Goes Without Saying - healing mothers & daughters: podmas #2

Episode Date: December 14, 2022

on the second day of podmas sephy and wing gave to me... rants about their childhoods that i didn't ask for.join the conversation every monday.shop our merch: sephyandwing.co.ukcome and chat in our book club.speak your mind on the @sephyandwing instagram. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. Nature. I've got a gay rooster named Francois. Is so gay. These rams are gay. I'm studying gay animals. Does that mean I'm gay?

So why don't more people know this? I'm Owen Ever. I'm Lane Kaplan-Levinson. And this is a field guide to gay animals. A podcast about queerness in the natural world. The animal kingdom is queer and we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on Spotify, Apple. Or wherever you get your podcasts.

Acast helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts. ACAST helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere. ACAST.com. Welcome back. Welcome back to Podmas, episode two. Welcome back to Podmas. On the second day of podmas um what can i give you make it rhyme a really cute episode filled with laughter lots of crying and two people at the pier on the oh we're still going on the did you like the bells yesterday that was really good I'm funny and like clever

did you like the bells that went really well from yesterday did you hear the bells I did like the bells did you I did like the bells well I thought

they're going on for a long time ding ding yeah ching ching ching three oh three chings and I was almost like is this going to happen the whole time

are these going to stop at any time it's like how long has she gone with these four but i really liked them okay good nice very festive so happily um received yesterday oh my god what a lovely experience everyone's so happy to hear from us thank you so much to everyone that listened thanks everyone that commented on our post i mean we weren't expecting that level of reaction i was thinking yesterday it's kind of funny because it's like i think you get used to like every monday i know people listen and they look forward to listening to the normal episodes on the monday but i think it put things into perspective for me of like god okay some people really like this podcast some people are like really happy about this which is really nice yeah it's really really nice it was really nice i really like the idea or i can feel

it like from everyone being like oh my god oh my god it was like i know that feeling for other things that i love and we were trying to kind of put it into context for ourselves and we're like imagine if like house of the dragon came out like suddenly said you're getting 12 new episodes at christmas we would have been really excited yeah so we were trying to like be like what would we want like how do they feel right now not to compare ourselves no no never how are you feeling today i honestly like yesterday put me in such a good mood i liked recording i loved the whole experience of like doing the episode and then when the episode went out and everyone was so nice it really like yeah wow i feel so good i woke up in such a good mood and i'm so festive these days you really are i

really am do you want to say what you're wearing and what you're drinking i'm wearing little christmas pajamas which are so cute yeah they really i'm never gonna take them off and i'm drinking out of a really cute christmas mug i'll put it on the story so you can get the gist of what's going on what about you how are you feeling well i woke up in a bad mood i woke up in a really bad mood well like i think i went to bed with a bad mood yeah i think i'm stressed about moving i put you in a bad mood yeah you didn't i think i'm stressed about moving i put you in a bad mood yeah you didn't i think i'm stressed about moving but i just i made a list for myself last night of like everything i need to do and it was like dismantle a bed and things like that and it's like i don't know how to dismantle

a bed even though i did build my bed i don't know how to dismantle it you know when you throw all the shit away you're like i'll never need all the like allen keys and things like that oh you threw it away definitely just i probably it's definitely gone your housemate will have some spare agreed but it's just like i made a list i was in a bad mood i was stressed but then this morning i did some yoga and i haven't done yoga in the fucking ages and i did some and i was like this is good for you like this does make you feel good so weird because i was quite not explicitly like naked but i was really distinctly like explicitly like directly thinking about you and your yoga this morning really yeah because i was thinking life really is about

finding the things that you enjoy yeah because otherwise what's the point as we've discussed many a time and i was just thinking about yoga for you because i don't have i don't like yoga but i know you do and it's just nice. But I also think I fell out of love with it, like, I haven't really done yoga at all in the last year, like, I think I can probably count on my hands the amount of times I've, like, really, like, sat down and done a fucking, like, yoga session, like, got my fucking mat out, and I think I was really associating it with, like, exercise, and I had a bit of a thing with exercise where i was like i don't think i'm someone that can do like exercise i don't think i can run or like unless it's swimming

