Goes Without Saying - WHITE LISTENERS, WE HAVE WORK TO DO

Episode Date: June 15, 2020

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Today's episode of Higher Priestess is going to focus on race and white privilege. These aren't obviously wholly new topics for this platform, but the recent events have been a reminder for all of us in our whiteness to be explicit when it comes to understanding our own internalised white supremacy and racism and privileges. The episode will be deliberately dense as we'll be steering you as a predominantly white audience not only into discomfort in our whiteness, but hopefully even more importantly into the perspectives of black voices. Gina Martin recently reflected that she isn't teaching her audience about race but instead is learning publicly alongside them and we're going to echo her sentiments here. White people including us as white girls are not your resources

and we are not your teachers. Our perspective is not what matters here. As always, any of the black women that we talk about during this episode, they are not your free labour. Do not overwhelm them with messages or questions from your own guilt and your own fragility. Pay them. Financially reimburse them in any way that you can. So really our hopes of this episode are twofold. So in a way, we hope that a lot of these voices are familiar to you already and that you've been listening to them for a long time already. But also, I think we do hope that we direct you to some new perspectives. Okay, Malcolm X said, hopefully you've heard of Malcolm X. We're starting from the basics.

The most, well, I think a lot of people are only now learning about Malcolm X. So here we go. Including us, we're learning. He said in 1962, the most disrespected woman in America is the black woman. The most unprotected person in America is the black woman. The most neglected person in America is the black woman. And so I think that poses the question, who does that leave as the most respected woman? Who does that leave as the most protected woman? Who does that leave as the most protected woman? Who does that leave as the most cherished woman? Having the white woman at the centre of a movement for women really makes no sense at all.

If your feminism isn't for all women, it isn't feminism at all. Rachel Cargill, who is a really, really amazing writer, and you can follow her at Rachel Cargill and also at The Great Unlearn, is an amazing platform that we'd really recommend. And she says, So white feminism, I think actually it's important

to highlight. This includes actually and is epitomised by something like the L'Oreal horrors, which I mean, if you've been on social media, if you've been watching our stories, if you've been keeping up with Monroe, which you should be, you will know. But essentially L'Oreal, massive company, they hired Monroe Bergdorf, who is an activist and actually an all round exceptional woman for two and a half thousand pounds. So they hired her as a trans black woman for I believe a year long campaign for two and a half thousand pounds. She spoke out against white supremacy, and they fired her and dragged her through a mass media onslaught to then a couple of years later put a black square on their instagram with the phrase speaking out is worth it particularly horrific how branded that is as well it's like

we're keeping the brand throughout ridiculous so yeah and so along with being obviously quite a blatant display of being a performative ally and white saviorism which are also terms that you should definitely write down now on google if you've not yet heard them or looked into them further. L'Oreal Paris really was teaching us all as white people what not to do. And I think going back as well to Rachel Cargill talking about how your feminism cannot be on brand. We shouldn't worry about the aesthetics of our feminism. If it's really feminism, there is no place for that. Even though she is someone that you've probably already heard of, I really think this is worth mentioning. And it's Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie. You probably will know her from her amazing book, We Should All Be Feminists. She's

also done some TED Talks, which are amazing, one of them being We Should All Be Feminists. But the one that I wanted to literally directly quote today was from The Danger of a Single Story. who literally directly quote today, was from The Danger of a Single Story. And I mean, she's just, she's got some of the most amazing work. If you're not familiar with her already and you call yourself a feminist, stop calling yourself that and get to know, I think.

So in The Danger of a Single Story, she says, I recently spoke at a university where a student told me that it was such a shame that Nigerian men were physical abusers like the father character in my novel. I told him that I had just read a novel called American Psycho and that it was such a shame that young Americans were serial killers. So powerful. I mean, just amazing. So powerful. And also, I mean, we're just I would absolutely implore you to go and watch that particular TED talk. And also her book, We Should All Be Feminists, is absolutely,

I mean, it's tiny, for goodness sake. It's going to take you 10 minutes. I would really implore you to go and watch that TED Talk and just absolutely indulge yourself in any of her work that you can find because she really is incredible. And every single thing that we speak about the link is going we're going to link everything so you can find it also yes yeah i think what is particularly important as well to know within her work and within that specific ted talk i mean it's called the danger

of a single story i think if feminism is really a movement that you are trying to push if feminism really is on your agenda it needs to encapsulate every single story and most of the time if you are a part of our predominantly white audience the story shouldn't revolve around you and us we can't be the center and they need to be intersectional completely well actually you lead me perfectly on to a name that i just can't get out of my mouth. Reni Eddo-Lodge. The thing with why I'm no longer talking to white people about race is it changes everybody's life when they read it. And I think there really isn't room to put off the work.

