Football Daily - World Cup: Kane Brace Rescues England – 5 Live Reaction

Episode Date: July 1, 2026

Relive the atmosphere and instant reaction from 5 Live at full-time as England's World Cup dream is saved by Harry Kane's brace against DR Congo. They now face Mexico in the cauldron of the Azteca Stadium for the Round of 16. Kelly Cates is joined by former England players Steph Houghton and Paul Robinson, plus John Murray and Kelly Somers get reaction from head coach Thomas Tuchel and the players. The Observer's Football Correspondent Rory Smith also gives his thoughts on the match.INTERVIEWS 17:00 Harry Kane 20:30 Declan Rice 23:10 Elliott Anderson 35:40 Anthony Gordon 37:10 Axel Tuanzebe 42:55 Thomas Tuchel

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Listen wherever you get your BBC podcasts. Football Daily at the People World Cup 2026. With Kelly Gates. Listen on BBC Sounds. Almost seven minutes of added time. Harry Kane scored two goals for England in the last 15 minutes. And that has won England the match. And England are three to the round of 16.

And Harry Kane, absolutely the centre of attention. No huge celebration here. Just one clenched faced in the air. from Harry Kane, who's scored his fourth and fifth goals at this World Cup. And Jude Ballyingham as the first man across to him. Now the rest of his teammates join him as well. And Harry Kane has dug England out of trouble here in Atlanta, and England have won it 2-1.

And England will go to Mexico City at the weekend to play the co-hosts Mexico. Paul Robinson, what a match. Four. We don't do it easy, do we? I'm tired John. That was a tough watch and for about an hour of that game we didn't think we were going to progress through this tournament England once again they've showed that they find it very difficult to play against the team that sit deep and try and break up the game and make it hard for them But all the superlatives that you use for Harry Kane you can't get tired of saying them He's dug England out of a hole today because it was not a convincing performance and they looked for a long long time that they were heading home from the tournament

But all of a sudden the changes that Thomas Tuchel made you've got to give him credit because of He changed the wide players. Anthony Gordon came on, Saka came on, Eze came on in the hydration break, and that changed England, and it changed the way that they played. They played on the front foot, and they're a lot more direct.

And then Harry Kane, he just pops up in the right places at the right time. He is England's leader, and we cannot be without him. So much in this match to talk about. Brian Sopanga with that early goal that caught out Jordan Pickford, it is near post.

Wiss, I should have scored. How he didn't, I don't know, he hit the post. The goalkeeper, with the saves that he made and passing. Harry Kane adamantly should have had a penalty. D.R. Congo leading for 68 minutes of this match before Harry Kane headed in the first in the 75th minute.

And then what a goal. You need to see that on BBC TV later to make it 2-1. And Harry Kane, who is continuing to be surrounded by his teammates. He's an absolute football history man now with his 84 goals for England. Kane with his 13 goals for England at a World Cup. He's now scored more goals at a World Cup than Pelle, and he's scored as many international goals as Ference Puskas.

That's where he is. But that's it. England through the round of 32, against super opponents, D.R. Congo, who absolutely, as we say, will go out with their heads held very high. Last 16 next. I'm not sure I can do that again. England to DR Congo won.

John Murray, Paul Robinson, thank you very much. John is going to go off and get all the reaction from the England manager and from the England players to that narrow victory over DR Congo. Paul Robinson is going to stay with us. We also have former England captain Steph Horton with us. And Steph, a country that have ambitions of winning this tournament, Harry Kane has made sure that England are through

by the skin of their teeth in a round that hasn't existed. did in previous World Cups. Yeah, I mean, God, we've got a lot to thank him for Kelly, especially in that second half. I think if there's anyone that was going to lead England to victory, he was always going to be Harry Kane. Of course, in the game, he's not really

in the game as much as he probably would like to, but when that moment comes, there's only one person that can do, and especially that second goal, he made that all himself, and I think second half was more of an England performance that we expected. Stephanie's right in the middle of a huddler

of England players at the moment, giving them a pep talk after that victory. He's scored as many World Cup goals as Peli, as we've been hearing. Since the 2018 World Cup, only Mbapapé scored more doubles at the World Cup than Harry Kane. And Bapesthe's got six and Kane's got three. But still, it's impressive from Harry Kane. And it's always crucial goals, more or less, that he manages to get for England. You cannot overstate his importance to this England side, who overall, over the 90-odd minutes, were toiling against Dior Congo?

Yeah, I think we were all sitting in here worried about what would potentially happen, but I think, Kelly, all the stats that you've just read out about Harry Kane, I think there was a question of Tuchel about over-reliance on certain players, but when you have someone like Harry Kane, why not rely on him? Because in their moments, he produces. And I think if we can give him more of the ball,

we can find him up in spaces where he can really hurt defences, We have a great chance, but there's still a lot, lot work to do. Paul, just reflecting on that performance by England, there is the huge relief for England supporters that they are through to the last 16 of this tournament, having trailed for so long in the game and been rescued by Harry Kane. But there will still be a lot of questions that remain.

Absolutely, there'll be a lot of questions that remain. But just let me paint a quick picture if I hear. The England players, to a man with all the staff, They stood at arm in arm inside the 18-yard box staring at this wall of England supporters away to my left-hand side that I described like the yellow wall at Borussia Dortmund and the England players have done this after every game

and they've stood there and they've been in front of the supporters but now they're all arm-in-arm singing jointly to Oasis Wonderwall. It's a really good scene here. Relief from the England supporters but also celebration but as you say there's still a huge amount of questions the relationship that we spoke about about the full backs, the wide players.

