Good Life Project - Brad Montague | Becoming Better Grownups

Episode Date: April 28, 2020

Brad Montague is the co-creator of Kid President, the internet sensation featured on Soulpancake Youtube channel. As a writer and director his work has garnered more than 900 million views, been translated into countless languages, and captured the attention of people like Tom Hanks, Beyonce’, and even the Obamas. As an illustrator, his encouraging work is seen and shared daily online. It can also be found on newsstands in Joanna Gaines' Magnolia Journal. Brad is the force behind ‘Socktober’ the worldwide annual drive connecting people with their local homeless shelters and ‘Wondersparks’ - free classroom resources designed to cultivate empathy and imagination. He and his wife Kristi live in Tennessee. They have two small children and operate Montague Workshop, a creative studio working to reimagine the future. His newest book, Becoming Better Grownups, (https://amzn.to/34DqPkx) inspires us to spend more time discovering what matters.You can find Brad Montague at: Website: http://beabettergrownup.com/|Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bradmontague-------------Have you discovered your Sparketype yet? Take the Sparketype Assessment™ now. IT’S FREE (https://sparketype.com/) and takes about 7-minutes to complete. At a minimum, it’ll open your eyes in a big way. It also just might change your life.If you enjoyed the show, please share it with a friend. Thank you to our super cool brand partners. If you like the show, please support them - they help make the podcast possible. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Imagine spending a summer, having a blast, being creative, making videos with one of your favorite people, then watching those videos go out into the world and become this massive global phenomenon that would lead to audiences with everyone from Beyonce to Tom Hanks and even Obama. That was the experience of today's guest, Brad Montague, who along with his brother-in-law, Robbie, created the viral phenomenon known as Kid President. Brad never saw it coming though. And in today's conversation, we take a step back in time to explore his passions, his interests, and experiences leading up to that moment, what it was supposed to be when they started out versus

what it became, how along with all the amazingness was also a lot of struggle and how when it ended, it also left Brad in a bit of a dark place that he had to figure out a way out of. And we also dive into how at the same time he became a dad and how that really changed him and his lens on life and what he wanted to do, how he reclaimed a new sense of purpose and identity, lifting himself back into a joyful and curious and creative place by sitting in classrooms around the country and listening to young kids share what life was like and what they most wanted from teachers and adults.

That journey not only brought him back to a place of creativity and curiosity and vibrance, it led to a book called Becoming Better Grownups. We dive into this entire miraculous, fun, and heartfelt journey today. So excited to share this conversation with you. I'm Jonathan Fields, and this is Good Life Project. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch,

getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series 10. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required. Charge time and actual results will vary. Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun.

On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die. Don't shoot him, we need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight Risk.

So I grew up on a farm, and you just go out the back door, and you have this just open fields to run in, and there were no limitations. It was just wide open and quiet. And I think that I really believe that small town life, and especially small southern life, breeds a certain type of weird that you see, because people are able to create their own worlds. And there's a certain idea too you get of how communities work and how important we are to each other because we're so small we we band together it's not just solitude and i'm alone it's it's also you know i know my postman's name i i know everybody you know it's it's tight-knit

yeah that's beautiful um so you grew up literally on a farm? Yes. My dad grew cotton and we had pigs and corn. And every story that has a hero who starts on a farm and wants to leave resonated with me deeply. I watched Star Wars and went, yes, Luke is right. He needs to go to battle. He's got to leave this little farm. All of those stories, I felt that as much as I loved that environment, I also felt this, ah, there's so much more to do and be. And I want to share this with the world. Yeah. I mean, was there an expectation when you were growing up that you would sort of continue

with the farm? You would continue the tradition sort of like a generational thing never stated in words like never said um i felt like there was but i don't think there that my dad would want that he the big thing i got from him was i watched my whole life a grown man do what he loves to do. I saw him with animals and I saw him tending to these crops and doing what he loved. And I know that he sees what I'm doing and might be like, I don't understand how you're making money, but I see that your eyes are lighting up. And I think that there's a respect and love for that. And I would be a terrible farmer. In an odd way, it's almost like you are a farmer, but it's different fields and a different crop.

That's true. I mean, so much of what in work, I will think about it as if it's tending to a garden. It's planting seeds and waiting and watching. And there's a story I tell a lot of a man who lived down the road from us who would sing to his flowers. And while I would never want to garden and plant flowers, I always loved, it was scary at the time because he's sitting on the porch singing to flowers. But I like that idea of telling flowers a story or seeing if that would help them grow. Because I know that that is something that nurtures us as people. And that's what I'm interested in. Yeah.

When does that interest start to touch down? When you're really young? I mean, were you somebody who loved consuming stories and devouring stories? And when did the notion of creating your own start to touch down? It's always been something that I just, it rattled my bones. Like if somebody said, hey, you want to hear a story? Or I'm going to tell you a story. Or Once Upon a Time.

