Goes Without Saying - how to be confident: challenge level impossible

Episode Date: January 11, 2024

podmothers sephy & wing enter the chat: spiralling on backhanded compliments, body image, surviving identity crises, social anxiety and public humiliation, schmoozing, parties, and kissing boys. not now sweetie, mummy's second-guessing her entire self-worth over one thing someone said to her 7 years ago. ✷shop ✷ www.sephyandwing.co.ukhear more ✷ www.instagram.com/sephyandwingwatch more ✷ www.tiktok.com/@sephyandwing Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Wendy's Small Frosty is the ultimate summer refreshment. And not because it's cool and creamy and made with fresh Canadian dairy. It's also refreshingly cheap. Just 99 cents until July 14th. It's a treat for you and your wallet. ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. Nature. I've got a gay rooster named Francois. Here's a show that we recommend. And this is a field guide to gay animals. A podcast about queerness in the natural world.

The animal kingdom is queer and we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on Spotify, Apple. Or wherever you get your podcasts. ACAST helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com It goes without saying you're listening to Goes Without Saying with Sefi and Wing. I'm Sefi. And I'm Wing. And I think this is one of my favorite episodes we've done in a while.

We're talking about confidence, how to find confidence and what knocks our confidence and how to kind of slowly get it back this is quite funny but also quite heartfelt we definitely go on quite a journey and i think this is one if you just need some really nice company how to feel like yourself oh and you'll you'll see the rest it's really good you'll see the rest that's so sweet you'll hear it rest. It's really good. You'll see the rest. That's so sweet. You'll hear it. That's really cute. Okay. Sorry, I just, I can see the sun setting.

Really? That's nice. Yeah, but it's like, what time is it? How long have I been? 17. It's quite funny if you look in our backgrounds that you've got your shutters closed. I've got my curtains drawn. It's like, why are we such like little hermits because if i do this then you can't really see me i know

well that's why i've got the other one open yeah we've both done the same uh lighting trick of the eye it's an optical illusion it is how are you i'm good i've done my classic move my room around and now i'm feeling great sort of thing it's almost a meme no it's ridiculous it's like a bit that we're doing yeah it's like tied up your space guys it's like I said it was kind of equivalent of midlife crisis getting convertible it's like I just need a little something to spice up my life but it's almost like in a few weeks we're gonna announce and we're sponsored by the cleaning company I don't even know what marie kondo it's like yeah it's like why are we pushing the cleaning angle so much maybe it's a sign of like getting older or

something that like suddenly you're a clean space means something but i also think definitely means something it means i'm not sure what it means but it means something yeah no it's definitely in a way that it didn't it's control as well i think for me i think it is it's like god look at this power i have yeah power over um that i can use over the kitchen and i'm taking it out on dust yeah it's like fuck you dust bizarre yeah i love it um any any any oh uh you know what we're gonna say cambridge cam. Cambridge. I love how we're promoting Cambridge more than... More than anything. We have like merch out and stuff like that, but it's like come to Cambridge.

More than anything we've ever... No, but I would love to see you there. We would love to see you. We haven't made it clear. It means more to us to see you than anything. Oh, no, literally more than anything. Yeah, more than anything. I'll be thinking about it for years to come.

Yeah. So come to Cambridge. We're speaking at Cambridge University on the 23rd of january 2024 uh-huh in a mere couple weeks few weeks yeah i don't know if there's so in a couple of you'll hear more you'll hear more okay you'll hear some more we just got our questions through that we're going to be asked on stage i'm trying not to read them too much because i don't i want to be like i don't want to be too rehearsed well it all started when well i also i pretty much like you kind of just sent me a screenshot of them even though i would send them as well i just didn't know the exact same but but i go i

received this from wing um and i just kind of had a skim through and i think that's as far as i'll look because i'm always best first go like off the cuff the more i read something and prepare the worse it gets i'm hoping maybe if you guys come down to cambridge and we see you there that you could ask your own questions perhaps i'm hoping there's a bit at the end well if not we'll be hanging around i'm sure yeah we'll be loitering we'll be um heckle us we'll be kicked out by the end the last thing they do they the last thing we did at manchester uni they actually had to move us out because so many people came and we were like loitering in the lobby chatting to everyone and they just like move us that was

which was my eyes out crazy amazing um right well we won't bore you too much, or will we? Who knows? Today, we're talking about... Oh, this is weird. Confidence. Hey, that was nice. That was fun. God, never done that before. No, never. Should we do it through the whole web?