So many more questions have come out of this game than answers but they've got the result and they've progressed in the tournament. Steph, do you think England, I mean, I know the first game against Croatia feels like a bit of an outlier now, but do you feel that England are improving? In some parts of the game, yes, Kelly, but I feel as though, I don't know what Paul thinks, but in terms of defensively, I haven't seen that much improvement over the last few games. I think Croatia, yeah, in terms of a team that wanted to come out and attack, I think that really suits us, but against Mexico, this probably could be,

the same formation that we play against and we can't afford to go one-nill down again. So from an attack and perspective, we're creating a lot more chances than we did in the first three games. But from a defensive point of view, I think we've still got things to iron out. Yeah, because after that Croatia game, Paul, there was lots of talk about how this was a brand new era for England, that Thomas Tuchel was bringing this brave new world to English football. It hasn't been the case in the game since then. But do you feel like, Steph, that's there has been improvement. Yeah, I mean, look, I think we've got our best ever goal scorer

scoring, which is fantastic. I think Saka and Gordon made a real big difference today. I think there's always been taught about who starts Rashford or Gordon, but I think Rashford is a bit more of an impact player. And I thought Eze was brilliant when he came on. I think he really settled the team down. I think at times I think we looked a bit anxious, we looked a bit rushed.

and to bring someone on of his quality to just sit in the middle of that midfield and really connect the play. I think it really kind of settled us as a team. We stopped running around a bit and we just started to stick to our position. So from an improvement point of view, I think our attack on play has definitely improved.

And this is just par for England, Paul. This is where they would expect to be at this stage of the tournament. But are the performances improving? Are the players clicking, you know, even while there are still areas for improvement? if the Croatia game was the game prior to this game, I'd say we were growing into the tournament. But after the Croatia game,

when we all got excited thinking that England we're going to win the World Cup, then we had those two, for one of a better phrase, clunky performances against Panama and Ghana. And then today, once again, we've proved that we find it very difficult to play against the team

with the tactics that the previous three sides we've played have set up against. And without Harry Kane today, we may not have got through to the round of 16. But actually, from an England point of view now, you obviously can't control who your opponents are and how they play, you would hope that we get teams that want to come and play

that want to come and play against us rather than sitting deep. That early goal for Diyar Congo today played perfectly into their hands and it allowed them to play to their game plan and it hurt England. But unlike other times, unlike the Garner game, the Panama game and today, we found a way. It wasn't pretty, but we got the job done. Yeah, but Paul, they'd be mad to come and try and play against England, wouldn't they?

What the teams that are going to win, or the team that's going to win this tournament can do is presumably do both. You know, be able to sit in and make life difficult for England but also have that attacking prowess to be able to take advantage of the many, many gaps that are exposed. It's almost a blueprint now, isn't it? How to play against England?

The last two group stages, the last two group games showed that. And then again today, so in Mexico, they will look at those three games and say, okay, if we sit low defensively and solid, the manager may select a side that they have quick players on the counter attack and play against that. But England, they're going to come up against it.

And like we said, that game today, it wasn't a great, I mean, it was a great watch but from an England point of view, it actually wasn't. It was a tough watch at times. And the answers that they're looking for the creativity in the final third, it came in the end because of Harry Kane. And they are going to come up against that and they have to keep finding those answers.

Rory Smith, football correspondent for the observer, joins us now. Rory, what do you think? Is that the game you expected? I think it's the approach from Congo, I expected. I wasn't sure I expected to destroy in the ninth minute. That kind of a bit of a surprise, to be honest. I think, yeah, Gabrielle Zakwani said, who's one of the assistant managers for Congo

and a former Laton Orient legend, Kelly, said that they had... No, so as thing is former in that sentence. That's true, yeah, he's a Latonorian legend. As Paul says, he said that they'd kind of seen how Garner played, England in particular, and he felt that Congo were better going forward than Garner, which I think they'd probably prove they are, to be honest.

They'd created, obviously, the goal, the chance where we solved. I think that might have been offside. And a couple of other little moments. So it was how I expected the pattern of the game to be. But I didn't, I've got to admit, I didn't think England would run it quite that fine. Well, why do you think it was that close from England?

What do you think they were lacking in that performance? A bit of creativity, a bit of ingenuity. But to be honest, I think it was partly that Conroe unsettled them by, I mean, the intensity that Conroe played with was incredible. But like enthusiasm for defying England. was amazing. It was a really heroic performance from Congo. And the other thing is, the winners, the Inland's fullbacks look like they'd never seen anyone dribble at them. They look really, really kind of nervy as soon as anybody picked up

the ball and ran at them. And, you know, you've got a player who scores Sopendra plays for Castellon in the Spanish 2nd Division. You know, they're not. I think sometimes we think of these teams as being minnows as they might have been in 1974, and they're not. You know, this is a Congo team with what, three Premier League players, a load of players. who play in league, you know, they are, I'm not pretending they're a giant of world football, but they're elite players by any real kind of broad definition of the word.

And I think once they had that lead, they were well-organised enough, they were disciplined enough, and they were kind of intense enough just to really knock England out of their rhythm. And I suppose the thing is that England did lack a bit of creativity and ingenuity. They stuck at it, I thought they didn't panic.

