Football Daily - Women’s Football Weekly: WSL season finale & what makes London City Lionesses unique?

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

Ellen White, Jen Beattie and Ben Haines speak to two title winning managers as the domestic league season comes to a close. London City Lionesses manager Jocelyn Precheur joins the pod as they secure promotion to the WSL and become the first ever sole entity club to compete in the women’s top tier. How influential is their owner, Michele Kang? And what are the benefits of being a smaller club? Sonia Bompastor reflects on winning the WSL title in her first year as Chelsea manager as they edge closer to an unbeaten season in the league. But does Chelsea’s spending on players take away from their success on the pitch? As Manchester United secure Champions League football for next season, have they gone under the radar this season? And what might the repercussions be of Manchester City failing to qualify for Europe?TIME CODES: 1’52 Final day of the Championship drama 4’17 London City Lionesses manager Jocelyn Precheur 22’02 Chelsea win the WSL title 22’44 Chelsea manager Sonia Bompastor 37’10 Manchester United qualify for Europe ahead of Manchester CityBBC Sounds/ 5 Live commentaries this week: Wednesday 7th May CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: PSG v Arsenal, live on 5 Live. Thursday 8th May EUROPA LEAGUE: Bodo Glimt v Spurs, live on 5 Live. EUROPA LEAGUE: Manchester United v Athletic Club, live on 5 Sports Extra. Saturday 10th May WOMENS SUPER LEAGUE: Chelsea v Liverpool 1230 KO, live on 5 Sports Extra. PREMIER LEAGUE: Southampton v Manchester City 1500 KO, live on 5 Live. PREMIER LEAGUE: Bournemouth v Aston Villa 1730 KO, live on 5 Live. Sunday 11th May PREMIER LEAGUE: Nottingham Forest v Leicester 1415 KO, live on 5 Live. PREMIER LEAGUE: Manchester United v West Ham 1415 KO, live on 5 Sports Extra. PREMIER LEAGUE: Spurs v Crystal Palace 1415 KO, live on BBC Sport Website and App. PREMIER LEAGUE: Liverpool v Arsenal 1630 KO, live on 5 Live.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. This week Matt sits down with team principal Christian Horner, you don't want to miss that. Watching him drive the car is a little bit like Roger Federer at the top of his game. So he'll be here driving for Red Bull next season. Experience F1 like never before by tuning into the inside track wherever you get your podcasts. Music Radio Podcasts. On the Football Daily, the Women's Football Weekly with Ben Haynes, Ellen White and Jen Beattie. Welcome along to the Women's Football Weekly with me, Ben Haynes, England women's record goalscorer Ellen White and former Arsenal and Scotland defender Jen Beattie. Lots to get into over the course of the next hour. Two title wing managers on the show.

We'll be hearing from Chelsea's Sonja Bompastor as her Chelsea side close in on an unbeaten season in the WSL. Plus London City Lionesses manager Jocelyn Prascha joins us shortly with promotion to the WSL from the championship secured at the weekend. Lots to discuss. And I think, Ellen, the first thing is, it's quite strange to go into the crescendo of a WSL season and then not be that much on the line in the final game.

Yeah, pretty much everything's pretty much wrapped up, really. There'll be the fight for second and third for Arsenal, Man United, when they play each other at the weekend. And then, yeah, just maybe if teams can maybe just jump a little bit higher. But it's all about pride, wanting to perform for your team, for your fans, for this season and put on a good show really. So there is still a lot to pay for, like personally and for the clubs as well. So I'm still excited to watch this weekend. And Jen, in terms of the silverware as well, we've still got some massive games on the

horizon there. Yeah, I was going to say from a fan perspective, you've still got, even if your team's not in the final, it's still awesome football to watch. The big FA Cup final coming up, and then of course having an English team in the Women's Champions League final is an unreal spot to be. Of course we wanted two of them to be there, but it's just Arsenal, and I'm actually going to be there, Ben. I love that. Do you know what? It's too special an occasion, isn't it? What a game that promises to be. We will get into that over the course of the next couple of weeks, I'm sure, but we're

going to start with the championship final day. The season couldn't really have finished in more dramatic style. If you missed the run-in, rather poetically, it was a straight two-way shootout on the final day for one promotion spot to the WSL. So first versus second, London City Lionesses needing a draw away at Birmingham City to confirm their promotion to the WSL, Birmingham City needing to win to jump ahead, London City Lionesses fly out, go 2-0 up, Birmingham City come from two goals down to level it up and make it super nervous at the end,

but it ultimately ended two all, which means that London City Lionesses become the first side with no men's team affiliation to make it into the WSL. And Ellen, I just, I want to start here with just what a special achievement that is. Absolutely phenomenal. Watched the game. It was wild. I was absolutely screaming at the TV Yeah, I thought London City Lionesses had done it at 2-0 and then Birmingham came right back into the game It was a nail-biting 10 minutes of added time. I was screaming I saw Michelle Caggin there in the stands and she looks so nervous The owner of London City Lionesses, but what an amazing occasion

