Goes Without Saying - how to glow-up: sad bitch to bad bitch

Episode Date: July 6, 2020

ready for the princess diaries makeover your 12-year-old self always dreamed of? in this episode of Goes Without Saying, we (sephy & wing) are discussing 'glow-ups', and why women are encouraged to transform themselves for the male gaze. can a makeover ever actually be empowering? why do we all feel pressure to change ourselves? join us in this episode to unpack the patriarchal undercurrent of makeovers and explore how capitalism wants us all to hate ourselves. # just girly things x speak your mind on our instagram! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Wendy's Small Frosty is the ultimate summer refreshment. And not because it's cool and creamy and made with fresh Canadian dairy. It's also refreshingly cheap. Just 99 cents until July 14th. It's a treat for you and your wallet. Hi guys, welcome back to Higher Priestess. I'm Erin. And I'm Persephone.

And today we're going to be talking about glow-ups. But before we get into it, I wanted to share some news with you. Oh my god, I can't wait. I'm Persephone and today we're going to be talking about glow ups but before we get into it I wanted to share some news with you. Oh my god I can't wait I don't know what this is. This is hot off the press I don't think I mean this is literally like about two hours ago this came out. Oh wow. I'm very on the ball when it comes to news about Kenny Ortega. I don't know who that is. Oh my god okay so Kenny ortega is the the mastermind behind high school musical oh wow okay i'm in dirty dancing cheat girls 2 got it got it got it all the classics that's extra funny actually because this morning i was saying this to jack so this is an article

that came out probably about three hours ago now and this this morning I said it to Jack, oh my God, so you know Kenny Ortega? And he said, yeah. And I was like, do you? And he said, yeah. I said, who is it then? He said, the guy from High School Musical. I was like, the guy from Cheater Girls 2. Oh, okay.

Yeah. That is hilarious. I was like, wow. All right, impressive. Kenny Ortega has done an interview with Variety. This isn't necessarily good news. It's just interesting yeah there's much to get into he's broken his silence

and he in it they ask about so it's for pride i think quite interestingly the headline is something along the lines of kenny ortega confirms that ryan from high school musical is gay this well we to be honest it doesn't take a genius to realize but it does add a whole new level to hey batter batter hey batter batter swing with chad completely where i've always dreamt is kind of a gay um sort of mating call between the two of them. Well, that's the thing. So there's issues on a few levels. Yeah.

First of all, I mean, it's massive queer coding the whole time in the sense that we fucking, we knew. We all knew. The little hat, we knew. But then we saw him holding hands with like Martha. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no.

But he's dancing around with Gabriella saying he's eating her brownies. Yeah, I know. I've had like martha it's like no no no no no but he's dancing around with gabriella saying he's eating her brownies yeah i know i've had them and zach's like yeah i fucking tried them before you cunt yeah quite rude from both of them yeah weird weird moment interesting yeah so it's queer coding essentially the whole thing has been like three films of this person who's very clearly gay and then kenny ortega says he's he's gay the whole time but like he we just thought you know he'd come out in college however take it even further really interesting i think that in this article kenny ortega kenny ortega is gay himself and he speaks about how he had drugs placed on him like planted to get him arrested he nearly got sentenced to like life

whilst filming no no like back in the day when he was kind of a young kind of gay actor he was in a musical all around america and the kkk got up on stage and like attacked them oh my god he's been through obviously some i mean obviously he's been through trauma as a result of how people feel about other people's sexuality, which is just insane anyway. It goes without saying that, I mean, even in 2020, you know, I reckon, largely speaking, if someone doesn't identify as straight, there is some level of embedded trauma as not necessarily a direct consequence of their own sexuality, but a direct consequence of how they have seen society treat people with a sexuality that isn't straightness. So just how horrific that this guy is talking about, like, real serious events,

his own experiences as a gay man, a really successful gay man, arguably. And the headline is, Ryan's gay, he's been gay the whole time. It's like, fucking hell, but this is for pride he's a pride icon apparently also it's like it's so obvious that that's offensive it's like we know he was gay he was only not allowed to be gay because it was on disney channel and disney channel are homophobic and they thought that gayness wouldn't sell or wouldn't be appropriate completely well it was really interesting kenny ortega says i mean i'm

paraphrasing but he says i didn't think of it frankly because i imagined that disney wouldn't go for it in 2006 it wouldn't sell to family and kids how offensive is that that people his personality will sell everyone loves ryan as an individual but his sexuality a defining thing about him is inappropriate and dirty but we have all the things that we like about gayness and campness we'll put that all in because that's appropriate but no no no he can't be with a boy he has to hold hands with a girl at the end completely completely so you can capitalize on like a marginalized experience without running the risk of actually standing for anything yeah without being overt in what you're standing for and interestingly he says you know we we put in enough with ryan so that people watching gay kids

watching would identify and they would know without saying it so it's just there's a whole sphere of god knows what going on that's really really interesting i thought it's like oh my god the fan fiction we can revive now takes a whole new level yeah confirmed but it's kind of um dumbledore it's kind of like but it's complete i mean it's then also it's completely different because kenny ortega isn't a fucking lgbt villain he literally is the community um whereas jk rowling obviously you know whatever i don't know what's going on there turf city yeah he's like uh let's not even so i thought that was interesting thought you might like to know i thought you might like to know i love to know it i love to know it because you know my favorite thing is batter hey batter batter because of the sexual undertones yeah overtones i watch that and just yeah overtones i'm literally watching

it with my eyes wide like fucking hell what is this i love it where's this going yeah like what like they have to surely kiss at the end surely not until college apparently when he goes swing surely so there we go so glow ups oh my god so stunning big news oh yeah so today we're talking about glow ups and should i read the questions we did a big big load of questions on the story as we do because we wanted to get your input so i'm just going to go straight into them and start reading them so the first thing we asked you was have you ever felt pressure to glow up and 90 of you said yes we're leaving if you can do math i can't i can't do math 10 saying no and this was probably our biggest one of our biggest ever reactions we had hundreds hundreds of people saying yes like this is one of the biggest numbers i've seen and you know i love the numbers as a capricorn

um so then we said have you ever had a glow up and interestingly 62 said yeah interesting 38 no fascinating do you want a glow up and i said ie do you desire this form of transformation 80 yes 17 no do you look this one i thought was interesting because i discussed this with a few people in person and got some interesting feedback so they said so it said do you look down on people that you perceive to be unattractive and i put in brackets be honest because there's no point in trying to look good on our polls like we all look bad here no one is ever honest the demand characteristics on our polls are unfortunate and completely unavoidable at this point there's nothing really we can do the social desirability