There was a point where I thought they might panic as they did against Iceland 10 years ago. I suppose the other thing is that they did create a lot of chances the three saves from Monsasie in the first half were extraordinary and there were another two in the second half so they did create chances they just had to keep grinding away it was a grind I liked Paul's word clunky

I think that was the right term I mean the other thing I was talking to Paul and to Steph about mainly at half time but I suppose you could apply it to the second half as well was the importance of the hydration slash ad breaks in this game for England because it gave Thomas Tuchel an opportunity to go out and really

one sort of rouse his players but also to presumably give them pointers and to give them that encouragement to get forward yeah absolutely their two best spells of the game were directly after the end of their first inning and directly after the end of the third inning that was I think I'm going for innings

rather than quarters I think the joke's better but the other thing is that the secret shame of this World Cup Kelly, the secret shame is that everyone boos the hydration break and then the music goes on and the cameras go on and people have a nice time. And they also, they go out for a drink and I think, I mean

I don't like them, it does break up the rhythm of the game, I'm not sure it breaks it up quite as much as everyone's saying it does. There are an okay experience for fans who are inside the ground. I mean, and to be fair, fans inside the ground get very little in terms of the so-called improvements to the game, so fair play to them, but it doesn't really add to the

the viewing experience and it certainly doesn't seem to be something that allows teams like, I think France particularly were concerned about this, the so-called bigger teams and we'll maybe see it coming to effect in the later stages of the competition where the momentum is halted for teams that are sort of building up ahead of steam. But if England are the so-called bigger team in this game, it worked to their advantage. Yeah, I mean, I think you can spin it both ways. I mean, I would say as well, Kelly, I agree completely about the fans watching at home. as a man in my 40s, I'm generally quite pro-reasons occasions where I can go to the toilet.

That is a useful thing of the course of the 90-minute match. No, I think no one likes them, but it is they're not, I don't think they're quite the evil that's been presented. And they do have benefits in that they absolutely stop the momentum of the game, which tends to benefit one team and disadvantage the other. But it depends how you want to look at it, doesn't it? Like someone is, it's working for someone there, and England did 100% get the benefit today. it gave Tuchel the chance to change it. I think his substitutions were brave as well.

I'm not sure what it would have looked like if it had gone to extra time. That would have been a weird team. I think you've got to give him so much credit. I really do. I think you've got to give Thomas Tuchel so much credit for his in-game management. I think so often as an England side,

even go back to when I played, we're guilty of defending our weaknesses rather than playing to strength. And actually in the Croatia game, when we won one goal up with that last hydration break that we had, he made changes that allowed England to go on and score that fourth goal and win the game,

rather than trying to sit deep and defend. And actually the changes that he made today, he made a slight formation change to start with. But then in the last break he brought Ezra on, he took off Jed Spence, the right back, almost went to three at the back. Declan Rice had to drop in there. The positivity of Thomas Tuchel is something that impresses me.

Go on, I'm sorry, right. He rolled the dice, and I suppose you could say that's a measure of how extreme the situation was. They were 15 minutes from going out to DR Congo, which would have been up there with Iceland, as a kind of day of shame or whatever. But he did, he went, he went fully for it.

And you could see after the, after the equalizer as Conradom made substitutions, that Tuchel was going absolutely mad at the fourth official to try and get the game rolling. And again, he wanted to do that momentum. Steph, thoughts on Thomas Tuchel's substitutions and maybe that's the sort of attacking mentality that he was supposed to bring.

And maybe we're not able to see it so much on the pitch at the moment because of how T-Otok have been setting up against England. But in terms of his substitutions, that's where we're seeing the intent from him. Yeah, without a doubt. And I think I said just previously that Eze, Gordon, Saka,

they brought a bit of a different dimension, a little bit more of an end product into what they were doing. And we just looked as though we got into our rhythm a little bit better with them three coming on. And I think Ezee, especially when you're in the middle of the park, you look at the likes of Anderson, Rice,

Bellingham, they love to run, they love to get around. And sometimes you need someone just to be able to stand still and just get really control of the game. And even putting rice to right back, I think, of course, we've spoke so much about the right back situation. But he has the qualities to play there and considering he's probably carrying a bit of a knock over this tournament,

it was the right decision to take him out of the middle of the park and put a pair of fresh legs on. And he can provide a different point of attack with the likes of Sakhar and Ezzi on that right-hand side. So I'm impressed because I think the guys have said, At some point you've got to kind of roll the dice and take a chance, but you're taking a chance with very, very good players that have played at the highest level.

And one of those players who played the full 90 minutes, who started for England, who is a record breaker for England, who got them out of trouble against DR Congo with the two goals that turn things around for England. Harry Kane is with Kelly Summers. Well, Harry, you've had some big moments in an England shirt, but you've just kept them in the World Cup. How on earth does that feel?

Yeah, it feels amazing, to be honest. Yeah, what a crazy game, obviously. First and foremost, it's a tough team, we're organized team. Going behind, but kind of after that first hydration break, I thought we up the level, we look good. I mean, the keeper made some unbelievable saves in that first off.

And it was just about pounding the rock, keep pounding the rock, and our moments will come. We spoke about people having hero moments. It could be anyone in the team. Whether it's me, a save from pickers, a block from the defenders, whoever it is, we have hero moments.