If it's books and like paid work that you're not engaging with yet,'s important that we do whatever we can to to support and really show up so i wanted to read from her book why i'm no longer talking to white people about race when she talks about white feminism and she says when black feminists started to push for an intersectional analysis in british feminism the widespread response from feminists who were white was not one of support instead they began to make the case that the word intersectional was utter jargon too difficult for anyone without a degree to understand and therefore useless um and also i would like to raise your attention again to john boyega's speech which we have spoken about before on the story or drawn your attention to there but it was during a black

lives matter protest in central london and it's highly emotional but very important and he reflects on black women as the foundations of the black community and the discourse of the strong black woman. After a black woman has been through so much, why do we still require her to be strong and independent and to be valid? Black women are three to four times more likely to die from pregnancy-related medical issues than white women. Black women are murdered by men at a higher rate than any other social group. 86% of LGBT plus murders in 2017 were trans women of colour. A lot of spaces that are branded feminist online feel and actually are predominantly white. So for example the sex positive spaces not only lack black perspectives whilst heralding white girls but also fail to even acknowledge the correlation between racism

and public consensus on sexuality and sex. So black people, particularly black women, aren't given the space to be open about their sexuality, especially their own sexuality. So we'd really recommend that you start by following somebody like Shan Boodie, and you can support her beyond engaging with her online content by buying her book. She has a book at the moment called The Game of Desire. Or even somebody like The Slumflower, and you can support Shadera as well by buying her books, including How to Get Over a Boy. Until sex positivity movements can acknowledge the rejection of black women's autonomy and sexuality, the sex positivity movement will not be intersectional. Until body positivity movements can acknowledge the co-option, commodification,

and exploitation of black women's bodies, feminism will not be intersectional. And if you still don't have Roxane Gay on your radar, listen, now is the time. There's really nothing that we can say on this that can ever come close to her genius, but your feminism cannot just be Emma Watson and Taylor Swift. It has to serve Munro, Bergdorf, Roxane Gay. Otherwise, you are a white feminist. So I wanted to move on and talk about how we within ourselves can denounce our own privilege and call out the internalised racism that like literally resides in every single one of us. So I'm going to start by discussing one of the best podcasts that you could listen to, which is About Race with Renny Edelodge, everybody's favourite. And I wanted to draw

your attention to an episode in particular that is called White Women Crying is Racist, which is the crux of the issue with us not being able to denounce our own privilege and think that maybe we are not centred in this conversation as white people. This is not about our guilt, our fragility. This is about being productive and taking productive action. And you can find About Race on Apple Podcasts and Spotify and you can buy renny's book why i'm no longer talking to white people about race literally everywhere so in this conversation in this episode they're talking about a white woman crying in the audience at a talk and the self-indulgence of this is a common response and how it restricts the productive conversation and centers white guilt. And they say, the deference, the tears are really a destructive byproduct of anti-racist conversation,

in which white ears hear black voices talk about racism and interpret it as information designed to make them feel like they are a bad person. And they refer to this as destructive individualization, in which the conversation folds in on itself in the form of guilt. What this does is take the conversation away from an analysis of structural power and moves it to a place where we all need to look after one white woman's hurt feelings, give them a tissue and a hug and tell them that they are not a bad person. And this links to the concept of white feminism. And it really is the crux of the issue with how white people are hearing about black suffering and black death and turning the conversation back onto their guilt rather than productive action. It's not productive for white women to centre the conversation on themselves and it kills the productive conversation and turns it into a discourse about white ego. This is

similar to Robin DiAngelo's concept of white fragility as outlined in the book by the same name and she's a white woman, but her work is really important in understanding white guilt and how absolutely useless this is as a concept. She discusses this on Leila F. Saad's podcast, Good Ancestor, which you can get on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. And I highly, highly, highly recommend that you listen to this because she has a huge range of guests with a huge range of perspectives and I think it's crucial listening. So in this conversation Robin D'Angelo defines white fragility as the inability for white people to handle any kind of challenge or opposition

