Good Life Project - Glo Atanmo | A Life Beyond Convention

Episode Date: June 24, 2021

When Glo Atamno stepped on a plane with a one-way ticket and $500 years back, she knew she wanted a life that was different from the one she was expected to live, one filled with adventure, one that broke the mold of how others had always told her life was “supposed” to be lived. What’s unfolded has been a life of not just adventure, but also profound exploration, growth, connection, and impact. A life of stories. Over a period of years, she also figured out how to build a powerful living around her quest as a creative entrepreneur and online educator. Starting as a travel blogger, venturing to over 80 countries across 6 continents and telling the stories of destinations around the world, she landed features in Forbes, Oprah Magazine, Conde Nast, Essence, BBC, collaborates with major brands, and hosted "The Glo Show" podcast. But, over time, her journey began to morph into something both bigger and deeper, especially over the last few years, as she felt called to speak honestly and openly on issues of equity, race, and community in a more intentional way. She's the founder of The Social Educators Academy, helping people leverage their social platforms to make a difference and make a living. As we spoke, Glo shared powerful reflections on the travel-centered life she’s been living, her experience both in the U.S. and on the road as a Black woman, and how she’s continuing to evolve her focus, life, and livelihood in new directions as we all emerge back into a changed world. You can find Glo at: Instagram : https://www.instagram.com/glographics/The Glo Show : https://pod.link/1537789031If you LOVED this episode:You’ll also love the conversations we had with Chris Guillebeau, who spent a decade traveling to every country in the world, while building a global community fueled by impact and adventure : https://tinyurl.com/GLP-Chris-------------Have you discovered your Sparketype yet? Take the Sparketype Assessment™ now. IT’S FREE (https://sparketype.com/) and takes about 7-minutes to complete. At a minimum, it’ll open your eyes in a big way. It also just might change your life.If you enjoyed the show, please share it with a friend. Thank you to our super cool brand partners. If you like the show, please support them - they help make the podcast possible. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

So my guest today, Glo Atonmo, stepped on a plane with a one-way ticket and $500 years back. She knew she wanted a life that was different from the one that she was expected to live, one filled with adventure, one that really broke the mold of how others had always told her life was supposed to be. And what unfolded has been a life of not just adventure, but also profound exploration, growth, connection, and impact. A life of stories. And over a period of years, she also figured out how to build a powerful living around her quest as a creative entrepreneur and online educator, starting out as a travel blogger,

venturing to over 80 countries across six continents, and online educator, starting out as a travel blogger, venturing to over 80 countries across six continents, and telling the stories of destinations around the world. She landed features in Forbes, Oprah, Conde Nast, Essence, BBC, collaborates with major brands, and hosts the Glow Show podcast. But over time, her journey also has morphed into something bigger and deeper, especially over the last few years, as she felt called to speak honestly and openly on issues of equity, race, and community in a more intentional way. She's the founder of the Social Educators Academy, helping people leverage their social platforms to make a difference and make a living. And as we spoke, Lo shared really powerful reflections on the travel-centered

life that she's been living, on her experience both in the U.S. and on the road as a Black woman, and how she's continuing to evolve her focus, life, and livelihood in new directions as we all emerge back into a changed world. So excited to share this conversation with you. I'm Jonathan Fields, and this is Good Life Project. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist,

whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone Xs are later required. Charge time and actual results black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS are later required. Charge time and actual results will vary.

Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were gonna be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is?

You're gonna die. Don't shoot him, we need him! Y'all need a pilot? Flight Risk. So, as you and I sit here jamming in different parts of the country, you are literally on your way back out of the country. You just came back into the country from Grenada. Yes.

And where you were for, I guess it was about a week or so. So here's my curiosity around this, right? You have for the better part of your adult life, been deeply vested in the pursuit of travel, in living basically around the world, almost perpetually. It's your devotion, a deep love of yours for a chunk of time, a substantial part of the way that you sustained yourself in the world. And then the last 16 months happened, right? And I'm so curious for somebody like you, where this is not just something that you happen to do on vacation, but it's so woven into the fiber of your being. What was this last window like for you? A necessary reminder to sit the heck down. And what I think quarantine and the height of the pandemic allowed for us high achieving, restless souls to do is sit with

ourselves and say, okay, are we running towards something or running away from something? What does this need to constantly be on the go stem from? And I had a very chaotic childhood. I'm the daughter of Nigerian immigrant parents, one of six kids. And so chaos became my norm. It's like, if the house was too quiet, I'm like, let me start a fight with one of my brothers and sisters. And I think with just being able to sit still,

like I'm 31 now, getting my first apartment, just first living space at 30 years old, I felt so behind. I was asking my friends questions like, okay, so when you pay rent, there's also utilities and water and like trash, because at Airbnb, you just pay one fee. So like hotels, you pay one fee. And I was like, what are all these extra expenses? So I was like asking these like very like basic questions. But again, what I do appreciate is that I was like, what are all these extra expenses? So I was like asking these like very like basic questions. But again, what I do appreciate is that I was able to just sit still and reflect. What am I building? Where do I want to go? Okay. I reached my dream to get paid to travel the world.