And, yeah, for me, it was the day. First goal kept England's alive, of course, but your second one, that celebration, was the 80-odd minutes of frustration coming out? Yeah, I think so. I think you have to stay patient in these games. The last couple games were very similar, and obviously when you get to knock out football, the pressure is higher, the risk is higher. But we spoke all week just about being ourselves. And from an attacking point of view, it is probably our best game of the tournament so far. Obviously, still things to work on for sure. But ultimately, these rounds are just about getting through.

I think the boss spoke about it before the game. This one and the next one are two difficult games for different reasons. The next one obviously away in Mexico against Mexico. But we're in the part of the tournament where you have to grind wins out and that's what we've done today. Special scenes at the end with the fans. They're still singing now. But we also saw you go into a huddle.

What did you say to the rest of the squad? Just told the boys you enjoy it. You know, sometimes as an England player, when you go through tough games like this in games that you're expected to win, you don't really celebrate how you should. We're the same as every other nation. We're through. So we enjoy it.

We're in a World Cup where fighting for every moment, every little margin. So I want the boys to enjoy it. Enjoy it with the fans like we did. And then we go again in four days. The way we England finished that game then, that has to be something to kick on from, doesn't it?

Yeah, for sure. We spoke even from the Cracer game. You know, the sub will make an impact. We've got wingers who are fresh who are coming into the game and keeping the level even higher. And you saw that again today with B and Ant just over 90 minutes.

you know, we're tough to handle. So, yeah, all my nature is pleased for everyone involved. And hopefully we can keep it going. Well done, stay, Harry. Thank you. That was Harry Kane. And he knows. And Paul, you're inside the stadium in Atlanta.

You can see and hear how those England fans are celebrating that victory. But Harry Kay knows. He said it in the interview that this was a victory that they had to grind out. And there has been maybe not a criticism, but questions asked about whether or not England are over-reliant on him. But the other thing that he said, look, if it's not me, it's Jordan Pickford making saves at the other end. And I suppose it's a question that fits quite nicely with a goalkeeper, that if you've got someone who's playing that well, does it matter if you're reliant on them?

If you have a world-class goalkeeper who pulls off saves that keeps you in a game, nobody really talks about it that much. But if you've got a striker who's scoring all the important goals for you, people go, well, what happens if he gets injured? It is about him. Regardless of what he says, it's all about. him. He's dug his goalkeeper out of the hole as well today because Jordan Pickford should have done better with a goal that he conceded down at his near post early on in the game and Jordan Pickford is outstanding. I think he's by far and away England's number one but he'll be disappointed with himself the way that the first goal went in. I'm going to come back to you on that because Declan Rice is waiting to talk to John Murray. Yes the England vice captain Declan Rice who I must say Declan you're still red-faced you look as though you've just gone through the mill.

That's what happens when you're playing 30 degree heat, I suppose. Yeah, tough game. Give it everything. And, yeah, obviously, the body's been through a lot in that match. So time to recover and go again. How are you? I'm fine. Good as gold.

Yeah, good. What a match that was. I mean, talk about a dramatic World Cup match. That had a little bit of everything, didn't it? Yeah, it was, it's a knockout game. They've got through the group and a tough group and it's never going to be easy. You can't, you can never underestimate opposition as a neutral as a player because they have polity and they can hurt you on any given moment and that first 10 minutes they did.

But other than that, I think we had so many chances. Their goalkeeper credit to him, he had an absolute worldie and Harry Kane inevitable scoring them goals. So in the end, I think it was a deserved win, but probably made a bit more hard work of it than we should have done. But the main thing is knockouts, we win. what we've done. Can you say anything that we've not heard before about the worth of Harry Kane to this England team?

He's going to get chances, isn't he? If you give him a chance, it's... Well, yeah, if you give him a chance, it's a goal. I think personally, I've seen it too many times. It's just ridiculous. The goals he scores and the way he scores them and his whole mentality around scoring is just

72 for the season now. It's just ridiculous. So credit to him. And, you know, the question now is, you know, this is a little bit like two years ago, isn't that, this sort of experience, this sort of feeling that you had in Germany at the Euros. Simply again, can you build on this? Yeah, I think as the games go on, even today, I think, again, we thought they were playing a back five, they changed the back four, it was more open. We had more attacks, more shots on goal. Yeah, for sure, as the games go on, we're going to keep getting better, so that's what we've got to keep doing.

Well done, Declan. Thank you. We'll see you in Mexico City, and off he goes. And I have to say, Kelly, he looks absolutely frazzled. Well, you could hear that in his voice, John. And Paul, I'm interested in getting your thoughts on this, because one, you can kind of contrast it with the scenes that you've just seen with the England fans,

and their extreme celebrations inside the ground, but also Declan Rice talking about how much playing in that 30-degree heat took out of him. But this is an air-conditioned stadium. so it's worth picking up on that after we've heard from Elliot Anderson with John. Yeah, Elliot Anderson, who I've just spoken to Declan Rice, Elliot, who looked as though he'd been dragged through a hedge backwards.

