Football Daily - World Cup: Steve Clarke Goes & England Get The Job Done

Episode Date: June 28, 2026

Steve Clarke has resigned as Scotland manager following their World Cup exit, with Eilidh Barbour joining Rick Edwards and Lloyd Griffith to react to the news and assess what went wrong for Scotland.England are through to the last 32 after a 2-0 win over Panama. Paul Robinson joins from the stadium to break down another slightly underwhelming performance, with Harry Kane and Jude Bellingham again central to the result to get the job done.The Athletic's Adam Crafton looks ahead to England’s knockout tie with DR Congo and runs through the standout fixtures from an exciting last 32 line-up.Plus, Rick and Lloyd discuss the Nigerian goalkeeper who’s taken over everyone’s algorithms despite not being at the World Cup, and Lloyd shares a story from his time working in DR Congo on an old job.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. In the Range Rover Sport, performance is more than a promise. It's something you feel on every drive. With the choice of powerful mild hybrid and plug-in hybrid engines, range River Sport responds instantly, bringing unbridled power and precise handling. It's a perfect balance. Explore more atrangerover.ca. Every story is a technology story in one way or another.

And on the interface, we decode the tech that's rewiring your weak. and your world. On this week's episode, is AI pushing us towards an infinite work week? And this year's World Cup is the most technologically advanced ever. But is it making the game better or worse? Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts. Football Daily at the People World Cup 2026 with Rick Edwards and Lloyd Griffith live from L.A. Hello, you're listening to The Football Daily with Lloyd Griffith and Rick, Rick, Rick Edwards. I'll say that one, I know. Okay, and...

Hello, and welcome to the Football Daily. We'll keep all this in. Okay. With Lloyd Griffith. And Rick Edwards. Oh, okay. Hello, and welcome to... You get the idea.

A busy day today with England playing. We spoke to Paul Robinson a bit earlier on. Steve Clark has resigned. Aili Barber's going to join us to talk more on that. We finally have our round of 32 fixtures. So, a quick roundup of the scores. England beat Panama 2-0 to top their group. Croatia beat Ghana 2-1 to finish second.

Dr. Congo beat Uzbekistan, They were 1-0-0 down. Columbia drew nil-nil with Portugal, and that means Dr Congo versus England in the round of 32. Worth saying we're recording this before Algeria, Austria, and Jordan, Argentina. But if you want to catch up, all of the scores and highlights are on the BBC Sport website. And we are back in the shop again. So occasionally people just sort of pop their heads and say,

can I go to Cherry Bakelach, well? And we say, absolutely, take it for free. Do you want to buy me one? Can I just say something Have you ever been to Dr Congo? I have not been to Dr Congo I've been to Dr Congo Have you been to Doctor Congo

Have you? Yeah I was working out there When I had a proper job Like a LinkedIn account And a skill set What were you? Well I was working for an event I was working for an event's company

That's not a proper job Cool, yeah, you're right actually It wasn't called Jack Morton Which no one's ever heard of That's the name of the company It's not an ad That's just a guy's name Essentially I work

You're just working for a man called Jack Morton I work for a man called Jack Morton Go to Kinshasa It was. I basically I had to take a satellite out. Are you putting it in me, Jack? I was essentially a mule who had to take a satellite out.

What are you taking? A satellite. Up your ass. No. I can't believe this. We're going to have to put the adult. We were doing a multi-country satellite launch of a phone company and one of the satellites broke.

And so I was helping back in, base and they were like Lloyd you've basically got to go to democratic republic of Congo um like now yeah so I just had to pop a couple of pairs of pants in me suitcase with a satellite I just went to Congo for for four days and it was a it was a nice time do you know what it was an absolutely amazing experience the people were so lovely like so welcoming so warm what I was so fascinated by was the fact that these the stadiums they play in were they were awful I mean like so um the fact that they've qualified and the fact that they're doing so well is amazing. Now, I went there back in 2009, and I'm sure things have improved, but I'm absolutely

buzzing for them. I did enjoy the reports today that the Uruguay Football Federation cancelled the players' private plane home and just said, you guys, make your own way home, you're a disgrace. I think it's so, it's so kind of petty. Yeah, it's ridiculous. I love it. It's like, I think you should do that to all of the teams. When you go home, you've got to sort out your own travel.

But it's not just that. Like, we've all been on stagdews. If you're trying to get 40 men to get to somewhere, it's an absolute nightmare. And now I imagine they're footballers. Yeah. Who can't, basically, and no offense, can't do anything for themselves? So then who's the best man? Like, is it the captain?

Is he go, right, well, I'll just put this on my credit card. And it can't be Bielsa. Bielsa must not be the best man. Bielsa's just in the airport looking down at the floor. Absolutely fuming. So who's going to do that? So someone's got to take hold of that. I'm like, right, okay.

Led's, we've got to get to the airport three hours before we've got our kits to take back. Worst possible organiser for that travel, Darwin Nunez. Why? The agent of chaos. The agent of chaos. The travel agent of chaos. Yeah, I mean, you wouldn't book with someone called the travel agent of chaos. Where are we going? It's a lottery.