Is this it? Do I sit comfortably at this, the top of this mountain and feel like I've made it, or do I climb back down and start summiting another one? Yeah. So that's so interesting. I mean, because from the outside looking in, it might be easy to assume that like, oh, this had to have been a devastating time for you. Like this had to have been a time. And for a lot of different reasons, I know there's been a lot to deal with. But in the context of travel, what it sounds like is that this was also a time of just really rich fertility of just, and deep exploration of, okay, like, let me look back at what got me here and then take this time as a pause to figure out where am I going from here? I love that word of exploration because it was like that outward

exploration was what I was doing, but that inward exploration was missing. And I was just constantly at the mercy of these brands and sponsors and tourism boards where I was doing, but that inward exploration was missing. And I was just constantly at the mercy of these brands and sponsors and tourism boards where I was just like constantly churning out content for them, their messaging, their content, their market, their country, just boom, boom, boom, just spamming my audience with like, travel is amazing and da, da, da, da, da. But I was like, Glo, what? Have you healed? Like you're talking about all the beauty of the world. Like what's the beauty in you? Like what do you love about yourself? Like these naturally intrinsic questions that most people should ask themselves at some point in life. I think I was able to avoid

that because I had such an adventurous outward life. So again, with just the stillness, like even something as basic as being able to sleep in the same bed for like more than a week. Such a luxury. Jonathan, I was like, oh, I get to like actually I picked out a mattress for the first time. I was just like, this is so cool. I get to like invest in something that I'm going to like go to bed in every night. So it really felt like I was on like this new kind of journey, which also felt like an adventure for me. Yeah. And I mean, to be able to do that is incredible. So you mentioned your

parents, Nigerian immigrants, six kids in the family, and it was not the happiest upbringing for you. So it sounds like that travel was part coping mechanism, part distraction slash escape. But over this time, and maybe like even before this, what were the things that were sort of seeded in your early life? What were the awakenings that you've had where you said, oh, well, you know, this is the stuff that I need to actually revisit now and process? Jonathan, with the good questions, wow. Well, I also grew up with a pastor's daughter. So again, and I still love Jesus and I still love God and the church and what Christianity represents. But I think because it was shoved down my throat and I didn't have a say in how I got to live my life. It's like, this is who you are, what you believe in. Anything that

you do to try to rebel, you just get your butt whooped. I grew up in a spanking household, so I got spanked a lot. But we would go to church three to four times on Sundays. And it became this chore rather than something that I actively got to participate in. And that spilled Christianity, that spilled into education, that spilled into what we were allowed to watch. And I remember watching the first PG-13 movie at 17 years old. Like that, it was like, there's restrictions like that the media puts on and then there's restrictions that Nigerian culture also like implements like, no, no, you need another four years before you can handle what PG-13 is. And even PG movies, it's like those, like, I think we started watching that maybe at 16. Like, it was just so delayed.

And so going to school, you know, in your formative years as a teenager, you just want to fit in. You want to be able to have the water cooler talk and know what everyone else is, like, referring to. But the music, the movies, the TV shows, I didn't have access to any of that. So I always felt so behind and so awkward because I couldn't relate to any of my peers. But like education, that was like a massive priority, which I do appreciate because that has like instilled this discipline in me. And I think even to this day, I'm still able to value education and learning and growth so much because that was deeply embedded into my childhood. But I will say one of the first

things that I revisited was just how I thought about the world. When you grow up in a very constrictive culture that tells you what to think, you kind of just take that as bond. You take that as you're like, okay, well, my parents know better than me. They're grown and they're adults in my life. I will just listen to whatever they say. But then you start growing older and getting curious like, wait, no, actually, even though I'm a Christian, let me explore what Buddhism stands for. Let me explore what Hinduism is. Like, just for the sake of having that awareness and that education, because I believe awareness

and education breeds compassion. And I didn't want to be this person where I was like forcing God down people's throats because I was holier than thou. It was like, no, I just, I invite people into my perspective of what Christianity is because I've seen how God has moved in my life. And so that became the way I started to revisit everything in life. Everything became an invitation to deeper perspective as to why I believed what I believed. And I think if the world can have that approach as like, let me make my beliefs an invitation to a new perspective

rather than you need to think this way, you need to believe this way, you need to act this way because it's the right way. And the travel taught me that there's no right or wrong, there's just different. And we can all coexist in our differences. Yeah. I mean, what a powerful lesson to learn. I wonder also, when you start traveling, you're sort of like, and I think you started back in 2013, basically, 500 bucks, one-way ticket, I am out, right? Sort of like tapping out of the mainstream choices and saying, this is where I need to go. But I wonder, back then, it sounds like you're just saying, I'm exiting all this really

traditional expectations to just go do this thing. But I wouldn't imagine, and tell me if this is right or not, that back then you started to realize part of what I'm actually doing is exploring so many different parts of the world, of culture, of geography, of society, so that I can start to understand there is something bigger than just the beliefs and the culture that I've been raised in. That must have been sort of like an emerging part of the experience, I would imagine. Absolutely. It was an act of rebellion, but then it was also an act of freedom. And it's funny, they say in Nigerian culture, you're a doctor, a lawyer, or a disappointment. And so I was in that third category for most of my 20s. And I actually didn't tell my

mom I was no longer a pre-med major until 10 days before graduation. That's how deeply embedded the fear was that I was like, I am disappointing her. This is going to like ruin our relationship. Like everything is going to be destroyed. And I went to school. I went to a university in Kansas. And so my mom lived in Arizona at the time. So I was like, after I graduate, technically I'll be, you know, I'll need a place to live. I can't go back and live under the roof of someone who I just told, like, I cannot be

the person you need me to be. So leaving the country was also like, look, I'm going to run away from all these expectations that you've placed on my life because I don't think I'm meant to be a doctor. I don't think I'm meant to be a lawyer either. As good with words as I am, I believe there's more to life than just having a career that's financially stable. I was willing to chase this sporadic, crazy, almost lawless industry of influencer marketing because it didn't even have a word back then. But I was willing to chase that because I was like, I'd rather start from the bottom and build a path, build a bridge, build a way, and then leave a path

behind me. Because when you go where there is no path, it a bridge, build a way and then leave a path behind me. Because when you go where there is no path, it's like, okay, at least you build one for the next people after you. And I've always been that kind of like self-starter leader. Even in my basketball teams, I was always a team captain because I love to mobilize and help and like bring things together. And sometimes you look back on your childhood, like the things that made you different as a kid is what like will make you money as an adult. And being able to be so observant because I never fit in, I was like

dorky, goofy, weird, poor. I got all these reasons that no one wanted to be my friend as a kid. And so it made me really observant. Okay, how do the rich people interact with each other? Okay, how do the jockeys and the cheerleaders, okay, the immigrant kids, like everyone had their clicks, even as young as elementary school. And I was able to just have that like bird's eye view of like, okay, this is these are like the societal norms and the things that people buy into at a very young age happens naturally. And like, how can I find a way to blend in with all communities? And so some days I would sit with the cheerleaders, other days with the chess club, another day with the immigrants, you know, and it was almost like that adaptability, that chameleonic way of like surviving as a kid, as a teenager is what allows me to be so open-minded when I traveled because