You look as cool as can be, but what a match that must have been to be involved in. Yeah, it was. It was really good, really good fun. It was stressful. Fun? Yeah, it was, it was. We're stuck together. I thought we played well. Obviously, the result, the halftime wasn't,

it wasn't where we wanted, but I thought we were doing well. We struggled to just get that goal. But no, look, we're fully believed in each other and we stayed positive. And what's it like being on the field when you watch Harry King do that? And I said to him before the tournament, the numbers that he's produced this season are almost like superhuman. Yeah, it's crazy. It's special to play with him, to be honest, you know, giving him the ball and just watching him go and do his stuff. When I hit the bat of the net, the relief was huge.

I remember talking to you at the Euros last summer, the under 21 euros, so you've experienced that tournament. But for you now to be involved in this at senior level, and you'll well remember the experiences that you've had watching England, this sort of thing, even two years ago in Germany, now to be a part of it? Yeah, it's incredible. There's not much words for it, really.

It's amazing, you know, it's what I've worked to for. for all my career and to be here on this stage, on this platform is special. And the feeling of now going to Mexico City to play Mexico. I mean, that's something that you, I mean, I know it's a daunting prospect, but again, that's the kind of fixture. If that said to you growing up, that's what you're going to play in for England. Yeah, it's probably one of the best games of your career, I think, Mexico and Mexico City, you know, it'll be good, it'll be a huge test for us and we'll get to work and hopefully

come through it. And sorry for asking this, I have to ask you, where are we up to with moving to Manchester City? I'm not too sure. I've got one objective today, and that was to focus on the country and getting this country through the next round, and I've done it, so I can now settle. Thanks for answering that question. Well done today, Elliot. Thank you. Yeah, Elliot Anderson. Yeah, very much, but very much, straddling those two positions at the moment,

turning up for England at the World Cup and then obviously with his club career with big changes John Murray with the interviews there Paul just to come back to that point on Declan Rice talking about playing in 30 degree heat and I know your position is up in the stands where you will be kind of exposed to the air conditioning at maybe a more forceful level

and the conditions may be different on the pitch but odd to hear him describe it as playing in 30 degree heat in an air-condition stadium surprising yeah I'm sat here in shorts and t-shirt and it's actually quite chilly. And we did a couple of bits downstairs yesterday at pitch level. And obviously without the crowd and the temperature is very different. But we do get information and they assure us that the temperatures regulated at 20 degrees.

But when it actually fills up with people, it goes up to 22 or 23 degrees, but it's actually very controlled. And to hear him say that, he obviously felt the heat of the game and he felt the heat of the battle. And I think that's obviously an instant reaction. John's got him right in the mix zone there straight after the game, which is an excellent thing to do. I think he's obviously describing the game in a very, very different way

to how we're obviously sat here watching it. And the other thing that you get from that step is just how much it's taken out of certainly, I mean, Elliot Anderson, a little bit younger than Decombeis, but it certainly, as John described him, sounded a lot fresher after the end of that game. But some of those players, it looked like it had really rung a lot out of them. Yeah, and of course, Kelly,

in terms of not only the game from a physical perspective, but mentally, I think, when you're 1-0 down, you know how much it means to everybody back home, the fans in the stadium, the expectation of England is to go through to the next round. That sometimes can take at all as a player because you look at the likes of Decker and Rice, Harry Kane, really experienced players, and they know how much it means to get through to the round of 16. And I think the season that Declan Rice has had,

I think that's one of the first interviews I've heard where he sounds a little bit different and a bit downbeat. In comparison to, I think, a very short time. short answer when John asked him about his injury, which normally I think it would be a little bit longer and I think it might just get at the point where you're just sick of answering them sorts of questions. You want

to focus on the football and he's probably not as happy as with his own performance than he has been in previous ones. So I think there's a lot of factors to take him when you're part of a World Cup. You've been away from home for a long time. The pressure's there. There's an expectation of England. Rightly so because of the players that we have

and I think we've just got to try and reset as quick as possible to look ahead to to Mexico and Mexico City because Declan described that as 30 degrees it's going to be a lot harder when we play them in their home country. Yeah, exactly, and under those sort of intense conditions and that's

kind of the point, isn't it? You know, Rory Declan Rice is talking there about playing in 30 degree heat in an air condition stadium in Atlanta. They're off to the Azteco, which isn't just hot and humid and filled with a hostile is probably the wrong word,

but a vociferous. largely Mexican crowd and they're going to be doing that extreme altitude as well. Yeah, I mean, I think hostile is probably the right word, Kelly, to be honest. Well, not hostile because they're going to be supportive of Mexico, I think. It's going to feel hostile to England. You know, I don't want to kind of calumny the Mexican people. But no, that'll be hostile and it should be hostile. It's the Azteca, it's Mexico City.

It's a home world cup. I don't know if you've seen the videos of what happened outside the Ecuadorian Team Hotel the night before the game yesterday. It will be fully hostile and they should take some air plugs. I'm sure, to be honest, I'm sure they'll expect nothing less. But it is the Azteca. Mexico's record there is insane. They look, I mean, they look really,

I mean, this is such a silly thing to say, but they look so up for it, the Mexican, the team. They're built on that winning the first game where I thought they looked a little bit nervy initially, and the crowd were booing before the second goal. They're under intense pressure. They've now broken the curse, the Quinto Partido, winning a knockout game, which they've not done for a long, long time.

They wanted England. Mexico, friends of mine, Nick Ames from The Guardian is there watching it in Mexico City and he said that they were chanting for England they want to get England to the Azteca and they want to beat them at the Azteca. That will be a whole... Wivalry, because of a rivalry, because they would take pleasure from beating England or because they think they're the team that they would most like... Well, I suppose there were only two that they could have played, weren't there?