What an amazing achievement to not be affiliated with the Men's Team, to be in an independent club, to be coming to the WSL, phenomenal. It was just amazing to watch the celebrations as well with the players and the staff and the owner. It was amazing. Jen? I just think for any season to go down to the wire, I think there's been so much chat as well around the championship and how competitive it is,

and it's spot on to go to the final game of the season and to still be that close, like exactly what Ellen was saying, everyone's on the edge of their seat. I think it was amazing that the game was televised as well and showcasing the game so that people can actually get on board with what the championship's trying to showcase and do. But Unreal, from London City Lionesses,

to be the first ever team to be a sole entity coming into WSL, and really show a huge ambition. It's not just about they've been the first team to do it. They want to go on and be successful, which I know we'll get into it more on the show. But I thought it was an Unreal achievement. It's awesome to see that kind of investment come true and be successful. And for a game to go down to the wire and it'd be as exciting as it was, I thought it was awesome to watch. Awesome

for the game in general. We're joined by London City Lionesses manager, Jocelyn Pressure. Thank you so much for joining us, Jocelyn. How are you? I'm very good, I'm very good as you can imagine, and it's a pleasure to join you and talk with you. Well, shall I tell you what I'm imagining? Because we were listening to the radio last night and apparently the celebrations were still ongoing, is that correct? Yeah, private celebration.

The girls keep going to celebrate. Tomorrow we go back to work. But yes, I give them, of course, the permission to celebrate as much as they wanted because it's a deserve this time and they deserve to share this moment together. It's such a special achievement. Just tell us what it was like as the clock was ticking down considering there was so much on the line. You must have felt such an enormous amount of pressure. The task was very huge, especially when I arrived. We start from very low, so much lower than I expected,

to be honest, at the beginning. We had so many things to do in terms of building the club, building a culture, not only building a strong roster. And, but step by step, we never stopped to walk, we never stopped to give our best to try to improve. I didn't want to talk about the promotion at the beginning because for me it was really a very far objective. We had so many things to do before,

but the girl works very hard, improve fast. And when we arrive at the end of this season, we really had a good chance to fight for promotion. And it was really a good one because it was a fight until really, till the end. That's right. It was really a good war because it was a fight until the end. It was quite unbelievable, but we did it in one year, so it's a very, very huge success for us. That's fascinating that you didn't want to commit to that early with the team. You didn't want to talk about promotion because you can imagine that it's one of those things that would be in the front of everyone's mind. Was it hard to try and push that to one

side for a bit? Yeah, but I think now after a few months, I think it was a mistake to talk about the promotion at the beginning of the season. Maybe not something really in regards of the situation we faced at the moment. We didn't have a good pitch, we didn't have a good infrastructure, the staff was not composed, we didn't have even not to have a medical side and anything at the beginning. Fortunately and with the help of Michel, we developed everything very fast and if you remember our situation in November is not very good. So this is the moment I say, okay, stop to... It's like the pressure was too huge at the moment and we focused to... We forget to focus on the essential, which was keep working, keep improving.

And at the moment we say, okay, we just focus on every game one by one and we will see at the end of the season where we are and even after in February in March I refuse we never change we stay refocused game by game really try to be better today than you were yesterday keep this philosophy keep this logic and of course after the victory in Newcast okay, now we start to talk about the promotion. We have a very good chance to get it. But I also wanted the player to focus on the work, keep preparing the game the way they did. And fortunately, it worked.

Huge congratulations, Josh. And I just wanted to ask what your pool was. Why London City Lionesses? Did you have those conversations with Michelle Kang about what her ambitions were for the club? Why did you come to England and want to manage this team? For many reasons, but the main reason, the first reason, of course, is Michelle's vision, Michelle's project. I have worked for maybe more than 15 years now in the women's football and meeting someone who wants to put all her resources only in the women's side is something quite unique,

I think. And of course, I like her ambition. I like the multi-club project. But what I really like is her wish to change the women's game, develop the knowledge about how we can train the women's athletes. And I really wanted to be part of this project,

whatever the club, she fully convinced me. And the second reason is after when she talked to me about London, I was very, very happy because England is really a country I wanted to walk, where I wanted to walk and you are so in advance in the women's side. So it was for me an opportunity I couldn't miss. I find it fascinating hearing the whole investment and research, but I would love to know just how important your players were.

