Good Life Project - Mari Andrew: The Art of Knowing You're Not Alone.

Episode Date: November 20, 2017

On one level, Mari Andrew never meant to have the life she's now living. On another, it was her destiny.Mari is a writer, illustrator and solo travel enthusiast currently living in New York. She ...began posting an illustration a day on Instagram in 2015 as a way to share her lens on life and connect with people. In a few short years, her following exploded to more 600,000 people.What's so fascinating is why. These daily posts aren't created by the stroke of a fine artist's brush or trained letterer's steady hand. Instead, she offers simple stick figures and line-drawings. The power in her daily dispatches lies not in the technique, but in the simplicity of expression, the emotion, the honesty and relatability her work conveys.Andrew doesn't share her "shiny, happy, made-for-social-media life," but rather invites you into her meandering and beautifully real mind, flush with everything from grief, heartbreak and career confusion to spiritual journeying, illness, love, friendship, and the pursuit of the perfect lipstick to create comics that speak to a wide audience.Simply put, Mari's art lets you know you're not alone.We sat down with Andrew to explore her early years as a kid in Seattle, and how her relationship with her parents shaped her and her work. We talked about her journey to becoming an "artist" (a word she still struggles with), developing her voice, point of view and surviving a rare condition that left her paralyzed in a Portuguese hospital (a terrifying experience she's still recovering from).Mari has a book of essays and illustrations, Am I There Yet?: The Loop-de-loop, Zigzagging Journey to Adulthood coming out in March 2018. But, you don't have to wait until then to experience her work. Go find her on Instagram now.We're grateful for the kind support of:  ZipRecruiter: Post jobs for FREE, go to ZipRecruiter.com/good.ShipStation: Manage and ship your orders. FREE for 30 days, plus a bonus. Visit ShipStation.com, click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type in GOODLIFE.Bombas: Shop today at Bombas.com/goodlife, and get 20% off your ENTIRE purchase. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 I felt like I was in hell. It was profoundly isolating and I felt like I was experiencing kind of a room of life. Like if life is a house, there's this room like in the basement that you know is there, but you might go down and tiptoe and look in sometimes and you'll close the door and run upstairs. And I was living in that room. So today's guest, Mari Andrew, is a full-time illustrator and author who came to her art and her work and her commentary on sort of the human condition later in life. She actually started doing it on the side as a way to pull her out of a really dark place after a very big personal loss. And over a period of years, that sort of form of therapy turned into something that gained a global following
Starting point is 00:01:05 and became her profession. She now actually shares her art on a daily basis on her Instagram account, among other places. You can find her actually at Mari-Anne Jodemel. Of course, include a link in the show notes to that. And really excited to dive into the story where she came up, how she spent her life navigating between these two split sides, the practical and the passion-driven, and even explored everything from marketing to theology before landing on what she's up to now, and then diving into what's driving her at this moment,
Starting point is 00:01:41 at this season in her life. I'm Jonathan Fields, and this is good life project mayday mayday we've been compromised the pilot's a hitman i knew you were gonna be fun on january 24th tell me how to fly this thing mark walberg you know what's the difference between me and you're gonna die don't shoot if we him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever.
Starting point is 00:02:14 It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone Xs are later required.
Starting point is 00:02:35 Charge time and actual results will vary. So we're hanging out in New York City right now. And I want to dive into the last handful of years because it sounds like it's one adventure piled on top of another adventure on top of another adventure. But I want to take a step back also. You grew up in Seattle. I did. And it's funny because I've seen you.
Starting point is 00:02:55 I don't remember where I read this. But I remember seeing you write somewhere that you grew up in Seattle and you kind of looked at New York as like somehow that was your place. Which is funny for me because I grew up in New York at a time where Seattle was everything. It was like the heartbeat of music. It was the grunty Nirvana and Pearl Jam and like singles, exactly all this stuff. And I'm like, oh man, I need to be in Seattle. Grass is always greener. I know. I know. I think it is for everyone except me.
Starting point is 00:03:28 I was the only child. Yeah. Big part of my identity. And so I just watched movies all the time and TV. And they all took place in New York. Yeah. It was like, what am I doing in this jungle out here? No one goes here.
Starting point is 00:03:41 Everyone's in New York. I got to get there. So tell me what kind of kid you are. Oh, I think, well, being an only, you have an only child, right? I do, yeah. Yeah. I can't say I do, we do. You do.
Starting point is 00:03:53 Right. The royal you. Yeah. It's a very specific way to grow up. I loved it. I think it had such an influence on what I do now. Yeah. It was very observant, very introverted,
Starting point is 00:04:06 consumed a lot of media, books, TV, movies. I think I lived in a sort of adult world. I was always with adults, I was talking to adults. If I wasn't talking to adults, I was sitting there listening to adults and drawing and writing what they were saying. So, yeah. Were you, it sounds like you're in your head a lot. Were you a journaler? Yeah, big time. Like a mad journaler? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. It's funny because you get the sense of that from the work that you do now. You get the
Starting point is 00:04:36 sense of somebody who's been processing her thoughts for a really long time. It's really nice. Yeah. In a good way, in a good way. time. That's really nice. Yeah. Well, yeah, I think being a kid who didn't have a whole lot of friends, and my parents were my very good friends, and my parents were really cool. And they would just kind of take me around with them as part of their lives, just whatever they were doing. They just kind of threw me over their shoulder and took me along. And I think that I got a real glimpse of the bigger world, but it wasn't a world I could access yet. So I was just an observer. I was just an audience member. Yeah. What are your parents? What did they do? My dad was a guitarist. Okay.
Starting point is 00:05:16 And a musician. Musician. In Seattle. In Seattle. Yeah, exactly. Later San Francisco. And my mom, I think it's too late in life to ask what she does. She works with the computer. So I had quite a balance of the creative person who, in my mind, had a lot of fun, was kind of irresponsible. And I knew that I couldn't really do that because I was very responsible, very responsible only child. And then my mom worked really hard to pay the bills. So I had two really interesting examples. Yeah, that's kind of like the yin and yang. It sounds to a certain extent, like there was also a bit of sort of traditional role reversal.