Or anything I was in. And also obsessed with creating my own that were stories always about birds who wanted to fly. Like always about these animals on the farm. And I created comics. I would finish my tests early in school just so I could draw on the back. I had a teacher who thankfully noticed that. And she said, hey, you don't have to rush through. I'll give you blank paper and you can share these stories with the class.

And that really gave me an outlet. She even helped those stories. Like she would take these things I was writing and would send them to the upperclassmen who had a school newspaper. And as a fourth grader to have your work in the school newspaper was huge. But those sorts of things were always something that I've been fascinated by, how you can create a world or create words together and somehow have that mean something to somebody. Yeah. I mean, that's beautiful. And at the same time, I'm just thinking as a fourth grader, which is right around the time when most of us are kind of starting to get pretty self-conscious, to know that you've written a story that maybe you love, but then to know that it's going to get published in

the school paper and then all the kids are going to see it. Was there any fear associated with that? Or were you just kind of rolling with it? The answer to that is no, there was no fear. And yes, there should have been. Because, you know, you think about what you would say to that younger version of yourself. And I was on the cusp of being, of about to go through a lot of challenges, a lot of misunderstandings and people seeing the things I would share and shutting them down.

One of the teachers that I talked to in the process of visiting classrooms and things, he's a music teacher and he works with kids. He actually does PS22 in your area. And Mr. Gregg, he said that in fifth grade, if you stop singing in fifth grade, it's going to take a long time for you to find your voice again. And I really believe that's true. There's a point where we begin to hide these things. We begin to see how, oh, what do they think of me? Oh, what is she going to say? And that really, that self-conscious stuff piles up. And that really started to hit me shortly after that.

Yeah. It's amazing how people sometimes touch down in our lives and give us little gems like that, that maybe even seem insignificant in the moment, but some way that it lands enough so that we remember it and maybe take action on it. I'm often reminded, and I've shared on the podcast, I'm sure more than once or twice, sitting now with Milton Glaser years back in the early days of Good Life Project, and him sharing a story about how in New York City, where he grew up, he was both good at art and good at science. And he was kind of supposed to go and take the exam to get into the, I think it was Bronx Science, which is this legendary institution in New York. But instead, he took the exam for performing arts without really telling anyone. He was making a left turn instead of a right turn. And his, I think it was his guidance counselor found out and called the man afterwards and said, Hey, uh, so I heard you took the exam for, uh, for performing arts. And he opened his door in his office, pulled out a box of these sort of like French pastel, you know, like, and, and said, you know, like do good work. And, and that was this beautiful acknowledgement to him

of something like, don't stop. This may not be what other people expected of you, but there's something here. And roll with it. Yes. Yes. That's beautiful. fascinated by when you're speaking to someone, regardless of who they are, what you have in common with them, or how uncomfortable you feel like, because you're like, oh, they're too much, they're too far more successful than me or whatever. If you begin talking about childhood,

and you talk about who the people were that informed who they became, it's like you're talking to the true version of them. Their shoulders relax, their eyes light up, and they tell you almost word for word the moment of when this person told them who they were, reminded them who they were. And that's rocket fuel for me because it somehow brings everybody back to their purpose. And it also just reminds me how valuable it is that we remind everybody that we're doing that every day. Somewhere, everywhere, that's happening right now.

Somebody's looking somebody in the eyes and saying, ooh, I see you. I see, I can see where you're headed. Yeah, it's a great moment when that does happen. You just shared that soon after this sort of like fourth grade-ish window, some bumpy times were headed your way. What was going on? It was a whole lot of feeling like I did not fit in in any place. I had no place at the table. I was too weird for some, not weird enough for others. All of these things that I've come to

discover are somewhat universal. And even talking to many of my classmates, realizing that they felt the same way. And going through that, I carried it with me for a long time, carried that feeling of worthlessness, of not being enough, and not knowing what to do with who I am. And I did a drawing of a backpack, and I drew it as a way to show that there's all this stuff that I think I had been carrying around with me for so long on into adulthood, things like shame, insecurity, what people thought of me, what had happened to me, all of this stuff I'd been lugging around and hadn't realized that I could just drop that.

And also hadn't realized that what's been inspiring too is as I open up and shared that this is something I've been carrying around, I've found that lots of other people have been lugging that stuff around too. Yeah. You're absolutely not the only one. Was your realization that you could take the pack off your shoulders and lower it to the ground, did something happen or was it just a gradual awakening to that? It's been a gradual awakening to that. It's been a gradual awakening all the way around. I think there's this idea that I had at least that I would arrive, that I would

suddenly blossom like the very hungry caterpillar and into this butterfly. And growth doesn't happen that way. And it at least didn't for me because it's still going on for me. It's an ongoing process. And I think back so much about how much I wish that a younger version of me could know that and know that you're a work in progress constantly and that it's okay to feel out of place because it's going to help you help others feel and find their place. It's okay right now that you feel all of this because at a certain point, you're going to understand where other people are coming from as well.