We don't know. You might not be going anywhere. Also, imagine if you're like a Uruguay fan and they're just on the same plane as you, You're going to get so much abuse from just the fans. Imagine as if the FAA did that. You've lost to Dr. Congo, have you? Right, well, you're going to... I'm in Elliot Anderson's ear the whole way back. 130 million pounds, yeah?

Is that what you think you're worth, mate? Sloppy passes as they're flying thin air via Recovic. Oh, no one's not. Yeah, sorry. I'm having fun. We, of course, we are. We ended up watching the England game with a number of friends,

which is very nice. Mainly mine. It was mainly yours. Thank you. And you invited everyone to a golf club. Yeah. But the best bit about it was, in the week, you'd gone to the golf club. And you spoke to the guy and you're like, so a table for 12, best spot in the house.

And the guy was like, no problem at all. You'll get an email confirmation on Friday. You didn't get an email confirmation on Friday. And then this morning, we were going to get some coffee. And you said, well, I'll just call, just a check that it's all okay. You called them up. And they said, no, we haven't got your booking. And then...

I cried, basically. No, you switched. And it was so nice. I haven't heard you cross and you were a little bit cross on the phone. You're like, well, what are you going to do about it? Because this is on you. This is your response. I know it wasn't you I spoke to.

But this is your responsibility. I'm going to have to let these people down. I was speaking to him. And I was like, I've got 13 friends that I've invited to your golf club. And we will buy a number of 0% alcoholic drinks because we're working. We did. We did, yeah, yeah. We got through him.

And he was like, okay, well, we just don't have space. I was like, please. I was like, have you heard of T4? And he's like, you're bringing Alexa Chung? I was like, no. Steve Jones is like, no. McKita Oliver? No, her mother, not her mother, no.

I was like, Rick Edwards. He's like, I'll get the tables clean now. That's right. And that's what did it. So thank you. Thank you so much for. But we had a great time, didn't we? We did have a great time.

It was a surprisingly good venue. And then what was really lovely, is my mate Chris Martin, not that one, and also not the other one as well, comedian Chris Martin. He brought his wife and a three-year-old child, and you gave over to me and said, what did he say, Rick? Well, look, the thing is,

so we've been away for three weeks now, and I really miss my son, who is a similar age to their son. Bless you. And I just came over to you and said, do you think your friends would mine if I just played with their son from him? And I looked at you and I was like,

oh, cranky, you miss your son? And I was like, yeah. Yeah. And I cannot tell you, the relief. They were delighted. They were over the moon. They were like, sorry, you want to go and look after our son over there? Like, causing chaos on the golf?

Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yes. And I did. He was great. And it was lovely. It turned over.

And he was shouting, Mommy, who is this man. Yeah. I have not heard of Steve Jones. You know, he was all, he was saying all those phrases. He was just mad. He started to learn how to speak. But it was, it was lovely. And I was very happy about it.

I think actually everyone was a winner. Everyone was a winner, actually. Possibly from the child. And also Panama. Yeah, true, actually. Probably Panama. And a bit of big news that broke overnight. Scotland boss Steve Clark has resigned after it's confirmed that Scotland

have been eliminated. Let's bring in Ailey, the SFA released a statement almost as soon as the Croatia game finished. There's a couple of quotes I just wanted to read out. The most emotional part of this goodbye is for my players. without whom we wouldn't have had any of the memories that we've accumulated from 2019 until now. They deserve all the praise and adulation that they receive. It is truly an honour to be called their gaffer.

Thanks for having me and good luck to my successor. We spoke to you a few days ago and everyone was kind of full of hope, really. Has this come as much of a shock to you as it has to me? Absolutely. Couldn't believe it. I was halfway through my dinner in my hotel room. very glamorous life on the road and suddenly I flick open

social media and there it is and I thought it was a spoof I was trying to see if it was like some sort of generated account that had put this up but no it came from the Scotland national team's own account and it is true

and Steve Clark has made the decision himself to leave and he, from what we've heard sat the players down a few hours ago and told them that he was leaving his position so I think it's come as a shock to pretty much everyone so including the players

then. Including the players, including the backroom staff. Yeah, and the timing quite strange as well. The night before they depart, it'll either be tomorrow or the day after that they depart Charlotte and head back home. So yeah, interesting timing, but he obviously didn't want it to get out in any way before the players. He had a chance to tell the players themselves because you don't need to speak to Steve Clark for very long to know how incredibly passionate he is about being the national. team manager of Scotland. He has spoken about it at great lengths, the pride that he has, and the fact that he's taking the country back into major tournaments and then finally back to a World Cup as well. He's the most successful manager the nation has ever had. So it is a huge shock. He was also given a four-year contract just before this World Cup. So it will be a shock as well

to those that are going to have to now try and find somebody to take his place. Because that's the thing that's really surprised me. There was a bit of chat before that contract was signed about whether this would be his last tournament. And then once that contract was signed, everyone was like, oh, okay, that puts that to bed then. So he's in for another four years. I wonder how much of a part the kind of media reaction and fan reaction to Scotland's performance at this tournament

has played in his decision? It may well have. I don't think that sort of thing is something that Steve Clark himself worries about or bothers about, but he has his family around. He has young grandchildren, maybe now that the age that they're guessing to, maybe that has influenced his decision about when it starts to affect your family. It becomes different.

