you can find a build out and it's gonna be great because the ball's moving perfectly and fast. Born with that, no disrespect, it's not gonna happen especially in the the knickets and now and I think that's where Arsenal was still so adamant of

playing this way and it's credit to them for trying to but ultimately Liverpool were like right try and play on this pitch because we're going to go after you and press you really high and Van Dompsela I think got caught on the ball a couple of times made some poor decisions on the ball based on them trying to play the Arsenal way and build out from the back but I think Liverpool really looked at that as an opportunity to take advantage of pressing high. I think their manager came out and said how well organized they were and you know making sure no one got a second to breathe on the ball which is really difficult to do against the top side by the way which have unbelievable quality from from back to front but

I think that's where it maybe could have adapted a little bit more to play a different way and a bit more direct. Not for 90 minutes but in certain moments I'm watching Liverpool press that high and there's so much space up the other end of the pitch and maybe can you go longer, can you change the way you're playing for a couple of phases of play just to get fire up the pitch and get more opportunities. I was just going to say Jen on what you just said as a centre half, at what point do you go to your goalkeeper or your other centre half? We're not playing back here. I can't stand, you might be different, when a goalkeeper is on her goal line and you've got two centre halves on either side of the six yard box just playing a square ball across and I'm

just like what are you doing? It obviously is the arse in the way, but at some point you think the press is very good for Liverpool. Just go long, just get rid of it. Of course you always want to play that way, but you have to be like, right, how good is the press? There's been a couple of times where if you started to give the ball away in your own third, that was always the alarm for me to be like, right, OK, the next pass, maybe think beyond the line, think straight up to the nine, think, try and hit a channel, try and turn a team.

But yeah, I would always mark that on the amount of errors be made in our third, which is kind of what we saw. You have to turn a team. Just to give yourself a bit of a second, people might not like it or might not like what they see or be like, no, still try and play, still try and play, but if you're putting your own teammates under pressure you know can you change it and can you adapt but look I think it's one they'll look back and they'll see the space higher up the pitch and be saying the same things but I also think the pitch had a huge bit to part to play but no I was definitely one playing those six yard square balls across the across the across the box and play out so you're probably terrible. I'd have been like, cooey, I'm over here. Do you, if you're Olivia Smith or Sophie Roman Howe, do you get a sense after the first one

that Daphna van Domselaar had not been able to get rid of and I suppose there's a discussion there about whether the pass perhaps put her under pressure or whether she could have just got rid of the ball but do you get a sense that oh okay they're not quite at it today and then does that spur you on a little bit? Oh yeah, that really gets you going as an eye and that does. Yeah, if you put a little bit of pressure on or you've worked at something in training on the press and it's worked that first time,

you're like, absolutely, we're going again. And they haven't changed what they're doing. So you go again, the goalkeeper's getting a bit flustered if she's given the ball away. The back line are playing, still playing across the six yard box. They're still not getting rid. You just keep putting pressure on and pressure on and pressure on and for a nine, I was a weird nine because I loved the press. I loved running about, loved to slide tackle, loved slide tackling the goalkeeper, the centre halves. But I feel like when you kind of smell blood as a nine, you just keep going for the jugular. And it felt like that's what they kept doing for Liverpool.

And she had a few opportunities, Roman Hogg, and she'll probably kick herself that she didn't score one of those. But at the end of the day, she obviously did get the goal. Well, it was an own goal, but I think it's really really impressive their press and that intensity that they showed against Arsenal. So a second consecutive win under Amber Whiteley and she very much agreed there just in terms of the press, she said I thought we were so well organised, the work rate was absolutely incredible and we limited their chances and put them under pressure in front of their

own goal. I wonder, Jim, with Liverpool at the moment, how much can we read into this result considering that with Arsenal and René Sleikers, they just kind of followed their feet for a little bit, saw how results played out and then made a decision once they'd seen that things were on the right path. Could we see a similar thing here with Liverpool? Yeah, potentially. Look, I think, you know, we've seen it across a lot across the WSL this season and more recently than others, but I do think it gives an opportunity for Instagram managers to change what they can in a short space of time. And look, if it is successful and it works, then why would they not be given