How did they step up in big moments, especially when, you know, all of us saw the likes of Aslany signing, Jakobsson, Kumagai, super experienced pros. How were they, they must have been instrumental in getting the team over the line. But for me, this player had an assertion role on the pitch, but I would say even more out of the pitch, because, as I said before, I needed to build a club, a team and a culture.

And the high level culture is something very hard to teach to players. And when you can have the support of a very experienced player who wants something in the past, who plays for a very big club in England or in other countries, of course, you have a link in the changing room, a link on the pitch to share my message and you win a lot of time. I would say when you have the impact of such an experienced and good player for a coach, it's something very valuable. It was so useful for me and I'm pretty sure without the help of this player, nothing could have been achieved in one season.

Impossible. Jocelyn, can you take us into the culture? What is it that you wanted to bring? Obviously you lean on and you rely on your senior players to help you, but what is the culture that you want to see in its purest form? I would say on the pitch. I really believe in the intensity. So, try to understand we need to train the same way as we play, which is easy to say, but not all the time easy

to do every day, especially when you have a long preseason. So, we won the last game May 4th and we started the season July 4th, so it's really 10 months. So keep this intensity for 10 months, it's hard. But I would say more important outside the pitch in terms of recovery, nutrition, discipline, life discipline. I could give many examples, but nothing existed when I arrived. Player just arrived, make the training and went back home. And of course, when you know what the high level requires, you know it's absolutely not

enough. You need to, so for example, we imposed from the beginning, the breakfast, we have a lunch together and player needs to go for recovery protocol before going back home. So all these kinds of things I needed to build. Fortunately, I had a strong staff with me to do it. As you can imagine, I didn't do it everything alone, far from it. But after it's also something you need to teach to players. I would even say educate some players about this, especially the young players. And after, they keep working hard

because we needed to improve fast. At the beginning, we were not ready. We lost many points in the first part of the season. So if we wanted to have a chance, we needed to improve. That's why to have a chance, we needed to improve. That's why I insisted a lot on the fact, focus on really, we cannot lose every one day. Be sure tomorrow you will be better than you we were today. And to keep this intensity, it means you need also to take care of your body. So we had many things to put outside the pitch, as I just said, in terms of recovery and self-discipline. How did the players adapt to all those different changes, obviously, that you implemented when you went in, like you say, about nutrition,

about breakfast, about lunch? I've been in a team that we didn't have any of that, and then suddenly it was implemented and it blew my mind. It was just crazy to then have to all that intensity of training as well. Step by step, of course, as you can imagine, we didn't implement everything in one day, but that's why I talk about education. We talk a lot with the player. I wanted to put the breakfast and the lunch to show them what we expect them to eat. And of course, after it's belonged to the responsibility of the player, if they want to follow this rule or not.

And after they are judged with their performance. But for many things, for example, for the massage, we didn't impose it, but we strongly recommended it and we made a lot of meetings to explain why it was so important, really, to make them understand the high level. For me, if I need to summarize, it's really the culture of details. And all these details, as I just mentioned, we explain to the players until they build their own discipline. Some players prefer this way, other players prefer the other one. And that's why having these experienced players who follow different protocol have their own habit. For the Kosovare, as you can imagine,

doesn't have the same protocol and habit than the Sakiko Magai, who has, by the way, her private message people, for example. So all these details, this is something we need to bring if you want to compete in the very high level. And for me, the fact we were in the championship doesn't matter because this culture, we need to build whatever the level is if you want to perform this is what I believe in you need to create this environment. I'm so interested to know what the plan is now for next season. I mean as the only club that isn't affiliated to a Premier League men's side for example, how is that going

to be different for you? Do you see that as a challenge or do you see that as something that potentially can liberate you a little bit? A little both. First, of course, it's harder because you don't have the men's side support. So when you build, for example, your medical department, you cannot have the sport doctor for the men's side who can advise you at the beginning. So no, you need to create everything from the beginning. But in the same time for me, and it's also a reason why I like this project so much,

it's because it's an opportunity to create and organize the environment of the first team the way I want. And this is a freedom Michelle gave me. And I expressed to her so many times how grateful I am about the trust she gave me because I have really the freedom to build these teams exactly the way I want

with the support of many other people. But that's why I say it's also an opportunity to try to find the best optimized organization, not for every club, but only for London City, a women's team with a women's youth team also, in regards of the environment specific we have in this club. Jocelyn, thank you so much for joining us. It's been wonderful to chat to you and congratulations again. I know us three

will absolutely be watching on with so much interest to see how you guys get on and enjoy the summer and I hope you get some rest. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. It's a pleasure and yes I will waste it. Lovely stuff. Thank you. Thank you. Justin Pressure there, who's London City Lionesses side are on the way to the WSL next season. Fascinating to hear about the way that they are going about things culturally, Jen. But also, in terms of Michelle Kang and what she's doing there, she hasn't been involved in the women's game for decades. This is someone

who's fairly new to it, and yet she seems to be getting it right all the way along the way as she kind of meets these various touch points. Yeah, and I think the culture thing is actually such a good point, Ben, because I think I'm sure Ellen would agree as well. When you have played in Europe for big clubs, that culture is kind of automatically set within the club in terms of identity, how to act as a player that lives and breathes that club.