I think it's probably... I don't think it's a rivalry with England so much as... I think it probably comes a point where you want to take on a big team. You want to face one of the... not that Mexico aren't a big team, but you kind of want to face one of the giants. You want that kind of seminal occasion, and there's no, Mexico have no reason whatsoever to believe that they can't beat England, not because of England's failings, but because of the way Mexico played in this tournament. Flawless in the group, they haven't conceded a first half goal in the World Cup since 2010. They are a legitimately good team, Mexico.

And I think that that will be the sort of occasion that they'll have been dreaming about. England have the quality and the players to stand up to that challenge and they have shown a lot of grit today. That's probably the big, the big kind of take away, the big positive from the performance is the grit, the patience they showed to stick with it to make that quality pay. But I think it's fairly obvious. They'll have to step up a level to beat Mexico.

Mexico are a different calibre of team. What about that kind of pre-match preparation, Paul, for England? When you do see the scenes of the Mexican fans outside the Ecuadorian Ecuadorian hotel where they turned up. When I say they turned up with drums, I don't mean they turned up with like a guy with a drum hung around his neck and two sticks. I mean, a full little makeshift drum kit

that he sat down at with high hats and everything. I mean, they're turning up prepared and they're turning up to make a lot of noise. They're playing instruments. They're honking car horns. They're trying to disrupt the sleep of the Ecuador players. They go away. They take that win.

Will England be prepared for that? level of hostility. There will certainly be a welcoming committee away to England, that is for sure. And Mexico in Mexico City is quite a daunting prospect. But obviously the England players will be prepared. As you know, whenever they travel, they kept well away. I'm assuming the hotel's got double glazing as well. Well, you would think so. And, you know, lessons will have been learned. You know, we live in a world now where things can be altered and changed very, very quickly. As we know from our flights yesterday, the day before yesterday here, that were cancelled. So I suspect the England... The England... The England...

organisers, if you like, will have seen that. And I think certain hotels will have been picked and certain floors of the hotels will have been picked and all that will have been taken into consideration. And then when actually, you know, you look at that, the hostility, yes, that is a factor as well. But Mexico, they've got an unbelievable record at home. Like Rory said, they've lost two of 88 competitive games

at the Azteca. So it's definitely not going to be straightforward for England. Paul, what was the most intense welcome you had to a game abroad? Definitely in Turkey. Yeah. Whenever you go to like Galatasaray or Bessetas or England against Turkey, those stadiums are full two or three hours before and it's like a nightclub.

The whole place is bouncing. And, you know, beforehand and afterwards, I remember one of the games that we went to, our police escort to the ground was two water cannons with like tanks. So that'll be a similar type thing. I think there's a wait in England in Mexico. I was going to say that you drove to different nightclubs to me. I don't. I'm too old now.

That's a man who's been to Oceania in Leeds. Water cannons. Did it make a difference? Does that sort of hostility make a difference to you? I think it brings the best out of you. As a player, it gives you a buzz and it gives you a drive. And you know, you pick the atmosphere up very quickly and you're looking forward to the game.

For me personally, it was an incentive rather than, you know, anything that oppressed it. Well, England, have Mexico lying in wait for them in the early hours of Sunday night into Monday morning, 1 a.m. kickoff at the Azteca. They've got that to look forward to thanks to two late hurricane goals that turned things around against Dior Congo in their last 32 game. Five likes four.

My favourite World Cup moment? It's the first World Cup I properly remember watching. Argentina 78. The ticker tape, Mario Kempes, Ari Hahn's scoring goals from miles out, and always one of my favourite World Cup moments, Archie Gemmell's great goal for Scotland against the Dutch. What makes the World Cup such a special tournament

is the atmosphere, the colour, it is a meeting of the nation, out of people who love football. The People World Cup 2026. Listen on BBC Sounds. At the People World Cup 20206, the Football Daily Podcasts with Kelly Gates. Listen on BBC Sounds.

Definitely. I was going to come to you on that, and then we ended up in a run of player interviews. But Tuchel's substitutions and the way in which he kind of, he brought, don't just brought players on who were involved in goals, but also the fact that he made the attacking substitutions that he built on what England were good at rather than trying to protect what they were trying to do less of. If I've explained that properly.

Does that encourage you? It does because I think there's been so much taught about the squad and the quality of the squad, especially in them forward areas. And I think we were doing okay with Rashford and Madwecky, but we didn't really create that many clear-cut chances. So to bring on fresh legs, to pose Congo's full-backs,

a bit of a different problem with two different wingers. And like Chris said, in terms of Anthony Gordon getting two assists, I think that will give him the boost of confidence that he probably needs over this World Cup to be able to come on and make an impact. And I think whenever you see that type of player come on the pitch, as a teammate, you always get a boost anyway because you know what they're going to do

and I think Tugel got the timing really, really well in terms of when he did that and I think as a team, we really improved and we grew as that game went on with them players coming on the pitch. Anthony Gordon, who's a little fact for you, has become the first England substitute since 1966 to provide two assists

in a single World Cup match. Let's hear from him. Yeah, I hate being a sub, to be honest. I'm a nervous wreck when I'm a sub. I head and kick every ball. I try not to. I try and tell myself to be calm, but I can't help it.