How are you feeling today with regards to confidence? That was a terrible sentence. How are you feeling today in regards to confidence? With regards to confidence. Yeah, I'll ask you then. How are you feeling today with regards to confidence? With regards. Please

the Lannisters send their regards. With regards. I think I'm feeling okay with regards to confidence i would hope so maybe could you answer in the spotify thing there's like a question we ask every app maybe we could ask how are you feeling today in regards to confidence and maybe you could reply i would love to know i check those answers every day what about you too they're addictive addictive yeah they are it's we're good we're in conversation i know i love to see people like writing their little things and it's so nice how do you think your confidence has changed over the past year i think it's grown a lot uh-huh i actually also think i've had a bit of a dip

recently oh okay yeah not nice i think what what kind of recently well in the last like three or four days genuinely i think it's because my period's imminent oh well there we go it is imminent because wings got me tracking my period at the moment and we're kind of we're kind of not cycle thinking we're you kind of preempt you're the precursor to mine yeah i'm the precursor i'm often ovulating when wing like we've got a cycle going within ourselves which is always in great balance it's always in perfect harmony yeah we are in perfect harmony harmony um but yeah no it's my periods in two days and i'm i'm aware my body is telling me um which is nice because i usually i never track my period at all yeah and i think my commiseration yeah

exactly wing usually tells me your periods in a few days she's tracking my period i've got my eye which is nice that someone is yeah so my period is always always always a surprise every single time for the last however many years i've had my period 15 years whatever um so i think it'd be nice to realize this time that it's like oh i feel really shit blah blah and i think usually i would just be like i just feel terrible blah blah but now it's like oh i actually know that that's why i can really um feel that my period is due and i do think in the last few days i felt a little bit insecure and yeah and kind of internal and a bit like sensitive and I think quite like down on myself a little bit. Kind of the mind plays tricks.

The mind has been playing tricks, I think, for sure. And I did a meditation last night as i was going to sleep looks like lying in bed and it was like the woman just said something i was like that's exactly how i feel she was like if you felt that you have like turned on yourself recently and i thought that's how i feel i feel like i've kind of just in the last few days I just turned on myself and I just suddenly I was all thought I was great doing all my thing then just something switched and I just went no you're doing badly you need to fucking sort this out it's a mess and I can I can acknowledge the fact that it probably is my period that's done it and

I'll feel okay in two days when it finally comes not that it's late it's literally on kit on right on key yeah don't be worried guys don't be worried wings tracking it's on schedule everything's running everything's running just as it should this was all in the plan but it's still when the mind is playing tricks the tricks look pretty real i mean that's the crux yeah that's kind of it though i do think it's but i do think i've turned on myself in the last few days but i'll turn back around it'll be fine yeah and then i'll turn it back on again and all of that are there kind of things that you feel yourself doing when you feel the confidence slipping that are like negative and destructive towards you and other things that

you do when you feel the confidence slipping to like help i think i can do both i think i get very out of tune with or not even out of tune i get quite neglectful of myself when like i was lying in bed yesterday so in bed so much honestly get this girl out of bed grandpa joe i know genuinely because i've got a heated blanket yeah so fucking nice i highly recommend um but i could feel myself getting hungry hungry hungry and it was before dinner time actually was about dinner time and i was like right okay i should probably go and make something blah blah blah getting hungry hungry hungry and it was about sort of two hours before i was like

i'm going to go and make food now like i it's almost like you can feel yourself putting yourself through pain essentially being hungry is not a nice feeling and i hate that feeling why am i prolonging that when it would all it would take is me to go downstairs make something eat something then then that's done but for some reason i can just feel myself not taking care of basic needs needs also like the anger and the frustration like i feel like i'm only just realizing like like i'm only just realizing that hello that when you're angry you're when you're angry when you're hungry you're fucking miserable like so sad yeah or like it's literally kind of like if you need a wee it's like yeah you're gonna be distracted and like anxious there's a need your sims bar is red what's wrong with me

and i'm waving at the camera so so help me out yeah i've definitely been thinking that recently like um soul soul soul soul soul we're speaking your language guys shout out to the sims out there honestly love the sims oh it's painful good the love is so real but yeah i've been really thinking about like um i think recently yeah i've not been feeding myself on schedule i don't think i've been feeding myself but probably a few hours too late um and i definitely have been like oh my god i just feel like shit i feel like shit and then i eat and i'm like oh no i feel fine it's like yeah it literally was you were starving hungry what are you doing i think because it's we kind of forget that there are like there's a psychological impact to hunger as well. Yeah. Also, when I say hunger, I don't...