is ongoing yeah literally just know that we're not we're not fussed guys we're not fussed you can look like bad people it's absolutely fine everyone's bad that's what we do for an hour each week on this podcast so don't worry about it every week we look horrific so you might as well look horrific on a on an anonymous poll um so do you look down on people that you perceive to be unattractive 63 said no they don't and 37 said yes they do okay i think those numbers should be reversed personally because you want to glow up so badly but no no you do not pity and look down on people yeah it's like of course you do because you look

down on yourself you look down on yourself for not glowing up so would you rather have an intellectual glow up or a physical glow up 63 percent of you guys want an intellectual glow up and 37 percent want a physical glow up what are your thoughts on that i mean i haven't i hadn't looked at it so that's the first time i'm hearing that the majority of people said they wanted an intellectual glow up more yeah i'm not buying it yeah i'm not buying it me neither what do you prioritize reading a book or going to the gym you you prioritize the gym every time completely yeah if you wanted an intellectual glow up you would have done it by now you would have been glowing up this whole time and if you are then that's fine but you don't feel that you're getting a glow up because no one's looking at you going oh my god you've had an intellectual glow up so even if you are

progressing and learning and you feel like your intellect is glowing up no one else is feeding that back to you there's no validation other than what getting a grade back which is not actually a mark of intellect yeah i'm shocked actually at that the way i was gonna word this was like an internal glow up or an external glow up because i didn't really want to say intellectual because i almost wanted to say spiritual but then it's like spiritual everyone's saying physical because everyone's like what is this woohoo bullshit yeah but it's almost like internal external which one are you which one do you design more because you would think oh internal definitely if i can have happiness and awareness and all of

these things surely but there's no validation for that at all of anything society doesn't want you to gain an internal glow up absolutely not yeah no they'll hide it from you they just want you focused on that external yeah so i was thinking that's interesting that so many people say they want an intellectual i.e internal glow up over a physical glow up this is one so i was doing some googling on glow ups as i do literally the first thing that i came up first thing that came up was what age will i glow up how can i instantly glow up how can i glow up in a month things like that i saw that what age do you normally glow up it's like oh puberty yeah exactly how sad is that there was an interesting thing about um summer being summer summer summer summer what time is it can anyone tell you you're absolute genius yeah so stunning a whole thing about summer about like leaving for summer from school and coming

back as this whole new person all the boys kind of a her Hermione Yorba moment kind of um Katy Perry one of the boys that I referenced in the last ep literally yeah but I think that's so interesting especially now that we're in quarantine because I think there's been a narrative of like up glowing up after quarantine like coming out of quarantine and you've transformed so I said do you feel did you feel pressure to glow up over summer specifically as a teenager and 78% of you said yes 22% of you said no interestingly a lot of boys answered no which I think is very interesting have you ever attempted to glow up 79% yes 21% no have you ever attempted to glow up 79% said yes yeah yeah and I bet you weren't fucking reading your books and fucking meditating

when you were attempting your glow up were you no you're doing your eyebrows differently and googling diets well i said i.e dieting for aesthetics extreme workouts drastic hair change style change makeup change etc etc and 79 of people are yesing that out and then i basically wanted to do i didn't want to say um do you find men or women more in like more likely to have more pressure to glow up because that's just absolutely bollocks so i said why do you think women are encouraged to change themselves and we'll get into all of your amazing answers later because we've got so many but that's the general gist of your guys opinions i had an interesting discovery actually coming off of what you said just then about men and women being more inclined to glow up or being told that the narrative fits more around women being needing to glow up. it was talking about from this guy's perspective so he's like a young gay man i'm assuming in the

uk and he talks about how he was going on this date and he was about to have sex and he's a quote unquote twink this guy brandon no he's about to have sex with this guy and the guy says i just oh i just imagined that you would be like more toned oh wow okay so brandon the self-proclaimed twink it's like brandon you have to leave yeah and you have to leave right now so brandon says half of me wanted to hit him and the other half of me wanted to sit there and cry and so it made me think about what i would do what i do in those situations what you do in those situations what probably everyone listening does in those situations where half of you wants to cry the other half wants to hit them but the reality is the whole of you just stays quiet and has sex with them when half of you wants to hit them the other half wants to

cry well the whole of you just does nothing and you silence yourself and you just go along with it i think it's because the whole of you you want to hit him you want to cry but you also just want to like hate yourself and at that moment the most self-hating thing you're about to have sex with and so now your internal insecurities have very much been confirmed to you yes i am worthless i'm a yeah untoned little twink and almost at least he wants me at least he wants me completely yeah and then it's just like well i'm not worth i'm not worth hitting him and i'm not worth running off crying i may as well just get along with it and i think that's where the actual so he said that's where my glow-up journey

began that he fought against this notion of being a twink which i think is really uh patriarchally charged hugely that's a phrase that it will be now in the sense that oh now you're feminine um and so you're a certain type of gay because you're the feminine gay and you're the tiny you're the weak one you're the weak submissive one and so i think he marked that as the beginning of his turn into quite a jockey bulky muscular man but i actually think really in practice this probably would have been a good place to end the podcast not start it but i think the real glow up starts when you get in those situations where half of you wants to hit someone and half of you wants to cry you actually just communicate and harness the situation

and demand not only a bit of justification from them but also teach that person what the standard is from which they should be treating you and also teach yourself and build a new association there where in situations where you're hurt and attacked you're not silencing yourself or shrinking yourself you are standing up for yourself because if you can build if you've lived your whole life personally speaking the majority of my life and i think the majority of people's years that they've been on this planet listening to this podcast, whenever you are faced with something where you are essentially being attacked or invalidated or hurt by something, it is the easier thing to do more often than not to shrink. And so you associate pain and hurt with shrinking yourself. really obvious that in life where you're constantly chasing validation we then seek to physically shrink ourselves and try and be skinny in order to seek that validation you want to silence yourself

you want to silence that acne on your skin well it's almost like safety like the smaller you are the safer you are the and the bigger you are the more you're seen you can be seen by everyone and therefore everyone can comment everyone says stuff it's It's like, okay, well, I'll just, if then safety becomes aligned with smallness and danger and self-hatred becomes aligned with bigness, it's like, well, I'll just go for the safe, small, tiny version of myself that no one can comment on. Well, the more people that see you, the more people are going to have something to say to you. It's becoming invisible. It's basically just a huge invisibility cloak. Which is loaded with patriarchy because you wouldn't have, in the same way,

a straight man who's maybe naturally skinnier or smaller than his peers. There's no label for that. He wouldn't be called a twink to begin with, first of all. And then beyond that, even if he is looking to fit in with, again, patriarchal standards of what people should look like

