Goes Without Saying - Hating Home at Christmas: podmas #9

Episode Date: December 9, 2024

merry podmas! festive podmothers sephy & wing enter a Big Sleigh: carolling on dysfunctional families, reclaiming your time, dealing with trauma, your uncle being a c**t, sneaking away to feel normal, and giving yourself permission to make the most of the season and enjoy Christmas. ✷see more ✷ www.youtube.com/@sephyandwing ✷ www.instagram.com/sephyandwing ✷ www.tiktok.com/@sephyandwingshop ✷ www.sephyandwing.co.uk Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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how we manage forests, capturing more carbon and safeguarding biodiversity for generations to come. At UBC, our researchers are answering today's most pressing questions. To learn how we're moving the world forward, visit ubc.ca slash forward happens here. Let the jingle bells ring. I thought you were going to say, let the games begin. Oh my god, I wish I was watching that. I'm actually kind of about to get a little bit horizontal. Not fully. I'm in a heated blanket right now. I know, that's what's kind of, that's what's getting me

into the spirit. This is nice. Wait, is this, yeah, that is the right microphone. Sorry, that was unbearable to listen to. That's alright. I just suddenly got scared But it wasn't the right microphone. Oh my god speaking of scared. What? Watch the most scary fucking movie last night What it was my house what we'll watch it together It's like the first movie we watched together that we've watched a bit of Fleabag together But I was like the first movie. Fun to do a scary film together. It was horrifying. That's a horrible big experience. What was it? I think it was really good but it's the classic thing.

But you don't sound so sure. Well it's the classic thing. Like it has actually affected me. Okay. Like it's affected my brain I think. I don't like that then. Because it's about like violent, like incredibly like disturbing violence. You don't see any of it but it's directed by a man which I don't like I was like a hatred of that it's called red rooms but it's like a French Canadians films because it's called like la chambre rouge but it's like red rooms but like I think it's actually just called red rooms okay I'm not really

scary I don't recommend it no yeah you buy. Okay. I'm not gonna watch it. Really scary. I don't recommend it at all. No yeah you've not. But I also really really I'm thinking about it and I'm like scared. See I like a scary film when it's like I pick it up I put it down never think about it again. I'm never gonna put this down I don't think. Yeah that I don't like that. It's staying with you it's haunting you. I checked in my wardrobe last night before I went to bed. Oh yeah I don't like that. And that's like not relevant to the film, like I'm just generally like scared. Sometimes if I watch a scary enough film I'll like beg whoever I'm with to come to the toilet with me and watch me wee because I just actually can't go on my own. That's kind of the whole thing. Yeah. Sleeps over energy. I'm sorry to hear that. I'm so sorry to hear that Sefi. It was amazing but like horrible. I'm glad you had a good time. Yeah I completely get it. I keep seeing people talk about like I feel like we've um we're beyond the peak of this now and we're kind of it's been on the decline for a couple of years, but the whole like crime, true crime, like investigation and like murdery stuff, the whole culture of that and people saying like, I saw someone say something along the lines of, I'm going to

butcher it, but it was basically like, like you're not going to win an award for the competition of who's the most desensitized to violence No, but there's no I will say I'll tell you now we all win. We all fucking win that We're also completely descent desensitized to its horrific. It's horrible I feel like I'm not like that we can even have a conversation about something that's part of the culture called true crime And also there is particularly It's always about women. Essentially centered around the violence against women but is mainly watched by women.

Which there's the huge market of makeup artists and influencers that talk about that. Talk about girls getting horrifically murdered whilst doing their makeup, I find very, very sick. It's very interesting. It's definitely a huge cultural, it's definitely a marker of something very interesting that we've experienced over the past like 20 years even. And also like with the Monopoly money shooter, just the kind of like the film, I

don't know, just the story, like the way that we can, yeah, anywhere, all of that. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay, so, oh this is coming out. Mary Poppins. Mary Poppins, and this is coming out right now. This is on the day, so yeah, you had a big storm yesterday.