I feel like it sounds, like, really sinister. Like, it's not, like... It sounds like you're starving yourself. Which I'm definitely not. I'm just a lazy person. Just, like, your stomach's rumbling, hungry. I'm just, like, a bit hungry. I just want to make that clear.

Because also, I think, like, if we're not talking in those terms, I don't think we're at all qualified to be talking in terms of, like yourself in any way so yeah we'll just say no go eat something please oh my god and actually i would say there was a podmas episode that we did um not that we're qualified in that one either yeah this podmas where we spoke about food and it's called something something food something something you'll find it look for the word food food yeah um and i loved that episode and it actually made me emotional editing it and i loved it when we were recording it and then i loved it even more seeing like all the spotify messages about it like i think a lot of people like that episode so if food is an issue for you what was it um what was said that made you emotional it was just really sweet like yeah

it was just it really felt like we were all there holding hands and like my favorite that's my favorite thing yeah give me your hand that's what we're gonna do at cambridge guys oh i'd love to but i wouldn't i would did we do a group hug at the last one uh god that's crazy if we did it's really weird of us i sort of have a vision we won't we would never i just want to make it clear like sorry to bring cambridge back up it's not going to be the the kind of environment we would never do this to you where like we're not going to like pick pick it's not that kind of event we're like we're going to pick you out and like make you say something i just want to make that really really clear like you can come and like slip in the back and like oh my god you don't say a word just come and watch and then go yeah and we're there with

you you're not going on your own you're we're you're with us i mean i'm probably gonna stutter my words i'm gonna be so nervous but i just want to make like almost like i was like oh i've got no one to go with oh yeah no no it's not no no just come in just slip in the back we'll be there anyway every event we ever do yeah to be the sort of thing you can go to on your own because i think people that i mean podcasts are very personal and i remember having issues before when i went to go and see my dad at a porno live i saw them twice live and i remember being like You saw them live again when we went to an ink art event. And then we saw them in real life, in the flesh. We went to this party thing.

Went to like an office do. We went to the work Christmas party and we were there for some reason. When we walked in, the guy said, the coolest people here have just arrived. And it was us. And then we got overshadowed because we got there early. Well, we actually haven't. I know this isn't isn't on topic guys but we've never told the story about you've been smooching we've been smooching with someone both of us someone big guys like that's uh this is like is all she goes on about place your bets who are we talking about

like what does no because it's a show what's the the show? What's the show that she can't resist? Because it's so relevant to everything. She can't resist bringing it up. Let's just say it now. Should we tell the story? Yeah, go on. It's about confidence in a way, guys. We were at this party, Acast party.

It was... Can we say Acast party? Of course we can. It's not a secret. Am I going to get get sued is that illegal am i going to jail podcast people like we a cast is our provider yeah we got there who walks we were there just smoothing about humble okay we're kind of the only sort of podcasters here i think we were getting schmoozed like nobody's business it was a lovely time somebody walked in that

overshadowed us immediately oh by a million miles the star of made in chelsea jamie lang himself creator of candy kittens husband to sophie husband to sophie habu aka habs from made in chelsea who i love we immediately were like to our manager go go go like we need basically i saw as soon as he walked in everyone suddenly thought how can we get into that conversation my heart's actually fluttering thinking about it just because it's crazy to me that it's like within the space of a week or two we knocked out like this is like seven top ten people louis through and jamie lang shortly hardly like it was i know the minute i saw him i thought god the energy in the room just everything shifted planets were moving we were the only podcasters in the room

up to that point then someone walks in like that it's like okay jesus christ everything's back i'll get my things i'll get my bag i'll show myself up don't worry but somehow we managed to put ourselves in the center of the action our manager doing her best work she's she's the got us in before we know it he's introducing himself to us saying hi guys i'm jamie crazy on both cheeks he kissed us twice each that's four kisses made in chelsea style four kisses on each cheek from jamie no one kiss on each cheek. Jesus. Four kisses on each cheek. No, I mean, four kisses. We'd be there all night. For each of our cheeks.

Other side. Yeah. That's a ton of kisses. Move on. Four kisses between us. Yeah. What a wonderful time. But then his friend said to him,

should we go out for a cigarette? And he took him away from us. Yeah, which is fair. It's fair enough. Which is, honestly, who can blame? I do think Jamie was intrigued by us for a moment. I think he was as well. And then we were talking to his producer.