And you're not alone in carrying all this. And it is a process. Yeah, no doubt. I mean, it's funny. I agree. And you see, especially in New York City, I think maybe this is more prevalent in major cities, kids sort of getting, quote, tracked for, you know, you're getting tracked for the Ivy Leagues at three years old. It starts with the preschool, especially in a city like New York, where you literally have to go on, you know, your kid has to interview to get into a preschool.

Right. Which has always kind of like amused me and horrified me simultaneously. But, but yeah, I mean, just to know that, you know, you know, like you are a perpetual unfolding and that's actually, that doesn't mean there's something wrong with you. That's just the way it is. Like if we could, if we could know that really early on and, and realize that that's not, it's not a signal that something's broken. Yeah. I mean, how much suffering could we all avoid? At least it seems like we could. Absolutely, absolutely.

To just know that it's okay. Nobody else got the memo on how to do this. We're all learning and growing together. And it's okay to even talk about that has been one exciting thing even just recently to realize that because I found myself after creating things quietly in a small town and then suddenly being pulled into a bigger world in which more people are paying attention to it and then realizing oh no I really need to shut down I don really need to shut down. I don't need to tell everybody that I don't know what I'm doing. Having a video go viral and then ending

up in these boardrooms and these big fancy people I've seen on the covers of magazines and not being able to carry that weight. And so finally just saying, I don't know what I'm doing. And then having the head of a network go, oh, good, me either. It's thrilling and terrifying. Yeah. And at the same time, it's the thing that connects us all, right? I mean, let's fill in a little bit of the gaps there. So did you end up in college or did you go straight into the working world? Yeah, I went to a small school in Tennessee, Freed Hardman University,

majored in everything possible until I figured it out. I landed in media because I loved communicating and creating. I played around with teaching fourth grade because that was such a pivotal time in my life. And I was like, I'm going to teach fourth grade. But I found myself in all the classes really being excited about designing videos and things for the curriculum. And just quickly realized I needed to be busy making. And moved on from that into the world of news. So behind the camera in that world?

Yes. I found myself in a local newsroom. I was working alongside the evening and morning news. And I was a photographer. I had the camera and I was supposed to go out with these reporters. And I was helping capture stories. And I enjoyed it at first until I hit this point in which there was an accident at an intersection. And I was so obsessed with getting the right shot that it hit me in this moment that I was moving a family member out of the

way to actually capture this image. And it just, I felt so gross. And I realized that I had become so obsessed with this story and that most of the stories I was telling, it was the worst day. It was somebody's worst day. And I was documenting that and broadcasting it and amplifying it out into the world. And I was like, I've got to find my way out. I don't know how or what, but I don't know that I'm built for this.

And I found people that are. There are people who are doing it well. But that was a wake-up call to me that I needed to find a way to tell different stories of what's happening. Yeah, so it wasn't that you wanted to stop telling stories. It's just this was not the type of story and this is not the way that you want to be involved in telling them. Yeah, because there's usually one of two ways. There's like you tell the tragic story and they do that on the news that they'll share there's an accident. Or there's like the guy who's the good news guy. And he comes on and says, isn't this great? Something great happened. And it's very quick. It's usually at the end. And it's just this like positive, it's just super positive. And it's like, that's too

blind to everything else. The other was too dark. Like how can those two things hold hands and dance and be friends? Like how can the dark and the light, the heavy and the light, how can all of those things be together and be playful, but also heavy, dealing with these profound things that are happening to us every day. I didn't know the answer. I mean, it's interesting that as you say that, the thing that immediately pops into my mind is Fred Rogers, who was known for being the guy that did that, you know, like for a couple of generations at scale, you know, where he would go in and, you know, he didn't want to just, he wanted to be of service to kids and to speak in a language that would resonate with him,

but at the same time was really pretty fearless and not shying away from hard things in life and introducing to them and having those conversations. I feel like in an interesting way, the path that you have carved for yourself over the last decade or so is sort of that state of mind and of that lens on work and service to the world. Wow, that's very kind words. What Fred Rogers did, it continues to be revolutionary to the point that it was so quietly revolutionary at the time that we're only just now catching up. Like everybody mocked him and made fun of him during his time on air, but he just kept showing up and kept doing it and talked about divorce and talked about family members in prison.

He talked about death. He went through all of this stuff alongside children every day. And people just thought, oh, they would use words like namby-pamby, and he's just this weak person when he was bold. And that kind of fierce gentleness is what we're hungry for. It's what we need. It's what actually moves things and changes things. I think about a lot the fact that you have several in media that will do things that are about making dreams come true. And Fred Rogers released a song that was, just because you dream it doesn't mean it's going to happen. That's actually a song he did.