Starting point is 00:06:04 Yeah, yeah. Would that be fair to say? Definitely, yeah. Well, I think there is that dynamic, the sort of Mrs. Doubtfire dynamic of the mom who's really trying to keep the family together and make sure everyone's fed, make sure everything's taken care of, and then sort of this carefree dad who, who just wants to be himself and just wants to do his thing. And I think that's pretty common as well. Yeah, I think it's interesting to have those two things when you're growing up also kind of see like the light side and the dark side of each orientation and sort of like see how that all comes together. What were you into? Would you, as you grow up in the Seattle area,
Starting point is 00:06:46 did you go to school? College. Oh, I went to college in Chicago. Yeah, that was closest to the East as I wanted to go at that time. I studied medieval history. Wait a minute. Yeah. Very lucrative. Suggested to anyone, especially graduating in the recession. So you graduated in 2008 with a degree in medieval history, which honestly was probably equally valuable to like an MBA at that moment in time. So why not? Why not? Totally.
Starting point is 00:07:19 All right. So what do you do with that? I moved to South America to teach English, and I started writing there. And what medieval history taught me was how philosophy is really juicy. Religion's really juicy. These are actually really interesting, sensual subjects that the Victorian era kind of stomped on, but they used to be really cool and kind of sexy. And I was writing a lot about, especially philosophy and theology while I was in South America, because I didn't speak Spanish, I didn't have that many friends. So I started this blog about my adventures, and then it sort of turned into a blog about other things, just
Starting point is 00:08:02 things I was thinking about spiritually and intellectually. Was that when you, so when you started doing that, was that more to process your own thoughts or were you looking to say like, let me build an audience or something like that? I was just processing my own thoughts. I really, I always wanted to be a writer, but I knew that given the example of my dad, the guitarist who never really had a job and life was kind of hard for him in that way. I knew that writing wasn't something I could do full time.
Starting point is 00:08:34 It didn't feel like an option for me. I knew I had to do something else. So I wasn't really trying to do anything except just process life the way I've always processed it in a little more public forum. I mean, Blogspot in 2008 wasn't super public, but slightly more public than my journal. So why South America? You ended up in Rio? I was in Chile.
Starting point is 00:09:01 And yeah, they were just hiring teachers. Okay, so that just happened to be... It was something to do. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yes, I did that for a year. And yeah, they were just hiring teachers. Okay, so that just happened to be. It was something to do. Right. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Got it. Yes, I did that for a year. And you didn't speak Spanish? No.
Starting point is 00:09:09 So again, in the position of observer. Yeah. Big time. I'm detecting a pattern early. Yeah, yeah. Just putting myself in these different circumstances. Right. I don't know what that means.
Starting point is 00:09:21 In your mind, are you thinking, okay, I'm starting to build a career? Or is this just like, you know what? I don't know which way is up In your mind, are you thinking, okay, I'm starting to build a career? Or is this just like, you know what? I don't know which way is up. Let me do this is interesting. Maybe it's your commitment or whatever it is. Let's see what happens. Yeah, exactly. Career was not.
Starting point is 00:09:35 It was a word I felt so uncomfortable with. I still do. I just I think again, because I thought I always wanted to be a writer and knew that that probably wouldn't be my day job, I separated job from hobby pretty early. I think I always knew I'd like to have a job that I enjoy, but it's not going to be the love of my life. What I'm going to do outside of my job is going to be the love of my life. So that made sense to me very young. And so I was just looking for jobs that I liked. Which is so interesting also because the sort of like your generation, I hate to use the phrase millennials because there's not one,
Starting point is 00:10:21 I mean, it's like a massive thing, but the knock on so many folks are like in their 30s, which I completely disagree with. But one of the sort of like the better sort of qualifiers very often is people are like, it is a generation which is fiercely purpose-driven and they are committed to living out a strong sense of purpose in the work that they do and get paid for. So it's a really different wiring that you came into, sort of like the idea of career and
Starting point is 00:10:52 vocation with. Yeah, I think I had that since I had the example of my dad who really did live his truth. He just did what he wanted to do at the expense of practicality and stability. And I saw the toll that that took on my mom and our family. And I had a very, very happy childhood and very lucky to have him as a dad. But I saw that that was hard. So I didn't romanticize it. I knew that I had to make money. And I also saw my mom, it's a single mom who had to support herself and a child. I thought that that was tough. And I knew that that was important. It was important as a girl to want to be independent and not need to have a man because you never know what's going to happen.
Starting point is 00:11:45 So I knew I wanted to work really hard and become independent somehow. Somehow. If it meant taking four jobs at a time, which I had for much of my 20s. Yeah. But to me, that's also, it's so interesting because it's so freeing to a certain extent when you kind of consider yourself, okay, so I know what I love. Like, I know it lights me up. I'm going to do that no matter what, you know, and it frees you up to sort of look at more of a mainstream thing and say, you know what, we'll take something which is okay. And that allows me the breathing room, the sense of security to go and do this other thing with as much time as I have. And it's, I think it's a path that a lot of times people look down on because they're like, no, no, no. If you know
Starting point is 00:12:31 that thing, it should be the center thing. And I don't, similar to you, I don't necessarily believe that's right for everybody. Yeah. I don't think so. It got a little more complicated in my late twenties because I moved to DC, which was a pretty, pretty random move. It didn't. So what took you there? What was it? Baltimore wasn't really working out, i.e. I broke up with someone, so I wanted to move away. And D.C. was just kind of the big city, you know, a little sister down there and a little more glamorous than Baltimore. So I thought, oh, I'll live there in some fabulous brownstone. I think I was about 25. And it's a very expensive city, very ambitious city, it was very, very hard for me to go meet people at parties who would say,
Starting point is 00:13:27 what do you do? And expect something a little more than, well, I'm a writer who works at a coffee shop. That wasn't really acceptable in DC. And I just remember about two years feeling really bad about myself. Like, so what am I doing, actually? And it's working in a nonprofit. It wasn't paying very well. I wasn't really passionate about it. And I thought, I got to get something else. I got to get something else going.
