Goes Without Saying - trying, failing, & the myth of "cringe": a villain origin story

Episode Date: August 24, 2023

Women Who Aren't Cringe Rarely Make History... etc etcjoin the conversation every monday.shop our merch: sephyandwing.co.ukspeak your mind on the @sephyandwing instagram. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. Nature. I've got a gay rooster named Francois. Is so gay. These rams are gay. I'm studying gay animals. Does that mean I'm gay?

So why don't more people know this? I'm Owen Ever. I'm Lane Kaplan-Levinson. And this is a field guide to gay animals. A podcast about queerness in the natural world. The animal kingdom is queer and we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on Spotify, Apple. Or wherever you get your podcasts.

Acast helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com Goes Without Saying. You're listening to Goes Without Saying with Sefi and Wing. I'm Wing. And I'm Sefi. This is a really nice, like actually quite cozy., like I'm in the pitch black right now. You really are. When did the lights go off by the way?

I know. The sun set before us. Like I swear when we started this you were in a bright room. In the daylight, yeah. What's happened? The sun went down. This is a very chilled, cosy episode of Goes Without Saying. We are having a really nice reflection on the journey that we've had starting this podcast

and like all of the cringy shit that that involves, like how embarrassing it is to do something that you believe in and put yourself out there. And hopefully, if not giving you advice, we're kind of talking to our past selves. So maybe you can learn kind of indirectly and vicariously through baby sephian wing on how we started the podcast and how we came to be enjoy okay perfect perfect oh right how's it going fucking knackered terrible so we're recording this wednesday night you'll be hearing it well it's gonna come out it's gonna come out tonight technically you're gonna be listening to it tomorrow morning so um i don't we've just put ourselves in a bad mood basically i don't even

know why about mammograms and like cat calling and yeah we basically we both so it's it's late for us we usually record not or even on the day let alone the evening yeah the episode comes out and or the day before the episode comes out we literally got to the space time and we were like we are knackered we're so tired oh my god we're so tired blah blah blah then we proceeded for an hour to talk about the most depressing things just about kind of the pain that women feel in this world that's so unnecessary blah blah and now we're so depressed like why did we do that i actually don't know why we did that but it was irresistible i couldn't stop the words from coming out of my mouth but considering we literally were like okay we're gonna do this so quickly three two one hit it let's do this episode

we've now just wasted we wasted that what little energy we had left on that great idea as usual to be honest but it will come back it's come it's already coming back it is coming back and you know what someone so we were like right let's think like what are we going to talk about like i just you know when you get in those moods where it's like i don't want to put you guys through the the pain of having to listen to me talk like i have nothing of value to say blah blah however since we're all here i actually thought just at the last minute wouldn't it be interesting to discuss something that we actually get asked quite a lot and something that we did get asked for the last off the record not not you know that's our most that's number two number one i actually think uni might be number

one actually you might be right but this is a highly asked high no we're not highly um it's in high demand highly anticipated how do you start a podcast how did the podcast come about you know what's what's the spirit behind it how do you how do you get from a to b in terms of starting a podcast and i do think we were just too scrappy dudes like we started this from and i think it shows i think it's pretty obvious i think this is gonna be a surprise to anyone that we don't know what we're doing we did this out of nothing like i would love like i always said i would love us to be the nepo babies of the world i would love us to be i'd love nothing more i wish we went on love island last year and we came out and we did a lovely little podcast we'd have a gorgeous tan we'd have some hilarious stories it would be

amazing we'd have loads of money in the bank not quite the case i would love it but no but no we really built this into something and actually this is kind of in honor of us hitting three million downloads which we haven't actually hit yet i think it's happening unless everyone jumps ship yeah no please don't everyone up your listens just download everything you can oh my god that would be great right now that would be really nice everything that you can download from us download download download listen listen to the repertoire send us to a few mates we don't often say that but like i don't think we've ever said that i don't think we've ever really said send us around but it would be actually so good if you could well i do think people do gatekeep us i've seen it do they seen them say it that people have said to us like