I was like, I was doing this before I even knew what I was doing. Like I can be in Jamaica, Japan, Sri Lanka, Norway, and still feel like I belong because I found a way to observe first and then blend in later. And yeah, I find that to kind of be a cool skill. Yeah. So it's almost like the early version of different countries for you were different clicks. Yes. Oh, Jonathan, putting the pieces together. So cool. Yeah. It's like it was effectively training for where you would go. But here's my other curiosity around this. I know you also bounced around, your family moved a whole bunch when you were younger. So part of my curiosity around that also, and because of what you just shared is,

was this curiosity and sort of like putting on the scientist hat and deconstructing the social dynamics of the different groups, was that entirely genuine curiosity? Or of like, you know, putting on the scientist hat and deconstructing the social dynamics of the different groups. Was that entirely genuine curiosity or was it, do you feel like some of it was also the manifestation of a, almost a level of hypervigilance that you tend to see with kids you see in military families, you know, like where they have to, they're constantly dropping into new environments and they need to develop the skill of scanning the horizon so they feel safe and they feel like, how can I navigate this world so I feel okay? Yeah.

Reading the room, that almost an act of survival. Yeah, you're right. Yeah. I think during those times, you never really look at it like, I'm doing this because this has happened so often. I need to be able to get through the days and the weeks and the new cities. But yeah, I look back on that. I'm like, yeah, that was like a sense of survival, because as a teenager, really, you put so much value into belonging and having your people,

your clique, your friends. And so when you don't have that sense of community or that tribe that you've built around people who are not just like minded, but like hearted, you feel out of place, you know? So yeah, I think for me, that was definitely a sense of like survival. And then also just like, how can I get through my day, you know, without feeling like isolated the entire time? Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense to me. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you.

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We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die.

Don't shoot him. We need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. The Apple Watch Series X is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist,

whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you 8 hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required. Charge time and actual results will vary. I know you've also,

I've heard you describe yourself as an empath. And I'm curious about, given the dynamic that you're describing, I'm really curious how you navigate that also, because, well, first tell me what you mean, because I've heard people use that word in different contexts and to mean different things. Tell me what that means to you. And then how did it really show up for you? Yeah. It was a taxi driver in a random country who just made an observation. He was like, you have HSP, don't you? You know, you're a highly sensitive person. And even in the brief moments that I was in his car, he could tell that I was just picking up on senses and things and everything around me. And I think as an empath, either something from our childhood or something that we've experienced makes us feel like we need to feel for other people, not just observe what they're going through, but feel with them.

And I think it could be a blessing and a curse. The reason I'm able to communicate, well, I have a communications degree, but the reason I'm able to communicate so well with people and, you know, share such in-depth stories on Instagram that gets thousands, tens of thousands of shares is because I'm able to put into words what a lot of people are thinking and feeling, but aren't able to really say. And when you're an empath, again, you probably have been very observant as a kid. You probably have been put in situations where you saw someone get deeply hurt and you had to sit in that hurt with them. And yeah, I think because I've also

just been through so much trauma in my life, I can see when someone else is in a traumatized position. And I rather than just sympathize like, oh, that sucks. Oh, I'm so sorry for that. It's like, I'm sitting there in the depths with them like, oh no, I know what this feels like. Let me shoulder some of this pain for you. And again, blessing and a curse because it's like, it makes you have thicker boundaries because I do, you know, there was a time where I shared in 2019, I had an ovarian cystectomy and it was basically like a watermelon sized cyst that was growing on my ovaries while I was traveling. And I kept ignoring it, finally had emergency surgery and it was insane. But when I finally shared that story, so many women came pouring into my DMs and emails saying, oh my gosh, this is my story. I've been so embarrassed about it. I couldn't find information online. Thank you for sharing.

But they were pouring so much of their pain, not their triumphs on me. And I was just like, I literally had this like vulnerability hangover where I just felt so heavy because I was now carrying the weight of all these people who had this really traumatizing surgery or going through the pain. And yeah, you have to really step away from that every now and then. But I see it more as a blessing. I'm very thankful that I think I have a deeper level of compassion because of that empathy that I can feel with people. And yeah, I look at it as a superpower at the end of the day. Yeah. I once heard an acquaintance of mine who's a neuroscientist describe, he's the first one who ever sort of like

made this distinction for me he described as a distinction between what he called emotional empathy and cognitive empathy and he said you know there's there's the empathy where you can like cognitively you can sort of like deconstruct and feel what other people are feeling and you feel some of it also and then there's emotional empathy where effectively you feel what they are feeling and he said you know the problem with that is on the one hand, it's beautiful. It's good because you can relate on a profoundly deep level to almost anybody and their suffering in particular. The problem with it is if you feel their suffering, their pain on the same level that they feel it, you lose the capacity to be of service because you're just right there with them.

And so it's so important to figure out how do I allow enough in to feel enough so that I can be of service in whatever way makes most sense, but have that boundary so that you're just not constantly in the wound with them. That's powerful. Thank you so much for sharing that. I'm going to marinate on that tonight.

Cognitive versus emotional empathy. That's so powerful because you're right. Losing that ability to be of service when you're just sitting in the sulk with them. That's good. It's interesting. So I have to imagine also with you, because you've spent so many years now dropping into situations where you couldn't control the circumstances.

You couldn't necessarily control who was coming at you. You were referencing online, people were pouring into your DMs, but you also put yourself in physical situations where you were not in a safe container. You just dropped into a world where you knew you had to figure it out. That being an empath and being highly empathic in those scenarios, again, was probably a bit of a mixed blessing.