Starting point is 00:13:56 And that's when I started thinking, okay, I do think I want my career to align with my passions. And I couldn't quite figure out what that was going to look like. It was a very challenging time. Yeah. What were the steps? What were the sort of explorations you were making towards that? I made a list of things I was interested in, big list maker. I feel like I had something to tell the world, and I was figuring out how I was going to tell them. I didn't know if that was writing for publications, pursuing writing in a more professional way, or I did think about going to seminary. I thought about – Really? Yeah.
Starting point is 00:14:43 Yeah, I was very interested in religion. I thought I had kind of something to say about it that might be a little different from the mainstream voice. How so? Take me deeper. I'm curious. I always felt really at home in places of worship. And I think that was unusual for a young city gal who loved literature and progressive politics. I felt like I really understood church and theology in a way that I could maybe express a little differently for people and through creative writing or, I don't know, maybe becoming, I thought about becoming a priest myself. I wanted to, I felt like I had a
Starting point is 00:15:25 lot to communicate and I just didn't know what really made sense. And I did think a lot about the place of communication in healing. And I knew that the church had a lot of healing to do. And I thought I could maybe be a part of that. Within, meaning healing within the church community. Yeah. Yeah. Were you brought up in a sort of faith-based household? Sort of, yeah. I went to a Protestant church. It wasn't something we really talked about. My dad was a very staunch atheist, so I also had that. Toed that line. Growing up as a teenager in college, I thought I was a little too smart to be religious. So that took me out of it.
Starting point is 00:16:07 And then I had a great professor in college when I was studying medieval theology, which I really loved, which I really, really identified with. I had this professor who gave me a more holistic understanding of what religion could really be, what faith could be to someone's personal life. You know, he would, I would say, like, whenever I, I see people singing, like closing their eyes in church, I don't feel that at all. I don't feel like I want to be a part of that. And he said, but what about when you, you know, you go outside on like the first spring day, and you listen to the Babel of the Creek, and you're in in Chicago and you're seeing all these people out enjoying their lives and everyone has such a different story.
Starting point is 00:16:51 Do you feel anything when you're out there? Do you feel anything in the city? And that to me was where I really experienced the divine. And I wanted to talk more about that. I wanted to learn more about that. I wanted to learn more about that. Yeah. It's almost like it's a more expansive view. Exactly.
Starting point is 00:17:10 Exactly. Yeah. Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing.
Starting point is 00:17:21 Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die. Don't shoot him. We need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here.
Starting point is 00:17:31 It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required. Charge time and actual results will vary. Today's show is supported by our friends at Bombas Socks, which I happen to be wearing as I talk to you right now.
Starting point is 00:18:10 I love these socks. I love receiving them and giving them, which is pretty awesome because gift-giving season is upon us. Why do I dig them? Super yummy cotton, blister tabs, awesome art supports, and my favorite part of them, seamless toes. You can't beat that. Really cool also, they're the gift that keeps giving. For every pair of Bombas that you buy, they donate a pair to someone in need. How awesome is that? So shop today at bombas.com slash goodlife and get 20% off your entire purchase. That's right, to thank their loyal customers, Bombas is giving everyone 20% off when you shop at bombas.com. That's B-O-M-B-A-S.com. It's interesting what you said about, I felt like I was almost too smart for religion.
Starting point is 00:19:01 I think there's this really interesting conversation around that. I wasn't brought up very religious and sort of like A.J. Jacobs says, I'm Jewish the way Olive Garden is Italian. And there were moments where I kind of said, well, you know, how can you be like a really intelligent person of science and proof and concrete ideas, and at the same time, believe so much in things that you can't touch and see and ever prove in any meaningful way. And yet, if you look back through history, like what you've spent so much time studying, you see some of the most brilliant people in history were deeply faith-based too.
Starting point is 00:19:43 And so you kind of like, you have to keep asking yourself the question, huh, what's that about? Clearly it's not about intelligence. Right, right. Exactly. I think that's very new. I think it used to be that there wasn't really a line between science and faith and to be a religious person meant to be very deep in study. Scholarly. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You were the wise person.
Starting point is 00:20:08 Right. Right. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It is interesting to sort of see how sort of public views have changed. So what stopped you from doing that? Or did you secretly do that? I'm making an assumption there.
Starting point is 00:20:23 Side hustle. I applied for seminary in New York. It was very important to me to go to study religion in a big city. I felt closest to a sort of God, divine universe, whatever you want to call it, in a city. And it was just too expensive. So I didn't apply. That was bad. I thought that I wanted to be a hospital chaplain, maybe. And I could kind of do, you know, the cheaper version, but it just,
Starting point is 00:20:56 it didn't really feel worth it to me. Again, I was pretty practical about finances and just a kind of practical life. And I thought that the hours would be hard and I would get into too much debt for something I couldn't, I probably couldn't really pay back. So I thought, I'm going to keep myself out of debt. And it seems, I mean, it's so interesting. You have these dual tracks that go all the way back with you where it's like deeply connected to something driven by purpose and passion and simultaneously deeply aware of practical implications of your choices. And it seems like you, for a lot of your life, kept defaulting to the practical side. It's like you would dance with sort of like the
Starting point is 00:21:39 more woo-woo side, more spiritual. And then in the end, you're like, but practical side reigns. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny. I really don't consider myself a practical person at all. But I did know that I'm prone to stress. And what stresses me out is not knowing how I'm going to pay my rent.
Starting point is 00:22:01 That's really stressful for me. For everybody. For everyone. Yeah. Yeah. So to this day, I mean, really stressful for me. For everybody. For everyone. Yeah. Yeah. So to this day, I mean, I echo Elizabeth Gilbert, be a patron for your own art. You don't have to, you don't have to quit your day job. In fact, day jobs, God, I mean, what a source of creative material.
Starting point is 00:22:18 I've had 500,000 jobs and they all come into what I do now every day. Yeah. Well, Dilbert wouldn't exist without that. Exactly. Exactly. One of the biggest comics ever. Totally. Yeah. I have a lot of young people, early 20s, college age, ask me, how do you do what you do? How do I get to where you are? And I want to tell them, start when you're 30. Start when you have things to say. If I had gotten a job at the New Yorker when I was 22, I wouldn't have anything to write about. I mean, maybe these kids have some font of wisdom in their old souls. But I think I was pretty reflective as a young kid. And I still, I just didn't have the life experience. I don't really have anything to say. Do you feel like there's a lot of pressure to identify, quote, your path, like really early in your 20s and just stick to it and build on it? Oh my gosh, yes.