people will come in the dms and be like guys i'm so sorry i do feel bad but i am keeping you to myself that's so fine i actually do get fine i'm happy to be here just we're just yours if you can bear other people to your dirty little secret i'd love to find my way to their eardrums as well in bed on myself i would love to but i just think it yeah it would be actually so great if just before we hit three mil let's get it to happen guys please could you just download everything maybe pop us on your story that would be so if you pop us on your story i'm sure we will share it we share a lot of that stuff we do we never do this people do this at the end of every episode this is the first ever time we've done this guys we've barely started right so that would be great i'd love to hit three mail it would be great yeah

and just thank you for the your tireless support honestly like actually jen i'm i am taking the piss but like thank you so much if you've ever listened you're listening now like we really do appreciate it like this is the best we appreciate it i would say too much like too much to a fault love it thank you so much okay so i think let's frame the episode around because i almost think it's it's too demanding i know i said it's in high demand but maybe too much of a demand to talk to everyone else who wants to start a podcast maybe quite a nice way to frame this so we can get really personal really like detailed and in-depth and feel really like we can be vulnerable and really open and not have to give any disclaimers

or like worry about being misconstrued or any of that just you know we can speak freely lisa's geese sounds i think let's speak to the past versions of us that hadn't yet started a podcast and had lots of questions almost like what did we need to know like those sorts of things okay god get it i mean yeah i get it i'm on board i'm on board i love it good good well do you want to start though i would love to hear what you would say to little wing okay okay little wing little wing look at little wing she's wearing big glasses i can see her now she's got blonde sort of balayage yeah she's got big glasses on cute she's just i almost make it sound like you're in your pre sort of princess diaries makeup but she's got her big glasses on you've got little glasses

on she's in little pajamas oh yeah she does she definitely has little pajamas on yeah so cute i would say i would say and i think we have said this before, so this is not like, it's not on the technical side of things, but kind of on the emotional side. I think something that, it depends on what the content of the podcast is actually going to be. But for us, it was always going to be pretty lifestyle-y and pretty personal, I think. I think we knew from the beginning that it was going to give quite a lot of like who we were and what our friendship was and the things that we were naturally interested in it wasn't going to be too like focused on it wasn't going to be interview kind of academic breakdown no we're not we haven't got it in us i think we're too smart we're smart enough to know that it's not what we but we it's not the right move i'd have not got it in me to do thoughts every app

you know what i think is interesting is i think you do if we weren't doing it together if we if you had a podcast and i had a book we had two separate things we were doing it with someone whatever like our dynamic it works so beautifully in what we give that it would actually just be a disservice to contain that and limit it to something quite strict yeah and concise it's always like don't hold us back don't chain us down don't fence us in let us run right we could go anywhere do you know what i mean set us free let us lose oh 100% so my advice would be anywhere i think learning conversation after conversation i think the biggest advice is like and something

i actually think i've been speaking about a lot on the podcast is like learning to just try and like not be that good learning to like get almost a bit more accustomed to like falling short because i think when you've got really high expectations and i definitely think little wing before she had a podcast would have thought to herself i know i did i thought if you have a podcast it has to be fucking perfect like you need to not be able to like it needs to it needs to be pristine you can't critique it like it needs to be absolutely perfect you need to be so considered at every moment you need to always say the right thing like don't slip like there was just no room for fucking up and something that i think has been really important has been learning that you don't have to like almost disregard or like not appreciate the amount of responsibility that it yeah involves speaking to a load of people i think there is an

important part of that that's like yeah you should try your best yeah but also allowing yourself to have lots of room for being human because you're always going to be human you're literally a human being like i'm so sorry you're not a perfect robot and it's almost like allowing yourself to not be the perfect version of yourself it's like what you're actually allowing the room for is just room for yourself the full version the real version of yourself every day yeah we have that conversation quite often actually what would you say it's a huge thing yeah what about you i think there's a million things like i don't know if i have one like big sound bite of advice because also i think as much as confidence has been a huge thing that