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think there's a quote by Les Brown. Gosh, it's going to slip by me, but it has to do with something about being willing to put up with the unknown challenges rather than the safety of existence. And I think that uncertainty, and Tony Robbins also has the six levels, six human needs, and one of them being variety slash uncertainty. That's probably in my top two. There's something about me that craves unfamiliarity, almost like a commitment

to my uncommitted ways. I can't commit to buying a house. I want to buy a home. I don't know where I want to live. I'm at a place where I'm like, go, it's time to, maybe there's investment property, but I want to start buying my forever home because I built up my savings and I'm ready, but I'm like, I don't know where I want to live. And I'm, I'm afraid to start building my dream home in a place where I'm like, I changed my mind. So you gotta, um, even with dating, it's not that I can't commit to one person, but I get bored very fast because I have to feel like you're a different adventure every week. Like if we go through every conversation possible and I feel like I can no longer learn from you, I'm going to get bored. I want everything to feel like an adventure. And that's not

sustainable or probably possible, you know, realistic. So I have to come to terms with that, you know, my therapist and I were unpacking that. But yeah, there's so many interesting things that I've learned about myself, again, stemming from just sitting still during the pandemic. an interesting sort of question to say, well, is it possible for me to get that same feeling through more of an internal experience anywhere I am for as long as I'm there with anyone who I'm with for as long as we're together in relation in some way, shape, or form? That's got to be a really interesting exploration. I think that's the power of books. Books take me out of my world and into someone else's. And even in my apartment, I've decorated it beautifully, but I'm already like, hmm, it's time to redecorate because I'm bored. I'm just like, Glo, this isn't a good use of your

money. It's beautiful. You don't need anything different. But I'm just like, I've seen it for too long. I need to switch it up. And you're right. It's like, how can I make that adventure or that variety inward, rather than constantly changing the outward appearance or location of something? Yeah, I mean, I remember the cognitive scientist Jonathan Haidt saying, you know, like he one of the first books, I think it was his first book actually is, you know, a sort of one of the leading voices in the world of positive psych, which I'm sure you know already. He wrote a book called the happiness hypothesis and effectively, you know, he summed it up by saying happiness is in the in-between, you know, it's the, in the in-between your relationship with you, with other people,

with location circumstances, the world. But I wonder like if, what if we reimagine the in-between, you know, as the in-between our ears? Ooh, I like that. I like that. And yeah, you do have to find that self-love and that happiness and joy of like yourself, your circumstances, your position, your career, what you're building, your purpose, your legacy, your mission, like all of that has to come from within before ever trying to project that on a person or a place. You know, I think back in 2013, 2014, when the rise of solo female travel bloggers started to like really take off, I remember that a lot of the hate mail that we received was like, what are you all running away from? Like, what are you all in search of? Are you trying to find love? And what are you trying to find? And it's just like, that sense of adventure that we craved was just, it was inherent. But I think until we find a way to create that adventure inside of our day-to-day

or in the mundane, the monotony of a sunrise and a sunset, that is something where I'm like, every single day I have an alarm. I'm like, nope, sun setting. I just get a coffee or a tea, maybe a glass of wine. And it's just like, I sit in that moment of gratitude of like, what went well today? What could I have improved on? What did I enjoy about today? And those moments I spend by myself and I might journal and it's really so powerful when you're able to have those small routines that you can really build for yourself. Yeah, I would imagine, especially when you're on the road a bunch, having some sort of ritual that's portable or practice has got to be. It's like you've got this moving foundation that always goes where you go.

Yes, absolutely. Journaling, for sure, is one of them. I have like six journals from 86 countries. So it's like, yeah, just so many, it's so cool to look back. Sometimes I'm like, no, I'm going to wait 10 years before I ever reread any of them. But it's really cool to look back five years ago, where I was, what I was doing, what I was building. Because for many months, I was actually living on $10 a day, eating bread and butter, because that's all I could afford. And I didn't want to give my mom the gratification that I was failing. When you're in the infancy stages of a new dream or a new goal,

you don't know what you're doing. You're building on the way up. You're building out the blueprint as you go. And so when I didn't have money, when I couldn't feed myself, I rather starve than call her and say, hey, can I borrow a hundred bucks, mom? Like I'm right now, I'm not in a good place. And right now, you know, one of the sponsors is three months late on a payment. I don't know when my next gig is going to be. It's like, no, I'll just, I would take a nap actually. That was like my best way to overcome the stomach growls. I would be sleeping in my hostel. And for those that don't know, hostels can be like rooms of like 20 different bunk beds. And you have people from like 20 different countries, it could be a really kind of like funny experience, just the side conversations

that can happen. But I would just like force myself to sleep all day because I'm like, I'm literally so hungry, that hearing my stomach growl, like if I could just avoid hearing that sound, because that sound reminded me how much I was struggling, how poor I was. So you know, but I would get back up, I'd write a blog post. I would pitch another company. I would pitch another brand. I would walk into different restaurants and just pitch myself on the spot. Like, hey, you know, I know this is, like, I'd be in Spain, for example, and I would just ask to see their menu. And I would, like, spot all their errors. And I'm like, hey, I can, like, because I was a graphic designer too. I was like, let me redesign your menu, like, just I was like let me redesign your menu like just 50 euros let me redesign your menu let me also correct all of your typos you know the

translation is bad soy americana you know I'm like I can do this for you and I would just like create opportunities as I go so yeah and and that just like hungry hustle like my goodness you can't teach that like at any moment when I like got down my last dollar, I could have been like, all right, Glo, well, you gave it a fair shot. Time to just pack it up, call your mom, ask her to book you a ticket home and go to grad school like she wants you to do. But I was like, nope, give me another year, get another month, another day. If I could just afford the next day or the next week, that was enough reason to keep

giving myself a shot. It's almost like failure wasn't even an option for me. I would go broke so many times, but it was like, okay, that didn't work. Okay, that didn't work. Okay, what did I learn? What can I do better? I was just so hungry and eager to figure it out that I was almost such a threat because it was like nothing could get me down. I was like, okay, been broke, been hungry, slept on a park bench when I couldn't afford a hostel. Like, I've been at my lowest so many times. I'm like, what? It doesn't get lower than here. So all I can do is keep rebuilding, keep trying, keep working towards something different until, you know, I figured it out.