Starting point is 00:23:16 Yes, I do. Because I kind of think that's not a good thing. I think it's so hard. I felt that so much as a just really passionate, creative person. I really felt pressure to find my one thing, my one way of expressing what I had done. I've only done it for a couple of years. I don't know if I'm going to do it forever. It's a way of expressing myself at this time. But yeah, I drew an illustration recently that was like me as a sun and all my planets, all my passions revolving around me instead of me revolving around one passion. I think that sounds, it's just too much pressure. No, I so agree. I feel like your 20s are made for just experimenting. Just like figuring out
Starting point is 00:24:11 who you are, what you're about, and where that intersects with what the world wants and needs. Absolutely. And if that means running like 25 experiments in 10 years, do it. Yes. I had someone tell me, someone in her 30s tell me when I turned 20, this is your decade to just experiment. Date, move, try different jobs, be a little reckless, try different hairstyles. This is it. This is what you've got. So just use it. And I felt very lucky to have that advice kind of guiding me. Yeah. no, that's awesome to be like tapped into that. So you end up in a series of different jobs
Starting point is 00:24:50 that take you to late 20s. Coming into 2014, 2015, what were you up to? I was managing a boutique in DC. I always liked fashion, so kind of wanted to get into that. I was doing some marketing for them. They didn't have much of a social media presence. So I kind of read some books about marketing and realized, oh, I think I kind of like this marketing thing. Maybe I could do this as a job. Like I didn't really, I hadn't really had a legit job before. And I thought, oh, maybe I can get a job marketing for some company. So I actually did that. I started at
Starting point is 00:25:34 a nonprofit doing marketing and really enjoyed writing for a living. It was amazing to me that I could actually get paid to use these skills I'd been building for a decade, where I was very observant. And I think that I knew a lot about different demographics of people, and I could kind of speak to them. And I felt very valuable. It was the first time I'd felt very valuable at a job and felt like, oh, I think I've kind of found my thing. So, yeah, that was a good experience. And then that year was 2015, Valentine's Day. My dad died.
Starting point is 00:26:18 He'd been sick for a couple weeks. We were estranged at that point. But what I didn't realize about death is that, I don't know if this is the right, I don't know enough about icebergs, but it feels like it's kind of like an iceberg where all the emotion, all the intimacy you had with someone when they're alive, it comes out after they've died. So the same emotion that you feel toward them, whether you're very close or you're estranged, and you still have that intense relationship, even if you're not speaking, that carries over after death. So even though we weren't close, because we weren't talking to each other, I think we probably thought about each other
Starting point is 00:27:02 constantly, because we were always trying to figure out this relationship. So after he died, it was extremely difficult. I think it surprised my friends how difficult it was for me. What I also learned about death is that you're not just mourning the person who died that year, but you're also mourning the relationship you had 20 years ago. He was a great dad when I was growing up. So it was a really powerful blow. And it was the first time I'd realized I'd had all these memories that I couldn't share with someone anymore. And especially as an only child, that was really hard. At the same time, I broke up with a boyfriend who I was very close to and just sort of felt like these men were
Starting point is 00:27:48 abandoning me. They were just leaving me. And then I had some health issues right after that and had to stay at home for like six weeks. And I felt like I was at the bottom of a pit. I just felt like I'm at the bottom of a well and no one's here. There's no ladder. What am I going to do? The only thing I can do is do a lot of pushups while I'm down here and get strong enough that I can pull myself out because otherwise I'm going to be here forever. And so that's what I started doing through hobbies, starting new hobbies.
Starting point is 00:28:32 What does that look like? Well, I watched this documentary called Happy, I think. Have you ever seen it? I have, yeah. It's a great documentary. It is, it's awesome. And something I learned from that, and I think that was during the kind of happiness. Yeah, everybody was into being happy. Everyone was into being happy.
Starting point is 00:28:49 Exactly. And I didn't, I think normally that wouldn't have really spoke to me. I was always one of those people who is like, I'd rather have an interesting life than a happy life. You know, now I think, well, both would be great. I think I sort of romanticized, you know, challenge and difficulty. Both would be good. I need to make myself happy. How can I do this? I found that ritual was something that most happy people shared. Like this guy who surfed every day in Brazil, he just seemed like the happiest guy in this movie. He's quite old, and he's just so committed to surfing every day. During that time, when I was mourning my dad and boyfriend, I went to Portugal for a week.
Starting point is 00:29:46 And I saw these people in a park one day, just picking up guitars and singing and playing and dancing. And I thought, I want to join them, but I don't have anything. I don't have anything to do. I don't have this thing that makes me really happy. So I've got to figure that out. So my dad left me these guitars. I started playing guitar. I was horrible at it. I took surfing lessons. Pretty bad at it, too.
Starting point is 00:30:15 I took dance lessons. That went a little better. And then I decided I really like doing watercolors. It's a very soothing activity. Where did that come from? Oh, who knows? I see where watercolors. It's a very soothing activity. Where did that come from? Oh, who knows? I see where the guitar goes. I see the connection with the surfing.
Starting point is 00:30:32 Yeah. But were you an artistic kid? Were you a painter, an illustrator, a drawing? Not really. I liked to doodle. I've always had this kind of funny handwriting. I developed it when I was working at a bakery, and I had to write the chalkboard every day, and it was super boring. So I came up with this different handwriting, which is now my natural handwriting. I really can't write any other way. And it's very loopy
Starting point is 00:30:54 and kind of whimsical. And so I would sometimes write, make little invitations, stuff like that, and paint over it with watercolor. And I thought, oh, this is really soothing. So I just decided this makes me happy. I want to do it every day. So I'm just going to do it every day. And I'm going to start this Instagram account, keep me accountable. So was it largely just that in the beginning? Just let me do this because if I do it publicly, I want to do it every day. And this will force me to be accountable. Yeah, it was private for the first month or so. So it wasn't really for anyone else.