I'm not sure if that is completely the case. But we've heard managers previously in Scotland talk about the effect that it has on their family when they're under this backlash. And there has been a backlash. Some of it possibly warranted. Some of his reactions, post-match press conferences, post-match interview. have been prickly. Does that reflect particularly well on him

in the heat of the moment? I can understand why he is feeling the way he is. Every Scot was hurting after that game against Brazil because the overriding feeling was that that was going to be too damaging for Scotland to get out of the group. So everybody was hurting.

I can understand why the emotions were high. But there has been a backlash about that. There's also been criticism over the last few camp, every campaign really, that he's taking Scotland about the way he sets the team up, tried to be a little bit more in the front foot this time, and then fell short due to some pretty bad defensive mistakes. So he has taken a lot of criticism, but it'll be interesting to hear from him exactly

what his reasons have been to making this decision, and we may get that in time. Ailey, obviously you're not home, you're in America, but do you know what the sentiment is back home? Obviously people are still sleeping, but from the people that are awake, you know, what's the reaction from them? I think it's mixed. I think there are certainly people that have wanted Steve Clark to go because there has been so much hope in the qualifying campaigns to suggest this Scotland team is the best capable team of getting out of the group stage, something that Scotland have never done before and there was a real feeling that this would be the time. So there has

been disappointment at the fact that Scotland failed to do it on the pitch. But there are also people who look at it and say we've had as a nation, Not quite three because the first tournament was during COVID, but there are certainly people who have been to all three major tournaments. And brilliant summers following the national team back on the stage. Scottish football fans have wanted that for so long. And Steve Clark has brought that back. He's reconnected the national team with the public.

When his first game at Hamden was played, it was played in front of a third of a full stadium, half a stadium. Now it's full every single game. He's reconnected that. and the environment that he's created alongside his players, the likes of Andy Roberts and John McGinn, Scott McTominy, the senior players, is an environment that every single player turns up

to every single international camp. So I think there's probably two sides off the coin in terms of how people are looking at this decision that he's made. But ultimately, it's massive shoes to fill. Can we indulge in a bit of idle speculation now? Who will the SFA be looking at? because it's a difficult job. Steve Clark has done really well.

And for the fans, it's evidently not quite good enough. Could you prize David Moyes away from Everton, for example? He will be one of the names, but whether he'll want to leave Everton, given what he's been building there, be a big question. Derek McKinness would have been another name, but he's just gone to Rangers, so that's not happening. Yeah, if he hadn't gone to Rangers,

he'd be well in the frame, wouldn't he? Yeah, 100%. Yeah, because he's just. he's always seen as being a future Scotland manager. Neil McCann is another name that will be floated around, I'm sure. He's done really well at Kilmarnock. That was Steve Clark's pathway into the Scotland job. So he may well be in the frame.

Stephen Naismith, one of Safe Clark's coaching staff, may well also be in the frame. There's also names like Ange Poster Coglu being mentioned, who's been the national team manager of Australia, and obviously has been loved in Scotland by half of Glasgow, not the other half, but certainly been admired for the style of football that he played at Celtic.

by anybody who watched them. So there's a few names knocking around, but it'd be really interesting to see who's interested, who Scotland can attract and what they do, because the expectations of Scotland national team has been raised hugely by what Steve Clark's achieved and what he's done. And you look at the next euros, the home euros,

and the expectation is that Scotland will be there and that they will once again try to make that history of getting out of the group. What will happen? Does he go home on a separate play? Does he get the same plane as the lad? I think they all still like him. Yeah, I know, sure.

I think they're all still pals. But he's not being ostracised. He's not been ostracised. He's not being tarred and feathered. But he's just a weird thing. Like, he's just there. I'm like, you know what? Stop calling Liam Gaffer.

Yeah, just stock on him and cover. All right, Steve. Steve. I mean, it's probably down the list of priorities for the Scotland backroom staff to be answering that question, but I will try my best to find out, do you like. I'd appreciate that. Very, very kind.

No worries. Just steamer the little man, please. Cheers, Ailey. Step inside the Range Rover sport and experience refinement in every detail. With features like cabin air purification and active noise cancellation, every drive feels composed and considered.

Explore more atrangerover.ca. Every story is a technology story in one way or another. And on the interface, we decode the tech that's rewiring your week and your world. On this week's episode, Is AI pushing us towards an infinite work week?

And this year's World Cup is the most technologically advanced ever. But is it making the game better or worse? Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts. Five life four. My favorite World Cup moment? It's the first World Cup I properly remember watching. Argentina 78. The ticker tape, Mario Kempes, Ari Hahn's scoring goals from miles out,

and always one of my favorite World Cup moments. Archie Gemmell's great goal for Scotland against the Dutch. What makes the World Cup such a special tournament is the atmosphere, the colour, it is a meeting of the nations and of people who love football. The People World Cup 2026. Listen on BBC Sounds. The Football Daily Podcasts at the People World Cup 2026

with Rick Edwards and Lloyd Griffith. Listen on BBC Sounds. As I mentioned earlier on we spoke to Paul Robinson, who were still in the stadium and we all agreed, just job done for England. Yeah, exactly that. I think that's the staying

and that's the mantra from the England players that are speaking to us after the game. They expected a difficult game. I don't think they expected the deadlock to be broken as late as it was. They would have liked an early goal

to make the pattern of the game very different. But I think, you know, in hindsight, it's a job well done. They've topped the group. They knew it was going to be difficult today. Panama trying to get their first ever