And then eventually, the five-figure jobs and the six-figure gigs and the first class tickets, all of that started playing out. And it's like, you look back and you're like, whoa, what if one day you just gave up? You know? Yeah. I mean, that, that is the question, right? Because so many people, I'm so fascinated by this journey of creation, you know, and effectively you're creating a business, you're creating a livelihood, but you know, when you're doing something that hasn't existed before you, there's no certainty.

There's no guarantee. There's like you're out there in the world and there's there's nothing, especially when you were doing it. You know, there weren't a whole lot of other people where you could point to and say, like, this is this is definitely possible. And here are the steps to make it happen. You're kind of building that bridge as you go. And there wake up every morning and I'm fascinated by the process of convincing yourself that I still believe enough that this is possible that I'm going to spend another day doing it, even on all those days where it feels like the universe is telling you you're dead wrong. Right. And it's almost like because you're building this brand as a reputable travel writer, travel blogger. I mean, I shared enough where I was like transparent about like what I was doing, where I was going next. But you can't really just post like, hey, guys, I haven't eaten in a week, but I'm still good. Like you can't, you're building your brand, you're building travel content, you're telling stories when people are following you, they're there for your stories. They, you know, at the end of the day, you're still living a very privileged life. And I always joked that like, you know, if I'm going to be broke, I want to pinch my pennies in Paris. Like I'd rather be looking in the over the river scene and Eiffel Tower and not have money there than, you know, somewhere in like my home city where I grew up in Hayward, California. So it was a sense of like, even though I was struggling, I still felt very privileged because I felt like I didn't have the confinements of a boss that I hated or a nine to five that didn't fulfill me or a job or coworkers that I didn't agree with

or like. I still got to create my every day. I'm like, okay, I would wake up like, what opportunities can I create today? Who can I pitch? What can I work towards? What can I do to just like build a little bit of momentum? Because momentum is lucrative. A lot of people want those big wins right away. But if you just take that one step, you get that one small win, it leads to the next one. So every day I would try to do just one small thing that builds a little bit of momentum to give me a little bit of hope, just enough to keep going. Yeah, I love that. And it's interesting also. So you mentioned that you also have a background in design. Was that part of what you studied in school also? I mean, you said communications, was it design also?

Yeah, so I was an interdisciplinary major of marketing, communications and design. I was like an early adopter to social media back in 2004 is when I had my very first blog. And that platform was called Xanga, which is now defunct. But every single social media back in 2004 is when I had my very first blog. And that platform was called Xanga, which is now defunct. But every single social media platform that came out almost 20 years ago, I was on the Tumblr, the blog spot, just the OG platform before MySpace and Facebook. So I really like, I got into that world of like learning coding, learning design, and teaching myself Photoshop. So yeah, it's interesting. Even to this day, my Instagram handle is still Glow Graphics because Glow Graphic Designs was my very first

entrepreneurial endeavor. I've actually been wondering about that. I was like, where did that come from? That's so interesting. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X.

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What's fascinating to me too is that there's the way that you approach travel is very much like human centered design. It's like design thinking approach to it. It's like sort of saying, okay, so this is a design problem, right? Can I actually make this work? Can I build a life that is filled with adventure and experience and shared humanity? And the way that you're describing figuring this out is like this iterative design thinking, deconstructing, let me figure out what the real questions are. Let me lead with empathy. Let me prototype every day and try something new and get feedback until I

figure it out. It's like, it's kind of a fascinating overlay in the way that you've approached it. Yeah. And I think I also started to understand that if my travels or my journey or my brand just became about showing off how luxurious or amazing my life was, there's no substance in that. Honestly, there's no quality to that. Honestly, there's no quality to that. And I knew that if I was going to maintain impact and I wanted to encourage people to see the world or change their opinions about a different religion or a different region of the world that they didn't have any experience in, other than what the news showed at the six o'clock segment about the violence that happened there. I really always wanted the approach to be like, how can I bring more humanity to the world in a way that was also

relatable? And that's sometimes bringing in humor that's talking on socioeconomics, talking about politics. Like I also became like a little bit of a risk, like when brands and agencies would hire me, it's like, okay, you're working with Gl Globe. Be careful because she might be honest. And I was willing to even turn away money, even when I was still building, but to say no to money if the messaging was like, okay, you have to make sure you only talk about the positive, that you're only promoting this, that you don't show the poverty. And I'm like, wait, but if that's the country's story, and it wasn't that I was going to highlight, like, look how broke people are here. It was like, no, if this is a part of this country's history, why not shed light on it to make people more informed? And I think one of the hardest countries that I had to cover was

Brazil. Because Brazil, a lot of people think, you know, the US, you know, slavery was the biggest in the US, but Brazil actually had the largest slave port in the Americas. So colorism is a huge issue there, where instead of just saying, okay, slavery, let's finish it, you know, and let's, you know, move on. It was like, let's send all of the Black people into the jungle so that they can die off. And then eventually, or we're going to force all of the Black people to reproduce with the white people so that, you know, we can eventually get rid of Black skin tone altogether. And that history showed up in me being at my five-star hotel with a brand on the brand's dime and someone coming, so a worker in

the hotel yelling at me in Portuguese, because that's the language they speak in Brazil, yelling at me in Portuguese, like, what are you doing? You could tell that it was just this anger. I was just like, what did I do? What did I do? And the night before I checked in at about 11 PM. So this was just my first morning in Rio de Janeiro. And I just bring out my room key and I'm like, what's the issue? And then she goes back to the front desk. I realized I'm actually a guest. They thought I was a sex worker soliciting other people.