Starting point is 00:31:36 It was just to keep myself accountable. What was the idea? Was it just sort of like taking whatever your thoughts were? Yeah, exactly. Whatever I saw during the day. So the early ones are like, like a fall leaf, like just things that I saw are just little funny. Like, one time I was a Energizer battery for Halloween when I was 10. And I drew that just little memories or things I saw. I want to deepen into that. But did you continue to play guitar also? I did. Yeah. Yeah. So I kind of had this huge overarching project. I did yoga every day.
Starting point is 00:32:13 I just, I gave myself all of these. This is like Mari's happiness project. Totally. I think I called it something like that. Like get out of the pit project, something like that. I just had to make myself better. There's this great Lin-Manuel Miranda quote that's something like, you can fume at the world if you want, or you can use your talents to bring us close to you or bring us in. And the way I imagined that was,
Starting point is 00:32:39 you know, I could sit there feeling really miserable for myself, which I did for a few months. Or I can start writing and I'd start making things and bring people into my world because I didn't really know how to enter the actual world at that point. I felt very isolated. So what can I do to reach out? I can go to yoga. I can play music. I can play music. I can draw things.
Starting point is 00:33:07 And I was writing a lot at that time, too. Cooking. Just trying to get out. Just trying to reach my fingers up from the pit and get myself out of there. Yeah. So it was really all sort of like different forms of therapy. Definitely. To a large extent.
Starting point is 00:33:22 Yeah, for sure. When you were playing guitar, your dad's guitars, did that do anything to or for you, knowing that you are now using his instruments to learn something and to pull you out of a dark place? I wish. I wish it had. Yeah. If I had been better. He's like, oh, that would have been a great story. Yeah, I wanted it to be this poignant thing. It wasn't really because I'm not very good at it.
Starting point is 00:33:51 Actually, living in New York now, I just moved here a couple of months ago. He lived all over the world, but he spent most of his life in New York and I feel very close to him here. And in a lot of ways feel like I am him sometimes. I'm really reconnecting with that really creative part of me that I had neglected for a while in pursuit of practicality and stability, which isn't saying much because I was a barista most of the time. It's not like I decided to be a lawyer or anything. But you had your workaday job. Exactly. So you're drawing on the side.
Starting point is 00:34:27 You're surfing. You're playing music. You're dancing. Like little drips in the pond of like starting to fill it, you know, so that you're rising above the level of being depressed. You're rising above it. Are you aware of the fact that all these things are starting to make a difference in how you're experiencing the world as you're doing them? Yeah, I did find that. I found that by building these muscles, I didn't even know I had, I was becoming so strong. I really felt like that. I felt like I'd be in yoga and not being a very physically strong person, I could do really difficult things because I just felt
Starting point is 00:35:19 like my mind was becoming stronger and my resolve was becoming stronger. And I was so determined. I think the understanding of mortality played into this as well. And the Hamilton soundtrack, I just felt like I've got to do something, I've got to do something bigger. And when I was doing all these different things, it was like, man, no one could say that I didn't try. I'm trying so hard to make myself the best self I can be. I was so determined to do that, that nothing even really mattered to me, publicity, anything like that. Yeah. I mean, it's interesting also that your approach to coming back to life was less about thinking it through or talking about through. It was just, it was doing your way into a different place. You know, it was like,
Starting point is 00:36:12 let me just act in all these different ways in a, like, let me do things that put me into a generative state and then just see what happens. See how that affects me. Exactly. Totally. Totally experimental. Yeah. And I think it's so interesting to do it that way also because then it's almost like the philosophy underneath that is rather than think and talk and I'll get back to a place where I'm happy, let me just experience, like do things that give me these momentary bursts of it right now.
Starting point is 00:36:43 Right. Right. Yeah. And then maybe it'll all add up to sort of like a persistent shift. Yeah, absolutely. Let me put happiness on the calendar and see how it goes. Yeah. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here.
Starting point is 00:36:59 It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required,
Starting point is 00:37:23 charge time and actual results will vary. Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is?
Starting point is 00:37:37 You're going to die. Don't shoot him, we need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. So, you start really with the illustrations. That becomes like a daily thing. At what point do you make the decision to say, you know, I'm going to flip this Instagram account where I'm sharing these things from friends and family and make it public and why? Gosh. and why? I think at some point, I decided to make it public, pretty arbitrary. I don't really
Starting point is 00:38:10 remember doing it. And people started following. I think it was friends of friends, probably. It grew very slowly, I think, I think in grand scheme very quickly, but at the time, at the beginning, very slowly, very organically. And I remember there was one post one time that got 100 likes, and I just couldn't believe, like, I couldn't even fathom 100 likes. I thought that was going viral. I was like, what are people, where are they finding this? What's going on? And what's resonating about it also. I was really not of that world. Don't have a favorite cartoonist or anything. I'm just kind of getting to know them now, which is a joy.
Starting point is 00:39:13 But I was just talking about my life. And I've always thought my life is pretty specific. I don't have a lot of experiences that other people do and vice versa. I think that I've had a sort of unusual go at it. And I was writing, drawing things that only happened to me, very specifically happening to me. And yet people were saying that this was relatable to them. That was kind of unbelievable to me. It still is unbelievable. Yeah. I mean, it deals with, I mean, I look at your illustrations and I'm like, oh my God, she's in my head. And I'm a 51 year old dude. So I totally get that. But I think it's
Starting point is 00:39:55 also so interesting, right? So, you know, over the last essentially two years now, you've built a massive global audience for your work. And what's so interesting is, you know, if you had gone back a couple of years, one of the questions I'm sure you get all the time is there are a million people who are like illustrators and artists and they're trained and they're beautiful. And like, who am I to like have something to say?
Starting point is 00:40:19 Nobody's going to care. And like when, when you do what you do and you say, you know what, there is still space for your lens, your voice. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's remarkable. I mean, I know that I'm not good at drawing and that's why they're pretty text heavy. Because I think I can write. But you have the awesome loopy. I have the awesome loopy.
Starting point is 00:40:48 The awesome loopy. And I need to develop those in the bakery. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it still boggles my mind why people want to hear what I have to say. I just, I mean, I just think we're all way more similar than we think we are. I think that comes down to that, which is very comforting. Sometimes I'll put something out there that's so specific to me. And I just think, no one's going to get this. And that's fine. It's totally fine. This is really for me to process. And those will be the most popular. And it's like, I'll talk about things that really have only happened to me. And I think, you know, when you're talking about anything specific, there's a, there's the essence, of course, underneath it. And I think most of us have pretty similar feelings.