of masculinity it's toxic but it's still the patriarchy also then it's become with aligned with bigness it's like for a guy is take up more more more space make yourself louder make yourself more but a woman is make yourself way less be less think less everything you must just be less than a man in every way well there we go the world is taken up by men that are allowed to be big and women that are allowed to be small they're not allowed to be anything but big men man spreading on the cheap horrific in every way you're told to be small so but i think that's where the the actual glow up starts and i think it's a nice idea that everyone voted that they would rather have an intellectual glow up and i saw someone said what about an emotional one which i i actually thought that was interesting i was umming and ahhing

between what word i would use to be the opposite of physical because obviously the opposite of physical is not intellectual but i purposely put intellectual because it's like i think that's an area that you would desire to build upon whereas emotions i mean we're on a podcast where we are all trying to get a hold of emotional issues but're on a podcast where we are all trying to get a hold of emotional issues but i think a lot of people that does feel very far from them the opposite of like beauty is intelligence like the beauty in the brains that sort of idea what i found interesting about an emotional glow up is like well as a human being you have a whole scope of emotions that you should be able to feel all of them within decent balance yeah what does a glow

up look like is it happiness all the time which is not desirable yeah that's not this doesn't work i think i've had an emotional glow up in a way lovely yeah but it doesn't mean being happy the whole time it's almost like i think i used to have um when i was a teenager a really i mean it's literally just hormones but just kind of a really what's a mood swingy personality of like when i was sad it was the end of the world and i'd almost be quite like tantrum me and it would be an awful thing and it would just be i was quite like a volatile person to be around yeah um or in my mind it was like that anyway it was quite like a what's the word like tumultuous place to be in my mind and now i think it's almost like quite a calm place and if

something happens that triggers me in a certain way I can deal with that in a certain way and you know balanced yeah I think there's definitely an element of balance that's just like there's good and bad in life and you can when something bad happens it's not the end of the world when it's been good it's not so manic almost as a teenager I think I've had an emotional glow up but I definitely think it's not um emotional glow up is like it's not just create a happy mind yeah it's just let's just not be sad then oh emotional glow up glowed up so how did you have an emotional glow up then because something else that I wanted to point out with the poll of everyone voting or the majority voting that they would rather have an

intellectual glow up is i also think that even if even if it's not a level you know even if they're not completely paralleled i do think the idea of an intellectual glow up can in many ways be just as damaging if not probably more so in some ways in the sense that it's a lifestyle glow up yeah it's like because it's you don't think you're ugly you think you're stupid you need to wake up every morning at 5am and go to the gym and drink your smoothie and go and read your 10 books in two days. And like, you need to be a perfect person in harmony when actually there's nothing harmonious about that. You would be miserable. Yeah, utterly miserable. I think it's really interesting that people said they want an

intellectual glow up because when I was speaking to people about their answers because i was sitting with my housemates and they were answering them kind of with me um and going through which i always find so fascinating to see people's like thought process behind stuff we've written because it's just hilarious yeah and they were saying oh well physical because i've already had the intellectual like i don't need to oh like definitely definitely physical and someone's like oh yeah because that's because you're already smart to them it would be like oh well i'll have a i'll take a physical one then because i've cut like that base is kind of more covered how interesting to think that you're already as intellectually glowed up as you can be at his young 23 years or whatever he didn't say that but

he said oh he jumped to oh well i have the physical one then because i've completed it mate his friend said oh but that's because you've already you you're already clever and he went oh yeah that's probably why he wasn't saying oh i'm already glowed up interesting that interesting that people think of cleverness and like glowing up your intellect which one would you rather if you could have an intellectual or a physical glow up in these terms that we're using that are so vague imagine i'm like i think i've i think i've handled them both so both covered i think there's much room here to move um which would i rather that's what we asked we made everyone else ask answer it you've got to

do it yeah i don't know why i'm like made everyone else ask answer it you've got to do it yeah i don't know why i'm like guys just answer the question it's not fucking hard then you ask me it's gonna take like 10 minutes let me think this is what i always do because i wrote them out and then i went on to my own one later i was like oh what what's a high priest priestess post i was like oh it's me an hour ago um and i was going through the questions i was like fuck fuck like they're hard like they're not easy questions they're hard and you really want to justify it I get why everyone's spilling over into the question box it's like when I said this I actually meant this and when I voted that it was because I voted that by accident I do that all the time because even the first one it was like

do you desire a glow up it's like hmm do I desire a glow up it's like so impossible to answer because like i know um socially i should not want one but do i want one if you offered me tomorrow desire as well it's quite beautiful yeah it's like if you offered me you're going into surgery tomorrow you've got the books on the go like you're you're gonna wake up and you're gonna be basically jonathan from queer eye level of beauty self-actualized smoking but but you're gonna come out tomorrow and you would have glowed up like do you want that like or is the journey more important like is the floors more are the floors more important i was really trying to think like would do i want that something i thought was really interesting and a really good point that somebody said uh which i should probably find and

i should have found it before i started speaking sorry we just had like a five minute break and i did absolutely nothing and now okay women are celebrated the most in their youth and beauty sad face honestly sad face for me too um someone essentially said it's easier pretty privilege undeniably involves better treatment and as a child you want that yeah if your life is easier if you look a certain way we've said it time and time again and now you're saying that back to us it's completely true time and time again i also think it's kind of more than that is wanting it as a child it's almost about the media as well that you watch that you consume because it's like not only do you see the girls on magazines who get to be on the magazines and the girl in your school gets to date the boy that you like in year five

when you're like oh my god i fancy this guy who has kind of spiky hair dreamy frosted tips yeah so dreamy kind of flame t-shirt like the kind of shirt that has the flames on he's sliding along the floor at the disco on his knees hot stuff but it's kind of also the you're watching the disney princess who is so stunning and she's the main character in quotes well she actually is the main character and then you think oh well i'll be the main character if i look like that or i can be the sidekick that looks pretty enough but she she doesn't get the prince and she doesn't really get to go on the adventure but she's like she has a good life like she's the cook in the house she's the maid like it's fine kind of even the extras are better looking than you and they are nothing yeah completely that mortifying look what we've done

you know what else is so kind of we talk again like we talk about this all the time but the the makeover scene yeah the makeover scene as what you watch as a kid from like the 80s yeah and then combine that with social media it's like oh okay so i can be i can i can i can be i can transform i can transform i can transform and you can go from princess diaries kind of breaking the brush with your frizzy hair glasses girl to being the princess of genovia like it's a wow that's hardly an that's hardly like a big decision i've got to make is i will get me in that chair get me the makeover right now instant decision did you ever think about makeover like i definitely thought about the makeover scene in films like i definitely

when there was a makeover scene like i was excited still am in queer eye like still love that yeah isn't that interesting actually should we talk about that what queer eye i love to talk about queer eye at any moment of the day call me at 3am i'll talk about queer eye with you because you love queer eye i have pleasant feelings i watch it in the bath that's where i watch it oh you say I'm risky in the bath because I use my phone and stuff in the bath. You're risky in the bath because you play Switch in the bath. But you watch TV in the bath. You bring your TV,