So I was fascinated to hear how they've done that from a standalone club. And I think I learned a little bit about that from being at BFC and how a brand new team because they existed in 2019, they separated from Millwall. So it's a quick amount of time that you've got to create that. But in terms of Michelle Kang, I think a lot of clubs we've looked at lately like Man United or Wolves that are really lacking the investment from the men's side and now we're seeing the huge benefits that can come from being a standalone team when someone who really believes in the

women's game and I think that's shining through when she's owner of Leon, Washington Spirit and now London City. The business mind that she has to kind of see the bigger picture that women's football is only going in one direction and if the right investment is made. Don't get me wrong, she's had success very quickly but I just love the quotes that are coming out that it's not just about getting promoted, it's about getting promoted and being successful in WSL. I think it's, I genuinely think it's really going to shake the shape of the women's game in England. And, you know, we've seen the likes of Crystal Palace go down, Bristol spending one season back

in top flight and going back down. And I think London City are really doing it differently and raising a lot of eyebrows about how the women's game is invested in around the world. I think it's really interesting as well when you think about them being a standalone team, an independent team owned by Michelle Kang, having only been there a year. And obviously, Joshin said about he came in the start of the season as well. And none of those things he mentioned were implemented. But you've got an owner whose sole focus is the women's team and things can happen so quickly then. You're not going off having to ask

the men's team for funding or different avenues like how can I get this and then it's drip fed. Obviously yes they probably drip fed different things to help support the players but it seemed like she was just on it and they had that collaboration be like we need these things quickly to help our players, support our players, play a welfare, and also to accelerate then us wanting to be in the promotion race and get into the WSL. And I think that's really fascinating that you've got someone, an owner that is so present as well, and so liked obviously by the players.

You saw her on the pitch, she had the trophy, it was mental, but I loved it. And they seem to just love her. Obviously he's got a great relationship with her as well and I just feel like having that closeness and that own brand and that own affiliated club, it just feels like things can get done quicker it seems. I was just about to mention that, Ellen. I think, you know, the amount of times that, how many people in the women's game can say that they've met the owner of the entire club in European football?

Very, very few. Like, maybe a captain on a very rare occasion. And again, compared to NWSL, it's much more common because there's just less layers. You're the only team. There's less staff members to go through. And I think when players can have that connection with the ownership and really understand what's going on behind the scenes, where the investment's being made, you just get more from the players. And I genuinely think that's a fact. The buy-in

is much more. I have no doubt that they wouldn't have got the likes of Kumagai, Jakobsson, Aslani, unless they understood the vision of the club. And I think that's such a special thing. How often do you ever see the owner get to present a trophy in the English game? It doesn't happen. It doesn't even happen in the States, but I think that connection that she's doing

and being present and making sure she's in vision so everyone knows what she's doing I think is amazing but from a player perspective if I was in those shoes it'd be even better because you get that contact time you get to ask questions you get to understand what's going on behind the scenes and be involved more and I think that's what especially the experienced pros at the club so I know I completely agree I thought it was so cool to see him. I'm Aaron Paul. And I'm Jovi Makhno. And on Wednesdays on The Football Daily we bring you 72 Plus,

the home of the EFL from Five Life Sport. As we'll get stuck into the latest from the Football League and beyond. I can't put a finger on why we weren't as energetic as we usually are. What they've got there is genuinely good people that really care about that football club and the fans have been huge in terms of the backing that they've given to this group. That's 72 Plus, the EFL podcast only on the Football Daily. Listen on BBC Sounds. Hello and welcome to the Inside Track, the Formula One podcast with exclusive access

to Red Bull Racing. I'm broadcaster and Formula One fan Rick Edwards. And I'm sports journalist Matt Magindy. Each week we break down the latest F1 news, the backstage gossip and who's under pressure. This week Matt sits down with team principal Christian Horny. You don't want to miss that. Watching him drive the car is a little bit like Roger Federer at the top of his game. So he'll be here driving for Red Bull next season. Experience F1 like never before by tuning into the Inside Track, wherever you get your podcasts. With me on the Women's Football Weekly, England women's record goalscorer Ellen White and Jen Beatty. With me on the Women's Football Weekly England Women's Record goal scorer Ellen White,