Very interesting. Yeah, she was great. I called her God, but that's a story we're not into anymore. I called her God. You called her God? Do you remember we were like because you were like god you're you were like you're really schmoozing you're really schmoozing and i was like yeah because you have to work you're like excited you're basically god is that how it's like it's

i was like just compliment them just like really ask them about themselves like just get them talking about themselves and then we came away from the conversation i was like i think it's more than that i think you have to call them god and i was like i don't think you do you remind me of someone it's kind of like god oh my god i think you're i think you're the creator of all being yeah god herself i also then i saw next stars walked in my dad wrote a porno yeah two of them jamie and james i believe their names are they're all jamie's going around in this room oh those balloons honestly so i have that facetime thing where like if you do like like a hand movement it does balloons it's really

embarrassing it's all jamie lang balloons oh congratulations confetti the most embarrassing is if you do kind of a rock on symbol um lasers come out of the screen that's that's a cool one she's cool that's a bad one um but my dad wrote a porn over there i was umming and ahhing do i go and say hi to them and then someone dropped a load of macaroons all over the floor oh god yeah there were macaroons everywhere everywhere and i i remember saying should we pick them up and then eat them and shock everyone you were like no like that would be a shock should we just go crazy clean them all up and then start eating we were i think there was such a thrill at like being in an event that we could not we weren't supposed to be at but it's like god you guys work here and we don't we don't go

here it's kind of oh i've gone to the prom of a different school i can just embarrass myself like it felt like oh i can just be really dumb and guess who goes to this school jamie jayme lang goes here crazy was it confidence though that was an exercise in confidence i think oh definitely let's bring it right back yeah it was an exercise in confidence absolutely and you had this issue with my dad that you couldn't go on your own i did and i remember thinking i don't want to go on my own so embarrassing and i remember because i was young at the time i was probably like 18 um i there was a girl that i worked with at the time that also liked them and i went with her then i went with another friend a few like a year later because she booked tickets another girl i

worked with um but i remember being so stressed out because it's like i love this podcast so much i have a like internal relationship with these people and it feels weird to like get someone to come with me that kind of has yeah oh i've've listened once or twice, blah, blah, blah. And I think it's so nice to go with those people. And it's ideal if your friendship group is brought in or at least a friend or a sibling or whatever is brought in on it as well. But more often than not, anyone you consume online is like quite an individual relationship. And it's so sacred. I would really want to have the kind of shows hopefully i would

love us to do like a tour at some point in our lives and things like that and i always want everything we do to be the sort of thing where you can go on your own that's what i feel like but you're not on your own though because you've we're there as well oh you know people there yeah so i think we are gonna be there perfect yeah you're sorted exactly um okay should we dig into some so we asked on the story sephie and wing if you don't know that yeah we're looking good on instagram by the way i will say we're looking great we did these photos in a photo booth and god we're milking them almost by accident yeah it was just like a fun thing to do uh-huh when we went before you know it we've got a whole new look yeah honestly and as soon as we saw them we thought that's it that's us that's us for the year let's do it again actually yeah let's definitely do

maybe let's try and find a photo booth in cambridge yeah does anyone in cambridge know a good photo booth that would be nice that's a good question also anywhere nice to eat because we're staying the night we'd love to oh no we're having a formal dinner we are with the host the leaders of cambridge university the leaders i don't know who it is someone's invited us for a formal dinner oh god the dean i don't know how formal i can be not the day the dean and the bursar dean highbottom oh god um oh god okay people said basically in cambridge do you know a good photo booth or maybe breakfast place or something yeah breakfast um so we asked can we come around for breakfast huh i said can we come around for breakfast honestly that would

be great that would be nice that would be so nice um we asked what knocks your confidence quite a harrowing um quite an annoying question it's like jesus guys give it a rest so fucking tuesday afternoon i'm trying to have a nice time should i just reel some off because i feel like it's good to get a um a gist a gist okay this is the one i thought people would say the most someone said toxic social media trends, brackets, with the beauty standard. Seeing someone do something that I can do, but they're doing it way better. And someone else said when I'm not good at my thing. That's a tough one, I think.

When you identify as good at something and you feel yourself kind of failing at it, whatever that means. Getting cancelled on. My acne, bad pics yeah gosh commiserations to all our friend jade has said when i come on my period lol how weird jade jade agree you're always right there with us jade always correct always right what knocks your confidence i would love to know i would say all of the above yeah all of that definitely all of that is hitting with me personally well something we wanted to talk about you had quite a nice sort of angle to this which i really like that we're talking about someone's message what was that message though it said um it was something along the lines of guys by the way a couple of episodes ago there

was a snap crackle pop happening on my end i don't know if you remember and i've realized it was because i had my phone out not that i wasn't paying attention but like i had my phone out during the recording yeah so then was feedback so now i am anxious to look at the responses during the recording while my mic is on because I don't want to affect the audio. ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. Nature. I've got a gay rooster named Francois.