Oh bloody hell. The wifi went down, which is why. Well so did you, everybody else had the storm as well, but I just couldn't believe that our wifi actually was like, gone. To the point where I couldn't even like, put something on the TV, because I was like, wait, I have to stream that our wifi actually was gone to the point where I couldn't even put something on the TV because I was like, wait, I have to stream that.

It made me realise that everything in my life runs on internet, which is fine. My access to all my favourite things are on the internet. I was starting to think, why haven't I saved anything to a hard drive? Genuinely. Why didn't I store my files? but yeah so this is coming out right now

so thanks for your patience harry thank you so much and thanks for being here, everyone's loving podmas sometimes you just can't predict podmas honestly if i've learned anything never wherever sephia and wing are involved it becomes incredibly unpredictable yeah it does and that's the way i like it

but i'm really loving everyone's comments on the episodes and stuff. Me too. Feels really like oh okay good. It feels close like it's really nice to say something and get immediate responses then say something again tomorrow and get immediate responses like it's just really really nice. Yeah it is nice it is nice. I don't know what we're gonna say today but we'll just see where it goes. We're gonna talk about, I think it will be called something like hating home at Christmas. Oh yeah, I couldn't remember which one we decided on then. Well we've got to do another one after this so enjoy tomorrow's episode. If it sounds worse than this one, that's why. Because we've had to record a couple. Hey, I mean, that is relevant.

Yeah. To me. Yes, yeah, agreed, agreed. Just because it's like, so I'm at uni now. Yeah. And I am leaving, like my last lesson is tomorrow, basically. And then I'm going to leave like probably at the weekend. During podmas, you'll get the updates of this, I'm sure.

Yeah, yeah, so true. I'll go back home for Christmas for like a couple weeks and it's like the whole family are back. Like my sister's back from Amsterdam, like we're all there. So it will be intense and stressful and all of the stuff. So yeah I'm right with you guys. I agree. I feel like there's just a big culture shock around like movement and stuff at Christmas and I also just feel like any sort of... I feel like there's just a big culture shock around like movement and stuff at Christmas and I also just feel like any sort of I feel like and I know we've said it for the past few podmasters But the kind of the culmination of all of your issues coming to a head at the end of the year Yeah, and tied up in a ribbon at the dinner table with all of your family or whatever

Or whoever you're surrounded by it just it can be very confronting and I do feel like it's kind of a demanding time of year. For sure. Especially when it comes to like that extended family thing, which I kind of, my family sort of have stopped doing that sort of around COVID, I guess, that all sort of dissipated because it seems like unsafe. And then it became like no longer really feasible to do like an extended family thing just because of people's

so many different needs going on and just a lot of autism basically going around in the family. Meaning that it doesn't all work, it doesn't all mesh, everyone's needs contradict and stuff. But those were some of the most stressful environments, like absolutely love it, like some of the best times but also like always tears, always an argument, always super political conversation and really really fucking tricky. Yowch. Yeah that is tricky. Yeah political is just like, eek, I'll put me right off my dinner. So political. And there's a lot of politics, very oppositional politics as well. Like it's not like we're talking about politics in the middle. Oh yeah no. It's not rally the troops, oh my god we're all just bonding so much over having the same beliefs.

It's not even like oh we vaguely disagree, everyone's got like big fucking opinions that like directly oppose. Yeah that's an interesting dynamic to deal with on the highest day of the year. Definitely, definitely stressful. Christmas is a weird one. I've spoken about this before but I feel like in my recent years it's really really nice but I've had to make a real effort to make it nice and undo a good succession of terrible years and I feel like I could easily be one of those people that's just like, oh, I don't like Christmas or I don't do Christmas or whatever, da, da, da, da, da. And I was just like quite determined and stubborn

to not let that, I didn't want to do that. I didn't want to let Christmas start. Kind of sick of missing out on it. Like why is that not something you can enjoy? Yeah, and almost like I knew that there was a lot of like, I had a lot of compounding evidence on one side that would make me feel negatively at this time of year and I just thought I have to challenge this like now as much as possible otherwise it's just gonna keep getting deeper and deeper and deeper