And I'm just like that idea that like, if you have darker skin, that you probably are here for sex work. And I had to literally learn Portuguese phrases, eu não falo português, eu não falo português, so that people could see that I was American, that I don't speak Portuguese, that I'm not a local sex worker. But like telling those stories wasn't just, it wasn't about exposing the country. It was so that other Black women who traveled to Brazil, if they experienced it too, for them to know that they're not alone and for them to say like, hey, if it happens to glow, you know, it could happen to me too. And having like that shared sense of like, okay, like, you know, but the world is still a good place wasn't just, you know, one of the core values beyond adventure, it seems like really was integrity. Like you have a set of values and

beliefs and that has to be at the center of everything you're doing. I mean, what you're describing is, you know, it is horrifying. And also I'm sure an everyday experience for so many people in so many different places and countries, including where, you know, like where we are, you and I were, had an interesting experience. I want to say it was a couple of months back. We were on this app clubhouse. We're in a room, you know, I was fairly new to it. I think you probably were at that point also.

And there was a conversation going on. I think we both got invited up to the stage, which meant like, you know, for some, some reason people felt like they wanted to hear our voices. And I was kind of keeping quiet the whole time because I had nothing to contribute. And I was just sort of listening contentedly. And the conversation was about to wrap. And a woman sort of like chimed in and shared her truth around race. And it was deep, deep pain that she was sharing.

And here we are on this sort of like small virtual stage. I believe it was her, a handful of middle-aged white guys and you, and you entered the conversation at that point in a way that was so profound and moving and open. Would you share a little bit about your experience of that? Yeah. And I think when we think about meeting people where they're at and acknowledging pain, most people, especially underprivileged communities, they just want that acknowledgement of like, hey, this is what we're going through. And a lot of the times in some of those rooms that speak to business or speak to healing or human psychology, it can feel like it's only targeting and talking to one demographic of people. And so her pain

really stemmed from like, how come no one has addressed these issues? How come no one is understanding that it's more than just not having the funds to start a dream, it could be like systemic and all these other issues and racial and you know, and she just wanted to be held in that moment. And I can tell and again, that's where that empathy really has benefited me on my journey, because I felt the tears, I felt the pain. I've been in rooms where I knew that just my journey and my struggle wasn't acknowledged. My demographic was just kind of like, it could be a trigger, you know? And I think in those situations, and I always, I appreciate it. I believe someone also stepped in and tried to just, you know, navigate. And I appreciated

that he even, you know, wanted to say something because I know how delicate of a situation it can be, especially when it comes to race, because everyone wants to make sure they're not saying a wrong word or really acknowledging and holding someone in the right kind of way. So yeah, that was a special moment. I had a lot of people reach out in my DMs after that. And it honestly, I feel kind of called in that way where I found that I was kind of like a bridge for different communities. I went to a school that was 95% white. So I've been in a lot of rooms where a lot of triggering and insensitive things were said. And because I was the only Black person, I'm like, this isn't a time to speak up. I can't defend myself because no one's going to defend me. So I can see that world. But then also growing up first generation Nigerian, but then also, you know, everything, I grew up in Black culture. So I'm standing in the middle of these two worlds trying to figure out how can we get both of them to communicate and understand each other's struggles. And even last July during George Floyd, or last May even, like I committed my page to just creating these carousels that

just educated on the Black experience. And I mean, that exploded. My account grew about 200,000. And I think it was because just having, again, the way that I teach and the way I show up in this world, I never wanted to feel like force. Obviously, if I'm feeling trigger and aggression, it can be valid. But I knew if the impact you want to make is to invite people into a deeper perspective, you've got to figure out a way to invite people into the conversation and not force it down their throat. And I think it's been a while, if even at all, like race has been talked about like that, you know, as a way where it's like, wait, this doesn't have to be this awkward, uncomfortable situation. It can be something where I'm just learning about the life and the experience of everyday people, of neighbors, of coworkers, you know? And I think the hardest thing was when my sister told me that she went to work the next day and she said it was like like as if all she was the only black woman, of course, in that office, which is the experience for many black women in corporate, but she said it was as if every white person was afraid to talk

to her afraid to be around her afraid to look at her in the eye. And she felt like a ghost. It was as if people were just afraid of her and she she had done nothing. And it was just the fact that she was black. It was like, Oh, don't want to, oh, there's a lot of racial reconciliation and protests going on. Let me just pretend that she doesn't even exist. And that's even worse. And again, it's that acknowledgement. Most Black people just want this country to acknowledge the history and see that there are so many reasons, even to this day, it's like you look at the 400 years of the slave background, but it's like, oh, no one, no one owns slaves anymore. But it's like, there's things deeply embedded in this country's constitution and systemic laws that keep black people oppressed, you know, and it's like, once that can be like a common truth, then we can start working towards like reconciliation. But I think there's still a lot of denial. There's still a lot of let's just pretend it's not happening and hope that one day it goes away. And that George Floyd incident, what it did to the country and just like the amount of like hundreds of like white people,

friends, colleagues, professors texting me like, how do you feel? Are you okay? And I'm like, where do I start? I couldn't hold space for the Black trauma and white guilt. It's not that I want white people to feel like, oh, feel bad about your ancestors and what they did. It's like, no, just acknowledge and know that this is still an issue. Even though the past isn't your fault, the future of this country is your responsibility. So what active role do you want to play in making sure everyone in this country has a level playing field? Yeah. I mean, that's so powerful. I wonder whether while you're moving through this moment also,

you're asking yourself the same question, like what role do I want to play in the conversation? I remember a little while back talking to Austin Channing Brown, who made a very deliberate choice. She said, for years, I took on the role of education at the point of entry in the conversation, mostly for white folks in organizations. And she's like, I've reached a point. I don't want to put words in her mouth. She's an incredible human being. But what I heard in the conversation was,

you know, I've reached a point in my life, in my career, in my thinking, in my contribution where I want to operate at a different point in the conversation when we're further down the road, that is where like I want to be. And these are the types of conversations I want to have. And very clear on the types of conversations she doesn't want to have. And these are the types of conversations I want to have. And very clear on the types of conversations she doesn't want to have. I'm so curious what your thought process has been around. Obviously, you're a black woman, so you're in this the way that white folks are, but differently because we're all living different experiences. Right. But when George Floyd happens and things break open in a very different way. Right.