plus former Arsenal and Scotland defender Jen Beatty too. And we're turning our attention to Chelsea. Their win in against Man United, combined with Arsenal failing to beat Aston Villa last week, sealed the title. But there's still the chance to go unbeaten in the league this season. Plus they could win a domestic treble with the FA Cup final to come to. A bit earlier on today, I caught up with their manager Sonja Bomperstor, and I started with whether we can say congratulations just yet with two big games still to come. Yeah, I think you can. You can for the double. But yeah, really pleased with the fact we are now champions. And we got this

title this year, especially the first year being the Chelsea manager. But we still have one more to go. I wondered whether you were going to let yourself have any chance to breathe or maybe just let your foot off the gas just a little bit to say congratulations to the players. I know they had a very strict bedtime last time you won a trophy. So what was it like this time around? No, I think this time around was a little bit different because we won the title with two games left and I think we had time to enjoy. I think we'll have a little bit of

celebration after the Liverpool game, especially because we play home game in Stamford Bridge with the fans and we'll have some time with friends and family after the game just to enjoy. But again, it's difficult to let it completely go because we still have one more important game. How are you managing to keep your energy at the level that's required? Because I think that the volume of games that players have, it requires so much of them, but they must be constantly looking at you to make sure that you consistently have that energy to drive them forward as well.

Where do you get your energy from? From my players, from my staff, from my family. And yeah, I think, as I said, I'm lucky enough to have a job with my patient. I think I'm really passionate about football. And when I come every day into the building, I'm not even feeling I'm working. So yeah, coming into Chelsea, that's a great atmosphere. Yeah, where we work is a great environment and I really enjoy being here every day so yeah all these things bring me a lot of energy.

Yeah, you're getting all of your energy from the people around you, not from caffeine, am I right? No coffee at all? No, not coffee at all. Sonia, that is unbelievable, it's just incredible. As someone that drinks a lot of coffee to get me through the day, the idea of you getting in from a Champions League night at two, three in the morning and then having to be back at the club by what, eight again, how on earth do you find the energy for that? Yeah, but to be fair, I have some meetings sometimes when I'm almost falling asleep, so that's fair to say that. And to be honest, I, yeah, I really, um, I make lots of jokes with my analysis

because we just had a meeting and they love to make the meetings at one 30, just after lunch. And that's the, that's the worst for me. So sometimes it's really difficult for me to stay awake. Just, just as you're getting sleepy after lunchtime. Um, um, I know you're always planning ahead and you're always thinking about the next thing. So is it the FA Cup that you look at next? Is it the summer that you look at next?

Or are you already thinking about planning for the Champions League again next season? All of them, I would say. My job is to make sure I'm thinking of all of them. I think, yeah, I'm thinking about the short term, the game this Saturday against Liverpool, because this game will be important for us to stay unbeaten in the league, but also it will be a good result on Saturday, but also winning another trophy. We need to make sure we stay focused on these goals, really important ones. I think in the medium term, I'm thinking about already next season, what adjustments do we need to make in terms of squad, staff, even here in our environment. But also, yeah, I'm thinking about how can we make adjustments just to make sure we compete in Europe in the Champions League. How did you manage the energy in the group and the feeling within the group after the Barcelona game? Because it doesn't feel like there's been any drop-off in the league, at least from the outside looking in?

Yeah, you know, I'm lucky enough again to have Def in my squad. I think I have a lot of quality and talent in the players but also in the staff. So I think most of the time we talk a lot about myself, but I'm lucky enough to have people and players around me who are good enough for us to perform all together and I think yeah yeah we just rotated the team against Tottenham and I think yeah the fact we were able to win the game get the three points just shows all the quality we have in the squad. This was also the opportunity for some players to rest mentally and physically for them to be ready to take the energy they need to be ready for the last games. Yeah, I did want to touch on this because I saw you had the end of the season awards and you presented Aaron Cuthbert with a player of the season award and Natalie Bjorn won

the players player. But I wondered whether there were any players that perhaps were the players that have done the work that hasn't been seen, any unsung heroes behind the scenes maybe that have done a load of work that hasn't necessarily always been seen out on the pitch? Yeah, you know, as a manager, I really like to put my team first instead of individuals. But again, you always have to recognize some individuals sometimes but first I like to talk about the team and I think even when I was the manager in France in OL I think most of the time I was a little bit annoyed because all the players were playing for the team and when we had

these evenings with awards and recognisations, sometimes the OL player or the Chelsea players are not always recognised because they play for the team. But yeah, as you said, you mentioned some names there, but I think some players need to be mentioned in terms of leadership. Again, Millie Bright, Lucy Browns, I think their experience, their leadership in this team is great and they really had an impact for the team performance. I think when we talk about her having a successful season, we can also talk about Hannah Hampton, who had a great season. I think she's been part of this success. I'm also thinking about