a chance at a longer term deal? Liverpool haven't made a semi-final in a long time and to go and beat Arsenal and knock them out of an FA Cup is a really big moment for them so under those circumstances why not? Why can't this continue? We've seen it change and happen under René Renee Slakers at Arsenal and you know if you results mean everything I think that's ultimately what it comes down to and if she gets results I can't see why Liverpool wouldn't give her the opportunity longer term. So a wonderful win for Liverpool which should really be the only talking point for Sunday at Meadow Park but once more we find ourselves sending solidarity and standing with another

player subject to abuse. Liverpool vice captain Taylor Hines was subjected to sexually inappropriate comments from a fan during the game. A Liverpool statement read the club condemns all forms of discrimination. All players now and in the future should have the knowledge that our pitches and our stadiums are safe places to play football. We thank Taylor for immediately raising this issue, her teammates and everyone at Arsenal for their swift actions. And once again, our solidarity and support with Taylor. Liverpool are in action on Friday in the WSL

in their rearranged fixture against Manchester United. And coverage of that one is available on BBC Three in the other FA Cup matches. Man United beat Sunderland, Chelsea saw off Crystal Palace and Manchester City won their game against Aston Villa to secure their semi-final spot which coming up in a few weeks time and they'll have a derby against Manchester United. The other semi-final is Chelsea against Liverpool. Tides take place in those ones on Sunday the 13th

of April and there is coverage right the way across the BBC. We're punching well above our weight already. We're a part-time team in a full-time league. Hopefully we can stay in the league in that ASDA. We're in a great position at the moment and long may that continue. That's 72 Plus, the EFL podcast only on the Football Daily. Listen on BBC Sounds. Hello, I'm Robin Ince. And I'm Brian Cox, and we would like to tell you about the new series of The Infinite Monkey Cage. We're going to have a planet off. Jupiter vs. Saturn!

It was very well done that, because in the script it does say, wrestling voice. After all of that, it's going to kind of chill out a bit and talk about ice. And also in this series we're discussing history music recording with Brian Eno and looking at nature shapes. So listen wherever you get your podcasts. So Chelsea and Man City head into this bonkers period where they'll play each other four times in a row. Lots of change to talk about Champions League, WSL and the League Cup final this Saturday.

Coverage on BBC One from 11.45 and on Sports Extra. And I caught up with Lucy Bronze to ask how she's feeling ahead of her first final with Chelsea. The last time I played in this final was, it was the same fixture but reversed for me. So I was with City playing against Chelsea and it was actually at Wimbledon which is obviously just down the road from me now so yes a little bit surreal but it's really exciting. Was Ellen in the team that day? Yeah Ellen White. Amazing. I know this sounds silly but like time at the moment is going so quick that feels like ages ago. Ellen's old now isn't she? Come on. She'll hate that. She'll hate that. I'll try and see if we can get that one cut out so I

don't get in trouble. Is this one different for you? I think it's a different feeling. I think you know coming to a new club with a new manager, the expectation that's around us at the minute and the whole like oh Chelsea are unbeaten what an amazing season but we haven't won anything like we've won the award for most games unbeaten or something I don't know that's not really a trophy so yeah to actually finally have the opportunity to win a trophy there's a lot bigger than anything else that we've done this season so far. It's really tough to try and find things that you haven't completed before but you've done an invincible season haven't you already with Leon? Yeah yeah I mean yeah a league

season. Yeah did the full league season and then you won you won Champions League that year as well. Yeah I've done the quadruple with Leon and with Barca. So okay so this is just now just time to do it in England which I guess is quite a cool challenge and I was thinking today when we were sort of on our way down I wonder what is the the thing that that drives you is it proving people wrong is it proving yourself right that you've made the right decisions? Yeah I think proving myself right more than other people wrong would be I think I always used to think of it as being I'm proving wrong, but actually I don't care what they have to say to be honest with you. And like, do I