Is so gay. These rams are gay. I'm studying gay animals. Does that mean I'm gay? So why don't more people know this? I'm Owen Ever. I'm Lane Kaplan-Levinson. And this is a field guide to gay animals.

A podcast about queerness in the natural world. The animal kingdom is queer and we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on spotify apple or wherever you get your podcasts a cast helps creators launch grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere a cast.com but that's fine because the roles can just reverse because i usually have my phone like it's dead or it's downstairs or something so now i can just be the reader well i'm gonna recall it from memory which will be yeah i can look i'll butcher it yeah maybe you'll go on why don't you

just look it up no why don't you just look it up in your mind yeah so in my mind it's saying something like what knocks my confidence is when people kind of you found it haven't you no okay yeah the idea of you having to like wrap through sort of a library of your mind looking through my files made me laugh um i've got it stored away here it was basically someone saying what knocks their confidence is when people give them not even unsolicited advice but just like um unwarranted feedback for example you look tired today that's nice thanks why don't you just fuck things like that how about go fuck yourself literally oh my god i was actually feeling really perky so fuck you what's wrong with you that's actually like surely in 2024 we can all

agree saying to someone you look tired is a fucked up thing to say surely i found myself saying this to someone it was someone i was dating and i said it on facetime you said they look tired i was like god you look tired and my friend was in the other room and she shouted because i was sort of it was a facetime with someone when i was at someone else's house a bit of a weird dynamic she was working at the time and i heard her shout that is so fucking rude and i was like god i'm so sorry that really was i was like i don't mean to sound like someone's kind of mum it is a bit of a mum thing yeah it is it did look like but you were you know i did i did i caught my well she caught me and then i thought god that was insane of me i'm so sorry well there's a level of affection that can come with like you

know please look after yourself no but i wasn't really saying it like that god what got into you i was just being like jesus like as soon as he answered the thing like you know but it is don't you think 2024 surely it's one of those things we actually always have this conversation we were recently having this conversation in wagamamas we were saying oh god sometimes do you remember we went from starving hungry hungry to like yes why are we always hungry but i remember we were we were waiting for our food to arrive and we were like you were like sorry i can't talk to you anymore i was i'm not even looking at you at this point i'm looking around the room for food it's like i'm gonna start scavenging on the floor that was insane

but then yeah that was like i felt ill afterwards we really go we ate a lot we did yeah i love it hit exactly how it needed oh my god it's perfect and the conversation was delightful the company was great we were having this conversation which is a conversation that we have had time and time again as we do with all of our stuff is just diluted regurgitated just the same lukewarm takes i think that's life i honestly think that's what life is the only way um but we were having a conversation of how sometimes people will say something under the kind of guise of like that's not offense that's not an offensive thing to say and it's like guys like you they kind of play ignorant and it's so like bad faith to kind of be you remind me it's like if i said to you you remind me of like just oh my god i've told this

on the podcast before so i was gonna say you remind me of donald trump which you don't it's just a funny thing to say. I mean, I'd love to know how I did. And it's like, oh no. Well, that is kind of like objectively offensive, but you get what I'm saying. I remember once, and I've told this story, I'm sure I told this story on the podcast because it just,

it actually shook me to my core in a way that I think, it was just so, I'm not, I'm obviously not over it. I don't even know what to say because i'm even scared to say it now in case people people start getting that idea of me do you know what i mean well yeah i completely know what you mean but go so it was in my third year of uni and i had this tutor and i have spoken about him before and i feel like when we this isn't spunky it is spunky yeah really yeah but not that he called me spunky not that not that but

the same that's fine the same guy though it's nice that he called you spunky he said my writing it's just also a weird word to use because you know the connotations you know about my writing style no i know but it's like just don't use the word spunk it wasn't yeah no it wasn't spunky it was spunk it's like you're gone actually when i think about it it's like you wanted to come all over me you wrote on winged essay your writing style is full of spunk and soon you will be too really well there was this kind of weird he was almost a bit young not too young but like he was a bit young he's kind of in his 30s i guess it could have it could happen it couldn't happen guys but it kind of so clear in his world it could and in my world it

could too if it meant that my dissertation would have been received better but anyway yeah he wrote that on my dissertation your writing style has flair and spunk why are we talking about spunk you have to have an awareness as a man writing that word to a girl on a girl's work i'm only 21 awareness that there is a double meaning of the word spunk balloons i said double meaning i put two fingers up and then fucking balloons the comedic timing of that was so perfect i need to turn it off i think at the time i actually now that i think about it more the the spunk line is feels more extreme than it did then it's actually a bit weird because we were young and naive and we thought he he he doesn't know what that means no no i thought he didn't know what it meant but