and she explores how white people often struggle to define what it means to be white, stating that if you can't hold what it means to be white then you cannot understand what it means to be white, stating that if you can't hold what it means to be white, then you cannot understand what it means not to be white. She discusses white people's relationship with race and white privilege. And she says, white supremacy is internalised superiority. From the time I took my first breath, even before I was born, the forces of white supremacy were operating on me. And they basically told me you are superior and that message circulated 24 7 365 and I think the crucial bit in that um segment is the bit where she says even before I was born and I think it's really really vital that we all understand that we're operating within a set of predetermined um social and hierarchical rules that have been imposed on you even before your birth. So it's

really naive to think that you've escaped the programming and basically indoctrination that is our society and think that you don't need to educate yourself. Even if you think that you understand the impact of white supremacy, it's so hard to see outside of a system that you were literally born into. So we all have so much work to do. She discusses the racial contract by Charles F Mills and D'Angelo explains that white supremacy is the social contract that underpins all other social contracts. It's the only one that isn't named. We name democracy, capitalism, socialism, fascism, but we don't name white supremacy that underlines all of them. Or if it is named, it's referred to as a fringe, extreme discourse,

not something that underpins everything. To quote directly from the racial contract, which is available to buy from anywhere, literally anywhere, but please don't buy it from Amazon because we're not trying to support Jeff Bezos, who literally is the king of all things bad in the world. Charles F. Mills writes that white supremacy is the unnamed political system

that has made the modern world what it is today. It's crucial to remember that racism is not this event that occurs every now and then by bad people, it's an entire system and if we look at it like it's an event that occurs now and again by white supremacists, we undermine the whole fact that this is a mainstream culture that we have been protecting with our silence for generations. In terms of challenging white supremacy, there really is no clearer way to put it. We have to be uncomfortable. And this isn't about white people just can't say anything. I just can't say anything right.

No, you need to be prepared to be called out. Call us out. Prepare to call out your loved ones call out your white friends your white facebook friends even this doesn't end once you've got to the last chapter of leila sad's book me and white supremacy if you're not taking this to the dinner table or the facebook comments it's literally white savioring on our instagram feed with a hashtag without taking the work outside this isn't the time for white guilt or white saviourism. Something that I think is really, really important for, I know that we have parents,

white parents, white mums who listen, and it's really important to direct you to Bola Juju. You might know her as at Witch Doctor Poet. And actually, you can buy her debut poetry book and also just support her on Patreon. As we should be supporting every black name that we mention, all of these women need to be reimbursed. Yes. Reparations. Bola Juju says, white folks, are you teaching your children about the realities of racism or sheltering them? Black children don't share the same luxury of being coddled and having their innocence protected. And even her bio says don't follow if you expect to be coddled. This is all about harnessing the guilt that we all have in our whiteness.

I am actually going to quote word for word now, Sonia Renee Taylor, who again, you can find at Sonia Renee Taylor and pay her and endorse her and support her. I would absolutely implore you to just pause this podcast now and go and find her IGTV and all of her work where she discusses this and her own experience in her own words. But I'm going to read this particular IGTV word for word because it's incredibly powerful. And I think the more white ears that find it, the better. In this particular instance instance sonia was referencing a video which i'm sure most of us have seen these types of videos i think it was a tiktok with a young teenage white girl and she's like crying talking about how her parents are racist and etc etc and whilst it's obviously really important that white people are having these

conversations everywhere because racism is a white problem. I think Sonia really perfectly encapsulates everything that white people need to hear, which is, she says, here is where the conversations with white people miss the boat. Hayley was having a conversation about black people. Hayley was arguing with her parents about whether or not black people are worthy of life. The fact that this is a conversation is the problem and that is actually what it was that Hayley needed to be pointing out. Hayley needed to be pointing out that whiteness and white people are so bereft of humanity that they will have a conversation about whether or not another group of people deserve to live. The fact that you can have that conversation, the fact that we can have

that conversation as white girls, is the root of the sickness that is white supremacist delusion. That white people actually have the right to sit around their kitchen tables and debate the humanity of other people's existence. When you find yourself in a debate about whether or not black people are worthy, the work is to stop in that moment and say this conversation is white supremacy. we are sick and don't not include yourself when you're talking to your family we are sick do you hear us that's the conversation i want white people to start having with their white family members saying what are we so afraid of inside of ourselves that we constructed an entire world of disconnection

and violence to protect us from ever having to look at ourselves that is the work of whiteness right now not to be sitting around having conversations about what black people are doing with the shambles you have left our community in you need to be talking about why you are inclined to leave the world in shambles so powerful and i would really really really um you can't go on without watching her and without hearing this from her own voice. All of this information really should be coming to you directly from the Black voices and it's the Black perspectives that are important here. So we have to be uncomfortable and we have to face that racism is a white problem. And again, as you said, we've named every realm every facet of the society that we know