really have to care when I'm happy and I'm winning? Like I'm winning at life. Come on. Now like I'm the one who's, you know, playing the game that I love. I've traveled the world. I've played in these amazing teams. I've improved as a player, I've had ups, I've had downs and all this kind of thing. And yeah, I think when I speak about all the different moves that I've done in my life, I do feel like I've always made the right steps and that makes me really happy that I've enjoyed that and I've made decisions that other people might not have wanted to take and took risks and I've enjoyed it all along the way. Does it make you feel more relaxed having done so many of these things before? When you come into a final like this, do you still feel that same nervous excitement that

you used to feel or are you now a lot more focused I guess and present? Somehow I was like, as I've got older, I've got younger at the same time. You've been buttoning it. Yeah, yeah, people say that. So I think like, I have this excitement but it's because I'm kind of just sharing in the excitement of everybody else and maybe the fact that I have

done it before, you can enjoy it a little bit more but at the same time my first, I remember like my first FA Cup final, that was my first final was so exciting so I guess your perspective changes but the emotions still are there but just for different reasons. I wonder what with your

with the things that motivate you I thought maybe it'd be a little bit like you seen that Michael Jordan thing of he's like I took that personally if anyone ever says to him like oh like you know what maybe you're not in as good a form as you were or maybe you're're not at your peak or whatever, and he always goes on about taking it personally or finding a way to kind of drive himself forward. Do you still do that with yourself? Do you still try and find things that make you have that edge,

or do you just always have it? No, I think I do. I think I push myself a lot. Like, I think people who know me really closely know that I'm like very obsessed. I maybe push myself a bit too much sometimes and can be my own worst enemy but I really enjoy that and I enjoy finding another level in myself. I enjoy you know breaking barriers whether it's as an individual, as in a collective team. It's just fun and why not if I can? Why would I not take advantage of all these opportunities that I've got?

I think some people need that. I think some people thrive on that. The idea that you just keep going and keep going and keep going. And you know when you get people say to you like, oh, why don't you just slow down? And you're like, no, why? You could actually go so much further. There's so much more to go.

I've had that my whole career. Why don't you take a little bit more rest? I'm like, I don't need rest. You've proved that you don't, right? I mean, you're still like, you're playing almost as many games as you always have. You're still finding yourself in finals, in huge games, just had a repeat of the World Cup final and came out on the right side of that one as well. You're not exactly slowing down just in terms of the amount of things that you want to achieve. No, definitely not and I think, I just think I set a really high bar for myself really early on in my, not early on in my career but in kind of when people talk about peak years of your late 20s and I ran around in games like crazy, like I could flip a game

on the head and I was right back like what the, when I look back now at Alexi Poteos told me that she was like we played Leon once and like we were talking about stopping the right back and she was like how insane is that and I was like that is so sick like I didn't know that really happened and she was like of course she did and I was like I did this when you when I was a teammate yeah when I was at Barca she was like I was like isn't that crazy from a right back she was like Lucy that is crazy and I'm like oh yeah maybe it is but now I did all that I'm I'm still performing now but it's just what I did before was a little bit wild

sometimes I think also what an amazing thing for a position on the pitch that I suppose a lot of people that have played football in any level won't necessarily have considered a glamour position at times. It's the most glamorous. You've made it the most glamorous. You couldn't slide tackle off the line but at the same time you can head back post at the other side like you're just everywhere you're everywhere but it can be whatever you want to be. I think that's the Lucy Bronze version of right back. Oh yeah, maybe. I'm the magician. I'm the thing. In my very, very limited capacity, getting shoved at right back was like, oh this guy's

bogus. Just pop him in it right back. I think it suits me because it is a position where like, they say you make a position your own. There's limitations to a centre-back running up the pitch. There's limitations to a number nine coming back. Midfielders, you operate in certain areas. I don't know if full-back does, but it's my choice to attack or not. It's my choice in a lot of the things I do, so I have to dictate the game that I play within that position. Son, you just said to us that with the four games coming up against City, she's going to have to make use of her squad and no one will be able to play every game 90 minutes.