like almost like yeah you're right he's got spunk yeah cool that's that's a nice thing to say but now i'm like guy i'm not gonna say your name because i don't remember it you there were so many words you could have used but you chose spunk it's just it's a it's a choice it's just it's intriguing anyway that wasn't what he said that bothered me um yeah believe it or not what he said that bothered me was i had gone in again to speak about my dissertation and i was yeah it was actually the um it was like politics in power demagoguery and i was yes the demagogue the demagogues i wasn't in it i just heard about no you heard about it from me going on i got secondhand education from wayne and my dissertation was going to be on like a history of emotions take on donald trump and like his power and his demagoguery sort of thing stunning yeah not bad i think love it and he actually was the one who introduced the this is why it bothers me so much

because he was the one who introduced the idea of history of history of emotions to me he was like that's an interesting angle you could take like that's some interesting historiography that you could use the history of emotions that's a nice lens here. I love that, yeah. To Donald Trump. Yeah, use the word emotions. Oh God, I'm already crying. That sounds perfect. I'm emotional.

Yeah, I can talk about the history of emotions. That's fascinating. Well, cut to every single office hours, he would be like, yeah, I just don't think the history of emotions angle is going to work. And I'd be like, so why the fucking fucker who hell did you introduce literally introduce it to me i've never heard

of such a thing in fact yeah until you brought it to me for this specific reason anyway so i said i really want to do it on donald trump because he's the biggest demagogue of all time i am i and in this office hours i am getting to the point guys i promise he said to me and what i perceive as him completely misreading me it couldn't have been more misreading in fact because i was going in if you can imagine i'm going into every office hours being so people pleasing so sweet and so like i can hear your voice right that you're doing like i'm ready to be told that i've got spunk and that's it i'm looking for spunk i'm not looking for an argument absolutely not looking for i'm not looking for an argument and i'm not looking to um fight my case either it's like

if i go in and you just want to be kind of liked and him to like your work totally it that's the power i'll give some ideas sure but really i would prefer if he told me his ideas and i could feed them back to him that's what i wanted i'm not coming here like i mean i hate that but but i was coming that is that dynamic i was i couldn't have been more receptive to what he wanted if anything i just wanted what he wanted because that would have got me a good grade. And I did get a good grade. But anyway, not without being called Theresa May. Wait, in what context? He said, you remind me of Theresa May. Right?

Guys, in the height of her power, by way which wasn't that much power god can we just for the international listeners here yeah go on you describe describe me the fuck describe me apparently because it was a blip in history political time um she was the prime minister of the conservative party probably whilst we were at uni yeah for a moment like a short period of time it's a bit of a similar situation none of them do yeah yeah none of them do they've just been hanging on by thread but she had she was the second ever female prime minister yeah after margaret thatcher who was famous didn't go down too well i must say um god my heart's racing

theresa mate there was definitely an embarrassingness to her she was she's a joke she's yeah no she was definitely considered a big fat joke it's not a nice thing it's not a night no you know my political leanings guy so that aside, it was her movement, even. Everything about her is bad. The style, everything. What she stands for, who she is, how she does it. She's like a fucking 60-year-old woman. I'm spunk.

Who am I to you? I honestly think he was negging me. You know, negging. I actually think he was trying to put me down a hundred theresa may is insane in what way i'd love to know so he said which again honestly what knocks your confidence that's insane it's absurd that's insane i actually forgot that i'm kind of remembering that with its full power theresa may oh i don't even know what i said but anyway so rude he's also got like an irrelevance attached to it now especially it's like what that's a fucking joke but at the time it's like

no you remind me of the leader of the conservative party you remind me of the prime minister theresa may so anyway he said basically and this is this the way he backed it up or the way that he was using it makes it even like weirder because it just couldn't have been further from the truth in my opinion he said so i had kind of come to him and said i'd literally said probably word for word i'll do whatever you think like if you think this is a shit angle i'll do whatever you think like if you think this is a shit angle i'll do whatever you think like i whatever you think is going to be a better dissertation i'll do like i'm not um so but how's i'm not clinging to an idea right he said then weirdest response he said you remind me