So I was desperate to get on. The lads who started the game grinded them down, grinded them down and I felt like when I come on, they were tired, so I tried to make the most of it. Usually in that situation,

I'd probably try and shoot or do a bit of a skill, but I think with H, he probably dictates my decision. I just thought, try and put it in there. I know he's in there somewhere. As soon as he hit it,

I knew it was going in. I was already celebrating, but I remember the celebration, and it's more the consistency that he surprised me with. Anyone can score a good goal, at this level can put the ball in the top corner, but it's the consistency that he does it.

Every day in training, every game, it's phenomenal. He plays at such a high, high level. It's amazing to be around them every day because when you're around someone at the elite level, he's at the very, very top of football. He's having a season that's only ever been beat by Leon M.S.E., the greatest football of all time. So that speaks to the level he's playing at.

When you're around, someone like that, you want to pick up as many habits and watch everything he does to see why he's at that level. And it's no accident. Like I said then, there's consistency every day. How hard he works, every finishing drills. He does it with passion. He does it with seriousness.

He never, ever messes about. So it's amazing to be around him. He's definitely an inspiration to all of us. And that was Anthony Gordon, and he finished off by talking about Harry Kane and how inspiring he is. Do... Oh, hang on.

Tuan Zebby is with John Murray. Yes, Axel Tuan Zebby. This is the other side of the story. What a match to be involved in and in the end, Harry Kane makes the difference, doesn't he? Yeah, he made his impact on the game, but ultimately we're kicking ourselves more so because we felt that we should have definitely

held out the game. Probably should have finished it in the first half as well. But it was unfortunate it wasn't meant to be for us today. But we'll definitely look on this and think how we can build for future tournaments. You absolutely rattled England didn't you in that first quarter of the of the match. For sure. Look when you get into the knockout stage is the pressure multiplies tenfold and you can see it in the first half. We was able to play and combine and have a real confidence in

that game and going up maybe hindered our performance a little bit probably did actually because we felt like okay we're winning the game and we want to hold the victory out. But I think we'll definitely learn from this and continue attacking the game, especially that early on because having to defend wave of attack after attack after attack, eventually with this kind of caliber of players, they will prevail and they did so today. And I know clear, you've got the disappointment now, the massive disappointment of the results. But just give us an overview of what this experience has been like and a wider context as well with everything that is going on back in D.R. Congo?

Yeah, if anything, it's a real mission for us to one, put Congo on the map and to really show or give our people something to be proud of, to be happy about, to talk about, to embrace in their culture, and be able to really

talk about Congo in a positive way. Our country's had a lot of suffering. I've been exploited a lot. So this for the people, I'm sure they're very happy and very proud of what we've done. But for us as professionals, it's a stepping stone. We're not done yet.

Mission continues and we want to really have a massive impact on our nation. Well said, Axel. Thanks for talking to us. Thank you. Axel to Nzeppe. Thank you very much, John Murray, for that. And we really should talk about DR Congo because that was, I mean, Rory, I know I started off by asking you about whether it was the game that you were. expected and we knew what their approach would be. But the way that they executed it, I think, was beyond expectations. Yeah, they were. They were. And it was really hard not to feel sorry for them at the end. The way, you know, obviously it was an incredible finish for the second from Kane.

But the effort they put in, the organisation that they'd shown, the discipline, the intelligence, all of that stuff was an incredible performance for a team that, like I said before, you know, they do have some Premier League quality. They've got lots of players playing in League Der and League Der and telling the Spanish First and Second divisions. They're not, they're not a team of amateurs who turned up. They are proper footballers, but you know, they're not, they don't have players of the caliber of England. And they were, certainly for 75 minutes, they were absolutely outstanding. And I think what you see with them, as you've seen with so many teams in the World Cup, and I'm going to be slightly cheesy now, Kelly,

is how much it means to them to represent their country on this stage. And that is the thing that is, once you take your own personal loyalties of, you know, which team you actually want to win out of it, that's what is so special about this tournament. And it's special, whether it's 32, teams or 48 teams. It's special, regardless of which particular country is hoping to burnish their reputation in the world by hosting it. It's the reason that every four years the world does kind of grind to a halt for it because it means so much.

We've seen so many examples of that this week, whether it's individual players playing despite like desperate tragedies in their own lives or the kind of unity of teams that weren't expecting to get this far, the delight of Paraguay beating Germany. And Congo, given all that country, continues to suffer, not just with Ebola, but with an ongoing sort of exploitative war is really uplifting. And I'm sure that the players will be disappointed. Paul and Step are better qualified than me to think about how the players will respond. But in time, and it won't take a long time at all,

they'll be incredibly proud of what they've done here, not just today, but throughout the tournament. Just before we talk about that from a player's perspective, having worked on the Destination New Jersey programs, which are available on BBC Sounds and give you an insight into lots of the teams that will be taking place at this World Cup, We looked a lot at teams from Africa and there are six still left in this tournament and DR Congo have been part of that success story and about the sort of broader growth and improvement

of competitiveness of African football. Yeah and it's partly to do with their use of their diaspora population. So obviously there's a lot of players in Africa. This is something we talked about a lot on destination in New Jersey, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah, and Debbie Zackawani's been. been really integral to that, but a lot of, there was a brilliant piece, there's been so many pieces that are so good recently, there was a brilliant piece that I can't remember where it was

about the way that countries are setting up offices to try and tap into those populations in Europe in North America to get, to persuade players to play for the lands of their parents or their grandparents rather than necessarily the place they were born. That's really improved them, but also the kind of expertise that's come in domestically within those countries in terms of youth development has really helped. It is a shame, I'm going to sound a little bit woke now, It's a shame that Europe kind of takes the young players away from Senegal and from countries in West Africa in particular. Let's hear from the England manager.