folds right into the wall. You put it off your TV and put it into the bath. No, I put it, I copied this off my brother because he has a really luxurious bath routine. And I thought, God, that really is the life like he takes like kind of food in there and like yeah he takes like fruit like it's almost like a roman bath like that he creates he has like someone's peeling his

grapes and fanning him down genuinely he has like candles big like boiling hot steaming bath for a bowl of fruit and and he's um type 1 diabetics he's like injected for the fruit like all prep and then he has on the tea on the toilet seat he puts his ipad there so it's just this whole nice bath experience and i thought that's what i want i want to watch queer Eye on the toilet seat with me in the bath with an ice I love my new thing is I have an ice coffee in the bath and that mix of like hot extreme hot and extreme cold oh you need a cold drink in the bath it's like my body doesn't know what to do and it's just like whoa it's an amazing experience I do just think everyone should do that yes I mean if you're not having a bath like at least i'm gonna need it to be twice a week i don't know for you yeah yeah completely agree i had one last night yeah stunning so stunning i love just

that extreme temperature thing of like god it's so hot that i'm about to like faint like it's so hot but don't you ever get it where you put your foot in the bath and you're like right i'm taking it too far this time every time i'm like every time i think it's burning up well i can't do it i i kind of do a few laps kind of walking to kind of mix it up like i kind of sit i sit on the earth and i dip my toes in i really bit by bit kind of when you're getting into the pool on holiday and you can splash yourself just dip a toe in a dip in the pool yeah come on in the water's fine but it's not the water is like fucking steaming like you're gonna be boiling alive yeah yeah mine is boiling alive like i'm bobbing about like a lobster yeah honestly i was gonna say i'm in a pot of pasta like it's really bad it's bad yeah it's like boiling water yeah but that's how i like it if

you take up really cold drinking as well it's like boiling water yeah but that's how i like it if you take up really cold drinking as well it's like with ice honestly the most strange experience like you're inside of your body like your whole stomach is frozen but your skin is boiling kind of the camera is zooming in following the ice going down your body it's so stunning i really highly recommend that whole experience so that's how you consume queer eye that's how i consume queer eye because i thought fine then when you're watching a whole transformation it's like this big experience you're kind of like dying a little bit in your own body and you're watching like bobby build a house like oh my god i can't imagine anything better you're transformed by the time you come out of the bar so is it problematic that they that they physically

transform them and like change up their whole lives in order for them to be happy based on what five other people think? Well, it depends on who the five people are. And I must say the five that they've picked are pretty fab. The fab five. But they, I think the way they do it, obviously any makeover scene,

there's just like a history of like problematic stuff that goes into filming makeovers. But I think the way they do it. Because they do women too, don't they? Yeah, they do men and women. Because I've seen, so they're five guys. What is it? Three, three of them are white.

But is that not interesting? So three, I've seen an episode where it's a black woman being made over by white men. And they're kind of walking around their house and they're like picking up kind of old food and stuff. They're god you're such a tramp like they're not they're not rude obviously they're like crying with them no they are rude like anthony when he sees the food yeah i guess that yeah it is strange i know you love it i i like it too i think it's great i think you can't be on netflix without there being problematic stuff like it's a capitalist institution it's a white capitalist world in terms of the makeover thing that is going on there it's very much i know it is orientated

around like the external but there is they do the external for the internal like karamo is very involved like it's very mind heavy therapy revolving around like transforming how you feel that's the how it's marketed anyway whether that's what's happening or not definitely that's what i was going to say because i reckon a lot of that internal transformation actually is more about getting a good sob story for the audience and selling in the fab five than it is about making that person be any happier and you feel confident because because tans finally put you in a pair of jeans that fit you right and then you get people go oh yeah you look good and it's like oh well then i must be transformed absolutely and how long does that last before it wears off and all of that but i mean i just love every single person involved

yeah what do you love about it so much you love them as individuals kind of if they were doing something else that wasn't queer i used back it still like it's about them all their podcasts yeah i do back them all in every in every way i can i think they just are i don't know how they picked a squad more compatible i love them all with my full heart well that's great that's really special isn't it it's it's so that it's like you've got my absolute king jonathan i also have a uh quite controversial second favorite fab five member which is bobby i love bobby which one's that is that the blonde one he does the house is he blonde yeah yeah he's kind of strawberry blonde

strawberry blonde i would say strawberry blonde okay i love him so you always love the transformations oh sorry sorry sorry i've stepped on your rating i was just working out then it probably goes anthony just yeah i love how he looks but then I would say to be honest they are all joined other than Jonathan who stands out from the crowd he's the king he is my absolute king everyone listen to his audiobook or buy his book I would recommend listening so you get his voice just just Jonathan too he really needs our advertising yeah everyone have you heard of Jonathan I think he's struggling oh he's so stunning um so you loved the transformation stuff when you were a kid well

I don't know if I loved the transformation stuff but I think um I was told that I loved it and therefore I loved it right you see um even like wild child yeah like fucking Ali Shidi, Katie Harron whatever her name is everyone everyone's done it that moment of course you love it because it's their big it's kind of them becoming empowered by society's standards of now you're stepping into your power before you were like a weedy loser obviously hugely wrong that you have to be pretty to be empowered I disagree with that with my whole heart but I think you watch that as a child. You're told, yeah, that's what you should aspire for.

And that just goes in somewhere and you just become a bit more fucked. Do you think Mean Girls, I love Mean Girls, in any way redeems itself at the end? I remember Tina Fey specifically talking about how at the end, KD, is it Kaddy or KD? It's KD, but they call her Kaddy, isn't it? But she says, and she's like, I'm gonna call you Kaddy. And she's like, fuck you. Right. Okay. It's been years since I've seen

Mean Girls. It's so, I think it does really hold up. Yeah. From what I remember. And 2004 was a long time ago. But I remember Tina Fey specifically talking about how at the end they didn't have kd come into this kind of mini skirt um like tube top look and then at the end go completely back to what she was or stay with who she was like this kind of and they never had her be super the ugly girl i remember her saying it was never a conscious decision it was very much a conscious decision sorry sorry, to not have her be kind of Princess Diaries vibe, to not have her be, you know, she was just dressing pretty mediocrely, pretty average, run-of-the-mill 2004 girl.

She was just in her jeans and her little polo top, which you would hate. I hate it. Oh yeah, I've got a phobia of polo tops, just context. Just kind of all collars, really. We'll go into it. I've got a huge phobia, but we'll go into another point. I can't even talk about them.