World Cup point. They had nothing to lose, everything to play for. and from an England point of view, I think if you'd have asked Thomas Tuchel, the way that the performances have gone, he would much rather have had a Croatia-like performance today to take into the knockout stages

rather than starting the tournament extremely well, everyone thinking that we're going to win the World Cup, as we always do, after the Croatia performance, and then the two clunky performances that have ensued. But as you say, that's exactly the saying that's ringing around the stadium. Job done, we move on. Even though we didn't manage to score in the first half,

the intent was there, wasn't it? It was more of an attacking starting 11, compared to the last game, would you say? He had the opportunity to leave out Declan Rice because of that booking that he picked up and the way that they finished in the Garner game with a 4-1-4-1 formation. They looked like a much more attacking threat

and credit to Thomas Tuchel. He realised that. And when you're looking at Declan Rice and Elliot Anderson, who'd you leave out? You don't leave either of them out on a good day. You know, you play one of them higher up the field. But in this game today, he didn't require two holding midfielders. And in this system, it allowed Jude Bellingham

to play almost a free role. Elliot Anderson sat in. in front of the back four, then you had Saka, Morgan Rogers in the 10 and Marcus Rashford out on the left, which then you thought, well, are Rogers and Bellingham going to get in one another's way, actually playing as two number 10s? But they didn't because Jude Bellingham was given a really free roaming role, which played to England's advantage later in the game. I thought Elliot Anderson actually did a really good job in there. He's becoming undroppable. I mean, he's becoming a really key figure for England. We spoke about it on air after

the game, and we talked about the rotation in the fullback areas, the two central defensive partnerships, you know, which one would be which. But when you look at Thomas Tuchel's England, there's a spine there that are undroppable. And it's Pickford, and at the moment it's Conzer, Anderson, Rice, Bellingham, Harry Kane. And that spine, you will see go through the tournament. He'll put meat on the bones of that spine. There'll be different personnel. I think he's still looking for answers in the wide areas.

The relationships between the wide players and the fullbacks are yet to be finalised, if you like. I think he's still searching for answers in those areas. but when you look at that spine and Elliot Anderson is a key, key part of that. Harry Kane is now England's record goal scorer in the World Cup. I mean, how lovely is that for him? You run out of superlatives for him

and I think the player that he's become not just the player that he's become but the person that he's become as well. Off the field, the leader, all the superlatives, the captain talisman leader, all of those type of things. You can accustom to him.

He's become so key for England. I mean, Thomas Tuchel has showed in this season with leaving Jude Bellingham out of the squad, leading him out to start in 11 that England are okay without Jude Bellingham. Yes, he's a big game player, he's a big moment player, but actually with Morgan Rogers,

they've got another option. Without Harry Kane, they don't have another option. He is that key to this England side. He has become, you know, listen, he's up there. When you talk about the likes of Ronaldo and Messi, if he doesn't win the Ballandoor this year, I don't know why.

61 goals in 51 games for Bayern Munich the numbers that he's churning out on a regular basis and yes we do give him a lot of plaudits but I still don't think he gets the plaudits that he deserves because he's up there in that bracket of striker that we're talking about I'd take your point about Harry Kane being the one that England can't cope without

but actually today without Jude Bellingham England would have struggled well that's what I say about him been the big game player the big moment player but you have to get Jude Bellingham the Jude Bellingham that we've got of this World Cup and Thomas Tuchel's worked hard on that. I think his management of Jude Bellingham

the way that he's treated him, as in leaving him out of the side, leaving him out of the squad, and showing Jude Bellingham that it's not all about Jude Bellingham, it's about the team, it's about the collective. And that was the message that we got from the players and from the manager after that opening game against Croatia

where Jude played a huge part in that as well. But you see what you're getting from him today and he's playing with the freedom and he's playing like the Jude Bellingham that you want in and around the squad and the side. And he's big moments player like he got his goal today and he got his assist today. That's exactly why he's in this side. But if he's not in that right frame of mind and that mentality where Thomas Tuchler has put him

coming into this tournament, I'm not necessarily sure that you get the best out of him. But we are certainly getting the best out of him at the moment. The right back issues look to be a bit of a problem going forward. Quince went off limping, Jed Spence, come on. Is that a worry? I expected Jed Spence to start in all honesty. I thought that would be a straight switch from left back to right. back an easy option with Reach James is his injury.

The worrying thing for Thomas Tuchel is we don't actually know how often if, again, that we're going to see Rees James in this tournament, he's brought Trevor Chalabar into the squad who can cover as a central defender. When he initially came into the squad, I thought, okay, that's maybe for cover for John Stones and the central defenders that he's not quite sure on their fitness. But actually with Jed Spence, he's going to have to play there now. Reach James doesn't look like he's coming back anytime soon. Nico O'Reilly was the first pick in the first game against Croatia,

missed the last game, came back in again today. It is an issue for Thomas Tuchel, and it's going to be a question that will always be asked of him as we progress through the tournament, should you have brought maybe Trent Alexander Arnold? You know, that will come up in conversation. If England are not successful, we will always ask those questions. But at the moment, the injuries that he's picking up.