yeah and also luckily like I'm at an age where like I can choose I'm also at an age and in a position where I can choose where I am and I don't see any of my family on Christmas Day and I make an effort to go and see the people that I want to see on certain days and stuff like that. I have not had a traditional set up for the past, like over 10 years. So I feel like I'm in a privileged position now because I feel like the things that I get to do are my choice. But when you're younger and you're like following like the rules and decisions of your parents or whoever is in control, God, it actually makes my heart hurt a little bit. Terrifying.

Thinking about that. Yeah, it's a bit like, oh God, Harry, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, but like a few more years and you're you're fine. But like, yeah, there is something so liberating about Being able to choose. Yes. God is everything. I feel like I've done that sort of with my birthday because my birthday and Christmas are a package deal essentially. Yes, she's a holy girl. Yeah, oh my god. Well, you know my thoughts on the name Mary, beautiful beautiful queen. So if I started calling you Mary as like a little bit of a funny thing would you be opposed to that?

No, I don't want you to call me Mary because I want it from like my child maybe. For somebody else. Okay. Like so if I start calling you mother Mary here and there you're not gonna like that. I think like Mary means too much to me. Okay. Externally. As like rather than me being called Mary like it's the name of all my pets and Tamagotchis and dolls and characters in my late imaginary games. It's not me. Okay, yeah, yeah.

You know? I really do know. She's an external being. Yeah, yeah, okay, got you. Yeah, something larger than... It's Pauly's mother. It's bigger than us, yeah, yeah. It's Mary and Paul.

It's huge. I love that, I said it, I think that was in Podmas when I was like, oh, you guys, you're not gonna miss out on anything if you miss an episode, like you haven't missed anything, and then they're like, who's Paulie? What's Mary? And who's his mum, Mary?

Also, I don't even know I've never met this woman and I don't know her name At about four years old I thought if that man's mom is called Mary, I would love her She must be the most beautiful woman on the planet I mean, to be honest, she probably is dead now. RIP, she's definitely toast. I don't know anything about this woman. I've never met her in my life. She's a goner.

At the age of four, I hooked onto this woman. Now we've kept her alive. Someone else's mum. My dad's friend's mum, so good. But anyway, I have actually been thinking that's just on that note. I think I might try and get diagnosed with autism through the uni. Definitely, that's a good idea. I was speaking to one of my friends who's autistic here and she was saying she got diagnosed

through the uni and she was like that was quite an easy process. Oh, okay. Well, she didn't say it was easy. Like she was like basically. Well, be easier. You know, easier than the rest of the shit. So I might try and do that here. Wow. Just an off thought.

Yeah, I'm taking it, I'm receiving it with so much love. I don't know if I will, but like, I kind of think like, I feel like I'm getting to the point where the diagnosis would actually help me. I mean, yeah. But, you know. It's good to have the option. That's just on the note of obsessing

over your dad's friend's mutt. That's the diagnosis, I think. For your entire life. I think that confirms that. So much so you're gonna name your child after someone you've never met. What were you saying? You were saying like, you make your own choice.

Christmas, your birthday, you've made your own choice. Christmas, a birthday you've reclaimed. Yes. My birthday is the 27th of December and it has always been ruined. This person is going to be sad about this but they are a birthday grinch. My mother, my mum, as I call her mummy. She ruins my birthday. She ruins my birthday every god damn... That's crazy. So wait, but always? Or like as a kid or as you've gotten older? No, as a kid she was great. As a kid she was great and then she just suddenly switched on me and said... and basically... not just on me, on everyone and was just like, you're too old now, like birthdays of kids.