I'm like, move next subject, please. Nope. So I think that's really interesting that still in 2004, there was, I guess, quite a minor shift, but still a consciousness around not setting up the main character to have such an extreme transformation as super super ugly kind of sandy moment yeah because also lindsey lohan is stunning emma watson was always beautiful just because now she's in a pretty dress and she's still beautiful you know and i so i wonder if at the end of mean girls do they redeem themselves by um tearing up the tiara and all of that and sharing it around and it's not so much about being empowered in your beauty.

She's like winning with the mathletes and still is the prom queen or whatever. Yeah, well, it definitely was like revolutionary her doing the prom, doing the snapping of the tiara. Social suicide. Yeah, literally social suicide. I think it's stunning. Yeah, I guess it does redeem itself, but I don't know really what it's redeeming from

because it's already part of female cinema cinema female teen cinema that is so problematic it feeds into that but it also kind of is slightly satirical in the same way like it is kind of it fits in a really niche place that now places other films have like emulated but it definitely was one of the first if not the first that yeah was enjoyable to watch with no awareness of the makeover um scene sellable it's marketable yeah exactly but also you could watch it as a man who has no context of oh my god i desire a glow up a transformation and watch it and still really enjoy it because i think also part of it is and this doesn't necessarily make it better but part of it is you're made to kind of ridicule the regina and the gretchen and the karen and think they're kind of stupid and like ridiculous

so when they're kind of propping about with katie who you know is super smart and she does math and she's so cool and math is the same in every country and it's so beautiful yeah and so you're kind of laughing it's kind of another woman's expense it's like even though yeah we're watching this makeover scene and we can see that katie's being transformed into something quite beautiful and blah blah blah and then that is still being redeemed in its own way because it's supposed to be satirical even when it's satirical you're still then there's still another woman at the expense of that there's still another woman who is the part of that joke it still operates in the system of um those movies which are patriarchal but also

really enjoyable with tina fey yeah it's complex it really is there is that thing of ridiculing the popular girl i.e i was thinking um angus thongs kind of like slaggy lindsey it's like the fact that we hate slaggy lindsey so much it's like oh my god she is more damaging she wears um what they called like push-up things in her bra what they called chicken fillets chicken fillets she wears chicken fillets and we see her take them out and it's like oh my god fuck her she's so fake and it's like what is this strange narrative that we like the girl with the big nose and the weird cat and she loves robbie and all of this we love her she does like wear weird clothes. Georgia. She's actually really unlikable, Georgia. I never watched that film as a child and I reckon

I escaped quite a lot of damaging messaging from it. You never liked Angus Thongs? I never watched it when I was a kid. I wanted to but I didn't. I was obviously busy doing God knows what else. I was obsessed. Yeah but I think you can tell who was really bought into Angus Thongs because they still call other girls sluts and slags or say I'm going to wear a really slutty outfit. Do you know what Georgia is? Georgia is so I'm not like other girls. Yeah, completely. It's so that kind of, oh my God, she's slaggy Lindsay.

And she's the main character. And you know what it is? Early 2000s. Yeah, totally. The tone has shifted where now it's kind of not cool to be Regina. And if you are regina we're kind of laughing at you a bit we still want to fuck you you're still the hottest one yeah you're still in the sense the main character and the coolest but we're not happy about it this

is why book smart was so important because it the popular kids in that film i mean if you haven't seen book smart you will have to see it like if we ever recommend anything in this yeah it's book smart like more than anything i could recommend is book smart but the popular kids in that film are getting internships at like apple google whatever going to fucking harvard yale like all these amazing unis and academic and the kind of losers of that school but we've studied we're going to these unis and it's like yeah but everyone else the cool people are too we went to parties and we i think it's such an important thing if like they're not regina georges which are dumb like karen from me and guys it's like oh my god i'm touching my boob

and i know it's raining i'm like i'm a dumb dumbo it's like no no you're pretty you conform to patriarchal standards and you're going to harvard stunning gab. Mm-hmm. Gabriella Montez. Gabriella Montez. The classic example. Walked so they could run. Literally. So stunning. So should we talk about social media? Yes, definitely.

Because it's a social media trend. As you just said, we were just talking in our little break then. Yeah, off the record. Off the record. We're saying it goes about saying between the two of us and then we realised we have to talk about social media.

We have to say it, yeah. We literally have have to so this is a huge thing on social media right now the idea of glowing up i mean if you're on tiktok it's i'm trying to fit back into my jeans blah blah blah it's glow up city i've seen that girl it's everywhere it's hi my name is rebecca and i'm trying to fit back into my jeans i don't even know yeah everyone is wanting this big for lunch i had poached egg on toast and she goes through our whole day i'm like god rebecca what's going on what's new with you and then people do kind of like um fake ones where they use her audio but i had a little poached egg and then they're showing their like packet of cigarettes and things like that then i had a little smoothie

and it's like a beer it's a funny little tiktok thing hilarious yeah it's everywhere everyone wants this transformation why would you not goes without saying goes without saying that's gonna what that's gonna be what our merch says it says goes without saying it goes without saying goes without saying well because often as well you guys will be like it's interesting because you were talking about this thing but like you didn't mention kind of the biggest thing about it and we're like fuck yeah you're so right because we thought it goes without saying but turns out we're on a podcast where you have to say things but it's because yeah between us it goes without saying but we're running a podcast it's so dumb as well because amongst friends it's difficult to remember that you guys aren't physically in our friendship and don't know everything that we've discussed and like yeah who we are and some things between us go without saying and so we imagine that between

all of us it goes without saying but it really doesn't like guys it goes without saying yeah no of course it doesn't some things need to be declared what was it why would it go about saying what we all just imagine the combo let's just all imagine the podcast combo well we know what we're gonna say so it goes without saying netflix are like oh we're not putting out any more shows just imagine the shows it goes about saying they'll be good it goes about saying they'll be good just imagine what they are you can imagine what they're like it's so true something that i wanted to discuss that we have spoken about a million and one times but let's declare it let's air it out is what i would call the glossier model and not a physical human being model, but as in the model

of a brand like Glossier and what they have imposed and what we then as consumers sustain. So if you don't know, Glossier is a relatively new within the scope of things, within the beauty industry brand that sells girl next door, barely there,-unquote makeup and skincare products it's a beauty brand and all of their marketing uh revolves around a very um natural um and natural beauty kind of face and i think there's a lot to be said actually when it comes to something like glossier because it really pushes that whole beauty branding narrative of love the skin you're in. But also transform the skin you're in. Love it whilst transforming the skin you're in. Love the skin you're in, but only if it fits within the five shades that we have in our shade range. Kind of only if your skin is white? Yeah. But also,

that's what I think is interesting with Glossier, is it's love the skin you're in, but only if your skin looks perfect before. And after you put on our £30 foundation, you're not going to be able to tell it's there anyway. So all that acne you've got, forget about it. This isn't for you. So this whole brand that everybody's completely obsessed with is so far from inclusivity. It is nuts. And whilst then you still have Fenty on the other side of that, that is so amazing. It's so insane that the two can coexist. It's bizarre. Because I was shocked with Glossier because I didn't really know much about them.