And Madewiki as well, he didn't look comfortable towards the end of that game. I know he came off the bench, but actually he picked up a little bit of a knock. So he's got injuries going into this last 32 game and also there's only four days to go until they play again. Shearer on commentary said he felt that better opposition would have troubled England. And I think that's probably fair, isn't it? Absolutely.

I mean, you look at the goal that Panama had ruled out for offside and it was a marginal offside. I mean, I was doing the commentary for the TV and initially you thought, oh, he's miles offside, yeah, no problem there. And then you saw the replays in the VAR. It was a very, very close decision. And the TV camera's cut to Thomas Tuchel, once or twice in that game,

the substitute that came off the bench, Diaz, he caused England problems and against a better side, a better opponent, granted, we wouldn't play the same way. We'd play with Anderson and Rice, the two holding midfielders. We wouldn't be that exposed, but actually the chances that Panama created

specifically towards the end of the game were worrying. And as I say, the cut to the England manager, it was a persona of frustration. You could see the way he was. He wasn't happy with what he saw. And the interview that we played out on Five Live after the game,

it was a Thomas Tuchel that was kind of dead batting the questions back, exactly what you'd expect, but you could tell he was grumpy, he wasn't happy. You know, he's picked up injuries and this wasn't the type of performance that he wanted today. There were certain things in that performance, more so defensively that didn't

please the England manager. Do you think you'd have a little shout this afternoon? Well, himself. Himself and anyone else who happens to be around? I don't think he's, I think he's more constructive than that. You know, you work for some managers and the old school throwing the teacups around in the dressing room. I think that's gone. And a lot of the managers now, especially the

day managers, they will actually take themselves off into the coach's room, which is at the side of the dressing room before they come in and address the dressing room. Basically, obviously, at high octane, there's a lot of emotion going on and the players will shout and ball, they'll rant and rave and they'll have their talks with each other. And the modern day manager will take the self off into the coaches room, let the dressing room calm down, let the quiet ensue, and then they will go in and deliver a calm, collected, tactical opinion, rather than just immediately going in there hot-headed and, you know, shooting off the cuff if you like.

So they've got a sort of rage room. I like that. Love that. Go in there, let us some steam, smash some stuff up. Smash a few TVs, get out there. Paul, just quickly, is it going to be all right? Are we going to be okay? There's a few injuries.

Good question. We've not really kind of won by huge margins. Tell me it's going to be okay. If this was the first game and Ghana was the second game and Croatia was the third game, then I'd say, yeah, we're absolutely flying. We're building into this tournament. What a great performance.

Look forward to the knockout. rounds. But actually the Croatia performance, as I say, we all thought we're going to win the World Cup and then the two clunky performances after it. So yes, I do think there is more to come from England, but I didn't see enough today to convince me that we're going to go all the way. But we have got the quality to do it. We have got the players to do it. But I think there's still a lot of question marks around Thomas Tuchel's starting 11 and relationships in that team as in left back, left winger, right back, right winger, who, what, where and when. And the relationship between the back four and the goalkeeper. Chopping and changing personnel that often doesn't normally

bode well. You look at the best teams, whether it be at club level or international level, the back four very rarely changes. The goalkeeper doesn't change. The midfield and the striker, there's an understanding and there's a nucleus of players there that don't change. The worrying thing for me is that the amount of change that we've seen within this England side. Yeah, a horrible phrase, but it feels like it might be shrinking into it. You can have that, Paul, if you don't. I'll put that in commentary for you this week. He doesn't want it. He doesn't want it. He's a right. Yeah, fine. I just thought I'd offer it. And we have finally got the round of 32 confirmed, or well, not quite, nearly.

We're recording before the Austrian-Algeria games. England will face Dr Congo. Dr Congo. Good old Dr Congo. The first time they qualified in their history for the round of 32. Adam, from the Athletic, joins us now. Adam, you just got back from the England game, yes? Yes, just got back into Manhattan after the England game, made my way through the Lincoln Tunnel.

And are you feeling suitably underwhelmed by what you saw? It's quite hard in these press boxes in the stadium. I sound like the world's smallest violin. But the press boxes are these glass boxes where you have no sound coming from the stadium. You can't even hear the referee's whistle. So you can't really get a sense in MetLife Stadium of even how fans are reacting to the game. So the only real sense I have is kind of how journalists around me are reacting to the game. and it was a sleepy first half.

Yeah, they are going to have to get better rather than get worse. Who would you expect to start on that right-hand side then? Yeah, I mean, it's a quick turnaround now. I mean, look, you would think against Democrats' Republic of Congo that whoever England put out of their 26-man squad should be good enough to win that game. So I don't think he'll take at risk with Reese James.

I'm not sure Reese James would be ready for that game in any case. I think he'd be lucky to be ready. for the round of 16 even, to be honest. I presume he'll move Jed Spence over to that right side, O'Reilly on the left, and then probably Saka. It would feel crazy to not have Bacayosat. He's meant to be the best of all of those wingers. So my instinct would be, you know,

you give Saku another hour in that game and you hope that it starts to click for him. I probably agree, but I just wonder if Saka might be more effective coming on for the last half hour again and stick Madwake in from the start? It feels like it's a question of it, is it fitness or is it form with Saka? And if it's a bit of fitness, then you need minutes.