Starting point is 00:41:44 We're all human. We're all human. We're all human. I mean, that's the thing. It's like, and fundamentally, we keep it, everyone experiences love and sorrow and angst and anxiety and fear and uncertainty. And, you know, you may be illustrating a scenario where that triggered this for you. But, you know, like a billion other people have experienced that identical emotion or state just triggered slightly differently, but they can connect with the emotion. And when you share it in a way where you're like, I'm not alone. It's funny because I look at your work and to me, because I'm always trying to,
Starting point is 00:42:21 as an artist, as a creator, as a maker, and then also as like a marketer, an entrepreneur, I'm always trying to figure out what's happening here that so many people are responding. And I feel like one of the big things is that when people see your work, it's a daily reminder that they're not alone. Yeah. It's really nice. Do you sense that?
Starting point is 00:42:43 I hear that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's hard to process. Your body language is like, that's too trippy for me. It's trippy. It's trippy. I think I just have to believe it. It's very hard to process. What stops you from believing it? Oh, because I'm just some random person. I just don't even know what I'm doing. And it's not hard for me to be vulnerable in that way. It's not hard for me to put names to those emotions. There are plenty of things that are
Starting point is 00:43:15 very, very hard for me, but that's not hard for me. And so I think when something, you know, comes very naturally to you, it's a little hard to process that it could be meaningful to someone else. I don't take it for granted. It makes me cry every day, but it is very difficult to understand. Yeah. There's an interesting tie-in, I think, with your interest in theology. People don't want prophecy, they want reality. You know, you don't have to be prophetic in your work. You just have to be real. And I feel like that's what's so powerful about your work. And that's why I said, I think people just really, it lets you feel like I'm not alone in the world. And I think it's also, I'm curious how actually, because you're very conversational around your work, and I'm sure a lot of people look to you for advice.
Starting point is 00:44:10 How does that land with you? Oh, yeah. I don't know. You guys need to just, like, see the body language. It's like, oh, God, ask somebody else. There's so many good writers out there, read their books. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know.
Starting point is 00:44:29 There's nuggets of wisdom I've taken from other people. And that's what I cling to. Part of the other thing that I love also, and we're sitting in our studio here, and actually a couple of things on the walls are from an old friend of mine, Lisa Congton, who's an illustrator who came to art in her early 30s also, having considered herself the non-artistic kid in her family. Oh, that's great. And I love when people demonstrate that you can come to this at any point in your life. Yeah. You don't have to have been doing this when you're five years old. Oh my gosh, totally.
Starting point is 00:45:02 And you can express what's in your heart and matter and have it resonate with people. Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure. And like I said before, just having kind of a, having lived a life, people, my friends would tell me when I was in the depths of mid-twenties confusion and especially career insecurities, they'd say, you're just getting material now for your novel that you'll write later. So they knew it was coming long before you did.
Starting point is 00:45:32 Yeah, yeah. I really appreciated that. That's what I always tell people is you're just getting material now and you're going to use that. I use that all the time. I think something very lucky about the way the body I was born into is I have very good emotional memory. And it's always used to drive me nuts because it makes me hold grudges. It makes it very hard to forgive people because I can remember how exactly I felt when something happened. And it's hard to forgive people when you have such a good memory of the feeling. Exactly, very visceral. I can put myself right back there. And now it's very helpful for my career. I can put myself back in being a 12-year-old. I can remember exactly what that's like and draw on many times of life that were very painful and difficult. I can really
Starting point is 00:46:26 just jump right, I just put on a song that I was listening to at the time and get right back in that space. I bet the journals are probably also super helpful. How much of your material comes out of your sort of like modern everyday life versus stuff where you're sort of flipping back through journals and recalling, oh, this? Yeah, it used to be every day. It was very real time. Whatever I was going through at that moment, you could know what was going on in my life. Now I draw back. I'm in a pretty pleasant time of life right now. I have a book coming out, which is so special. My dream come true. I'm living in New York, my favorite place in the world. I feel pretty untethered. I have a lot of freedom. I'm getting to travel. There's not a lot that's
Starting point is 00:47:12 that hard. I'm still recovering from recent illness, but things are pretty good. I feel very loved. And so it's not like I'm in the depths of this pain, but I can get there if I want to. That's a gift. Does that freak you out, though, as somebody who's committed to sort of, well, I guess you're not doing it every day anymore, but you're still doing it like three, four times a week. I do it every day. Is it still every day? Yeah. Okay.
Starting point is 00:47:37 Because one of the big things that sometimes you'll hear people who are artists in all different domains is, I got to feel the feels. Yeah. And if I like, if life is good, like life can't be good because then I'm not going to have the raw material and like the deep emotions to create something really powerful. Yeah. I don't feel like you're. No, I could have a, I could have a very boring rest of my life. I think I, I feel like if you want to be an artist or writer,
Starting point is 00:48:07 the way that I, the way I imagine this is before you're born, you tell the universe, I want to be, I want to create things and you have to sign this contract that, okay, you can be an artist or writer, but weird shit is going to happen to you. And you just have to take that and run with it. You just have to be grateful that it's material and you're understanding the human condition a little more. And then you get to use that material, but that's going to happen to you. So I feel like enough has happened to me that I'm all set. And I also feel like more weird stuff is going to happen to me. I don't think there's any shortage. So I can just enjoy a pleasant time. You don't have to manufacture anything. Exactly. It's like
Starting point is 00:48:50 the universe has got you covered. They've got me. Yep, totally. Got it. So you start to sort of to offer out your art and your thoughts and your creativity on a daily basis. People start responding on a bigger and bigger level and you a massive very substantial global audience what happens in your mind at what point do you start to look at this and say like this has been my side thing in fact it didn't even start as my side this was just one of the things that was helping me come out of a dark place yeah yeah so i figured you know like it would be cool and then it's starting to become something bigger and bigger and bigger. At what point do you look at that and say, maybe this isn't my side thing anymore? And how would that happen?