And I saw a review and I was like, yeah, okay, that looks like my kind of thing. So I don't really like wearing foundation, blah, blah, blah. You were influenced. Yeah, I was so influenced. Literally used an influencer's code. I was like, yeah, I'm so influenced on this shit. Got a load of Glossier stuff because I was like was like okay this kind of looks like my kind of vibe

got it i remember we were having a conversation with this and it's like you said a thing that is so true it's like it's almost like they've got a foundation wiped off half of the product and sold you that yeah it's literally packaged in like a minimalist kind of look looks very stunning but there's nothing there's no product i really like it this is the thing i really like it as a product because it suits my kind of completely clear skin basically but that's because i fit a very niche and it's fun to put on yeah it's that it's fun to hold a beautiful little bottle where everyone's got it on instagram and they've completely pervaded our sense of our scope

of what it is to be beautiful and that's why i think social media is really important that we reference because you if you're listening to this podcast i think it goes without saying you've been completely saturated by what you see on social media totally and you just want whatever you're seeing you literally want whatever you see and what you're seeing is a skinny blonde white girl so of course you want to go on your summer holidays and come back super skinny you're seeing you literally want whatever you see and what you're seeing is a skinny blonde white girl so of course you want to go on your summer holidays and come back super skinny you're gonna dye your hair also you're not only just seeing the picture you're seeing the number of likes and the comments below it and believe me there's many but what i find interesting and i don't have an answer for this so maybe you do why even though we know we we know all of this about

glossy i'm not this is new news everyone knows this everyone knows that about glossier everyone knows this about social media it's not real and no one really looks like that and you can you've been told a million times before yeah love the skin you're in whatever just be who you are why still then even though we know social media so much of it's fake do we still slip in so often to trying to adhere to it adhere to the standards that aren't attainable why even though we know because i think the whole we know it's fake thing is so silly from people because it's the same thing as i always think this with either horror mazes or horror films you know it's fake you can't go into something saying you know it's fake so don't be scared you

know it's fake you go into a horror maze there's people jumping out of you you know they're actors you know it's not so our brains are fucking thick we know it's a picture that's been photoshopped of a stunning stunning model but what i'm seeing is a stunning stunning stunning model that i could look like if i did these ridiculous steps so you go into a horror maze and you're thinking this is fake i know it's fake i'm entering it knowing this is all a facade but i'm still terrified but my brain is not going to be able to tell the difference yeah completely that it's the same thing so however much we hear oh love the skin you're in which is the most crazy marketing isn't that insane it's literally a 180 thing they've done in a year and in five years and

expected us all to go with it from hate your skin hate your life hate your weight hate everything about yourself to no now love yourself please hate your skin so much that you're gonna spend your hard-earned money yeah on changing it but but do love it love it love it love it just buy this thing that costs 100 pounds love it as well definitely so it's the most um incredible thing they've made us they've honestly managed to trick us into thinking they want us to love our skin that's a hilarious thing a hilarious to think that a brand would want that from you because they don't yeah um but yeah i think we're all thick as fuck that's why we believe it well society just couldn't function if you loved yourself society wouldn't function because believe me you would

not be living the life that you are living now if you loved yourself absolutely not it's you put a thing this morning this will be about a week ago for you guys listening you put it on the story this morning saying you can either live insecure and everyone will love you or you can live to yourself authentically having fun and everyone will hate you which one do you choose it's that which do you choose slumflower said i say this all the time we we literally don't stop saying this even though at this point it does go without saying but the slumflower had this amazing quote where she said so many people, even the people close to you,

even the people you would never imagine it of, will be enemies of your happiness. Yeah, enemies of your happiness is such a quote we use. Because I was thinking yesterday, I lived so long fearing embarrassing myself. I lived so long like fearing stepping out and doing something that or whatever in order to like maintain relationships or just to not rock the boat. So you live so long not doing what you want in order to keep everyone else around you happy

or just not talking about you. To shrink yourself. Yeah. The more I go and do whatever that is really mortifying and embarrassing, the more fun I'm having. Yeah. So more I go and do whatever that is really mortifying and embarrassing, the more fun I'm having. Yeah. So I'm going to keep doing it. I have never had more fun than I have had since I've been absolutely the most embarrassing person alive. I completely agree.

Yeah, I need to be mortified. If you're embarrassed for me, good, because I'm having an absolute whale of a time. It's so fucking true it's actually so true the more that you do that's authentic that other people will be like oh my god that's cringe it's cringe can you did you see she did that cringe no i'm cringing at you because you are miserable now and you will die miserable but i've done it both like i've never been more fucking um depressed than when I've just been conforming

to what everyone else wants from me. Oh, but we wanted you to do this. Okay, I'll do that then. And I'm miserable. Or we wanted you to look like this. Yeah, okay, well, I'll just wear that then because you have an image of me and I'll just live up to that.

Miserable. Or I can live how I want to live, do what I want to do. Everyone's suddenly a bit pissed off with me, but I'm not pissed off with myself. Time of your life. Time of my life. Yeah, I think it's's so interesting so you have an option in life everyone has the option you can piss people off by embarrassing yourself essentially by society standards by wearing what

you want to wear looking how you want to look and doing what you want to do having sex with who you want to have sex with or you can not do any of that but you get to keep around a sort of squad of fake people that all want each other's misery. Your choice. And will further validate their own conformity. It's funny how active that choice is. You think it's like, oh no, no, but my life is different. That wouldn't happen to me.

I can maybe... The people around me wouldn't say that to me. I honestly think if you want to see who is loyal to you if you want to see who's kind of potentially insecure do something different just do one thing that's different and see what how that sits just speak out about something put something a bit weird on your story and see them just watch just do something that you believe in just watch them cry in your dms or just wear just literally wear um a zebra print pair of boots that are really stunning just like a pair of heeled boots that are a bit stunning and a bit

different and they and watch what people say when they fear oh your boots are a bit loud aren't they yeah they fear it they fear the confidence people are terrified they're shaking in their boots because we don't want women to do what they want they're shaking in their nike trainers they honestly are but i think that's the thing it's it's actually really liberating to realize you do have a choice and literally to be like okay well i can be insecure with friends quote unquote friends if your friends secretly hate you and are digging you out at every meeting and every chance that you see them i don't see no friends i'm not even talking about friends though kind of everyone acquaintances everyone that you see them. I don't see no friends. I'm not even talking about friends though. Kind of everyone, acquaintances, everyone that you meet. Society.

If you want to test, if you want to test society, do something that society doesn't like. And what society doesn't like is people that are happy and confident. So fucking true. So be happy and confident and see what happens. It will crumble. Just fucking test it out.