And I thought, I know someone who'll want to. The thing is, not even just me, I tell you the other person who will want to be Millie and it's the oldest two players on the team. You two have literally not taken us off the pitch to drag us off to make us not play. I think Millie's played the most this season as well. Yeah, it's funny. Why do you reckon that is? She's played the most. We're like the two of you, like which we were like, let's use the right terminology. Senior players. Yeah, but you're the two that will be the hardest to get off the pitch. I think we're just, yeah, I mean we've been in the game so long we know what the right things are to do and things like that and we just both enjoy

competing. I think that's the similarities with myself and Millie is wanting to compete and wanting to go up against people. Like we just thrive off of it. We don't feel pain because we're from the north either. Don't feel the cold, don't feel the pain. Yeah, Millie definitely doesn't feel the cold. I think I do a little bit more now. But yeah, it's just like wanting to compete, wanting to be there, wanting to push yourself, knowing what the right things are for your body. You learn that as you get older and it's something that's just been drilled in us from a young age and we've just kept it for a long, long

time. And also I suppose you become more aware of the something that's just been drilled in us from a young age and we've just kept it for a long, long time. And also I suppose you become more aware of the fact that these days are fewer and farther between. What are you talking about? We're like once you get to these, once you get to this point, find those ways. Yeah, you know, like exactly. You don't, I think having injuries as well. Really, can I borrow you very quickly for two seconds?

Come and join our interview. He's just talking about you. We were just talking about you. So Millie Bright has just come to join us as well. And I said, Sonia said to us a little bit earlier on, she said, it's gonna be very difficult for any players to play four games against Man City back to back and play 90 minutes.

And I said, well, I can think of one. And I said, I can think of someone else. And I said, me and Millie are the last two who want to get dragged off that pitch. And I said, but the funniest thing is, we're the two oldest. We are available. Yeah, we're available. And we're playing every minute. What did you put that down to, by the way?

Mentality. We do absolutely everything we need to do every single day. And we're from the north? And we're northern. We've got the northern blood. That's basically what I said. I love it. You're free now. Thank you so much. You can go on the rest of your day Yes, sorry Sonia Just so you know and I can't chat you about talking a little bit about England and about playing Spain You know, sometimes you'll be watching players play and you think they're thriving and loving this game

Look like you were just enjoying that game so much. Yeah they're loving this game. Look like you were just enjoying that game so much. Yeah, a lot of people said that. Oh really? Yeah. I don't know, like, obviously I know the Spain team so well. I have so much respect for them. Like, they're amazing players, playing at Bath with them for two years. I know the talent that they have. But yeah, I mean, I think they've got, they've kind of got that label that England used to have after we won the Euros. Like, untouchable. Every player's the most amazing thing ever and now England are just not as good kind of thing and I was a bit like, mate like they're just they're just players like I

think me and Kira both kind of said they're amazing we respect them but we play with and against them for the past few years like they're just players and yeah like I remember speaking to Kira before and we talked about like Bob Matty and I said Kira you played against this girl every single day in training like so did I we know these players like they're amazing but we also know like they have their flaws like we do and we can just play against them like it's cool like let's have fun with it I think I did have fun with it. Just finally, Lucy, before you finished up, Mother's Day on the horizon. And we've spoken multiple times about Diane Bronze.

I wondered, what is the one thing that you're most proud to take from Diane Bronze in terms of her character? I think she always puts other people ahead of herself, has a whole life. I think that's puts other people ahead of herself, has a whole life. I think that's why me and my siblings have had an amazing life and amazing opportunities. And I think that's something that when I play football, like me and Milly, I sometimes say like, oh, we're like the parents and I want to do so much to give to them.

And I think it's from the example that she had of putting me in front of, ahead of herself sometimes and I think that's something that I've took into football definitely and in life but yeah in football it's like I need to get the best out of the people around me because that equally adds to my enjoyment in it as well. That's such a wonderful thing that when people have that I think it's just so special. Yeah I think my mum's got like, I think that's her. I don't think anyone in the world does it more than her like putting her kids and everyone ahead of herself. Lucy, best of luck. I hope it goes as well as it can for you and also that

you're enjoying it as much as you seem to be enjoying everything else on the pitch at the moment. Thank you. Wonderful to listen to as always and just in case you couldn't hear that bit where Millie Bright was just walking away she said I just want to be clear I am available for all of those games. I hope you're listening Sonja which I thought was really really funny and I also thought it was quite telling Alan that those two are two of the most senior members in the squad, and yet both of them are so hungry. They just, they want to be a part of absolutely everything. They've got an incredible mentality.