Thomas Tuchel is with John Murray. Yes, Thomas Tuchel joins us live on BBC Radio 5 Live. Thomas, the phrase that seems to be the one that is used is never in doubt. Easy to say now, but I think it was no time for doubt. It was too intense to doubt. This team didn't accept it. They didn't accept it and that's the best of it. I felt no doubt from the players. I felt Yeah, I felt that they were just doing what is needed to do. I felt that they showed their teeth and I

felt they were fully committed again. It was difficult because we conceded first and we got didn't get the press right in the first 20 minutes commitment was always there, but in the in the in the last three quarters, I think we were excellent and And we are just fully, and I felt the belief from the players, that's the best sign of it. And then we created a lot of chances, maybe penalty, maybe not. And then another save and another save. And still, they didn't doubt. They just kept on doing what we were doing. And I feel like with the goal that we got the equalizer, we got, of course, the momentum totally on our side.

And even more belief than we had and then turned it around. But even you must have felt the nerves jangling. Yeah, but if you feel your players, you're totally in the game. Of course, you know the time is running, clock is ticking, but you feel your players at halftime, you feel them in a hydration break, and you feel them pushing from the side. I felt a team that does not accept a defeat today. I felt a team that just fully aware where we are at this very moment.

It is a moment in the tournament where, yeah, if you want to compare it, It's maybe January or February and you go in a way, imagine a FA Cup, and things can get complicated, and it's just so necessary that you keep the belief, you show your teeth and you don't give in, you don't give in no matter what. And I think that's what the team deserves the praise for, because they did exactly this.

We turned it around and well deserved, by the way, but it took a long way. And what would you say to people, because people will say, well, England are not hitting the heights of France, Argentina. I don't care what people say. I saw what I do. And we will see, we will see when it comes to that.

These two teams are, by the way, the favorites. And we're the underdogs. We're happy where we are. Are you going to be ready for Mexico and everything that entails playing at altitude? I'm not sure if we're ready because we cannot. It's a huge disadvantage for us, of course, because Mexico, they play there since the tournament starts

and they're adapted to the altitude. We don't have enough time to adapt. So big. It's a big disadvantage. And I'm not sure if we get a lot of, there will come in other disadvantages. I'm not so sure if the traveling will be smooth. I'm not so sure if the sleep will be smooth. If it will be noise outside of the hotel, okay, bring it on.

It's a very, very beautiful and exciting fixture. And we are prepared. There will be a lot of obstacles, but this team is ready to overcome them, whatever it takes. We will see you there. Thank you, Thomas. Well done. Thomas Tuchel. Bullish.

He was bullish, John Murray, and he was unconcerned about people who are saying that England are maybe not hitting the heights of France or Argentina. And we'll point to the type of opponents that they have faced and the fact that they've had to kind of break down these very low blocks. Thoughts on England's chances of progressing, not just past Mexico, but through this tournament, Steph? I think we've got a great chance, Kelly, especially if we take, like Thomas Tugel's in. interview there in terms of how bullish he is and how positive he is and the realisation that when you're in tournament football look I've been there and when you're away at these tournaments there's just so many things you can't control

and ultimately you can get really frustrated by them the travel the different types of weather the time that you play at and unfortunately that's just how tournament football is so those teams that overcome them problems and get them out of their mind as quick as possible the ones that are going to go forward and look this World Cup campaign hasn't gone to smooth as we probably all want to all like in terms of

we'd all love England to be playing the best football, the likes of what France have shown over the last four games, but ultimately we're getting results and I think of course the climatisation is impossible, but we've just got to go and try and show the best version ourselves, and I did love the mentality of the team today, I think we could have easily gave in, we could it easily went off on our own in terms of being selfish, trying to win ourselves, but the boys really stuck together, so for me, I'm excited for Sunday,

on Monday, whatever day we want to call it, and I'm looking forward to watching us play. And hopefully this has given us a little bit of confidence, especially that last 50, 60 minutes of playing. Paul, thoughts on England and where they are now and what they can achieve in this World Cup? Well, I'll answer it as I always answer it. As a player and now as a co-commentator and a pundit,

England can beat anybody on their day. And I think that pretty much sums it up. Are England going to win the World Cup? Have I seen better sides here? Yes, I have. I've seen Spain play here inside. this arena. We saw the way that Franz played yesterday. And we've seen Argentina. We've seen other teams hitting heights that England haven't hit. But they've proved again they can get a

job done. And on their day, man for man, they are capable of beating anybody in this tournament, but they need a little bit of look to progress. Paul Robinson, Steph Horton, Rory Smith. Thank you very much for your company this evening. Thank you too to John Murray and all of our guests this evening as England beat Dior Congo by two goals to one, two late Harry Kane goals to turn things around as England squeak into the round of 16 at this World Cup. Five Live Sports. So here's the first ball of this series. All the cricket you laugh.

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