Test it fucking out. I was also, this is on a different subject but i think it kind of is it's not really relevant but it's about korea korea the country it's about north korea and it's about korea's jobs work capitalism any way you want to phrase it it kind of does fit it's not really glow ups but in the idea of like either be this or be this i think there's an option you have in korea I was talking about this with my friend the other day who also does kind of a job that's not conventional. And I was saying to her that me and you have a theory that you can either choose, you have an active decision to make, you can choose stability and boredom or anxiety and fun.

Those are your two options in life that you can choose the stable job where you'll be bored or you can choose the kind of anxiety inducing job, which is fun. Also, because I reckon the anxiety that's induced is pretty temporary once you realise how true to yourself that you are being. Like once you realise that there really is no anxiety and just shedding what is holding you back anyway there is no there is no negative there's no negative there's no ramification there's no ramification i do think there's anxiety at the beginning though there's definitely been anxiety at the beginning though of starting a different thing oh my god i didn't know how my life would um change not even fall apart just

everyone has an opinion and also we're conned into thinking that before they didn't have an opinion but they did they were just digging you out subtly and then not saying anything to your face because they weren't you but they weren't threatened by you a woman with confidence is terrifying it's a terrifying thing society as a whole is scared of confident of women that are confident beautiful intelligent or have any traits that men should possess i.e power so you're not supposed to have any you're not supposed to love the skin you're in you're supposed to absolutely fucking despise the skin you're in but also you're supposed to be miserable and get back in the kitchen

basically yeah man alive man oh man oh man honestly oh something else i wanted to talk about and someone else actually sent this in so i screenshotted this um something i wanted to talk about was how glow-ups are so succinctly linked to the concept of a revenge body absolutely and that a revenge body is kind of a much more um i think that's a term that's slightly more on its way out but glow-ups is kind of the exact same thing just with a very thin veil over it totally we actually got quite a few comments of people saying that yeah i wanted to go up after a breakup and things like that so that is um you're calling it a glut but it's a revenge body 100 it's a revenge body which i mean it's the patriarchy at work isn't it it's um men after a breakup yeah yeah go out and go out with

the lads go and sleep with some girls girls go and get yourself in your in the gym don't eat suffer know your place book a hair appointment yeah and you're gonna try and get that same guy back or show him that you're happy with another guy so strange well this is what i find troubling worrisome about revenge body because who are you really vengeful of who are you avenging yeah it's like yeah who are you vengeful of yourself are you vengeful for your grandma for giving her your wide waist or even vengeful of your patrilineal line for your hairline that was passed on to you who are you vengeful of and who were you before you learned that you should hate yourself exactly that what are you avenging it's more commiserations for you

you want a revenge body the boy's not feeling bad when he sees you he doesn't give a fuck he sees you and you've got a nose job and you've lost a stone he doesn't give a fucking fuck well you know what the narrative will be yeah i dumped her and she just like went and got skinny and now she's like fucking loads of boys she's so insecure she's so insecure she's so needy oh she did that trust me mate she's so fucking yeah she's suicidal she's a psycho trust me yeah she's a fucking psycho yeah so don't think that that's helping the case do not think that's helping your fucking situation here something else i thought was really interesting was a lot of people and this i definitely did screenshot because

i've just seen it uh a couple of people said this someone said they had more of an anti-glow up they dyed their hair got a fringe nose ring and tattoos became a goth love that um someone else said but that is glowing up well i thought it was interesting because it reminded me of miley cyrus i don't know if you ever read miley cyrus's book miles to go no i didn't wow love a pun i mean you know I love a pun. Oh, love it. And in the book, she talks about when her and Nick Jonas first broke up, he had always said during their relationship that he loved her hair when she had these beautiful golden highlights and all of this, blah, blah, blah.

So when they broke up, she dyed her hair dark fucking like black and she goes to the premiere of their fucking film with this dark black curly hair there's actually the meme of miley with the fucking bright blue eyes and the dark hair and the pale skin is from that night and it was a concept that i didn't really understand at the time and i i kind of i can't i can't relate to it still i mean then and i can't relate to it now i definitely think that makes sense i think it makes complete sense but i can't i can't i've never done that what bit can't you relate to as in that you would transform yourself into something they would dislike into the opposite yeah i've never done that i know someone that did this

their boyfriend would who was their boyfriend was actually like incredibly abusive like had a lot of mental health issues but was incredibly abusive as well and the two can coexist and we see it all the time totally he would always say i love your hair long i love your hair long of course he fucking did um love it long long long long fucking princess little girl sort of vibes but second they broke up she caught it into like a short dark bob stunning nice kind of rapunzel yeah honestly from tangled honestly tangled i love it short bob stunning and it was kind of like a big gaining yourself back move i think after a relationship where you feel you've lost yourself a bit in becoming something that they would find desirable into just being like fuck i've had long hair which

i have slightly disliked or not really had any thoughts on it's just grown during the time of our relationship that you've always praised and you used to be horrific to me so now it's chopped because now i can be myself again i like that in theory i like the theory of it being a tool for liberation or a tool to progress to empowerment but i still think or do you think it's self-destructive you're making a choice about yourself you're making a choice about your appearance still based on what somebody else's opinion is of you even though you're rejecting it you're still doing something to yourself based on somebody else i think that's the part that i've been lucky to escape i've seen it happen before where it's been where it's been done in an empowering way it's not in like a self-destructive i'm gonna shave my head like stress it's like i'm gonna shave my head yeah yeah like i need to do

this now well i completely agree that changing up your appearance can be so liberating and i can i completely get that i mean i get all i understand all of it but i completely relate to that idea of act more accurately expressing yourself and empowering yourself in that way but i feel like any decision that you're making about your own self that is based on the opinion of a boy yeah that is based in the opinion of somebody else is wrong dangerous yeah i completely agree and especially the revenge body thing because a revenge body requires essentially restriction excessive workouts and essentially a lot of pain for you maybe surgery it's a painful experience on the most part i know well yeah working out can

be healthy that argument is fucking tired like we're not living in a world where it's like working out people do it for health no they fucking don't they do it for aesthetics they starve themselves and they go to the gym yeah absolutely your mental health can be helped by endorphins absolutely not denying it but i think the way that women are encouraged to diet and work out don't tell me that's to help us live longer, is to fucking kill us and make us into skeletons. Yeah. Well, it's the whole glow up,

lifestyle glow up thing that we kind of touched on at the start. It's like, there are so many ways in which you are told to better yourself that are actually just incredibly counterintuitive and very damaging. Starve yourself. And it's largely when you're making a decision

about your own self based on what you think everybody else wants of you the thing that people want from you is your misery i think when you realize that the thing that people want from you is you to be miserable quiet and compliant it sounds so extreme but i promise you it's fucking true as i say if you think no no my family don't want that no no my my friends don't want that go and do something different do something and see see what happens fucking hell feedback after we sound really angry but it's crazy it's such a it's such an epiphany no i'm angry at the world it's i'm not angry at any individuals i'm angry at yeah it's the world

it's like if you think that your your ex-boyfriend wants to see you succeed be stunning and all of these things no he doesn't he wants to see you fucking miserable people who will actually back you and actually want quote unquote what's best for you are an anomaly want what's best for them yeah but that's what I mean like people who are actually looking out for you and actually are invested in your happiness are an anomaly and i think if you think you found one give it a test yeah and see what happens give it the test that we've just said give it the test see what happens but also i almost think it's of no fault of them in a way it's almost like we live in an insecure anxious society it's a societal. And we've probably all been that person that's wanted misery.