Sandy Baltimore, who just came and joined the club from France and yes she had for her first season she had a great season too but many of them I could almost mention and name all my players because I told them like I'm really proud of what they achieved this year. And just very finally you've got a huge game coming up at Stam Stanford Bridge to finish the season on a high. I remember earlier on in the season you said to me that just getting the result was more important than the performance. How important is it to put on a show in front of your fans in the final game of the season as well as going out and finishing the season

unbeaten in the league? Really important, you know, we are competitors and as competitors you want to win every single game, you want to perform at your best always in every single game and I think that's our DNA, our mentality and for that reason I will never let my players breathe, they need to work even this week. We have three training sessions going into the Liverpool game and from this morning I just want to make sure they come on the pitch with the right mentality and we work with intensity. That's really important for me.

Ellen, we've watched over the course of the season and seen Chelsea not fall off much at all, then have this huge dent to their pride probably with that game against Barcelona going out at the Champions League semi-final stage. How much does it take when you're in a side like that to pick yourself up off the canvas and still finish the season strongly? It takes a lot. A lot from their mentality. And I think a lot of togetherness really, what they've built. And I feel like Sonja and her staff would have really installed within the team to just have a day or two just to process what happened. And they've still got things to obviously achieve. Obviously they lost against Barcelona and then they went on to win the title in the

next game obviously with Arsenal losing as well. But they seem to have the right mentality but then the right group of individuals that are able to kind of bring the group back, I think, that are very experienced. Obviously, I feel like it is hard to imagine what you're going to go through and feel when you are heavily defeated like that in the Champions League against Barcelona. When you're obviously wanting everything, you're pushing everything to get to that final, but I think fair play to that whole group, her staff, everyone for that mentality to have that switch to be like, no, we've won the League Cup, we've still got this title, six in a row, unbelievable, and they've still got an FA Cup final. It's still so much for them to achieve this season and it's phenomenal, that mentality. We spoke a little bit about unsung heroes with Chelsea and we spoke a little bit about the idea of the players maybe that are not getting the headlines and they're not being

spoken about all the time but will also be setting standards, Jen, off the pitch or the players that potentially get rotated in and they're not in for the most glamorous games of the season. How crucial is it to have those players that are constantly pushing your side that might be starting in the bigger games? It's massive. I think it's so key that it's not 11 players that win trophies or titles. It's the squad that does it. We used to say all the time, okay, it's the team that starts the game, but it's also the team that finishes the game. And it's the whole squad that's been in training and turned up and

implemented. It's never nice being on the other side of training and training the way the opposition is about to play. That's a horrible role but some players have to do it and ultimately you're you've got one task and that is to lift trophies as many as possible at the end of the season and you're spot on. It's the unsung heroes that come off the bench and that just keep their attitude spot on and give those bits of information to help each other and it's 100% the squad that gets it over at the line and the management. Management with staff and conversations that happen. There's so much that goes on behind the scenes day to day that ultimately makes a team the most successful they can be when they get on the pitch. If the job is to lift trophies, is three trophies enough? I think so. Look, don't get me wrong, I think the way that Chelsea have

invested and the money that they've put towards it, of course they want the Champions League. There's no doubt about that. Next year they will go for the quadruple. We've said a couple of times that maybe it's one season too soon. Germa getting injured as soon as she signed was really unfortunate but I generally think look this the semi-final was a reflection of how good Barcelona are not a dampening of what Chelsea have done in the WSL this season. They have been incredible to go unbeaten you know after so many games is an insane stat. To have the squad depth they've gone we've've said it, of course they've not played the most beautiful football,

but I love their mentality after that semi-final to go in and not necessarily perform the best against United, but get it over the line. That's been the story of their entire season. When they don't perform exceptionally well, they get points, they get results and they deserve it. So I do think fans won't settle for anything less than a treble, that's for sure. Do they deserve it? Absolutely. And I think the semi-final not winning Champions League has got nothing to do with Chelsea failing them. It's just a reflection of how good Barcelona have been. They have been unbelievable over two legs to batter Chelsea in the way that they did. And if they do manage to go unbeaten, Ellen, how big an achievement is that? Jen spoken there about the nature of the investment. Does that take anything away from

that achievement? The fact that they have gone unspent? No, I don't think so. I think that's an unbelievable achievement if they were to go unbeaten this season. I don't think it's a disaster or failure they were to go on beaten this season. I don't think it's a disaster or a failure that they haven't won the Champions League. I totally agree with what Jen's saying. You're beaten by a better team in Europe. They're the best team in Europe right now. And I don't think that's a bad thing to admit. I think you've got to look at what happened, analyse it and be like, right, how can we be better? Because we need to, if we want a challenge, we have to compete with these types of teams in Europe.