And people were like, oh, he's just that nice guy. But no, he was saying the hard stuff. And we need to go through the hard stuff together. And it takes fierce gentleness. sleeping. And it's the fastest charging Apple Watch, getting you 8 hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required, charge time and actual results will vary. Mayday, mayday. We've been

compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were gonna be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're gonna die. Don't shoot if we Yeah, I know one of, you know, after you start to make your decision and move out of the world of business, you know, at some point after that, you end up teaming up with your, I believe, across the street neighbor. And I want to dive into that and the relationship there. That then becomes this huge phenomenon that we come to know as Kid President. But even knowing you a little bit and knowing that you're very likely the type of person where your brain is just throwing out ideas nonstop. I'm curious, were there sort of like these pockets or ideas or projects that happened in the interim there that just, you kept trying and falling flat

on your face or until you sort of like hit this thing? Oh, there's a whole like just sea of terrible ideas behind me that I've left in my wake. I mean, when I left news, I was like, I've still got to figure this out. And I have my own camera. I was doing advertising sales for a while and I was making commercials. And I loved being able to inject creativity into that. But there was one bagel shop in our town and I was like, he just needs customers. If I could, I got an idea. So I said, what if I hosted a live talk show in your bagel shop, brought people in, we aired it on TV, local TV. And he's like, great,

that sounds perfect. And so we did it. Except he kept running the business while I was doing this live talk show. So it aired on TV and it's me like interviewing the mayor and different people. We had a lady that brought a dog on. She wasn't from the vet or anything. She just liked dogs. It's just all different guests from the community. And you could hear coffee grinder in the background the whole time just going. it was terrible TV, but it would, that was my grad school. The rest of my friends were out going to law school or wherever else.

I was in a coffee shop on a no budget talk show, learning how to produce, right. Make your own thing and have nobody watch it. And, but you know, like you said, at least there was an educational value in the experience at the end of the day.

So how does the idea for Kid President drop? Like, how does this actually come to life? Well, I'd been just really figuring out what it was that fired me up and what I loved. What I really loved was telling stories and bringing people together. There was this element that I found when my wife and I started asking the question, how can we be who we needed when we were younger? How can we be who we needed? we were younger? Like, how can we be who we needed?

And the answers to that were many. We began thinking of all the things we had, all the things we wished we had. One of those things was summer camp was really important to us. And we met at summer camp. We worked at a summer camp together, and then we got married on the soccer field at the camp. It was special to us. So we created this program for kids who wanted to change the world. And it was junior high, high school students. We're spending time with them. All of these young people that had ideas about how to make their community better. So I'm spending time with kids who are doing things like starting soup kitchens, a couple of girls in Alabama that did that. Kids that were starting programs in their community to feed people all year round that were doing fundraisers. It was beautiful. And then I've experienced this massive culture shock almost of going back into adult world and not seeing that same childlike openness to solving problems.

Instead, there is a critique of the problem. They actually were like, let's just do something about it. And at that same time, I had a friend who gave me some hard truth. And he said, you are one of our most creative friends, but we actually just need you to start doing one of your ideas. And that hurt. He was like saying, you're very creative, but you actually need to do one of your ideas. And so instead of just rattling around all these ideas, we started the camp. We did the camp. And then from that, I said, I'm going to actually create something that invites people to listen to kids.

What would it be like if a child was in charge? And so we got a little desk, invited my brother-in-law who lives across the street, it's Robbie. And I just started to ask him questions. And I was gonna, the original idea was just a handful of videos I was gonna do over the summer

while he's on summer break. And it was gonna be a creative series that I was gonna stick to. It was gonna be an idea that I didn't give up on, but it was just going to be for two months. And I asked him questions like, you know, if you were in charge of the world, what would you do? And he started dancing. I asked him questions about the political party system. And he said, like, I'm not in a party. I'm in a party. Began like playing, writing scripts, like playing around with how it could feel like it's very improvised, but also it had a mission and heart behind it that was pushing things forward as

point of view. And it worked. Yeah. Did it work out of the gate or was there, I mean, I guess when you say it worked, I know it seems like the energy that you both had, and I think probably not a lot of people realized that there was this guy named Brad behind the scenes sort of like orchestrating a lot of stuff. But clearly the dynamic between you and the comfort and the ease led to this really wonderful on-screen experience. Saying it worked, I mean, how are you measuring that in the beginning? And how did you measuring that in the beginning? And how did you know?