of theresa may you know like she's got these lines of like she's determined to do something determined i couldn't to be honest i couldn't be less determined that's not what she did anyway you idiot it's bizarre almost history teacher stuck in the past she doesn't know what's going on like oh she's naive to what's good for her sort of thing oh my god he's an idiot i'm like i'm coming to you i'm crawling on my knees to your office hours do you know how hard it was first of all for me to even show up to these office hours you know how hard that is for a young girl to turn up yeah honestly and you call me theresa may harrowing and i've been rebuilding my confidence ever since that is a mad one because i must just say like in no way i know you very well thank you and in no way yes in no way thank you ever ever reminded me even slightly

even in the slightest way he'd obviously just watched the news seen her face and you walked in he was like i don't know why i'm seeing that's devastating no that is devastating i couldn't be less like her in fact no genuinely guys i'm so embarrassed she's like a weird she's running through fields of wheat that's all like she's killing poor people that's all she's doing i've never ever once in my life killed a poor person i wouldn't be caught dead should i kill myself mental mental crazy thing to say when i'm literally anyway anyway anyway so that did knock my confidence yeah that is a knock it is a knock but going back to what we were saying about and it is kind of the thing that we were saying in waggers of like people will say things

under the guise of like oh i didn't mean it like that it almost invalidates your feelings like you're made to feel like you can't have a reaction in life i think i think also with like for example someone saying you're like theresa may it got it you can have a negative reaction to that because that's obviously you can't in that context at all but like it everyone can agree that it's a horrific person the ones that i find are more kind of sinister yes are the ones where it's like that person isn't ideal it's not really how i see myself but i can't really snag off that person yes like that one is one where it's like i definitely what we were talking about in my mamas was some messages that

it was a message that i got probably two and a half years ago yeah it was ages that someone had said that i looked like someone and i would just put a psa out now just i don't think we should be telling anyone who people look like like it's just a it's a risky game to be honest there is a risk there there definitely is because you are never going to know the way that someone wants to look or the anything like that um but someone had said i look like someone should i just say who it was because it was quite a way it was it was a toddler it is it's a toddler it's bizarre yeah someone had said look if you're if you're listening to this i hi thank you understand where you're coming from it just hit me in a weird way it's more my problem than yours but someone had said that i looked like the little kid that

wrapped super bass on ellen do you remember this kid who wore a little tutu and she sang super bass she knew every word and her little sister was there like doing nothing in the background ourselves in this episode it's quite embarrassing no completely but that one is again like almost a hesitant to say because it's like i don't want people to be like yeah you do like that fucking little no no no no no no i think it's more so like i think we should make it really clear we're not insulting her in any way i'm not insulting a toddler i'm more just saying it's not necessarily how i see myself how i want to be perceived and not necessarily who i want as my look like a little baby in a tutu singing this one for the boom with the boomers is like not necessarily what i want for myself

it's crazy and the weird thing was it was on our we had a discord it was on there and it had like quite a few thumbs up and it just made me think like like you probably had like three thumbs up but it was like it's just not the sort of thing i need to see, because it's not something I can come back and be like, oh my god, that's outrageous, it's out of order, she's a crazy bitch or something. It's like, it's a little kid. It's a little kid, and there's nothing wrong with this little kid looks. But I, at the time, was like a 23-year-old woman.

It's like, it's not necessarily what I want. So I would just say, and there's been funny i see it all the time with people telling people they look like people that's like not necessarily they won't look like so i just would be wary if you're saying someone you look like this person i think as well like even just generally even if you're not comparing someone directly to anybody else even just and i don't know if it's as clean or like i don't know like everyone comments on people all the time to their face behind their back whatever and i often i'm i literally today said sephi your hair looks great but thank you and it

and it still does i still mean that thank you so much yours looks great as well i also yeah you did throw it straight back to you yeah you did throw it straight back thank you so much that's great thank you um but we comment like i comment to people's faces on their appearance all the time in a complimentary way but i think have the awareness of anything you say about someone else's appearance to them could be not what they want to hear and definitely it's just a risk every single time so just have the awareness i think i know we all do and also then have the awareness when anything gets fed to you just know like realistically it actually doesn't mean anything about you it truly doesn't that's one of the things that i've really realized um as i've kind of um i would honestly say like healed so much of my body image yeah issues

actually congratulations thanks i really do feel in a completely different space than i have been in literally years probably since puberty but i have been noticing that when people say things as they always do like but people recently weight has always been a sensitive subject i don't i used to be like people don't tell me anything not even a compliment tell me nothing i don't want any feedback at all from anyone which i don't really feel like that anymore but it's also like my standard is to not give anyone any feedback on their weight i find that a very odd thing yeah that's i just think generally that's please just nobody i think that just goes without saying yeah um but recently i've encountered two people who have both been completely incorrect but that have said to me have you lost weight have you lost weight you look like you've lost weight and my reaction both