But to go on beating would just be unbelievable. But I feel like then the teams in the league need to step up and be like, we need to start chasing Chelsea and really start pushing them points wise. This is one of the things that I wanted to get onto with London City Lionesses, is that you feel that potentially that new energy in the league next year might just ruffle a few feathers. It might just potentially make people think a little bit differently. You don't get the impression that Chelsea are sitting and going to sit still and they're just going to go, well, that was enough for us.

We'll just try and go again next year and get the right side of Barcelona or Lyon or whoever it is they face in the knockout stages of the Champions League. Sonia Bompastor seems, Jen, like she's going to go out and try and find the missing pieces of the jigsaw? Oh, for sure. I think it was the last interview she did, which absolutely fascinated me. When she described the phone call with Lucy Bronze when she first got the job, and we all kind of joked that she was on speed dial. And I just loved the Bronze when she first got the job and we all kind of joked that she was on speed dial and I just loved the fact that she got the job, picked up the phone and thought, right, what's this Chelsea team, how can I make them better? Who's the best right back in the world?

I'm going to go and phone them. Who's the best midfielder in the world? Holding midfielder, Keira Walsh, I'm going to go get them. Who's the best spoken about center back right now? Naomi Germa goes and gets them. I think that's the kind of thing that Bonpas Dora, she'll be looking at whatever weakness she thinks Chelsea have and she will be out to go and get whoever she wants. And I think it's a, I love that phone call where she just like, no, this is what we need.

And she has a board and investment that's going to back any decision she makes, which I think is any manager ever wants. So I think she'll have been looking massively at these two Barcelona games and thinking, how can we beat them? How can we exploit their weaknesses going into next year in terms of Champions League? And still two huge games to come for Chelsea at the end of this season, not just in the WSL but in the FA Cup Final too. Let's move on to talk a little bit about Man United here on the Women's Football Weekly. They'll be playing in the FA Cup final against Chelsea in a couple of weeks' time, but with the title decided, they've also managed to secure a Champions League spot for next season against rivals Manchester City. They were in a really, really

tough spot. They almost had left the door of Jaffa Man City to come back. They managed to get level, get to all, went down to 10 players and saw out 20 minutes against City to get over the line. And I think, Ellen, when you look at the celebrations at full time, is it fair to say the overarching emotion that those United players are feeling is just relief that they managed to get there. Yeah probably relief to be honest because Man City were quite a few points behind at one point in the season and they managed to catch up and I didn't think they would so to almost come down to like that game and potentially go on to the final game of the season

to know whether you're going to get Champions League football. I think it was just pure relief to be in those Champions League spots but now it all comes down to that Arsenal game that they play at the Emirates, whether they get second or third because that obviously changes where they come in the qualifying round so I think it'd be really interesting but I think fair play to them. They've worked hard, they've gone under the radar this season a little bit, Man United, they've just plugged away. Why do you think that is? Why do you think we just more broadly they haven't had as much focus on them? Probably the amount of Chelsea is spent to be honest and I feel like you know

there was a lot of talk about them not being as well supported or funded and I feel like you know they were just wanting to win games and just roll on and not really talk well supported or funded and I feel like you know they were just wanting to win games and just roll on and not really talk about it too much and just get their heads down and just fight and I feel like that's what they've done. They've just fought as a team and it shows their togetherness and culture and obviously they're in the FA Cup final as well, potential to retain in that which will just be amazing for what they've done collectively as a squad because what's happening at the men's side with their backing, it's hard work for them. So I think they've done an incredible job. I think Mark Skinner's done a good job

this season and I think it's credit to those players as well. And if they could get second as well, it will give them a great chance then to get into the actual Champions League league phase. I don't want to sound like a broken record. I know we speak a lot about investment and what's required in order to be able to match these sides, Jen, but the fact is that Man United, if they do want to go deep in the Champions League, will need to invest in the squad. Oh, and it's the biggest pool, I think, that any player can have if a team that you're signing for is in European football. I think that's all any top player wants to be playing in Champions League. So if Manchester United are in that picture, Mark Skinner said it himself.

It's such a pool. Every agent is asking for Champions League qualification. That's what their players want. So no, it's and when you're talking about squad depth, I probably think that's why Man United. We don't speak about them in the same way of other clubs that we talk more often about is because of squad depth. I probably think that's why Man United, we don't speak about them in the same way of other clubs that we talk more often about is because of squad depth. So I do definitely think that that's something they need to improve on. We've spoken a lot about London City Lionesses and the

investment that we think they might have. I think it's now Man United's time to kind of step up and be in that bracket because for me it's a top four now and I think if they hadn't qualified for Chapman's League knowing the amount of injuries that Man City have had it would have been such a disappointment regardless of FA Cup final if I'm totally honest. I think if they hadn't taken advantage of it which they have and credit to them but based on that happening it looks like a top four situation now. The gap after the top four is getting pretty big. That would be my worry going into next season, but definitely. I think Mark Skinner, knowing Champions League's

qualified, the investment has to be there now for them going into next season, knowing they'll be playing more games, they need more squad depth, they need to rotate more. It's a different ball game when you're in Champions League. When you say it's a different ball game when you're in Champions League. When you say it's a different ball game when you're in Champions League, is that because it's just so much easier to recruit? You don't have to work as hard to drag people through the door. You're almost saying, look, come and play Champions League football here. And I suppose to add onto that question, are Man City going to have the inverse problem?