That's a good question because when I think back, when I say it worked, like my metric was very different because the first video got like maybe 100 views and lots of positive comments. By lots, I mean a dozen or so saying, this is great. You guys were awesome. It was all friends. And it was just a joy of feeling that we had made something together. And also, I started to feel like it was the first thing I had ever made that felt like me. Even though I wasn't on screen, it was like I found my voice. And I got to do it

with my little brother together. We made this and we had fun doing it. And so there was just such an ease in creating them and then releasing them. And it was only by doing it, I just said, I'm going to release one every week. And with each one, they began to grow. And my vision of what we could do began to grow. A lot of people think the first video was the first one they saw, which we had a video that went cuckoo bonkers viral. That was the pep talk? It was this pep talk from him. That was our first one that really blew up. And that one was a runaway train of millions of views. But we had made about 15 or so before that. But I'd just been building community around, listen to kids, listen to kids, every single week saying, listen to kids,

not just this kid, but all the kids around you, every single week. And then millions of people started listening. So on the one hand, I would imagine that's incredible because now it gives you access and it gives you a certain amount of power and also a certain amount of responsibility. And at the same time as somebody who loves to create and loves to tell stories and kind of loves to be in a bit of a small town controlled environment. When this happens, when that one video, you're doing the early ones and you're getting a good feeling and you're doing something you love with somebody who you love. And that's how, in your mind, well, yeah, that's success. This is awesome. And at the same time, you're 15 videos in, you're like, oh, I'm actually sticking to this. So it's like, it's proving what you were trying to prove, you know, on that level too. And then when, when the pep talk video just explodes globally into

the public's consciousness, on the one hand, it's, it's quote success on one level. I'm curious how else you experienced that. You know, like, was it, because along with that is a lot of eyeballs and a lot of high level exposure. And I'm wondering, you know, just what was going on with you? Was it all good? Was it all amazing? How are you experiencing that profoundly rapid transition and scale? Yeah. I mean, it came from such a pure, joyful place and then suddenly became something everybody had an idea about. They thought they knew what it was and i i felt very much like oh no people don't understand what we're trying to do here so it went pretty fast from being this is so fun and i'm loving this to oh no everybody thinks i'm doing something different than I am. Because on YouTube, the general idea is you film a kid opening toys or something

and you build up a community and brand around it. And that wasn't what we were doing. It wasn't about that. There's also this idea that there was this big machine behind it. And it was literally just he and I at the house making these. And it went from me finding my voice and my joy and making to suddenly being lost in it. And we had created a monster that was bigger than me or Robbie.

People would stop him in the airports and be like, give me a pep talk. I need one right now. And he's just a child, like a normal kid. And he would go, I don't know you. I'm not supposed to talk to strangers. And they're like, oh, he talked to me. And they just go away. And at the same time, there were other people who were reaching out asking for him to endorse energy drinks, to be in like a horror movie. There was one film that wanted, this is insane. And I'm going, this is not what we intended.

And so it became a constant course correction daily of going, that's not what this is. That's not what this is. This is what we are celebrating kids. This is about celebrating not just one child, but all children. This is about the children around you, not just putting up one kid on a pedestal. It's all children. And what I've found is that you can't control the mob. You can't control everybody. But there is that core group of people who latch on to and see what you're actually up to, and who believe in it and understand it and embrace it. And so I had to tune my frequency away from that and into the actual heart and soul of this mission. And the mission became what I focused on. And thankfully, we had creative

partners with Soul Pancake. It was Rainn Wilson and some friends created this just wonderful production company that championed it. They believed in sticking to that, creating walls around people turning it into something else it was and letting me continue to guide the ship and me trying to let it be love that's guiding that ship. It took a lot of work. It took a lot of breath out of me. Yeah, I mean, I would imagine, especially because there's the dynamic of you also, you know, Robbie was what, 10 or 11 at the time, something like that? Yeah, he was, I think, nine years old when we were

at the White House meeting President Obama. Right. So here's a young kid and granted, yes, he's joyful, but at the same time, you're the grownup in the room. I would imagine there's a certain sense of responsibility. Not just am I doing right by the project, not just am I doing right by the community of kids who are really trying to be a source of love and service to, but also to this one kid, you know, like who's family to me and like, is almost like a perpetual question in your head, which is like, is this okay? Are we okay? Is he okay? Yes. That was the constant terror. It was, I saw this side of me at the time when we started, I wasn't a father yet. So I hadn't seen that side of me of turning into Papa Bear, of being able to speak up and say, no, you leave him alone.

You get back like, no. And realizing that this was only going to be a success if at the end of it all, our family was still a success. Like if we still liked each other, we still wanted to be together. One person that reached out, which is this has become a habit for me now because this guy did this. But Nirvan Mulk is a filmmaker. He had had a video the year before the Kid President pep talk went viral. I remember that. Yeah.

Kane's Arcade. It's beautiful. This guy's heart is just, I love him. And I loved that video. And I got a message from him the week after the pep talk went viral. And he reached out to me. And at the time, my phone, my email was just a war zone. And there was this little message from him.