If it's formed, then that's a different thing. And I think that's what we're sort of trying to get to the bottom of, really, at the moment. And it might be that it's a bit of both things. Do you think with D.R. Congo, are we just going to see a little bit more of the same until we get into the 16? Hopefully.

Yeah, yeah, I agree with you. I'm not sure how much you can rotate when it's a knockout game. I mean, imagine if you make seven changes and then loses against Diocongo, and you're like, what the hell are you doing? Quite funny. Quite funny. Quite funny. Probably won't be very funny for his job prospects.

Well, the Scotland job's available. Scotland job is available. I don't think you'll make that many changes, but they are going to have to use the squad at the same time as saying that because the next game after that, if they win, is a really hard one. I think it's going to be a real, real test for England. They're going to play Ecuador or Mexico in Mexico City. And both of those scenarios, I think, present a real challenge.

I'm really looking forward to it as a game, potentially. Ecuador, I saw them play here against Germany the other night, and they won, and they were brilliant. And I think they would also be better suited than England playing at altitude, being a bit more used to that in some of the South American qualifying games. and obviously Mexico, if they would to beat Ecuador and be the game that England face, that's a home crowd, that would be Mexico full winds in a row. We've seen what some of those atmospheres are like.

And to go into the Aztec who would knock out the hosts, it would take a lot of guts. But I think it would give England a huge amount of belief if they were able to do it. And what about D.R. Congo, then, what are the obstacles that they might present for England? I guess, I mean, you know, Vista's having a good tournament. Scored three goals, I think. Yeah, because I was on the way back tonight from the game.

I didn't see them tonight. I saw the game they drew against Portugal, and that's obviously a fantastic result, so they've clearly got the ability to frustrate a team. We don't have a 40, 41-year-old walking around up front, I would say, so unlike Portugal, it may be a little bit more difficult.

Get off the fence. Yeah. Get off the fence. So I think that might be in England's interest. I think England should move them around a little bit more than what Portugal did. They're going to be organised. They've got a threat up front in Wissar.

The game plan's pretty clear. It's to frustrate. It's to hit on the counterattack and steal the moment. As and when they come. I think they're already kind of performing beyond expectations by getting to this next round. But it would be a real calamity from England if they weren't, you know, to win that game.

Let's have a look at the next round of fixtures then. The ones that we know about. I mean, there are some really great ties in there. I'm just going to pick out some that I really like. Brazil, Japan. So Japan, I've been really impressed with. If Brazil get knocked up, be their worst performance since 1966, then become the knocked up.

Knocked up, yeah. I did say, I hope I said knocked up. I hope I keep that in. If I didn't say knocked up, I certainly hope that I did. If they get knocked out or up, it would be their worst performance since 1966 and the longest they've ever gone without winning the World Cup and I think they would find a very very unhappy Brazilian public but it doesn't feel beyond the realms I know Brazil look better in their second and third games but Japan I have been impressed with they've been really good

really good I was at the Brazil Morocco game at the MetLife the Brazil opener in Morocco first 25 minutes half an hour caused Brazil a lot of problems equally I think you know maybe Brazil have just been warming into the tournament a little bit. I mean, Ancelotti's been wearing a three-piece suit in some very hot places over the past week or so. He doesn't seem... He just doesn't seem flustered whatsoever. There hasn't been a bead of sweat coming down him. So he seems pretty relaxed.

They don't look to me like the best team in the competition, I would say Brazil. You know, when I think of the great Brazil teams and maybe it's a bit unfair, you think of fantastic fallbacks, sort of flying up and down. They don't have that. And I think they also look a bit vulnerable in centre midfield as well with, you know, Paccatar and Casamiro, Bruno. I think you can get at them.

I'd still expect them to overcome that game just about, but I don't think it'll be easy for them. And then there's some other really good games. The Mexico, Ecuador one, I think will be fantastic. Yeah. In Mexico City, I think Belgium, Senegal could be a good game. Yes. Well, Belgium haven't been great this tournament, have they?

and Senegal have. No. I think sort of came, well, I think both of them come into it in the last game, last game of the groups. I think the pick of the tyres is probably Netherlands, Morocco, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a really good one as well.

Culturally as well. Yeah, culturally an interesting game. Your kind of history tells you to persuade towards Netherlands, doesn't it, a little bit. But Morocco sort of recency, what they did in Afcon, obviously in January, and then 2002 World Cup, how good they were against Brazil.

That's a really hard one to call. I think both teams will probably feel a bit annoyed to kind of have to play together this early. Neither of them have been like sort of porch gun and kind of being a bit sloppy and dropped sloppy points. And I think Holland and Morocco will think... That's a bit unlucky. It feels more like a quarter-final than a round of 32 game.

I think France, Sweden as well, as strong as France are, you look at those Swedish front players. they could cause a problem I know they've sort of barely won a game and they're finally in the round of 32 of the World Cup and they did get tonked by the Netherlands didn't they? Yeah and you've got France's heavy favourites

but you know you look at those forwards and you think that's a lot of exciting forwards players to have on one pitch with Isaac and Giacourers and about 15 attacking players that France have I like the retirement home Derby which is Portugal versus Croatia

which I mean there would be a lot of Freedom passes knocking about that. That game, look, I'm happy to be proved wrong and eat humble pie yet again, but that I don't think will be played at pace. There's a lot of footballers in those starting 11th, in those squad that we're not going to see again.