and some or something that walking that i love anyway i don't think i'm someone that can i don't have a healthy enough relationship to my body that i can be doing like workouts without becoming really unhealthy then i had a really good therapy session about exercise and all of this stuff and i was like you know what you fucking love yoga it doesn't mean you're doing it to boost yet that booty you're not doing that you're not doing that because i don't want to be someone that does that that was exactly what i was picturing of you this morning i was picturing you and squat and actually my sister was talking about this recently with um like boxing my family loves boxing it's a big thing one of my middle names is named after a boxer like boxing is a big thing in my family keep it

quiet what it is it's a weird one being very vague yeah it's a niche one um but like boxing's a big thing in my family and my sister went to a boxing class and she was saying like it's weird because all the men there are like in the ring like sparring and all the girls are there in their like little outfits like squatting by the side of the ring it's like it's not boxing and it's just i think i'm trying to switch the relationship between like i think exercise is marketed to women as like a body toning experience whereas to men men get to actually enjoy the fun of the exercise so i think with yoga and all of this stuff it's like i need to remember that i love the actual thing and completely take it away from like 10 minute yoga routine to boost those arms yeah it's just not for me yeah yeah

anyway that was a little bit for you at the beginning i love it well i think this episode will be uh i think it will be a really nice one it's kind of something that we talk about all the time in life right maybe one of the pillars of our friendship i think pillars of our identity yeah yeah and i think pillars of a lot of people's identity um and just something that i think is all the time we're always like why is no one talking about blah blah blah like like sephie being ill it's like people don't say how bad flu is it's like you know it's bad like god and i think don't remind me yeah but i think like the relationship between mothers and daughters is something that we go on about all the time but it's so much more important than like what society lets on massively i'm so intrigued to

hear what you're gonna say in this because i think me too this is such a big topic for both of us i think and not even like necessarily like our relationships with our mums but just like the concept of like motherhood is this whole yeah fucking deep fucking thing and almost just like women and children like they're just the whole fucking thing um but i as much as i know what you're gonna say like i know your beliefs i know all of you yeah i also i'm intrigued where you want to go with this yeah me too me too i just think it's it's gonna be peak seven win content i think i'm excited i think it's a crux it's so deep in there 100 maybe the crux full cruxes oh the person that birthed you yeah it's a lot it's a hell of a lot okay i would like to kick us off kick it off go on

with a deep convo about something i feel like i have thought about a lot as i've gotten older and something that therapists talk about all the time not just with me but just in life something my friends talk about is our relationship to ourselves and the way that we parent ourselves and the ways that we have to step in to like take care of all of the needs that haven't been met by other people in our lives yeah maybe i'll ask you if you don't mind can i ask you a question yeah one of the ways that you parent your inner child and it works in what way you are good parents that inner child i know this episode is gonna be really

cringe but i'm also so here for the combo yeah it goes out you gotta be yeah we've got bells at the beginning come on this sets the tone straight away it's festive trauma um i think i'm getting better at realizing when i'm like overwhelmed recently um and i think in the past when i've been like in a state of like oh my god like i'm stressed blah blah about i think when i get stressed i can jump into almost quite like a sour mood like almost quite like bitter and resentful and like angry which i hate i hate i hate i hate and actually when you're in that mood what you need to do is not kind of power through is essentially sit down have a cup of tea chill

like essentially what you would do for a toddler and be like have a snack are you hungry are you tired do you want to have a bath like what do you want is your hair band too tight in your hair like really what is going on here um and i think recently i've got quite good at being like almost watching myself as an outsider and being like you feel really fucking shit right now that's not your fault like you you're not some because i almost think when i go into like an like a bitterness like an angry like vibe i then pile on like resentment onto myself of being like that's really bad that you feel like that that's really embarrassing you need to fucking check that like that makes you evil that you feel like that rather than being like if your kid was feeling

fucking angry and sulking you'd be like i fucking sit down it's a human emotion like this not bad so i think i'm better at that now do you think when you were like younger there was something that made you like were your needs not met in that way that when you had maybe different emotions you didn't feel comfortable expressing them or they had to like for example like channeling sadness or frustration into anger or bitterness is that an easier route for you that's really funny because i i actually was speaking to i was speaking to my family about this recently i think that anger is an easier emotion than sadness so i think if something goes wrong my instinct is to be like oh those fucking people fucked it up or like this is so fucked of the world rather than be like i am