capitalism socialism democracy etc you should know your white supremacy this is a white issue and really i think often white people struggle and us to struggle with well what do i do what do i do how can i help what do i do when people tell you do the work do the reading do the learning that doesn't translate to do nothing I think as white people we look for okay but how can I how can I physically help I want to do something tangible doing that learning is tangible because only from that learning will we be able to make real change because if you haven't learned all of this and we haven't listened to any of these perspectives how can we do anything tangible because our conversations will be all about whether black people deserve to live or not and not what we are going to do with the white

problem that is white supremacy we're going to move on and talk about systematic racism and class because you cannot talk about racism without talking about class because you cannot talk about racism without talking about class and you cannot talk about class without talking about capitalism they are absolutely intrinsically linked. I'm going to quote directly from an IGTV that went viral recently it was made by Kimberly Latrice-Jones who released a video explaining the intersection between economics and racial injustice the video has been shared worldwide and you can watch it on Kimberley's Instagram at Kimberly Latrice Jones. And I really, really, really, really, really recommend watching the original video on Kimberley's Instagram before you hear it from a literal white voice. And I'm not going to read the whole thing because I want

you to go and hear it for yourself because it is so powerful. But here's just a small bit before you watch the whole video at Kimberly Latrice Jones on Instagram. If I right now decided that I wanted to play Monopoly with you and for 400 rounds of playing Monopoly I didn't let you have any money, I didn't let you have anything on the board, I didn't allow you to have anything and then we played another 50 rounds of Monopoly and everything that you earned and everything you gained whilst you were playing that round of Monopoly was taken from you. Not only do you not get to play but you have to play on behalf of the person you're playing against. You have to play and make money and make wealth for them and then you have to turn it over to them. And in the original video Kimberley

goes on to directly name places where black communities have created wealth and thriving communities and they have literally been burnt to the ground by white people. It's an amazing metaphor for the way that white supremacy is directly related to economics and class. And it's literally inexcusable to pretend that capitalism and white supremacy are not essentially the same thing. Somebody else that I wanted to mention is Akala, who discusses racism and ingrained prejudice in his book and his book is called Natives Race and Class in the Ruins of Empire and Akala writes that as long as whiteness is a metaphor for power blackness must of course function as a metaphor for powerlessness as long as money whitens poverty must blacken and there's a chapter in

Natives called The Decline of Whiteness, The Decline of Race or The End of Capitalism and explores how race and capitalism are intrinsically interconnected. In the same way that we name our social contracts as Charles F Mills taught us in the racial contract, it's important that we name capitalism for what it is. It's a white construct that white people benefit from which has been responsible for so much segregation poverty and basically suffering in our society and it's important that capitalism is named as a result of white supremacy you actually reminded me by saying by bringing up a carla um of another black british rapper it's important not only to learn from but also to support dave who is so so phenomenal and particularly the song black which we have spoken about on high process before you have to listen

to it i'm not going to sit here and read you the lyrics and make it all nice you have to listen to it and and feel horrific in your whiteness and and support him and then take action as a as a result of that guilt do not fold into white fragility white guilt can be a productive action but white tears as they said in the renee eddie lodge podcast white tears are racist you cannot do that you cannot make this about your own guilt you're crumbling crumbling white fragility this needs to be a time of action yeah and a time of productivity completely we all it's no good not trying it's not good enough that you're a vegan that cried when you listen to a dave album no

absolutely absolutely guys thank you so so much for listening um and also we wanted to say before you so kindly share this podcast online um don't please share the work of the people that we've mentioned and we will mention now instead um and feel free to share this podcast with your white friends but more importantly share the perspectives that we have kind of gone through today we're not important just just like just no go directly to the source it shouldn't have to be filtered through the lens of white people yeah white people aren't the resource so um somebody that i wanted to mention that uh does amazing youtube content that i haven't mentioned yet in the podcast is courtney daniella um she's a uk-based youtuber and she makes really good content and her at is well the youtube is courtney daniella you'll find her another youtuber that you should watch is