Manchester United are definitely more of an appeal now for top players now that if you're in Champions League. That's just facts. Any top player in Europe or around the world wants to be playing. That's why you see American top US national team players come to play in Europe is they play for Champions League teams. So yes, I do agree that it's a bigger pool and it's a different ball game also because you're playing more games.

You have to have, there's more games in the calendar. You have to rotate. You have to have a bigger squad depth. If you want to get to cup finals, be in Chamois League. Your season starts earlier, if you're in the qualification rounds. I'll never forget being a part of that Arsenal. Those qualification rounds started way before, I think it was just after our major tournament.

We were barely together, a squad for, I think it was, we laughed, it was four full training sessions as a team before we were playing Champions League qualification rounds. So you need to have a squad that's ready, fit and ready to go to hit the ground running earlier than the season actually starts itself. So it's multiple reasons why it's a different ballgame. And I suppose for City, Ellen, they'll be looking at something and they potentially could have managed to sneak their way back into it. Yeah, they could.

Go on. No, no, no. Go on, go on. No, no, no. I can't remember your question. Sorry. Well, the thing I was going to say is that now the complexion of their season next season is so totally different.

They've got some huge names on their squad list that are not going to be playing Champions League football. How hard is it going to be for them to keep hold of some of those players? Potentially. I do feel like it gives them a chance to go for the title now, to go for the FA Cup, to go to the for the League Cup. They haven't won anything for three years, which is pretty shocking for a team of Man City stature for the funding and investment that they say is implemented from the club so I feel like it's, I think they've got to go all guns blazing for the title, they have to, they have to go for

a trophy, we don't know who's obviously going to be in charge, there's been a massive overhaul for staff, obviously they've got a new managing director who got rid of Gareth Taylor so I feel like things are happening behind the scenes and obviously they need to keep people fit so once you get those players fit they won't be playing Champions League football so hopefully keep more of them fit as well and they've got to obviously go for the title and trophies and keep that squad together. I don't think any of them will really leave essentially the big players it will just be maybe bringing a few in and maybe get you know moving on some of the the other players that maybe Weren't good enough this season. I don't know or maybe looking to go somewhere different. Yeah, I can't see big players leave

I think the narrative of Man City season has been injuries have cost us massively and I think it's it's not a case of has been injuries have cost us massively and I think it's not a case of... Of course there's the added extra questions of right what's the direction of the club? We didn't replace, we've seen Chelsea have injuries and they still replace them with big top players. Man City didn't necessarily do that but I do think the narrative in that dressing room and that changing room will be right. If we have everyone fit we're still in a good place so I think for them it's not necessarily about who they're going to lose over summer it's yes can they still bring in more players and bring in that depth that they needed when they've then they've lost them but for sure Ellen's spot on with with less amount of games not

being in Champions League keep everyone fit they can still do their aim has to be getting one or two trophies next year for sure because that's what Nick Cushing is used to as well, whether he stays, who knows, but that's what that club is used to, used to lifting silverware and that's what they need to get back to. Ellen, do you think without Champions League they can challenge Chelsea for the title? I think I agree in the sense of Jen, they need to still recruit and be able to recruit players as well, but it's about keeping those fit, but when you have those players fit they are unstoppable. We saw last season it came down to goal differences we talked about so much on the on the pod

that they will they can challenge. They have had a really unlucky season with season you've got with injuries you've got to keep those players fit and I definitely think they could potentially challenge next season. Lovely stuff. That's all from us this week on the Women's Football Weekly podcast thanks to Jen and Ellen. Next up on the Football Daily Feed, Aaron Paul and the 72 plus team preview the EFL playoffs. This is the football story of the century. It's pandemonium, it's ecstasy.

It's an authoritarian regime. For the past 15 years, English football has been dominated by Manchester City. Eight Premier League titles, six league cups, three FA Cups, one Champions League. And more than a hundred charges. Somebody turned up at the Etihad Stadium and effectively served papers. I'm Clive Myrie and this is Football on Trial, the Manchester City charges. They believe they've got irrefutable evidence. Listen on BBC Sounds.

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