like it inevitably comes up in doing anything that's like even slightly confronting but I think I always had the sense that I was going to do something like this big big I knew I was destined for big things but weirdly I did like I don't know I weirdly I just I think I was kind of not even big things I always knew and it was never a conflict a conflict of my identity of like oh god how am i going to get to a microphone the microphone i already had it god knows how i was i i never had the conflict of like it has to be perfect any of that but i think i i i have the awareness now that if you keep doing it then you have it like it's there's no door that has opened on the other side almost of like i think i've always thought that the the gateway to doing what you want to do like if I get if I am lucky enough to be one of the people that does the things I've always had the sense that I want to do that but not really that it's

possible to do yes I think I was waiting for um Mr CEO Stephen partner himself yeah to open the door to like mr ceo and his diary to open the chamber of secrets for me that's like right okay thing about i was waiting for the basilisk down there like let's so let me in so millennial so lame um but i never realized that it's like if you keep doing it that then that's it there is no like if you keep doing it then someone might notice you and then maybe then that they know someone that blah blah blah which i think is the myth that gets told to us or like that kind of probably happened to our parents that like the media industry is like run by people that are unattainable you might know someone it's who you know blah blah blah and it's like the amazing fucking gift of the internet is it's not who you know it's just whether you

keep fucking going like obviously there are huge doors to get if you know someone traditional media like if you if we suddenly wanted to be rich as well yeah you need to know some people but i do think to get what we already have now all we needed to do is just keep posting every monday and now every thursday but i think if we knew people we could be at this point now but like two weeks in we could but i don't need that i think i know neither i just think it's neither neither well i do i think it would have been nice i don't i think it would have been hell i think it would have been hell we were not ready like no we weren't but like almost if we were the um if we were nepo baby 101 if we were the character it would have it would have been ideal you just slot

right into place i i agree like it's not um i do i would love the easy route i don't think we would have our friendship wouldn't have survived it we wouldn't have survived that like i that's why these things because we're two different people like we that's a different world almost it is but like i get it we wouldn't have even known each other i agree with you of course of course being an apo baby getting it handed to you by steven violet himself handing it on a platter would be stunning yeah it's legit also it does happen to people it happens all the time but if i actually tune into me and you like would i have wanted where we are now snap our

fingers we got it two weeks in absolutely not because i think we actually had to learn things the hard way we had to learn first of all what the fucking rss feed is we had to learn this and i'm glad i know what an rss feed was because now i can actually say no i have a podcast and i know what an rss feed is like it's nice and then it is really nice that came with it and all of that like i do not want we would not have been ready we would have fucking fallen out over some bullshit thing week two like i'm glad we've had to learn with it like me too that's been the best bit of it that also that is it that's the whole process yeah it's just doing it i'm not waiting for some um moment that it all clicks and cherry pop moment i'm not

yeah i'm not waiting for that i'm no what we've done it has been it and it continues to be it like i think there's a whole idea around making it or like when when do you feel kind of that it's complete or like mission accomplished it's like no mission accomplished the day with what the day one that we sat down and did it mission accomplished day two again like i'm not waiting for anything yeah we'll be doing it and we have been doing it i think more so my point was just like oh sorry really what did i go off if you said no not at all oh i thought you said more so no no i just didn't want you to think guys we're so tired i don't want you to think that i'm like arguing you i was no i don't think you are no i was also just saying like some people really do get almost like i think my point was more when