How old are you, like 15? Your expectations are too high, like you basically were just having a normal day. And I tried to go along with that for a few years. But it's hard. There was that resistance within the day of her wanting it to be a normal day, very strange. And she heard thinking, I'm strange for wanting to do

like a good thing. Something nice. Or she would be like, like we can have a like go for a walk and have a cake and that's it and I'm like I just want to do something yeah how old were you when the switch happened? 18 it was like when you're no longer a kid because she let me have some good like parties like house parties when I was younger like 16, 17. I bet that was then used in the thing of like well I've I've let you do that. So now you're done. That's the last hurrah. Exactly. Yeah. It kind of was that. But yeah, then I just sort of made the decision, like, I'm going to take this into my own hands. Like, I'm not going to spend this at home. Like, I've done that enough times now that I know that

there is that resistance there. Yeah. And it's very much like a conversation within the house. Like, I'm like, you are ruining this. And she's like, no, you're ruining it. Like it's just a whole thing. Yeah. And yeah, I do say you're a gringe, birthday gringe. And what does she say? And she's like, I'm not.

Yeah, no, it's just a whole thing. And she would deny this, but I say her a million times. She would not be shocked to hear me say it. But she might be annoyed that I'm saying it on a podcast. She might, but she should have thought about that. Before you ruin on a podcast. She might but she should have thought about that. Before you ruin it all with a birthday! Yeah she should have thought about that. Yeah so I just, I go to the theatre now. Oh yeah. I'm literally like, I'm going, I go into London and I go to the theatre on my birthday and then I have my now second birthday in summer. Yeah right.

It's a good thing to do, go to the theatre on your birthday. I just think it's like, that's the kind of the only thing you can do in December like no one's around You don't really want to be out and about you sort of want to be just somewhere warm watching something But cinema feels kind of too maybe a bit little for a birthday. I just go Theatre is good because it takes you out for a couple of hours You're like fully immersed in something something. It feels a bit special. It's special, you've got the hours on either side of it that you can like, just actually, you're enjoying something, do you know what I mean?

You're immersed enough for that designated time, and then the time surrounding it is pleasant, and you're kind of preoccupied and distracted, and you're active doing something. Yeah. I think it might be a bit of a life hack. I think it is as well. Go to the theatre on your birthday. It's really really like I highly recommend and also you obviously in December things are more expensive which is shit but like if your birthday isn't in December especially it's like January you might be able to get it quite

cheap. Yeah or just do a second birthday. Just move it that's what I'm doing. Just move it that's what Sefi did. Yeah and I'm gonna be doing it Just move it. That's what I'm doing. Just move it. That's what Sefi did Yeah, and I'm gonna be doing it again next year. Yeah, you should I'm looking forward to it already. Yeah. Thanks. Nice Okay, so reclaiming the day reclaiming your time. I think is an important one Mmm, what are you looking at? Oh, I'm just moving you around the screen Oh god, cuz like it wasn't perfectly lined up in a little line Put me down, put me down, ahhhh put me down it wasn't perfectly lined up in a little line. Put me down, put me down. Just wasn't quite symmetrical.

Yeah, reclaiming the day I think is a big, oh god it's tough, it's hard out here. It really is, especially when you kind of have no control over the structure of that day. Because it's almost been a tradition, like if there are traditions that are set up before your arrival. But also tradition makes it sound quite nice, or intentional, but I think a lot of things, even though they are traditions, that's too flattering of a word.

It's like these are just things that we do with a moody face on. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, they are habits. It's like, it's not a nice tradition. Oh, we all wake up and we go to our uncle Paulie's house or whatever, sorry Paulie to bring him up. But do you know what I mean?

It's not like, oh, and then we all do this traditions, traditions, it's like, oh, get up quick, we're going to Paul, you're late for Paul, I told you we're leaving and blah, blah, blah. Do you know what I mean? Traditions is way too nice of a word for the actual reality of the hardship. Definitely.

It's a habit. It genuinely is one of those things that like we do that because we've always done that. Like I, we're sort of reframing things a little bit or like in the last few years we've been reframing stuff because it used to be like, get up early, do like stockings and like our presence and stuff. And then we'd like get in the car and drive to my grandparents like really early. And now that we don't do that, it doesn't work for some of the family members to be getting up early, they don't function in that way.