really fucking sad about this thing that's happened right now and like i just think it's an easier emotion and i think it's actually sad to cut off the sadness and go straight to anger because it's more like active emotion so i almost feel like it feels more proactive to just be angry but actually it fucks you because you're stuck in almost like a low it's like a very um shallow emotion anger whereas sadness is actually quite deep and like connected to yourself well that's what i was gonna say i feel like it's almost a deflection because i feel like anger you it can be so external and you can project it somebody else's fault and someone else is to blame and it's kind of end of story like no questions are sort of thing like oh they fucked it up whatever like and i'm annoyed you know but if it's sadness it's so

internal and it requires you to think about your own yeah yeah acast powers the world's best podcasts here's a show that we recommend nature i've got a gay rooster named francois is so gay these rams are gay i'm studying gay animals does that mean i'm gay so why don't more people know this? I'm Owen Ever. I'm Lane Kaplan-Levinson, and this is a field guide to gay animals. A podcast about queerness in the natural world. The animal kingdom is queer, and we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on Spotify, Apple.

Or wherever you get your podcasts. Acast helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com. What about you? What? Do you have something like that? I have everything like that. Let me think.

I think something, I've said this this before but something i'm really i think i've gotten so much better at and something that i'm really making an effort to do um and it's one of those things that it's like you kind of always know it like yeah like whatever like it's just one of those things that people say and it's like a bit cliche but when you actually like let it hit sometimes life lessons just you really properly learn them rather than just being like oh i know that everyone is unique for example like you know those things that you like you're supposed to grow up knowing but you don't necessarily feel it i feel like i had a real transition over the past year probably of going from um i had a real transition of thinking that I understood, yeah, love only really can come

from yourself, like you have to support yourself, of course, blah, blah, blah, to really feeling that and knowing it to be true for me in my life, because I feel like I kind of went through the roller coaster of feeling, and as a child, feeling like i couldn't express my emotions that i had to always be just getting on with things or like not making a scene and not ever just though i could never make a demand i feel like i felt like i should never make a demand i'm not saying like yeah oh my god i was so hard done by blah blah blah not at all but i think i definitely felt like i should just get on with things and like sort it out on my own in my own time and like not burden other people with my problems because that is um annoying for

people to be around and blah blah blah and I think I learned over the past year that it was important for me to open up to people that I love and people that love me and get the support from other people and I think through getting support from others it also it was so amazing and it also showed me that ultimately though the biggest form of support has to come from me because if seffy says to me oh my god like let's not record today like you're obviously not feeling good like let's just leave it that still isn't gonna give me what i need if i just say look seffy i don't feel good we're not doing it today yeah there's there's like a firmness that i need of like standing up for myself that i think has been really important yeah it's been really important for me to learn like i don't have

to wait around for someone to notice that i'm not doing good or to offer me up and give you something yeah and give me permission to make me feel better it's like i really really i have no choice but to give that to myself and almost um be a bit i'm sure lots of people would think it's outrageous to just be honest about your needs and and meet your own needs like i think a lot of people have a discomfort with being like you know what i'm not gonna bend over backwards to make this person happy because i need this this and this today i'm not gonna go i'm not gonna do this or i'm gonna see this person because that makes me feel good that's what i want i feel like sometimes you're met with hesitation yeah and i feel like i've really had to learn that having my needs met isn't like

a it's not something that other people would need to do for me i can just do it for myself obviously i need support and like people in my life but i need to have the balls and like the and the commitment of just showing up and being like look i'm doing this my way because it's what i want and it's what i would want for everyone else i would want people to just be up front with me and be like look even i feel like this is sounding ridiculous but even someone being like i'm sorry i'm not in the mood to go to this place for lunch can we just go to nando's that's what i'm in the mood for it's like yes that is exactly how i want to live just like yeah the awareness of your own needs and doing what you have to do

to fulfill them obviously if no one wants to go to nando's then i'm not about to stomp my feet but i just think it's really important for people to be able to back themselves definitely i think that's a really rare skill to have definitely well i think it's something that even my mom and i have this conversation all the time of i'm still trying to convince her that that's something that she needs to have an awareness of of like yeah you're not doing anyone have any favors by pretending that you don't have any needs. Like, you're not doing anyone any favours. There are no awards handed out for going through life pretending that you don't matter.