Starting point is 00:49:31 Yeah, I got too busy to do my actual job. Yeah, it felt increasingly important. I felt like with a growing audience, I had a growing responsibility to make work I was really proud of that I thought said something. And for that reason, I rented a little art studio. I would go there before work, like 5 to 8 a.m. every day and answer emails. I would do little like personal commissions for like $10. And, you know, just enjoy kind of it becoming a legit side thing. And then there got a point when I was able to get a book deal because of my following, which is how it's done now. And that was just the best thing ever. And I thought, I gotta write a book, I gotta make art, I don't have time to do
Starting point is 00:50:28 marketing anymore. I just don't have time. So it wasn't even it wasn't even like a, oh, now I'm financially stable enough to stop this. Again, it was back to practicality. But this time, it was like, I don't I just don't have time to go to work. I have to draw. So that was the change. That's a nice change. Yeah, it was great. Oh, I love that. I just don't have time to work. I have to draw. That is an awesome moment in your brain, though. Were you nervous? Or were you just like, this feels right? Let's do this.
Starting point is 00:51:05 Yeah. And I think of everything in life is such a season. I thought there was a good chance I'd get back to a nine to five. I just knew for the time. I got a book to write. I got prints to send. I was spending my whole nine to five at the post office sending off prints. So I just felt like for now, I'm going to give myself this time to do this and see what happens. I think I'm still in that season. And I'd be happy to go back to a regular job.
Starting point is 00:51:28 I'd be happy to do something else. Yeah. As you're working on the book, earlier this year, you referenced, you had a pretty major scare. I did. Especially when you're not even, you're traveling outside. So tell me what happened. Right. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:51:41 I was in Spain to finish my book. Pretty arbitrarily chose this town town Granada, Spain. I googled most bohemian cities in Europe because I thought if I'm going to be a professional writer, I need to be in the right place. So this extraordinary, wonderful city Granada, and I was living there. It's just such a joy. And one day I couldn't walk very well. And I went to this little town outside of the city to totally finish my essays for my book. And I was doing some drawings,
Starting point is 00:52:13 I was noticing that my drawing was shaky. And by the end of a weekend there, I couldn't walk, I took one step and I collapsed. And it turns out I had a very rare autoimmune disease, Guillain-Barre syndrome, very similar to polio. And I was paralyzed for a month, my arms and legs, which was a very fast recovery for the intensity of the strain I had. So you wake up basically one morning, go to a cafe to draw, realize you're losing strength, control in a hand.
Starting point is 00:52:49 Yeah. And within a matter of days, you're in a hospital. Yeah. It's exactly like that. Paralyzed. Yeah. What,
Starting point is 00:52:58 in a country where you still don't speak Spanish. I still don't speak Spanish. You'd think I would have learned by now. Are you freaking out? Oh, yeah. I mean, I think freaking out is almost too weak a phrase. I felt like I was in hell.
Starting point is 00:53:20 It was profoundly isolating. And I felt like I was experiencing kind of a room of life. Like if life is a house, there's this room like in the basement that you know is there, but you might go down and tiptoe and look in sometimes and you'll close the door and run upstairs. And I was living in that room. And I realized, wow, a lot of people live in this room. And that was by far the hardest part is just realizing how many people live there and don't get to come out. And what is an identity of someone who can't move, especially someone who likes to make things and experience life. And so much of my identity was kind of based on my joie de vivre and, you know, desire to just create and put
Starting point is 00:54:15 things in the world and dance. And I'm lying in this hospital bed, I didn't even have Wi-Fi. And you also don't, I mean, you don't know if any of this is ever coming back in the early days, especially, right? Yeah. Well, I was lucky that they kept telling me, oh, it's just a couple more days. That was a great gift that they gave me. Did they actually know or were they saying that? I think they didn't know. I think they probably would have told me, but it was such a gift.
Starting point is 00:54:41 They would say, oh, you'll be out of here in a couple days. So there was hope. There was hope. Yeah. Yeah, say, oh, you'll be out of here in a couple of days. So there was hope. There was hope. Yeah. Yeah, which is really powerful for the mind. So I didn't think I was going to die. I just hated it. I just hated being there.
Starting point is 00:54:57 And it really was hellish. Yeah. Your mom was still West Coast at that point? My mom came to visit me as soon as – I only thought I was going to be in the hospital a couple days. And she flew because she's retired now and had that ability. Again, such a gift. And she was really my caretaker for that whole time. So it takes about a month for you to slowly recover everything. Is there an understanding of what brings this on? assert to myself I did not cause this. There's nothing I could have done because I did feel
Starting point is 00:55:48 I was sort of victim blaming myself if I just hadn't eaten this or been bitten by a mosquito or whatever. Because it's a syndrome, not a disease, right? Which is sort of like medical speak for it's a bundle of symptoms
Starting point is 00:56:04 that we're not really sure where it comes from. So we'll call it something. Yeah. It's pretty mysterious. Yeah. As you recover a month after that, is there any lingering thought of, or maybe it's, I don't know, I don't, I know very little about the syndrome, but is it, is it in your mind or is it part of the literature that does this just go away and you're good for life? Or is this something that's sort of like a part of you for life and returns? Well, it takes a couple, it can take a couple years to recover from. I'm still in recovery right now. I'm-
Starting point is 00:56:35 You still feel some of the- I do. Yeah. Sometimes I'll just drop things and it's pretty easy to explain. This is something I realized is it's pretty easy to explain a difficulty walking. Most people kind of understand that. But difficulty using your hands, there's not really a quick way to say that if someone hands me something heavy, and I can't get it. It's hard to say my immune system is eating the nerves in my hand. So I can't grab that. It's pretty, people don't really understand it. So it's kind of an isolating recovery, but I'm mostly back to normal. I am back to dancing and I can't do that as well as I used to. And I hear it can take
Starting point is 00:57:12 a couple of years, but it's not like once you have it, then you might relapse. I think it would be, to get it again would be as random as getting it the first time. Oh, okay. And when, because I'm assuming you weren't drawing for. No, yeah, for a couple months. When did you feel like you started to get back to it? Like you were back to who you were? Or do you feel that way now? I think I'm different now.