And it doesn't, and I think a lot more patience is needed. And so a few people, I don't know, we're trying to do things in a way softer way, no expectations, there's not a big sit down dinner because that doesn't work for some people either, like you can go and take your plate and you can take it to your room, it will be on the side, it will be, it will keep it hot, have it whenever you want,

no judgment, rather than this forced like, we're having a family dinner because it's Christmas. Like a willingness to be flexible, I think is really important. Definitely. In terms of like a group setting, where everyone's coming in with their own thing and there's dynamics and there's all of this stuff.

And the pressure is so, honestly, to be honest, like actually triggering. Yeah, it is. No, it is. Because also, it's kind of the thing with the birthday gringe, that's crazy. Yeah, I can't do it, it actually is. But it's kind of the thing where it's like, don't make me say that I want to have a nice time. Like, it's almost really difficult, I think, as a young English person to admit that you

want to have a nice time. I feel like that's, in my experience, not really been encouraged. No. You're not supposed to say, it's almost like, why do you think you're entitled to have a nice Christmas slash birthday? This day, yeah. think you're entitled to have a nice Christmas slash birthday. Yeah, no, it's seen as like, no, it's about getting through the day with no arguments and at the least level of like conflict possible. But it's like, but why can't it be nice? Like I'm not so, I'm not attached to.

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So no matter your era make it your best with peloton find your push find your power Peloton visit peloton at one peloton dot CA The like formality of a dinner the form formality of a present opening ceremony, I'm not attached to any of that. If people want to float in and out, I am not doing a bum's on chairs situation we need you all here. You're allowed to be absent, you don't have to come for a walk. I think that was loads of the forced marches when I was younger of and it's people just tantrums of all these fucking family members. What is that thing called the bleep test that's the vibe that gets me. It's exactly that. A forced march I never once went on a walk at Christmas I always thought that sounded really nice.

Oh my god well I'll tell you now. But my family would be like what do you want to go for a walk for? It's nice if the people want to go on the walk, but half the people don't want to go on the walk and half the people do. It's just like, but we're all being forced. It's like, why are you forcing people? I love the like, it's just, it's funny, isn't it? It's mental. Yeah, it's mental.

It's just like, there's a load of different needs, to be honest. Some people need people to go on a walk because they want, that's actually at my grandma. She wants people to go for a walk so then they'll all be out the house so she can relax But it's like I can't just force everyone out your fucking house Guys invited us about Long walk I might just got a new the way home new DS And I want to tend that my Nintendo yeah, I used to like that as a child.

Everyone would come to us on Christmas. Oh, that's so nice. So I could have all of my toys, et cetera, around. I had some great Christmases as like a child child. That's so nice actually having people over. Yeah, it was really good. I think I would love to like be the one, one day hosting. Yeah, be the host.

Oh God, it's definitely a power move, isn't it? It means, do you know what it means? It means you've got the biggest house. You've got the nicest house. Yeah, be closed. Oh god, it's definitely a power move, isn't it? It means, do you know what it means? It means you've got the biggest house. You've got the nicest house. Yeah, that's what it means. Oh, it's pretty iconic. Which is a good place to be. Yeah, it's not bad.

Guys, I have the biggest house. Guys, if you wouldn't mind sharing this podcast with a friend so one day Sefi and I can be the people who their family comes around to at Christmas. Cause I don't wanna get up and drive somewhere else on Christmas. Oh, tell me about it. It was like a two and a half hour drive every Christmas and then back in the evening. Two and a half hours? Yeah. I was gonna say yippee but I meant yikes.

You know genuinely yikes with us all in the car getting our hair pulled and oh my goodness Christ. Yeah that's a long drive and I guess if the birthday Grinch was the one driving then I do see how it could be like guys no you're not doing anything for your birthday because I'm knackered now. No and it's fair enough and then also like famously this bit I'm giving quite a lot of family stuff but like sorry my it's goes Christmas Day my uncle's birthday was Boxing Day then my birthday and then my great uncle's birthday is the 28th, like it is just bam bam bam bam family shit. So I can see why she's tired, you know?