And it was just this bright light of hope. He said, a lot of people are going to be asking things of you right now. I'm not asking anything for you. I just wanted you to know it's going to be asking things of you right now. I'm not asking anything for you. I just wanted you to know it's going to get crazy for a bit. But this was his advice. He said to let the love that you have for that kid be what informs everything you do. And it just suddenly made everything okay. It was like, okay, I don't have to worry about anything else that's my my job in this is just to love him well and everything will be okay and that that began to inform a lot of decisions and then we sort of formed this coalition of people that anytime there's something that goes

cuckoo cuckoo bonkers viral online or whatever i try so hard to just send a little transmission their way and say, hey, like, you're still a person no matter what everybody else says right now. And just take care of the kids around you. Let that love guide the way. Yeah. And at the same time, I mean, it was never really so front and center. But it also wasn't in any way hidden that, you know, like Robbie has this condition, osteogenesis imperfecta, which is sort of like, I guess,

more commonly known as brittle bone disease, where, you know, he's just, I guess, he is subject to having bones in his body broken much more easily than the average person with even the most normal movements or impact in a way. That has led to, I guess, many, many surgeries over the years and things like that. And so I would imagine that in the back of your mind, that's all part of this too. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It was early on, you know, when I first met him, he was just a few weeks old.

And they explained this condition. And I am terrified because I'm thinking, oh, this poor baby, I don't want to hurt him. And as he grew, he would want to play. And it was always he wanted to fight and be rough. And he wanted to be outside and he wanted to kick me. And I was like, this is not fair. I don't want you to get hurt. And there was an older child who had grown up and he had the same condition, osteogenesis imperfecta. And he said that one of the things he remembered from his childhood was his parents saying, no, you can't do this. And his advice to our whole family, to everybody, he just said, these are words that helped

us. He just said, we know our limits. Like, don't let us know what to do or not to do. Let us figure out the limits. And so that's really what we attempted to do and and i took the lead from his mom and dad my mother-in-law and father-in-law who are just some of the greatest people on the planet i believe i watched them parent him following their lead i let him say what the limits were and watching him blossom in the midst of any

challenges. There was a time he's a teenager now. And a few years ago, he's at the soccer field and his leg totally breaks in the middle of the game. He's on the ground. I rush out to the field and I look at him and he is laughing. Part of it to just cover the pain. And then also he's making fun of another guy's cleats. And it's just like, that's seeing the way he navigates those challenges was what made everything okay. And that I knew no matter what challenges he came up against or we came up

against, we could march through it joyfully. And that's the strongest you can be. It's when you're marching through things with joy. Yeah. I mean, having that compass and having that love between you, I think's so powerful. just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series 10. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required. Charge time and actual results will vary. Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to't shoot if we need them y'all need a pilot flight risk at some point also i mean you you i guess both realize that you were building not just an

audience but a community and it seemed like you know that that the seed got planted somewhere along the way that that you know how can we tap the power of this community to do good at scale like how can we how can we organize and activate them you know things like socktober um which will explain what that is actually well so the internet became this game for me when i started to realize that it was not fun anymore just to post a video. It was like, okay, people are watching. That's nice. Then it was, well, what could we get people to do? How could this fictional world we've created actually reach out into the real world and shake things up. And so it started out just with dumb things, where I would just say, Robbie, let's get everybody to have a big dance party. And so

people would send in videos of them dancing. And I would see the clips come back, and it would be families, these entire classrooms. And you have these images in your head, and you're going, whoa, people are actually watching and engaging and doing something differently with their lives. What else could we do? And so we did a thing where we had people mail corn dogs because that was the thing that I did in college where we would mail food to people. It's not smart. It was just a joke that he said and people actually began doing it. In fact, I still get corn dogs in the mail. It's funny, but disgusting. And then when we started activating people to love their community, to do something for their neighbors, they shared us ideas that were already happening. We had an initiative that we had done connected to this camp we had created with all these kids that was to serve our neighbors who were homeless. So we found out socks were one of the least donated,

but most needed items for our shelter as they're getting ready for winter. And we had done it and it had been really this just personal project that was really nice locally. But then when I had a kid president YouTube video, him declare Socktober for everybody to see people not just do it because a fictional YouTube character told them to do it, but to begin doing it because they're like, oh, this is actually simple. It's something we can do. And there's no prize. There's no reward other than it's just helpful. And they started to do it. And a few years ago, I made the decision I wasn't going to even advertise it anymore or push it because I wanted to see what would happen organically.