It actually just makes life harder for everyone around you. Well, it also teaches your kids that that's what they should do. It's like if you see your role model kind of bending over backwards to be kind of a ghost in this world that just kind of puts the food on the table and disappears and has no um needs or life outside of that role i mean it's not a great model yeah and i think as well i really grew up with the kind of sentiment that things should just be brushed under the rug and we should just move on and that's something that i speak to my mom about all the time now because lots of problems that we've had, I'll be like,

look where that got us, that rug that you had. Like, look where that put us. Brushing things under the rug, it just, it doesn't get rid of them. They just wait there and get dustier and dustier when they're eventually brought out and they will be brought out. Unless you're going to die miserable. At some point for me personally, I'll have to bring them them out drudge them back out and get everyone upset and have the argument because i can't live this fake life with people that matter to me do you know what

there's so many things that i see and i'm not even necessarily talking about people in my family for example but like there's so many people that i see in life that have got like even you look at like teachers at school and things like that that clearly have got so much like stuff that's been brushed under the rug like that that's almost like you have got to like a certain age and a lot of your shit has been unchecked for years and i think it's like a real example of okay so we have an opportunity to kind of nip some of this stuff in the bud now. And I think it's needed because I do not want to be fucking 70 still with a load of shit going around my head. Like I know that these people didn't sort it out and that's what happens. There's a quick look at what will happen if you don't sort out how you respond to your friend being successful in

something. Did you act like a fucking bitch to them? I'm seeing this behaviour in old women. Come on, we've got to sort it out then. Yeah yeah or even i think i wouldn't be mad at being an old woman and being a bitch when my friend is successful and then taking a step back and being like shit i was a bitch then that's everything and that's why i think it's even just the yeah the awareness is perfect like you're so there you're so on the right track and i think that is kind of why conversations like these that we're having about like our parents and who we are and all of those sorts of things are so much more common now with our generation because i think we're all having this awareness of shit that wasn't normal or shit that we wouldn't want to repeat yeah and looking at the

older people and being like well it didn't work for you like suppressing all of this shit for generations didn't work for you because the state of it is pretty bad the state of like the world that you've left for us is pretty bad so if we can just change that yeah surely we can leave it slightly better i would love to ask you if there's a thing that has if there's a positive thing of your relationship with your mom that you would want to carry on for your kids if you ever have them definitely definitely i think the kind of culture of my home was one that really really really encouraged um like being yourself and like whatever you are is accepted i think there was really a lot of room even if you're a square some would say that's more in later life oh you're such a square

um and also that's more my dad that calls me a square joking have you seen loads of people like what she's so fleabag like how could you be anyone honestly it's so mad to me like that that really shows me like for example you always say to me is everything you're so whatever you say i'm like you prioritize fun all of this stuff yeah you're so there's something about you that you yeah there's something you know well the thing you always say that's so nice i think my family is so that like and i am if any if anything seen as the most um illusory one yeah like there's i really think that i'm definitely seeing like for example my family's all quite like they're quite into their nudity i would say like they're very free with their bodies

i'm very much considered the angela from the office of the family it's like guys right okay yeah um but like i definitely think in my family there was a real like whoever you are is okay like there was a lot of room for a huge spectrum of emotion that like i really appreciate like there was no there wasn't a lot of shame in my house and i think that was really you are so shameless you are so shameless there wasn't a lot of shame like it's the best thing to be i think there was it was just a real atmosphere of like and still is of like whoever you are on that day you can completely be like um and like be it doing the boring path and like doing the safe thing um is never looked at as like as like oh well done sort of thing like i think there's always um room to like push yourself