I do as well, I'm tired of thinking about it. Yeah. Okay, good start. Any advice? What would you give for people, what advice would you give for people who are like, oh about Prince and about Christmas? The what, sorry? Just like not feeling great about it.

Get some time on your own if you can. Like if there's things you can't get out of, like if you have to go to this place that you don't wanna go to and you have to do the dinner and you have to do all of the stuff and speak to people that are difficult or whatever, I would just say try and get some time on your own. Like I remember as a kid,

like also I loved going to my grandparents on Christmas, but it is completely overwhelming. It's a lot of people, a lot of strong personalities in a big house, you know? And there's a lot of stuff going on. And it's just really intense. Our Christmas started early and all of the stuff and there's dynamics. I remember taking a portable DVD player, this is clearly back in the day before phones, and I got the DVD of An Idiot Abroad 2, and you know how I feel about those guys. And I went and sat in my grandparents room and just watched that for half an hour and I did get in trouble but I remember thinking like, is worth it. That is worth it. Just to get a bit of time

of a reset. Yeah, I think I do that even not even at Christmas. I'll just be like, I need a wee and then I'll sit in the toilet for 45 minutes. Yeah. Well, just a really big wee. Yeah, a shit in fact. Just a rude, sorry guys got diarrhea. For 45, I was just, yeah, I was just, you know,

things to do. So many things to do. So many things to do in the toilet. Do you have any advice? My advice would be nothing is permanent and... Yeah that's actually... I think I need to hear that. Yeah sometimes things can be really really hard but they're not forever. The good and the bad is not forever. So make the most of the things that you're happy about. Let go of the shit that you're not interested in. The new year is a new year, tomorrow's a new day.

Like you've got more Christmases ahead, touch wood. Just because you're having a hard time now doesn't mean you're having a hard time forever. And I agree with you, like get some alone time or just make room for some time like for you with people that you love and I think don't be hard on yourself. I feel like I felt it was like a real... I kind of in the Jacqueline Wilson way of like your parents getting divorced is not is your fault sort of thing. I think I felt like having bad Christmases was a personal failing of mine. Like almost like I hadn't been good enough to like...

God, you're getting cold. Yeah, yeah, like I'd been on the naughty list. Like I just felt like I had some really shit Christmases and I kind of felt like I just had to get on with it. I look back now and I'm like someone should have intervened and been like this child. Hello. She's Dinner. Yeah, come to mine for Christmas that sort of thing like I was a big like Denier of any help as a child or like a denier of any I Just wanted to be like that's continued. I wouldn't say as a child. Yeah

Yeah, you've got a lot better. But like I do think that's a child. Yeah, yeah. You've got a lot better, but like, I do think that's a trait, like. Yeah, definitely, definitely. Like, I wanna help you more than you would allow me to. Yeah, I guess. Yes, I'll allow you to, it's funny. I think I just feel like- You keep me at arms, like.

No, I definitely don't. You don't, you don't. I've done a good job at that. You really don't. I think I just felt like like almost if someone was like, oh, kind of like if the birthday Grinch came along and was like, oh, you're not doing anything for your birthday this year, are you?

I'd be like, no, no, no, definitely not. Like, what would I want to do anything for my birthday for? No, no, no, definitely not, definitely not. Or like, oh, you don't want Christmas dinner, do you? I'd be like, no, no, no. I remember people saying like, you're not gonna be upset that we're not doing Christmas, are you? And I was like, no, I'm not. Yeah.'re not gonna be upset that we're not doing Christmas are you and I was like no I'm not yeah but I was

I was devastated I carried it with me for years and years yeah it's devastating yeah very weird way to raise a child yeah I'll agree to that I'll say yeah I'll put my name to that statement. Things I wouldn't do, bring a stranger into my child's life and then dedicate my entire existence to them and their ideas about religion and life and all of these things. Absolutely not. Death to this man. But anyway, I'm ruining Christmas while you're at it. You've got to be joking me. Talk about Grinch. Talk about Grinch. It's crazy. Couldn't even get a bacon sandwich on Christmas morning. That's harrowing stuff. No, that's actually not fair.