But don't let yourself be miserable because someone else wants you to be miserable. Please don't do that. Yeah, don't do that to yourself. It's an active decision. Don't do that to yourself. The thing is, how basic does it sound? Don't be miserable because you think you should be

because other people want you to be miserable. It sounds so cliche, but I think that with every cliche sounds so cliche until you realize it's fucking true and you embody it within your own life well do you remember i messaged you the other day i think actually we were on the phone and you're like oh what's new for you and i think i said like i've just realized that my life is my life like i think i've realized that i'm alive like it's taken me 23 years to be like oh wait this thing that i'm in right now, it belongs to me. I think that, I think it takes a lot of time

to actually realise that what you're living for is not performance. It's not for anyone else to tick off and say, yeah, you did that well. You're not gonna have a rating when you're lying on your fucking deathbed. Yeah, you did that right. If you wanted to do something fucking crazy in your life,

there's no award system. There's no gold, silver and bronze awards. I reckon it takes quite a world shaking event to get to that epiphany because I only had that at the age that I did because my whole world had been turned upside down. And I remember, I don't know if I said this to you, but I remember literally being sat there, lifting my arm up in the air, turning my hands around, putting down my fingers one by one putting them back down lifting up the other one and thinking i'm the one doing that no one else is raising my limbs to and fro this is all me and whatever decision i make came from me and so so much of your life is not within your autonomous

control so the things that you have control over use them push the boundaries see what you can get away with it's so fucking true see what you can get away with i think that's so true we live in a world that's so fucking crazy that we've designed something we sound nuts don't we it's fucking but it's literally like just honestly just fucking do something different like you'll you'll love it i completely agree as usual goes without saying goes without saying guys you are alive it's within your control okay guys this is going to be kind of a long episode but we're going to just do one more question wow i attempted so many times hoping that it would make me feel complete attempted to glow up so many times it made me feel complete turns out i was just trans lol honestly lol do you see what society does to people i mean we could go on and on about that the world wants you to be anything but

authentic i had a nose job over the summer when i was 17 drastic and expensive glow up yeah i fucking bet over the summer as well did they say yeah yeah i had a nose job over the summer when i was 17 drastic yeah and expensive glow up love that for you if you want it but it's so fascinating that we're told i was talking about plastic surgery the other day with some people and i just think it's so interesting i think we should do an episode on that totally i think it's so interesting that we're told to chop up our bodies chop them and have things put in and moved around and sewn back up to fit in with a world that we hate isn't that crazy it's it's so drastic this is why i think we can't do this episode without talking about social media because now surgeons plastic surgeons are having

young girls 17 year old girls come through their doors and hold up pictures of them with filters on and say give me this version of myself i filmed a video for high process the other day it was a story and i didn't put it up because i did another one I do many takes because we do it takes a moment but I did one and I said on it oh my god I'm gonna show a plastic surgeon this filter like it was such a stunning filter I was like oh my god I'm gonna show this to a plastic surgeon like as a joke wow and then I was like I don't have a surgeon blah blah blah I see how it went off and why you didn't use that take it went off it's like I don't I think I said this is why i didn't use it the amount of googling i need to do to find a plastic surgeon it's like quite um extreme like i don't even know where to start with finding a plastic surgeon i'd literally

be googling plastic surgeon uk plastic surgeon near me yeah literally open it plastic surgeon opening times on fiverr.com free Three hours plastic surging, 24 hours. I go to someone's house. It's like, yeah, the amount that I look at a filter and think, well, yeah, that is the enhanced version of me. That's how I should look if I was a model. That's how society would want me to look. And also simultaneously not want me to look.

It's also not, there's then then we just hate women so much that now that's not what a model looks like that's what an insta model looks like yeah and so we hate attractive women on all levels they're slaggy lindsey it's oh you're gretchen weiner on all levels including physical we just absolutely despise women and we what we despise more than anything is we despise two things i'm gonna say we despise the fucking regina georges that are trendsetters when they cut fucking things in their bras and in their tops and see their bras and we despise them because they're pretty and they're influential and we also and they fit the mold and we also despise even more so women that act they operate in the world as if they have that influence but they don't so like lizzo sort of thing that you operate in the world as a pretty woman and with

all the confidence and all the power and all the influence of a model but you very much differ from what society's been told and there's i think there's nothing more threatening to society and the patriarchy capitalism white supremacy all of the same things as someone that operates with privilege and power but looks like they shouldn't completely completely completely completely and even if you fit into the regina george model regina george still has people talking bad about her behind her back and thinking she's not that pretty she's not that hot she's dumb she gets called stupid she's not fucking stupid she's manipulates all of you she's not that this she's not that this. She's not that this.

Yeah, completely. So even when you're doing absolutely everything to fit into what society wants, it still won't be enough. Because society doesn't want confident women. They want scared women that buy their barely there mascara, barely there makeup for 500 pounds. That's honestly what they want.

Fuckers, fuck the world. Burn it down burn it to the ground i love it well i hope you guys have loved it too same well we'll see you in the next episode see you when we see you really really grateful for everyone who sent in your thoughts and your experiences and your messages um fucking love you like god love you so much love you so much come to our uh animal crossing islands oh oh i said i was gonna do it update i just said i remembered i would do a reveal name reveal here we go my island is called so you know ikamarama yeah um oh wait my housemate's just

walking him trudge trudge trudge with a big old bike come on oh he's sighing he's gonna patriarchy's got him down he's going through okay so island reveal name yeah is erin's called mine if you're a studio ghibli fan you might remember this it's called laputa which is stunning guys It's in a film, A Floating Castle in the Sky, called Laputa, and I named it after that. Stunning. Beautiful.

We wouldn't have expected anything less. No. If you did, I'd be offended. Okay, thanks guys so much. So we'll see you in the next ep, guys. Off to Laputa and Ikamorama. Off we go. Bye! We'll see you in the next ep, guys. Off to Lapita and Ikamarama. Off we go. Bye.