But the stats, I think, will be... Ever? Well, not ever, but I think a major international tournament. I mean, we're not going to be put down, aren't they? I mean, we simply don't know, Rick. But I just don't think we're thinking going to say a lot of those players again and international tournament, which is obviously lovely for

nostalgia, but I don't think he's going to be incredible for quality. I am annoyed with Portugal tonight because I am down to go to this game in this quarter final in Kansas City, which was if Portugal had won, would have been the Ronaldo Messi

quarter final in Kansas City. But they've blown it. They have blown it. They've ruined your trip is what they've done. They've ruined my experience at a world cut. I'm still very grateful to be at this World Cup. It's fantastic. But that would have been,

it probably would have been one of the most watched World Cup games ever. You know, if you'd have had a Ronaldo messy quarterfinal. I think it was something that was kind of in everyone's diary as a possibility. I mean, Portugal just look. They did not look great. They've got so many talented individuals, but they just don't look like the sum of the parts whatsoever.

And Croatia, I think, look a bit tired. they look kind of their age to a certain extent I think Portugal will win that game but just a bit like the Brazil-Japan one and yeah it probably swayed towards Morocco with that Netherlands one it's good they're all on different days at least so we can sort of watch them all separately

I think for completely different reasons the game I'm most looking forward to is Argentina Cape Verde because Cape Verde are the story of the tournament so far and they're playing against Messi and I mean who would have called that before the start is fantastic. Defensively, they've been really fantastic

and it really is. One of the stories of the tournament and the fans of theirs who are able to be here is incredible and the 40-year-old goalkeeper and I think there was a lot of concerns before the tournament about the 48 team format and

I think what it's really given us in the group stage is kind of two ends of the spectrum. On the one hand you have these like superstar players you know, your Vinicius, Messi's messy and Bapé, Kane, Bellingham, who are giving you these moments. They're almost like, they're coming on one after the other,

like sort of like Disneyland versions of themselves. They're like the PlayStation version of themselves. Like, you press the messy finesse finish and he does it. And then Mbapé comes on and just powers a goal in. But then on the other end of the spectrum, we're still getting what we think of with World Cups from our childhood, this nostalgia, where you have discoverers. And we are discovering these characters.

like Vazenia in the Cape Verdi goal. And that side of it is fantastic. And the Curacao goalkeeper. And some of these teams who have now sadly departed, but others, you know, who are really giving us fantastic storylines. It's a situation where there'll be kids watching these games for the first time. And in 10, 20 years, they'll look back and be like, oh, that was the, that was the Vazenia World Cup, which I think is beautiful.

Like, you know, whenever I think back to my childhood, I just think of a very small, colourful Mexican goalkeeper. And I just think that's my childhood. So it's nice that we're making other kids' childhoods really. Not me personally. Have you learned how to say, what do we call Cape Verdi?

Oh, right, yes. So I spoke to former Cape Verde International, George Santos. We've had him on Five Live Breakfast a few times and he said Cabo Verde. I meant that, is it, I'm learning how to pronounce Occupelago? Oh, yeah, Archipelago.

Archipelago. Archipelago. I didn't know how I've pronounced that before the tournament. I think there's kids around the country learning that word, pointing to a map. This is great. That's geography. Look at this group of islands or as I like to think of it.

And archipelago. A little moment, I think, for the African team. So at the time of recording, eight of the ten in the World Cup are through to the next round, potentially, Algeria as well. And when you consider that before the start of this World Cup, only six African countries had ever qualified for the knockout stage.

It's remarkable, really. Yeah, it's really good. And also, if you think of some of the nations who aren't there, Nigeria, Cameroon, I mean, it shows how competitive that qualifying has become. And it also makes you think, loath as I am, to say it, would 64 teams be that bad? Because, you know, I'm already very tired, Adam. But if you think of some of the teams who aren't here, so Cameroon, Nigeria, Italy, Wales, Ireland, Wales, you know, Poland,

it doesn't become that hard if you're FIFA to tell that story and also have a slightly cleaner group stage with more jeopardy. I perversely have quite enjoyed the bizarre sort of permutation calculations around who is going to end up playing who and the bracket like it has it has sort of melted my mind but I felt like it's a it's a bit of fun whereas I mean also imagine what the qualifying would be like I mean basically just everyone qualifies right so it'd be awful what I will say is I'm not entirely sure the world will be able to cope with Nigeria in the World Cup at the moment with their goalkeeper he's so fit social media would explode my algorithm is

I know he's obviously goalkeepers anyway, but all every single person, but he's my vote. Fit goalkeepers. He is getting a lot of traction on my Instagram and algorithm. This is an expert area of mine. I was sent yesterday by, I won't say who, but basically they were saying that the mum's WhatsApp group in London was, and Instagram groups were going mad for the Nigeria goalkeeper. They are. And my immediate reaction was obviously to Google him. Yeah.