Starting point is 00:57:36 I still stayed in Europe for a while after I got out of the hospital, which was really, really challenging as in the city of Lisbon, which like New York has a lot of walk up apartments. And I was staying in one. I felt like the city, I've always felt very comfortable and happy in cities. And suddenly cities just felt so inhospitable to me. And one thing that was difficult is just turning the key of my apartment. That was that always took about half an hour to do. And the first day that I could just turn a key,
Starting point is 00:58:07 I thought, I think I can maybe draw again. So the first drawing I came back with was the back of my head looking at all these people. And it was me thinking something like, oh, these people with their easy lives, like they don't understand what I'm going through. And I had little pointers to each one saying something that they might be going through, like the death of a loved one or lost job.
Starting point is 00:58:35 And this was because my boyfriend was staying with me in Portugal at the time and I was telling him, this is so annoying. I'm walking these streets. It's so difficult. Everything's so hard for me. I'm depressed. I'm walking these streets. It's so difficult. Everything's so hard for me. I'm depressed. I'm dealing with post-trauma. I can't walk.
Starting point is 00:58:50 This is terrible. And everyone's just so happy here. And everyone's like on vacation. They don't have a care in the world. And he said, don't you think they might be going through something too? You don't know. You don't know what's going on. So that was my first one back. Did people know what was going on if you vanished for a month?
Starting point is 00:59:12 Yeah, I posted some old illustrations and kind of kept them updated. I would write some thoughts about what I was going through and the difficulty of recovering and the need for empathy and my new understanding of resilience. Yeah. And at the same time, you're writing a book, which is not out yet. So I don't know what's in it. But I'm imagining, like, how does this play into that whole process for you? And also into did it change what you're doing with the book? I did write some about the illness in my book. That was an addition. I think I wrote about themes of loss, resilience, empathy, things that I cover often in my illustrations, but I realized, wow, there was a whole lot more to know about these topics. And so I infused the insight that I got from being so sick and feeling so isolated into the drawings for the book, which I think makes it a bit more complete. So thank you, universe.
Starting point is 01:00:17 Yeah. So, I mean, it's interesting when you kind of zoom the lens out now, you found this one medium and one platform where it's kind of like you are the priest. I know, like, yeah, I'm not the one who has like the big things to say and the deep theological things. But it's funny how it ties in because when I think about the leaders of faith who, where I've been present during a sermon or during some thoughts or during a conversation or just witnessed a conversation between different people, the things that resonate most with me about those are the really simple stories that everybody in living every life can relate to and step into. And the slightest idea of how those stories reconnect you to humanity and how they can in some way, you can experience them a little bit more joyfully or lightly or as a vehicle to connect with other people.
Starting point is 01:01:18 And effectively, that's what you're doing. Yeah, that's really nice. Yeah. You still have so much trouble owning that. If you guys could see her face, oh my God. I so appreciate that. I really do. That is your work.
Starting point is 01:01:34 That is your work as you go into the world. Journal on this. Yes. Yeah, well, this is part of the transformation I've had since my illness is stepping into what is the power I have. I now have all of this knowledge. And I think that true artists, prophets, people who have something to express, I think a lot of them have dipped their toes in hell. And what can you do
Starting point is 01:02:06 with that? When I was in the hospital, I got an email from an energy healer, very good friend, it's very intuitive. And she gave me a reading from all the way from New York. And she said, you are making the transition at this time from artist to healer. And your understanding of wounds is increasing right now so that you can heal other people. And so since then, I really have tried to give thought to what is a healer? What's the essence of a healer? How can I do that? Especially on social media, which is such a broken and murky place full of wounds, full of chaos. What can I do to soothe that experience?
Starting point is 01:03:01 And these days full of vitriol. Yeah. I think that's part of what you've created also, is it feels like a bit of a place of refuge. Oh, that would be lovely. Yeah. I mean, but if you see, if you look at the comments, you have a robust community that talks amongst each other and to you. And it feels like it's an uplifting community. It feels like it's a place that feels safe for a lot of people. It does.
Starting point is 01:03:26 Yeah. Refuge. I love that word. Yeah. I don't go on social media very much. I don't really check Instagram that often. But I know what's going on there. And I always try and think, what are people seeing a lot of right now?
Starting point is 01:03:41 And how can I be the antidote? Like my most popular post by far was on Mother's Day, I drew a series of little bouquets for people who might feel forgotten, people who have lost mothers, people who are trying to be mothers, people who have bad relationships with their mothers. And on Christmas, I knew that people would probably see a lot of, you know, Instagrams of presents and family. And so I drew a bunch of little candles for people who might feel forgotten on Christmas. And I'm aware of what people are seeing. And I am trying to say there's a place for people who aren't really in the mainstream over here. So I try to create that little home.
Starting point is 01:04:28 It's kind of amazing to see because I never understood the power to create belonging within sort of like a single social media profile and the conversation in there. So it's interesting when I see that happening with what different people are creating. So it feels like a good time for us to kind of come full circle. So as we sit here now, this is a good life project. Happiness is so nebulous. What is happiness? When do you get there? But you know when you're having fun. And I think fun is kind of the beginning of resilience in a lot of ways. Right after I got a book deal, I took myself to Rio, best city in the world, besides New York. And I don't want to feed into any stereotypes about Rio, but I did get mugged. First couple days I was there. And that evening after getting a, you know, knife held up to me as a little concerned about going out as by myself, but I thought,
Starting point is 01:05:42 you know, Brazilians, they would be out dancing. That's how they would deal with this. They would just go out dancing. And when I was in the hospital, my best moments were having little dance parties in my wheelchair with my mom. And these ways, little ways that you can lift yourself up are usually in the pursuit of fun. When you're having fun, you're much less likely to judge other people. You know, stew over what you pursuit of fun. When you're having fun, you're much less likely to judge other people and stew over what you don't have. When you're having fun, you don't care about that. Thank you. Thank you. What a treat.
Starting point is 01:06:18 Hey, thanks so much for listening. And thanks also to our fantastic sponsors who help make this show possible. You can check them out in the links we've included in today's show notes. Thank you. that lead to action, that's when real change takes hold. Don't shoot him. We need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping.
Starting point is 01:07:21 And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X. Available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations, iPhone XS or later required, charge time and actual results will vary.

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