I'm so curious what your inner experience is of the process of sort of like saying, how do I want to be in this? It was almost like the calling was bigger than me. I didn't feel like if it was up to me, I would have just like uninstalled social media for another two months. Like I remember praying out to God, like where am, where am I needed? Like, let your will be done in my life. Cause I

don't, I don't want to show up. I don't, if it were up to me, I would just disappear and like meditate all day and like find my own healing. Because there was a lot of black people that we just felt broken and tired. And just, we just didn't want to be around people. We didn't have the energy. We didn't have the strength. We were hopeless, you know? So I'm like, I didn't want to do that, but I felt like there's this like divine inclination where it's like, okay, a lot of people are opening their eyes for the very first time. And when you think of like a newborn baby, are you telling your newborn, like, come on, get up and walk? You know, it's gotta be coddled just a little bit, you know? And so I'm, I saw that the content I was making was attracting newborns and toddlers.

And so in a way, I did feel like I had to spoon feed a little bit and really meet them at very basic and beginner levels. And some of my most viral carousels, like one of them has reached, I think 4 million people has been shared over half a million times. And the question is, is it rude to say black? And I'm like, sometimes I create these carousels. I'm like, oh, this is so obvious, but let me put it out anyway. And little did I know, people thought Black was derogatory.

They thought African-American was like the rule. Like they grew up, maybe they were taught that. Maybe that was, you know, the media they consumed. But Black was actually the preference. And a lot of people actually African- American means something different than Black American. And so just even categorizing the labels, because labels do mean a lot, especially for underprivileged communities. So I found myself just really just extending, probably overextending in the first like three months. I mean, I even created an ally resource guide that people can literally, it's like 30 days and 30 ways to be a better ally. Because my capacity was I can create one

carousel a day, but the DMs, the hundreds, thousands of DMs a day of like, ooh, teach on this, teach on this. And I'm like, wait, this is not my job. I'm doing this as like, I feel called to, but like my capacity is this. So creating this like $27 resource guide was also a way to say, okay, if you want to go at your own speed and also have a deeper resource, here's a handbook that you can do with your family, with your kids, with your partner. And that was also great because it allowed a little bit of a boundary that I didn't feel the need to keep creating at a faster rate than I could. And then I would say about November. So I'm doing this for about six months, just like leaning in

and just stepping up, being a voice. And I think I reached my burnout about November. I was like, wait, I'm not a racial educator. And I was getting like literally Fortune 500 companies like, hey, can you speak to our C-suite team and our executives, our 300 person department? I was like, I don't see. I could just like already sense the awkwardness of me speaking on a Zoom call of 300 middle-aged white men, because those are mostly the C-suite departments. And I'm just like, I don't see that being enjoyable for either side, you know? And I was like, there's got to be a better way. And I just, I started turning it down and referring other practitioners. I didn't find joy in that. And I also didn't want this to be my entire

identity. I didn't want to be the race girl. I don't enjoy talking about race. I'm doing it because I see a need and that's what leaders do. When they identify a need, they step up and they're usually called by this divine inclination or whatever. But I felt called to in that time because people were actually paying attention. But when I got back to the root of what I love and enjoy, it was that storytelling. It was the travel. It was the adventure. It was entrepreneurship. It was dream chasing. And so now I'm back, my account is back at a place where I'm able to mix in a little bit of both storytelling every now and then, allyship education. But at the core of it, it's like just chasing freedom, creativity,

what it means to build a life of your dreams. And that feels really good to get back to that place. Yeah, I love that. It's so fascinating to hear sort of like how you processed the decision making about where you were willing to go, not willing to go, how you want to be of service, how you didn't want to be of service and where the boundaries were as people just demanded more and more and more and more. And you're like, okay, so I need to be really clear

and set expectations to a certain extent. I'm also fascinated. So over the last 16 months or so, when everything was pretty much locked down, you know, like we're in this country during this, you know, the pandemic and a lot of racial reckoning and conversation in the country. Then almost as soon as it opens up,

you take a trip to Grenada, which is a majority black country. So I'm fascinated after sort of being in this country and in the way that society is here, and then dropping into a completely different place where it's majority black. How do you move into that? How does it affect you? How does it change the way that you feel and move through the day? It's therapy. Like I even just, I felt myself just like, cause I'll be honest, Jonathan, there's no tiptoeing. Like I live in a very like nice high rise building. It's mostly white men that, you know, live in this building and I could be walking down the hallway and I'll greet them, you know, good afternoon, good morning. And they'll just look at me and then look back down as if, again, that uncomfortable feeling of just like, oh,

black person. I'm like, what? I'm like, I could smile. So you see these teeth, like so approachable. Doesn't matter. It's this idea that I've created my opinion on what black people are. Therefore, I will not change that. And I will not communicate or acknowledge you. You experience that so often and it just starts to drain you and you get exhausted by it. And you do seek places where you can just slip in and just belong. And I've never really felt like I belong in any of the states that I've lived in. I never felt like I belonged anywhere because I was always met with, it could just take one or two people to look at me and scrunch their nose, to cross the street prematurely, to like be hesitant to get on the elevator if I'm there. I'm just like, really, you know, so Grenada, that was such you know, you have beautiful weather, beautiful beaches, and then

yeah, black culture, where it's just this invitation to just be and I felt so free there. I literally kept the word freedom just kept being this recurring theme in my mind of like, wow, this is what it's like to just be. And oh my goodness, I want that for every Black person. I don't know if they can find that in a specific city. And obviously it's a privilege to be able to just uproot yourself and your family. But I hope that wherever I do call forever home, I feel that sense of freedom. Yeah. When we think about the moment that we're in right now, I feel like we're all, there's a sense of emergence. I see it in you because you're out in the world more, you know, you're literally about to get on another plane after this conversation. And I know you've been through this re-imagining process. So knowing that you're a pretty intentional, as much as you hold a lot of space for serendipity in your life, there's a lot of intentionality also at the same time. When you think about what's coming next, how you would love to influence the creation of this next season, what does that feel like to you?