times have been like no i never have gained any i've never lost any i've always been the same pretty much since i was a kid i've actually my body has not changed and both of the people have fought me back on it no no you have you have no no you have oh god you definitely have and both times i've had to like almost fight the case of my body and be like i haven't i haven't lost any and if i had it wouldn't make me feel good it wouldn't make me feel bad my body will change throughout my life but right now trust me hasn't changed and there is something so jarring about having to fight the case of your body and i don't particularly care to prove anything but i find it

odd that people offer up that like almost as a compliment you've lost weight and it's like yeah mate i could be dying like you don't know what that just offering that up like it's a casual compliment you don't know shit about what weight means that's really weird for someone to say yeah first of all to say you've lost weight and then be like no i haven't but then argue with you and your body that's really interesting no trust me that's almost jarring because it's like are you questioning my ability to see myself and almost like are you questioning my relationship to who i am like you think you know me and my body more than me myself more than me there's nothing you know more than me but also it's like as if it's supposed to boost me up in some way and i i think that's the bit that i was

really keen to challenge in both these people of like you're offering what you think is a compliment and i'm turning it down actually yeah i don't accept your compliment it's not true it's um weird to me that you're offering that as like a positive thing and to be honest i'm not a part of that i'm not a part of your well i think that's the good thing as well is that probably then in re i for i guess some sort of bias but i would say an educated bias and picturing maybe a slightly older demographic and yes definitely and i do think both from different age demographics though different generations which is it's like god this shit spans generations oh yeah um but i like the

idea of it being met with resistance from you yeah and now it will be something that they'll be like oh i'm not gonna bother saying that now because you know it wasn't they they think i'm mental well they do think you're mental yeah i'm sure'm sure they do. They thought I was cocky, I think. Because I was like, no, never have, never will. That's weird. I think they thought it was like a bit sort of arrogant. Like I don't need their thing. But it's just I don't actually.

And I didn't ask for it. I don't want it. Well, I think it will make them... It could make people second guess more in the future saying it to other people even even if they don't understand it at all they might just be like i'm not going to bother saying that because it doesn't land very well yeah and it's like and i don't care to understand why or what that comes from or what that might mean or what that means about me and my beliefs and any of that none of that understanding and education

and growth or whatever has to happen as long as it means that someone else doesn't get that same messaging given to them then that's an improvement yeah agreed agreed but also congratulations for you i would like to just go back and be like congrats imagine i was like congratulations on losing weight i mean congratulations on saying that your relationship to body image has changed yeah no i completely feel a completely different space and i yeah i'm loving it i'm actually really enjoying my relationship with my body at the moment divine different that's amazing though that's actually like yeah that's incredible yeah no i actually i'm really feeling it at the moment divine different that's amazing though that's actually like yeah that's incredible yeah no i actually i'm really feeling it at the moment that makes me feel happy yeah no definitely it's and i do actually think just in terms of actually get a lot of messages being like like i probably just more for all of this stuff i think it's really shown me that the key the key for me anyway was like stop looking at

like almost like the academics of understanding things and like the logical world and actually just listen to your body and that has been the absolute key for me and actually getting in touch with myself yeah and just it is actually possible to genuinely feel good about your body like in quite a sustainable way i remember us with this is something we've said to each other over and over again in so many different ways one of us will say i don't think it's possible to get better from this and the other one will say yeah no you can yeah like you definitely definitely can and it's so that thing of when you're in it and it feels like you're literally at the bottom of like a long old drain in salt but

it's like you're you feel so miles and miles and miles away from the light but start crawling slowly but surely like there is yeah it there is always better more everything yeah i completely agree and yeah we're giving you that message now with some we always need it one of us is always needing it so yeah definitely giving that message you can of course it actually can believe in you guys good yeah all right is this one of my favorite episodes of all time of the year oh wow so many to choose from so many to choose from um thanks guys yeah thank you so much for our date and also um we have merch wing has designed absolutely incredible merch do you still like the new look because i do you're

talking to me talking to all of us i guess talking to the guy i absolutely love it and i don't think i ever see that changing i feel really strongly about it it's absolutely divine um but go buy our merch go look at our logo yeah on your phone right now admire us it's on your phone if you click the button on your phone you can see it now admire us from afar beautiful right we're sending love sending so much love you probably just

don't even believe that like what a ridiculous thing like imagine you're just on your walk or whatever it's like oh these podcasts send me love yeah right no we genuinely do

I've got my hands up in the air yeah sending you feeling it bang they got it you got it boom alright

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