you were saying about like with the internet and stuff it really can challenge the idea of like the oh it's all about who you know narrative yeah but i think the sad thing is that is still oh absolutely and i know you agree that largely the who you know narrative is kind of like the foundation of the world everything well it has and it would be really nice to like know everyone like it would be nice to know everyone and slip in the back door it goes without saying i love the joke of like i wish i i wish my dad was steve jobs but also i don't like i love that my dad is who my dad and i love that i had to do the shit that i had to do and i love that i'm not an arsehole because of it exactly but sometimes it is nice to kick back and relax and think i wish i was a nepo baby and i didn't have to work so fucking hard

i do but i don't like it's kind of um the conversation that we had did this go on the podcast but we were just having it just now when you were saying about like i would choose to be a man do you remember yeah i don't know this was on the podcast but i mean we just had this as part of what bummed us out um yeah but that's almost what i'm saying that so do you mind me saying this sephie was like i mean so you've changed i don't know what you're gonna say but go on whatever well before when we had the conversation you were like i would obviously choose to be a man because it's so much easier well i, I think it's just like... There's so much heart in being a woman and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And I almost feel like that's the conversation that we're having now, but almost mirrored in like... In terms of capitalism. Yeah. Yeah. Like the other way around of like, obviously, I wouldn't choose to be a nepo baby. And obviously, you wouldn't choose to be a man. But it's nice to entertain these thoughts every once in a while. Do do you know what it is you don't necessarily want the symbol of it but basically what you're saying is you want more power uh more ease exactly and it's like yeah okay when you're saying oh i wish i was a man or i wish i was an epo baby blah blah blah you're not actually saying i wish i had a dick and i wish i had my daddy was blah blah blah with steve jobs you're not actually saying that

no i said daddy as a joke then by the way i'm not just saying my daddy was blah blah blah with Steve Jobs you're not actually saying that no I said daddy as a joke then by the way I'm not just saying my daddy even though I do say daddy I don't say my daddy I would call him daddy to his face but I'm not gonna say my daddy no but you'd say you would say daddy like our daddy to your sister and stuff I wouldn't say our daddy but I would I would phone my sister and say have you spoken to daddy recently good for you and look guys it's one of my red flags but i can't deny it i don't deny it don't deny it it is the biggest red flag about it was it's one of it's one of i do say it's one of many it's what it's on the list it's higher than that it's a turn off i would say yeah for guys if

a guy was on the phone say you've just had sex with this guy whatever the next morning he answers the phone hey mummy i'm being honest it's a turn off it was horrific it's horrific but i do feel like it's different from me of course it no everything's different from unfortunately the patriarchy works in my favor in that in that it's less creepy for a woman to say mummy than it is for them for a boy to say mummy is it yeah i think the patriarchy works in our favor for that one that is just like if you want to be a girl being like hey mummy daddy it's not as creepy as if a guy being like oh hi mummy i just look it's fucked but yeah i think it's different yeah um you can give us that at least but if you're when we're saying i want to be a nepa baby i want to be a man blah blah blah i actually think it's

like look you're you're just um skipping what you actually want which is power ease um money totally freedom you're also just being a weird figurehead of that thing which actually isn't really what you want so your advice would be do it my advice is not only do it but do it again and again and again and again like i think you can't do something three times and expect anything like the amazing truth but also the kind of it takes energy like but i do think if you do it then you have it it's not if you do it then steven bartlett comes out steve jobs comes out and says well you've got it now you actually get the real thing if you do it you have it like we had a podcast from day one we had a podcast with no listeners

but the listeners do come god knows why they can't i'm sure everyone's thinking now god knows why i came they're like why did i click on this no so true so true um kind of off the back of that actually i think waiting for permission is a huge thing and i know we've spoken recently about the idea of like almost like introducing yourself to the world as like what your what are your interests like show the world who you are rather than just like waiting for someone else to tell you about yourself um and i also think giving yourself the room as much as possible to like allow yourself to figure out who that is with a lot of patience and like compassion for yourself

yeah and i think also like trying not to um kind of fit yourself into like a mold acas powers the world's best podcasts here's a show that we recommend nature i've got a gay rooster named Francois. Is so gay. These rams are gay. I'm studying gay animals. Does that mean I'm gay? So why don't more people know this? I'm Owen Ever.