Let her have a bacon sandwich, guys. Well, now I've eaten my fair share of them, so nobody panic. And more. Huh? And even more than a bacon sandwich. And more, yeah, and the rest. Chocolate tart, bring it out, lashings of cream. God, I'd love that.

Yeah, I don't know I just think it makes me sad like thinking of like a little 13 year old wing like on my own in my room and Christmas Day having a McDonald's like that's so sad yeah I was gonna say the McDonald's really I think the McDonald's year was a bit highlights well that if anything I took that as a thing of yes I can get a McDonald's on Christmas crazy do I think that was a thing of, oh yes, I can get a McDonald's on Christmas. Crazy. I think that was the kind of thing of like, I don't wanna say manipulation tactic,

but like kind of like, well, I've got you a McDonald's, so what now? Like almost like don't be ungrateful or like, we've really pushed both out for you here. Got you a McDonald's so big on Christmas, yeah. This is kind of psychotic and this is not your problem, Harry, so don't worry about this. he would send me this person would

send me into school and be like why don't you ask your RE teacher why they pick the 25th of December to have this capitalist holiday when they all know that Jesus wasn't actually born that day doing all these weird like are you pulling all these stunts on a 12 year old girl you psychopath. Like who? But we said like, okay did you just Google that? Like yeah we know. He's honestly. Durrbrain. Death. But anyway.

Literally Durrbrain. But yeah, that, you know, these terrible Christmases I had they weren't forever. Now I have literally the best Christmases ever. And a lot of that is down to my own choosing and my own forcing and my own making because sometimes the world tries to serve you up shit and you think no no send it back to the kitchen. Don't really fancy shit today. That wasn't what I ordered send it back. No that isn't wild actually. Back to the kitchen come up with something else what else on the menu because I'm not happy with that actually and I do think that is a skill in life that you learn over time and try and try and try again and grow the muscle of being able to stand up for yourself and say,

this thing you've served me is not quite what I wanted. It's not going to work for me. No. That's not your lot in life. I feel like sometimes once you're used to something you sort of think oh that's just the way that that is for me and actually realizing I do think that's part of growing up being like actually that isn't what I want for myself and I am allowed to, like I do have free will here and like I can choose something different. I'm allowed to question it. I think as well, yeah I don't know, it's a bit difficult Harry because I don't know. It's a bit difficult, Harry, because I don't know what's going on for you right now, but you know those situations where it's like, that's not normal, actually,

and you can not deal with that, for example. Like if there's someone in your life doing a certain thing or a certain set up, a certain habit that you've got yourself into, where if it's making a negative impact on your life you deserve to be able to like speak to somebody about that and figure that out and get to the other side of that because that's not you don't have to deal with that. Yeah you know I also think like in terms of just like I feel like there's so much

language around like Christmas being chaotic and like family dynamics and blah blah like it's a difficult thing. I also would say to people, if it is like actually hard, like all of that stuff that we just said, like if that applies to you, then like follow that advice. But also I feel like there's another side where it's like, it's actually quite a nice time.

Like if you have a functional family and like it is nice, but obviously there are like a few small arguments, try and be like maybe quite grateful for it. Like I was speaking to one of my friends. Have you considered being fucking grateful? You fucking asshole. I think like there's a bit of a gap. There's a message, yeah, 100%.

Just because there's so, like basically I was speaking to one of my friends about her Christmas and we were like, God, it was just mental blah blah blah. And I like said a story of one of my Christmases ago which got very out of hand. I won't get into it, but it got. Out of hand. I'll say violent.