ezzy pros who also does amazing youtube content as well um also andrea manful and also lizzie mathis another youtuber and also just internet like presence influencer samantha maria you probably know her and that's samantha maria official and you should also buy her jewelry sammy maria jewelry umery um also no name no name hiding you will have seen all over instagram just an amazing one to enrich your life again don't message these people and overwhelm them with your white guilt also lauren nicole who is an amazing influencer model photographer what can't she do i've heard she's writing an ebook i don't know she's amazing lauren nicole fk and also fashionkiller.co.uk um and also follow danielle prescott on instagram probably lots of

you have as well and again not your resource not your teacher support her support her work in terms of media that you can consume we highly highly highly recommend black clansmen which will change your life will just teach you so many things and it's so important that you watch this show this if you know a fucking white supremacist fucking show them this and then cut them out and educate that bitch you can watch that on now tv you can also watch on amazon but don't watch on now tv um dave as we mentioned but specifically it would be good if you could look at his performance at the Brits, which is an amazing performance and also his Psychodrama album specifically and even more specifically the song Black that we mentioned. He really is an amazing artist, very young boy, but so, so amazing. You should definitely support in any way that you can.

Someone that you've probably heard of is Jordan Peele who directed Get Out and Us and wrote them both you can watch both of them on Netflix and Now TV and you can follow his production company as a whole which is Monkeypaw and they are producing some amazing work I think it's so important not only to be following black work that is about the black experience but also just stories that are about black people in terms of books we wanted to mention the color purple by alice walker which you've definitely heard of hopefully you've read um it's just phenomenal and also jessamine ward is an amazing author and i personally loved her book sing unburied sing and i think a lot of you would really enjoy to read about i mean we should all do to read about the black experience in that way for a

podcast that we want to shout out that we love so much and i hope you listen i for god's sake i hope you listen bobo and flex which you can follow at bobo and flex on instagram they're on apple podcast and they're on spotify you can follow bobo matjilla and at flex mummy you can follow them both everywhere and also we wanted to mention Rachel Ammer. She makes amazing online content, but she also has a vegan eats book, which you should definitely support instead of what most of us do, which is take as much as we can for possible for free

without actually paying. Mahalia, there's not really much more to say. She's amazing. Mahalia, everybody listen to Mahalia's music. Buy tickets to her concerts. If you're're she tours everywhere she's fucking insanely amazing go and listen to Mahalia and just become a better person um and the retweet podcast we wanted to mention you should definitely listen it's a really good

podcast and definitely um go and show them some love as well so now everybody that we've mentioned in this episode and where you can find them at sonia renee taylor and by the book the body is not an apology and also by the workbook um rachel cargill i know we referenced a lot and you should follow her at rachel.cargill but also specifically at the great unlearn is a really good platform on instagram at renee eddo lodge follow her on instagram and also listen to her podcast and at leila f sad and also do the same listen to her book listen to her podcast read her book at kimberly letrice jones go to her instagram go and watch all her ig tvs and specifically watch her talk

about monopoly and economics and just watch your mind melt with um amazement um akala i think for like if you're in the uk you will know akala already but you should definitely listen to his music um read his book and you can follow him at akala music also i hope you're writing all of this down and also chadira eggeroo who is the slumflower at the slumflower we cannot talk about the Slumflower enough. We're obsessed by both of her books, What A Time To Be Alone and also How To Get Over A Boy and follow her every move on Instagram and just love her. Monroe. This wouldn't be, we can only go kind of five minutes without mentioning Monroe. Would not be an episode if we didn't talk about Monroe. No. Monroe Bergdorf, at Monroe

Bergdorf. Monroe Bergdorf if you really need to listen to her that is really a voice that you need to be listening to. She's now been hired by L'Oreal as a part of their racial inclusivity board after being paid essentially zero pounds to work with them. She's really creating the change and also Bola Juju who's an amazing poet and you can buy her poetry book her first poetry book which dr poet and you can follow her at which dr poet um and she has lots of online content so i hope that you genuinely go and i think that we've just given you a bulk of work if you don't know where to start yeah i hope you're still here if you're still listening if you're still listening and also if

you don't know where to start there's so many people there's so much discourse at the moment where do i start what now what now What now? That's what now. Yeah. What's now is you educate yourself and then you educate others and you support, you continue. Yeah. Reimbursing black people for the damage

we have done and we are continually doing. Completely that. And any IGTVs and accounts and videos and everything will be available from our stories as well at Higher Priestess. So you can find everything directly from there and then go and support the black people that need your ears and your money there we go thank you the work continues learn with us call us out call each

other out call your friends out support black perspectives black voices listen and learn let's do it guys we've all got work to do let's go let's do it got work to do let's go