I'm Lane Kaplan-Levinson. And this is a field guide to gay animals. A podcast about queerness in the natural world. The animal kingdom is queer. And we are a part. Find a field guide to gay animals on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts. ACAST helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere.

ACAST.com I think that's so true you're not a stereotype identity yeah i think it's that's really important like not being like oh i because i once mentioned um that my opinion is this i once said that my favorite color is blue it doesn't mean you're fixed to that forever like i do think yeah i love that we've allowed ourselves to be so like basically flippant on this in loads of ways like we're pretty fluid with our identities like i can one week be like i love this the next week love i hate it whatever and i feel like there is some room for the understanding of being a human obviously if it fluctuated massively a bit weird but i love that and i think don't get attached to

any particular version of yourself like you will be different there are different moods there are different vibes your opinions change like I do think it's so important to have room for that and not be like yeah because I came in showing um I don't know something about myself you haven't got to stick with that but I know also think a huge thing is boundaries like as much as i kind of hate that word just feels so but just i just don't love it but even though it is it's so true yeah like i just think it's so important not to share not even keep secrets because i don't think it's secret but there are some things in your life that are not public like that don't have to be public and I don't think you should share anything like I think

we've always had the kind of rule with ourselves that if something makes us feel uncomfortable then we don't speak about it we never put never push ourselves to speak about things until we're ready to speak about them and the time usually comes that we want to speak about it but I don't the the worst thing i could imagine doing is sitting down with you and being like come on then spill your guts like it's just like absolutely not i think we really take our time with them put no pressure on us ourselves to be like willing to talk about things that definitely um we don't we're not ready to talk about yeah we let ourselves work things out before we speak about them i think that goes across um the whole internet as well yeah yeah i think as well sorry going back

to like the idea of like boundaries talking about what you want to talk about and also kind of marrying it to the idea of allowing yourself to change and grow and evolve i think as well something and this is quite um i think what's really central to go without saying and what's been really the biggest thing one of the biggest things for us doing a podcast is the idea of like we tell you what we're okay with so because we present like it's okay for us to change our minds there'll be a huge faction of an audience that would disagree with that and so we tell the audience okay unfortunately this isn't for you and you can move on and so i think by presenting yourself as true to yourself as possible that doesn't mean

giving too much away but almost like as lovingly and authentically as possible you kind of leave your potential audience no choice but to you faction out the people who aren't for you and you leave the audience no choice but to like have the people that do connect with that come to you so it's almost like yeah we we set the tone so it's like i think in essence like the idea of like there's no point talking to an audience that you don't want and i think why we've been so lucky with like having literally the coolest like what we think is the coolest people ever it's just people that we like yeah with our like terrible taste but I think we have great taste in people and I feel very passionately about the fact that we have very cool a very i just i have such a faith in our demographic and our listeners like kind of goes without saying that i feel like there's no point

pandering to voices that you don't want to listen to and that you don't feel safe speaking to there's actually just no point and beyond podcasting i actually think in general the quicker you learn to stop trying to convince people to like you when you don't actually like them at all the quicker you can get to enjoying your life this is everything that that's also the thing that we have spoken about quite a lot that was always confused me with i don't know sound if i'm saying too much but with the people pleasing vibe that you've spoken about before it always confuses me that people want to make people they don't like like them oh definitely yeah always confuse me like it I get it I get it that you don't want to be disliked but people that that you don't like you look at and you think I don't like what you're fucking saying I don't

like what you're about I expect you is a compliment for you to not like me yeah why the fuck would i want you in theory scum of the earth andrew tay whoever to like me i think it's so important to like basically i don't know that we have like spoken our minds and being ourselves and also like not being like scared of the wrong people hating us like i would be absolutely mortified to have a podcast that was liked by people that are like fucking homophobic or something like i like the fact that what's actually not even i like the fact is crucial that our audience yeah generally agrees with the things that i believe to be right in the world because it would be awful otherwise it would it would undeniably be very worrying not fun i'm not here to i would hate the idea of us sitting here trying to convince people i think that might be my final point as well is kind of the idea of