more but like in in a quite a loving way which i think i really really really want to make sure that like my family would know like if i was a mother i would want to really instill in my child whoever you are is completely okay yeah and i think it's a feat to you to raise a young girl to be shameless yeah like to raise a young girl around in a culture that there's no shame is so rare and special yeah because also like i think there's a huge confidence with all of the women in my family and i think it's from having i mean i was in my mom was a single mom and me and my sister both have like a quite outrageous confidence and yeah like obviously there are insecurities that play into so much fucking shit i've lived in a bad world like there's crazy shit going on yeah give

her a break guys she's only human guys but there's a level of confidence and i was i don't know who asked me recently like when why do you think you're confident probably you and i remember saying 100 my mum like my mom has like a huge level of like self-belief and confidence that i just directly can link to me and my sister and like our views of ourself as well and i'd want to pass that for sure yeah you have a very innate confidence and i just i can just trace it so directly from like all of the women like then i can go my grandma as well like she has it as well like it's just a very direct line of like um self-belief and like uh self-acceptance of who that is yeah and i just think that's the biggest probably the biggest thing my mum has

given me that's lovely is there anything you would want to pass down or like so many things in your relationship with your mum i think both of my parents something i've been thinking about a lot recently is like i just as a child i definitely felt like the most loved special child in the world like my parents were not shy with their love for me which i think is actually more rare than it should be definitely like i definitely grew up feeling like my parents liked me as a person. They thought I was funny. They found value in like the things I would, yeah, I'm hilarious. They found value in the things that I would create or like they thought I was intelligent. Even if I was like a little five-year-old, like I've definitely felt very secure in their love

for me as a child child i definitely think things changed and things always change like over the years nothing hits like puberty really but i think like i even say about ozzy i'll be like he could never say he wasn't loved yeah like there's my dog but i'm like he like there's no part of that dog that can say oh i'm not sure actually if my mom really likes me that much it's like no you are absolutely adored you're amazing and i think that kind of it all boils down to that but there are a few that i mean there are so many things i think this is actually something that my nan my nan really raised me like my nan was really my day in day out my day one gal and she is hilarious amazing storyteller oh well must run in the family no

surprises there amazing storyteller and she would always be singing reading me stories telling me stories that maybe she was making up i don't know where she was getting these probably the past life that she was talking about just always really like communicating with me as if she gave a shit about what i was saying back and always down to like be a bit silly even if she was really serious yeah bloody hell can you hear this what the fuck was that fucking avalanche i don't know what just happened what was that that's outside santa's on your roof a ton of logs santa's coming down the fireplace you're fucking early mate yeah i feel like my nan really raised me with like a really strong sense of humor and just like ability to turn my nan actually lived like she had a lot

of darkness especially in the beginning of her life and all throughout her life she's been really put through her shit she's obviously the strongest woman i've ever known in my whole life but she's also so hilarious and i think she really really always able to like find the lightness and the humor and like the silliness in really dark things which is something i think is like the most yeah it's the most important thing i think that's a nice place to wrap i think that's the perfect place to wrap and don't want a big sleigh wrap up this present thank you so much for everyone for being here this has been a really good convo i think thank you so much yeah good good okay i'm glad have you enjoyed it loved it so much

luckiest gal in the world to get this combo same well thanks so much for everyone for listening to pod yeah thanks guys we'll see you tomorrow I hope you're having a good um December I hope these are me too coming at good times for you yeah yeah I hope you're feeling good I hope we're um giving you everything you need and more go and have um a little hot chocolate or something hot chocolate yeah stunning cool well if you don't hear from us yeah if you don't hear from us let's think of something everyone was saying big sleigh which i thought was fun big sleigh it's not really a it's not really like a greeting if you don't hear from us big sleigh um yeah we'll work on it come on we're gonna come up with a new pod well we're too into it now that's what i'm saying what you want to come up with a podmas intro outro yeah we didn't get

assumed the worst until like a year and a half in so true so true we milked that for all it's worth who even were we before that i know literally who were what were we doing assuming the best never were we just saying what we're doing just saying bye yeah that's pathetic that's bizarre that's embarrassing how weird is that bye so basic what what did you just say to me when we say when we're beginning them hi rather than games without saying yeah maybe we were hi guys that's everyone yeah let's go let's go right we'll see you next time, okay? Be good.

If you don't hear from us, Big Slay. If you don't hear from us, Big Slay. All of that. What did she say?