It got a bit crazy, but like nothing new. It's a thing that I think families with like autism within them If you have that, you know what I mean. It was like very stressful and all of the stuff and One of my friends was like, oh my god Well, I didn't mean that like my uncle was just being like an idiot Yeah, and it's like there's room for both of those things I think because of the language and I'm not trying to be like my Christmas was worse than your Christmas

but we were having the conversation of like because there's so much conversation about like, oh my god, like, my grandma Christmas was just so annoying. I think like, maybe there is room to like, actually enjoy your Christmas. That's the time with your family, you're like amazing. And like, you know, they're your family in a way, in every way. It is actually, and I love my dysfunctional family in every way, but to have that functional family that is like, there's just a few difficult arguments when you're playing fucking Cluedo in the evening. I do think there's no shame in just enjoying that. I think that is really beautiful and like-

Amazing. That is really nice and you can be annoyed at all the stuff that goes on like annoying all really annoying But like god, that's a nice time and I think that's the stuff that I want to really like notice this Year round. Yes. I want to really when the moments are really nice. I do really want to just enjoy them And be like I'm just so lucky to be here with my family and be having a nice moment with them. Agreed. There's a big difference between like, some of the things that me and Sefi have been talking about

about our own experiences when Christmases have been hard and the kind of narratives and like conversations that are also valid around like, yeah, Christmas is difficult, Christmas is annoying, Christmas has highs and lows and all of these things. And I think that's one of the biggest things that has allowed me to have good Christmases now is because I was determined to not get into the habit

of almost the language that I was using around like, Christmas has been really objectively not nice, like abusive, all of these horrible things. And I'm not gonna carry that perspective into Christmases that are like- When they're actually nice. Really nice and there's a few arguments and there's a bit of drama and like someone's annoyed about this and that's so amazing actually. And it's actually a reality for so many people and that's really nice. Oh my god, I mean there's literally what a special, I actually feel emotional about it,

what a special thing in life that you can be around all of these people, there's literally, what a special, I actually feel emotional about it. What a special thing in life that you can be around all of these people and there's like a bit of a drama because this person brought up that thing that happened and oh, this person's so annoying and oh, we can't have them get into the same room because that's blah, blah, blah, blah. All of these things where it's like,

it's just, so lucky to be with a family who's a bit difficult at Christmas Yeah, genuinely, I want to go or shame anyone into like feeling the difficult moment No 100% no like but to be allowed to enjoy it There are those moments and like you know people aren't around forever as well And I think it's like Christmas is a real time that highlights that Because it is this occasion that comes up every year and like it's so family based I do just think fucking lean into it and enjoy as much as you can like if there's any like

Moments that you can enjoy. I just think honestly lean the fuck into it Like that's what I'm gonna be doing. You deserve to have as most as much fun as possible You deserve to have as much time as possible. There deserve to have as nice of a time as possible. There's gonna be a load of shit stopping that from happening. Are you stopping that from happening as well? Maybe. That's the thing that I always have to tell myself is like, so I always say the final boss of my self hatred

and all the things, all the obstacles, all the things in life that are against you, but ultimately no one is better at making you have a bad time than you. Yeah. I think this is a good app. Nice, me too. I would like it. I really like this. Yeah, same. I mean, I could put this for hours.

I feel like I've really enjoyed that, but then it's like this, but then I'm like, is it because I'm in a heated blanket? Like, of course you would enjoy. I might put mine on. Yeah, we've got another to do, so you might as well crank it up yeah I also noticed that you're wearing our merch I have just then as you bent over to do that am I matching with you Harry let me know yeah you can get it on our store what's it called? Cepheanwing.co.uk thank you everyone nice Christmas present for your friend nice Christmas present to yourself yeah very nice very very nice Christmas present to us as well

God, that is the nicest present to us Thanks for being here guys, hope everyone's finding December alright and we'll see you in the next one yeah see you tomorrow no no what is it? yeah I'm just saying we'll let them bring and then what is it again? we say Merry Podmas and a happy new year.

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