And to see that it is so much bigger than a person or a thing, like nobody even knows where it started. A lot of people are just doing it because we've always done it. And that's something that I'll never grow tired of. And I'll always be trying to find other ways to do those things. And just to give a little context, Socktober actually is, it's basically, it was this mass invitation for people to donate socks super simple but at scale it turns into this thing where in October it's October millions of socks at some point like at one point are getting donated around the country

yes I there's there was a moment within that that that I've held dear to me because I'm in the midst of all the kid president craziness and the misunderstandings, people not understanding what we're for a living. And I said, oh, I make silly videos on the internet. It's about kids and grownups working together to make the world better. And he's like, that's nice. Let me show you something. And he pulls out his phone and he showed me a picture of him with his daughters delivering items to their local shelter. And he said, yeah, you should check this out. It's called Socked Over. And part of me wanted to scream local shelter. And he said, yeah, you should check this out. It's called Socked

Over. And part of me wanted to scream to him, I did that. That was me. That was my idea. And the other part, I was so in shock that I'd sat there in the sky on a plane just going, wow. Sometimes it doesn't matter who gets the credit. It just matters that it happened. And I got like a little wink from the universe, you know, hey, it's working. Just keep going. You'll see little glimpses here and there, but you won't always. So I hold that one dear for the days that I don't see the impact. Yeah. It feels like, I guess at a certain point,

Kid President as a phenomenon kind of plays its way out. And I guess at a certain point, Robbie doesn't want to be that person anymore, right? I can imagine he's moving into his teen years. It's like, can I just live my life, right? He's not a showbiz kid. He has no interest in it. It was just fun. He liked it

because we were doing it together. And now he just wants to play in band and soccer, be with friends, normal human boy stuff, which was the exact prayer at the beginning that he would be normal. Yeah. Which also drops you into this really interesting moment, right? Because you go into this with one idea of what it's going to be. It turned into this whole different thing, teaches you a ton, also shows you what's possible. And I'm guessing kind of reconnects you more visually to both what you do want to be doing and what you don't want to be doing. And now you're a couple of years older, married, a parent at that point also then, right? Right. I have a son and a daughter now. Right. So then you're in this window. You're kind of like, okay, so that was amazing. What now?

Yeah. I thought it would be fairly simple. I'd just move on to the next project and that would be it. Except the next project was a kid's show that took about a year and a half or maybe two years. And it was a good show, but it never aired. They just didn't pick it up. And then I found myself pitching projects, working on books, and really soul searching, going, what is it I want to sink my teeth into? A bit of fear now to even launch into an idea because I'd actually had an idea that worked and going, oh no, if you try this, it could work and could overtake your

life for the next few years. So there was a bit of fear to now that an idea would work, not that they would fail. And I struggled too with really wrestling with a deep sadness, a depression, a place in which I didn't know how to pull myself out of because I didn't know what the next steps were. And so I did know the one thing I did enjoy because I was too afraid to write anything else. I was too afraid to make any more videos. I didn't want to go on YouTube and read comments. I didn't want to make anything on YouTube. I was too afraid to make any more videos. I didn't want to go on YouTube and read comments. I didn't want to make anything on YouTube. I was done. So I just got an email from a teacher and she asked if I would visit her class.

And I was like, I can't, I wasn't going to even leave my office. And it was just an online thing. I could just check in. And she wanted me to listen to projects her kids were doing. And so that was the first little classroom visit that I did. We had done them before, but I just, that one woke me, woke me up. I sat there and I didn't have to speak. I just sat there and listened as these kids excitedly shared with me ideas about how they were going to make their school a better place.

And I just started to realize maybe I could just, I don't know what this means or is or what to do with this, but I'm going to visit kids because this is giving me life. This is waking me back up to what matters. So I did school visits and then I turned into a whole listening tour. And I said, I'm not going to speak. Don't worry. I'm not going to like bore you with any new stories. I just want to hear from you.

So then I would send a few prompts or I'd send a treasure map for them to talk about or something for them to draw. And I would send a few prompts or I'd send a treasure map for them to talk about or something for them to draw. And I would listen. Sometimes I would put tape over my mouth and they would just talk to me. It's like, this is your one chance to just say to a grownup whatever you've always wanted to say. And more with each visit, it was like oxygen. I was just coming alive. And it turned into what is now this book, Becoming Better

Grownups. Yeah. And I mean, it sounds like it not only turned into a creative endeavor for you, but also to a certain extent, it was the thing that began to lift the weight of the sense of depression that you were feeling. It was the thing that kind of brought you back to a place of curiosity and interest and sense that, oh, and almost like it reconnected with you with a broader sense of purpose and, or at least being more interested in exploring that again. Yeah. What was so great is the kids didn't want anything from me. They didn't request any, I did not have to perform. I did not have to be anything other than who I was, which was a gift. Nobody else in the world other than my family was asking that. Like,

everybody else wanted me to deliver the next viral thing, tell their brand how they could connect with people on YouTube or something that just felt icky. All they wanted was just to be and share. So there was that element. And then there was this whole hum underneath it all of seeing that in the midst of these kids and their brightness, their ability to open up, there were these teachers, parents, caregivers of all types that were enabling this attitude that were having these classrooms that were places that felt like what I wanted the world to feel like.