What's coming up for you around that? It's scary because I think this next chapter of my life is something that I've been putting off for a while, but it's now I feel thrusted into this space. And it feels good to feel like your level of competence matches your dreams. Because I think a lot of what keeps us back is like, oh, I need another degree and I need another certification. And we diminish what we know because we don't have the whatever resume. But I look at, Les Brown inspires me so much. I love the man. And I just, the way he speaks, the way he moves the room, the way he combines humor, motivation, and a little bit of church into his talks. I'm like, to be the female version of that would be incredible. And I'll be doing a speaking tour next year where it'll be kind of like, you know, we look at Brendan Burchard's, you know, seminars and his

High Performance Academy, but this will be a little bit smaller and more intimate, but just reaching people where they're at and just giving a little bit of everything because I feel like I've lived six lives. And I don't know if you know this, but I actually played semi-pro basketball in Spain for a season because that was able to get me residency. It gave me a stable income and insurance. So I mean, there's so many things I've done in my adult life that I don't really talk about or not many people know, but it's added to my level of wisdom or the lessons that I've learned in life. And being able to share that on a larger scale, being able to package that in a two hour keynote or presentation or documentary, something, but I'm ready to get my story out in a bigger way.

You know, I'm working with my lit agent on my book as well. So I'm ready for that exposure. I think I've, even if the exposure comes, I still be like, oh, well, maybe next year. I still hide because I know the level of criticism that also comes with that. And I've always been afraid of like, well, what if people think that my story is not good enough? What if they think I'm too this, I'm too that? You let the fear of what non-existent critics could say about you keep you small. And at the end of the day, you got to really just say, I think Brene Brown always says, I'm not interested in your opinion if you're not in the arena getting your butt kicked. Like, I'm down here willing to fight. If you're in the nosebleeds, I'm not

interested in your opinion. And most critics are in the nosebleeds. So I have to remember that. Yeah. Easy thing to know, not necessarily so easy to really integrate. I know. You know, but yeah. When you think about yourself, like doing this thing, going out into the world and what you just described and creating these experiences and these moments and sharing on the level you're talking about, do you have a wish or an intention for those who would participate in those experiences, those moments, that community? Yeah. One of my favorite comments to get on social media is, I needed this, or this was for me. And I remember in school, I was always so appreciative. I don't

know what administrators are responsible for booking those speakers, but you'd get every now and then in third grade and sixth grade and ninth grade, you get someone to come in and just talk to you about your future, about your dreams and your goals. And even though you'd see people on their phones and you'd see people talking, you see people look around and they're bored by it. I would just be like at the edge of my seat. I'm like, oh my gosh, I know it. I know this is me. This is for me. They're speaking to my life. I always felt so reignited by those talks because I knew that I'd never fit in. I knew I was never meant to be whatever people consider normal. Nothing about me is normal. Nothing about where I'm going is normal. And I always felt isolated by that. And so in these experiences that I'm curating,

I want to not only liberate people, but to make them feel like there's another way. Because oftentimes we get trapped by our circumstances or by the lives that our parents or our partners have already dictated for us. And so if I can just liberate someone for someone to walk out and feel like they've got a breakthrough, just seeing what's possible liberates people. And we joke in the Black community that like so many times we got to see someone else do it before we do it. You know, people will come to me like, Glo, I'm just waiting for you to go to Romania to make sure it's okay for me.

You know, Glo, what's Russia like? Once you go, I'll go. So we have to wait for someone else to give us permission, like give you the thumbs up, like, okay, entrepreneurship, it's scary, but it's not that bad. Come along, you know? And there's always that argument, is everyone meant to be an entrepreneur? I don't think so. But everyone deserves more, whether that's more freedom, more creativity, more time with their family and loved ones,

everyone deserves that. And I want to show people how they can start building ways to make that possible. Love that. I remember when you first shared about that you're working on a book, I literally wrote this down. You wrote, I have a journal where I document the emotions a book makes me feel and try to use that as a guideline for how I want my book to make others feel. And it seems like you have a devotion to creating moments, experiences, insight, wisdom that creates a feeling of possibility in others. Wow. I can't wait to listen to this episode because you poured into me so much that that is perfectly said. I think that's exactly it. I love that. It feels like a good place for us

to come full circle as well. So sitting here in this container of a good life project, if I offer up the phrase to live a good life, what comes up? To live a good life to me means a life filled with alignment. You are living according to your divine purpose. Something that you feel is so uniquely you and you're putting it out into the world. You are loving and living in a way that just sets you free, sets others free. You find joy in every circumstance. Even the bad times, you're like, well, I'm going to learn something from this, you know? But there's this level of peace that just floods your life. That's what the good life means to me.

Thank you. Yeah. Hey, before you leave, if you love this episode, safe bet you will also love the conversation we had with Chris Guillebeau, who has spent over a decade traveling to every country in the world while building a global community fueled by impact and adventure. You'll find a link to Chris's episode in the show notes. And even if you don't listen now, be sure to click and download so it's ready to play when you're on the go.

And of course, if you haven't already done so, be sure to follow Good Life Project in your favorite listening app so you never miss an episode and then share the Good Life Project love with friends. Because when ideas become conversations that lead to action, that's when real change takes hold.

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We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were gonna be fun. January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're gonna die. Don't shoot him, we need him! Y'all need a pilot?

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