It might be from them being Northern, but I just think it's just an old school mentality that we don't see as much now. Just that drive, that want to just do absolutely anything to win for the team. It's absolutely incredible to have that mentality and them two probably being the oldest in that team as well to being like, I'm gonna be playing every single minute.

I think she said it before, didn't she, about Serena Vigman just saying like, I will not stop until she tells me like, you cannot play. She said, you're gonna have to physically drag me off, which I loved. Yeah, I just love her mentality. She's she's she's such an amazing kind of person, Lucy, but she's she works so hard on and off the pitch to be a great right back.

But then she leads by example. And like she said there, she wants the best. She wants to leave an amazing legacy for those players coming through as well, which is super powerful. And she's a she's an amazing legacy for those players coming through as well which is super powerful and she's an amazing role model. Yeah I mean I think that comes with experience she's had right? She's gone from Manchester City to Lyon to Barcelona and achieved everything there is to achieve in the women's game at a domestic level and you know played in some really high pressure situations so I think once you've done that and once you've got a taste for it and then you've got a taste for the success of it you want to be

involved in absolutely everything so it's no surprise hearing hearing the way she speaks and I as a player as well loved this crunch time of the season where it was every game was either, you know, a knockout cup or a crunch game in the league. And this is the part I think where players like Lucy Bronze and Millie Byrne absolutely thrive because it's crunch time. It's in the March start of April where games start to really matter. She said herself, they haven't won anything yet. This is their opportunity to lift a trophy, to actually get the success that everyone's been talking about for this Chelsea team but this is the first game where they could potentially get

their hands on some silverware so I kind of love that attitude as well, like we're going to do absolutely everything but we've not won anything yet and I think I've been in that situation as well where you're in every trophy situation and come away with nothing which is devastating so I love that attitude as well where you know you want to play in every minute but we've not won anything yet and I thought that speaks volumes of who she is as a player and a character. And I guess the other thing in there Jen as a defender, it must be really lovely to hear her talking about the idea that she believes from right back that she can influence the game in any way possible

That she thinks basically I can be the one scoring the goals. I can be making goal line blocks I could be making a last player tackle. I can be getting the assist that wins the game like that to me just listening to that so refreshing because when when I was growing up and And you were being coached as a kid no one no one was like oh by the way the right back is going to be the most important person on the pitch. Yeah I mean she's made that position her own right she's kind of but also she's an absolute engine right when you speak of Lucy it's box-to-box she's everywhere on a pitch and I thought that was so amazing that little moment that she was

having with Poteus that she talked about of playing against Lucy, we were trying to stop the right back. That's what Poteus was saying. And I thought that was, if you're a right back coming in and you're thinking, right, that's amazing. But that is the level the game's at now. You're constantly, you're looking at every player on the pitch being like, how can we stop them?

But she is 100% made right back her own. And she is the epitome of what a right back, I think, you know, a world class stands for is every, every area of the pitch she's in. She's going forward as much as she is an attacker, she's just even better as a defender. And that's like her attribute. She has everything needed to be the best right back in the world. So no, I think it's credit to her that, you know, teams are talking about how do we stop a right back. That is pretty incredible. So the first of four crunch games between Chelsea and Man City

coming up this weekend. A reminder, you can listen to the League Cup final on Saturday on 5 Sports Extra and watch on BBC One as well. And then next week we'll also have a full interview with Sonja Bompas-Dore looking ahead to those crucial games across the Champions League and in the WSL. That's where we'll leave it for today. On the next Football Daily Mark Chapman brings you all of the reaction to the men's Champions League and myself, Ellen and General will be back next week. We'll catch you all then.

Hello, I'm Robin Ince. And I'm Brian Cox. And we would like to tell you about the new series of the Infinite Monkey Cage. We're going to have a planet off. Jupiter versus Saturn! Well, it's very well done that, because in the script it does say wrestling voice. After all of that, it's going to kind of chill out a bit and talk about ice. And also in this series, we're discussing history of music,

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