like don't rush if for example a podcast is what you're looking for you think podcast is the next move for you yeah my advice to myself and my advice in turn to you would be don't rush to just start a podcast with just any old tom dick and harry scrappy do on the street yeah i think what works and kind of why it's so it's just almost like don't blow your podcast load on the wrong person there's nothing stopping you from like trying with one person and not working you try again or whatever blah blah blah yeah but i just almost think if you're looking to start a podcast with somebody else ideally like i think understand that that's going to be a relationship

that like if you're really looking to take this to the long haul yeah to the grave to the grave you are starting a life partnership with somebody else and you need to work on your relationship with them outside of whatever your podcast might be do you know what this was actually on the tip of my tongue right at the beginning and i was kind of i've been wanting to say it the whole way through so i'm glad it's coming up right at the end yeah um um that i do think one of the main bits the main one of the main lessons that i have learned from this is like the skill of like a partnership in this way like it is a really huge thing to start with anyone i think it's a podcast aside but like any kind of like way that you're bringing a kind

of don't mix business with pleasure like don't mix the older advisors don't go into business with your fucking friends and family whatever definitely don't do that and we're like okay sign us up sign us up and as much as we're not necessarily being like okay so we're business partners we 100 are our money is joint we do this thing there are adverts on it we come to this microphones all this stuff we do sort of public creative endeavors are join like almost our wants and fears are join i join our feedback is join a huge huge thing and like we have always i think it's the crucial thing we say this all the time off the podcast i don't know if we've ever really said it um on the podcast but it's like if me and you wing fall out or there's some issue or something like that then we don't have a podcast

we've got nothing like that it's gone podcast at least tomorrow if we ever been falling out i'm not thinking about well i need to see you to record on thursday no no but it's like okay so if we if we pour so much into this we love it so much blah blah and we think okay so we're just gonna do the episode the important thing isn't all of the like nitty gritty shit the important thing is the foundation that it's built on which is me and you as friends if that we don't kind of water that plan of our friendship then we have nothing it doesn't matter about oh my god we missed a thursday or oh my god you blah blah blah which i don't know what that has never happened yeah it never happened but like any like silly little things which i would hate you blah blah makes me cry at the thought i'm terrified i don't want i

don't like it but like the real thing that we have is the friendship which then has the podcast like it always has to be friendship first and then on top of that we have a podcast that we have made together but we don't have a podcast first and a friendship second definitely it doesn't have anything i mean yeah like it doesn't mean anything if we don't have that thing i'm not gonna lie i also do have a lot of faith in us i know that this is a very weird world and anything can happen yeah but i think as individuals and as a partnership i have a lot of faith in us being able to handle a lot of shit together so do i so do i i think it's just there are loads of things that i think i do i always

think we should spend more time with each other in real life i always i've been saying that since we've both been saying that since we've both been saying it since day one that it's just like we need to prioritize it more because it means so much um but i think that's one thing kind of that is so crucial to kind of wanting anything to last long time you don't want to like a long time well last a long time god i'm so tired i haven't slept in a long time and we're getting up tomorrow and we're doing we're doing a ball it's so fun though this no it's the best but i do need a good long sleep before it basically every night i am like trying to go to sleep because i'm working at a cafe i'll get into it another point but i'm loving it

um and i've got to get up at like eight to go and open the cafe well they're they're there but i've got to like set up the setup and i'm going american what am i doing set up the cakes and shit but i'm every night like reading hunger games before and i can't stop reading and i'm accidentally staying up too late isn't it you know what i'm reading and we've kind of oh sorry sorry should we should we actually just wrap this sorry i don't know why i'm about no what are you reading obviously i want to know well i think about you because i think about you often in my life i think about you too how do you like when obviously okay let me think you got me cookie i got you cookie i get you cookie man i think about