Yeah. And the, I mean, from that tour also becomes sort of a, like a giant data set that becomes this beautiful new book, Becoming Better Grownups. I'm curious at what point along the tour do you start to realize, oh, there's something here that needs to be consolidated. Like I'm getting all of this amazing wisdom from these kids. And it's not just about what they want, but it's about what they want from people who are the grownups in their lives. It's in the title of your book, Becoming Better Grownups. When does it go from a listening tour that's bringing you back to life to, oh, this actually needs to be a book? And why?

I think it was about halfway through. My goal was to get all 50 states. And I'm about halfway through all the states. And I was thinking, this isn't a podcast because there's enough podcasts. And also, I didn't want to worry about sharing kids' voices without them. You know, it was just I wanted it to be pure. And then I saw this look in some of the kids' eyes as they would share with me. And it was this look of hope that I would tell somebody. Like, you're going to make sure the grownups hear this, right?

Like that kind of idea. And they would share it, not just because it was going to be funny to share this drawing of a grownup. They would share that they would draw them really scary or whatever. They would share some silly idea. There was that element of fun, but there was also this element of please let them know we need them. Please, please send this message.

And there was also this idea that if I really want to create things out of this be who I needed when I was younger, I think about all the adults in my life and what a gift it would be for them to know how much they matter, to live into how much they matter, and those moments with me I needed. There's also, you think about, when we were running summer camps, we would begin each week by thinking about what we wanted the face of the kids to look like at the end. So we would say, okay, what does the face of every camper to look like at the end. So we would say, okay, what is the face of every camper here look like when their mom shows up? Like, is it just total

that we would talk about that face and you want that child's face to be, I just experienced the most magical thing ever. And I don't have words for it, but over the next couple of weeks, mom, it's going to leak out and I'll be able to explain it and put it into words maybe. But things are different now. So with the book, I began to think about, well, what if there was a world that felt like these classrooms? Like what if the things that are already happening in the world were amplified and we could show people how much is happening already interactions between an older person and a younger person that are literally shaping the future helping us reimagine what's possible that there's this strong undercurrent

of good that's happening all the time that we don't nurture enough. So I thought about the end. I love that. I mean, there are so many poignant stories and just, and the illustration's also awesome. But the whole thing is sort of like you're holding a document, which is sort of the manifestation of sustained wonder, but also poignance, you know, and moments back and forth within it with stories between one of the things that really stayed with me, actually, there was a story you share about a conversation, a kid named Marcus.

Would you share that? Yeah. Well, it was one of those situations where that insecurity was popping in again, a feeling like I don't belong in this room. I had been invited to be part of a panel of people in which there were community helpers. So there were people with real jobs that were working in politics, someone that was a veterinarian, there was a law enforcement official. And then there was me. And I was just going, I don't want you kids to turn out like me. These other people are good, but you don't want me here. And there was a kid who reached his hand up in the back. And at the very end of things, he asked a question of me and asked what I was like as a kid.

And it was almost as if he knew I'm the artist in this classroom. I need to know that everything's going to be okay. I got to share with him how much his teacher then opened up about how he was the artist. He was drawing. He was a little quieter. He had created all this art. And she began to point in the classroom and show me his stuff. And I got to just let him know what a gift he had and not to lose that.

And that we needed him to be Marcus and to stay Marcus, like stay who you are, Marcus. And as I was giving him that advice, I was thinking, I've been sitting here this whole time not wanting to be me. And I have the audacity to look at a child and tell him that he's okay just the way he is. So I had a lot of growth that needed to happen for me. And I have a drawing somewhere here in the workshop that's from Marcus, a thank you with birds. Because we need each other to help each other grow. And he helped me grow that day. This is beautiful so i think um

feels a good place for us to come full circle in our conversation also so hanging out together in this container of the good life um and the good life project um if i offer up this phrase to live a good life what comes up a flood of things come into my head, but there actually is an answer that an older man I interviewed said that I hold on to so dearly and I wanted to keep it. So I've made it into this little poem I could just carry with me everywhere. I asked an old man the meaning of life and what to do before we're all dead. To love well is to live well, is all the old man said. There's a man who said that to me. To love well is to live well. And I think that that is the secret answer to unlocking everything for us. Wherever you are, whatever context you're in, how can you love well?

And I'm still figuring that out. I'm a student of love. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening. And thanks also to our fantastic sponsors who help make this show possible. You can check them out in the links we have included in today's show notes. And while you're at it, if you've ever asked yourself, what should I do with my life? We have created a really cool online assessment that will help you discover the source code

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If there's something that you've heard in this episode that you would love to turn into a conversation, share it with people and have that conversation. Because when ideas become conversations that lead to action, that's when real change takes hold. See you next time. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die. Don't shoot him, we need him! Y'all need a pilot? Flight Risk. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever,

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