Before remembering, they're not even in the. They're not in the competition. So I'm not sure what the mums are watching in this WhatsApp group. They are just scrolling Instagram. Yes. Yeah. Dads. Mums and dads. Oh yeah. The dads and the dads. I mean, look. I'm a dad. I'm going to look at the guy and I'm impressed. He's beautiful. He's lovely looking. He's beautiful. Get him in the world. Come on then.

64 teams. Come on. How is it a goalkeeping? No one cares. No one cares. Give me those hands on. One team we haven't mentioned and should mention one of the hosts USA, they've got Bosnia, Herzegovina, and you would think that they've got a decent chance of progressing. From a US perspective, it's opened up pretty nicely for them. You know, they're obviously in a being one of the host nations, you get a slightly kind of draw in the group, which I don't think is the American interpretation of how it's gone.

I think the American interpretation is not that, is not perhaps that humble. I would say. I think the American interpretation is they're going to win it. I think a lot of them think they've already won it. And we're going to bring it back here next time because now we've discovered it. We have to have it always. No, my adopted country, America, so I thought they were really, really good in the first half

against Paraguay, really good, a lot better than many of the performances we've seen under Pocetino for them. And also a really good start against Australia. And you would expect them, I think, to beat Bosnia as long as they've got as long as Poulosix fear and some of the other players who have had

a few injury issues. So I think, you know, they go into that game feeling good about themselves. And they've also, they've sort of stayed on that West Coast where you are as well. So they'll play in near San Francisco for the next game. And I think it's LA and Seattle if they carry on. So that helps. You know, some of the teams are going to be traveling a hell of a lot sort of from one side of the country, into different countries.

And it enables them to really just have a sense of continuity play at places that they've already played out in the case of LA and Seattle. And then I think after that it would be Belgium or Senegal. So that's a pretty... It could be worse, right? It could be much worse. Nice route. Lovely route.

Just quickly, who's going to win it, Adam? It's France, isn't it? It is. Yeah, that's the right answer. It is so good. Absolutely right. Thanks for coming on. That's so good.

I saw and play live once and Mbapé live. I know Messi is like beautiful and Mesmeric and all of that stuff and Harlem's great. Mbapé Live, I think is the best thing in the tournament. like the speed when he gets going and when he basically decides it's time to click into gear I just think he's unbelievable

and he's two assists for Dembella in the last game he's probably going to end up with the golden boot because they'll go so far and he's just he was clearly felt quite burned by what happened at Rail Madrid

towards the end of the season and just look at the players around him with Dembele and Ely and Elise and Dewe and if they're not working you bring on Cherokee or Barcala and it's a joke It's a total joke.

It's what we thought England might be, you know, when you bring on Foden and Palmer and... Let's not go there. Adam, thank you so much. Appreciate your time. Cheers, Adam. Thank you very much. Thanks for having me, enjoying the show.

Oh, we've had some more WhatsApp in, and I'm just going to read the one that is nice about us. Rick and Lloyd, Best World Cup podcast out there. Funny yet informative. Thank you. Need to do these for all tournaments going forward, not our decision. To quote Casablanca, it could be the beginning of a beautiful.

beautiful friendship. Although Tony Kahn is the director of football and son of owner of Fulham, not the owner unless he's been promoted. Keep up the good work. To be fair, we did have a conversation about whether we're going to say co-owner or like that. So we just thought owner was cleaner. I said, is it only? He's like, well, I'm co-owner. He's like, but just like whatever. And if I'm honest, I think it's a family business. So I mean, it still counts, doesn't it? And then you said, you know how to say this name. Oh yeah, and that's from Doty in Bermansy. She says also more backgammon content, please.

Won't be a problem. No, won't be happening. I think it's what you meant to say. You can get in touch with us throughout the tournament, send us a WhatsApp or a voice note on 08-0-8-200-289-369. We would love to hear from you, obviously. Start the message with Rick and Lloyd. Only one game for you on Five Live Sport today,

full commentary of South Africa, Canada, from eight. Rick, can you tell us who's doing the stuff before? This guy. Yeah, Rick Edwards. Yeah, it's fantastic. presumably with some other people as well. Otherwise, it's going to be a tough old hour. Big Phil.

There will be Big Phil. Scalar? No, as in from... That'd be a hell of a booking. We know. No, as in from Fresh Prince. Why are you boonking so much tonight? I'm laughing at my believe in a hard.

You're having a good time. Oink-koink. There will be no podcast from us tomorrow. We will be back on Tuesday. In the meantime to get more World Cup content and podcasts, including the Football Daily. Just search World Cup on the BBC. Sounds app.

There's this noise that you make. You don't decide to make it. It just comes out. I don't know what that's good either. But everyone makes it at the same time. And it makes you feel... I don't know how to say it. We know that feeling.

The FIFA World Cup 2026. 1 5 live in BBC Sounds. On the open road, conditions change. Your composure doesn't have to. But technologies like terrain response to and clear site ground view, Range Rover Sport brings confidence and control the challenging conditions. Explore more atrangerover.ca. Every story is a technology story in one way or another.

And on the interface, we decode the tech that's rewiring your weak and your world. On this week's episode, is AI pushing us towards an infinite work. week. And this year's World Cup is the most technologically advanced ever, but is it making the game better or worse? Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.