you a lot i was thinking today even putting the cakes out putting the lovely little thing wing would love these well i was thinking like would she like it here like i'll get into it but it's very much like unpretentious would she like it sort of thing and i was thinking like would she like it here or would she find it like not um sort of thing and what what do you think i think i would like it no i think you'd like it and i was thinking like what if she should come down to my hometown oh i love it and i should come here and i would love to bring her here i was thinking that today i would love more than anything i would love to yeah i would love that well anyway when we're thinking about me i gave you cookie now give me cookie yeah here's your cookie i was thinking about you because we've kind of you won't remember but

we have spoken about this vaguely before you know the author and let me know actually if you've read anything from her but i don't think you have from the last time we spoke about her emily henry no i haven't but i as we spoke about in person i know the covers you do okay i'm aware i i do love to know your thoughts just because i think you're almost i mean out of everyone i know you're definitely someone who leans into like the idea of romance so much big time it's my hobby it really is your hobby and yet i'm not hearing from you about the romance books no and i know it's it's you know there's pros and cons to a romance book but i would be intrigued to hear your thoughts on anything from emily henry well maybe i'll read her because um my friend is quite into sort of romance books and she was talking about them and i was saying it's funny that i don't really read

a lot of romance it is funny i think if you started reading romance it would be the end of you because i'm quite at the no i agree i completely agree it's dangerous you know it's already the end of me like i'd like i watch so much it's already the end i remember i remember hang on i remember talking to you about wattpad and like fan fiction and stuff like that and you were like I've never really read any like super crazy like romantic smutty fan fiction and I just thought it's probably for the best because it would be the end of years like we would never see you again and I get it like we've all been there but it is it's almost like enter at your own risk I almost think kind of the gods of the world never kind of gave me the word Wattpad to Google as a teenager. Like they'll just like keep that word away from her.

Don't let her know. Don't let her in. It's by design that you think they're lost in the heart. She cannot find out about Wattpad or like she's going to start really probably writing it and really embarrassing herself. Well, look. Really, really embarrassing. Okay. Should we wrap this?

Because. Yeah. I just also wanted to say about Hunger Games. Okay. I'm in a real, speaking of romance, really a peter malark kind of phase i know i knew you'd hate it i'm loving him i'm loving peter malark i can't help it he's covered in crumbs all the time i love the crumbs i love the crumbs baker boy throwing out the little bread he's i love the dynamic the dynamic is so good baker boy

was he harry smiles little baker from district 12 i love it it's always like bakery i just love the dynamic i love that he works for bakery i think that's so cool i think that's so cool cool i quite just love the thing of like he really does love you like he does he doesn't no he oh he does he does he's had his eye on katniss for a while he's through the bread he's such a bore he's had his eye on her for a while she kind of has been noticing him but not in a big way she goes into the games she loves gail she loves someone else but he's in love with you he announces it to caesar flickerman whatever his name is he announces it and then you kind of have you then slowly over the course of a battle for your life you've fallen in love with him too of course what well you

wouldn't you because times are tough we all need you know some companionship that's why we're together this time to warm us through the cold nights of doing in a little um what do they go into a little sort of cave and eat some soup oh it's horrific with like mud on their faces um i'm so sorry but i have to cut i know yeah no this is a real sign of like the combo is dying god the worst thing is the combo is getting more and more heated it's like let's just go like it's getting more interesting but i have to we no no no when we're talking about the soup they eat in the hunger games i think we need to go let's right but just now i'm loving peter um i thought you're gonna

say me and i was gonna say well i'm loving you too i'm loving you too always loving and loving you guys thanks for being here and good luck with your podcasts and all your endeavors may the odds be ever in your face so creepy so millennial right if you don't hear from us assume the worst last.